Latest / Imagine If with Doone Roisin | Health, Wealth & Wisdom for Women (formerly Female Startup Club Podcast) / Fave Hits: How to get a $100,000 order with retailers like Net-A-Porter, with Liv Koennecke from Maison Essentiele (Part 1)

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Fave Hits: How to get a $100,000 order with retailers like Net-A-Porter, with Liv Koennecke from Maison Essentiele (Part 1) · Imagine If with Doone Roisin | Health, Wealth & Wisdom for Women (formerly Female Startup Club Podcast)

• 0:00
  Hey there, I'm recording this quick message to let you know that for the next few episodes, we'll be playing some of our favorite hits from the past year while we knuckle down on some very new exciting things we have in the works. If you miss these the first time around, they are so good and packed with so many learnings. And if you love them, remember to share with us on social media because we love it when you do that. Enjoy. This is Live Kinecki for Female Startup Club.
• 0:38
  Hey everyone, welcome back. It's Dune here, your host and hype girl. Today on the show, we are learning from Liv Konecki, founder of luxury pajamas brand, Mason Essential. If you're in the fashion industry, this is such an amazing deep dive on things you should be considering when it comes to capital, how to go about getting a retailer like Net-A-Porter or Bloomingdale's, and thoughts behind gifting high-priced products to influencers.
• 1:07
  Mason Essential creates luxury home essentials for your daily rituals of sleep, lounge, and self-care.
• 1:15
  Now, while I've got you here, I'd love to ask anyone that's new around here a big favor. If you're listening in on the Apple Podcast app and you have a quick moment right now, would you please hop into the main feed of all the Female Startup Club episodes and scroll to the very, very bottom and leave us a cheeky five-star review?
• 1:38
  You might have heard me say this before, but this is truly what helps us find new ears and it is so, so, so important to indie creators like me. So if you haven't already done so and you're a fan of the podcast, I will be forever grateful to you. And also, while I'm at it, leave your other favorite podcasters a review too. It really goes a long way and it's a real mood booster to read the reviews back.
• 2:04
  But that's all from me. Let's get stuck into this episode. It is a real cracker. This is Liv for Female Startup Club. Liv, hello. Welcome to the Female Startup Club podcast. Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to be here.
• 2:21
  I'm so excited to be here too. I wanted to give everyone a little bit of context because, you know, why not? As all good friendships start, I feel like we, like so many other people these days, met online because you had supplied one of my favorite girlfriend's bridal outfits for her wedding. And then we got to chatting somehow, and that then somehow led to us catching up in 2019. And.
• 2:50
  And now here we are having you on the show, which I'm so excited about. Love this for us. So good. And it's been so great to watch. You know, I'm such a fan of the podcast and watch it grow, you know, and it's just, yeah, and I'm so, I guess, flattered and grateful to be a guest on it. So thank you for having me.
• 3:11
  Well, thank you so much. Okay. So for everyone listening, you have the most beautiful silk pajama company that's really been taking off in the last couple of years and you're stocked in all the cool places, which we're definitely going to get into a bit later in the show, especially around how to get stocked in Net-a-Porter. But how do you usually introduce yourself and what your brand is? What's your elevator pitch? Yeah.
• 3:37
  Yeah, sure. So I'm Liv. I'm the founder of Mason Essential. We create premium sleep and loungewear and around, you know, that kind of whole idea of luxury self-care at home. So it's kind of an ever-changing thing, isn't it? How you introduce yourself. But at the moment, that's what I say.
• 3:56
  Love it. Love a bit of luxury in my life. Let's go back to the very beginning. I want to understand where you were at in your life when you decided to start a business in the fashion space. Obviously, it's highly competitive. It's highly saturated. What got you thinking about pajamas and getting started?
• 4:17
  Yeah, for sure. Looking back, it's really interesting because I feel like, you know, I've heard a lot of life coaches and things say recently, you know, when you think about what you should be doing as a career, you should look at what you did when you were a child. And when I was a child, I was doing lemonade stands. I was door knocking, like selling my arts and crafts to all my neighbors, like trying to make them buy like my little trauma beads and stuff. And,
• 4:40
  I even pitched like a whole bunch of ideas to my school principal when I was in junior school to like do different events at school. God knows who gave me the like who gave me the appointment of his poor principal's time because I was just always in there. And I really feel like I've just always been really passionate about that kind of business space. Fast forwarding into my high school years, you know, like any girl, I was, you know, quite interested in fashion. And that really kind of, I guess, started my passion for fashion.
• 5:08
  the real business side as well as the creative side of the fashion industry. I was, you know, my favorite publication growing up to read was the Business of Fashion in high school. You know, I had a Tumblr. I was quite an early adopter of social media, like all those types of things. You know, that real 90s kid nostalgia. And then, you know, kind of after school, I had a vintage fashion label. I used to sell it at local markets.
• 5:36
  And then moving into my career, you know, kind of tertiary wise, I studied marketing. I got my first job in marketing when I was 19. I was always like a big doer. Like I just wanted to get in there. So I was working full time from 19. I was chosen to be part of the ASOS program.
• 5:57
  student brand ambassador program. So I was one of 20. One of the other girls in the group was Maeva, who I know you've had on the show before, the founder of Bread. Oh, that's so cool. Yeah. And then I moved to Sydney and worked for a number of different fashion brands. And I worked for a big PR agency in fashion. And then I actually moved in-house for Calvin Klein and Tommy Hilfiger doing all their kind of PR. So I guess that's kind of my career to date before I
• 6:26
  And then when I was at PVH, I, you know, had moved to Sydney, was living in Sydney. I'm originally from Adelaide. And I went back one weekend to stay with my grandparents. And just this particular weekend, I had forgotten to pack my pajamas. So my grandma had laid out this robe and this like kind of silk nightgown. She has this really beautiful range of, you know, vintage silk nightgowns and robes.
• 6:50
  And, you know, we really used to bond over vintage shopping together when I had my own little business and stuff. So she had laid this out for me to wear. And I was like, kind of not sure on that. Usually, you know, more of a trackies gal, but, you know, we'll give it a go.
• 7:05
  I ended up wearing it and it was just such a beautiful experience. It just felt so nice. I just felt like I was really doing something that was really, you know, kind of a very self-care moment for myself, like, you know, doing a mask or having a bath or whatever. It just, it was a really, I just remember it just feeling so nice. And the next morning I, you know, stayed in it until like 11. Cause I was just like, I just love this. Like, I just want to, I want to stay in this.
• 7:28
  So I came back to Sydney and I was hooked and I was like, where can I get myself some nice pajamas? And obviously I was already working for a fashion brand. I knew about what was kind of, you know, on the market for the brands I was working for. And I spoke to my friends and everyone was kind of like, I don't actually really know. You know, I went on to, you know, your net-a-porters and your matches and all the silk pieces that I was really interested in were, you know, $800 or $900 a set.
• 7:56
  which was not in my budget. And on the other end of the spectrum was, you know, your more kind of mid-tier fast fashion brands. Everything had, you know, gimmicky designs or maybe it was made out of a lower quality material. And so I guess that was my moment where I was like, something's missing. And, you know, that aha moment people talk about, that was definitely mine for Mason Essential. Oh my gosh. So it was all on from there. You, the doer, were ready to take some action. What did you do?
• 8:26
  Yeah, I mean, I honestly was hooked. I always knew that I wanted to have my own business eventually and in the fashion space, but I just didn't know what that looked like. You know, I'm not traditionally a designer and I have this, you know, great kind of career in the marketing business space, but I just...
• 8:44
  Knew that eventually that's where I wanted to be, but just wasn't sure, you know, how I was going to get there. So when I had this moment, you know, I realized that there was a lot of roles I needed to fill that I had no experience with doing. So I think it actually took about almost two years for me from this idea, conception to like a soft launch of Mason Essential. And during that time, I just basically dove in and educated myself on everything from materials, fit, design, design.
• 9:12
  you know, trying to find manufacturers, everything that you would probably need to kind of just get that initial sample range done. I spent that two years just really perfecting that process. So that was kind of, I guess, how Mason Essential was born. And yeah, just I started it with three credit cards, very high interest credit cards in my bedroom. And yeah, just haven't really stopped since.
• 9:41
  Gosh, what kind of capital do you actually need to start a fashion brand? Like for someone who's maybe just entering the space and doesn't kind of have all the knowledge yet about starting a fashion brand. I know you said you had three credit cards, but like, what does that actually look like? How much kind of capital did you need to build out your samples to get your first order, to get your website up and running, like all that kind of stuff?
• 10:07
  Yeah, for sure. So when I started Mason Essential, I actually envisioned it as more of a direct-to-consumer company. You know, being that kind of brand, like, you know, fan and brand nerd that I am with, you know, that whole kind of space. I had seen the success of other big, you know, scaled direct-to-consumer businesses in the U.S. And I really wanted to try and, I guess, emulate that kind of a strategy for Mason Essential.
• 10:32
  So, you know, being the ripe old age of 24, I went out and just cold pitched to angel investors on LinkedIn. I would literally just Google or, you know, not Google search and LinkedIn angel investor and try and find people that had had previous retail experience and just honestly pitch them my idea. So I ended up meeting with a few investors who, for whatever reason, decided to entertain me.
• 10:57
  And, you know, and basically, you know, they were like, look, we're really impressed by your passion and your vision for the brand. But, you know, you haven't run a company before. You don't have any, you know, any partners or staff, et cetera. There's still a lot of gaps that need to be filled here. And, you know, build something first, get some traction. And then I would suggest maybe kind of, you know, looking for investment post that.
• 11:26
  And I guess, you know, that was really, really difficult for me because I didn't have any money to put into the business. I just knew that this is what I wanted to do and I knew that, you know, I was on to something. You know, I think going into Mason Essentials,
• 11:41
  Because I'm from the business background, I really started with a commercial mindset. And I think that's what's really key in this whole idea of building a fashion brand is, you know, of course, design and the creativity side is equally as important.
• 11:57
  I went into this business knowing that sleepwear is one of the fastest growing categories in fashion, that it was a fragmented space with something missing for someone like me as a customer. I couldn't find what I was looking for on the market, which was a high quality product within my price range with, you know, kind of stylish options.
• 12:16
  Um, and I, uh, basically, you know, knew that there was, yeah, there was that gap in the market. So although I wasn't able to secure that investor, I learned a lot through having to put together that pitch and going in with that commercial mindset, which has honestly really lent, um, into things that I've ended up doing, um, you know, to this day. And I'm honestly so grateful that I wasn't able to secure that investment because, you know, um, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I,
• 12:45
  At the time, I think I was asking for something really small. Like I was in conversation with somebody about $50,000 or something. Whereas, you know, now anyone that runs like a company knows that something like $50,000 is just a drop in the ocean. So not only am I so thankful that that didn't come off, but because I had no capital to work with, it has always made me have a really lean operating, you know, way of operating and.
• 13:13
  I've always had to be really savvy with my money and I've had to become really creative with the ways that I have done what I've done. And I think that's probably my biggest lesson that I could pass on to other business owners is that you actually, to begin with, don't need a huge amount of money. Of course it helps, but what are we talking here? Like what's the, what do you need to get started?
• 13:38
  So for example, you know, things like for me personally, things like doing a logo or doing a website or, you know, designing some packaging, et cetera. There are so many great tools that you can use right now that are so much lower cost. So for example, when I did my logo, I ended up working with a young up and coming graphic designer on Instagram that I found that was, you know, a lot more cost efficient than the packages I was receiving from agencies that were tens of thousands of dollars.
• 14:08
  When I've designed my packaging, I've worked using, you know, different outsourcing websites. So ones like Fiverr or ones like Upwork, et cetera, to find people who are experts in things like fashion illustration or graphic design who are able to help me put together those technical sketches or design a print for me or something. Yeah.
• 14:32
  Because although I didn't have those skills, you know, these people possess them. And sometimes they just do this as a side hustle, trying to earn a little bit of extra money. And I was able to just pay, you know, by the hour or by the project, you know, a lot smaller amounts rather than hiring a team, hiring an in-house designer or paying an agency to do a big, you know, branding project for me, etc. Yeah.
• 14:56
  So totally starting small, keeping it scrappy, keeping it lean. I love that. And I think starting within your means is like something that,
• 15:05
  Of course, you want to go for all the bells and whistles. Of course, it would be great to have a team. But actually, by starting small and being scrappy, you learn so much faster. You learn so much about every aspect of the business. And I think it sets you up for greater success and a greater foundation down the track when you are able to start hiring a team and when you are able to start bringing people in to do those things for you.
• 15:29
  I want to lead into launch and what kind of marketing initiatives you were doing in those early days to kind of get your first, I don't know, few hundred or first thousand customers, say, and kind of building that early base.
• 15:45
  Yeah, for sure. So going with that same kind of just start attitude from the beginning, I set up social media accounts. That was really key for me. I find that a lot of people think, you know, oh, but if I start something now, like I'm worried it's not going to, you know, I'm scared of, you know, what the products or what my images are going to look like now versus what I want them to be, et cetera.
• 16:07
  you know, as a business now, four years in my imagery still isn't where I want it to be. My, you know, things are always, you're always going to want more. So for me, I was just really gung ho about setting up things. Like at the time, Instagram was, was the main platform.
• 16:22
  And I was already building out that aesthetic on the page. So, you know, we had a lot of inspirational photos and, you know, kind of just honestly, yeah, just aesthetic images that we grew this, this really organic, I guess, fan base of people that just really was like those types of images, you know, back when that was really, you know, the main thing Instagram was used for.
• 16:46
  So pre-launch, I think we already had about 5,000 followers just from people that, you know, were along for the ride because they liked that kind of aesthetic that we had started to create. And that was a really powerful tool because, you know, then even when I started to eventually reach out to influencers or retailers or buyers, etc.,
• 17:06
  You know, I might not have had fantastic imagery yet of my product, but I did have, you know, they could already understand my aesthetic just from looking at that. And a lot of the time they look it up and be like, oh, wow, you have such a beautiful Instagram. You know, this really fits into, you know, leans into our category or our customer. So being able to build that up just really organically before we even started with product was really key for us.
• 17:33
  And then we just had a Shopify account and we still use Shopify. That was honestly, you know, it turns down, I think, the best one for e-commerce. And, you know, I just built everything kind of myself in Shopify and use all of the marketing tools in Shopify. And, yeah, it just went from there.
• 17:53
  And when you kind of got to that point where you were ready to launch, what are the things that you were doing to find your customers and find the people to actually like building on that, building on that fan base that you'd built on Instagram and having everything set up? How are you going about finding your customers and getting those sales, you know, especially in the beginning when...
• 18:13
  it's really hard to convince someone to buy from a brand they don't know about or they haven't seen before, you know, getting people to, you know, even come to your website, that kind of thing. What were you doing in those early days? Well, I think even similar to you, Dune, is honestly just seeding product to people that were brand, genuine brand fans. You know, I think for us,
• 18:36
  not having any marketing budget, you know, to this day, actually, we've barely spent anything on marketing. We've had, you know, over, you know, I think it's something like 20 million media impressions worldwide, you know, over 200 million, you know, kind of Instagram impressions with different influences. And that really grassroot approach was key for us. You know, I would see anyone that would be interested in the brand.
• 19:03
  genuinely interested. You know, I wouldn't gift someone that I knew was really popular and just hope for the best. I mean, starting that dialogue, that engagement, reaching out to them and, you know, seeing if that was something they were interested in, whether they were an influencer or...
• 19:22
  or whether they were a buyer of a brand or a friend of a buyer or a friend of an influencer, anyone that was kind of, you know, look like that it was something that they might be interested in. It was that real grassroots approach, you know, that led to, and I think that's key is that sometimes people think when you gift someone for, from on social media, that the key is content, you know, and having them repost.
• 19:50
  Yes, that is one definite great thing about, you know, gifting influences or gifting people of influence on social media. But it's also that organic approach that, you know, they might not necessarily post about it, but they might tell their friends about it. Or they might, you know, next time one of their friends is getting married, they might end up wearing it for their bridal party.
• 20:09
  Or, you know, if they, you know, and it just kind of goes from there. I think we just honestly gifted anyone that was interested in the brand and just kind of the rest fell into place.
• 20:22
  I think that's so important what you've touched on with influencers because it's so true. Just because someone doesn't post or do kind of what you expect or what you want to happen doesn't mean that it's still not working in the background and someone's still not passing on that they had this amazing experience with this brand and, you know, highly recommend and check it out. Exactly. Exactly.
• 20:44
  Something I'm wondering about, what is like your thoughts around, obviously gifting a product that is a higher price point, it's expensive, right? Like you have to be able to have the budget to be able to gift that kind of thing. So for the people who are listening being like, oh my God, I can't give out that product. Like, you know, it costs so much. What would you recommend in that case? Like whether it's, you know,
• 21:06
  In the beginning, how many pieces were you giving out a month? Or how did you make it feel okay to be able to give out a high price point product? It's definitely so hard. But I guess the way I always looked at it was that
• 21:21
  the ROI to gift them and potentially, you know, either get content or get those relationships, et cetera, versus if I was to pay someone, pay an influencer to post about something, pay a sales agent to connect me with a buyer, et cetera, was going to be so much more expensive. So let's say, for example, I might've ended up spending $500 on gifting and
• 21:42
  But if I had paid an influencer who ended up posting, that might have costed me, you know, two and a half thousand to five thousand. So for me, it was an easy pill to swallow being able to let go of that price. I think as well, you know, as a new brand, I was working with.
• 21:59
  manufacturers who require minimums. And although I have a manufacturer that, you know, is quite, or I have a few manufacturers that are quite good with, with minimums, you know, there always is some. And as a new brand, you're just simply not going to get through that stock. And I think that's another thing as well as that people think, you know, all right, I'm going to order a hundred pieces of something and we're going to have an a hundred percent sell through. A hundred percent sell through doesn't often exist. It's,
• 22:28
  whether it be just kind of, you know, off sizes or what have you, or maybe something's not as popular as another style, which you end up restocking, you always have some sort of leftover. So, you know, in that instance, I would use that product as if it was a style that we might have been
• 22:46
  you know, have a few random sizes of, or I had to, you know, meet minimums. It was just easier and more cost efficient for me to take that product and use it for marketing than it was to pay for an agency to do that for me. When you have gifting now, and obviously you're a few years in, you're established, that kind of thing. But if you were to have just say a hundred, because it's an easy number, a hundred units, what would you dedicate out of a hundred units
• 23:16
  Maybe 20. 20%. Oh, wow. Okay. So it's quite high. Cool. Amazing. Wow. I think it's important. You know, I just, I just, I just made, I just made that number up, but I think it's important. Usually actually, no, I'll take that back. Usually rule of thumb, I say 10% of, um, you should always spend 10% of your revenue on marketing initiatives. So when I'm talking about that, if I got, and of course it always fluctuates depending on what the opportunity is, but I'm
• 23:44
  If I got an order from, let's say, Net-A-Porter, again, let's just say it's a round number. I'll say $100,000. I would probably try and dedicate $10,000 towards marketing that goes specifically towards Net-A-Porter's buy. So I think 10% is my general rule of thumb.
• 24:07
  Okay. This leads us into, it's a great segue into Net-A-Porter and your retail strategy. Obviously over the last few years, you've kind of secured these amazing brands like Net-A-Porter and Bloomingdale's. And I'm sure so many in Australia that are the it kind of dream places for someone in fashion to get stocked in.
• 24:30
  What is your kind of strategy and approach to that? And what advice do you have for other founders listening who have that same goal?
• 24:40
  Yeah, for sure. I have a few things to say about this. So thank you for bringing it up. So I think it comes back to, again, what I was talking about that I went into owning a fashion brand or starting a fashion brand being really commercially minded. So I knew that this was an area where there was a gap in the market and there was a niche. And I knew that this is the product that I could fill. So when you go into somewhere like Net-A-Porter, for example, you're going to
• 25:05
  You can go into, say, the ready-to-wear section. You're going to be flooded with over 1,000, if not 2,000, different options for every category, whether it's tops, pants, swim. Not to say that you couldn't succeed in those areas, but just as an example. But you go into sleepwear and there's about 150 to 300 options at any one time. So I knew, for example, that there was already a gap where I could be filling. I was never trying to go in being like, you know,
• 25:34
  for the races that was also the same price point and the same style and the same design as many other brands on the market because there wasn't that niche that was really going to be able to help capture those buyers because the buyers at the end of the day are trying to provide their customers with, you know, some variety and, you know, fill those gaps. And I felt that Mason Essential really did.
• 25:59
  Um, so going into it, I was very commercially minded and my advice to others would be to really find out what your niche is. If that's for fashion, you know, um, that might be, you have an idea for swim. Okay. So what about your swim is going to be, um, you know, really interesting for these buyers to want to take it on.
• 26:19
  Is it, you know, really sustainable, but also really, really luxe? Is it, you know, more towards plus size? Do you do a number of different ranges of skin tone, you know, nude underwear? You know, these are all just ideas I have at the top of my head. But, you know, really finding that niche I find to get their interest is key.
• 26:40
  And then also understanding your customer. You know, I always knew that somewhere like Net-A-Porter was where I wanted to be. And coming back to your idea of my price point, my price point was very strategic in that we provide the highest quality silk and linen garments on the market.
• 26:56
  So when I'm talking about that, the silk is quality 6A, which is the highest quality in a 19 mum, which is that really nice lustrous thickness. It's not sheer when you wear it. And we use European linens, everything's certified sustainable, but it's for a better price than what was on the market already.
• 27:17
  Now, if I was starting a brand, you could think, oh, well, I'll price it what the other competitors are priced at, because that seems like, you know, a good ballpark. Whereas I was very, very conscious that I wanted mine to be, you know, slightly more accessible because it's really worked for us in terms of, you know, offering that extra thing to the customer.
• 27:37
  Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And then in terms of how I actually landed those accounts, you know, I'd already worked in the industry for some time before I started Mason Essential. Starting working in marketing from so young, I was 19 and, you know, I started in fashion in Sydney when I was 22. You know, I'd spent a lot of years really building up those connections and my database of, you know, of friends and professionals in the industry that I could reach out to.
• 28:07
  So when I was in a position where I started Mason Essential and I was looking at wholesale, you know, I would unapologetically talk to anyone that would listen about the brand. And that I feel is a really scary thing for a lot of people to actually put yourself out there. And, you know, especially when you care so passionately and so deeply about this, that somebody's opinion might not reflect, you know, your passion for the business, but
• 28:30
  I hear that a lot, basically, you know, people are like, oh, but I'm scared about talking to people about it. But I would talk to anyone that would listen because, you know, you never know where that's going to lead you. And through my network of connections, I was able to meet with this new agency that was opening up in Australia or that had opened up in Australia in fashion. And when I met with them, you know...
• 28:54
  The only reason I even got that meeting was because of the connections I had built over those years, firstly. And secondly, being in that niche, they didn't have a sleepwear brand that they were currently representing. You know, they had many ready-to-wear brands. They had many brands in, you know, jewelry or bags, etc.,
• 29:12
  but not one for sleep. And I basically was able to pitch it like, you guys are also in sales. You're also commercially minded. Sleep was the fastest growing category. Selfridges increased their floor space by X percent last year and you sold to selfridges. You know, if you're looking from a sales perspective and you work on commission, don't you want to be part of a category that's, you know, so, you know, that's growing so quickly? Yeah.
• 29:36
  And I think, you know, not only having that mutual friend, but also being able to talk in that kind of capacity with them. They weren't, they still weren't 100% convinced, you know, but they were like, okay, this could potentially have legs. And from there, they actually took my brand with them to their showings in New York.
• 29:57
  I was, it was only to test it. And, you know, I paid for, for, for my brand to be part of that, which usually they only take brands they have under, under their, their wing, but this was just like a one-off test and it went really well. And they had some really fantastic responses from buyers. And yeah, after that, I was able to get picked up by, by their, them as an agency. And I was also, which is what has led me to, to, to land these amazing accounts.
• 30:26
  Okay, right. So when you say agency, you kind of mean like they basically take your brand and pitch it out to everyone. You're not going to an individual retailer and pitching it out. Okay, right. And so for example, how much did you have to pay them to get them to take your brand to New York to the showing? I can't remember the exact amount, but I want to say it was...
• 30:51
  So it was all that I was paying for was their floor space and yet them to them to take on this one one off thing. And I think it might have been about five grand, five thousand dollars Australian, which for me at the time was a lot of money. You know, I was nearly starting out. I just left my job.
• 31:08
  you know, everything else. But I really felt strongly that this was the right thing to do. And yes, you're right. So Mason Essential works that we are with a sales agency. So what that means for people not in fashion is like you have a PR agency, we have a wholesale agency, and they look after a myriad of Australian and New Zealand brands.
• 31:30
  and pitch them out to their network of buyers. And they hold showings seasonally, quarterly, all over the world. So they do Paris, New York, Sydney, basically internationally. And they help me secure these accounts. Got it.
• 31:48
  Yeah. So the reason this was really, I guess, appealing to me doing it this way is that they have great relationships with these buyers. So, you know, buyers like media are inundated with pitches all the time from different brands, but having this authority, this trusted authority that is this agency that they know on a personal level,
• 32:10
  was really key to getting their attention. You know, I tried myself to pitch it a number of times, but I just didn't have those personal relationships. So from that perspective, it was really good. And the second thing was that it allowed me to be aligned with the other brands that they represented.
• 32:28
  So you might not have known Mason Essential, but you might have known other brands that they had under their wing. Or the buyer might have come in particularly to see another brand that they represent. And in that process, they were able to be like, while you're here, let us show you Mason Essential. And I feel like that was really, really important because, you know,
• 32:49
  going in as a no one brand with no connections and being based in Australia, you know, being able to be aligned with these other brands that already existed, that they already stopped and that they already knew were trusted, you know, kind of in the fashion space was really, really key and just was kind of able to give it that immediate, that immediate, I guess, yeah, brand authority that we were missing. Yeah.
• 33:16
  Yeah, I totally get that. And that makes so much sense. You said something a moment ago, also relating to Net-A-Porter that I want to dig a little deeper into. You said that they, you know, might place an order for say like $100,000. Is that typically like ballpark where a retailer like Net-A-Porter would be spending on an order? And there's a follow-up question to it, but just to paint a picture. Yeah.
• 33:39
  Yeah, sure. I mean, I'm still learning in terms of what a ballpark order is because it changes seasonally. But from what I understand and the way that, you know, the fashion space works is that per year, a buyer has a certain amount of budget to spend.
• 33:56
  or per season, a buyer has a certain amount of budget to spend. And how they split that up between their brands is kind of up to them based on their data. Now, when I was, before I was in this kind of more, before I had my own brand, I thought that buyers were just buying what they like.
• 34:14
  I thought they were like, oh, wow, I love this top. We should stock this top at Net-A-Porter, you know. But from now what I understand is that it's actually a lot more data-driven than that. It's based on previous trends, what's done really well, you know, in terms of sales, et cetera. And that kind of provides them with the framework of how they buy for the next season. Yeah.
• 34:37
  So in terms of the size of the buy, it changes seasonally. But I would say for someone like Netter Porter, yeah, it would usually be around anywhere between 50 to 120,000 Australian. Other larger retailers actually like to start a lot smaller.
• 34:55
  You know, it might only be a $10,000 or a $15,000 Australian order, sorry, US dollar order to test the waters. But someone like Netoporter require a lot of volume. So, yeah, it's usually around that. Yeah.
• 35:10
  So keeping that in mind then as a small business owner, as a small brand, if you have an order coming in from Net-A-Porter, you have one coming in from Bloomingdale's, you have one coming in from XYZ, 10 retailers later, you obviously have to pay your manufacturer up front that huge amount of money and your payment terms are probably, I imagine, 60 to 90 days if they're good at paying. Maybe it's a little bit longer. Maybe you've negotiated a little bit less. Yeah.
• 35:39
  But my point being, how do you fund the business when you're going into this retail, like wholesale strategy? Because it's, it's a lot, right? Like, especially if you are winning a lot of accounts, you need to have working capital. So I'm wanting to understand like how you do that and, you know, what your insights and learnings are now that you're at that point where this is happening, or I assume this is happening to you. Yeah, definitely. Yeah.
• 36:05
  So I think going into all of this, I was quite naive. You know, even when I signed with my agency, you know, they said to me, look, if matches, well, I'm not on matches, but they said, if matches put in a $300,000 order, would you be able to fund that? And I just said, yes, absolutely. You know, because...
• 36:24
  In the moment, like, you know, you're not going to say no when you're asked these types of questions. It's kind of like a test. And so I've always kind of been a yes person and a doer and, you know, you kind of make it up along the way. But when I was actually faced with this exact situation, you know, I went into the season saying and we had decided that we would offer payment terms of 50% upfront, 50% on delivery.
• 36:50
  Now, that was going to be enough to cover my manufacturing costs and then deliver the product. And then they would, you know, pay the rest on delivery.
• 37:02
  Going into larger retailers, obviously they have their own ways of working and they were like, that's nice, sweetie, but we do it this way. And so I quickly learned that wasn't going to be sustainable. I most definitely try different retailers require different payment terms and I most definitely try to dictate the value.
• 37:23
  payment terms of 50% upfront, 50% on delivery, because it does help with my cash flow. But you're correct in saying, you know, some will have, you know, you manufacture and then it takes you three months to manufacture, takes you two weeks to ship, and then they don't pay you until they get the goods 60 days after. So sometimes you're left out of pocket for up to six months, which is just crazy, especially as a new brand.
• 37:51
  That is when capital would really come in handy. But for me, that wasn't an option and something that I wasn't able to secure. And, you know, in the moment I was already in amongst getting these incredible dream opportunities. So I just said, yes, I just said, yes, I can do it. And then was left with trying to figure out the rest later. Um, yeah.
• 38:16
  I've developed a really great relationship with my manufacturer where we have payment terms now. And I think that's really key for people trying to, you know, build a business or build a fashion brand is you immediately when you're looking for a manufacturer, you want to ask them the questions. What are your minimum unit quantities?
• 38:36
  Because some might say a thousand and for a new brand, that's just not something that you should take part in because you're not going to be able to move a thousand units of stock, you know, per style, per color.
• 38:48
  And so finding a manufacturer that will allow you to do flexible units as well as payment terms. So I'm now in a position where our payment terms, I pay only 20% upfront and that has really helped with cash flow. But these are all things that I feel like you don't learn until you're really in the thick of it. You know, you don't think of these things.
• 39:12
  So yeah, definitely trying to negotiate those terms with your manufacturer before engaging with them and then finding out, you know, after you've done your sample round, once you already have retailer orders, you go back to your manufacturer, you're like, okay, great. Can we, can we manufacture this? And they're like, yeah, sure. A hundred percent upfront. You're going to be in a, in a real tight spot. So finding that out upfront, I find is key.
• 39:40
  Yeah, that's a really great insight. And I think that's a really great piece of advice just for anyone, I guess, across different industries as well. It's a really great thing to keep in mind when you're choosing a manufacturer and when you're choosing who to produce your products with. Where are you now with the brand? What fun, exciting things can you shout about?
• 40:10
  And we are launching into a number of new retailers internationally over the coming months. So we're launching into Simmons in Canada. We're launching into the Undone here in Australia. We are launching into Shopbop in the US. And yeah, so I think there's a lot of international expansion that's continuing to happen for the brand, which is super exciting. Yeah.
• 40:38
  We are also talking about bringing out a few other categories for the business. Still around the idea of sleep and, you know, it's really important for the brand to continue to solidify itself as, you know, that premium authority for sleep and lounge. But, you know, kind of starting to look at accessories or men's or overnight bags, etc. So watch this space from a design perspective as well. And yeah, I think just those are probably the main things, to be honest.
• 41:08
  So exciting. Gosh, love that for you. How cool. So many great names there. Wowee.
• 41:20
  Hey, it's June here. Thanks for listening to this amazing episode of the Female Startup Club podcast. If you're a fan of the show and want even more of the good stuff, I'd recommend checking out femalestartupclub.com where you can subscribe to our free newsletter. We send it out weekly covering female founder business news, insights and learnings in D2C, and interesting business resources.
• 41:45
  And if you're a founder building an e-commerce brand, you can join our private network of entrepreneurs called Hype Club at femalestartupclub.com forward slash Hype Club. We have guests from the show joining us for intimate Ask Me Anythings, expert workshops, and a group of totally amazing, like-minded women building the future of D2C brands.
• 42:07
  As always, please do subscribe, rate and review the show and post your favorite episodes to Instagram stories. I am beyond grateful when you do that.
• 42:23
  Hey, it's Dune here. Thanks for listening to this amazing episode of the Female Startup Club podcast. If you're a fan of the show and want even more of the good stuff, I'd recommend checking out femalestartupclub.com where you can subscribe to our free newsletter. We send it out weekly covering female founder business news, insights and learnings in D2C, and interesting business resources.
• 42:47
  And if you're a founder building an e-commerce brand, you can join our private network of entrepreneurs called Hype Club at femalestartupclub.com forward slash Hype Club. We have guests from the show joining us for intimate Ask Me Anythings, expert workshops, and a group of totally amazing, like-minded women building the future of D2C brands.
• 43:10
  As always, please do subscribe, rate and review the show and post your favorite episodes to Instagram stories. I am beyond grateful when you do that.