Latest / UK Column Radio / Alice and the Money Tree, Revisited | UK Column Interviews

Transcript

Alice and the Money Tree, Revisited | UK Column Interviews · UK Column Radio

• 0:08
  Speaker 1: Hello. I'm Mark Anderson, us correspondent for UK column and
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: this is another interview for the year twenty twenty six.
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: I've done one so far prior to this on banking
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: with Conrad Lebau Banking and Money. But now we're going
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: to take a deeper and different look at the monetary riddle.
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: What's sometimes called the money trick. And who better to
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: describe the money trick it's some, it's substance, what it's
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: about than John Weston Briggs from Hastings UK. I've made
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: his acquaintance casually over the years, and this is the
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: ten year anniversary approximately of when he first created this book,
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: Alice and the Money Tree. And this book fills a
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: very important role in society's efforts, and these efforts are
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: becoming more widely known. People are waking up society's efforts
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: to unmask the real magicians, know not David Copperfield, but
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: with names like Alan Greenspan, with names like Mark Karney
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: and even their bosses. Yes, I'm talking about the banksters,
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: the central bankers and their minions in the commercial banking
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: system and what we've been experiencing over the decades and
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: even centuries. In fact, a lot of this goes back
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: to antiquity, is the machinations of the banking system. And
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: what John has done, and this is really Yeoman's work
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: here is put it into rhyme and verse and prose
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: and giving it a poetic and inspirational edge, because it
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: makes it easier to read, easier to understand, easier to absorb.
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: You're dealing with something ultimately very unpleasant, and you have
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: to have a way to get at it. You have
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: to have a way to teach the young people and
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: even the adults in a way that they can actually enjoy,
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: even though it's a rather dark topic, and this book
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: does that. Alice and the Money Tree John John Briggs,
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the show. I'm so glad that you were
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: able to do this on this UK Colin interview. How
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: you doing today.
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: I'm fine and thank you for doing this. Mark. This
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: is the key subject in all of the things that
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: you can find on the web anywhere. This is the
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: key to putting everything right in the world, and everything
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: is not so good everywhere as we know. I'm not
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: improving anywhere, but this is the key and it always
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: has been for hundreds of years.
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: Indeed, like we've often set off the air. Solve this,
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: you solve everything ultimately. I think there's a lot of
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: truth to that.
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: And it's.
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: This conjuring trick of outsourcing. A nation that wants to
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: be truly sovereign and control of its own affairs can
• 3:16
  Speaker 2: outsource its organization for buying and selling things to an
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: outside agency. Is you can't imagine anyone would ever want
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: to do that. However, there are great pressures for people
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: in charge of our societies to be bribed and blackmailed
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: and influenced so that the money in circulation is the
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: cure for it. All is for the governments to spend
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: the money into circulation interest and debt free. But what
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: we have is borrowed into circulation, and we're told, I mean,
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: the story is they have money in the vaults which
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: is collected by which save us place there and this
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: has learned out to us. But it's a conjuring trick.
• 4:17
  Speaker 2: They've just got a little bit of money in the
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: vaults and they create a vast amount of money in connection,
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: and it's the paused. This causes three huge problems to
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: three huge problems for society. The first one is that
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: everybody thinks that money is prices arising and surging, and
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: nobody quite knows why. And it's because the pool of
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: money is continually being diluted with money, which you know
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: is I think widely understood by everybody creator a thin air, kay.
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: Uh.
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: And it just doesn't have any It doesn't have any
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: more value than the paper it's printed on, if virtually,
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: but it has to be paid back with money which
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: represents people's trades, things they've sold, and their work. So
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: inflation is the great problem. And the other problem is
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: all the treasure of the kingdom or the or the
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: state is hoovered up with compound interest, repaying two or
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: three times over loans which were never actually made or
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: any partial not fully made. And the government's answer to
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: this everywhere because they don't. The great thing about the
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: thing about money, which I think everyone should understand is
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: money has it's it's it comes with control. You cannot
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: argue with whoever. Everybody needs things to live, You need
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: to rufe failure, headed, you need to be able to eat,
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: and everything you want is you have to have money
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: to get it. So we all need money. Now the
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: person who provides you with the money, you can't fall
• 6:17
  Speaker 2: out with him. If you go to work, you can
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: argue with anyone you like, but not the boss. You're
• 6:21
  Speaker 2: out of the door and finishes. If you are a
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: journalist on a newspaper, if you write something that the
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: boss doesn't agree with, you're out of the job before
• 6:31
  Speaker 2: the sun goes down. So the supplier of money has
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: control over you. And the way that it can be
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: done successfully is that without you can either borrow it
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: into existence, or you can spend it into the government
• 6:55
  Speaker 2: can look at the workout what the value of the
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: king or the state is and make tokens on money
• 7:05
  Speaker 2: to represent that value and spend it ination or that's correct,
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: or you can borrow it into circulation. And the money
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: that you borrow into circulation doesn't have any value until
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: it's swapped for something, and then it gathers the value
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: of whatever it's swapped for. And this process of I
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: hope I'm not ranting too much, Mark, but trying to
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: get my thoughts together. The process is, for instance, in England,
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: sterling is that pound sterling is the basic unit of currency,
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: and you can't get a pound note anymore because it's
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: been devalue so much that the smallest know you can
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: get is a five pound note now a pound. When
• 7:54
  Speaker 2: this system originally started, for pound represented a pound of silver,
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: which in today's value is about five hundred pounds. That
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: shows you how much the system over you know, a
• 8:06
  Speaker 2: couple of hundred years or more is devalued and in fact,
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: the five pound note but it was. If you went
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: back to when it was originally the value of that
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: would be two and a half thousand pounds, and now
• 8:20
  Speaker 2: you can barely get a cup of tea for it.
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: That's how much the system is continually diminishing the value
• 8:32
  Speaker 2: of money. And everybody thinks money is going up, and
• 8:35
  Speaker 2: the answer from the government is to expand have more trade.
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: We must have that. They had this mantra, growth doesn't
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: matter what party they want to we must have growth
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: instead of dealing with the real problem and the real.
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: Let me let me interject there, John, that's a good plateau.
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: I want to make sure that we introduce you a
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: little bit about your background and we'll revisit because you
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: just led us on a nice narrative that kind of
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: describes the basic foundational problem and you got us to
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: a nice plateau there. Now you've worked in I believe
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: the shipping industry, and I think you have an engineering background.
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: Correct me if I'm wrong. Tell us a little bit
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: about yourself. You're from Hastings, correct, but.
• 9:21
  Speaker 2: Really I was born in Kem but most of my
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: life I spent in the Chiltern Hills, which a sort
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: of in between London and an Oxydshire. For some reason
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: I decided to move down to Hastings by the sea.
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: What inspired you to write this book? When did you
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: first realize that these money machinations were working against us?
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: And the root of the problem is, as you so
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: ablely described in the narrative that you just gave. When
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: did you first realize it? And what made you write
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: not only a book but this particular kind of book? Yeah?
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: Good, that's good. Mark. Well I first came across I
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: was on a skiing holiday years ago, you know, I
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: don't know before two thousand and twenty thirty years ago,
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: and we're in a skiing group and the chap that
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: was the alpha male leading us all from the hotel
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: his wife. I think it was something big in the
• 10:17
  Speaker 2: city of London, and she used to talk to me
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: as we queued up, and she said, well, you know,
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: money isn't really money, it's death, and it disappears when
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: you paid off. I'm not sure that she really understood this,
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: but every morning I talked to her and questioned her
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: about this. I couldn't really it didn't make much sense
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: to me. But I dug into it and it was
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: like a dog with a bone, and I'm going back
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: twenty years, probably more than that. And then when I
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: worked out what was really happening, you know, my jaw
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: hit the ground. I could see that it's just, frankly
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: a swindle.
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: And to write this kind of book.
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: What it wrote, it's your rather question. I wrote that
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: because I think if you rant and talk a bit
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: like I am now, you don't get so much penetration.
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: But if you made an agreeable book with pictures which
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: with big gaps between the writing. And I stole all
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: of the pictures from the original Alice in Wonderland. I
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: discovered that the copyright was off and I thought, well,
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: I can't get it. I can't find anyone to draw
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: as well as that, I'm going to use them. And
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: I did, and I put lots of spaces between it
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: all so you could read the whole thing from various
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: directions within half an hour, probably, or it's certainly less
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: than an hour. And my intention was perhaps for mothers
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: to read to their children or to get penetration. Now, Mark,
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: can I tell you this. I got this out to
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: remind myself when it first. I've got this letter here
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: that I'll read it to you. And it was sent
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: to me by a gentleman who got my book and
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: he came back and he bought another ten. He wrote
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: in this letter, this is the most extraordinary thing because
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: this is one of the front players in the you know,
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: in the financial industry. And I mean just the other
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: night I was watching that film called Margin Call.
• 12:19
  Speaker 3: If you've seen that, no, sir, I don't believe, So
• 12:23
  Speaker 3: you must watch it. It's really talking about the lab
• 12:26
  Speaker 3: and Bars crash in two thousand and eight. It's a
• 12:29
  Speaker 3: brilliant it's one of the best. You you must get
• 12:31
  Speaker 3: it and watch it.
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: Now. This chat is one of these these people that
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: work on the front line of the financial industry. They
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: are brain surgeons. They are really clever people. And this
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: chap wrote to me and he said, I graduated with
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: a degree in business studies in nineteen ninety two. I
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: studied economics and finance at school and college. A total
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: of seven years, I worked in the investment industry, including
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: the Riddish's Market, Fidelity, stop Broking, and then Investments, and
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: also Morgan Stanley. In nineteen ninety five, I resigned and
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: got out to save my sanity and health. I knew
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: deep down something was wrong, but I never quite understood
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: what the big picture was. This is our problem. People
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: on the cold face dealing with stuff with great minds
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: can't realize it's such a draw dropping scam. The human
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: brain can't take it in, he said. He goes on
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: to say, not once was I told how the money
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: system worked. It is not incredible.
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: So it really is. And this book based on people
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: like that and their epiphanies and their realizations and the
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: gradual awakening that you described that you went through. It
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: led to the writing of this book. What's great about this,
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: John is not only did you understand that there's a
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: money riddle, a money trick that needs to be unraveled,
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: you devised a way to unravel it. It's like the
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: screwdriver that takes the bolt out of the out of
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: the structure. And and I really think that if I
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: share a little bit of this book and read the
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: pros and the rhyme and the verse, and and as
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: you say, you had some Alie in Wonderland style illustrations
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: there the book. The book has a certain charm despite
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: the rather dark and ambiguous and you know, puzzling topic.
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: And I think that what it would enable people to do,
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: because it's designed for it, is to create a kind
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: of child and adult education crusade. This book needs to
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: get into more classrooms, it needs to get into homeschooling curriculums,
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: and adults need to share it at the kitchen table.
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: As we all know, the kitchen table is a formidable
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: weapon against the New world order if we sit down
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: and talk. But I'm going to share some of this,
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: and I want you to comment on what I read
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: a little bit, because I want people to understand the
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: way this book is written.
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: Now.
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: Right in the beginning, there's an introductory verse illiteracy. That
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: curse of old kept the people poor and cold. Now
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: ignorance of cash is used to keep the silly geese confused. Yeah, well, so,
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: I mean what's interesting there is illiteracy is a problem.
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: And I have a good handle on why there is
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: a literacy. We won't go into that, but illiteracy is foundational.
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: If you're illiterate, you can't read the learn. You have
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: to learn to read in order to read the learn.
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: So if you have enough illiteracy, people don't have the
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: tools to grasp anything. So John West and John Western
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: Briggs book would be a tough read. But fortunately we
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: have reasonable literacy in the world over overall, although it
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: could be better. Yes, but then, but then if, even
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: if you have reading literacy, if you still have financial illiteracy,
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: which is what most of the world has. Yes, and
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: you cited. You cited the guy that wrote you the letter,
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: that person you think, you would think would have financial literacy,
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: but he does not not in the full sense of
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: the of the concept. Correct. So so therefore we'll read
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: a little bit more. Then I'll have your comment the
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: mad Hatter's Tea Party. Money doesn't grow on trees, said Alice.
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: Of course it does, retorted the march Hare scornfully, money
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: is paper, and papers is made from trees. Everybody knows that.
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: Then how does it come to us, asked Alice, you
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: stoopid child, snap the mad Hatter. The Bank of Wonderland
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: presides over money creation. First, it declares the value. And
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: then here's the key. It is lent out at interest.
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: And Alice is, of course quizzical. Why does the bank
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: declare that? She asks, You must be very dull to
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: ask that, replied the hair. All kingdoms must do this.
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: How else do you think the population can buy and
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: sell things? So if it's borrowed at interest, Alice asked,
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: who pays it back? Why the population retorts the hair
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: with an exasperated sigh, like, huh, you seem to have
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: a very poor understanding of the simplest things. So the
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: hair is pretty wise here, well, who gets the interest
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: when it's paid back? Alice asked, The men who create
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: and lend the money? Of course, snapped the hair. How
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: else do you think they are able to buy their
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: yachts and castles and all the kingdom treasure? And that's
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: the Bank of Wonderland a great metaphor for the Bank
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: of England, the Federal Reserve System, the European Central Bank.
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: That's the very first part of this wonderful book, John,
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: And it must have taken you a while to work
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: all that out. Any reflections you might have on that.
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: When I look at it, I can't believe I wrote it. Frankly,
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: I mean I'm not a very I listric person, but
• 18:28
  Speaker 2: I felt compelled I must do something, and do something
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: which had penetration and indeed best attempt. Perhaps somebody might
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: pick this up and issue a comic to make, or
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: make some leaflets and drop them from helicopters.
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: I'll tell you what, John, I'll rent the helicopter and
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: you do the dropping. How's that?
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: Okay? Yeah, this We've got to get everybody to understand this.
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: If we're to escape, we're not going to vote our
• 19:05
  Speaker 2: way out of it, We're not going to protest our
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: way out of it. We're not going to get anybody
• 19:10
  Speaker 2: in Parliament to do anything about it, because you to
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: qualify for parliament these days it seems to be you've
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: got to be mentioned in dispatches in the Epstein files,
• 19:20
  Speaker 2: so your ground level. And if somebody could make a
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: comic or well, I don't know. I mean a few
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: thousand people can read this book, but we need more
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: than this mark and what can we do? Well, that's
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: the great that's the wonderful things.
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: That's the partial purpose of this interview, of course, is
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: to raise the visibility of a book that's spent out
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: ten years and has had some reasonable circulations, some reasonable
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: sales here and there, but how do get it to
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: the next level. That's part of what this is about.
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: Thank you, by the way, thank you for recently shipping
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: me about twenty of these. And I'm going to get
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: there's a brand new library going up about five miles
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: to my east. When they christened the place and open
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: their doors, I'm going to be the first one waiting
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: with my nose against the glass with some copies of
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: this book in tow. And I want to keep going
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: a little bit on this opening chapter, John, because it's
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: so brilliantly written. Who are these people? Alice went on
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: to ask about the Bank of Wonderland, those that are
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: profiting off the interest, because it's not so much the
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: creation of the money from nothing, although that raises eyebrows,
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: it's the fact that they charge interest on it. And
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: I've read a lot of the Federal Reserve's own books,
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: like Modern Money Mechanics and what happens when a bank
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: makes a loan is they don't actually part with any assets.
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: They don't lend the depositors' money, as is commonly believed,
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: and they don't lend their own so Therefore the only
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: thing they can lend is new new bank credit entered
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: now not with the quill pen anymore. The quill pen
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: is the old weapon, that's the musket. The new weapon
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: putting the musket away is the computer keyboard. And they
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: conjure up these figures. As H. Douglas, a noted UK
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: based monetary analysts once noted, the banks loan something, but
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: they part with nothing. Yeah, and so Alice is exasperated
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: about this and their The Mad Hatter is telling Alice
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: that the bank's workings quote are hidden by Royal Charter
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: and hidden by the Official Secrets Act, so that you
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: might not find very much out. And I looked that up,
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: by the way, And the Official Secrets Act does have
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: something to do with keeping the banking operations more or
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: less sequestered and more or less under wraps. It may
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: not be absolute protection right down to the n degree,
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: but it does have something to do with it, very much, so,
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: as you noted, and Alice says disapprovingly, this just can't
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: be right, for if their activities were wholesome and proper,
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: it would not be necessary to keep them secret. You
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: must understand, replied the Mad Hatter the Bank of Wonderland
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: is independent from any government control and exists to look
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: after the interests of the money people and their system.
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: And Alice, of course, is more and more beset by this.
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: I think that's very unfair. It costs hardly anything for
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: them to print the money, yet when it's paid back
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: much additional value has been attached. And so Alice is
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: in this opening chapter, Alice's waking up to this very
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: grim reality, and she's very, very bothered by it. And
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: it's a great first chapter, John, because it reflects, does
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: it not anyone hearing this for the first time, we
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: are all Alice now. And when I read this, I
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: said that to myself, we are all Alice now. If
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: we have at least the basic information to have the
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: epiphany to wake up to what's going on, we are
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: all Alice now. Yeah, Alice in any yeah, yeah, go
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: ahead and comment, John, go ahead.
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: She has to say in those Alice books, think about it,
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: those Alice you know, in the Alice in Wonderland, and
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: Alice's she's challenging Authoroy all the way through it. She's
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: a little girl. And and and that's what I used.
• 23:52
  Speaker 2: She's challenging Authoroughy and there received states of things in
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: question all the way through. So that's what I thought
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: that that's why I chose out is to do it.
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: You know, and you make a very good point. Not
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: only is it authority, it's illicit improper authority. It's not
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: elected authority. And people will come back on that and say, well,
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: you're elected and appointed officials hired these bankers, so it's legitimate.
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: But the thing is is when that authority is arbitrarily
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: exercised and you have no real way to remove that authority,
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: you have no real concrete way of getting out from
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: under their thumb. And that's the very the very definition
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: of tyranny is basically having power without having been given
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: the proper authority to exercise that power. Footmark Yes, and
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: bank charters are not the answer. Brian Garish of UK
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: column some time ago brought out how not only Switzerland
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: but the UK are under these agreements with the Bank
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: for International Settlements which is the central bank of the
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: central banks. Long story short, the understanding or contract that
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: the Bank for International Settlements have has for any country
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: in which it operates basically tells that country you can't
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: touch us. We will do what we will do. We however,
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: we want your government to provide us with security when
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: we need it. We want your police, maybe even your army.
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: But in return, you do not get to meaningfully or
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: substance substantively regulate anything we do. We're the bank for
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: international settlements. You're not will do as we please. And
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: that is what these agreements that that Central Bank of
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: the Central Bank puts puts together with these countries. It
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: renders itself basically untouchable, and yet it still wants state protection.
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's Oh, they play
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: their game very very successfully. It's very very hard, you
• 26:05
  Speaker 2: count it. The only way we'll ever do it is
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: to get everyone to understand it.
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: And people that's exactly right. And that's why I talk
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: about this book not only in general, but in terms
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: of it being a way to put a real gap,
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: a real breach in their armor, because it's going to
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: take something that they're not counting on. It's going to
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: take an educational movement, and that educational movement needs the
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: right tools. Dry lectures on the evils of banking alone
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: will not do it.
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: No, absolutely could even make it simpler like a leaflet
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: I gave I posted you I mean it's not really
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: worked out properly, but something very very simple, like a
• 26:55
  Speaker 2: grim's fairy story to distribute. I think it might kick
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: more doors open. Indeed, indeed simple and easy to read.
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll share a little bit more because this is
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: so much fun to read at the same time being
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: so informative. And the Mad Hatter is talking to Alice
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: and cautioning her about being too outspoken. I'd be very
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: careful to whom you say, that, said the Mad Hatter sternly.
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: A number of people have tried to undo this thing
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: in other countries, and curiously, it always seems to bring
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: to them very bad luck. I'm thinking of mister Lincoln,
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: mister Kennedy, and a number of other American presidents that
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: would be James Garfield, William McKinley, all pretty much assumed
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: to have been given retirement plans to put it mildly
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: by the banksters. And then I put an out in
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: here that this is my copy, so I gave myself
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: permission to scribble in it. I put media as a subhead. Remember,
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: the Mad Hatter continued, Every newspaper and channel of information
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: must be controlled tightly, and all key people bribed or blackmailed.
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: If the word is not to get out. And Alice
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: has had enough, that's outrageous. She cried, why they are
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: nothing but knaves and tricksters and parasites, and then she
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: intimates we need to send them packing. Ye, and there's
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: I can't get over the charm of this. Even though
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: it's telling me something I don't want to hear, it
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: makes me want to hear it. That's what I love
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: about it. And that's what's so important about spreading the word.
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: You don't want to put this down until you're done
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: with it, and so you can't help but be informed.
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: If it was just straight telling you about the banksters,
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: you might quit halfway and go, man, that's that's just
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: too heavy. Yeah, you know, that's trying to eat a
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: loaf of bread in one bite. I can't do it.
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: So very very brilliant, John. The way it's laid out,
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: and some of it is more poetry than pros. I'll
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: share some of the poetry, but of course i'll ask
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: you for any further reflections.
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: Here extend my huge gratitude of view. Mark is splendid.
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: That's everything I wanted to try and achieve. You have articulated,
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: and that's why I constructed it that way.
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: What feedback before I share a little bit more? What
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: feedback over the years that since you wrote this book
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: were basically at the ten year anniversary. What feedback have
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: you gotten not only the letter that you shared earlier today,
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: but what other feedback have you gotten from retired teachers,
• 29:46
  Speaker 1: it might be other people that worked in the financial system,
• 29:49
  Speaker 1: former co workers, family members, friends, What feedback or what's
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: some of the more notable feedback you may have gotten
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: over the years.
• 29:59
  Speaker 2: A lot of people come back and buy more copies.
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: Quite I'm one of them.
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I've a vehicle to to you know, once the
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: panties dropped through the who has managed to read it
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: to pause. It's a way of getting this information to
• 30:16
  Speaker 2: others because it's it's it's it's it's it's hard work
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: trying to explain this to somebody because it is such
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: blindingly obvious fraud that it's the human the human brains
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: just it can't take it in.
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: Indeed, you know, there's a Sherlock Holmes movie, one of
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: the ones where Robert Donney Junior played Sherlock Holmes, which
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: was a little awkward. Jude Law played doctor Watson. But
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: one thing that Holmes said in that movie, it's so
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: over it's covert. Yeah, yeah, and that that describes this.
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: It's it's not as if the banking system's invisible. It's
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: over and yet it's so over it it's covert.
• 31:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: We handle the money every day. It absorbs our lives,
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: and yet as much of it might be visible above ground,
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: like the proverbial iceberg, most of what it's constructed of
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: is below ground and out of sight.
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: M anyway, go ahead, John, if you have something to add.
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: Otherwise I'll share a little poetry. But it's up to you.
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: Yes, this is great with George, this is I haven't
• 31:35
  Speaker 2: got anything really.
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: Well, let's let's not forget the question. Though. Other feedback
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: that you've gotten, you said that most people buy more books.
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: Is there anything else that you want to mention? I
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: know that some of the comments on the back of
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: the book.
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: You must understand that I wrote. You must know that
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: I invented those comments.
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: Oh okay, okay, so that's a play on words. That's fine.
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: But what what are any other memorable feedback you've gotten?
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: I know again, you mostly get a request for more books,
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: which is a good sign. But in those ten years,
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: has it been a constant struggle or have there been
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: some breakthroughs. I haven't asked you that question off the air,
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: so this is a fresh question.
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: I put it every month. If you get sold, it's
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: with the whole set. There two huge There are just
• 32:33
  Speaker 2: two whole settters of books in Britain. And I chose Gardeners,
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: which is near here, and I supplied it with fifty
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: books every month or every other month, and they seldom
• 32:47
  Speaker 2: they send me a bill for it all. But I
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: do get comments back, and people do come, as I said,
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: buy extra copies to give to other people and people Mark.
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: I just wish it could sell in the millions, not
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: the thousands.
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Indeed, the publishing world, as well as the media world,
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: as we know, is quite tightly controlled. I think it's
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: a good time to share a little bit of the
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: poetry too, And a lot of this is done in
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: sort of a socratic method, asking questions. You know, Oh,
• 33:26
  Speaker 1: tell me the truth about cash? Is it only a
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: token to buy things we need to and stash? How
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: on earth would we get on without it? Please tell
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: me the truth about cash? Could buttons be used for this?
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: Purpose or tally sticks fashioned from ash. If we say that,
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: if we say the object has value, oh, please tell
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: me the truth about cash. The tally sticks, of course,
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: is a Middle Ages way that they had a way
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: of accounting for spending and commerce.
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: Through seven hundred years old. Government expenditure was by tally
• 34:03
  Speaker 2: sticks when we were free of usury.
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: Indeed, and Ellen Brown in her book The Web of
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: Debt tells us about tally sticks, which is a very
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: interesting thing. And what you just said puts it into perspective.
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: Back when things were saying, you know, I'll just pull
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: over on the road here just for a moment. They
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: tell us that the Dark Ages were so dark. It's
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: beginning to emerge that the Dark Ages weren't exactly dark.
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: Maybe that people had to work less each year to
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: make ends meet, they had much more leisure and free time.
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: And maybe the Dark Ages are now.
• 34:41
  Speaker 2: You said, absolutely so. And when the users were thrown
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: out of England it was a golden age. All we
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: hear about is the black jazz and people dying. But
• 34:54
  Speaker 2: there were one hundred and sixty holy days in the
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: English carrier. That's where we get the word holiday. Now,
• 35:01
  Speaker 2: how many months holiday is that. I mean, everbodybody knows
• 35:04
  Speaker 2: there were twelve days of Christmas, but nobody actually gets
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: them these anymore. But and I think, I mean the
• 35:11
  Speaker 2: church sort of shared power with the king and it
• 35:17
  Speaker 2: probably invented these days. So they had lots of free
• 35:19
  Speaker 2: laybor to help build these marvelous churches, one in stone
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: in every village in this land.
• 35:26
  Speaker 1: Indeed, that's you can say, I'm sorry, go ahead.
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: England was colored lots. I mean there's still them, there's
• 35:34
  Speaker 2: Wimbledon Colemon and there are still comments. But most of
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: it has been stolen by landowners and government. But there
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: was lots of room for people to run, you know,
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: keep a few chickens and forage for wood, and it
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: was free to everybody. But that's all been with the
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: Enclosures Act. Greatest crime every in England, apart from selling
• 35:56
  Speaker 2: out to the usury.
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: But for.
• 36:00
  Speaker 2: Hundreds of years in England before they right up through
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: Queen Elizabeth's time. Wow, the users came back in with
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: William the Conqueror. These people look for They're like hyenas
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: looking for weak deer in the herd, and if they
• 36:19
  Speaker 2: can see trouble or confrontation, they'll climb in there and
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: offer to lay in gold and that back in again
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: they funded. They funded William the Conqueror's invasion England before
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: them under or King Alfred earlier, I believe, right back
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: to seven hundred and something, there was a there were
• 36:44
  Speaker 2: half a dozen English kingdoms before it was England, and
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: usury was outlawed by King Offer in seven hundred, in
• 36:53
  Speaker 2: the seven hundreds, and really enforced by King Alfred, the
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: first King of the English, the first English king. And
• 37:02
  Speaker 2: people couldn't read and writing those days, but they understood this.
• 37:06
  Speaker 2: And now we've got a really it's a real challenge
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: trying to get dis message through to people.
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: You know what you just described there. I'm glad that
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: we pulled off and did a pitstop. As I'm reading this, Oh,
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: tell me the truth about cash poetry section in your book,
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: Alice and the Money Tree. That's very important. The Enclosures
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: Act and everything that you just described Mary England, which
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: probably went up until the fourteen or fifteen hundreds before
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: things began to change, and all the free time people had,
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: and you know, one of the tricky things about literacy,
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: even though we had the invention of the printing press
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: and many good things happen is that now we have
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: a you know, reasonable extent and reasonable degree of literature understanding,
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: you know, reading literacy, that sort of thing. But we
• 38:02
  Speaker 1: have so much false information. So yes, there's literacy, but
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: there's propaganda for people to read, and that literacy is
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: not being given or not being merged with the correct information.
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: So when reading literacy meets financial literacy, imagine the dynamite
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: effect in the proper sense, in the positive sense that
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: that would have. We would then usher in maybe a new, merry,
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: Old England kind of age, maybe the world over, maybe worldwide,
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: and we ought to have a lot less labor required
• 38:40
  Speaker 1: to have the basic necessities of life. We shouldn't have
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: to be working slaves and being yoked in some sort
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: of work state that comes right out of a dystopian novel.
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: And most dystopian novels show work states. They're not people
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: on welfare or the dole, the people being worked to death,
• 39:02
  Speaker 1: working their whole lives away. If you remember Metropolis, the
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: old German silent movie, the people had to work so
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: hard that men actually had to make the hands of
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: the clock move manually. The clocks didn't even go on
• 39:16
  Speaker 1: their own, and granted that's a stretch, but it's indicative
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: of the exact opposite of what you described. There used
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: to be this leisure society. People work to the extent
• 39:29
  Speaker 1: that society required work to have the goods and services
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: needed to survive and flourish. That happened. You had many,
• 39:38
  Speaker 1: many holidays. That's where the term holiday holidays or holidays
• 39:41
  Speaker 1: came from. And so all these cathedrals and all these
• 39:45
  Speaker 1: beautiful structures were built, and that's what gave your homeland.
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: It's character that fortunately it still possesses today. But now
• 39:54
  Speaker 1: we have this overlapping cancer of these financial powers that
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: are trying to cancel out everything that you just described.
• 40:01
  Speaker 2: Absolutely said you pretty say, well, long.
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: Well that since this book is part of the remedy,
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: I'll read a little bit more. And I'm glad we
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: hit on tally sticks because that's what inspired our foray
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: into that conversation there. Who is it that chooses its value?
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: Does the queen dream it up in a flash? Is
• 40:23
  Speaker 1: it pulled from a hat like a rabbit? Please tell
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: me the truth about cash? Does it spring from the
• 40:29
  Speaker 1: air like a phantom? When our fingers computer keys bash?
• 40:35
  Speaker 1: Do they know when enough has been printed? Oh? Tell
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: me the truth about cash and the money to pay
• 40:41
  Speaker 1: for our projects all over the country to splash? Must
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: we borrow these tokens from bankers? Oh? Please tell me
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: the truth about cash. When these tokens are seized by
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: our taxes causing everyone's teeth much to gnash? Why you
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: them to featherbed the bankers? Oh tell me the truth
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: about cash? Is the central bank subject to no one?
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: Would to question it? Prove very rash? Why is Parliament
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: deaf on this subject? Oh? Tell me the truth about cash?
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: If the banks produce money from nowhere? How much would
• 41:21
  Speaker 1: their profits be dashed? Should the nation take over this function? Oh?
• 41:28
  Speaker 1: Please tell me the truth about cash? A little more?
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: What on earth would we do with the money? Not
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: to mention the interest that we'd slash? Would our days
• 41:39
  Speaker 1: then forever be sunny? Oh? Please tell me the truth
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: about cash. That kind of takes it full circle. Would
• 41:49
  Speaker 1: our days then forever be sunny? In other words, would
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: we then, as we said a minute ago? Would we
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: then usher in anew enlightened age, a real one, and
• 41:58
  Speaker 1: get rid of this dark age we live in that's
• 42:00
  Speaker 1: disguised as an enlightened age. Yeah, and so you see
• 42:05
  Speaker 1: what would happen if the money trick is exposed and
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: we know how the magician does his trick how quickly
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: And that's the thing. It looks formidable, But wouldn't it
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: I'm going to put it in the form of a question.
• 42:19
  Speaker 1: If we reach that one hundredth monkey, that threshold where
• 42:23
  Speaker 1: enough people have read this and things like it, wouldn't
• 42:26
  Speaker 1: it change rather quickly? Or do you think it would
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: take a while? Or do you think the enlightenment would
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: be so vast that it would change rather quickly and
• 42:35
  Speaker 1: change to what it needs to be. It makes you
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: wonder just how quickly this would unravel, is what I'm saying.
• 42:44
  Speaker 2: It is my hope that would be so. But I'm
• 42:49
  Speaker 2: certainly the key to escaping from this prison that we're
• 42:53
  Speaker 2: all in with his money prison is for everyone to
• 42:57
  Speaker 2: understand it, and so few do. We got it in
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: more ways to be able to get this across the people. Yeah,
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's my effort is is not enough a
• 43:14
  Speaker 2: few thousand people reading it? I mean, it's great, it's
• 43:17
  Speaker 2: something that's there, But Arthur, I don't I don't think
• 43:23
  Speaker 2: we'll ever do it politically. I don't think anybody will
• 43:26
  Speaker 2: get on a soup soap box and listen you you'll never, never, never,
• 43:30
  Speaker 2: get anywhere in politics with it.
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: The only caveat. Yeah, go ahead, I'm sorry.
• 43:40
  Speaker 2: Well, we're not going to do it with votes, We're
• 43:41
  Speaker 2: not going to do it with protests. We can only
• 43:44
  Speaker 2: do it with education. If everybody knew this, then then
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: the powers that be that that enslave us with this
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: ghastly money system would have a very serious problem.
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: Indeed, So and maybe the next time or two that
• 44:01
  Speaker 1: I come to the UK, John, like I've done here
• 44:04
  Speaker 1: in the past some years ago, we can find a
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: local library that would host us for an evening program.
• 44:11
  Speaker 1: And maybe, even though maybe I'm being a little overly
• 44:14
  Speaker 1: speculative at this point in time, maybe you and I
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: can do a little presentation. Of course, you'd take the
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: lead and I would just be sort of the guy associations.
• 44:23
  Speaker 2: Mark you or your your your style. But I'm up
• 44:27
  Speaker 2: for that. Yes, please, Yeah.
• 44:29
  Speaker 1: Let's do a public presentation together. Ruffle some feathers and suit. Yeah,
• 44:36
  Speaker 1: so you're you're okay with that?
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: We're making a tentative plan.
• 44:40
  Speaker 2: My life before I fall off. My tweek is to
• 44:43
  Speaker 2: get everybody in the world to understand it.
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so why not do it together U if that
• 44:50
  Speaker 1: if that works out in all respects that it needs to.
• 44:54
  Speaker 1: And so we say about that, I.
• 44:56
  Speaker 2: Do not have your talent for getting all my hind
• 44:58
  Speaker 2: legs and delivering the in the way that you do.
• 45:01
  Speaker 2: But I want to assist you in every way I can.
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: Well, I was looking at it as me assisting you,
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: but uh, that's okay. I want one hand rubs the other.
• 45:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 45:11
  Speaker 1: So yeah, okay, so it's a date.
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: We'll call that a Yes, I'm looking forward to that much.
• 45:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, very good, very good. And I noticed also that
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: you call it the money trick, and you put something
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: in here that you can comment on a little more
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: or reflect on the magician metaphor. I scribbled that in there. Yeah,
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: and you're saying, and there's one of the characters in
• 45:42
  Speaker 1: your book that's saying this, the entire rule, the entire
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: world is fooled by this conjuring stunt. You must understand
• 45:49
  Speaker 1: that the process of turning debt into money, or you
• 45:53
  Speaker 1: might say money into debt, was not designed to be logical.
• 45:57
  Speaker 1: This is important. It was not designed to be logical,
• 45:59
  Speaker 1: but designed rather to confuse and deceive. After all, when
• 46:04
  Speaker 1: you see a lady cut in half by a magician.
• 46:08
  Speaker 1: You know, it's a trick. You don't have to understand
• 46:12
  Speaker 1: how the trick works to know that it's a trick. Similarly,
• 46:17
  Speaker 1: the bank pretending to lend money it doesn't have, while
• 46:21
  Speaker 1: receiving payment and interest for money it didn't lend. As
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: we said, a bank loans something but parts with nothing,
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: performs just such a trick like a magician. However, most
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: people don't realize that it's a trick, and of course
• 46:38
  Speaker 1: very few understand how it works, and some do, and
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: so on and so forth. So yeah, there's this minority
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: of people that understand not only that it's a trick,
• 46:52
  Speaker 1: but that it's a trick meant to deceive. Of course, tricks,
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: all tricks deceive in a way, but deceive in such
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: a way as to bring about oppression and suppress and
• 47:04
  Speaker 1: oppress the people. So it's for evil and immoral and
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: fraudulent ends. It's not simply some innocent trick like pulling
• 47:13
  Speaker 1: a rabbit out of your hat. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and
• 47:19
  Speaker 1: so on and so forth. But yeah, this book is
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: is really remarkable. Other parts about it, or are within it. Rather,
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: there's something here that says the Gryffen. This is this
• 47:34
  Speaker 1: mythical creature, the Gryffen g r y p h o N.
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: Alice has a conversation with this Gryffen, which is something
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: like a griffin. It's it's a mythical creature. The defense
• 47:50
  Speaker 1: of the realm and the establishment and maintenance of the
• 47:54
  Speaker 1: currency are the two prime responsibilities of government. The Gryffen
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: says to Alice. To hand control of either to private
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: hands is high treason. And you know that's interesting. There's
• 48:10
  Speaker 1: a movie starring Russell Crowe where he's a reporter. In
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: the movie is called State of Play. And the ultimate
• 48:16
  Speaker 1: realization that the reporter finds out in his investigations is
• 48:20
  Speaker 1: that all these private military contracting companies soldiers of fortune
• 48:25
  Speaker 1: type companies, and in real life there have been there
• 48:28
  Speaker 1: are such companies. I think Executive Outcomes was the name
• 48:31
  Speaker 1: of one of them. But what Russell Crowe the reporter
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: finds out is all the private companies are not competing
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: with one another to go fight wars and to be
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: contracting with nations to go fight those nations wars. They're
• 48:45
  Speaker 1: private armies. What Russell Crowe the reporter finds out is
• 48:49
  Speaker 1: all the private army companies have banded together to form
• 48:53
  Speaker 1: a cartel, and that's considered off the page outrageous. This
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: has to be stopped. But when financial financial bloodlines and
• 49:04
  Speaker 1: uh fortunes that are built over the centuries, when they
• 49:08
  Speaker 1: combine and conspire to form central banks, to form these
• 49:13
  Speaker 1: large financial institutions, we don't bat an eye. So we
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: don't want private army contractors to collaborate and conspire, and
• 49:23
  Speaker 1: yet we don't really realize what the same when we
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: don't really realize it or bad an eye, when financial
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: financial outfits, financial elements combine and collaborate to do the
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: very same thing as the Griphon is explaining. So the
• 49:40
  Speaker 1: defense of the realm we try to keep under government control,
• 49:43
  Speaker 1: even though there's still a lot of contracting with private companies.
• 49:47
  Speaker 1: But the currency of the realm is just handed over
• 49:51
  Speaker 1: hand over fist to private control.
• 49:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's that's the key to bring it
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: back under control of the state, to be spent into circulation,
• 50:08
  Speaker 2: not borrowed into circulation of interest.
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: And the Bradbury Pound was a chapter in British history
• 50:16
  Speaker 1: around the time of World War One, and I'm not
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: an expert on it, but the Bradbury Pound was although tentative,
• 50:22
  Speaker 1: although not complete. Necessarily there was a window of opportunity,
• 50:27
  Speaker 1: there was there not.
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: Indeed, yes, there was a when the balloon went up.
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: There's a run on gold and haven't got enough gold
• 50:35
  Speaker 2: to give up to people that wanted them. So the
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: Secretary of the Treasury was called John Bradbury. Yeah, and
• 50:43
  Speaker 2: if you read it, it doesn't say I promised to
• 50:47
  Speaker 2: pay the bear of one pound. It says it is
• 50:50
  Speaker 2: one pound like Lincoln's greenback. It was one pound, didn't
• 50:55
  Speaker 2: carry any interest. It got them out of a hole
• 50:58
  Speaker 2: for about a year, and then they dumped it went
• 51:01
  Speaker 2: back to usury again.
• 51:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so there was a one year window. And I
• 51:06
  Speaker 1: have an article on the UK column website about the
• 51:10
  Speaker 1: Island of Guernsey in the English Channel in the early
• 51:13
  Speaker 1: eighteen hundreds. The island freed itself from the clutches of
• 51:17
  Speaker 1: the banksters for twenty years and issued their own currency
• 51:22
  Speaker 1: twenty years. Yeah, right off the shores of your home
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: country now. See, so it has been done. If it's
• 51:31
  Speaker 1: been done before, and we don't want.
• 51:33
  Speaker 2: To canister, it's a good thought. We could do that again.
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: We can have our own currency in Hastings and I
• 51:41
  Speaker 2: don't know our income tax on it, but at least
• 51:46
  Speaker 2: we could swap our goods with our own currency, which
• 51:51
  Speaker 2: presumably it wouldn't it wouldn't have diminishing value monthly in
• 51:56
  Speaker 2: the way that inflation is destroying our currency at the moment.
• 52:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, there are people. This is worth a footnote the
• 52:04
  Speaker 1: late Robert J. Van Bemlin, And I'll mention I'm dedicating
• 52:09
  Speaker 1: this interview largely to the memory of Robert J. Van Bemlein,
• 52:13
  Speaker 1: who was a gardener and a teacher and a leader
• 52:18
  Speaker 1: in his family in his community. Lived in Ipsilanti and
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: near Ann Arbor, Michigan. He passed away, unfortunately from cardiac
• 52:26
  Speaker 1: arrest in twenty twenty. But he saw this book. He
• 52:30
  Speaker 1: really liked this book. He had several in his office,
• 52:34
  Speaker 1: and when I visit his family, I still sit in
• 52:36
  Speaker 1: his office in his memory and work in there. He
• 52:39
  Speaker 1: would have wanted that, and he understood that local currencies,
• 52:47
  Speaker 1: as you're suggesting, can at least be a starting point.
• 52:52
  Speaker 1: Because what happens is if you create a local currency
• 52:55
  Speaker 1: that has even some modicum of success, not only does
• 52:59
  Speaker 1: it work at least within a limited realm of buying
• 53:02
  Speaker 1: and selling, you know, maybe farmers' markets, things like that,
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: maybe homemade crafts, church church bazaars, church festivals. Not only
• 53:14
  Speaker 1: does it do that, but by using a local currency,
• 53:18
  Speaker 1: it begins to teach people wait a minute, I don't
• 53:21
  Speaker 1: necessarily need this British pound for everything.
• 53:25
  Speaker 2: Yes, yeah's excellent.
• 53:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And so people might hear local currency. It sounds
• 53:32
  Speaker 1: too little, too late, It sounds naive and all that.
• 53:36
  Speaker 1: It's a start. It's like a first step to get
• 53:40
  Speaker 1: people to think, Aha, something larger does need to happen, Yeah,
• 53:46
  Speaker 1: something more nationwide, worldwide. But this, you know, a journey
• 53:51
  Speaker 1: of one thousand miles begins with the first step. And
• 53:54
  Speaker 1: so I'm just putting that out there that if you're
• 53:57
  Speaker 1: cynical about it or skeptical, that's fine. But a local current,
• 54:00
  Speaker 1: and I have a little bit of experience in this
• 54:02
  Speaker 1: within Canada and the United States can have currency. A
• 54:09
  Speaker 1: local currency can have currency in the sense that it
• 54:11
  Speaker 1: can move goods and services to a point and then
• 54:16
  Speaker 1: or have a way of providing a discount on existing
• 54:20
  Speaker 1: goods and services where you'd pay a little bit of
• 54:22
  Speaker 1: regular money and then the local currency would be sort
• 54:25
  Speaker 1: of like a coupon currency and provide a discount, which
• 54:28
  Speaker 1: was Bob Van Bemlein's idea. He called it unity. So
• 54:32
  Speaker 1: that's a brief, a brief salute to Robert J. Van
• 54:36
  Speaker 1: Bemlin of ann Arbor, Michigan, to dedicate this interview partly
• 54:41
  Speaker 1: to his memory. But anyway, John, much could be said
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: about this book. I've shared some very significant sections of it,
• 54:52
  Speaker 1: and I want people viewing this interview, of course, to
• 54:57
  Speaker 1: buy copies, buy multiple copies if you're onclined, and spread
• 55:01
  Speaker 1: the word. Retired teachers, homeschooling programs, adult education courses to
• 55:08
  Speaker 1: the extent they might still exist. They used to be
• 55:10
  Speaker 1: a big thing around the turn of the early twentieth century.
• 55:15
  Speaker 1: Adult education was pretty widespread in the US and the UK,
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: and pretty pretty free in terms of what they could teach. Yes,
• 55:23
  Speaker 1: but yeah, the so what what might you think we
• 55:30
  Speaker 1: could we could do with this book? Uh? Maybe have
• 55:34
  Speaker 1: you ever considered doing like a little book tour? Has
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: have you ever approached any small bookstores? I'm just wondering
• 55:42
  Speaker 1: if any small bookstores have.
• 55:44
  Speaker 2: Each And I walk into a bookshop and I, you know,
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: try and give them the spill and try and get
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: them to take it on. With some success, I have
• 55:51
  Speaker 2: to say, and great, it's I do remember. This is
• 55:58
  Speaker 2: an interesting story. When I first took it to Waterstones,
• 56:02
  Speaker 2: they said, oh, well, you know we I took it
• 56:06
  Speaker 2: to a place called lakes No, it's not Lakeside, it's
• 56:16
  Speaker 2: it's called blue Water and it's near dark near the
• 56:19
  Speaker 2: Dartford Tunnel. It's the biggest shopping center in Europe. And
• 56:22
  Speaker 2: I took it to Waterstones, which is the biggest bookseller
• 56:26
  Speaker 2: in bigger than Foils. And they ordered a half dozen
• 56:32
  Speaker 2: and they sold them. And when they went to re
• 56:34
  Speaker 2: sell it again, the buyer said, do not reorder this box.
• 56:36
  Speaker 2: There's clearly some sort of censorship there.
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: But hmmm.
• 56:41
  Speaker 2: And the chap ordering it was more senior than the buyer,
• 56:45
  Speaker 2: but it wouldn't answer the emails, so there's resistance from However,
• 56:51
  Speaker 2: they now hold a dozen copies and you can get
• 56:56
  Speaker 2: it online from them. And of my, oh, I'm a
• 57:01
  Speaker 2: bit lazy, but I should go around to all of
• 57:03
  Speaker 2: the Waterstone shops and getting them individually to stop the
• 57:10
  Speaker 2: book so it's on display. It's one of my I
• 57:13
  Speaker 2: do remember. It was on display next to nineteen eighty
• 57:16
  Speaker 2: four and George, Oh, well that in that Dartford store
• 57:21
  Speaker 2: I'm very proud of that.
• 57:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, that's an excellent idea to give it that
• 57:32
  Speaker 1: extra turn, you know, that extra push at this very vital,
• 57:36
  Speaker 1: pivotal time that we're living in.
• 57:40
  Speaker 2: Mark, you lived my spirits and you've encouraged me. I'm
• 57:42
  Speaker 2: not doing enough. I must get out there and push
• 57:44
  Speaker 2: it harder.
• 57:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, only because it's so important, and only because so
• 57:50
  Speaker 1: many people have worked so hard, you being one of them,
• 57:53
  Speaker 1: to bring such vital information to light that tends to
• 57:56
  Speaker 1: get buried behind the headlines. Headlines tend to be if
• 58:00
  Speaker 1: it bleeds, it leads, if it blows up, it shows up.
• 58:04
  Speaker 1: It's got to be this more immediate thing. And some
• 58:06
  Speaker 1: of that's unavoidable. You need to report that stuff, but
• 58:09
  Speaker 1: we don't want it to be ultimately at the total
• 58:12
  Speaker 1: expense of If this were to get completely buried underneath
• 58:16
  Speaker 1: the headlines, then we wouldn't have the key to unlock
• 58:22
  Speaker 1: what we need to unlock and solve the problem. And
• 58:25
  Speaker 1: then you'd have far fewer things blowing up, you'd have
• 58:29
  Speaker 1: far fewer things bleeding. There'd be far more peace in
• 58:33
  Speaker 1: the world and far more cooperation and even migration, you know, logically,
• 58:39
  Speaker 1: migration heavy unchecked migration that tends to be overblown and
• 58:45
  Speaker 1: tends to cause damage to societies arguably is Arguably that's
• 58:51
  Speaker 1: because to a degree at least, some people are looking
• 58:54
  Speaker 1: for greener financial pastures, and the irregularities and problems that
• 58:59
  Speaker 1: this financial system some causes is no doubt among the
• 59:02
  Speaker 1: reasons that people just up and uproot, pull up their
• 59:06
  Speaker 1: ten stakes, and just walk, even illegally into another country
• 59:10
  Speaker 1: like the Texas border here because the economic system is
• 59:14
  Speaker 1: so unjust, they figured that maybe the next country over
• 59:17
  Speaker 1: has a better system, so it would it would arguably
• 59:21
  Speaker 1: it would cut down at least reduce illegal heavy unchecked
• 59:26
  Speaker 1: migration or what they call illegal immigration in the United
• 59:30
  Speaker 1: States that.
• 59:30
  Speaker 2: I know, you have a huge we have a problem here,
• 59:33
  Speaker 2: but not like yours.
• 59:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, maybe not in the overall magnitude of it, but
• 59:38
  Speaker 1: some of the results can be the same. You know.
• 59:41
  Speaker 1: It causes sort of multicultural tension, even though in my
• 59:45
  Speaker 1: mind maybe even people from different cultures if they got
• 59:48
  Speaker 1: together and read stuff like this, it would kind of
• 59:51
  Speaker 1: foil the whole migration trick and migration subdusion that's here
• 59:58
  Speaker 1: in England.
• 59:59
  Speaker 2: We've got to I'm to show you this month. We've
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 2: got to. In fact, I'll post you a couple of these.
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 2: You might be interested these. In America, we have a newspaper.
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 2: Can you see that. It's called The Light if you
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 2: come across.
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, when I was in your class October for a
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 1: UK column conference, I read several editions. Yeah, it's done
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 1: quite well.
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 2: Every month and there are people standing on you know,
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 2: in haste, and they're dishing them out people and they're
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 2: getting very very popular.
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Indeed that if your book has not been promoted
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 1: in there yet, maybe it has, but if it hasn't,
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 1: of course that would be a good outlet. And before
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 1: we before we sign off for today, I'm going to
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 1: have you give a website or all the ways that
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 1: people can get this book. We're going to do that
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 1: in a minute, but let me read a little bit more,
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 1: just to uh provide a summation to our discussion today.
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 1: The banks usurp the right of kings to create our
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 1: money and so bring to everyone the user's yoke enslaving
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 1: all till all are broke. Yeah, that really puts the
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 1: period on the end of a long and spirited discussion
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 1: that we've had today. On that note, John, how do
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 1: people get this book? What are all the different ways
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 1: or what's the best.
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 2: Way to any bookshop and asked for it, And of
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 2: course those people go to Amazon these days and they
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 2: stock it and they and they'll paste it to you.
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 1: So a bookshop can look it up in their computer catalog.
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 2: Is it yeah, and it's it's and they can get
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 2: it with very short There are stocks of it in
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 2: the in the host sailors, which is called gardeners. There's
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 2: just too carry out books in England, and they carry
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 2: a stock of it, and the bookshops if you ask
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 2: for it in anybody. I like to go to bookshops
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 2: rather than than Waterstones, the big one, because I like
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 2: to support little bookshops and then if they are. There
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 2: was a I do remember in London there was a
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 2: sort of analysis exposition exhibition at the Rule of Victoria.
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 2: What's the Music that the Albert Victoria and Albert Museum.
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 2: So I went there and tried to give them my book,
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 2: because you need to sell this. I didn't want to
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 2: know about it. But the bookshop just down the road
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 2: I went in and they sold a couple of dozen.
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 1: You see that that's very interesting. That doesn't sound like
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 1: a lot of books, but to just take a book
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 1: in there cold Turkey and say here and they saw
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 1: a couple dozen. That means that people.
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 2: Were talking to London to go to see this this
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 2: Alice in Wonderland exhibition at them.
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I was going to say that when you sell,
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 1: when you sell that books like that, they would.
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 2: Want to sell it through, you know, to earn a bomber.
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 2: The book shot around the corners sold.
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 1: A few, right, I mean that's that's fairly brisk sales.
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 1: As I was mentioning here that you know, you sell
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: a couple dozen, couple doesen't there? A couple doesn't here.
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 1: It shows that once people know it's there, either a
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 1: few people are buying those couple doesn't maybe three or
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 1: four people buy three or four books each whatever, or
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 1: somebody's buying somebody's buying all ten or twelve, fifteen, twenty
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 1: four of them, meaning that they want to share them
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 1: with other people. Either way, it shows you that when
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 1: people get a whiff of this, when they get a
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 1: tast status.
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 2: They get energized about it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And that's the purpose of this interview is to
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 1: increase that energizing of the population. Both UK Colum viewers
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 1: that are already largely aware of the basic problem, existing
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 1: viewers and the many many new viewers and members that
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 1: UK Column always attracts, and so we're all at different
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 1: stages of education about various issues. That's just the way
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 1: it works. But John Briggs, thanks for doing this interview
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 1: with me today.
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 2: Well, I can't thank you enough Mark, that's absolutely supervan.
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 2: I'm glad you presided over it in such a wonderful
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 2: way because I'm not very good at delivering this stuff,
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 2: but i can see you have a real talent for
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 2: this and I thank you for it deeply.
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 1: Well, that's nice to you to say John Allison the
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 1: Money Tree, he just explained ladies and gentlemen how to
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 1: get your copies. It's not a long read, but it's
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 1: a pleasant read despite the topic. And I'm Mark Anderson,
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 1: US based UK column correspondent and we'll see you next
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 1: time here on UK Column Interviews. Thanks for listening, Thanks
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 1: John for being with me.
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 2: God bless you and thank you so much.