Latest / Best of Business / Tim Groser: Former US ambassador on the significance of Luxon appearing at next week's NATO summit

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Tim Groser: Former US ambassador on the significance of Luxon appearing at next week's NATO summit · Best of Business

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  Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from News Talks be follow
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  Speaker 1: this and our Wide Ranger podcasts now on iHeartRadio. Ever
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  Speaker 1: dup see Allen.
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  Speaker 2: Prime Minister Chris Luxen is headed to the US next
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  Speaker 2: week to attend the NATO Summit in Washington, where he's
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  Speaker 2: going to meet with members of the US administration in Congress,
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  Speaker 2: and then he's also going to head over to San
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  Speaker 2: fran to promote business and investment. Tim Grosser is the
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  Speaker 2: former New Zealand Ambassador to the US and is with
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  Speaker 2: US now.
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  Speaker 3: Hate Tim, good evening.
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  Speaker 2: Do you reckon he's going to get to meet Biden.
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  Speaker 3: Well, I'm sure he will shake his hand, but I
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  Speaker 3: don't believe for a minute there will be enough time
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  Speaker 3: for President Biden to have a separate bilateral given the
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  Speaker 3: number of leaders that will be there from NATO, country's
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  Speaker 3: vastly more important than US. But I still think it's
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  Speaker 3: a terrific thing that he's going there, and I can't
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  Speaker 3: think of a more tense or important time. So I mean,
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  Speaker 3: let me give you my overall perspective. I mean, the
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  Speaker 3: rest of the visit is all I mean. I would
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  Speaker 3: use the term boilerplate, but that's sounds negative. I don't
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  Speaker 3: really mean that. The key issue is what is going
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  Speaker 3: to be able to perceive amongst the other leaders of NATO,
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  Speaker 3: given the confluence of the huge strategic threat from the
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  Speaker 3: Ukrainian situation and the resurgence of Donald Trump's chances of
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  Speaker 3: winning the presidency. If you give me two or three minutes,
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  Speaker 3: I'll elaborate on those things. So we start with I'll
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  Speaker 3: try and keep this basic. You know, the NATO existed
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  Speaker 3: after the War to protect European security. It's been a
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  Speaker 3: fantastic political success. It was aimed at the then Soviet
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  Speaker 3: Union and then that became Russia. And the core commitment
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  Speaker 3: technically is called Article five. What it means is you
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  Speaker 3: formerly the Soviet Union or Russia attack any of our
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  Speaker 3: members and it's an in tank on all of US,
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  Speaker 3: and US includes most importantly the United States, doesn't include
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  Speaker 3: New Zealand, by the way. So this kept the peace
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  Speaker 3: in this ghastly faustian bargain pack US and face nuclear
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  Speaker 3: armageddon for seventy five years. And then Putin decided to
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  Speaker 3: invade first crime year in twenty fourteen. I was stuck
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  Speaker 3: in Moscow at the time. The exact time that's happened
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  Speaker 3: but that's another story. And then in twenty twenty two,
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  Speaker 3: his tanks and his troops invade Western Ukraine, the most
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  Speaker 3: serious threat to European security for seventy five years. Now
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  Speaker 3: Ukraine is not a native member. They'd love to be,
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  Speaker 3: they never will be. And the reality is that the
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  Speaker 3: fantasy of you know, Boris Johnson, lez Trust and co.
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  Speaker 3: Of total defeat of Russia now two plus years on,
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  Speaker 3: is now clear to everyone, even if nobody's worked out
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  Speaker 3: a way to say it in public. And that's the
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  Speaker 3: underlying issue. And then along comes Donald Trump's resurgence last week.
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  Speaker 3: So go back to I think twenty sixteen, just after
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  Speaker 3: I was appointed ambassador in Washington, Trump made a statement
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  Speaker 3: that basically said Russia has no longer a threat. And
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  Speaker 3: then he went a step further, I think in either
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  Speaker 3: twenty seventeen or twenty eighteen, by actually questioning whether the
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  Speaker 3: United States would validate Article five, the mutual deterrance central
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  Speaker 3: component of NATO. And I went to this. So he
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  Speaker 3: went there, and there was shock and horror throughout Europe
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  Speaker 3: when he basically left it ambiguous. And I went to
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  Speaker 3: a catch up job, a massive elegant black tie dinner
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  Speaker 3: for about six hundred people and all the Western ambassadors,
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  Speaker 3: including me, were invited at an elegant hotel in Washington,
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  Speaker 3: and you know, all the great and the good Stoltenberg,
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  Speaker 3: the then Secretary General of NATO and all came up
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  Speaker 3: to say, the support of the United States for Article
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  Speaker 3: five and for the defense of Europe is unquestionable. And
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  Speaker 3: Mike Pence, who was then still the Vice president and
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  Speaker 3: on Donald Trump's started got up and said the same thing,
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  Speaker 3: and there was dead silence because everybody is thinking what
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  Speaker 3: I'm thinking. It doesn't matter, mister Vice president, what you
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  Speaker 3: think if your boss has just said this that can't
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  Speaker 3: be repaired by a gloss over show like this blank
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  Speaker 3: tie dinner.
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  Speaker 2: And so is this the threat of Trump winning a gain?
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  Speaker 2: Is that we go back into this particular the possibility
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  Speaker 2: that my.
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  Speaker 3: Point exactly my point either And I think that our
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  Speaker 3: Prime minister, I mean, you can receive as many briefings
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  Speaker 3: as he likes from foreign policy experts people, you know,
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  Speaker 3: like I was in the past, but he really has
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  Speaker 3: to go and hear it amongst the leaders have to
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  Speaker 3: make real decisions. And I mean, I don't know what
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  Speaker 3: your take on the debate is. While there's a massive
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  Speaker 3: cover up. That's what is very clear to me from
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  Speaker 3: a series of brilliant analyses that I've read in the
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  Speaker 3: last forty eight hours and a few conversations I've had
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  Speaker 3: with friends in the stage still deeply inside the political process,
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  Speaker 3: this has got to be played out, and the chances
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  Speaker 3: of a second Drump presidency have increased by some factor.
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  Speaker 3: Nobody can say quite what.
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  Speaker 2: I'm pleased that you say that, because that's quite obvious
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  Speaker 2: to everybody, and I'm please somebody with your expertise and
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  Speaker 2: your years and politics sees it as well. Tim, Thank you,
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  Speaker 2: I appreciate it. Tim Grosser, former New Zealand Ambassadors to
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  Speaker 2: the U, is just on what Tim was just saying
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  Speaker 2: about Ukraine not joining NATO. Next week when NATO meets,
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  Speaker 2: according to the Telegraph, Ukraine is going to be told
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  Speaker 2: it is too corrupt to join NATO and it's so
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  Speaker 2: it's not going to be able.
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