Latest / Health with Hashimoto’s - Thyroid or Immune Education for Autoimmune Thyroid Disease / 167 // When 'Fine' Is a Lie: High functioning fatigue in Hashimoto’s. [Interview: Michelle McCoy]
Transcript
- 0:00Are you juggling a million different responsibilities while battling exhaustion that just won't quit?
- 0:06I recently sat down with my friend Michelle McCoy to talk about high-functioning
- 0:10fatigue in women with Hashimoto's.
- 0:12If you feel like you're pushing through life despite feeling so drained.
- 0:17This episode is absolutely for you.
- 0:19Welcome to the Health with Hashimoto's podcast. This is where you will find
- 0:23clarity and simple, sustainable strategies to feel better.
- 0:27I want to help you figure out your root causes.
- 0:30My name is Esther Yunkin. I am a registered nurse.
- 0:33I spent about 17 years in the emergency department and then I got sick and tired
- 0:37of putting band-aids on chronic things.
- 0:38I went back to school and now I have been in holistic health education for about 10 years.
- 0:44I know how exhausting it is to live with fatigue, brain fog,
- 0:48and the ups and downs of Hashimoto's. And that is why I'm here.
- 0:51I'm here to cut through the confusion and to give you practical steps that support
- 0:56your body, calm your immune system, so that you can regain your energy and feel like yourself again.
- 1:01This is episode 167 of the Health with Hashimoto's podcast, and I have a guest for you today.
- 1:08Let me introduce you to my friend, Michelle McCoy. She is a wife,
- 1:12mom, and board-certified holistic functional health coach.
- 1:14She is the host of another podcast you should go check out. It is a treasured wellness podcast.
- 1:19It is for Christian women looking for answers to break free from daily fatigue
- 1:24and brain fog so they can finally feel energized and sharp again for those 4
- 1:28p.m. conference calls and date nights with the hubby.
- 1:31So Michelle's story starts with her own debilitating fatigue and health challenges,
- 1:35and then she had to navigate her daughter's health crisis.
- 1:39Michelle, let's start there. Tell us about how things failed for you and then
- 1:43how you pivoted and what you're doing now.
- 1:45So great to be here pouring into your audience, Esther, and helping them to
- 1:49find fatigue freedom. Yes.
- 1:52So thank you for having me. I do love talking about that, even though we have
- 1:56to go back 21 years ago. So I'll try to make this very brief.
- 1:59But our daughter was sick for three years before we finally got a diagnosis,
- 2:04and it was not from conventional medicine.
- 2:07We actually wasted a lot of years' time, medications, poking, prodding, exams,
- 2:14And they could not find the root cause of why she was having severe migraines,
- 2:19skin conditions like eczema, psoriasis, and her gut was a mess.
- 2:24And every time I said, food has got to have something to do with this, right?
- 2:29Because I'm tracking. I was doing an elimination diet before I knew what that was.
- 2:34And every time they would say, feed this girl whatever she wants.
- 2:38She doesn't feel good. Food has nothing to do with it.
- 2:41Well, Esther, food had everything to do with it. Everything.
- 2:45And so the last straw, right, the last straw that broke this mama's back,
- 2:50right, was when I took her to another neurology appointment at the top,
- 2:56top neurology for children that our insurance would cover. We were seeing the best of the best.
- 3:03And they had no answers. And they said, perhaps something's going on at home
- 3:10she doesn't feel safe talking about.
- 3:12That was the last straw. I was like, I am done with conventional medicine.
- 3:17And I literally left the state, literally left the state and found a holistic provider.
- 3:23She was an herbalist. And she took one look at my daughter and knew that she
- 3:27had a serious food allergy.
- 3:30So 21 years ago, right? We know so much more now, but that really fueled my
- 3:38fire for holistic nutrition.
- 3:41Functional medicine and incorporating and integrating
- 3:44how food is medicine food is powerful and
- 3:47oh yes we need to be our own best advocate for our health because we don't need
- 3:53to be wasting three years we wasted three years she was sick for three years
- 3:57and no child nobody should go through that so that's what really got me started
- 4:04and fueled my fire yeah well and not
- 4:07only did they not find the answers, but they started blaming you,
- 4:10which I feel is just way too common.
- 4:13Like, oh, you know, everything's fine. I don't see what the problem is.
- 4:16So clearly you're the problem.
- 4:17Like how horrible and demeaning and just full of lies that is.
- 4:23And I'm so sorry that happened to you and your daughter.
- 4:26So you saw the holistic nutritionist or you said it was nutritionist, right?
- 4:30She was an herbalist. Okay. So what happened next? Did she like,
- 4:34how soon did your daughter have pain-free days?
- 4:38So this was the amazing ability, just a visual and real life experience of how
- 4:44the body has the ability to heal and recover when we give it the proper tools and support.
- 4:50Absolutely. God designed our bodies to heal.
- 4:53And so it was within a month of the protocol that we did with her gut and removing
- 4:59foods and gluten was a huge,
- 5:03huge, that was like She had a gluten allergy and all of those things and cleaned her up.
- 5:11Detoxing, all of that. Within a month, she was already like skin was clearing.
- 5:16She was acting more like herself.
- 5:18She also had failure to thrive, which is very common in gluten intolerant children.
- 5:24And so she's very tiny. I mean, she's still very tiny. She's only five feet tall.
- 5:29I just curiously, I wonder, I mean, I'm not very tall and five three,
- 5:33but I curiously, I wonder if that stunted her a little bit because it was three years.
- 5:38Within six months, she was our little girl again.
- 5:40She looked healthy, whereas before she did not look healthy.
- 5:45And she had the dark circles in her eyes. She was very pale and had no energy.
- 5:50Straight A student, but she would come home and fall apart.
- 5:54Yes. So I love that you recognize that the body is designed to heal.
- 5:59Like, yes, we have problems. Yes. When Adam and Eve sinned, one of the consequences
- 6:04was that there will be disease, there will be illness, there will be accidents, there will be death.
- 6:10But we don't have to accept that as the original design.
- 6:14Our bodies are designed to heal. So the people who are listening,
- 6:18most of them have autoimmune conditions like Hashimoto's, or they're listening
- 6:23to a friend or family member who does.
- 6:25So tell me your perspective when things go wrong and autoimmune strikes.
- 6:31What's your perspective on that? And then we're going to talk about high-functioning
- 6:35fatigue, which is so huge in the Hashimoto's world. But first,
- 6:40let's talk about autoimmunity and healing.
- 6:42Yeah, absolutely. Well, autoimmunity is very close to my heart,
- 6:47too, because that was my, I guess, first.
- 6:51Fatigue crisis where I realized how my Hashimoto's was greatly affecting me.
- 6:58I was not, again, 21 years ago with my daughter's story, things haven't changed much.
- 7:04Women are still getting dismissed, gas lit. And I hate to use that word, but it's very true.
- 7:09And, you know, women's health is being very much overlooked and women are being
- 7:14underserved, under heard, and just dismissed.
- 7:19And so, again, I had her journey.
- 7:22I had my own personal journey. And so I got to see firsthand when we are able
- 7:28to give the body what it needs, though, when we truly have that support,
- 7:32that support network like you or myself helping,
- 7:37then the body will be able to recover and heal and repair on a cellular level,
- 7:43which then helps to reduce all of those symptoms, all those autoimmune symptoms that you have.
- 7:49And a lot of women have fatigue, pain, sleeplessness, all of that sleep disorders
- 7:55or disordered sleep is what I call it.
- 7:58And so the body does have the ability to do that.
- 8:03The problem is, is our current medical model of healthcare is so broken.
- 8:09We don't have a healthcare system. We have a disease management system.
- 8:13And for our communities, right, Esther, our women are not, they're not taking that anymore.
- 8:20They're not taking that anymore. They want healing.
- 8:23They want remission.
- 8:25They want their Hashimoto's or autoimmune to be in remission,
- 8:28to go into remission and to be able to live their life pain-free,
- 8:33you know, with energy and restorative sleep and all of those things.
- 8:39Lower your stress response, all of that. And it can be done because the body wants to do that for you.
- 8:46It wants to heal. It wants to recover.
- 8:49We just need to know what it is for you because we're not one size fits all. We can't.
- 8:56We are so brilliantly designed and we're very individual.
- 9:00And God is a very personal God. And so I'm always bringing my clients back to
- 9:05talk to him. And what is he saying?
- 9:08And what does he say in his word? and how can we help your nervous system from
- 9:13a biblical perspective?
- 9:14And that's just one of the things that just automatically is coming up in conversation.
- 9:19Yeah, yeah. So if somebody doesn't believe as you do, like somebody doesn't
- 9:25believe the Bible or love Jesus, what do you say to those clients?
- 9:29Because I know you have clients like that too.
- 9:31For how they can heal? Yeah.
- 9:34Yeah, absolutely. Well, you know, I'll just say flat out, Like the body was
- 9:38designed to heal and recover, plain and simple.
- 9:41It was, you know, everything's attached.
- 9:43We cannot compartmentalize, which is what they were doing with my daughter.
- 9:46They were just focusing on her head, her migraines, but we cannot compartmentalize
- 9:51because it's all connected.
- 9:52You know, the analogy of the body that Paul, I believe, uses in the Bible is
- 9:59applicable for believers and non-believers because it just is. It just is.
- 10:05As we are all part of the body as believers, the body itself is all connected.
- 10:11You can't ignore other body systems and just focus on one.
- 10:14It doesn't work that way. You might get some improvement, but you're not going
- 10:18to get all over improvement.
- 10:21And this is why diets don't work, Esther, as you and I have talked about.
- 10:25Diets don't work because they are focusing on one thing and they're not focusing
- 10:29on the body as a whole. And so taking the body, mind, spirit approach,
- 10:36whether somebody is a believer or not, is really very important.
- 10:41Absolutely. I totally agree. Because, yeah, you can't divide it. You are one.
- 10:47Whether or not you believe what the Bible says, or you just look at science,
- 10:52because science is now showing that body, mind, and spirit, it's all connected. Absolutely.
- 10:58So let's talk about the high functioning fatigue that you have mentioned on your podcast.
- 11:03I have commented before on my podcast, it was one of the first things I noticed
- 11:08when I started talking to women with Hashimoto's, is everybody is wearing like
- 11:1375 different hats. Everybody is doing so many things.
- 11:17And yes, I know everybody is busy in general in our culture,
- 11:22but I felt like most of the women that I was talking to were even more so.
- 11:28They were in positions of leadership. They were in multiple different volunteer positions.
- 11:33It wasn't just like they were going and working and then doing the standard busy.
- 11:39It was above and beyond. So I really think that high-functioning part applies
- 11:46to so many women with Hashimoto's.
- 11:48So tell me more about that. Yeah, I agree.
- 11:51And because I was dealing with Hashimoto's while I was going through my fatigue
- 11:56crisis, one and two, you know, and burnout, like I totally lived this firsthand.
- 12:04And so what I helped myself through, I now help my clients walk through in the
- 12:09midlife health makeover.
- 12:10And that's what we do, right? Because then we've lived it.
- 12:14We know we experienced it. So, yeah, high functioning fatigue. It is exactly that.
- 12:19You know, women are pushing through, getting things done.
- 12:21They are putting themselves on the back burner.
- 12:24So they're putting other people first consistently, their job,
- 12:28their career, their family, their service, all of that at the expense of their
- 12:32own health. And they just think that that's normal because they've done that for so long. Yes.
- 12:39The problem is when we are 40 and dare I say even 35, this starts to begin because here's the thing.
- 12:46We are two thirds of the way sick before a diagnosis is even made.
- 12:51And you can look at your labs and you can see.
- 12:54Okay. From a functional perspective, right, you're looking at that and you're
- 12:59seeing a trend of where your body's been crying out for help and it's been ignored
- 13:04or dismissed because it's in conventional ranges.
- 13:07We are pushing through. We're getting things done. We're burning the midnight oil.
- 13:13We're doing things that are expected of us. We are saying yes when we should be saying no.
- 13:19We should be saying yes when we want to be. We're saying yes when we want to
- 13:22be saying no. So it's expectations that other people place on us,
- 13:27but then we also place on ourselves.
- 13:30We lie to ourselves all the time. Like, I'll rest when?
- 13:35I'll rest when? We talk to ourselves with such a negative, just really a not
- 13:41nice tone of voice in our mind. We would never talk to our daughters that way.
- 13:46We would never talk to our girlfriends or our sisters that way.
- 13:49But yet somehow it's okay because we've been doing this for our whole life or
- 13:55it's gotten worse or worse.
- 13:57It's been poured into us and we just kept up that commentary.
- 14:02That's a whole other conversation. But stress, trauma, all of that contributes
- 14:08to high-functioning fatigue because it's a buildup and it leads to burnout.
- 14:14So, you know, it's, again, wearing that smile on the outside while you're feeling
- 14:20like you're dying a little bit on the inside.
- 14:22And that was me because I was very much a people pleaser.
- 14:26I was a perfectionist. I had pushed through mindset and I had protection.
- 14:30So those are the four mindsets that I have found that women have that also are
- 14:36fighting high functioning fatigue. We've got this perfectionistic mindset where
- 14:41it has to be done a certain way and it has to be done with excellence.
- 14:44That's not necessarily a bad thing, but we got to tone it down,
- 14:49right? We got to bring that down a little bit.
- 14:51We've got the push through mindset where we're just constantly at our own expense
- 14:55pushing through. It doesn't matter. We'll rest later.
- 14:58We've got the protection where it's all us. It's all on us.
- 15:03We can't delegate because nobody can do it the way we do. You know,
- 15:08and it's we've got these mindsets that are just keeping us,
- 15:12in bondage, really. Really, that's what it is.
- 15:16It's keeping us in bondage and not living in the good health that God has designed for us.
- 15:22Somebody's listening and they're like, that's me. What's their next step?
- 15:25Well, the first step is recognizing it for sure. Yeah, you got to recognize
- 15:29it and you have to give yourself grace.
- 15:32You really need to give yourself grace. I talk to my clients about grace and
- 15:36grit because give yourself grace, but then have the grit as well to come alongside
- 15:41and help yourself get through.
- 15:44Our body needs to feel safe and secure to heal and recover.
- 15:49It absolutely has to. And this is why we can't compartmentalize.
- 15:53So just tactically, very tangibly,
- 15:59helping your body feel safe and secure is it goes a long way to helping reduce
- 16:05the overwhelm and the fatigue and the stress symptoms that you're feeling that
- 16:10are impacting your daily life and your sleep,
- 16:13your digestion, all of that.
- 16:15So these four ways are restorative stretch, and that's just moving your body.
- 16:21You know, when we're struggling with chronic fatigue, adrenal fatigue,
- 16:24Hashimoto's, whatever we're struggling with and we're in pain and we're exhausted.
- 16:30Exercise is not necessarily your best friend.
- 16:34And again, this is very individual. So I talk about restorative stretch while
- 16:39we are trying to help our body feel safe and secure.
- 16:42And then restorative breath, that deep breathing that so many women are neglectful.
- 16:48We shallow breathe all day long.
- 16:50And, you know, I find myself doing that too when I'm like back to back to back
- 16:54to back meetings. It's like, okay, I need to break away and have a five-minute
- 16:58reset and I'm just going to breathe.
- 17:00And, you know, outside, preferably, I love to be outside. right.
- 17:03That is going to help bring your body back into balance, help calm your nervous system a lot.
- 17:09And then those restorative thoughts, really reframing.
- 17:15It's so much more than reframing, but it's taking that Romans 12 to that biblical
- 17:20mindset around your thoughts.
- 17:22You know, you are renewing your mind.
- 17:25When a negative thought comes in, like, what does God say? Did God really say that?
- 17:29Because the enemy will put words into our mind, voices, like, right? Is it our mind?
- 17:35Is it our thought? Is it the enemy? Is that the Lord? You know,
- 17:39we need to restore our thoughts and getting back into the word or back into
- 17:44something that we've heard helps us to calm the noise in our mind too.
- 17:52And then of course, there's restorative nutrition, eating well.
- 17:56And I know you talk about that a lot because it's very critical in helping the
- 18:00body to feel safe and secure as well.
- 18:03Right. Yes. Oh, all four of those.
- 18:06Absolutely. 100% agree. On the way to school. So two of my kids go to a local charter school.
- 18:13One's graduated and the other's homeschooled. But on the way to town every morning
- 18:17so I can drop them off at the bus, they do soundtracks.
- 18:20And so that's from John Acuff. And he wrote a book where you turn down the noise
- 18:26on the negative things that you talk to yourself about.
- 18:30And then you turn up the new soundtracks and you replace those because you can
- 18:35choose what you're going to focus on.
- 18:38And so every morning, I've got a list and a lot of the new soundtracks that
- 18:44we have on this list, they're accompanied by a Bible verse because there's so much truth in the Bible.
- 18:50And I want the kids to know that, yes, we can have mantras, we can have sayings
- 18:56that we tell ourselves, but we want them rooted in truth.
- 18:59And I love that concept for women who are struggling with their self-talk.
- 19:06Because we all do, especially, like you said, we're perfectionists.
- 19:09We want everything to be done right, done well, done quickly.
- 19:14You know, that triangle of things that you can do, you can have it fast,
- 19:17you can have it well, well done and cheap.
- 19:21Like we want the full triangle and in everything we do and can't. Yeah, we're human.
- 19:29If we're going to do it really well, it might not be really fast.
- 19:33And that doesn't mean we failed.
- 19:35That's true. Yes. Yeah. So, so many things I love about those four different
- 19:40things that you mentioned.
- 19:42Absolutely. So, okay. So somebody heard themselves in your description of the
- 19:48high functioning fatigue, and now they've got the four things to do with the
- 19:51breathing, the stretching,
- 19:53the self-talk, and the nutrition, if they can pick one thing for this week to
- 20:01focus on, because you can't implement four things all at once,
- 20:06where are they going to start today?
- 20:10And then they can obviously come back to the podcast, they can listen to this
- 20:12episode, they can read the blog post, and they can come back and implement the next thing.
- 20:16But for today, where's the most impactful thing to start with?
- 20:20I would say restorative thoughts, because the women that I work with in the
- 20:26midlife health makeover are generally between 40 and 65 years of age.
- 20:31So that's a lifetime of negative thoughts, self-talk, treating ourselves poorly,
- 20:39mentally, and physically, emotionally.
- 20:42And so we want to restore our thoughts.
- 20:46We want to shift our mindset to that stronger mindset instead of the weaker mindset.
- 20:52Because then once we feel strong, it's like we need to be bold.
- 20:56We need to put on our boldness, right?
- 20:59And like, no, this is not.
- 21:02And as a believer, ask, did God really say that?
- 21:05Because chances are he didn't. If it's a negative thought, if it causes you
- 21:09stress and anxiety, if it makes you feel bad or shameful or doubtful,
- 21:14whatever, that is not of the Lord. Plain and simple, it's just not.
- 21:18And believe it or not, that is not of the Lord ever. He convicts, he does not condemn.
- 21:24And so I would say, let's start with restorative thoughts and let this practice
- 21:29of every morning as you get out of bed,
- 21:32you know you're you're just giving
- 21:35gratitude again whatever is
- 21:39coming to your mind at that moment that
- 21:42your body needs because a lot of this is intuitive what do i need because you
- 21:46know if you're not talking nice to yourself you know this you know this you
- 21:51know i said you dummy the other day to myself and i'm like no stop and you are
- 21:56not a dummy i don't i was kind of joking like You know,
- 22:00it was like, oh, I could have had a V8 moment.
- 22:03But it's just even those little, simple, silly things make a difference.
- 22:08What is it, Esther, they used to say for every one negative comment you say,
- 22:13you need to say five more to negate that one?
- 22:16Yeah. Yep. I've even heard 10. Yeah.
- 22:21It's so pivotal. It's so powerful. And here's the other thing about the whole
- 22:26nutrition and the breathing and the stretching and the hydration and all of
- 22:30the what I call seven essentials for optimal health.
- 22:34Once our mindset, when we feel calmer, the rest is easier to implement.
- 22:41Yes because if our mind is a jumble
- 22:44like i call it a squirrel's nest of anxiety and
- 22:47stress it's so much harder to follow that
- 22:51plan or follow that whatever that
- 22:55goal that we've set so i i would say restorative thoughts right and i love how
- 23:00you know you're starting with your thoughts but that's directly impacting everything
- 23:05so if somebody wants better physical health and they're still they're trying
- 23:10to bring it all together and recognize body, mind, spirit.
- 23:14But you said it's going to help the physical health too.
- 23:18So yes, it's in your head. It's in your mind. You're thinking those thoughts.
- 23:23It's absolutely impacting your physical health as well as everything else.
- 23:28Absolutely. Yeah. Yes. Awesome. So tell the listeners where they can find you
- 23:33and connect and learn more if they want to?
- 23:36The best thing to do is follow the podcast, Treasured Wellness Podcast.
- 23:40And that would be easiest. It's wherever you listen to podcasts.
- 23:44And then you can also check out the website, treasuredwellness.com.
- 23:48But yeah, come over and hang out with the Treasured Wellness family community
- 23:53and join us on the podcast.
- 23:55Awesome. Thank you so much, Michelle. And now the disclaimer.
- 23:58This podcast is for informational and educational purposes only.
- 24:02Please discuss any changes with your trusted healthcare provider.
- 24:05To take your next step, join our school community and explore the courses available there.
- 24:09You do not have to figure your health out alone.
- 24:12So that is school, S-K-O-O-L dot com, and it is the Health with Hashimoto's community.
- 24:18I'll see you next time on the Health with Hashimoto's.