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Brigitte Cutshall: The Formula for Publishing a Quality Book · The Daily Writer

• 0:12
  SPEAKER_00: Hey my friend, welcome to the Saturday edition of the Daily Rider.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_00: Each weekday we bring you a short lesson that helps you live out the four practices of a successful writer.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_00: Creativity, consistency, courage, and connection.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_00: Here on the weekend edition, we take a deeper dive into those topics through conversations with writers and teaching that helps us apply what we're learning.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_00: For more, you can visit us at dailyriderlife.com.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_00: Whenever I talk to new writers, the most overwhelming emotion that I sense from them is confusion.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_00: There are so many options and resources for publishing and writing a book that it's honestly hard to know what to do next.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_00: Fortunately, there is a clear pathway forward, and my good friend Bridget Cutshall is here today to walk us through the formula for publishing a quality book.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_00: In fact, the title of her new fantastic book is Quality Book Formula Professionally Publish Your Book for Excellence.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_00: Bridget is a solutions consultant and the founder of Gemini Media.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_00: She knows all the secrets to publishing a quality book after spending three decades in the print media industry.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_00: She started Gemini Media to share her insider knowledge on the best solutions with content creators like you.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_00: And the solutions she offers include production services, print project management, strategic sourcing, and content development.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_00: In this conversation, Bridget and I get pretty deep into the geeky side of publishing, which was a ton of fun.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_00: We talk about shipping issues, creating print books, and what it takes to just develop a really high-quality book.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_00: Bridget is basically a creative genius, and it was really a blast having her on the show.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I know you're going to enjoy this conversation as much as I did.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_00: So let's get to the conversation with my good friend Bridget Cutshaw.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: Bridget, welcome to the Daily Writer Podcast.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_00: It is so good to connect with you on here.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_00: We've been friends for a little while now, but it's good to have you as a guest for the very first time on the show.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_00: So welcome.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_02: I appreciate it.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_02: It's a great, a great honor to be on your podcast, Kent.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_00: Well, thanks.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_00: I appreciate that.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_00: So, Bridget, we're here to talk about your amazing new book, Quality Book Formula, Professionally Publish Your Book for Excellence.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_00: And I want to dive into some of the topics that you mentioned in this book because this is such a critical element.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_00: You can write a great book, but actually crafting a high-quality book going through the publishing process is really a whole different animal than just sitting down and typing words into a Word document or a Google Doc.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_00: So before I get into some specific questions about all this, can you give us somewhat of your background with creating high-quality books and why this topic is so important to you?
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I got into, I've been in print media for over three decades, and books fall into that.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_02: Print media 30 years ago, whatever, was very popular, even before that.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_02: I got in, I joke, I got into it by accident.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_02: I was a college student and I had to get a job, part-time job, and I ended up working for a um huge book printer, right?
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't know back then printers were part of publishing companies.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it's just a lot of there's a lot of cost involved.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_02: And so I learned about um the actual production process there.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_02: Because, like you said, it's not just, you know, uh words on a word doc, whatever, it there's so much involved in the actual production.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_02: And traditional publishers put a lot of time and money into it.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_02: And that's why their books look so good, right?
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_02: And there's a reason behind it.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_02: And I got the idea.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I've been in different aspects.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_02: I work for book publishers, I work for book large book printers, I work for equipment manufacturer and the marketing and product management as so I've seen every angle of it, if that makes sense.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_02: There's different little aspects of it or big aspects, excuse me.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_02: And that's kind of how I got a lot of different types of perspectives to understand how a book is should look.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_02: Or I back then we called it print media, right?
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_02: But um, but but the book, the book aspect, I've always been fascinated with them for some reason as a little kid.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_02: That's what I had.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_02: We didn't have the internet back then, right?
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's true.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_00: We didn't.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_02: We had libraries, and my parents had books access for me, like encyclopedia set.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_02: That's kind of how I got fascinated with it.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_02: And that's why I think I stayed in the business so long because I love books.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_02: The physical books aren't going to go away.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_02: It the idea came to me to write this is because I kept seeing so much out there, books about how to write, and then books of how to market it.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_02: But what about the actual thing, you know, the book itself, the product?
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_02: But no one talks about it because I think they find it kind of boring.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_02: And I had some other successful authors say, Bridget, share your knowledge.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_02: And I took that for granted.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_02: I want a lot of us do that.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_02: We take that knowledge for granted.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_02: And it's still very, very popular.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_02: And be and during COVID, um, books um being published and the actual printing has actually exploded.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_02: It's gotten better.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_02: People were afraid that these ebooks were going to take over.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_01: It's not.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_02: And no, and it's right, they have not.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm like, I'm I'm glad I listened to these other authors.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_02: They're like, why don't you share that?
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, okay, you know, but but I I had to be convinced just because I thought, well, what I know is boring, and it's not, and I should not hide that information.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_00: No, I I love this.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_00: So uh it is so funny.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if you have this experience, but I'll share an experience.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously, I'm not going to name the author because I don't want to embarrass them, but this is let's say in the in the last six months.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, I'm thinking of at least one book.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_00: There's probably several of these, but I picked up a book, self-published book by a friend of mine.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_00: And uh I really loved their book, it was great.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_00: But when I got the printed copy, I opened it up and my heart sunk a little bit because the margins were not correct in the book.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm curious, so you know, maybe I should call in a priest right now because this is like confession time.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_00: But but honestly, every time I open a print book, I always look for that stuff because you know, the font choices, the design elements, the margins, the headers, all that stuff, I feel is really, really important and it gets ignored a lot.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_00: What are some of the things that when you crack open a particularly a self-published book for the first time, what are some of the things that you always look for immediately, just as somebody who's really into this?
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you mentioned too the the trim or the margins and the bleeds.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_02: And I think a lot of people uh self-publishing are trying to save money and they design it themselves and they don't know what they're if you hire ideas.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_02: That's what's going on.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_02: And I look at that, I look at the I look at more I for some reason the gutter margin, which's in the center.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_02: And if there you have to have a larger gap, especially, especially soft cover books real popular.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_02: If you have to keep pushing it open, that book is eventually going to fall apart.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_02: I said, well, I mean, it will happen.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_02: And I, you know, I'm thinking, well, they don't know what they're uh they're doing here, and that turns me off.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_02: And especially if you're an author trying to promote your business or expertise, that turns that turns Bridget off.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_02: Because I think right.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_02: And that's I I do look at the if they're bleeds, if people are listening, a bleed means like an image or something or a color graphic goes off the edge.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_02: If you you you want to make sure that is is proper and you have to make sure, again, it's really worth the time and effort to have a designer involved.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_02: It it's it is so to me, it's important.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_02: It says a lot about your message.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_02: With an ebook, you can't really tell, right?
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I find ebooks I can tell them when they're crappily put together too.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_02: Sorry.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_02: But um, but um, but the physical book is really, really important because that I I mentioned that in the book, it is part of your brand too, right?
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_02: It is, it's you.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_02: People think of you when they see that.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_02: And your message, you don't want it to stand out in a bad way, your book.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_02: You want it to stand out more positive.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_02: And I call it being a little bit subtle.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_02: Do you know what I'm saying?
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_02: Certain, certain that's why another reason you got to get a designer involved.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_02: They have different genres of books, they have different types of cover designs, but the the interior is just as important.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_02: And I will throw the book away.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_02: I really will, if it's not designed, meaning the design, meaning they didn't consider the paper.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, another thing that's sorry, the paper that bugs the heck out of me.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_02: If you're using really cheap paper and you can see it bleeds through the, you know, if you have heavy design, you gotta have thicker paper.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_02: People don't realize there's different types of paper.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_02: That you just gotta think of all that.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_02: And that's why you have to plan ahead um with your whoever you're gonna, if you're gonna have a physical book, it's best to look at you know, samples.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_02: I recommend that of the previous printing because you don't know, they could say whatever they want on the website.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_02: You know, you want something physical to to look at it.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_02: And to me, paper is just as critical as how it's designed.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_00: So, what is your feeling?
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_00: Now, here I'm getting really granular and geeky.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_00: What is your feeling about cream paper versus white paper in nonfiction books?
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I think from my experience and what I've seen, the traditionally published books that from the big publishers, they usually uh use cream paper in the beginning, natural.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_02: We also call it natural.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_02: That actually is slightly thicker or bulk creates more bulk in your book, if that makes sense.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_02: And that's one of the reasons why they do it.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_02: And um, it's it's not less slightly more than the white paper.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_02: But right now we're in a crazy world with the um paper industry with COVID.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_02: But it's that's one of the main reasons because it it it looks better.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_02: I think it does, especially if it's just black and white, you know what I'm saying.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_02: It's not if you haven't had photographs, you definitely don't want to use the natural cream paper.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_02: But that's really the main reason.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_02: It is slightly thicker and it costs slightly more, but it does have a better visual appeal to your eyes, and it won't be so could be glaring if you just have black and white or you know, black text on white paper.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_00: It is funny how these these kinds of things I feel like they subtly affect the reader's experience.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I got a this is a nonfiction book.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um, this is probably three or four months ago, and the author has written a series of books.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_00: This is like a history kind of a book, and I don't remember what what their name was, but when I got the book, it was printed on the kind of paper, it's like that real slick, glossy paper that was white.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: And the the physical book was really, really heavy.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_00: It wasn't, it was like maybe 300 pages or something, and I was really, really surprised.
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I don't see nonfiction books that often that are, unless they're textbooks that are printed on that, like that slick kind of really white paper.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_00: It was super, it was like a really odd choice by the publisher.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: Is there a reason sometimes they do that?
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_02: It could be um the man issue with paper right now that we're having, and they just you know, but that makes no sense for a nonfiction book to be on gloss at at all.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_00: It was really yeah, it was really strange.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't make sense.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_02: They could have, I see some people.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_02: One of the reasons I dove into this with this book, more people are self-publishing and they don't understand that.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_02: And they need to unlike you said, it's subtly you're affecting your brand.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_02: And I I don't know why they would do that.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_02: Obviously, they to me they use a commercial printer, which specializes in pamphlets and booklets, you know what I'm saying, and not actual books.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_02: It could be the issue with unfortunately, we're having some turnaround time issues because so many people are publishing books and which is good, but then people don't understand.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_02: Well, they want it out sooner, and so then they will get it printed on glassy paper, which I that would turn me off too.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_02: It's that's meant for like photographs, right?
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, uh the book is still great, but I found that the I know this sounds super geeky, but because the book feels a lot heavier to me, it actually deters me from picking it up and carrying it with me or from reading it.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_00: I know that sounds really silly, but but that the physical experience of reading the print book, I think is such a critical part of it that that many times we just overlook as writers because because we're focused on the words and the stories and so forth, but that physical experience subtly communicates your attention to detail, it communicates your desire to have a quality product, which is really important.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_00: Now, walk us through because I don't fully know know what's going on with this.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um, what's the deal with the paper issue right now?
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, we all know the world is is is all kind of whacked out.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_00: We've had a pandemic, now we have a war going on.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_00: That's only adding to all kinds of chaos.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that doesn't help.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_00: So kind of help us understand as writers what's going on with the paper uh supply issues.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_02: This actually, the paper stuff actually started before COVID happened.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I didn't know that.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, it did.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_02: But the main reason is we are ordering, I'm not blaming on Amazon, but we're ordering stuff from home.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_02: And so those paper mills are creating material for the corrugated boxes.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, seriously, yes, not for paper.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_02: And then never thought about that.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_02: So these part of it is we think we were like not very happy in the book printing industry.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_02: They were doing this to create more, reduce the supply to increase the demand.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I'm saying?
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_00: In the paper just oh, I never thought about that, right?
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_02: Because they're competing, they were competing in North America with like China to bring in the paper.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I'm saying?
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_02: There's a big competition with that, and so that was another reason.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_02: People were importing so much paper from China, and so you're right, and so they had just too much supply out there.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_02: It's the supply and demand thing, economics.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_02: So then what happened is COVID came about, and people were afraid the first year in 2020 to like publish anything.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_02: But then they're like, everybody wanted a physical book because they missed it.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_02: And then that's why that, and so now we have this huge demand now.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_02: So, but we don't have enough, we don't have enough um paper manufacturers and business anymore.
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_02: And then you have the then you have the um the ports, you know, the that they're getting clogged up.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_02: That was happening before COVID.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_02: They just didn't talk about that.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_02: That was happening before I had to, sorry guys, I had to import something from China.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_02: It wasn't a book, but it used to get stuck in uh LA.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_02: So then I started having it coming into Savannah because we weren't so clogged up.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_02: It's just the labor, it's just a combination of of it's the economic issue.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_02: And then interesting.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, COVID just amplified it.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_02: So if you want really good, you know, most of our paper in North America does come from Canada.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_02: And and by the way, it didn't help that uh, I think those truckers were there's some truckers.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_00: Right, there's some kind of a trucker issue in Canada.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_00: I don't I don't know anything about it beyond that.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_00: I've just seen it in the news.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_02: Right, and but that wasn't helping.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_02: We need our paper from Canada.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, guys, just figure it out.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_00: Whatever it takes, please figure it out.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_02: And that's the good, the good we we call it the good paper.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_02: There's manufacturers in in like um, I shouldn't say the southwest, but the south, not the southeast, but that we also have some paper coming in from Mexico, but that's usually more of like what you call the groundwood paper, you know.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_02: I'm talking about.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay, okay.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_02: Groundwood was I don't recommend that for a book because that could turn yellow in the future.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_00: Is that more newspaper paper?
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's more like that.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_02: A lot of people do their when catalogs are popular, um, they use groundwood paper.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_02: So that makes sense.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_02: And there's, you know, there's so many different ways.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_02: I recommend if you're gonna do put on there if you use recycle paper, and and that's another reason why that we mentioned the natural paper.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_02: You don't have bleach in that.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_02: That's another reason.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_02: So that makes sense.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_02: There's just so many little I didn't think about that mentioning that earlier.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_02: There's there's bleach added um to the white paper.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_02: That's why it's white.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_00: Well, yeah, that makes sense.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_02: And but then straight up groundwork paper, which is on average what we here in the United States, we call it the basis weight, is on average like 40 to 45 pounds.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_02: But that business is there, most of those people are probably not making corrugated material.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, because not many people are producing catalogs anymore.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, that's true.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_02: That's that's part of it.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_02: And so there's just we're just trying to figure out what's the best thing to do.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_02: And right now, what we're involved in can't, the actual books that people want to read, that's that's a good um demand issue.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_02: But then the paper companies are trying to figure out, and then also I need to mention this the paper industry, they're allocating only allowing so many pounds to go to book printers.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_02: So that's another thing that's added.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_02: There it's called allocation.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_02: If you're some huge global book printer like R.R.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_02: Donnelly, um, they're gonna get lots more of the paper.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_02: So that makes sense.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_02: Totally makes sense.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_02: Just trying to, I don't know, people don't talk about it, but it's I used to um one of the printers I the original one I worked for a long time ago, they were bought out by R.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_02: R R Donnelly.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if you've ever heard of them, but I you know it's it's funny you mentioned them.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: So I used to live in northern Illinois in a town called Singer, which is like an hour north of Bloomington, Illinois, uh, a couple hours south of Chicago, something like that, an hour and a half.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_00: And we had a gentleman in our church who worked for R.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_00: R.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_00: Donald, but he drove like probably an hour each way.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: And he worked there the whole time.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_00: I was I was at the church for like seven or eight years, and he worked there.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_00: And I remember him talking about some of the stuff they would print, you know, they would do catalogs and everything, Bibles.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_00: I and it's interesting because I think occasionally I will get something from Amazon that says it was printed by R.R.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_00: Donnelly.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_00: It may not say it was printed by Donnelly, but I think where where are they located?
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_02: Is it they have multiple, they have multiple locations, they're headquartered in Chicago, but they bought multiple plants, and I think R.R.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_02: Donnelly is being merged with somebody else.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_02: I can't remember specifically.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_02: But one thing, I mean, yeah, Amazon is doing people don't know this, they are outsourcing two book printers now.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_00: They so um so Ingram's outsourcing Amazon who's outsourcing two.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_02: Right, right.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_02: That's what's going on.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_02: And because Amazon is really good at distribution, but nine in production is very expensive for the equipment.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_02: So now they it's all happened recently that this is going on.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_02: And um Amazon, I I think in a way it's good and it's good and bad.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_02: They're helping these book printers stay alive, you know what I'm saying?
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, which I'm hey, anything that helps independent companies or small companies that are connected with books stay open, I am all for that.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, and I also read recently that Amazon is closing their physical bookstores.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know how many they have.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_00: I read that too the other day.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_02: And in that, but that's good for the independent bookstores.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_02: My understanding is they weren't doing well because they were curating books that were like popular online.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_02: Well, who gives a you know what?
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_02: What about your local community?
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_02: What books do they want?
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_02: It's about who is your audience, and if you're in that particular, I mean that's it all goes into to the marketing aspect, but I used to like I could tell back in the day, I'm like, ew, this was printed by Amazon, but now the books have gotten better because you're actually outsourcing to uh actual book um printers.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I've got one here that I got from a friend of mine yesterday.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um so the only the only I think complaint that I have about Amazon's paperbacks is the the paper's fine, but sometimes the covers feel like they're printed on like a like an ink.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_00: Well, maybe they are they're printed on like an inkjet printer.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_00: Probably not quite the level of publishers.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's really good, but it's not quite the level of like a of a traditional publisher.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_02: It it definitely looks different.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_02: I had uh my book, I had uh one printed um with a on a digital press, however, but it's not yeah, it's different quality compared to something that will be printed on Amazon.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_02: It's just spread, we don't know which equipment they have and which brand.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_00: And it can be different depending on what day you order.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_00: It could be printed as the East Coast or the Midwest or whatever.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_02: That's the downside of Amazon outsourcing everything, is the quality is not going to be consistent.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_02: That's the downside.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_00: But I still would rather deal with that than having to go through all the the machinery of a traditional publisher for everything that I want to do.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that's just a whole other ball of wax.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_02: It's expensive, it's very expensive.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_02: And but the industry understands that, and that's why these book printers do offer um the inkjet, which is better quality if you're gonna have photos.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_02: Now the laser printing is actually much better quality than inkjet, right?
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_00: But they don't do that though, correct?
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_00: Amazon doesn't do laser Amazon does does not think so, correct.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_02: And it's more expensive.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_02: That equipment is if you're gonna have good quality digital print, you want it to be on a laser press.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_02: And um, but then and this bigger, you they're usually bigger formats.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_02: And I think Amazon got into all this when they bought Create Space, which is based in South Carolina.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_02: I can't remember.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_02: I think I've been there before a long time ago when I was like part of the equipment, you know, trying to push equipment on.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_02: Sorry.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_02: And that was in the marketing aspect.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_02: But and that's what is, that's how they got into it.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_02: They bought pa companies like Create Space in Charleston, and then they slowly got into it.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_02: But now everybody, their brother wants to self-publish, which is fine, but you still have to know all the the steps involved.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_02: And again, it goes back to just pause a little bit and don't try to do everything yourself, right?
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_02: Especially physical book.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_00: Now let's so I'm I'm glad you made that that segue because I could geek out over this the minutiae of Amazon and and paper and books, because I just love talking about this stuff.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_00: And there's like nobody, very few people in my everyday world, you know, really enjoy having these conversations about highly geeked out issues related to supply lines and uh Amazon print quality, that kind of stuff.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_00: So I think it's really fun.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_00: But I'm glad you brought this back around.
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_00: I would love to dive into a couple of things from your book.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_00: Walk us through, if if you would, maybe two or three of the major concepts from your book as far as hey, if you're a writer, don't forget about these really important parts of creating a high quality book.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_00: Let's assume the writing is good, let's assume the editing and the cover design, you know, let's kind of assume that we have those locked in to some degree.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_00: What are some of the things that authors are going to tend to mess up and things that you talk about in your book?
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_02: They um need to make sure, like you mentioned, the cover is usually done first.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_02: That provides inspiration on how you're gonna lay out the interior.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_02: I also recommend you have a um a designer.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_02: Usually it's it's recommended to have someone separate, an interior designer.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_02: Do you know what I'm saying?
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_00: Really?
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_02: Um that's okay, but they there's some designers who've been there in the business for a long time and they can do both.
• 24:15
  unknown: Okay.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_00: Because I thought you would I thought those uh those graphical elements that there should be some continuity between choices for the cover and the interior.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_02: You that's why you have to have a cover done first.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_02: And then what I recommend people need to do is get that's when you get a designer involved, even if it is your cover designer, get them involved to help you decide um what kind of trim size you want in paper.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_02: How is a you know, how much ink is gonna be required on the interior?
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_02: It decides on how much, you know, the type of paper you're gonna have.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_02: And that's when I think people forget they don't create their budget early enough to if they're gonna have a physical copy, even if it's through Amazon, even if it's through Amazon, you still got to know the expected page count and the kind of paper you're gonna use and how much ink is gonna go on that paper.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_02: Amazon is fantastic with one color, but if you try to do anything with four-color interior, it's really expensive.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_02: And you need to that also is gonna help you develop what your retail price is gonna be.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_02: It's all related, you know, in the beginning.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_02: You have, like you said, the editing is done, and then you start the design phase.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_02: Then you have to get, I recommend you get um, even if it is Amazon, you've got to get an idea of the estimate of what the prints are gonna be for the the pages.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_02: And as I also recommend in printing, your page count at a minimum should be divisible by four.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_02: Sorry, it's just based on the equipment.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_02: I prefer um, if you're gonna go end up going offset, if it's a larger quantity, it's even better if it's divisible by 16.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_00: So make it basically explain.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I I know what it is, but explain for listeners what is offset printing versus going through Amazon.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_02: Offset printing is was invented uh over a hundred years ago.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_02: And I can't remember the guy's name.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_02: Sorry, it's in my book.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_02: I can't remember his name, but it's really super high quality where you have the um, you have to use a plate to put the ink onto the onto the paper, and it's super um we just call it offset because it's not directly from the ink to the paper, you know, like digital, where it's offset.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_02: That's why they call it offset.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_02: It has to go through a plate and then um on a paper.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_00: The ink is transferred to the plate, then it's transferred from the plate to the paper.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, and then and that's why it's more expensive because you have to make these plates.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, but the plate has something to do with um it's higher quality, isn't it?
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_02: It's just much higher quality in this, and that's why it's better to have a min, but there's usually a minimum print run to do something like that.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_02: On average, it's 500 to 1000.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_02: But if you're gonna have especially photography, you know, books, and even it most textbooks are printed offset printing now, and because you want you usually have images in there and it's just gonna be better, if that makes sense.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_02: And inkjet, I shouldn't say inkjet, I'm sorry, digital print came around early in the 90s, and we're like, oh my goodness, what the heck is this?
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_02: You you know, you think of a printer in your office, and back then the printing in your office was not as good, but it has improved along the way.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_02: And they um weren't sure in the beginning about binding for like perfect bound books.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_02: That's been was an issue in the early stages too.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_02: The binding wasn't as good, and it was again uh it was just a glue issue.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_02: We call that part of production called post, we call it post press after it's printed.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_02: How are you gonna put it together?
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_02: Right, and if it's offset or uh usually digital print, they usually have a perfect bound at the end of the piece of the equipment.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_02: If that makes sense.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_02: Perfect bound is where you have multiple pages together and you have a cover with the spine, you have art on the spine.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_02: That we call that perfect binding.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, as opposed to glue, right?
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_02: And the glue is included inside, but we call it perfect binding because of the edges are perfect.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_02: See, I brought my book, it's like perfect and smooth, and the glue um that's used, it also depends on oh, heavier the book, you want what's a heavier, a more durable glue called P U R, which is polyurethane.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_02: I'm getting too geeky here, sorry.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_02: But that if you're gonna have like these bigger textbooks, some of them are smythe sewn.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_02: That's another type of binding, too, right?
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_02: Smythe is where you actually have it, has it sewn with thread, right?
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_02: And those are definitely for really popular for the hardcover books and for training books if it keeps it together.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_02: And then there was another type of there's so many options out there.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_02: That's why it what's the purpose of your book?
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_02: And that'll help you determine the kind of binding.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_00: Mostly you would not need to worry about that unless you are sending your book, unless you're having independently printed through a printer, as opposed to just using Amazon, correct?
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_02: Correct.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_02: Amazon can only give you a perfect bound book, that's the only thing they can offer right right now.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_02: That's the only thing they offer.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_00: Well, it makes sense, you know, economically for them just to offer one type of thing because they're not primarily a printing company.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_00: No, they're really an an e-commerce company.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's happens to do printing.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and they and it's and it's fine.
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that's it opened the door to help more people get their message out there.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_02: And that's the that's the pro of Amazon.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_02: They can they're allowing more people to have their voices heard and create a book.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_02: And I think they recently started offering hardcover version, but that's again because they're outsourcing that they didn't buy the crazy.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, let me dive into to one thing, kind of as we begin to wrap this up.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_00: There's just tons of directions we could go with this, right?
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_00: There really is.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and there's so much to this that sometimes people can get lost down the black hole of book stuff, you know, what and because there's so many options.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_00: But let's talk about something that I feel is not talked about hardly ever among authors, and that is how to decide what your trim size of your book should be.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_00: In fact, I had this conversation with a coaching client just this morning.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I was talking about, hey, you know, what size do you want your book to be?
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_00: Have you thought about that?
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_00: And they hadn't really thought about it.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_00: It's something else people never give much thought to, but can you walk us through how to decide how big your your book should be?
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_00: And let's let's assume we're doing a paperback book through Amazon just to kind of simplify things here.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, what it is, you wanted to, you know, to me, it's important to know who is your, who's gonna be, you know, your client or who's gonna buy this book, your avatar, right?
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_02: And also your genre is is uh should be considered.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_02: And I think the most common books that are printed on Amazon are like six by nine and five by eight.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_02: And those are usually you've got this the self-help books, um, and then but then you have like romance novels, they're gonna be slightly smaller.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_02: It kind of goes in line with genre.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 31:33
  SPEAKER_00: So basically do whatever's popular in your genre.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_00: Then you really can't go wrong.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that will help you fit in.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_02: And again, you want to be subtle, right, with with your book if you're self-publishing.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_02: Now, when you have like a training material, like a book to help you, I shouldn't say training material, but um educational in a way, those are usually larger.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_02: Those are going to be like eight by ten or eight and a half by eleven.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, yes, that's that's what's in that particular genre.
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_02: There's also um, if you decide to do four-color printing with Amazon and it has a lot of photos in it, you want it to stand out a little differently, like a seven by ten.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_02: It so just a photo of I should say photo book, but they they stand out anyway, regardless.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_02: And they're gonna have um, I think Amazon offers the right kind of paper for that, but it is gonna be more expensive, but you gotta you put that in your retail price to cover those expenses, and that's really what it is.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_02: What is your genre?
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_02: And you want it to kind of fit in.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_02: There are some people who want to make the book stand out to make it slightly different, but then that can make your costs be higher because it's not a standard size.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_02: That's that's what you gotta it is.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_02: What is your budget?
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_02: What is your purpose of the book?
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_02: What kind of attention do you want for it?
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_02: And um, and also something to consider.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_02: I I think I wrote this in my book.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_02: If you have a six by nine versus five by eight, you'll have more pages if you do a five by eight book.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, and it makes your book a little thicker.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_02: So that's something to think about too.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I have to.
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_00: So again, this is confession time, but I really I generally think six by nine books are too big.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, they they feel to me like they're just a little bit too big to hold comfortably in your hand.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_02: Correct.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I it baffles me why they're so popular.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_00: I really don't understand that, other than it's just what everybody does.
• 33:30
  SPEAKER_00: But then another size, I'm also baffled by the five by eight book size because it feels too narrow to me.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_00: I really prefer the five and a quarter by eight.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_00: And that to me, that quarter inch just adds a little bit of extra that the width, yeah.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_00: The width makes a a more visually pleasing book.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like I spend way too much time thinking about this stuff, to be honest with you.
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not sure it's healthy, but I think it's okay.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_02: You just got to give that kind of feedback, you know, to your designer and get in there.
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_02: That's why I recommend to use a designer that have experience in books because they understand the genre, they understand that's a great point to look like.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_02: And I um on my last book, I had a great designer help me because he came up with a design I'd never would have thought of.
• 34:18
  unknown: Right.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_02: And that's right, because he understood what my purpose of my book was, and we came up with this vintage design.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_02: And I, because I talk about how I love I love historical fiction, even though my book is about nonfiction.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_02: So we made it kind of vintage, put a little bit of history in there, right?
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_02: It it just depends on.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_02: I also recommend, by the way, you can go if there's a bookstore around you, you can go there to see what are popular, right?
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_02: Um there's um people don't realize, but like Target has a huge book section, at least the Target they do, they do.
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_02: You can just go look at the shelves there.
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_02: I've gotten some great ideas to help some of my customers in the past.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_02: I used to go to Lifeway Christian bookstore, they're not around here anymore, but uh I don't think they're anywhere anymore.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_02: Right, it's sad, but they had some great stuff on their bookshelves and they curated it for um Yep.
• 35:11
  SPEAKER_00: And the great thing about I'm sorry, go ahead.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_02: No, I was just saying they they curated the book for their for their audience.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, and I think that that is a really, really important thing.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_00: And I think a place like Barnes and Noble is wonderful to go look at book covers, but there's so many books there, it's hard to kind of know yes, really what you should look at.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_00: And Target is great because that or Walmart, same thing.
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, I'd probably pick Target.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_00: Target to me seems like it's probably a little more carefully curated.
• 35:36
  unknown: Yes.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_00: Walmart, no offense to Walmart people.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but it's good because I think Target pays a lot of attention to what's popular, what's selling.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_00: Their book displays, there is actually some thought put into those at Target's.
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_00: So to me, you're exactly right.
• 35:52
  SPEAKER_00: Where that's a good place to go to see what kind of cover designs are popular, what's hot right now, what's in, what's not in, and just to get a good idea of what people are paying attention to.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's there's a lot of value in that.
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_02: And another thing, you can also even go on Amazon and type in a certain genre, and then whatever books pop up, go look at the trim sizes at the and the description.
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_02: That's another way that it's there.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's all there.
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_02: And um there's a some lot of local bookstores too that I try to support as well.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_02: And I and I I'll go there, but most of them have lots of hardcover books there, and those are expensive.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_02: But if you have a budget for it, um you definitely need to consider that.
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_02: If you have a budget, get you'll you'll figure a way out though if you want it.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I would say if you if you don't have a budget for this stuff, try try your best to find a way to have a budget for it.
• 36:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because it will really make a huge difference.
• 36:52
  SPEAKER_02: It'll pay off.
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_00: I remember when I did my well, not my last book, I guess.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um a few years ago I did a book, and the way that I actually paid, this is back when I still worked as a college prof.
• 37:06
  SPEAKER_00: Like I didn't have any extra money uh at that time.
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_00: So I ended up selling a bunch of my uh like Bible resources.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_00: This was like huge Bible dictionaries, encyclopedias, that kind of stuff.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_00: I sold a whole bunch of those to students actually, uh, and our staff to get money so I could pay for editing and cover design.
• 37:25
  SPEAKER_00: So I think just like do whatever you need to do to get the money to have a quality book.
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's really, really worth it and it makes a huge difference.
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_02: It's definitely worth it in the long run.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_00: Well, Bridget, thanks so much for joining me on this episode.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_00: This has been a blast.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_00: I could geek out with you for hours on this stuff.
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm so thankful there are people like you in the world who know the intimate details of paper supply lines and um the importance of having a great interior format and cover design and Amazon stuff and printers.
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_00: It really makes a huge difference.
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm grateful for you and for your knowledge and your friendship.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, if you can, let's wrap up with this.
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_00: Can you tell our listeners how to get in touch with you?
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, where to find out all the cool stuff that you're doing in the book world?
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_02: Well, one of the things I had a landing page created called Qualitybookformula.com, and what it does, it will have a PDF checklist you can download the expected turnaround time.
• 38:23
  SPEAKER_02: I think that's important to know too.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_02: And or you can also check out my personal website, prejudichaw.com, B R I G I T T E C U T S H A L L dot com.
• 38:37
  SPEAKER_02: That's a great way to connect with me.
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_00: Perfect.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_00: Well, thanks again.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_00: This has been an absolute blast and a total pleasure, and can't wait to do it again.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much, Kent.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 38:48
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, wasn't that a fun conversation?
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_00: I had an absolute blast talking with Bridget about all things related to books, publishing, paper sourcing issues, production, shipping, and all those kinds of things.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I know that some of those things might seem pretty far removed from what you're doing right now in your writing, but they're really not.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_00: Because as you're well aware, everything affects everything else.
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_00: Wars in Europe and countries on the opposite side of the world, they do affect how we actually are able to source our paper and our print books, and everything affects everything else.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_00: So I think it's important as a writer to be aware of these kind of global events and just to know what's happening in the world.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_00: Fortunately, we have people like Bridget who can help walk us through some of these issues.
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_00: So this was an absolute blast.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_00: And I would say my main takeaway from this conversation is that it's really not that complicated to create a high-quality book.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_00: And I would just recommend that you grab Bridget's book.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_00: Again, it's called Quality Book Formula: Professionally Publish Your Book for Excellence.
• 39:46
  SPEAKER_00: Make sure and grab that.
• 39:47
  SPEAKER_00: It's a little paperback.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_00: You can read it in probably less than an hour.
• 39:51
  SPEAKER_00: And it's just really, really, really good stuff.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_00: So make sure and grab that as well.
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_00: Make sure and check out Bridget's websites and her social media links, which I will have all those in the show notes as well.
• 40:01
  SPEAKER_00: But I want to give a huge shout out to Bridget for making the time to come on this episode.
• 40:04
  SPEAKER_00: It was an absolute blast.
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_00: And I, of course, appreciate your time.
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks so much for listening to today's episode.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_00: I want to take a moment to let you know about our Daily Writer membership community.
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_00: You know, one of the very best ways to develop better habits and impact more people's lives with your writing is to spend time around other successful writers.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're tired of feeling isolated and chasing success on your own, then I know you're gonna love the Daily Writer community.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_00: For years, I searched for the kind of writing community that I would want to join, but I could never find what I wanted, so I created my own.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_00: Some of the features include weekly writing sprints, monthly community calls, book discussions, calls with guest experts, and much more.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_00: For more info, you can visit dailywriterlife.comslash community.
• 40:52
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks, and I'll see you tomorrow.