Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / BARDSTOWN: Young Mom disappears after midnight walk with boyfriend. Where is Crystal Rogers?

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BARDSTOWN: Young Mom disappears after midnight walk with boyfriend. Where is Crystal Rogers? · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Four days after she vanishes.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: On July eighth, twenty fifteen, Nelson County Detective John Snow
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: sits down with Crystel's boyfriend, Brooks Howk. The conversation lasts
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: for about ninety minutes. Brooks tells Detective Snow just what
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: he told Cristel's mom, Sherry Ballard, about his last hours
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: with Crystal. He and Crystel were at his family's farm
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: feeding the cows. You will fed the cows, and then
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: you come back out, and you walked the road right.
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: The roady goes to the after we come after we
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: come back down, were walking up through here? Brookstraws a
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: makeshift map for the detective and shows where he says
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: he and Crystel were on Friday, July third, twenty fifteen.
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: That's you the drama way, yeah, the struggling right, and
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: then we walk out the road. We just walk back
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: through there. Wearing a blue polo shirt and jeans, Brooks
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: its casually arm up on the table. He maintains his
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: composure and appears unfazed by the detective's questions about the
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: last time he saw Crystal on his mom's farm. I
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: mean'sy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: with us. You are hearing just a tiny portion of
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: a fantastic new podcast. I'm totally hooked on it. Bardstown
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: b is in brother aar d Stown bard like Shakespeare,
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: the bard Bardstown Podcast, and this is what it is about.
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: It's all about the mysterious deaths that take place in
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: a very small Kentucky town considered the Bourbon capital of
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: the world, Bardstown, Kentucky. It's like so many small communities
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: across our country, much like the one I grew up in,
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: except people are dropping like flies in Bardstown with me
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: right now, investigating journalist, podcast producer with A Vault Studios,
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: Jessica Noel with me her partner, investigative reporter with wh
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: A s N Louisville. They are responsible for Bardstown Podcast.
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: You can find it at www dot Bardstown podcast dot com.
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: We earlier spoke of the multiple murders that had taken
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: place in and around Bardstown, Kentucky, an incredibly small town
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: for so many dead bodies, but today we're focusing on
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: one in particular, and that is Crystal Rogers. Welcome Jessica
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: Noel and Shane McAllister, to you, Jessica, tell me about
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: Crystal Rogers. Who is she? Who was she? Well? Crystal
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: Rogers is a thirty five year old mother of five.
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: She had lived and grown up in Bardstown her whole life,
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: and she was dating a man by the name of
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: Brooks Howk. They had a child together, and she seemingly
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: vanished July third, twenty fifteen, and her car was found
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: on the popular roadway through Kentucky Bluegrass Parkway a couple
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: days later, and her purse, her cell phone, everything that
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: a woman would keep with her was found in her car,
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: her unlocked car, and she's not been seen since four
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: years later. You know, to Shane McAlister, investigative reporter, wha
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: s Louisville. Shay, you guys are rolling her in to
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: the Bardstown murders. Tell me about the other murders. Sure,
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: so all of these cases date back to two thousand thirteen.
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: That's when Bardstown police officer Jason Ellis was ambushed on
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: his way home from work. It was the middle of
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: the night and as he was pulling off the highway
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: onto its exit, there was branches laying in the middle
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: of the road and at least one person hiding, who
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: then shot and killed him when he got out to
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: move the branches. That was the first case. Just over
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: a year later, Samantha and Kathy Netherland, a mother and daughter,
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: were in their home when they were attacked and brutally murdered.
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: And this is a special education teacher at Bardstown Elementary
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: School and a high schooler, a teenage student. They were
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: very beloved in the community. And that one happened next
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: and then sixteen months later, Crystal Rogers goes missing. And
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: as of right now, we don't know what has become
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: of Crystal Rogers. If she's dead, we don't know her
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: mode of day or cause of death. But so far
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: we know that multiple people have been murdered in the
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: Bardstown area called the most beautiful small town in America.
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: And why that is significant is you expect a high
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: murder rate in a big city like Atlanta or New York, Philadelphia, LA.
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: But in smaller rural areas you don't expect any murders
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: at all. They traditionally have a very low crime rate,
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: much less a murder rate. Welcome signs actually call it
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: the most beautiful small town in America. The Bourbon capital
• 5:36
  Speaker 1: of the world. And as a matter of fact, Jessica
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: Noll can testify to that. Jessica, weren't you just at
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: the Bourbon Festival, right? So we went back. Spencer Brutig
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: and I, one of our producers, went back to Bardstown
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: for the Kentucky Bourbon Festival, which is a huge deal
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: in Bardstown. Thousands of people come in from all over
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  Speaker 1: to sample bourbon from several distilleries that are actually based
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: right there in Bardstown. It's probably the biggest event of
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: the year every year there. So we wanted to go
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: back because there had been some issues with signs that
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: were in yards for the prayers for Crystal and standing
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: with the ballads. They were being taken down and so
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: we wanted to go back and see what was going
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: on and what people were saying. And what we saw
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: was an incredible outcry of community support. Now wait a minute,
• 6:33
  Speaker 1: wait a minute, I want to talk. I don't want
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: to gloss over what you just said. Signs across Bardstown
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: have been removed and the signs specifically were showing support
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: for Crystal Rogers who goes missing, incredible pain for Crystal's mother,
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: Sherry Ballard, her daughter Crystal went missing, and then her
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: own husband was mysteriously killed in twenty sixteen. Now a
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: brand new heartache, very very disturbing because these signs all
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: across the county were taken down. Now, Balor blames Bardstown,
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: the city, which says it has to follow city policy
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: all temporary signs in right of ways have to be removed. Now,
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: I don't know if that had anything to do with it,
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: but I'm looking at a giant pink plaqueard a sign
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: that says Prayers for Crystal. Now, why would anybody want
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: to take that down? And it's not in a right
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: of way, it's off I would say, a good fifteen
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: to thirty feet off the highway. So what happened to
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: the Prayers for Crystal signs? Jessica? Well, the city and
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: the county deny taking them down. But the signs were
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: actually found behind city hall, near a dumpster where they
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: store signs that have been taken down. So and Sherry
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: and some friends and family are actually the ones who
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: found those signs back behind city hall, and they it
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: didn't stop them. They replenished what was out there. When
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: we went to Bardstown, there were new signs out, but
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: there was also you know uh Bourbon Festival signs, no
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: parking signs, no pets here, signs that were exactly in
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: places where the Prayers for Crystal signs used to be
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: and were taken down. But they had created some brand
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: new signs also, And some of the signs I should
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: mention aren't just prayers for Crystal. They were also pointing
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: the finger at the prime suspect in her case, Brooks
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: Howe and his brother Nick Howe. You know, I'm very
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: curious about why these signs were removed. Prayers for Crystal
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: signs and others pointing the finger and others were not
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: interesting because now her family's working double time to replace
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: his signs at the Bourbon Festival. In the last days,
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: Denise and Brittany Emerson wore neon Solve these murder shirts
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: hoping to get attention to the case. Take a listen
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: to this. He had a little fire. When was that
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: after Etiky Walker, before e Tykie Walker. I know we
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: fed the cows first because I want to do that
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: as quickly where we had still plenty of Anyway, I
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: don't know if I lit the fire before we walked
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: back here. When I got back, I could have done
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: it either well, I don't remember. After the fire and
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: with their toddler and toe, Brooks says, he and Crystal
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: take a walk to me, and I've got a couple
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: of kids, you know, but everybody parts a little differently
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: to me. It seems a little late to be out
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  Speaker 1: on the farm with the two and a half year old.
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: Whereas he had at midnight, as he has he'd been
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: asleep in the car for a while, as he still
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: wide opening hill any anybody he's used So we used
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: to sleep and so later in the morning. His normal
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: dad's his seven eight o'clock in the evening, real eleven,
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: because she sleeps much later in the morning, she stays up.
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: So yeah, it's always been that way. So he midnight,
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  Speaker 1: he's wild. Man, did you go straight home on Friday night?
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: Or did y'all stop somewhere or because I'm thinking if
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: that's their normal seven eight o'clock in the evening, it
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: might be dinner time. Did you stop and eat something
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: or did you go straight home? We did not eat anything.
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: I went straight home, Okay, So he went straight home.
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: So let's if we assume that he's correct. In about
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: ten minutes after midnight, clime stories with Nancy Grace. To me,
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: it seems a little late to be out on the
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: farm with the two and a half year whereas he
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: had at midnight, as he has, he'd been asleep in
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: the car for a while, as any any night he's used,
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: so he used to sleep and so lighter in the morning,
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: his normal dad's his set eight o'clock in the evening. Really,
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: because she sleeps much lighter in the morn she stays up.
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: So what Yeah, it's always been that way. So you're
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: hearing the boyfriend brooks help and he's speaking to Detective Snow. Now,
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: let me understand something. To Shane McAllister, investigative reporter with
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: wh A S in Louisville, the boyfriend says he goes
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: for a walk with Crystal and the little baby, the
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: one year old, at midnight. That's what he tells police.
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: He says they went down to feed the cows. But
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: Sherry Ballard, Crystal's mom, has had a big problem with
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: this since the beginning. She says that it was very
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: rainy that night, and there's just no way Crystal would
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: have wanted to be watching around the farm, much less
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: with her baby. Whose farm was it? It was Howke's
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: mom's farm. So, Brooks Howke's mom, Rosemary Howk, has a
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: huge farm on the outskirts of Bardstown. That's where they
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: say they were. So did brooks house mother see Crystal
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: there with the baby that night? We don't have any
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: kind of recordings of her police interviews, and she has
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: never given us an interview. I don't know. Have you
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: tried have you tried to talk to her? Yeah, we
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: have tried to talk to her. We've seen her in
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: court multiple times over the years. She's always there when
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: Brooks's in court or at custody hearings for that little boy,
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: and we have definitely tried to talk to her. Who
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: has the baby right now? Brooks? How interesting? Very interesting?
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: So she's on a date I guess you could call
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: it with her boyfriend and he thinks it's a good
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: thing to take her to feed the cows at midnight
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: with the baby? Do I am I understanding this correctly?
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: Jessicall that is correct, And I do want to point
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: out also in an upcoming episode of our podcast, we
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: actually do go to the farm and try to speak
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: to Rosemary there. But what's interesting about the clip that
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: you just ran someone on Facebook because we've had a
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: lot of chatter from folks that want to chime in
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: with what they're hearing and their thoughts and theories. And
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: someone pointed out that he actually says in that clip,
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: I went home. He doesn't say we, which I thought
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: was kind of interesting for someone to hear when they
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: were listening to that, because I didn't pick that up.
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: He says we didn't get anything to eat. But then
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: he says I went home. I noticed that. I noticed
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: when he said I went home, and I just assumed
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: that Crystal Rogers peeled off. But having a baby out
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: at midnight, I just don't believe that for a minute.
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: Take a listen to Brooks Houp and Detective Snow. I
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: probably woke up real you know in between that time
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: made six or seven o'clock, and then I left. You know,
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: I got give my normal thing to you know, changing
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: my clothes, put my clothes on, and and uh and
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: headed out, you know shortly after that. You know, So
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: you get up between six and seven, and where's Eli
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: at When you wake up, he's next to me. He's
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: in the bed with you. M okay, so you get up,
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: does he get up with you? He's still he's still
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: sleeps on ever I whenever I get up, but I
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: go to uh, you know, the bathroom and all that
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: kind of stuff, and he's still sleeping, sleeping there on
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: the bed. But Crystal isn't there when he gets out. Yes,
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: I noticed, I mean I noticed that she wasn't there,
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: and I didn't know what was I didn't know exactly
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: what to think. I don't know what time I called her. Yes,
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: I called her that morning. Brookes takes his son to
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: the farm, but his lack of concern for Crystal's whereabouts
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: gives the detective pause, and he probes, if I woke
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: up on a Saturday morning and my life wasn't with
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: me in the mid as is normal? If she were not,
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: probably the first thing I would do would be a
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: card to find out where she was. Interesting. You are
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: hearing Brooks how the boyfriend of Crystal, Rogers, the father
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: of their child, and Detective snow speaking and we're talking
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: about a new podcast, Bardstown Podcast at Bardstown Podcasts dot com.
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: We're all of this unfold. I'm going to circle back
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: to what we were just listening to, but take a
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: listen to our friends. Is w d RB another Crystal
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: Rogers went missing and still no answers, But now mysterious
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: signs are plastered all over Nelson County, and as w
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: dr b's Katrina Helmer reports, the signs don't hold back
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: on who's to blame. Signs like this are popping up
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: all over Bardstown, pointing fingers directly at the help Brothers.
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: They grab your attention and that's the point I saw
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: all the signs. They are very But Sherry Ballard is
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: making it through another fourth of July without her daughter,
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: Crystal Rogers. She disappeared four years ago. No one has
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: ever been charged without any clear answers. Ballard vows to
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: never let anyone forget Crystal, and when these signs popped
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: up overnight, she says, it's comforting and booked. Houk was
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: named the number one suspect of my daughter's disappearance, and
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: it makes me feel good to think that people out
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: there believe the same thing that I do. We don't
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: want It's a dial the album We Don't Want to
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: Hurt You for Cotton. This person wants to remain anonymous,
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: but admits to being one of several people planting these
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: signs in the early morning hours of July fourth, they
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: put out seventy five signs with specific phrases. We chose
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: Nick Fille to polygraph because Nick did polygraph. Another sign,
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: brooks How is the only suspect in the disappearance of
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: Crystal Rogers. You know, you're still the onliest aspect and
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: we want to keep that out there. And this one
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: ride the wave. It's worked out this far. It refers
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: to a eatement brooks How made to w DRB to
• 17:08
  Speaker 1: That's what I've done and it's worked out great. dISTAR.
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: We still think that he's very cold and disrespectful to
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: the family, uncaring Um. He never really seemed to be.
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: Um are all bothered by her missing, you know, and
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: that's the mother of his son. At the bottom of
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: the sign, we're praying for sharks. Another clear pointed message.
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: The overall goal is we still don't have answers, we
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: still don't have justice UM, and we need to keep
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: them in the public eye until we do. They know
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: in their heart what happened. That's where our friends at
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: w d r B. You know, it's amazing to me
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: that people have to put up signs, seventy five signs
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: overnight to try to get justice. Now. Remember Brooke Howe
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: how brothers say they are innocent and everyone is innocent
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: until even guilty. But it's amazing to me, jessicaol that
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: it seems as if the investigation has totally stymied. It's
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: come to a screeching halt. What's happening? That's a great question, Nancy.
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: I wish we had some answers for that. What we
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: When you hear this the episode, it kind of lays
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: out what evidence it seems like police have and what
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: it would appear is lacking is a body in this case.
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: But Shay and I asked the sheriff while we were
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: in town originally covering all this in July, is it
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: possible to prosecute and have a conviction without a body,
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: and he said yes. So we really don't know what
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: the hang up is and what they're waiting on. Essentially
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: clime stories with Nancy Grace. You know, I want to
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: follow up with something you're just saying. If you don't mind, Jackie,
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: could you play cut three one more time? I probably
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: I probably woke up around you know, in between that
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: time May six or seven o'clock and then I left.
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: You know, I got give my normal thing, because you know,
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: change my clothes, putting my clothes on, and and uh
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: and headed out, you know shortly after that. You know,
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: So you get up between six and seven, and where's
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: Eli at when you wake up? He's next to me.
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: He's in the bed with you. Okay, Um, so you
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: get up? Does he get up with you? He's still
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: he's still sleeps on every eye whenever I get up.
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: But I go to uh, you know, the bathroom and
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: all that, Stefan, he's still sleeping, sleeping there on the bed.
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: But Crystal isn't there when he gets at Yes, I noticed,
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: I mean I noticed that she wasn't there. I didn't
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: know what was. I didn't know exactly what too. I
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: don't know what time about call her? Yes, I called
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: her that morning. Brooks takes his son to the farm,
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: but his lack of concern for Crystel's whereabouts gives the
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: detective pause. If I will up on a Saturday morning
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: and my wife wasn't with me in the bed as
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: is normal, if she were not, probably the first thing
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: I would do would be to call her to find
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: out where she was. Shay mc allister, I'm hearing them
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: talking about the help brothers. There's more than one of them, Yes,
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: there is. There are two help brothers. There's Nick Holp,
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: the older of the two. He was a Bargetown police
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: officer when Crystel went missing, and then his younger brother
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: Brooks help with Crystel's boyfriend. So is he is the
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: brother still with the police force. He is not. He
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: was fired just a few months after Crystel went missing.
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: And you'll actually to hear a little bit more on
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: that in the recent or upcoming episodes where Nick interfered
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: with the investigation. He actually called his brother Brooks while
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: he was in an interrogation room with police. As a
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: matter of fact, take a listen to this. The interview
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: is interrupted when Brooks gets a call from his older brother,
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: Nick Holck, the Bartstown police officer. Yeah, I'm I'm up period.
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: I know that you didn't know what I'm up hearing
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: this interview with um the detective. Detective Snow, I've been
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: up here a good little while. I'm feeling out this
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: this statement here and everything. Do you know, are you
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: telling me that's here? You telling me that's what I
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: need to do? I know, I know, I don't I know.
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: I'm not. I know that. But what if I look
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: at it is, I'm in a hain't done nothing wrong. Well,
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: you know, I know you told me innocent people have
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: got jammed up. If you're telling me to leave, I'll
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: get up and leave if you want me, if you
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: want me to, I know I'm gonta do a lot,
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: but I'm trying to get this guy to help me.
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: I don't think. I don't think she's ran off with
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: another guy. I don't believe that. You can't make me
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: think that. Look yeah, I mean, I mean, I mean ups,
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: I'll do exactly what you're telling me to do. Right now.
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: You want me get up to leave, Well, that's exactly
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: what he did. That's Brooks how the boyfriend the lover
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: of Crystal Rogers, now missing with Detective Snow. And as
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: a matter of fact, he did get up and leave. Well,
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: long story short, the Bardstown Police Chief Rick McGavin. Here's
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: that the officer, Officer Howe, calls his brother and tells
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: him to leave listen. But news of that phone call
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: eventually gets back to Bardstown Police Chief McCubbin and goes
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: against everything his oath of ethics stands for. In his department.
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: Nick wasn't being questioned, No, But what really got my
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: irishow was the fact that he called his brother and
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: I guess, you know, kind of encouraged him to, you know,
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: to leave, to get out of there. And sure you
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: again let me let me use an example. You and
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: your friend could call you and go and Jessica, you
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: need to shut up and leave. Nothing I can do
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: about it. Which friends not a cop, Your brother's not
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: a cop. And I told him, I said, that's not
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: how this profession rolls. You don't get to do that.
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: I don't care if you're looking out for your brother
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: or not. You don't get to do that, you know.
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: So that was, you know, part of it. Well. As
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: a matter of fact, after that, Nick How's the boss,
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: the police chief orders him to talk to detectives, and
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: according to an FBI polygraph examiner who tells Nick Howe
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: in a police interrogation video quote, it's pretty clear you
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: haven't told me the complete truth. The questions you're having
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: problems with are questions about Crystal, in particular whether or
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: not you know where she is right now. Explain that
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: to me, Deskinal what happened? So the FBI polygraph examiner
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: tells Nick how the police officer at that time that
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: he is not being truthful with him, and that whole
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: interaction just really begins to escalate, and he at one
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: point asks him as Nick is getting audibly frustrated with
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: him because he's calling him a liar essentially, At one point,
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: the FBI polygraph examiner says, is this how you acted
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: towards Crystal? And and he obviously begins yelling at that point.
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: So there is something, and you know better than us
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: that polygraphic examinations aren't always one, but there was something.
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: There was enough of not telling the truth that set
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: off their radar, and that he was not being truthful
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: when he was talking about Crystal, about her disappearance, about
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: Brooks possibly telling him something about him having any involvement,
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: He was not being truthful according to their examination. Take
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: a listen to this. Well, Nick, I've had a chance
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: to review in your charts on the test that first
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: test you I did not pass the test, and it's
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: pretty clear to me that you have a police truth
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: to that. Nick questions you're having a problem with or
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: questions about Crystal, and they particular one about whether or
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: not you know where she has right now, and I
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: don't I treat police officers in these circumstances so like
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: I would myself. So we're not going to go through
• 25:57
  Speaker 1: all the interview of derogation constense. You and I are
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: in the same page. But again, I'm also continue to
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: complete truth because we're sitting here and it's no longer
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: a matter I'm wondering do you know anything about what happened?
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: We're past that now, and now I got crystal clear
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: with you. I give everybody a good fair test. I'm
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: no longer asking you if you know you do? Now
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: what do you want to do with that is entirely
• 26:21
  Speaker 1: up to you. I'm gonna yea let's great match and
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: get the sick words, falling book and all that. I'm
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: talking to you, man to managers, a fallow enforce an
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: officer that the time has come for you to think
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: real hard about the rest of your life. This is you,
• 26:36
  Speaker 1: my time of Brooks everybody else, and I'm telling you facts.
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: I'm an old guy and I'm trying to be a
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: father figure here, but I'll tell you doing this for
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: twenty five years. The way that this pans out when
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: the FBI gets involved in this investigation, or you're listening
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: one thing. You don't have to say anything to tell
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: you do whatever you want to do. As I said,
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: we you may never even be an FBI agent, all right,
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: but once you get on the radar, we don't go
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: away unless there's every reason too. I thought there would be.
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: He had passed this, and there's some other information there
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: as well, So I guarantee you what I'm going away,
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: all right. The FBI has unlimited resources in terms of
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: forensic information, electronic information, many bodies that want to pour
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: attribute surveillance and look at everything that's ever not on.
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: We will find Crystal lives zero about about this, no
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: matter what it's gonna On July fifteenth, twenty fifteen, detectives
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: also revealed to Nick they found bodily fluids inside his
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: police cruiser the day after he and Brooks leave the
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: station together and drive to their mom's farm. Have you
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: ever heard of limit all? All right? You know what
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: limit all is used for. It's fine, bloody or other.
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: So we all excreted bodily fluid, sweat, you know, vomit,
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: anything you saliva. All that is wood fluoresce. Why would
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: why would your trunk look like a smurf if they
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: sprayed it. Why would it fluoress that you look like
• 28:10
  Speaker 1: they're noble. There's col spots in the trunk, in that blanket,
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: I mean, just little electron roble. Why would that they're
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: be any blood and trunk? I got blood, and I
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: say blood, I'm talking about other bodily fluids. I don't
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: have you love, There shouldn't There shouldn't be anybody bodying
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: floods in the crime. WHOA, it's not gonna be any blood. Well,
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: that tells me right there that there's a strong possibility
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: she was asphyxiated. She's not gonna be any blood. That's
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: the first thing he said. And again everyone who said
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: they're not guilty, that they're innocent in this case and
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: they have a right to a trial by jury, you know,
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: in many big jurisdictions, and I assume this is true
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: and small as well. Cars are cleaned out at the
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: end of every patrol with cleaner. Let me ask you
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: something to Jessica Noel, Investigative journalist podcast Prodigia with Vault Studios.
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: Shane mcallis or Investigative Report of a WHA s Louisville
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: who have come up with an incredible podcast, Bardstown Podcast.
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: Were the fluids left in the patrol car tested and
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: if so, did they match Crystal Rogers? Again, Nancy, A
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: really great question. What we know is what we have
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: heard in these recordings with police. The police, the KSP,
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: I believe the testing may have been done by the
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: FBI are being very tight lipped about what they have found,
• 29:37
  Speaker 1: both in the car in the searches they've done, which
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: you'll hear about this week. They're not telling us what
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: they've found or any test results that have come back. Wow. Okay.
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: Question to Shane McAlister. So according to the boyfriend, okay,
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: how Crystal Rogers in the bay are there at his
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: mom's farm that evening? He takes them at midnight to
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: walk down to the cow barn and take care of
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: the cows. They come, He goes, I come home, and
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: then he says, the next morning Crystal is gone. Where
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: did he report her missing? Brooks Hawk never reports her missing?
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace, Christa Rodgers and the baby
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: are there at his mom's farm that evening. He takes
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: them at midnight to walk down to the cow barn
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: and take care of the cows. They come, He goes,
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: I come home, and then he says, the next morning,
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: Crystal is gone. Where did he report her missing? Brooks,
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: how never reports her missing. Actually, her mom reports her
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: missing a few days later when she's had trouble reaching
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: her over the phone, and when she actually runs into
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: Brooks's house in town. She asked Brooks, hey, have you
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: seen Crystel. Where do you think she is? And Brooks
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: said no, I haven't seen her. And Sherry says, well,
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: then I'm going to go report her missing. And Brooks says, yeah,
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: I think you should do that. Take a listen to
• 31:33
  Speaker 1: brooks house speaking to detectives now on this very issue.
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: Brooks runs into Crystal's mom. I've met her mother to
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: gas station somewhere one of those days, her mother, Sharry.
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: Crystel's mother, Sharry came up her to my window and
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: asked me if I had seen Crystel. And when you
• 31:55
  Speaker 1: told her what, I haven't seen her, don't know where
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: she is, and she just said okay, And she thought
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: that she thought that the wisest thing for us to do. Well,
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: she says, She's going to go to the police station.
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: Then I went home. Meanwhile, Crystal's mom files a missing
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: person's report at the Nelson County Sheriff's office around three pm.
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: Two hours later, her father Tommy gets a call Crystal's
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: car has been found along the Bluegrass Parkway. Tommy goes
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: and uncovers her keys, phone, and purse inside. Brooks tells
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: Detective Snow that he wasn't concerned until Sunday because she'd
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: quote done this before joining me right now. In addition
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: to her parents saw Tom and Sherry Ballard, her boyfriend
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: that she lived with. So Brooks, you go to bed
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: and she's still playing games on her phone. The next morning,
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: around eight o'clock, you notice that she's missing. Did you
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: report her missing? No, ma'am why That is a great
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: question and one that I definitely once to his the
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: the public in the media. I was not in the
• 33:06
  Speaker 1: least little bit alonged in any way, shape or form.
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: We have had a stress relationship at times, and one
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: of the ways that Crystal has always chose to the
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: culprit to deal with that is going to a young
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: woman's name Sabrina, that is her cousin, her dad's brother's daughter,
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: whom she's very close to. That she's spent the night
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: there on several occasions. When you say several, do you
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: mean one three twenty in the neighborhood of four to six? Okay,
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: Thomas Sherry Ballard, were you aware of that? Do you
• 33:46
  Speaker 1: know who Sabrina is? His name? That's my niece? Okay?
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: Did you know that she goes and spends the night
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: over there when she's having an issue at home? I'm
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: not on probably one time? Right, Okay, I want to
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: go back to Brooke's. How let me ask you this.
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: I know that you agree to take a polygraph? Did
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: you pass? They because of the way that the lines
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: or whatever wrong that they made, determined it to be
• 34:13
  Speaker 1: what's called inconclusive. I'm not exactly sure what that means,
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: but they did tell me if it does mean that
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: I wasn't lying, or I didn't pass it, or I
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: didn't feel it, they just ruled it inconclusive. And that's
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: exactly the way that it stands. I've been one hundred
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: percent completely honest with everyone. I've been a one hundred
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: percent cooperative and everything that has been asked of me,
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: I've not asked for any kind of legal advice or
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: assistance or an attorney with any nature I'm one hundred
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: percent completely innocent in this, and I have exhausted my
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: efforts with the law enforcement agencies to gather all the
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: fights necessary to allow me to have a clean name again,
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: and that's very important to me. You are hearing, oh,
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: who has been called the number one suspect, Crystal Rogers
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: lover Brooks help with me questioning him. I find it
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: very interesting that either he's not telling me the truth
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: or the FBI agent that took the polygraph is not
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: telling truth. Because I was looking right at the video
• 35:26
  Speaker 1: when the agent that the polygrapher says, you did not pass. Okay,
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: that's not inconclusive. That's you did not pass. But when
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: I was questioning him, Howe says that it was inconclusive,
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: basically blaming the test. Also, I heard something very significant apparently.
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: The first story was they were up playing games like
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: video games, I guess, and then went to sleep. That's
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: a far cry from feeding the cows. Jessica Nole Brooks's
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: story is that once they got home from the farm,
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: he went to bed and his son stayed up with
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: Crystal and Crystal played games on her phone, and that
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: was the last time he saw her. HM Hm for
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: more on the disappearance and many of us believe the
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: death of a mom of five. Crystal Rogers joined Shay
• 36:21
  Speaker 1: and Jessica at Bardstown podcast dot Com. We Wait as
• 36:28
  Speaker 1: justice unfalse Nancy Grace Crimestory signing off good bye.