Latest / The Marketing Career Podcast with Fexingo: Marketing Jobs, Skills, and Career Growth / How Mid-Career Marketers Use the Informational Interview to Unlock Hidden Jobs
Transcript
- Lucas: So Luna, we talk a lot on this show about the visible job market — job boards, recruiter outreach, the formal application process. But there's this parallel track that I think very few mid-career marketers use intentionally, and it's arguably the most powerful one. Luna: You're talking about the informational interview, right? The coffee chat that isn't really a job interview? Lucas: Exactly. And I know that term sounds like something you'd hear in a college career center — 'Go do informational interviews!' — and most people do one or two, and then they stop because it feels awkward or because they're not sure what to ask. But I want to argue that for a mid-career marketer, the informational interview is actually a strategy, not a one-off task. Luna: Okay, I'm listening. Because I've definitely been on both sides of that table. Sometimes it feels productive. Other times it feels like you're just taking up someone's time. Lucas: Right, and that's exactly the problem. Most people approach it without a system. So let me give you a concrete case. A former colleague of mine — let's call her Sarah — she was a senior marketing manager at a mid-size CPG company. She wanted to move into brand strategy at an outdoor lifestyle company, specifically Patagonia. She didn't know anyone there. So she did what most people do: she applied online. And she got no response. Luna: Classic black hole. Lucas: Exactly. So she switched tactics. She identified 10 people at Patagonia who held roles she'd want in two to three years — not her exact dream job, but one step ahead. She found them on LinkedIn, looked for common ground: same university, same conference, shared connection. Then she sent a short email asking for 20 minutes of advice, specifically asking one question: 'What's the one thing you wish you'd known before taking this role?' Luna: That's a good question. It's low pressure, and it shows you've thought about it. Lucas: She got seven replies out of ten. Seven. That's a 70 percent response rate. She did those calls over three weeks. Now here's the key — she never asked for a job. She didn't send her resume unless asked. She just listened and asked follow-ups. And at the end of each call, she'd ask: 'Is there anyone else you think I should talk to?' Luna: That's the classic network expansion move. And it works because you're basically getting a warm introduction from someone who already trusts you. Lucas: Precisely. Within two months, she had a referral from one of those conversations into a role that wasn't even posted yet. She got an interview, and she eventually got the offer. The job was never on a public board. Luna: So the lesson is: the hidden job market is real, and informational interviews are the skeleton key. But I think a lot of people struggle with the 'ask' itself. They don't know what to say in that first email. Lucas: That's where the framework comes in. I break it into two phases: the scout phase and the learn phase. The scout phase is about identifying the right people. You don't want to target people in the exact job you want — that can feel like you're trying to take their spot. Instead, target people one or two levels above, or in a parallel function. Use LinkedIn filters, alumni databases, even conference speaker lists. Luna: And the learn phase? That's the actual conversation. Lucas: Right. Before the call, you prepare five questions. But the rule is: none of them should be answerable with a quick Google search. So don't ask 'What does a brand manager do?' Instead, ask something like 'What's the most unexpected part of your week?' Or 'What skill did you lean on most in your first six months?' The goal is to get them talking about their real experience, not a job description. Luna: I love that. And I think there's a subtle psychological shift here. When you ask for advice, you're positioning yourself as someone who's thoughtful and coachable. That's a much better signal than 'Can you look at my resume?' Lucas: Exactly. And if the conversation goes well, you can ask for a referral. But you don't do it in the moment. You send a thank-you note the same day, referencing something specific they said. Then, a week later, if you see a role that fits, you send a short note: 'I saw this posting and thought of our conversation. Would you feel comfortable referring me?' Luna: That's respectful. You're not putting them on the spot during the call. Lucas: And if they say no? That's fine. You thank them and move on. The relationship is still warm. You can ask again later for a different role. The key is to not treat each call as a transaction. Luna: So what's the one piece of advice you'd give to a listener who's about to send their first informational interview request today? Lucas: Keep the ask tiny. 15 or 20 minutes. Offer to meet at their convenience. And include that one question I mentioned — 'What's the one thing you wish you'd known?' It's disarming. It shows you're not wasting their time. And honestly, people like talking about themselves. Give them a chance to share their hard-earned lessons. Luna: That's a good reminder that this whole practice is ultimately about building genuine curiosity. If you're just trying to extract a job, it shows. But if you're genuinely interested in someone's career path, that comes across. Lucas: And if these marketing conversations have sparked something you've actually used — maybe a framework, a question, a tactic — and you want to support the fact that we deliberately keep this show ad-free, you can do that at buy me a coffee dot com slash fexingo. No pressure. Just a way to keep the conversations going without any sponsor interference. Luna: Yeah, it's a small thing that makes a big difference for us. We get to keep the focus on what's useful for you, not on selling something. Lucas: Alright, back to informational interviews. One thing I think is under-discussed: how do you actually turn a good conversation into a referral without feeling pushy? Luna: I think the timing matters. Don't ask in the first email. Don't ask during the call unless they explicitly offer. But in that thank-you note, you can plant a seed: 'I really valued your perspective on X. If you ever hear of an opening in your team, I'd love to know.' Lucas: That's smart. It's a soft ask. And then if a role appears, you have permission to follow up. I'd add one more thing: track your conversations. Use a simple spreadsheet — name, company, date, key takeaway, follow-up action. A lot of people let these connections go cold because they forget to follow up after two months. Luna: That's such a practical tip. And it's a basic marketing skill, right? You're managing a pipeline of relationships, not just applications. Lucas: Exactly. You're building a network of informed advocates. And the beauty is that even if the first round of conversations doesn't land you a job, you've built this asset that pays dividends over your entire career. I still hear from people I had coffee with five years ago who now send me job leads. Luna: So the informational interview is really a long-term play. It's not a quick fix. Lucas: Right. But it's the most reliable way into the hidden market. And for mid-career marketers, where your network is often your most valuable asset, it's a skill worth investing in. Luna: Great conversation. Let's leave listeners with that one question to use in their next informational interview. Lucas: 'What's the one thing you wish you'd known before taking this role?' Write it down, use it, and see what happens.