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- Chesla Wechsler: This is the part where we're gonna segue into the Doc Martin people, so if you're a Best Medicine unspoiled listener or watcher, this is where you wanna bail out. There will be Doc Martin spoilers in this one, especially given it was episode that had Martin Clunes in it. Plenty of for us to talk about. So if you do wanna get those spoilers, you wanna leave now. This is my final warning. It seems quite fitting to have a Doc Martin super fan in the studio today to talk about the long awaited Martin Clunes episode of Best Medicine, cleverly titled Doc Martin. So we're joined today by Kathy, come through and welcome back to Podcast Portwenn. Here's my Podcast Portwenn service announcement. This episode informs us that the Best doesn't discuss Rosemary and is so shut down about it that Robert can't even say her name. When I saw the preview for last week's episode, that hit me in the gut. I want to tell folks, if you have a tragedy that hits your family, especially when you have small children, shutting down and burying it is a defense mechanism, but it's really not a good way to go. Martin Clunes made his debut as Martin's dad, someone I hope to see again, especially as Best Medicine is officially renewed. To chat about this episode cleverly called Doc Martin, I have Doug and Erica, two of my 'Best Medicine' unspoiled people. Come through and welcome back to Podcast Kathy: Hey there, Chesla. How are you doing today? Chesla Wechsler: I am well and it's great to see you again. Thanks for joining. Kathy: My pleasure, my pleasure, completely. Chesla Wechsler: Excellent. So been waiting for this one for a long time. I just want to put a quarter in you and let you go. ⁓ Portwenn. Erica Susko: Hello. Doug B: Good to be here. Chesla Wechsler: Good to see you guys, thanks for coming. So I'm gonna just launch right in here, I'm excited. So Doug, what did you think? Kathy: yes. Well, this the best one yet, the best episode yet. That doesn't mean it's perfect, but it's definitely the best episode yet. Chesla Wechsler: dad lost his first wife when he had an almost eight-year-old, a five-year-old, and a one-and-a-half-year-old. His approach to handling it was to shut down, tell the children that it was very sad, that they had to move on, and then they never talked about it. He remarried and they had me. Even though I wasn't even a twinkle in anyone's eyes when this all happened, Dad's which I'm sure that he perceived as a gift to us, that we could reason away or logic to get ourselves out of any emotion, Doug B: Well, I was a little disappointed that we didn't find out whole thing about Rosemary. Just that it was a thing and there was no more information there. I was surprised that his parents didn't know why he left. So his blood secret is still his secret that he not shared with other folks. I really, so one thing I enjoyed was Chesla Wechsler: I agree. Kathy: I've decided ⁓ are really to the point where they're just taking off and this is their own show. This is not really, it's maybe inspired Doc Martin, but their own show. doing their own thing. Chesla Wechsler: Yes. Kathy: Doc's father, parents coming to visit. Both parents were interesting. They were so different from Ellingham's parents, his mother especially. Martin Ellingham's ⁓ was, you society matron. Everything was just You did everything perfectly. Vanessa, Dr. Best's mother, Chesla Wechsler: that was not the right approach for children. impacted my siblings greatly and based on the general vibe that it set in the family and approach my parents took to emotion, it affected me too. It taught us all that emotions, especially the quote unquote bad ones like hurt and sadness were useless, silly to dwell in and optional. All of us had mental health that we had to work on and my brother never beat his. Doug B: kind of like, how did Martin turn out so well, given where he came from? So compared to his parents, he's just, he's an easygoing, nice likeable guy. So I thought that was kind of an interesting juxtaposition. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Yeah. Sure, sure, what'd you think Erica? Erica Susko: I liked it. I think we saw finally a separation from doctor ⁓ ⁓ event with some mass illness or something like that, or delaying the event and everyone getting mad at him, you know, while he wasn't on board in joining the slumber party so much. At least they didn't have that set up again. So I liked that a lot. I thought was a lot of sweet moments. Kathy: is a psychiatrist or a psychologist. I'm not sure which, but she has clients and she goes for radical honesty. And she has a, well, Margaret Ellingham had opinions about everything, but Vanessa Best definitely has opinions about everything. And she doesn't hesitate to express them. Chesla Wechsler: Yes. dying of a fentanyl overdose. So if tragedy strikes you like this, please talk about it, grieve, get help to work through it. Do not say, I cannot and I will not talk about her. Thanks for listening. Kathy: So for instance, she told Elaine that you're just spouting garbage when you could be great art. ⁓ Erica Susko: between Louisa and the doctor, and actually the doctor and a few different people. was nice to get a chance. I never the Doc so I'm not familiar with the actor that played. ⁓ So I didn't have of a connection to him, so to speak, but it was good to see that maybe Martin isn't bad when look at ⁓ how bad his father is. Chesla Wechsler: Yes, a message I thought Elaine needed to hear. That's why you're here. Kathy: Yes, yes, but then Al told her, no, I love everything you do. And I thought, Al, don't mess this up. She could be doing something better. Chesla Wechsler: But you know what that reminded me of though was hiding Pauline's application for nursing school. Erica Susko: We've had a lot of like touching moments and he really kind of opened up. I love that he's trying the, what did he call it? The immersion therapy or something with the blood vial ⁓ exposure. That's it. Exposure therapy with the blood in the cabinet. Interesting with with Elaine and Vanessa kind of telling her how it is. ⁓ She took that to heart. But I do. ⁓ Kathy: yes, that really upset me. ⁓ he shouldn't have done that. And she found him out and she ⁓ off to nursing school anyway. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. or exposure or something. Yeah. do you, I mean, we learned that Al has perfect scores on his SATs, right? So he's a smart kid. Do you think he like just loves Elaine and wants to support her by being complimentary? Or do you think he really believes that she's doing good stuff? Because, you know, I think all of us know she's not, unless it's an age group thing and they think that this is fun, but, or is he in a sense kind of a... Erica Susko: I did also like how they ended it with Rosemary's name up there. It's clear that, the doctor's working through some of his stuff and he's trying to, growing, you know, a lot of growth. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, I agree. undermining her because if she continues to do garbage, she won't leave the town. She won't be successful. Kathy: That's a good way of looking at it, but the whole town seems to support her and her efforts. So I don't think it's just Al. But yes, I think it's a little bit of both. He doesn't want her to leave. But on the other hand, he could probably go anywhere he wants if he's got those SAT scores. And as Louisa pointed out, they're good for five years. Yeah, yeah, so he could be staying for his father. Chesla Wechsler: Yes. Doug B: Picking up on what Erica said about the growth, so I thought it was interesting how Louisa, I think, helped Martin see that he needs to acknowledge, maybe talk about his past so that he can get through it. She was using the analogy of the school and all the events at the school that's going away. She said, you know, it's like if we don't talk about it, it never happened. I said, hmm. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. he's charming too. Mm-hmm. Kathy: Not likely, but possible. But ⁓ for Elaine and then maybe just likes living in Portwenn. ⁓ I don't And there's nothing with that. he could make a there, but could also do something else and then come back and ⁓ be benefit to the town. ⁓ But on Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, Right. Doug B: And that seemed to really hit home for him. And then he his dad and why didn't we talk about this? Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. And he went right out and he talked to Aunt Sarah to find out why he wasn't invited or he didn't go back to her, right? Yeah, yeah. Kathy: thought of Vanessa, Martin Best's mother. Who did she criticize? She criticized Sarah, ⁓ her this bluster of hers was just covering up her or something. I even remember what. Sarah got right back at her, thank goodness. ⁓ She also criticized, she criticized Mark. Doug B: Right, Yeah, that crazy Aunt Sarah, who would have ever thought? Erica Susko: I really loved his line though that he said, nothing for me to forgive. I thought that it was ⁓ I did. I that was really touching. I think bigger picture even outside of the show, I don't enough people consider that as an option of saying, it's okay. Like made a mistake and you did something and ⁓ you don't need forgive, you don't need forgiveness. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yes. Yes. Kathy: How could you possibly be a friend, and this is not what you said, but I'm paraphrasing, a friend of my son's when you have no cognitive ability, whatever, you're so basically dumb. Chesla Wechsler: Right, yeah, and the way he said it, I don't remember the exact wording, but interestingly, she says, can you forgive me? And he says, no, and you're like, right? But he doesn't say there's nothing to forgive. He says it a little differently. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That was pretty cruel. Kathy: just, you know, lets it slide right off. ⁓ you're so funny. You're just like your son, I think. Chesla Wechsler: Right. And pulls them in for a group hug like they all loved that. Kathy: Right? I still ⁓ can't understand how Louisa with him for eight years. But then Vanessa, again, with ⁓ radical honesty, she tells Louisa that very kind. ⁓ And ⁓ I, as much as don't like version of Louisa, because she's kind of shrill and... ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yes. Kathy: nervous and ⁓ to be all over the place. ⁓ is kind. ⁓ Erica Susko: You've done nothing that requires forgiveness. Yeah, or that you need to be forgiven for something like that. Chesla Wechsler: She is very kind. I thought we got a sense right off the bat or that you need to be forgiven for. Yeah. Yeah. It was better. Yeah, I thought that was good. did you think of You've now seen two new actors, right? We've got Judith who played Vanessa, and we've got Martin Clunes, who played Robert. and Robert, the distance between the Best family when Martin calls them by their first names. And then. Kathy: Well, that could be the psychologist mother, Chesla Wechsler: So Doug, what'd think? Doug B: ⁓ I'm kind of drawing the analogy that I have is episode one. Right? It's like I really wanted to like the doctor, but really didn't like the doctor. And these guys, I mean, there's, there seemed be to like about them. They, you know, they were just mean and rude and unpleasant. So, so acting. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: I remember growing up, it was a thing that people would call their parents, but you just have him, the way he says, I am their offspring. ⁓ Yeah. Good acting. Yes. Yes. I thought there was very good acting. You did dislike them and that was the point. What about you, Erica? ⁓ Kathy: ⁓ my goodness. Chesla Wechsler: It wasn't they are my parents. It was I am their offspring. And I wonder if they're sending us a message with that. Like, they don't parent at all. But yeah, they bore me. Doug B: Right. Erica Susko: I actually liked them. I'm gonna go out on a limb here. I mean, I liked them for their characters were. And maybe What you said is a better way to say it. Obviously it was good acting, but I thought that they stuck to their characters and they were different. And bringing them into a town of, let's just say do-gooders and smilers and happy people. And here ⁓ they came from this town. Kathy: Yes. On the other hand, Vanessa and Robert somewhat close. He was defending her to Martin. She can't even go to the salon now because of him. He has embarrassed them. I thought, hmm. I don't recall Christopher. Chesla Wechsler: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Erica Susko: or visited this town and now they ended up this way. And I thought it was a great full circle of Vanessa being the harsh truth person. And then here she gets the harsh truth and she's hitting the pinata and Chesla Wechsler: Right. Yeah. Kathy: or Margaret Ellingham saying that had embarrassed them by moving to Portwenn in Cornwall. don't recall. Erica Susko: not handling it really well. I thought that was a great moment. Chesla Wechsler: Shh. mean, they certainly thought that he embarrassed him by becoming a GP in a backwards town. So I got that sense that, I mean, I'm not sure if it was the idea, but the whole idea that he was a GP was very embarrassing because he'd fallen from such a high position. Isn't she a psychiatrist? ⁓ Erica Susko: That's what she said. She said, I think she said she was a harsh, truth psychologist or something. something. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I forget how she worded it, but I just thought they had a lot of to what we've seen from other characters in the show. ⁓ so I enjoyed watching that. Chesla Wechsler: Radical radical honesty or something Kathy: Right, they were very critical of him, treated him as he basically he was a horrible He never did anything to make them feel So on the scale of parenting. Chesla Wechsler: My opinion was in one episode you have more depth of character around these two people than we get depth of character in nine episodes of other people. And maybe because this was sort of a one-off, like they're gonna be here for this one episode so their entire character needs developing right off the bat. Kathy: I think they were the worst parents. And then the Bests are, they're not great parents, and they're not average, but they're one or two rungs above the Ellinghams. Chesla Wechsler: I agree, yeah, yeah. It would be tough to be worse than the Ellinghams. I mean, don't get a sense that Martin's been beaten or locked in a closet, right? And told he was miserable his whole life and always weak and always, a child and a whiner and all that, so. ⁓ Doug B: are we allowed to ask is that how Doc Martin is and you know, is that how the senior Doc Martin is? Kathy: No. Chesla Wechsler: Well, you're allowed to anything. Kathy: whining Doug B: Right, but you won't tell us, okay. Kathy: and letting bullies beat up on him. We didn't get that from them anyway. Chesla Wechsler: Correct, No. No. Yes. the half of ⁓ this episode, will be talking through that with my Doc Martin people, but have to keep guys unspoiled, you know? ⁓ So I have apologize to Erica because I was convinced we'd know the root cause of the blood phobia, but it is what it is. ⁓ Hopefully we'll find at some point, but we certainly could see. We don't even have a marriage strain between Robert and until the I mean, they seem to be fine together. They're happy together. And it's not until Robert's gambling problem and the sort of lying he's been doing to Vanessa pops up. Erica Susko: their point. Kathy: Yeah, that was, really has a problem. And ⁓ have to wonder when go back to their home, as he she's up there plotting against me or something. And Martin says, well, not. ⁓ ⁓ it'll be ⁓ wonder how things go for them they get back to their home. Erica Susko: Yeah. Chesla Wechsler: in that last scene. I watched the episode three times. There's a lot of prep stuff, because there's a lot of things that you pick up that are arcs from the original show that I talk about in the second half of this. ⁓ at the very end when Robert is talking to ⁓ and he just says, I cannot and I will not talk about her. Yeah, plotting her revenge, Kathy: I mean, I would think that he needs to go back to work pay off his gambling debts. ⁓ he be able to avoid Francesca, ⁓ bookie? ⁓ don't Chesla Wechsler: Mm-hmm. And you just look at his eyes and his face and his, the tension in his face. there's just so much emotion in that. And we... Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Interesting difference in the plots there. The new things that I thought we saw I don't about you, but I've always wondered, like, there's no insurance forms, there's no payments in this office, but we finally see a reference to a copay with a chicken, right? And there's a little nod back to Doc Martin because doesn't, Erica Susko: And he took a beat between he said, cannot and will not talk about her. Like he took that beat, like really hit home on that. That was nicely done. Chesla Wechsler: Yes. Yeah. And you know, Aunt Sarah earlier when was asking him and he said something like, I'm not going to talk about that. This nothing to do with that. And she says, you mean her. And you really get a sense that this is a taboo subject. Kathy: Right. Chesla Wechsler: Montgomery say, they pay you in chickens or something like that? So, here's somebody paying in chickens. Kathy: Yes, yes she does, yes. Chesla Wechsler: And I'm going to tell everybody who's watching this, I put a little Podcast Portwenn service announcement at the end of this segment, which you can choose to listen to or you can choose not. It's a little personal reflection about how to handle tragedy in your family when young children are in there. Cause it's just something that I've got a little bit of experience with. mentioned last week that, that idea of not talking about something hit home. Kathy: when his parents walk in the door. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yes, the most embarrassing thing, his whole office is in bedlam. Yeah. Kathy: It really was a little kid blowing on his horn and obviously very good at it, just like the little who moved in across the alley from, ⁓ played Violin. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, that's right. Bernie, Bernie. Yeah, yeah. Kathy: Yes, and her mother who just thought she was talented. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: So unfortunately, Doug, this disappoints you, also, we get to talk about it. So that was a stinker. What stood out to you about this episode? I mean, we see a lot of ⁓ interplay between Martin and his parents. Either of you wanna talk about it? Doug, wanna start? That's right. Kathy: talked about how most of the episodes focus on an event in the town, some kind of an event. And I was thinking, well, we don't really have an event, but we do. It's the sleep-in, the sleepover. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Doug B: One of the things that jumped out at me is, and we had very little of this, but when they were working on Mark, when both doctors were working on Mark, despite the open conflict, when they had a doctor thing to do, ⁓ were together. Right? They seemed, you know, once agreed what they were going to do, even though that was different, they were together on, okay, we're going to do this, let's do this together. ⁓ by the way, I gotta go fast, because there might be blood. So I thought that was kind of cool. Chesla Wechsler: Yes, yes. did you see, Erica, what did you think? Erica Susko: I thought it was interesting that there was not between parents and but between husband and wife, no eye contact, physical contact. There was never any ⁓ hug, hello, goodbye, of a hand, hand on the small of your back, leading you into a room, his wife into the room. ⁓ and we see a lot of that with Martin. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Erica Susko: where, I not to that degree, but you could see where he wouldn't be comfortable getting a hug, even when Aunt Sarah hugs him and he's like, okay, all right, we don't need it to do that. You can tell that he's, I would assume, maybe I should say, I assume he picked that up from watching his parents have that kind of lack of Chesla Wechsler: Right. Yeah, it could be. just remember at the very beginning, and I don't know why this stood out to me, probably because these characters were being introduced to me for the first time and I was attuned to Martin Clunes to see how he would be, I did notice that she had his arm. Like she was holding his arm when they first came into the surgery. But then after that, I don't think there was a heck of a lot of contact You they were always sitting across from him. didn't have the two of them looking at each other. They were always sort of parallel. And it was, to me, it looked very much them against Martin. Erica Susko: Well, and even though the arm walking in, to me, it looked more like a serviceable act, not an attentive or caring act. was almost like that generation does that. They help their wife into a room or up the stairs, carry their suitcase kind of thing. So I took it as more of a serviceable act than love. Not that they don't love each other, but... Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah. It did, yeah, I agree. It sort of looked stiff. Yeah. Yeah. And then you've got this angle of him, you know, having this gambling issue going on. Erica Susko: Yeah. Sounds like that might've stemmed from Rosemary situation. Sometimes deal with grief by diving into something and then it becomes an addiction, maybe not. But it does seem from his reaction and Aunt Sarah's reaction and Martin's reaction that it might've been parents' fault or something that, for the accident. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, it's... Erica Susko: They might've been more involved at it. You know, having, there's grief, I'm sure even if you weren't involved, if they weren't involved, there'd be grief. I'm not saying that, but the about it and to mention her name or anything, it seems they had, you know, they might have a part in it. I'm not sure. Chesla Wechsler: All right. I have a theory I'm trying to figure out if I should share it in here or am I gonna share it at the back end? But it's, know, the whole Rosemary thing is a brand new plot arc. So it doesn't have anything to do with Doc Martin. things stuck out at me that make me like try and what I think happened. I it was odd when Martin and Robert were outside of the cafe and they were holding their coffees ⁓ and Martin was asking Robert questions and he was challenging him on whether he went out. And it just seemed odd when Robert stops and he just said, I'm still your father. If I say I didn't go out, I didn't go out. And that just seemed like an odd thing to say at that time. I'm still your father. Like, why was that his complaint being confronted about whether or not he went out? There was another point where Robert sort of left the room and Vanessa came in and she just says, Martin, what have you done? And I just got a sense that Martin probably grew up with Martin, have you done? Like has he even blamed for everything all the time? And Robert says to Martin when he sits down, you never grew out of fidgeting, did you? So, and then at the very end when Mark is impaled, Robert comes in and just says, what have you done here? And I put all those things together into a theory. Like I had my complicated grief theory, but now I have my, Robert was at fault, but he blamed Martin. Erica Susko: That very well could be, yeah. Chesla Wechsler: Just from a Doc Martin perspective, I thought that there were a lot of ⁓ what I would call broad that we saw. And there were also a lot of little subtle Easter egg-y kind of things. ⁓ Yes. Yep. And Martin trying to do his ⁓ exposures training or desensitization with blood. Right? Yep. That's theory, ⁓ I'm sticking to it until new piece of information comes up. Doug B: I wonder if we'll ever find out. Chesla Wechsler: I know. I don't think it'll be this season. I really think that they have to bring back Martin Clunes and Judith Ivey. I think the parents have to come back for this to all come out. Kathy: mean, the broad one was the guy with the hairball. Doug B: Yes. Erica Susko: Well, if they're talking about selling Aunt Sarah's house, might just, mean, I'm assuming it's just for the gambling thing, but if they are truly gonna sell the house, that opens up a whole nother storyline and they would have to come back at some point. Kathy: Yes. Yes. Chesla Wechsler: the need to sell Aunt Sarah's house because it was left to him. I mean, it wasn't half his in this show, like it was in Doc Martin. It was like all his and she was just living there. Yeah. Yeah. Kathy: Yes. Doug B: Well, now wait, maybe I didn't understand it. Are they selling Aunt Sarah's house where Aunt Sarah lives now? Or are they selling their house where they live? Chesla Wechsler: Yes. Kathy: So I wonder if it really is. But she's been living there ⁓ for ages. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Now, over there. Erica Susko: It seems like Aunt Sarah lives in the family house, but it was left to Robert when their parents passed away. But since Sarah stayed in Port Wenn she's living there. Chesla Wechsler: Correct. Right. And of course Aunt Sarah doesn't have two nickels to rub together, so. Doug B: So. Wow, I totally missed that. I thought they were selling their house where Vanessa and Robert live. Chesla Wechsler: Mm-mm. No, because they, I guess they grew up in Port Wenn, right? Yeah, I, I, yeah. Doug B: ⁓ okay. Right. Chesla Wechsler: So it must have been the will. That's why it was left to me ⁓ as the eldest Very pompous. Erica Susko: That's what, yeah, that's what it sounded like. I only picked it up because when, when Robert when Sarah said, why are you here? Robert ⁓ ⁓ came to sell the house ⁓ Sarah said, ⁓ house. ⁓ he said, no, it's my house. Our left it to me. Kathy: He was very pompous. Of course you can buy it from me. Jerk. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, jerk is right. And that was delivered very, you just get a sense that there's not a lot of love lost between Sarah and Robert, right? Doug B: ⁓ okay, that's Kathy: whatsoever. He's very pompous. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: as the eldest son. Yeah. And we've got the Aunt Sarah has an affair Doug B: Got it. Kathy: Right, right, which is why Martin could no longer come and visit her when he was 10 or 11 or whatever. Doug B: Wow, okay. Chesla Wechsler: okay. What did you think of Vanessa's interactions with Erica. Mm-hmm. but a different choice on her part. Erica Susko: They're harsh but truthful. Honestly, I think Elaine needed to hear that. I just don't know that she needed hear it from a complete stranger and in the harsh that she did hear it. It's time for Elaine to ⁓ realize she. Kathy: Yeah, I was surprised that she would choose her lover as over him. Chesla Wechsler: I was also surprised. Erica Susko: I hate another person garbage, but she does do garbage stuff. ⁓ me add another rubber band. think the first episode was her adding a rubber band. ⁓ seen her opening stuff from a box. We've seen her just really stuff that I would never stop those things if I was scrolling on my phone. So it is kind of a good point to say, ⁓ you're not doing You're never gonna Chesla Wechsler: Mm-hmm. Doug B: You Chesla Wechsler: But you know, it wasn't like a John Slater situation with Joan because Slater was unattached. Whereas Sarah was the unattached one and ⁓ we don't know the name of this man, but. Erica Susko: get out of Port Wenn and do this. it was interesting that it didn't click to her when she accidentally filmed the guy throwing up the hairball. And she's like, I'm finally taking off. It's like, because you something that was worth seeing, I guess. I I wouldn't want to see it, but I didn't want see it in the show. ⁓ Kathy: Exactly. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: You know, was he gonna leave his wife to be with her? Kathy: Well, obviously not. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, because they moved away. But yeah, but Aunt Sarah, just like Aunt Joan, it ends up being a lose-lose proposition because she loses Martin and she loses him. And Aunt Joan gave up John Slater for Martin, you know, made the other sacrifice and then Christopher wouldn't send Martin. Yeah, I will share this. Hairball is a plot line of the original Doc Martin and it is probably everyone's least favorite. Kathy: Yeah, she lost Martin anyway. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. It went a little, it was more extensive. And, ⁓ yeah. Doug B: We always have that to look forward to. Chesla Wechsler: It was interesting that they, yes, you do. And they portrayed Robert as a gastroenterologist, was a, you know, that was different. But idea of the hairball guy was, You get more character development even the people appear on one episode in Doc Martin. Thank you. Erica Susko: So perhaps this was just a nod because real Doc Martin or the original Doc Martin was guest starring on this show as Robert Best. Was that like a nod to him where you think this is going to take off and be something? Chesla Wechsler: Well, are many nods to him that I'm not going to talk about in this segment, but the use of plot arcs differently from Doc Martin in Best Medicine has been happening the whole series. I don't think I've been bringing them up, but this one just bore special mention because it's everybody's least favorite one. I mean, you've got 79 episodes worth of medical problems. Erica Susko: Okay. Chesla Wechsler: That was, yeah. I was a little bummed when contradicted Vanessa. Cause thought ⁓ Elaine taking a lesson, right? That maybe she's just producing garbage content and then Al turns around and says, I love your show. Erica Susko: That's a good boyfriend. Doug B: Yeah, yeah, he has ulterior motives. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Do you recall? Yes, he does. Do you recall what we learned about Al though, when they were at the school? Do you recall anything from that, They were looking at pictures on the memory wall. Al had perfect SATs, right? Erica Susko: Yep, he got a perfect math and English score. that's when Louisa said, they last for five years. So obviously Al didn't go away to college or take any courses or anything like that locally. ⁓ Kathy: Did you notice his voice? Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, I I thought a very good American accent. Erica and Doug didn't even think, yeah, that's right, this guy's British. Like, they didn't even have this. It sounded like a guy faking an accent. Mm-hmm. But he's a smart cookie. He's probably somebody who could leave Port Wenn if he wanted. Doug B: Right. Chesla Wechsler: All right. it looks like they're going to close the school. I was surprised that the principal just bailed. Kathy: To me, it didn't sound like Martin Clunes. But his voice sounded raspy to me, like maybe ⁓ trying to do the American accent, he doing with his throat. And maybe that could just be me. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Mm-hmm. Erica Susko: I assumed that was to further Louisa's more than you make her front center. Because it didn't really make much sense to me for any other reason than to give her more of a prominent role in the school. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Maybe. Have you ever tried to do an accent? looked at some YouTube videos on, think RP, on how to actually speak with a British accent. It is difficult and your voice. ⁓ Mm-hmm. What'd you think, Doug? It sounded like you were gonna say something there. Doug B: Well, so here's a prediction and, know, hopefully I'll, hopefully I won't be wrong or horribly wrong. But so, Doc Martin offered to help Aunt Sarah. like, you know, I'll help you out Aunt Sarah. It's like, I'm not taking charity from you. Like, well, so he's a doctor. been, he had practice, I he's not young. So he drives an Audi. So he has a few dollars. He could save the school for Louisa, his love. He just doesn't realize it yet. Chesla Wechsler: your vocal cords act differently. Like it's as if you've trained your voice to be one way your whole life and now you're asking it to do something very different. That would be interesting. Yeah, I like that. Erica Susko: I like that. Doug B: Just throwing it out. So while were we talking about Louisa? So I thought it was interesting how the interaction between her and Mark at the very end. Mark kind of said, I'm done, I'm moving on. And I thought that was interesting that that occurred just a few minutes after Vanessa told Louisa, know, you can be in love with them, watch out what you're buying. Chesla Wechsler: Mm-hmm. Yeah, that was a great quote, too. The Best men are difficult. Doug B: So I thought that was foreshadowing. Chesla Wechsler: But it's difficult. It is difficult to do that. So I agree. was raspy and a little higher pitched. And also think that that could have been a creative choice in order to add the age factor. Erica Susko: Thank you. Doug B: Yeah, yeah, I like that. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, because you can take best as a family name or an adjective. Right? In this case. But yeah, it's interesting that Mark's finally gonna move on. And It took me three watchings actually catch he said, which was, I almost died and I almost died hating the person who saved me. But I didn't catch that the first two times. Doug B: I didn't catch that either. Chesla Wechsler: And yeah. Doug B: So thinks that Louisa saved him? Chesla Wechsler: because she was the one, because he was panicking, right? He's got this thing stuck through his gut and he's panicking. And she figured out school song would sort of calm him down. Doug B: Okay, Got it. Chesla Wechsler: And Martin was praising Louisa, her that it was a ⁓ plan and keep and all that. Erica Susko: you can tell that Louisa really cares for Mark and that their breakup was not out of spite or hate or anything other than they weren't meant to be together. She obviously cares a lot about him. And I think Mark saw that in this episode, that it was not about hating him or him being wrong for something or that he did anything wrong. She does care. Chesla Wechsler: He Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah. would not have been able to make her happy. Erica Susko: I wanna know what's gonna, not know. I'd like to see it play out times in this episode. Mark calls ⁓ his best bud. We're close, we're best buddies, all that. Mark unaware ⁓ of and Martin's kind of connection, sparks. I wonder how Mark will handle it as they move forward. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, thoughts on that Doug? Doug B: I have that same exact question as well, Erica. Yep. It's... I think, and I think it's going to be a challenge for Mark. Mark will not be very happy. Chesla Wechsler: Even if he's over her at this point? Doug B: Well, that's what he says. I'm not sure I believe him. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Well, he said something interesting by the memory tree. Like he almost wishes they didn't get back together, because why have those happy memories, right? If it's not going to be worth anything. Doug B: Yeah That's a point. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Erica Susko: Yeah, but even if you don't, you're over the relationship, to see ⁓ you consider your best bud developing this relationship with someone that you ⁓ about to marry could be another opening for another scenario, ⁓ storyline kind of thing. ⁓ think it would be a missed opportunity if they didn't explore that a little bit and ⁓ give Mark a little bit more of the humanity side. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. when you after Louisa broke up with Mark, who's the first person Mark starts wooing is Louisa's coworker, Jeannie, right? So he went for somebody close to her right off the bat. Little Karma, maybe? Yeah, little Karma. Erica Susko: So fair's fair. Chesla Wechsler: we are officially renewed for season two. Hoorah. yes. In my mind, that's where we needed to be. if they've got 13 episodes in the bag and they're feedback from the audience ⁓ on what's working and what's not, you know, you don't have a chance to fix anything or change anything. they made certain creative decisions for this season on how characters were going to be played. And, you know, maybe we'll be able to see things moved in a direction that make us as viewers, not that we're a representative sample necessarily, but, you know, happier viewers. So we went through some of the broad similarities, but there were also some more subtle reminders. Do you remember any of them? Kathy: Well, you know, neither one of them likes dogs. Ellingham can't dogs. Martin Best particularly care for them, but he's getting used to the little dog. Robert Best really excoriates the dog. You know, it's ⁓ Erica Susko: I did have one odd observation about the dog. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Erica Susko: So when Martin and Robert were walking, the dogs trotting along and we've seen over the last few episodes as much as Martin doesn't want anything to do with the dog. You kind of sense that he's starting to get used to him being around made the joke with Louisa. I think it was last episode, she I like your pet or something. He's like, not my pet. But he took it like a step further with his dad and he was like, I don't know that dog. I've never even seen that dog. ⁓ It kind of made me. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Yeah, he really was avoiding him. I mean, really giving him a wide berth. Kathy: And Martin says, well, does have a point when he went out. That was funny. ⁓ I didn't much at this show, but I chuckled little bit at that. Let's Chesla Wechsler: Right, yeah, not my dog. Yes, but- Yeah Yeah. Erica Susko: get a sense of fear from to Like, ⁓ didn't to show that he actually cared for an animal. ⁓ A dog, I think is what Robert called him or something like that. Like his reaction was just so much more over the top than what he normally does when people say, is that your dog or that's your pet? He ⁓ kind of you know, just was very specific to that's not my dog. I've never seen it before. Chesla Wechsler: Hmm. Kathy: Robert is very brusque. ⁓ When the guy threw up and they were leaving, he shouted back to Elaine, name, whoever you are, get that cleaned up. It's unhygienic. ⁓ That's very much a Ellingham thing to say. Chesla Wechsler: Brusque. Mm-hmm. Kathy: And that was right after his wife had told her she was putting out garbage. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Kathy: When Robert Best crashed his car into the tree avoiding a squirrel. don't even like squirrels, ⁓ his son says. ⁓ Doug B: I thought that was odd. But agree with you, Erica, I think he's fearful of telling the truth or I'm not sure what's up. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, I'll have to go check that out. Erica Susko: Maybe looking weak or, well, we go back to the emotion thing. You know, they aren't very emotional people to each other. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Kathy: Mark Mylow was there saying, oh, these are your parents. Oh, I'm his best friend. And Vanessa looks at him and she goes, you couldn't possibly be my son's best friend. You're not very smart. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Yeah. Kathy: Poor Mark. But nonetheless, Mark just lets ⁓ right over his head and he pulls everyone in for a group hug. I know about ⁓ Vanessa, Robert and Martin ⁓ aren't group hugs. So that a very awkward, funny moment. ⁓ Erica Susko: so one would think since there's not a lot of emotions and, you know, physical ⁓ interactions the parents and with Martin, Martin admitting he lets this dog follow him around, even if he doesn't admit it's, you know, his dog. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. And I just thought of that when you were talking that in Martin, Christopher Ellingham, it's not Margaret, but Christopher Ellingham is very disparaging of Mark Mylow because that's when he says he's going have to lock her up to keep her about Julie. Erica Susko: would be very disappointing to Robert. So I think he took it a step further to say, I don't even know that dog. Cause we open up with him, his father walking in and he's holding a chicken. And now we see a dog following them. know, Martin doesn't want to look Kathy: Yeah. Right, right, right. yeah, it's interesting that Christopher Ellingham is very much a ladies man. ⁓ And Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Erica Susko: ⁓ in front of his father, even the doctor's ⁓ office when he was looking at patients, anytime that Robert superseded him, no, this, no, do that with Mark's injury, no, we're doing this, we can't do that, Martin just shut down and shut up and just did it, which we haven't seen him do in other episodes. He's usually very good at fighting for his patients. ⁓ Kathy: Best refused even thought that he would have an affair. ⁓ He would never do that? ⁓ ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. It seems to me those two are actually a good couple still. Kathy: Yes, I agree. I think they're maybe not happily married, but contented there with each other until the very end when Vanessa finds out he's got a gambling problem and he's basically thrown away all their money. And he had been lying to her and she goes, here I am. How can I, Chesla Wechsler: Mm-hmm. Yeah. He did overrule Robert with respect to the guy with the cantaloupe balls. Like we're just gonna, I'm gonna send a prescription down to the, to the pharmacist for some pills or something. And Robert was the one who wanted to give him the shot. That was funny scene. Erica Susko: Yeah. Chesla Wechsler: and been lying to her. Kathy: put myself out there as a respected psychologist when I can't even realize what's going on with my own husband. Chesla Wechsler: Right. Right. Kathy: Let's see. Chesla Wechsler: Well, we were talking about when Robert says he swerved to avoid a squirrel. In my mind, I was thinking, yeah, a squirrel that wasn't there? I was thinking of Anthony. Yeah. ⁓ Doug B: with the pills was a good choice from my perspective. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, yeah, I'm sure, yes. I would think, yeah, that would certainly hurt less. sure there would be a local anesthetic, but, yeah. And at least give the guy an ice pack, right? Erica Susko: Thank ⁓ Kathy: Maybe it was Anthony who crossed the pond. Doug B: Hahaha Chesla Wechsler: that was ⁓ an Easter for Doc Martin fans. It obviously wasn't a, they didn't use an imaginary squirrel that was six feet tall as part of the plot, but to me that felt like a little nod to Anthony. Robert certainly had far more animosity and disgust towards the dog than we've seen from Martin. mean, he was very much like giving that dog a wide berth. Kathy: Yeah. Robert Best frequently says, 'Stop talking' patients, which is a Martin Ellingham thing. And when he was operating on Mark Mylow with the wires sticking him. And Martin looked at him and he says, that's no way to talk to a patient. ⁓ He's a person. Best just looks him he's a patient. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yes. You can tell that Aunt Sarah has no love for Robert. And I'm sure it's because he gave her the ultimatum, right? Choose the principal or choose your nephew. And we find that Aunt Sarah chooses the principal. Mm-hmm. Yeah, it was to me, it was, I think the wording was, he was calling him the patient and Martin said, not just a patient, he's a person. And that was like, like Louisa in Doc Martin could have said that to Martin, right? They're not bodies, they're people. over her nephew, ⁓ Erica Susko: I would like a little more of that story. I mean, because that's a big choice. I mean, you're talking about your everyday life, someone that you love and family that you love, but only see, you know, a couple of weeks a year. Kathy: Right, easily, Erica Susko: I don't know, do you choose to be for ⁓ % of the year to be with your nephew 10 % of the time? Or do you choose 90 % of the year you're with somebody that a companion and a love? I don't make that choice. I would not wanna have that choice, ⁓ Kathy: So are little Easter eggs for the Doc Martin fans. But the more I watched that, more I realized that ⁓ they are working into their own TV show. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, but we have to remember that, you know, it's, you know, some, even if we call it, you know, two out of 12, right? One sixth of the year is with Martin. This is the nephew whose sister was killed in a car accident and he was in the car. So like there's, to me, there's extenuating circumstances ⁓ I don't know, family, blood thicker than water, I don't know. They are. They are. Erica Susko: I don't think I would have made the same decision, but I'm not gonna blame, know, point fingers at her. Doug B: Hmm. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Right, right. We won't judge. We won't judge. Erica Susko: Yeah, we don't know all the facts around it, you know. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Doug B: But it would be interesting to find out. could certainly, ⁓ me too. Erica Susko: Right, I'd like to know more. Chesla Wechsler: With respect other subtle reminders, you were talking about, Mark saying he was his friend. ⁓ I also noticed later at end, he called Martin his partner, which seemed very dynamic duo-ish. We could do a flashback or something on that, right? Erica Susko: Yeah, but it was very touching when she did ask, as we talked about before, forgiveness. And Martin said he didn't need it. It was very raw of him ⁓ to thought it me. thought I was just annoying or too much, I think he said. ⁓ That's really hard say to anybody to open up like that. Doug B: Yeah, sure. Kathy: Yeah. Chesla Wechsler: Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah, Of of the episodes, where would you put this one in your favorites, not favorites? ⁓ Erica Susko: I think this might be my favorite one. Yeah, lots of growth, lots of still fun, still insight, little quirkiness here and there to keep it light. But I thought there was just so much ⁓ in that I've really enjoyed it. Chesla Wechsler: And when the guy had the cantaloupe balls and the two of them looking. Doug B: I enjoyed it as well, yeah, think for me it's in middle. in the middle it was okay. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Doug, what do you think? Kathy: and you're thinking ⁓ ⁓ ⁓ with the breasts. ⁓ ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: You really wanted to understand. ⁓ Yes, Gilbert Spencer with the breasts. Wow. Doug B: I guess I was really hoping there'd be more depth of understanding the Rosemary thing and the blood thing, but that really didn't play out. So that's probably my own fault for having those expectations. Chesla Wechsler: That was like the only wow and surprise on the face that I think we ever saw of Martin Ellingham, but that definitely reminded me of that. Yeah. I had those expectations. ⁓ gave you guys those expectations like, is the episode, right? I you. Kathy: I'd almost forgotten that, yes. And loved how they debated about how to treat him. You know, would you have cantaloupe balls for a week or a day? ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yes. Erica Susko: But I have to say, what I liked about it is, I keep talking about like the blood and stuff, and what was annoying me about not knowing what happened, at least we're seeing, no longer just seeing him ⁓ blood and freak out. Like see him evolving with it and trying to test his boundaries. And we see him Elaine knows and Louisa know. Chesla Wechsler: Right, Yeah. far more invasive to give the man a shot. Thanks, doc! Kathy: and the patient is going, you're going to me a shot. Where? ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yes, yes, Kathy: tell you that scene also reminded me of. And it was on ⁓ Martin Louise's day before he got in taxi. ⁓ was examining a woman her feet up, and he looking and whatnot. For some reason or another, the two of them looking there reminded me of that. ⁓ Erica Susko: Same thing with like other character developments and things. And the Rosemary story, at least we're talking about it. He wrote his, you he wrote her name down. So I don't necessarily need to know right away everything. I'm just glad we finally have something. And that's why I really liked the story. Yes, I obviously would have loved all the answers right away. Who wouldn't? But least we got something. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, yeah. Kathy: Like you said, there are just little tiny Easter eggs all throughout. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. And you know, sometimes they might not even be intentional and we might just be picking things up because we're kind of attuned and looking. I found this plot to be a more complex plot, right? Like you said at the beginning, it wasn't just wrapped around an event, but the idea, me there was so much more, it was just a much more complex plot, a lot more things going on that seemed to me to be real human experiences. So to me, this seemed much more like a Doc Martin episode than prior Medicine episodes, which just... Kathy: I'm sure they're intentional. ⁓ ⁓ mean, you know, all the things that they did in Doc Martin, that, even the reference of Anthony the giant squirrel ⁓ and James, ⁓ James and ⁓ you know, rabbit. ⁓ mean, was, that was you know, obvious right there. They were stuff up. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. He Stewart James? Yeah. Yes. Yeah. all screamed sitcom to me, whereas this one did not scream sitcom to me. This is more of the dramedy where funny things happen. And the eggplant and tomatoes, were a lot of little sight gags and stuff in Doc Martin. ⁓ right, so if we look at this now, instead of looking at as comparisons with Doc Martin just overall, Kathy: Yes, yes. Chesla Wechsler: So that made me happy. I don't know what's gonna happen going forward. Erica Susko: And that's probably why I picked That's why I picked it as one of my favorites. Hearing you describe it like that is, I'm confident that's why I really liked it. Chesla Wechsler: I liked this episode. And think the reason I really liked it so much is to me, this like a drama where funny things happened. Mm-hmm. Yeah, it wasn't just fluffy, formulaic stuff. I we see these two characters again. I don't think that they're predicted to come in this season. So I certainly hope don't drag this stuff into next season because wouldn't that be terrible? anyway, the fact that got 12 more episodes after this one that are planned for next season, it's good news. I don't know when they're filming that. which is how I've always sort of described Doc Martin. Like it's not a comedy, it's not slapstick, it's a drama. But funny things happen and it's realistic and they've got character development. Kathy: Yes. Chesla Wechsler: In this particular episode, you the hairball guy, but you learn nothing about his backstory. you don't care about him. He's just a guy with a problem. ⁓ He's caricaturish patient. Whereas in Doc Martin, that guy was, he was his farm and he was contacting his financial people and you were hoping that he would get to be living at his farm again. And he was renting from Auntie Joan. There was a whole backstory with this man that we don't get here. That said. With Vanessa and Robert, we get character development at a good depth, right? Kathy: Yes, we did. Chesla Wechsler: One thing I thought was interesting about this episode, was that Martin was actually recommending a treatment for Mark that wasn't the best treatment for Mark. And his recommendation was based on his blood phobia. Erica Susko: ⁓ you know what? Yeah, now that you say that. Chesla Wechsler: Right? Because he did not, he wanted the EMTs to arrive, he wanted to just cut the wire send them off. And here's his father, the gastroenterologist, who's saying, no, we, you know, we've got to pull this thing and get that foreign body out of him as quickly as we can to save on ⁓ sources or whatever it was. Kathy: For this episode, I really thought that the writing was much better than had it been in the previous episodes. And I don't know why that would be if Martin Clunes or Philippa Braithwaite had any influence on the writing, but it was, I thought, much improved. Because, as you said, it was more of a drama with funny things happening as opposed to being almost a slapstick comedy, which some of the earlier episodes were. Doug B: Well. Chesla Wechsler: Martin even says there's gonna be blood. He says there'll be a lot of blood. Erica Susko: Do you think that? Yeah. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Yeah. I agree. Yeah, didn't it? I felt like people just stepped up their game. Doug B: Well. Kathy: so it had more depth. Erica Susko: heard him say there's going to be a lot of blood, but I thought he was making the decision. You know, if we go back into the episode with the guy that swallows the hair trick, trick a phobia or something, whatever that is, ⁓ forget what that is. He was also recommending the guy go to the hospital when his father was saying, no, no, no, he doesn't need to go. ⁓ And. Kathy: Yeah, yeah. So I hope that that continues. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, I forget what it was, yeah. ⁓ Kathy: As Joe Penhale would say, fingers crossed. Chesla Wechsler: Yes, yes. No, I don't think his father recommended he didn't need to go. Erica Susko: When he came in, when he came back and the guy said, you know, before he actually threw up the hairball, Doc Martin, so Martin said, you have to go to the hospital right now. Chesla Wechsler: Mm-hmm. we did learn a lot about these two characters more than we would learn about, I was thinking like George and Greg, they told us their backstory, he was a chef and he was a finance guy, so you kind of got that narrative. You got a little bit of more than tell with... Right. Right. Erica Susko: And Robert said, no, come back in. We'll look at you. I'm a gastroenterologist. And then he crippled over and then threw up the hairball. And then that's when he was like, so I kind of thought it was almost like, when I watched that scene, I thought it was a challenge with his father. Like I wanted the other guy to go to the hospital. You were going to examine him. Now I'm saying yes to go to the hospital. You're fighting with me again. Like, but you're right. It might have been just as simple as the blood. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. these characters, where you got to see them interacting with each other more and there's just, I don't know, Kathy: And at the end, when Martin Best his father and said, why did we never talk about it? Why can't you say her name? Say my sister's name. Robert Best, goes, I can't and I won't say her name. It was... Chesla Wechsler: What did you think Doug? Doug B: Well, I recall other medical shows and don't know whether it was ER or maybe even The Pitt. But I remember, Items being stuck people and they come into the ER with the thing still stuck in them. So I'm surprised that they just didn't cut it off and then he could go to the hospital and he wouldn't bleed out. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Yeah. Kathy: really, really, want to call it dramatic. It almost tragic. And I think it leaves us open for them to return in the future. We need to. I'm not sure how they'll come back because the people that wrote Doc Martin episodes always surprised me. You know, it never went the way I thought it was going to go. So. Chesla Wechsler: One thing that I noticed was, and it took multiple viewings to see this, was Robert had Martin's ultrasound. he actually ultrasounded the area and said, it hasn't penetrated the capsule or whatever. So he looked at the guy and knew that it was not a problem to remove it. And the that I thought Martin was sending Mm-hmm. hairball guy off to the hospital was he knew he had a bowel obstruction because he could tell from like the way the guy felt and everything. So he knew he had to go basically to a gastroenterologist in, I was just about to say Truro because that's, that's Doc Martin, ⁓ Bar Harbor. But Robert is a gastroenterologist. So he was like, I can examine you right now. So to me, that was, it was a different scenario. It was like, okay, Martin wants to send him to an expert. Kathy: Maybe it won't go the same way here. They'll find an interesting way to bring them back, hope. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, I mean, we need to understand that accident because clearly whatever happened is what explains, Martin's standoffishness and all that, but it also, ⁓ we know why he developed a blood phobia. We know that he saw this girl who reminded him of his sister so you could understand why he would freeze in the surgery because he would just be like, ⁓ my gosh, but why then have a blood phobia after that? Kathy: Yes. We'll. Chesla Wechsler: And in Robert's case, he is the expert, where Martin wasn't for the first one. And then in the second case, Robert is also the expert. But Martin is saying, if we pull it out, there's going to be, well, there'll be a lot of blood. And Robert's like, doctors don't mind a little blood. And thank God for Elaine to get that in there and send him off. Kathy: Well, why then did Martin Ellingham get a blood phobia after, had the same kind of reaction in a surgery? it was one his patients, routine surgery, special. ⁓ And then he got there and he her as a person, ⁓ someone who had a family, not just body. And suddenly he couldn't do it. And we have that from Martin Best. I we have that it was... Doug B: you Chesla Wechsler: Mm-hmm. Well good, you guys are gonna keep watching. You're invested at this point to, Erica, I worried about you halfway through the season, but I think you're in for a penny, in for a pound now. Kathy: Sarah said it reminded him of his sister. and that was enough, but that would get him off of surgery. Why would it make him sick at the sight of blood? And he is very sick at the sight of blood. It's even more severe than it was with Martin Ellingham. So. ⁓ Erica Susko: I was too. I was too. I was waffling there a bit. ⁓ But I'm glad I stuck to it, and I'm definitely going to keep watching. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Good, good, and Doug, know you're gonna, you've got that DVR set, you're ready. Next week, I believe we will have Patty back. So that's good news. the week after that, the 17th Patrick's Day, there is no episode. And then they'll finish out the series with maybe what, three more after that. So yeah, but cool. Well listen. Yeah, yeah. There's a story there that we don't know yet. Doug B: Okay. Kathy: Right. need to, we need, ⁓ would like ⁓ know what happened there. And why will Robert Best not talk about it? Why will he refuse to talk about it? ⁓ what's going on there? Now we never really got Vanessa's ⁓ We know how she about it. Obviously it really, it really deeply Robert Best and that's why he's suppressing it. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yes. Yes. Yeah. Right. Erica Susko: Nice. Chesla Wechsler: Everybody out here who's watching or listening to this, I hope you will like it if you indeed like it and subscribe to the podcast. And I would like to thank every one of my existing subscribers because we have over 100 subscribers now, which is great. We had 18 just a couple of weeks ago, so things are catching on. Please leave comments. We've had people interacting on the site, which I absolutely enjoy, and I reply to all those comments. Yeah, and ⁓ as I mentioned, I've got a little public announcement that you can watch after this. Mm-hmm. Yes. Kathy: we don't know Vanessa's story and that's her daughter. You would think she would be very emotional about it. Chesla Wechsler: but as the psychiatrist, she might have more tools. Kathy: Or maybe that's why she went into psychiatry. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. And we don't know if it was a post-family career choice or if it's something that she was doing previously. and then we'll go into our Doc Martin people. So thank you guys again and we'll see you next week. Thanks. Erica Susko: See you. Doug B: Take care. Kathy: Yeah, yeah, we need, we want, I don't say we need, because of course we do, but we want to know more of the story. And since they've been renewed for a second season, I'm thinking we'll get it. Chesla Wechsler: Mm-hmm. Right. Right. Yeah, there's a theory that I proposed ⁓ top half of this episode. I'm gonna share it with you to see what you think about it. I'm already sort of rethinking it, even though I sounded very sure about it in the top part of this. I took like quotes from the show that seemed strange to me. And I'm always looking for plot arcs, right? I thought it was odd outside of, it's probably the Salty Breeze where they were coming out with coffees, where Martin is challenging ⁓ you you went out last night and why are you lying about it? And his response is, I'm still your father. If I say I didn't go out, I didn't go out. That just sounded like an odd line and it, you could either say, well, that's a really strange piece of writing, or you could say they're seeding that for something to make sense later. Vanessa challenges Martin after Robert gets mad at him and leaves. Martin, have you done? And at very end when they're treating Mark, comes in and Martin's there with Mark and it is, what have you done here? And it's not clear who that's addressed to. Like, is it addressed to Martin? Like, did you screw this up? And then when Martin first sits down with Robert, he says, you grew out of fidgeting, did you? And to me, it's like, seed these little things because a plot later on is going to refer back to them, right? Kathy: thought the fidgeting comment was just a criticism, one of those things to make Martin feel smaller. Chesla Wechsler: It could very well be. Could very well be. Kathy: make his father feel a better man. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, but my theory is that Robert caused the accident, Rosemary's accident, and blamed it on Martin. Kathy: Hmm. Chesla Wechsler: or at least made it seem like it was Martin's fault in some way. Kathy: That's a possibility But I think he would have that opinion to Martin if that's how he had felt. And would have been more defensive about it. ⁓ it's a good plausible theory. your father and if I said I didn't go out, then I didn't go out. That struck me as an ⁓ odd to respond ⁓ to Martin. Chesla Wechsler: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Kathy: But on the other hand, as you said, maybe there's more to it. always been, I'm the authority figure. ⁓ always right ⁓ you ⁓ know what you're talking about. And ⁓ way of putting Martin down, which Chesla Wechsler: Mm-hmm. Yeah, it could be as simple as that. I'm always, I'm always trying to solve things. Kathy: But it was an odd, it did seem like an odd statement. And then What the other one you said you? Chesla Wechsler: have you yeah yeah ⁓ what have you here yeah I ⁓ Kathy: What have you done the two different times? What have you done? Look, the 'what have you done' done, that's ⁓ Is it his fault for everything? Is everything Martin's ⁓ ⁓ Could because his mother said, what have you done, Martin? Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And one thing that I have earlier in this I put in a little Podcast Portwenn service announcement. When I first the trailer for this show last week and they talked about, don't you think it's strange we never talked about it or never talked about what happened? but ⁓ just relating back to my PSA that people might've seen earlier. I was thinking, the one time I ever heard my dad talk about his wife dying, I don't even know why it came up, but we were sitting at the dinner table. He was there, mom was there. And all remember him saying, cause he was very stoic and he never talked about it. He said something about the policeman came to the house and said, your wife was in a car accident. And I said, is she okay? ⁓ And he said, I'm sorry, sir. expired like was a magazine ⁓ subscription. he started crying. And after I did my little public service announcement, I thought, gosh, when you let it go, when you talk about it, it just, ⁓ so my theory just, you know, it's Robert's blaming it on Martin, that's just me being Machiavellian and knowing that Doc Martin, ⁓ Ellingham's parents were so horrible, These parents may not be horrible. They may not have done this evil thing and blamed their son for something that wasn't their fault. It just might be as simple Robert not being able to deal with that grief of losing his daughter. Kathy: I don't think he can handle it. That's why he suppressed it. Just like your father did. at some point, hopefully another episode, it will come out. But I he suppressed it. ⁓ Yeah, ⁓ can't losing a child ⁓ like that. Chesla Wechsler: Mm-hmm. Yeah. or your wife. just one day she's there and the next day she's not. And that's, for the kids, it's, I for everybody, it's devastating, but. Yeah, wild. I enjoyed this episode. One thing I will say that is a to Martin Clunes, imagine if Sean Connery had to be the villain in a James Bond movie with Roger Moore. And how would the audience that be able to separate the two characters? Kathy: Yeah. Chesla Wechsler: effectively. And I felt as a huge Doc Martin fan, and you're a huge Doc Martin fan, I didn't see Doc Martin. I didn't see Martin Ellingham. I wasn't thinking of Martin Ellingham at all. There was a character called Robert Best. And yeah, there he was. I think that's Martin Clunes... Kathy: I was thinking a little more about Martin Clunes and what an incredibly skilled actor he is to be able to... There were bits of Martin Ellingham in his characterization of Robert Best, but a lot of it was just Robert Best. So see what you mean, but I have to confess, I still saw not Martin Ellingham, but Martin Clunes in some of Yeah. Chesla Wechsler: Mm-hmm. Martin Clunes, yeah. And we were very attuned to that. But I saw Robert Best and the, I mean, all the little tics. Because I watched the show several times and, he's got more than just the head He had like a, his hand at one was doing weird things, his mouth was doing weird things. It was like there were ⁓ many little tics, not just the sort of movement stuff. Kathy: And then the falling asleep, and I thought that was so funny, and Vanessa slaps him on the side and he goes, what, what? I just. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, Well, I think we have the same opinion. was our favorite of the show so far. Kathy: Yeah, and I can't decide if it was my favorite because Martin Clunes was in it. do not like to categorize myself as a Clunetic, but have to confess that I probably am. Chesla Wechsler: I can resonate with that thought. I'm not a fan girl. Like Oliver was saying, I'm not a fan girl. That's not me. But I'm a Clunatic, I'm also a Neill-atic for Sam Neill and a Hopkins-atic for ⁓ Hopkins. I have lots of favorites. My current most favorite right now is Martin Clunes. Kathy: I've never been a fangirl. are probably three shows that I always wanted to watch. One was Lost, and then The X-Files, and Gilmore Girls. Those are my three shows that I would want to always be able to see. But I can't tell you anything else until Doc Martin came along. And then, you know, Chesla Wechsler: Mm-hmm. Kathy: But then I was retired by the time I started watching Doc Martin, and I had the time to obsess over it, which we've never had the time before. Chesla Wechsler: Doc Martin struck a note in me and I think it is because of what I just shared with respect to how I grew up. And to watching this guy who has just, built up a whole bunch of emotional armor and everything is just intellectual, that's how I grew up. So when I tell people, Kathy: Yeah. Chesla Wechsler: I've shared in numerous podcasts. I feel very much Martin-like. It, to me watching the show it's therapeutic. And the stories that I write, they're my therapy. I mean, I I am ⁓ doing ⁓ therapy. I'm ⁓ working on Martin, but I'm really working me. Kathy: Yeah, I read your most recent one. Yeah, it was very interesting. But I hadn't, was unaware of your own personal experiences when I was reading it. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, So yeah, so I'm doing therapy when I'm writing my stories. I think that that's why this show has been that meaningful to me and just hit me. ⁓ really grabbed me as, ⁓ this guy is me. And he gonna make out? Is he gonna be okay? Kathy: So. But he's not you. Okay? As you said. Chesla Wechsler: I know. Well, I'm the cheerful Martin Ellingham. But see all of the positive emotions from me, but you're not going to see a lot of anything else. Those are the bad ones that you can't have. Kathy: Okay. Chesla Wechsler: Yeah, working on it. Kathy: Yeah, I'm not sure I relate to anyone on either, in either show. But Martin is the reason I got hooked on the show. it was like, what makes this man the way he is? That just intrigued me. So. ⁓ Chesla Wechsler: Yeah. this has great. I always appreciate your time. Thanks so much, Kathy. And for everybody who's out there watching, ⁓ please like show, please subscribe to the show, forward it to your friends who like Doc Martin, tell them about it, write comments. If you have ideas for other things you'd like on podcasts, drop them. Can't guarantee anything, but I'm always looking for things. So Kathy, thanks again so much. Take care, ⁓ bye. Kathy: ⁓ Thank you for having me. Bye bye.