Latest / Azadeh and Guy on AI / Litmaps Unveiled

Transcript

Litmaps Unveiled · Azadeh and Guy on AI

• 0:01
  SPEAKER_01: Hi, how are you?
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_00: Hello.
• 0:03
  SPEAKER_00: How are you doing?
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_01: I've been better.
• 0:06
  A little bit of a cold,
• 0:07
  so it's giving my voice a different timbre,
• 0:09
  but that's okay.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_00: We have natural sound effects, which is perfect.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_00: So what are we going to talk about today?
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_00: Today we are recording the seventh episode of Azadeh and Guy on AI.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm pretty excited.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, this is becoming a regular thing.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_01: So as we're talking today, we're talking about, I think, LeetMaps?
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_01: And we're first going to talk,
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_01: I'm going to talk a little bit,
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_01: or we're both going to talk about LeetMaps,
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: the software,
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_01: and then you're going to talk about a paper that discusses those.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, exactly.
• 0:49
  So that's,
• 0:50
  as they say in the wine and dine business,
• 0:55
  a dinner and a drink.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 0:58
  So LeetMaps is another one of those apps that looks to help us
• 1:05
  do a good LeetReview.
• 1:08
  And this is something we've talked about when we talked about
• 1:11
  SciSpace,
• 1:11
  we talked about Asta.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_01: So we talked about a few of them.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_01: ResearchRabbit.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_00: ResearchRabbit.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_00: We also talked about Perplexity.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_00: So we are exploring different Gen.AI tools that...
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: scholars more specifically are using to do their lit review.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:29
  And really when you're entering a new field and you just need
• 1:32
  to get a sense of what's going on.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_01: And this is also,
• 1:36
  we had a presentation today and one of the questions came out
• 1:39
  as to how ethical is
• 1:40
  it to use AI and to call things the things you've made when AI
• 1:45
  has participated in
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_01: a major way.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_01: And one of the things that I think about the lit review process.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_01: has always been assisted by AI.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_01: We called it keywords.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_01: We called it a search engine.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_01: But it always was one form of AI or another.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_01: So what we're getting is a better tool.
• 2:05
  I don't think there are real ethical concerns about using of
• 2:10
  the tool as long as
• 2:12
  you're getting proper access from a copyright perspective to
• 2:15
  the articles as you
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_01: read them after you get the input from AI.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm less concerned ethically.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_01: I mean,
• 2:21
  I think we'll eventually get to discuss some of the things that
• 2:25
  are making us
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_01: somewhat uncomfortable.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_01: And there are things that make me uncomfortable about using AI,
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_01: using it too much and all of this.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_01: where are the boundaries around that,
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: who's got the copyright,
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_01: and all of these really important issues to discuss.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_01: But in this case, I think it's a fairly straightforward process.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_01: So you actually introduced me to Lit Maps, I think, originally.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_00: I did, yes.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_01: And said, you've got to try this.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
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  And I think the thing that is the first thing that jumps at you
• 2:55
  is these are maps.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_01: So they track authorship in time.
• 3:00
  And as a result,
• 3:01
  what you get is something visual and not just a list of
• 3:06
  studies.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_01: And that's their thing.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_01: Now, they actually existed before AI.
• 3:11
  So they're pre-AI in the way we think about right now as a
• 3:15
  large language model.
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  SPEAKER_01: It is a very sophisticated set of algorithms that was always there.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_01: But there is a new addition of AI on top of the existing litmaps.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_01: So you can actually,
• 3:30
  one of the things you do is if you've played with litmaps
• 3:34
  before and now you want
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_01: to play again or you want to say,
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_01: so what is new?
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_01: Well,
• 3:39
  one of the things that is new is they've added AI into this so
• 3:43
  you can have this
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_01: conversation with people
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_01: An analysis using LLM,
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  SPEAKER_01: so using AI to show you what are common tags,
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_01: what are ways to think about the topic and to get a summary.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_01: So there are...
• 4:03
  There's another layer of analysis on top,
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  especially if you connect it to your Zotero library.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_01: Here's the one thing.
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  SPEAKER_01: After you try Lit Maps for a short time on a free version,
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_01: all of those features,
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_01: all of those extra features are behind a paywall.
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  So you have to play with it enough to decide that it's
• 4:23
  worthwhile investing in a
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  SPEAKER_01: one-month or a two-month or one-year subscription.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_01: And then you can judge if those extra features are worth it for you.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_01: And then you can take that away.
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  So that's the one thing with things that have been here a
• 4:42
  little bit longer.
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  SPEAKER_01: They're already established.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_01: They already have a price.
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  And they're not going to give it to you like a perplexity does
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  for free or size
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_01: space and all of those.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_01: They give you quite a few tokens to play before you decide.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_01: This one has a little bit less or maybe I just played with it too much.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
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  SPEAKER_01: Because it is fun to play.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_00: And the other thing,
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  good thing about LitMap is that they have a kind of complete
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  collection of articles
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  SPEAKER_00: on how to use LitMaps.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 5:15
  The introduction,
• 5:16
  search algorithms,
• 5:18
  LitMap databases,
• 5:19
  and how do I do something in LitMaps?
• 5:23
  which i really love and yes yes there's great documentation
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  there's videos although
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  most of the new ones as they get new features also get new
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  videos so cyspace for
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_01: example has a series of them and um
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_00: They also have a couple of YouTube videos within each article.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_01: And so it depends on how do you prefer to do it.
• 5:45
  I love the videos just because you can skip along to the
• 5:49
  feature you want to look at.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_01: And it's visual.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_01: The whole software is visual.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_01: So it's really easy to find out where you want to be.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_01: The one thing that I did find a little bit challenging...
• 6:03
  in all of this was that it seems that the list of connected
• 6:10
  articles is very,
• 6:13
  very filtered.
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  And so I'm not getting as rich of a system of connections as I
• 6:20
  expected to,
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  even for papers that I know have a lot of references and a lot
• 6:25
  of places they refer
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_01: to.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_01: And so I'm thinking...
• 6:30
  Whatever is happening in the algorithm,
• 6:32
  it's not giving me a complete list.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_00: Could you explain more and what do you exactly mean?
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_01: So, for example, if I start my search with something about TPAC.
• 6:44
  Now,
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  I know for a fact that TPAC has been referenced in literally
• 6:48
  thousands of papers.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_02: Thousands of, yeah.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_01: But when I do a search, I don't get thousands of papers.
• 6:53
  So in one way,
• 6:54
  it's really good because do I really want thousands of papers?
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  And unless I'm doing a meta-analysis or some kind of a
• 7:00
  summative review,
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  I don't need thousands.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_00: Mm-hmm.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_01: But the fact that I'm getting only 50 is saying,
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  how did you exactly select the ones that I'm getting to give me
• 7:15
  what I'm seeing
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  SPEAKER_01: right now?
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_01: Because that seems...
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_01: Again,
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  and we always said that you want to start in the areas where
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  you know a lot so you
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  SPEAKER_01: can judge how good the quality is.
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  SPEAKER_01: And that's why originally when you told me about Lit Maps,
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_01: I played with it and I said,
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not loving it because it's not giving me exactly everything I wanted.
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  Do you feel that there are any kind of hidden criteria that we
• 7:42
  don't know about?
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  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_00: you remember we reviewed ASTA together,
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  and the same thing happened when they kind of categorized their
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  output based on the
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  SPEAKER_00: relevance.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_00: So do you feel that the same thing is happening with lead maps?
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  SPEAKER_00: Or,
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_00: I mean,
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  did you figure out or did you see any kind of pattern in the
• 8:02
  paper that it gave you
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  SPEAKER_00: as the result?
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_01: I don't know that I'm 100% sure how it decided.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_01: So it definitely gives me opportunity to say, oh, I want more like this.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_01: There's an actual place where you mark that and you say, oh, I want more.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_01: I want more.
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  But I'd like to be able to define how many maximum are in the
• 8:26
  original set.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm not sure I understand how.
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  SPEAKER_01: And when things are not intuitive for me,
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  SPEAKER_01: I know you like the documentation,
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_01: but I think if you've listened to the last six episodes,
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_01: you know that I'm lazier than other days.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_01: And so I want things to just work.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_01: And this for me, I have to do extra work.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_01: And it's not clear to me if that's giving me a better result.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_01: That's the one thing.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_01: However, again...
• 8:52
  The advantage is if you're getting quality results,
• 8:56
  that should be enough.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_01: Unless,
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_01: again,
• 8:57
  you're trying to do summative work and then you probably should
• 9:00
  use a different
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  SPEAKER_01: process.
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  SPEAKER_01: The other thing is it does work with Zotero,
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_01: which,
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_01: again,
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  is critically important for me because you don't want to
• 9:08
  memorize everything and
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_01: you don't want to always redo a search.
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  You want to do the search,
• 9:13
  connect it to Zotero and have it available to you at all times.
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  SPEAKER_00: And I think similar apps or Gen AI tools,
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_00: to be more specific,
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  SPEAKER_00: they did a good job in terms of connecting their tools to Zotero.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: We saw the Zotero feature in other apps that we reviewed together.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
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  SPEAKER_01: So that seems fairly standard and that's really,
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_01: really important because,
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_01: again,
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_01: you don't want to chase things.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_01: And it took me many,
• 9:40
  many years and mostly an Azadeh intervention to get on Zotero
• 9:44
  finally and to use it
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_01: consistently.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_01: I'm still not fully there.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_01: But this is,
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_01: again,
• 9:53
  something that makes Zotero also more attractive because
• 9:56
  there's that communication
• 9:57
  between the two devices or the two pieces of software that make
• 10:02
  both of them more
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  SPEAKER_01: usable at the same time.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, yes.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_01: And also important,
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  SPEAKER_01: if you do change,
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_01: from LeetMaps to SciSpace and all of that,
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_01: the fact that you have everything saved in Zotero is also good.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm curious,
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_00: Guy,
• 10:17
  did you see any significant difference between LeetMaps and
• 10:22
  what was the thing that
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_00: we reviewed together?
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: ResearchRabbit?
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's a sleeker interface than ResearchRabbit.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_01: It's a cleaner interface.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_01: basic interface that does what I want it to do.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_01: From that perspective, it's better.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_01: There's less just stuff everywhere, which I appreciate.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_01: I'm a simple person.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_01: I need things very, very simply.
• 10:45
  And I think I told you that I received an email from Research
• 10:48
  Rabbit and they are
• 10:49
  going to launch a new version of their app and they are
• 10:53
  partnering with Leadmaps.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 10:55
  So that does make sense that there will be some consolidation
• 11:00
  as they're looking
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_01: for academic markets.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_01: Because eventually I think that from a marketing perspective,
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_01: all of these outfits really want to sell this to the university,
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_01: not to individuals.
• 11:12
  They want the university to pay a license so anybody can use it
• 11:15
  instead of going
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_01: one researcher at a time.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_01: Not that one researcher at a time is bad,
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  but if you can sell it to 5,000 researchers at a time and then
• 11:25
  you get paid once
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_01: instead of 5,000 small installments.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_01: And like me, I'm like, I don't want this again.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_01: And so I'm not going to do it this time.
• 11:34
  And that's partially what's on my mind as kind of what's going
• 11:40
  to happen next,
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_01: because that happened with all kinds of research software,
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_01: whether it's SPSS or anything that was licensed,
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_01: Qualtrics and all of that.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_01: It eventually goes to the institutional license.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's interesting.
• 11:56
  Research Rabbit said that they are going to launch their new
• 11:58
  version in October.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_00: I just visited their website and I cannot see any difference.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_00: So maybe we need to wait.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_01: And,
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_01: these things sometimes take us a little bit longer,
• 12:09
  especially since one of the things that they don't control is
• 12:12
  most of these outfits
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_01: sit on top of other pieces of software,
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_01: whether it's Google Scholar or whether it's...
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_01: all kinds of other data, including the LLMs themselves.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_01: And every time they change something in the algorithm in the LLM,
• 12:30
  they might have to do some fine-tuning to make sure the product
• 12:33
  still works and all
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_01: of that.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_01: So that's always something they will be chasing, I'm guessing.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_01: All right, let's talk about the paper.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_01: I'm excited to hear what's going on there.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, yes.
• 12:45
  I wanted to choose a paper that is very specifically focused on
• 12:50
  lead maps,
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_00: and I was very lucky to find that paper.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_00: The paper has been published in 2022.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 12:57
  And in the very beginning of the paper,
• 13:00
  they say lead maps was launched in 2016.
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, so it's been around for a while.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, by Kyle Webster, a molecular biology PhD candidate.
• 13:09
  And Axton Pitt was a neuroscience and he turned software
• 13:15
  developer to overcome the
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_00: problem commonly experienced by researchers and students.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_00: Or in other words, navigating scientific literature.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_00: So that's very interesting.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_00: I found that information very interesting.
• 13:31
  By the way,
• 13:31
  you can see that because when you look at the website,
• 13:34
  it does look like molecules.
• 13:36
  So the fact that the molecular biologist has done this,
• 13:40
  I'm like,
• 13:40
  yeah,
• 13:40
  that does make sense.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, yes, that makes sense.
• 13:43
  I didn't look at that in that way,
• 13:45
  but yeah,
• 13:45
  now that you are saying that,
• 13:46
  yes.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_00: So talking about the meta section of that paper,
• 13:51
  obviously they use lead maps and they created a literature map
• 13:58
  by using the word
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_00: open educational resources.
• 14:02
  So the map included 36 relevant papers and the first 20 were
• 14:07
  core articles and 16
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_00: were suggested by lead maps.
• 14:12
  So maybe it kind of explains what you experienced with your
• 14:16
  search with late maps.
• 14:18
  And each paper became a node and lines showing citations and
• 14:22
  references between those nodes.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_00: So, and obviously it's a kind of visual tool.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_00: So visualization settings allowed nodes to scale by number of citations,
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_00: labels to show snippets or titles,
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_00: and also timelines to trace growth of research.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_00: So they experienced the same things.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_00: They mostly just,
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_00: I think it was in the beginning of just using those,
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_00: and those tools were not that much prevalent at that time.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_00: So the paper doesn't really...
• 14:58
  dives into all of the applications of that tool,
• 15:02
  but they talk about the feature of Lit Maps.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_00: So they say some of the features are dynamic visualization.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_00: You can hover over articles to see citation links.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's a powerful search.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: You can use keywords, authors, ORCID IDs, or imported bibliographies.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, there are recommendations of closely connected papers.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_00: And you can share the map, which I really love for collaboration.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: And you can even embed maps on websites.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_00: And there's also citation network search to find related works,
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: which are two or more steps away.
• 15:47
  And what I love is that feature to be able to put those lead
• 15:52
  maps on a website.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_01: That to me is leading to the point that I've been making, which is.
• 16:00
  we need more permanent ways to show the structure of the
• 16:04
  literature with a
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_01: proliferation of just the sheer quantity of papers out there?
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think permanent and also dynamic.
• 16:11
  So if something new comes up,
• 16:14
  then it's being added to the map automatically.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_01: And that's where you want it because we've spent years on...
• 16:25
  really cataloging and organizing the information about things
• 16:31
  that have been very popular.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_01: So I think about recently,
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_01: I mean,
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_01: we talked about TPAC even in this time,
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_01: but if we talk about different models like the TAM models,
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_01: about technology adoption,
• 16:45
  um theory or others it it would be great to have a place that
• 16:51
  keeps on populating
• 16:52
  automatically instead of somebody having to spend literally
• 16:55
  hours every week
• 16:57
  cataloging every article and every proceedings that use that
• 17:02
  theory i mean it is
• 17:04
  possible and people have done it tpac for years had a website
• 17:07
  that somebody very
• 17:08
  dedicated just kept adding to but now we can do it
• 17:11
  automatically which is fantastic
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_01: and visually
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 17:15
  And finally,
• 17:16
  they talked about the advantages of using LeetMaps for
• 17:19
  researchers.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_00: They said it's easy to track how research field develops over time.
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_00: I personally love that.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_00: This has been my question, especially when you want to do a kind of…
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_00: Very deep list review.
• 17:31
  You always want to know when that kind of trend started and how
• 17:34
  it developed.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_00: So it also helps avoid missed papers due to keyword errors.
• 17:40
  It allows creation of overlapping maps to explore intersections
• 17:44
  across disciplines.
• 17:46
  And it has customizable layouts that you can customize by
• 17:51
  publication date,
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_00: by citation count,
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_00: or by topic similarity.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_00: So they also said that Lit Maps is like a Google Maps for citations.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
• 18:04
  And what I'm starting to see in systematic reviews is that in
• 18:09
  some cases they say
• 18:11
  we searched Scopus and SEI indexed research and lead maps and
• 18:15
  web of science.
• 18:16
  So it's really interesting to see how it's becoming a tool that
• 18:22
  people use as part
• 18:23
  of this other set of tools to make sure that they're extracting
• 18:29
  everything that
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_01: they need to find.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_00: It was a short paper,
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: but,
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: yeah,
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_00: it was interesting that they did that kind of research at that time,
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_00: even,
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_00: yeah.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_01: And,
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_01: again,
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_01: just to add,
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_01: some of the research actually includes delete maps to show,
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_01: especially,
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_01: again,
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_01: in systematic reviews,
• 18:52
  which is something we're interested in occasionally or
• 18:54
  sometimes hate occasionally.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_01: But,
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 18:59
  it's a way to think about what is another way to show how the
• 19:03
  articles around this
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_01: topic are connected to each other.
• 19:06
  So who cites whom and all of that and the robustness of the
• 19:10
  references and all of that.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_01: Those are really, really nice.
• 19:13
  And there are other applications we're probably going to talk
• 19:16
  about another time.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_01: But there are other applications in Biblio research.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_00: Mm-hmm.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's it for today.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_01: Episode 7 is done.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: Episode 7 is done.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_01: And we're moving on.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_00: We are moving on.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_00: See you next time.