Latest / DEEP INSIGHT / What the latest drone finding reveals about the suspected hybrid attack at Leipzig airport

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What the latest drone finding reveals about the suspected hybrid attack at Leipzig airport · DEEP INSIGHT

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  Speaker 1: Here in Berlin, Chancellor Friedrich Merz today said that the
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  Speaker 1: focus on national security must be stronger. It comes after
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  Speaker 1: German media reported that investigators found a third drone carrying
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  Speaker 1: explosives near Leipzig's international airport earlier this month. On the
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  Speaker 1: night of August 4th, a drone carrying explosives was found
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  Speaker 1: near a Ukrainian cargo aircraft, prompting the airport's closure for
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  Speaker 1: several hours. A second drone collided with a plane that
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  Speaker 1: very night, while the third was discovered near the airfield
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  Speaker 1: 10 days later. The airport in Leipzig is a hub
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  Speaker 1: for transporting military goods. It also serves as a base
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  Speaker 1: for Ukraine's Antonov Airlines. The Chancellor says the drones are
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  Speaker 1: part of hybrid attacks which include espionage, arson and sabotage.
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  Speaker 2: Germany has increasingly found itself in the crosshairs of hybrid attackers.
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  Speaker 2: This is demonstrated not least by the August 4th attack
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  Speaker 2: at Leipzig airport. Attackers are increasingly willing, with no scruples,
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  Speaker 2: to accept serious property damage and even injuries and deaths.
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  Speaker 1: Well, for more now, I'm joined by Olaf Bönke. He's
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  Speaker 1: the Germany director at Rasmussen Global. That's the geopolitical advisory
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  Speaker 1: firm founded by former NATO Secretary General Anders Fogart Rasmussen.
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  Speaker 3: Olaf, it's good to have you on the program.
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  Speaker 1: You know, for viewers who may not be familiar with
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  Speaker 1: the term, what exactly is a hybrid attack and how
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  Speaker 1: does it differ from conventional military aggressions?
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  Speaker 4: Hi, Brian.
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  Speaker 3: Good to see you.
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  Speaker 4: I mean, hybrid attacks, exactly as you said, and the Chancellor,
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  Speaker 4: so everything which is under the threshold of an open
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  Speaker 4: military attack. So everything we cannot call a war or
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  Speaker 4: a military attack can be called a hybrid attack. So
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  Speaker 4: this includes cyber attacks, sabotage, disinformation. For instance, we are
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  Speaker 4: running into elections here soon. So all the disinformation around
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  Speaker 4: could also be part of this. Espionage, increasingly also drone
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  Speaker 4: operations now.
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  Speaker 1: And authorities are investigating multiple explosive carrying drones that were
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  Speaker 1: found near the airport in Leipzig. What does the apparent
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  Speaker 1: coordination of these incidents suggest about the sophistication of the operation?
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  Speaker 4: I mean, what is important to state here is that
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  Speaker 4: Germany is not facing isolated incidents any longer. So Germany
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  Speaker 4: is facing a pattern. We had more than 1,000 suspicious
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  Speaker 4: drone flights reported by German authorities just last year, including
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  Speaker 4: 116 incidents around civilian airports.
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  Speaker 3: So we have.
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  Speaker 4: Seen this over and over again. But what makes Leipzig
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  Speaker 4: particularly alarming is that we're not longer talking about civilians.
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  Speaker 4: I mean, the issue here is we've seen two drones
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  Speaker 4: which were loaded by massive explosives. And that's, I think,
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  Speaker 4: what's the concerning issue. So I think if this will
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  Speaker 4: be confirmed, what we have seen in reports, so this
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  Speaker 4: might be a new sort of escalation. So this is
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  Speaker 4: not longer we're watching you, but this is the signal
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  Speaker 4: actually of saying, so we are acting.
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  Speaker 1: So what do you think the lessons will be that
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  Speaker 1: NATO will draw from this?
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  Speaker 3: I mean, could it trigger changes in how airports.
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  Speaker 1: military supply routes and logistics hubs, how they are protected?
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  Speaker 3: Definitely.
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  Speaker 4: I think this is definitely the one conclusion NATO needs
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  Speaker 4: to draw from this. For the past year or so,
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  Speaker 4: all our concentration has been towards how we can support Ukraine,
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  Speaker 4: how we can strengthen our borders, and how potential whatever
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  Speaker 4: support on the ground in Ukraine and other allied partners
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  Speaker 4: could look like. So watch now is that, okay, Russia
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  Speaker 4: is not stopping at the border. They are already here.
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  Speaker 4: And they use these hybrid attacks. So they don't go
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  Speaker 4: in with tanks, but they go in very sophisticated with drones,
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  Speaker 4: with the tanks. We have seen a number of assassinations
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  Speaker 4: over the past years. Much of them actually linked to
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  Speaker 4: Russian spies, former Russian spies. So The Russians are willing
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  Speaker 4: to do something and NATO really needs to beef up here.
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  Speaker 4: So how we protect critical infrastructure across the NATO allies countries.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, there's a lot of talking. I don't know how
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  Speaker 1: much walking there is in this story. I know that
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  Speaker 1: the German chancellor has promised that those responsible will pay.
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  Speaker 1: I mean, what options does Germany actually have if investigators
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  Speaker 1: conclude that a foreign state or a state backed actor
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  Speaker 1: was involved with these drones?
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  Speaker 4: I mean, you will not escalate this from zero to 180.
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  Speaker 4: So the thing is, so we might see the diplomats
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  Speaker 4: will be sent back if this can be attributed to Russia.
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  Speaker 4: I mean, the attribution is key. So the question is,
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  Speaker 4: and this makes it much more difficult these days. So
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  Speaker 4: who has been behind this? But most of the experts
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  Speaker 4: agree this all falls into a very clear Russian pattern.
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  Speaker 4: So therefore, we have seen this in the past that
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  Speaker 4: Russian diplomats had been sent home, Russian diplomats who had
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  Speaker 4: been actually KGB agents. So this is something we know
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  Speaker 4: that sanctions, of course, are also on the table. This
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  Speaker 4: is something the EU is very strong at. energy supply
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  Speaker 4: is also still something. Russia is still exporting energy, gas
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  Speaker 4: and oil also to Europe.
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  Speaker 3: That's something.
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  Speaker 4: But if everything is really coming to an end, so
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  Speaker 4: NATO could also call on Article 4, which is the
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  Speaker 4: level below Article 5 actually to act by really standing
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  Speaker 4: together and taking almost military action against the potential threat.
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  Speaker 3: That would that's a possible response.
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  Speaker 1: But if you have evidence that let's just say Russia,
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  Speaker 1: Russia was responsible for planting these drones near the airport
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  Speaker 1: or at the airport, kicking out Russian diplomats.
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  Speaker 3: Is that really an adequate response?
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  Speaker 4: I mean, as I said, the war in Ukraine is
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  Speaker 4: definitely linked and connected to what's happening now in our country.
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  Speaker 4: And the question, of course, is we know that the
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  Speaker 4: same Chancellor Merz was very strong as an opposition leader
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  Speaker 4: to advocate for we need to send Taurus to Ukraine.
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  Speaker 4: So the moment he became chancellor, actually, that was not
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  Speaker 4: a topic at all. So, of course, this could steer
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  Speaker 4: up the debate again, saying, OK, maybe we also need
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  Speaker 4: to help at least the Ukrainians to attack Russia much
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  Speaker 4: stronger in their motherland than they did before. While, to
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  Speaker 4: be very honest, actually, the Ukrainians already developed their own
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  Speaker 4: measures and means by now and are doing already this.
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  Speaker 4: But that's also, of course, something which is possible, a
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  Speaker 4: much stronger, much stiffer support of Ukraine with military equipment
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  Speaker 4: to really fight back here.
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  Speaker 3: Olaf Bunker.
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  Speaker 1: Olaf, as always, we appreciate your time and your insights tonight.
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  Speaker 3: Thank you. Thank you.