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AUSTIN SERIAL KILLER FEARS: Families' Anger Boils · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Greece.
• 0:14
  Speaker 2: Is a serial killer stalking the city of Austin, while
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: police steadfastly insist.
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: That seven bodies fished.
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: Out of Ladybird Lake in four months is just a coincidence.
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: Okay, let that sink in.
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: Four to seven bodies fished out of Lady Bird Lake
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: in Austin, and police are saying it's just a coincdinc Look,
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: you don't have to go to law school to figure
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: out there's something very, very wrong at Lady Bird Lake. Grace.
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: here at Crime Stories and on Serious XM one eleven.
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: What the hey is happening? Listen to Austin police officers
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: speaking out.
• 1:11
  Speaker 3: Our initial information doesn't show anything suspicious, but we don't
• 1:14
  Speaker 3: make that final determination until the medical examiner has been
• 1:17
  Speaker 3: able to conduct their review.
• 1:19
  Speaker 4: As well, a lot of.
• 1:20
  Speaker 5: BODI has been pulled out of the water.
• 1:21
  Speaker 6: Officer, can you understand the public's concern, worries and the
• 1:27
  Speaker 6: heighten of alert?
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: Sure?
• 1:28
  Speaker 3: Absolutely.
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: You know.
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  Speaker 3: One thing to keep in mind is that Austin has
• 1:32
  Speaker 3: thousands of acres of green space and waterways. You know,
• 1:36
  Speaker 3: it's a very nature focused, large metropolitan area so you know,
• 1:41
  Speaker 3: we would just encourage people to always be aware of
• 1:43
  Speaker 3: your surroundings, you know, and if you can go with friends,
• 1:46
  Speaker 3: keep yourself safe, right so that way we don't have
• 1:49
  Speaker 3: unfortunate incidents that that can occur.
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: What unfortunate incidents many people call it murder. Now, I've
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: been researching this and there are many bodies that have
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: just been recently pulled out of Lady Bird Lake, but
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: all the way back to two thousand and eight, there
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: have been suspicious deaths, bodies floating up in Ladybird Lake
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: that have been deemed accident or suicide. Specifically, in two
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: thousand and eight, rid hamad rid Ahmad a dad, a husband,
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: great job, second job.
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: He's found dead in Ladybird Lake.
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: His hands and feet are bound and he has tape
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: over his mouth and nose. Witnesses saw it when he
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: was pulled out of the water. Multiple witnesses saw that
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: he was bound and dug taped, but it.
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: Was ruled a suicide.
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  Speaker 2: How did he bind his feet and hands, get dug
• 2:59
  Speaker 2: tape in his mouth and nose, and what hobble into
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: the water and flee himself in That's statistically impossible if
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: you look at method and assessment of homicide and suicide.
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: That assessment is very wrong. But let's fast forward to now.
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: Cops in Austin still insisting it's all just a coincidence.
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: Agree or disagree. Another body just found. Take a listen
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: to rachel Bania crime online.
• 3:33
  Speaker 5: Another body has been found in Ladybird Lake in Austin.
• 3:37
  Speaker 5: At one thirty one pm, Austin police respond to a
• 3:39
  Speaker 5: check welfare urgent call after a nine to one to
• 3:42
  Speaker 5: one caller reports seeing a body about twenty feet off shore.
• 3:45
  Speaker 5: Police arrive at one thirty three pm minutes after the
• 3:48
  Speaker 5: call is made and find a body of an unknown
• 3:51
  Speaker 5: person who's pronounced dead. So the body is found in
• 3:54
  Speaker 5: the same site where other deceased individuals have been recovered
• 3:57
  Speaker 5: in recent months.
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: Okay, let me understand what's had happening. First of all,
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: let's go out to a special guest joining us, the
• 4:03
  Speaker 2: Brionna Hollis crime reporter.
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: K XA and news Brianna. Thank you for being with us.
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: First of all, tell me about Lady Bird Like I understand,
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: it's a man made lake to what hold water for
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: a reservoir?
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: What is it.
• 4:19
  Speaker 7: Correct it for? You know, the average person who hasn't
• 4:23
  Speaker 7: been to Austin. It's referred to as the River. It's
• 4:27
  Speaker 7: I believe, about four hundred and seventy acres of the
• 4:31
  Speaker 7: service surface area, and it flows under the two major
• 4:35
  Speaker 7: highways in town, goes all through downtown, is lined by
• 4:40
  Speaker 7: a lot of green space, is close to bars, right
• 4:43
  Speaker 7: by a popular walking and hiking trail.
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: So let me understand Lady Bird Lake actually has a
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: ban on swimming in it, doesn't.
• 4:56
  Speaker 8: It for most parts of it?
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  Speaker 2: Correct, because so many dead bodies have been fished out.
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  Speaker 7: There's other reasons for that as well, just kind of
• 5:06
  Speaker 7: some I believe, general safety and bacteria in the water
• 5:11
  Speaker 7: kind of issues as well.
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: Okay, I understood that swimming was banned a few years
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: after Riat Hamad was found floating with his hands and
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  Speaker 2: feet bound and duct tape. After a few more bodies
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: floated up and officers continued fishing them out, swimming was
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: in fact banned at Lady Bird Lake.
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: But let's move forward to what we know now.
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  Speaker 2: Also near Ladybird Lake is a popular area that includes
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: food trucks, food trucks.
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: And it's a long rainy street. Listen.
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  Speaker 9: Rainey Street in downtown Austin is one point eight miles
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  Speaker 9: from Ladybird Lake, Rocus bar and food truck area where
• 6:02
  Speaker 9: many of the victims were seen before their deaths. It's
• 6:05
  Speaker 9: also an area with a long standing reputation for crime.
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  Speaker 9: One theory is that people are in danger of having
• 6:10
  Speaker 9: their drink spiked so they can be robbed or worse.
• 6:14
  Speaker 9: Over the last two years, the Austin Police Department has
• 6:16
  Speaker 9: been investigating crimes where men are being potentially drugged while
• 6:20
  Speaker 9: out for the evening. KXAN reports in each case, a
• 6:23
  Speaker 9: man meets a woman at one of the downtown establishments,
• 6:26
  Speaker 9: and during the course of the evening, the victim is
• 6:28
  Speaker 9: drugged and the suspect takes off with their credit cards
• 6:31
  Speaker 9: and cell phone. Investigators say the cell phones and credit
• 6:34
  Speaker 9: cards have been used to commit more than seventy five
• 6:37
  Speaker 9: thousand dollars in fraudulent purchases and transactions. The suspect uses
• 6:41
  Speaker 9: the credit cards for physical purchases at various businesses and
• 6:45
  Speaker 9: the cell phone for banking apps for fraudulent purchases and
• 6:48
  Speaker 9: other transactions.
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  Speaker 2: This would not be the first time that late night
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  Speaker 2: food trucks have been linked to homicide. Brian Coburger specific
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: as to whom I am referring listen.
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  Speaker 9: To a four murdered University of Idaho students caught on
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  Speaker 9: video less than two hours before they were stabbed to death.
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  Speaker 9: Madison Mogan and ki leagansolves ordered a ten dollars portion
• 7:13
  Speaker 9: of carbonara from the Grub Truckers, a food truck at
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  Speaker 9: one am. During their ten minute wait, they took photos
• 7:19
  Speaker 9: of each other and chatted with other customers. They arrived
• 7:22
  Speaker 9: at the truck with an unidentified young man, but didn't
• 7:25
  Speaker 9: leave with him. The video was filmed by the food
• 7:27
  Speaker 9: truck operators as part of a live stream.
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: Joining me an all star panel to make sense of
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: what we know right now. But I want to go.
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: To Dennis Frank's, former FBI Supervisory Special Agent, President of
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: Investigative and Security Global Solutions, Dennis, thank you for being with.
• 7:45
  Speaker 4: Us, good morning.
• 7:46
  Speaker 10: Thank you.
• 7:47
  Speaker 2: The food truck and bar and restaurant area along Rainy
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: Street not far from Ladybird Lake, and I believe in
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  Speaker 2: criminal law there is no coincidence. And I base that
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: on not only ten years of prosecuting nothing but felonies,
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: of course, including homicide, serial murders, spree murders, But in
• 8:13
  Speaker 2: all the cases that I've covered, when you keep having
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: dead bodies slowed up in the same lake, you have
• 8:21
  Speaker 2: to at least consider a serial killer.
• 8:25
  Speaker 10: I would agree it's you count the number of bodies
• 8:28
  Speaker 10: that have been found in this area over the last
• 8:31
  Speaker 10: several years, and this is an area where people don't
• 8:35
  Speaker 10: spend their motorized boats are not allowed. You know, there
• 8:38
  Speaker 10: are a few drownings every year on Lake Austin and
• 8:41
  Speaker 10: Lake Travis, but these are usually for boating situations and
• 8:45
  Speaker 10: swimming situations. So this number of bodies in one location
• 8:51
  Speaker 10: to me, is not a coincidence either in their probably
• 8:54
  Speaker 10: I think I've counted, maybe there are fifteen bars on
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  Speaker 10: Rainy Street and they're all within distance walking distance of
• 9:01
  Speaker 10: the lake.
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: Joining me.
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  Speaker 2: In addition to Brionna Hollis from k x a N
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: and Dennis Frank's for me FBI, another special guest is
• 9:13
  Speaker 2: Reagan Apodisio, mother to one of the Lady Bird Lake
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: victim's son. I am referring to John Christopher Hayes Clark.
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: He was found dead April fifteen, twenty twenty three. His
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: coeod cause of death even now is undetermined.
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  Speaker 1: Reagan, thank you for being with us.
• 9:37
  Speaker 8: Thank you for having me.
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: Reagan What do.
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  Speaker 2: You make of police insisting that all of these deaths
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: are either accident or suicide.
• 9:48
  Speaker 11: I don't believe anything the Austin Police Department says.
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  Speaker 8: I haven't since I've known, since I first got the
• 9:56
  Speaker 8: call about Chris.
• 10:01
  Speaker 11: It's been crazy dealing with them, and I haven't had
• 10:05
  Speaker 11: too much clarification on anything of his death, So that
• 10:10
  Speaker 11: makes me not believe them.
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  Speaker 2: When you say it's been crazy dealing with them, what
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: do you mean by that.
• 10:15
  Speaker 11: Little to no contact with them? I have to keep
• 10:19
  Speaker 11: basically begging to talk to the detective at the time
• 10:22
  Speaker 11: when all this happened. I literally only talked to him
• 10:26
  Speaker 11: two times, met him one time, and the one time
• 10:29
  Speaker 11: I met him is when they were about to close
• 10:32
  Speaker 11: the case.
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: Is the case actually closed?
• 10:34
  Speaker 8: Yes?
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  Speaker 1: And what was their decision as to cause of death?
• 10:38
  Speaker 11: They deemed it as undetermined and they closed the case
• 10:42
  Speaker 11: because they said they had no information on Chris on
• 10:46
  Speaker 11: where he would have been or who was the last
• 10:48
  Speaker 11: person to see him, so there was no reason to
• 10:51
  Speaker 11: keep the case open.
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: Time Stories with Me Nancy Grace.
• 11:08
  Speaker 2: Joining me is Reegan Aparico. She is the mother of
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: one of the victims, young son, who is now twelve
• 11:18
  Speaker 2: and he wants to know what happened to dad? And
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: can I tell you as each year passes is going
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: to nag him and haunt him the rest of his
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: life if we don't get answers. Now is the time
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: to get those answers. Reaganet hold on just one moment.
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  Speaker 2: Also joining us is renowned medical examiner chief medical Examiner
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: in Texas of Terrance County. That's Fort Worth Lecturer, University
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: of Texas, Austin and at TCU, Texas Christian University Medical School,
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: doctor Kendall Crown's.
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  Speaker 1: Doctor crowns, thank you for being with us. To me,
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  Speaker 1: when a case is.
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  Speaker 2: Labeled undetermined CEOD cause of death and the family has
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: no answers, that's not a case that I would consider
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: to be closed.
• 12:07
  Speaker 12: Yeah, you're correct on that, Nancy. Any case that's left
• 12:10
  Speaker 12: undetermined means that the medical examiner wasn't able to figure
• 12:13
  Speaker 12: out an exact cause of death and so because of
• 12:17
  Speaker 12: that they've left it undetermined in case any investigative information
• 12:21
  Speaker 12: comes up on a later date or anything else may
• 12:25
  Speaker 12: come arise that may change the outcome. So when you
• 12:30
  Speaker 12: get an undetermined, especially in a case found in a
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  Speaker 12: lake like that, It means that they didn't find anything specific,
• 12:37
  Speaker 12: because drowning finding themselves are non specific, and so they
• 12:40
  Speaker 12: didn't find anything that they felt was valid enough to
• 12:44
  Speaker 12: cause it to give a good valid cause death.
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: Well, they're saying that about so many of the cases,
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: Doctor Kendall Crowns. I want to circle back to you
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: on obtaining cause of death when a body has been
• 12:55
  Speaker 2: in the water submerged for a period of time. But
• 12:58
  Speaker 2: I want to go back to Reagan UPDC, mother to
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: victim Christopher Clark's son.
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: Now, I believe as your son turned thirteen.
• 13:07
  Speaker 8: Yet he'll be thirteen next month.
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: Question to you regarding the death of Chris Clark. You
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: guys were together for over ten years. I understand you
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: last saw him on Easter Sunday, It's correct, and when
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: he walked out after visiting with you and your son,
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: you had no idea you would never see him again.
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: When did you learn that Christopher had been killed?
• 13:35
  Speaker 11: I learned Sunday after they let his mother know what
• 13:39
  Speaker 11: were you told? His best friend called me and he
• 13:43
  Speaker 11: was very distraught and let me know that they had
• 13:45
  Speaker 11: found Chris in the lake. And I didn't believe it,
• 13:49
  Speaker 11: and I went to his mom's house, and she told
• 13:52
  Speaker 11: me that the police had came and let them know
• 13:55
  Speaker 11: that they had identified him in the lake and that
• 13:59
  Speaker 11: you know, he was deceased, and I kind of lost
• 14:03
  Speaker 11: it from there.
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: Do you know, Reagan whether he had drugs or alcohol
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: in his body?
• 14:10
  Speaker 8: Yes?
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: I do know, Diddy, Yes, you know.
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: That leads me back Brianna joining me, Brianna Hollis k
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: x A N to the scheme that apparently some women
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: have drugging and robbing male victims and then they are
• 14:30
  Speaker 2: found in and around Ladybird Lake. Are you familiar with
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: that scheme that investigation by Austin p DA.
• 14:38
  Speaker 7: In my experience, when it has come to cases similar
• 14:42
  Speaker 7: to what you have brought up in the past two
• 14:44
  Speaker 7: years that I personally have looked into, they have either
• 14:48
  Speaker 7: been not reported to police or have been unsubstantiated, or
• 14:53
  Speaker 7: the police department has suspended the cases on the bonus
• 14:58
  Speaker 7: of the complaint.
• 14:59
  Speaker 13: End.
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: Okay, I'm really not sure what you're saying. Are you
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: saying that you know of other cases where it's alleged
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: victims were drugged and then robbed, but they were never prosecuted,
• 15:13
  Speaker 2: whether it's because it couldn't be substantiated, or that victim
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: didn't want to testify, is that what you're saying.
• 15:19
  Speaker 7: I'm saying, Or because the alleged victims didn't report it
• 15:22
  Speaker 7: to police at all and it was just social media
• 15:26
  Speaker 7: chatter or okay, people reaching out My question.
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: Do you know of cases, whether they've been prosecuted or not,
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: where victims claim they were drugged and robbed in the area. Yeah, okay,
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: let me go to doctor Kendall Crown's again, chief medical
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: examiner there in Fort Worth. Doctor Crowns, I find this
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: baffling and confusing that so many bodies have been pulled
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: out of Ladybird Lake, but police are continued to say
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: it's all.
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: Just a coincidence.
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: Could you explain to me whether in life of to
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: psychology reports that it could be determined if these victims
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: had been drugged anyway.
• 16:13
  Speaker 12: So the toxology of reports will tell you what drugs
• 16:15
  Speaker 12: are in the system, and there are certain drugs that
• 16:18
  Speaker 12: are used to try and coerce or to drug an
• 16:23
  Speaker 12: individual like row him being I think is one of
• 16:25
  Speaker 12: the date breap drugs. But if you're seeing other types
• 16:29
  Speaker 12: of drugs, it may or may not have been used
• 16:32
  Speaker 12: coercely so it's difficult to say just on toxicology. The
• 16:37
  Speaker 12: problem is, as you pointed out, you have many bodies
• 16:40
  Speaker 12: coming from the same area in a short period of time,
• 16:44
  Speaker 12: so you have to kind of wonder if they're clustering
• 16:46
  Speaker 12: like that, what's going on and what's causing it. It's
• 16:49
  Speaker 12: more than just a simple oh, they all happen to
• 16:52
  Speaker 12: go to the same area and die. I do feel
• 16:55
  Speaker 12: that that's something the Medical Examiner's office in Travis and
• 16:58
  Speaker 12: the police then should be really looking at. Why are
• 17:01
  Speaker 12: all these same people ending up and dead in the
• 17:04
  Speaker 12: same area. There's got to be a connection.
• 17:06
  Speaker 7: I'm sorry, can I say something sure? Japan, there's a
• 17:10
  Speaker 7: lot of talk that all of these bodies have been
• 17:11
  Speaker 7: found near Rainy Street, and that isn't true. There have
• 17:14
  Speaker 7: only been I'm looking at our map right now, there
• 17:16
  Speaker 7: have only been two found near Rainy Street, where the
• 17:19
  Speaker 7: victim was reported last seen on Rainy Street since twenty
• 17:23
  Speaker 7: twenty two.
• 17:23
  Speaker 8: The rest of been in.
• 17:24
  Speaker 7: All different parts of Ladybird Lake, which again, if you're
• 17:27
  Speaker 7: looking at it on a map, that looks more like
• 17:29
  Speaker 7: a river. So I think it's really important to note
• 17:31
  Speaker 7: that all of these bodies aren't showing up near Rainy Street.
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: That's good to know, Yeah, but it's not.
• 17:37
  Speaker 12: Laborg Lake have a current associated with it, so those
• 17:41
  Speaker 12: bodies can be being dropped at the centralized location and
• 17:43
  Speaker 12: then washing down the rivers so they don't.
• 17:46
  Speaker 7: Look at there that has been found upstream from Rainey
• 17:49
  Speaker 7: Streets upstream?
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: Ot is that dodger Kendall crown speaking. Yes, sorry, okay,
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: doctor Kendall Crowns. You took the words straight out of
• 17:59
  Speaker 2: my mouth. Because the current leading into and out of
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: and in Ladybird Lake is considerable and your analysis is correct.
• 18:11
  Speaker 12: Well, that's actually one of the reasons why they don't
• 18:14
  Speaker 12: want people swimming in Ladybird Lake is because the current
• 18:17
  Speaker 12: is very dangerous and people that aren't very good at
• 18:20
  Speaker 12: swimming get caught in that current drown And.
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: As a matter of fact, I'm looking right at it
• 18:25
  Speaker 2: the map including the current, and you're right.
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: Let me go to Alan.
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: Bennett, former felony prosecutor now partner at Gunter Bennett and
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: anthis at GBA firm dot com.
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: Alan, I mean here, a former felony prosecutor like myself.
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: If you're prosecuting this case or investigating it, do you
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: really care if the victim is pushed into the water
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: or dumped upstream in the lake or downstream.
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: Do you care? It's a series.
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: Of young men of men dead in and around Lady
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: Bird Lake. So I appreciate the distinction, and it sounds
• 19:08
  Speaker 2: like a wonderful distinction a veteran defense attorney might make
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: at trial. But I have handled serial murder cases. I
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: have argued them to the Georgia Supreme Court. One of
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: the first ones. You'll like this for its analogy to
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: the current case Alan Bennett. Was a string of young
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: black males that were killed in Atlanta, everyone within a
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: certain age range, everyone African American, everyone killed with I
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: believe it was a thirty six caliber in the head
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: in the middle of a sex act, or so police thought.
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: But yet no one would say serial killer. Well, it
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: was a serial killer who would lure these young guys
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: out of a bar, go out to have sex and
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: kill them.
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: Why. I don't know.
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: Did he hate himself, did he hate them? I don't know,
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: and I don't care why. But he was a serial killer.
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: Ever the longest time, nobody would say serial killer. And
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: I don't know why. But when you have this many bodies,
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: whether they're up straight, in the lake or downstream. They
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: all have to be examined very closely.
• 20:24
  Speaker 4: Alan, Yes, ma'am, I would agree. I think topsychology reports
• 20:28
  Speaker 4: need to be done on all of those folks. And
• 20:31
  Speaker 4: I can't speak to this investigation directly in I can't
• 20:34
  Speaker 4: speak great toe, but having worked with APD for the
• 20:38
  Speaker 4: last thirty seven years now, both as a prosecutor and
• 20:40
  Speaker 4: in frinch arning, one thing I see across the board,
• 20:44
  Speaker 4: and I'm sure you've seen us as well, answer across
• 20:47
  Speaker 4: the board in law enforcement. Any detective, investigator, a forensic analyst, officer,
• 20:53
  Speaker 4: everyone across the board. Good detective work dictates that you
• 20:57
  Speaker 4: work the facts, not the theory, and I've heard that
• 21:01
  Speaker 4: countless times. I suspect APD may take the position that
• 21:05
  Speaker 4: this isn't necessarily a coincidence. There is a common thread
• 21:08
  Speaker 4: to all these. We have a bunch of young people
• 21:10
  Speaker 4: and a very very well working entertainment district here in Austin,
• 21:16
  Speaker 4: a bunch of bunch of alcohol. They're very close to
• 21:19
  Speaker 4: a very dangerous body of water with a strong current.
• 21:22
  Speaker 4: They would say that it's coincidental. There are a number
• 21:25
  Speaker 4: in such a short period of time. And I'll be
• 21:27
  Speaker 4: the first to admit the number of bodies found in
• 21:29
  Speaker 4: such a short period of time. There's the old adage
• 21:32
  Speaker 4: where there is smoke, there is fire. That's a lot
• 21:34
  Speaker 4: a lot of smoke. But I think former specialized of
• 21:37
  Speaker 4: friends will hopefully agree with me. You have to work
• 21:40
  Speaker 4: the facts and not the theory. The facts and the
• 21:43
  Speaker 4: clues will help you develop the theory. The theory doesn't
• 21:47
  Speaker 4: help you develop facts. And it may very well be
• 21:49
  Speaker 4: as Miss Hollismans and the Long Ago APD. They close
• 21:53
  Speaker 4: cases that they will also administratively close the case, which
• 21:57
  Speaker 4: basically means we're just not doing anything right now. Now
• 22:00
  Speaker 4: we don't have any lease to follow, we don't have
• 22:02
  Speaker 4: any and where this is taking us, they're not going
• 22:05
  Speaker 4: to go more. If additional evidence comes up, as doctor
• 22:07
  Speaker 4: Brown to mention, absolutely, they'll reopen that case if they
• 22:11
  Speaker 4: can find that common thread, and they as well be
• 22:14
  Speaker 4: the currently APD is not finding the common thread that
• 22:19
  Speaker 4: our intuition tells us must be there, should be there,
• 22:22
  Speaker 4: and it must be something more than simply young folks
• 22:26
  Speaker 4: bunch of alcohol close to a body of water.
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: Now I know why you wont so many cases, Alan Bennett.
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: I agree with everything that you just said. But for
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: Austin ployees to just come out and announce there isn't
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: a serial killer at this juncture, I think is highly,
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: highly premature and a risk to the public because we.
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: Really don't know.
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: And you're right, you've got to follow the facts before
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: you develop a theory. Another thing you said that I
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: think should be very comforting to Miss Reagan Apodicio, the
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: mother to victim Christopher Clark's twelve year olds, is that
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: the cases are not closed in the TV sense, in
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: the street vernacular sense of the word. They are closed
• 23:09
  Speaker 2: as in, we've had a dead end, we're not giving up. Well,
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: you don't have anywhere to go right now. And I
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: got to tell you something, Reagan. When I became a
• 23:19
  Speaker 2: felony prosecutor, I inherited a courtroom, a very very busy
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: felony courtroom in inner city Atlanta, and I inherited about
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: one hundred and fifty pending cases while getting about one
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: hundred new cases every week or so.
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: So the case isn't gone, it's not done.
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: It's closed for now until new evidence emerges. And that's
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: why we are talking about this case today. I want
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: to go to doctor Dana Anderson forensics psychologist, host of
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: Killer Psychologist podcast, and you can find doctor Dana at
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: Killer Psychologist. Doctor Dana, thank you for being with us.
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: Why do you believe police don't want to even entertain
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: discussion of a serial killer in Austin.
• 24:09
  Speaker 13: Well, one reason is you don't want to brighten the public.
• 24:13
  Speaker 13: You want to create that sense of safety. And maybe
• 24:18
  Speaker 13: they do have more information and they don't want the
• 24:21
  Speaker 13: public to know about it. They don't want to create
• 24:23
  Speaker 13: that panic and fear. Although too late, that's actually already
• 24:28
  Speaker 13: happening if you scour the internet, and even this morning,
• 24:31
  Speaker 13: I went online and looked at the bars on Rainy Street,
• 24:37
  Speaker 13: the sidebar, and there's hundreds of reviews saying don't go
• 24:40
  Speaker 13: out to these places, you're going to get drugged. And
• 24:44
  Speaker 13: there's lots of information on the internet about these individuals
• 24:50
  Speaker 13: that have gone missing, and a lot of speculation and theories.
• 24:54
  Speaker 13: So there is panic and people want answers, and it
• 24:59
  Speaker 13: is concerning hear that cases are being closed to prematurely.
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: Agree agree, and again based on what Alan Bennett was
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: just explaining, the cases may not be closed in the
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: layperson understanding, they're closed as in, we don't have any
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: updates right now, we're waiting for more evidence to be uncovered.
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: It would not be the first.
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: Time by any stretch that a serial killer stalked an area,
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: while police steadfastly deny any such apparition as a serial killer.
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: Take a listen to our cut sixteen A. This is
• 25:37
  Speaker 2: Dave Mack from Crime Online discussing a recent spate of murders.
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: For the longest time, police refused to acknowledge a serial
• 25:47
  Speaker 2: killer alert to the area.
• 25:48
  Speaker 6: Listen with Eric Opania's description of the man, the make
• 25:51
  Speaker 6: and model of the truck. Authorities were able to identify
• 25:54
  Speaker 6: Border Patrol Agent one David Ortiz as their suspect. As
• 25:58
  Speaker 6: authorities mobilized to look for one David or Tees, they
• 26:00
  Speaker 6: couldn't find him. After paying his escape from Martese officers
• 26:03
  Speaker 6: only knew of victims Melissa Ramirez and Claudine Duerra, but
• 26:07
  Speaker 6: while they were chasing after him, they heard about a
• 26:09
  Speaker 6: third body that had been found later identified as thirty
• 26:12
  Speaker 6: five year old Gizelda Elisa Hernetez can too. Believing Ortiz
• 26:16
  Speaker 6: will return to the home he shares with his wife
• 26:18
  Speaker 6: and children, authorities head to his home, hoping to avoid
• 26:21
  Speaker 6: an armed confrontation.
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: That's right, the border patrol agent was in fact a
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: serial killer, and if police had acknowledged that these women
• 26:29
  Speaker 2: were dropping like flies at the hands of serial killer,
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: that last victim may very well have been saved. And
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: that's certainly not the only one. The same thing happened
• 26:41
  Speaker 2: in Oregon.
• 26:43
  Speaker 6: Listen weeks after saying the deaths of several women were
• 26:46
  Speaker 6: not linked to one murderer, investigators and prosecutors say they're
• 26:50
  Speaker 6: working together on the evidence that now links one person,
• 26:52
  Speaker 6: jesse Lee Calhoun, to at least four of the murdered women.
• 26:56
  Speaker 6: Kristin Smith reported missing December twenty second, twenty twenty two,
• 27:00
  Speaker 6: dead eight weeks later in Portland. Twenty two year old
• 27:03
  Speaker 6: Ashley Real reported missing in Portland April second, twenty twenty three,
• 27:06
  Speaker 6: found dead five weeks later in CLACKHAMUS County. Charity Perry
• 27:09
  Speaker 6: twenty four, found dead in East Molknomah County. Bridget Leanne
• 27:13
  Speaker 6: Ramsey Webster thirty one, found dead in Paul County April thirtieth,
• 27:16
  Speaker 6: twenty twenty three. Jesse Lee Calhoun has not been charged yet,
• 27:20
  Speaker 6: but he remains a person of interest.
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: In many instances we see where cops don't want to
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: alarm the public, but in fact that's hurting the public
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: because they're not aware that there could be a serial
• 27:33
  Speaker 2: killer lurking among them. Prime stories with Nancy Grace, let
• 27:51
  Speaker 2: me go back to you, doctor Kendall, Crown's chief medical
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: examiner Terran County. Let's talk about potential drugging of the victims.
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: What are your thoughts on any way to link some
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: of these victims together. For instance, a date rape drug
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: could be used like I believe it was used in
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: the Natalie Holloway case. Or victims could be watched or party.
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: They could be partying with the victim and when they
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: pull out their own drugs, that's a perfect chance to
• 28:21
  Speaker 2: rob them or kill them. So I'm trying to figure
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: out all the various mos mos operandi method of operation
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: a killer could utilize in this scenario. So where would
• 28:34
  Speaker 2: a medical examiner fit into this puzzle to help link
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: victims potentially?
• 28:40
  Speaker 12: So what you can do is when you have a
• 28:42
  Speaker 12: string of victims all from the same area, or you
• 28:46
  Speaker 12: start looking for similarities, you know, as they have a
• 28:49
  Speaker 12: similar pattern and bruising where they similarly tied up, things
• 28:54
  Speaker 12: of that nature. If you're worried about a drug, someone
• 28:57
  Speaker 12: drugging them and then you know, jumping them. Look for
• 29:00
  Speaker 12: similar if they have similar toxlogic findings, because the serial killer,
• 29:05
  Speaker 12: if you will, isn't going to be switching up drugs
• 29:08
  Speaker 12: between victims. They're going to go with what works and
• 29:10
  Speaker 12: then continue to use it. So if the medical exambler
• 29:13
  Speaker 12: has noticed you have a cluster of bodies from the
• 29:15
  Speaker 12: same area and they all have the same drugs on board,
• 29:19
  Speaker 12: then you have a very obvious issue.
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: Now I've been looking at a lot of the victims
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: and Brianna Hollis may.
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: Be able to help me out here.
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: Kaxa in News again, thank you for being with us.
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: So many of the victims and of course to my knowledge,
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: they're dating back to two thousand and eight, but some
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: of them had facial bruising, some of them had broken bones.
• 29:43
  Speaker 2: I don't really understand how that can fit into an
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: accidental death scenario. But what can you tell me about
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: the most recent victims, Brianna.
• 29:56
  Speaker 7: So obviously we had a case this week where where
• 30:00
  Speaker 7: a body was pulled from Ladybird Lake. This was near
• 30:03
  Speaker 7: City Hall, which is northwest of Rainey Street upstream. How
• 30:08
  Speaker 7: far from Rainey Street, probably about a mile and a
• 30:10
  Speaker 7: half or so two miles and this was identified as
• 30:16
  Speaker 7: a female. That's all the information we have at the moment. Again,
• 30:19
  Speaker 7: this just happened this week, so it's common to not
• 30:23
  Speaker 7: you know, we obviously don't have the toxicology report all
• 30:26
  Speaker 7: tops of you report any of that back yet, but
• 30:29
  Speaker 7: that is what we know at the moment of this case. Otherwise,
• 30:34
  Speaker 7: like I said, most of my reporting has been on
• 30:38
  Speaker 7: the cases dating back to July of twenty twenty two.
• 30:43
  Speaker 7: I'm looking at our map and our chart here right now,
• 30:48
  Speaker 7: all kind of what you guys have been talking about.
• 30:50
  Speaker 7: Accidental drowning, cause of death undetermined. There's two cases I
• 30:54
  Speaker 7: do want to bring up the and before I get
• 30:57
  Speaker 7: into that, I do want to mention that, of course,
• 31:00
  Speaker 7: every death is a tragedy, no matter how it happened.
• 31:04
  Speaker 7: So I go into these details with you know, the
• 31:07
  Speaker 7: utmost level of respect and sensitivity for the family members
• 31:11
  Speaker 7: of these victims. Just wanted to put that out there.
• 31:14
  Speaker 7: But two of the cases that sparked a lot of
• 31:16
  Speaker 7: alarm last year were the Jason John case and the
• 31:20
  Speaker 7: Jonathan Honey case.
• 31:21
  Speaker 8: These were two instances, the only.
• 31:23
  Speaker 7: Two incidents in my reporting since I've gotten here where
• 31:28
  Speaker 7: the victim was actually last seen on Rainey Street. And
• 31:33
  Speaker 7: in the two cases of toxicology reports found no drugs
• 31:36
  Speaker 7: but found alcohol. And then in the Jonathan Honey case
• 31:41
  Speaker 7: they found drugs consistent with over the counter I believe
• 31:44
  Speaker 7: allergy medicine.
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: Okay, so those two victims on Rainey Street did not
• 31:50
  Speaker 2: have anything such as GHB, gamma hydroxy viewed right or
• 31:57
  Speaker 2: another potentialitive. But to you, doctor Kendall Crowns, in this scenario,
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: if people are getting guys or women to party, getting
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: them drunk, getting them to use drugs, and killing them,
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: I don't know that drugs would be in their system.
• 32:17
  Speaker 12: Well, if they're getting them drunk or in any if
• 32:20
  Speaker 12: they aren't getting them drunk, then yes, or giving them drugs,
• 32:24
  Speaker 12: of course there wouldn't be drugs in their system. But
• 32:27
  Speaker 12: if they're giving them anything, it should show up on
• 32:29
  Speaker 12: the toxicology. But of course you could lure them away
• 32:32
  Speaker 12: into those areas and then strangle theomen, push them into
• 32:35
  Speaker 12: the river, or whatever you're doing to them.
• 32:37
  Speaker 4: Who knows at this form you.
• 32:39
  Speaker 2: Know another issue, And let me go to Dennis Franks
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: on this former FBI special agent now with Investigative and
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: Security Global Solutions, Dennis. So many people assume that theft
• 32:54
  Speaker 2: would be the motive. With a serial killer, that's not
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: necessarily the motive. The joy of killing is very often
• 33:04
  Speaker 2: the motive.
• 33:04
  Speaker 10: I agree, and no, I'm not a behavioral science expert,
• 33:08
  Speaker 10: but yet you know these I do not see theft
• 33:12
  Speaker 10: as being a situation where somebody gets robbed and then
• 33:16
  Speaker 10: they kill them and throw them in the lake.
• 33:19
  Speaker 8: I would go on.
• 33:21
  Speaker 10: To say that assuming that the Austin Police Department has
• 33:25
  Speaker 10: a behavioral science unit or experts trained in that they
• 33:29
  Speaker 10: should be looking at this, looking at any patterns anything
• 33:33
  Speaker 10: at all, coordinating with the FBI's behavioral science unit, looking
• 33:36
  Speaker 10: at statistics nationwide, and looking for any clues at all
• 33:40
  Speaker 10: that might whether or not they're going to admit that
• 33:43
  Speaker 10: this might be a serial killer. They should be doing this,
• 33:46
  Speaker 10: and I would hope they are.
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: All I've been in joining us former felony prosecutor joining
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: us out of Austin. You've handled so many homicide cases,
• 33:54
  Speaker 2: but in serial killer cases, I mean John Wayne Gacy.
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: He didn't steal from victims, He molested them, then he
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: killed them and buried him in his crawls base off
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: his basement.
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: Ted Bundy, he didn't rob.
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: While many serial killers do take a mento like jewelry,
• 34:12
  Speaker 2: or they might take a driver's license or a hair
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: rib and or underwear. Theft is not the motivator. For
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: for instance, Ted Bundy, I could go on and on
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: and on, like Ortiz the Border patrol Ation, he hated prostitutes,
• 34:28
  Speaker 2: so he killed them. The Boston Strangler, for Pete's sake,
• 34:31
  Speaker 2: he did rob the victims. He hated them because they
• 34:35
  Speaker 2: were prostitutes. So motivation for serial killers is not, by
• 34:41
  Speaker 2: far always theft.
• 34:43
  Speaker 4: I agree Answering. In fact, I'm not sure that I'm
• 34:45
  Speaker 4: aware of any serial killer in history who was in
• 34:49
  Speaker 4: fact motig back up and then again, how they come
• 34:52
  Speaker 4: A special agent Priance could give us a better startisip.
• 34:55
  Speaker 4: But my understanding is that at any given time, the
• 34:58
  Speaker 4: FBI believe there are only about fifty serial killers operating
• 35:03
  Speaker 4: within the United States.
• 35:04
  Speaker 8: M M.
• 35:05
  Speaker 4: Because our lady mentioned a moment ago, if that is
• 35:08
  Speaker 4: the most is most prevalent crime, that's the most important crime.
• 35:12
  Speaker 4: Serial killers are not. I think I think you're right.
• 35:16
  Speaker 4: All the serial killers you mentioned, they are a special
• 35:20
  Speaker 4: breed of people. And they may collect souvenirs, they may
• 35:24
  Speaker 4: take momentos from the victims, but they're not they're not
• 35:27
  Speaker 4: robbing their victims. In fact, I'm not even sure if
• 35:30
  Speaker 4: there's any evidence that any of the bodies have been
• 35:32
  Speaker 4: pulled from the lake or in fact victims of robbery
• 35:36
  Speaker 4: or theft. I'm not sure if any of those bodies
• 35:38
  Speaker 4: were pulled that had their wallet impact had their money
• 35:41
  Speaker 4: still in their wallet. I'm not sure if there's any
• 35:44
  Speaker 4: association or any connection of theft.
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: Brianna Hollis, what about it? K x An, Have any
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: of these victams been robbed?
• 35:50
  Speaker 7: Not to nine knowledge the ones I've covered.
• 35:53
  Speaker 2: There you go, Alan Bennett, what you're saying is really
• 35:56
  Speaker 2: interesting to me because I disagree with the FBI, and
• 36:00
  Speaker 2: I certainly don't want to poke the bear. It's like
• 36:04
  Speaker 2: having a tiger by the tail. You can't hold on
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: and you can't let go. But it'll be a cold
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: day in HG. Double l that there is only fifty
• 36:10
  Speaker 2: serial killers in America right now. No, they may only
• 36:16
  Speaker 2: know of fifty serial killers in America, but I guarantee
• 36:19
  Speaker 2: you that is woefully, woefully under reported. Another body in
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: Lady Bird Lake. Listen to our cut six Dave matt
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: Crime Online.
• 36:29
  Speaker 6: The recent discovery of another body in lady Bird Lake
• 36:32
  Speaker 6: in Austin brings the total number of bodies found in
• 36:34
  Speaker 6: the lake in the last year to six. Ladybird Lake
• 36:37
  Speaker 6: is a portion of the Colorado River that runs through
• 36:39
  Speaker 6: downtown Austin, so there have been at least five other
• 36:42
  Speaker 6: bodies pulled from the lake in the last year, while
• 36:44
  Speaker 6: ben in and around their thirties. In each case, the
• 36:47
  Speaker 6: victim had been drinking on or nearby Rainy Street in
• 36:50
  Speaker 6: downtown Austin, just a thirty five minute walk to Ladybird
• 36:53
  Speaker 6: Lake is a rackus bar and food truck area with
• 36:56
  Speaker 6: a long standing reputation for crime. One theory loading around
• 37:00
  Speaker 6: is that people are in danger of having their drink
• 37:02
  Speaker 6: spiked so they can be robbed or worse.
• 37:05
  Speaker 2: The victims that we know of riad hamad Cole Christensen,
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: Fernando Ortiz, Luis Ramerez, Martin Gutierrez, Ricky Parks, Kyle Thornton, Jason,
• 37:20
  Speaker 2: John Clifton, Oxtail, Jonathan Honey, John Christopher Hayes, Clark, Mogo Degol,
• 37:30
  Speaker 2: and one unidentified female to you joining us Breonna Hollis,
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: k X A N I'm curious as to the physical
• 37:41
  Speaker 2: appearance of the victims.
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: What can you tell me about that? Are they similar
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: in appearance?
• 37:47
  Speaker 7: That's something I don't know directly. The only information that
• 37:50
  Speaker 7: we've gotten from police regarding this was just difficulties when
• 37:56
  Speaker 7: it comes to the autopsy and the investigations because of
• 38:00
  Speaker 7: you know, bodies being in the water with you know,
• 38:04
  Speaker 7: bloating and decomposition and whatnot.
• 38:07
  Speaker 2: Many of them are light complected with dark hair. That's
• 38:10
  Speaker 2: my observation so far. And as you know, to Dennis
• 38:15
  Speaker 2: Frank's former FBI now in security, serial killers typically kill
• 38:23
  Speaker 2: within their own race. Also, they have a type a
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: type of victim to which they gravitate. I mean, if
• 38:32
  Speaker 2: you look at Ted Bundy's victims, they all look like thin,
• 38:36
  Speaker 2: white females with dark hair, part of down the middle.
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: There are a few variations, but that's what you find
• 38:42
  Speaker 2: very very often.
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: What do you make of that, Dennis.
• 38:45
  Speaker 8: Franks, Yeah, I think that's true.
• 38:47
  Speaker 10: I think they're usually a pattern of the victims with
• 38:50
  Speaker 10: serial killers. And I've been looking at that in these
• 38:55
  Speaker 10: unfortunate does and it does seem that the victims do
• 38:58
  Speaker 10: have that picture of look, you know, it doesn't seem
• 39:04
  Speaker 10: for sure. You know, certainly there's not random you know,
• 39:07
  Speaker 10: victims or or people who have found that of different uh,
• 39:12
  Speaker 10: you know, different looks. And so that's a factor that
• 39:16
  Speaker 10: I think is important in this because you're going to
• 39:19
  Speaker 10: look at any pattern you can, and that's an important pattern,
• 39:23
  Speaker 10: and then you're going to look for other commonalities. And
• 39:29
  Speaker 10: you know, it's it's a mystery that they may not
• 39:33
  Speaker 10: say that it's, you know, a serial killer, but they
• 39:36
  Speaker 10: have to be looking at it. I just can't see
• 39:38
  Speaker 10: why they wouldn't.
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: I am looking at a picture of Christopher Clark right now.
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: Reagan Aparicio is joining us, the mother of Christopher's son,
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: twelve years old. Rigan, what is your message today?
• 39:57
  Speaker 11: My message today is to the city of our state
• 40:00
  Speaker 11: into the Austin Police Department. I really just want to say,
• 40:04
  Speaker 11: shame on them because as they're stating that these individuals
• 40:08
  Speaker 11: are just.
• 40:08
  Speaker 8: Going to the lake, whether they're drunk, have drugs in
• 40:11
  Speaker 8: their system. If that's the case, if that's the picture
• 40:14
  Speaker 8: they're trying.
• 40:14
  Speaker 11: To paint, then why are they not doing anything as
• 40:17
  Speaker 11: far as safety. I'm an Austin nite, Chris was an
• 40:20
  Speaker 11: Austin nite and my son was an Austin Nite.
• 40:22
  Speaker 8: We grew up here, we all still live here.
• 40:24
  Speaker 11: They're not doing anything to protect, to put protection.
• 40:28
  Speaker 8: Around their lake.
• 40:29
  Speaker 11: There's no barriers, there's nothing, there's no patrol, there's nothing.
• 40:32
  Speaker 8: So for them to sit here and.
• 40:34
  Speaker 11: Say that you know, there's no serial killer, there is
• 40:36
  Speaker 11: nothing happening. They can't find any connections to any of
• 40:40
  Speaker 11: the individuals. I think that's very wrong, and I just
• 40:43
  Speaker 11: want them to understand that my son does not have
• 40:45
  Speaker 11: his dad anymore.
• 40:46
  Speaker 8: That was his best friend.
• 40:47
  Speaker 11: He's never going to get that back ever, So shame
• 40:51
  Speaker 11: on them.
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: Having relied on police.
• 40:55
  Speaker 2: Officers my entire prosecuting career, I find many of them
• 41:02
  Speaker 2: to be the most honorable people I've met. In this case,
• 41:08
  Speaker 2: I strongly urge a second look. We wait as justice unfolds. Goodbye,
• 41:16
  Speaker 2: saying