Latest / Reasonably Happy with Paul Ollinger / The Beatles, Ted Turner, and Ric Flair with Steve Chamberlain

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The Beatles, Ted Turner, and Ric Flair with Steve Chamberlain · Reasonably Happy with Paul Ollinger

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Hello, everybody.
• 0:01
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome back to Reasonably Happy.
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_01: My name is Paul Allinger.
• 0:03
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for being here today.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_01: My guest this week is Steve Chamberlain,
• 0:07
  a former media executive whose career has intersected with some
• 0:10
  of the biggest
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_01: brands and celebrities in entertainment history.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_01: Steve started out as a local television news reporter in
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_01: the bustling metropolis of Biloxi,
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_01: Mississippi,
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_01: but redirected his talents toward the business side of media,
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_01: eventually landing at a Young Turner Broadcasting in Atlanta,
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_01: Georgia,
• 0:28
  eventually landing at a Young Turner Broadcasting where he ran
• 0:31
  Turner Home
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_01: Entertainment and oversaw divisions including worldwide home video,
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_01: merchandising,
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_01: licensing,
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_01: and pay-per-view.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_01: During his time there,
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_01: Turner acquired the MGM movie library,
• 0:43
  for which Steve managed the 50th anniversary celebrations of
• 0:46
  classic films like The
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_01: Wizard of Oz,
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: Casablanca,
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_01: Citizen Kane,
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_01: as well as animation studio Hanna-Barbera,
• 0:52
  which brought iconic characters like the Flintstones'
• 0:55
  Scooby-Doo and the Jetsons
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_01: into the company.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_01: After Turner,
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_01: Steve led the marketing of Frank Sinatra's final album,
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_01: Duets,
• 1:04
  and was brought in by EMI to help lead the launch of the
• 1:07
  Beatles Anthology,
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_01: which became the highest grossing music compilation series in history.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what we're going to talk about today.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_01: Speaking of today,
• 1:14
  today Steve is an early stage tech investor and advisor who has
• 1:18
  backed dozens of
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_01: startups,
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_01: including an early investment in WebMD.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_01: This, my friends, is Steve Chamberlain.
• 1:26
  you're never going to be perfectly happy all the time the best
• 1:29
  you can hope for is
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: to be reasonably happy
• 1:40
  So what I did love in what you sent me over is that picture of
• 1:43
  you and Ric Flair.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_01: Where was that taken?
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that was taken in Las Vegas at one of our conventions.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_02: And we would have our own booth out there,
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_02: Turner Home Entertainment,
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_02: along with the other major studios like Sony and Universal.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_02: And we'd bring out stars that had been in some of our motion pictures.
• 2:02
  But wrestling was something that fell underneath me in terms of
• 2:05
  distribution.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_01: Really?
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_01: And so, yeah.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_01: Starting when in like 83?
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_01: Is that when you were?
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, no.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_02: It was really in about 1987 to 88.
• 2:15
  And we ended up,
• 2:16
  Turner Broadcasting,
• 2:17
  ended up buying a wrestling company.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_01: So just before you go into it,
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_01: I want to say I grew up in Atlanta,
• 2:23
  so I remember watching Saturday Morning Wrestling with Gordon
• 2:27
  Soley or Gordon Solo
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_01: or whatever his name was.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_01: That was filmed downtown, you know, when it was when it was channels.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it was it was a UHF station, Channel 17.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 2:39
  It was filmed in the basement of where Ted Turner's office was
• 2:44
  physically.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_02: And these people would come in on Saturday morning,
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_02: park their cars there,
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_02: and we'd let them into the studio.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_02: You would think that there was like 500 people in there.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_02: There's probably 60 or 70,
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_02: but,
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_02: it's black curtains and all these sound effects and stuff.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_02: And I used to take friends of mine down there, you know, because...
• 3:04
  The wrestlers all knew me in the back and all that stuff,
• 3:06
  and we were having a good time.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_02: My job was to suspend somebody's disbelief, and we did it pretty good.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_02: What we ended up doing is getting into the pay-per-view business,
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_02: and that was another division that came underneath me.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_02: So we would do six of those a year.
• 3:23
  um and it was the early days we could only clear about 12 to 14
• 3:27
  million households
• 3:28
  today you can do 100 million but that was what wcw was the name
• 3:32
  world championship
• 3:33
  wrestling and our host was gordon solo yeah and uh there's a
• 3:37
  ton of funny stories
• 3:38
  about it and and uh what was the pay-per-view cost and what was
• 3:42
  a big event that
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_01: somebody would pay for back then
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, we would start at like 1495.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_02: So we would go direct to the household.
• 3:50
  And then there were other bars and restaurants and stuff that
• 3:54
  we would license it to.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_02: So it grew dramatically over the years.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_02: But back in the very beginning,
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 4:00
  there were only two pay-per-view providers and it was only
• 4:03
  about 10 million
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_02: households.
• 4:05
  We had access to it,
• 4:06
  but it grew quickly and it became a very big business.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_02: Very important to the health of the company, the wrestling company.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_01: So it's interesting,
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_01: like looking at your resume and thinking about,
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_01: every time there's a new technological innovation,
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_01: there's a new opportunity to sell content through that channel.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_01: And you had a home entertainment at Turner in the 80s.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_01: Does that mean Blockbuster was your biggest client?
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_01: You were selling VHS tapes?
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_01: It was at the beginning.
• 4:34
  I mean,
• 4:34
  let me give you a really good example from the wrestling point
• 4:37
  of view.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_02: They had never been in the pay-per-view business.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_02: They didn't know what it was.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_02: It also occurred to me that people,
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_02: they may not have access to pay-per-view,
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_02: but they've got access to a telephone.
• 4:52
  And so I ended up going out to Las Vegas,
• 4:54
  and I literally met with three gangsters.
• 4:57
  And at that time,
• 4:59
  there were only like 200 of these unlimited 1-900 phone
• 5:04
  numbers.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_01: I got in trouble.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_01: I got in trouble with my parents for using one of those a few times.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_02: So I ended up buying one.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_02: Ted Turner let me pay him like they wanted to become partners with us.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_02: And I was telling these guys, I said, look, we're a public company.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_02: I can't do that.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_02: I mean,
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_02: when we release our stock report,
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_02: we would have to mention you as individuals and your contribution.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, no, no, no, no.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_02: We can't do that.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_02: So I ended up writing a check for like $250,000.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_02: And Ted Turner said, well, this better work, Steve.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_02: Well, what else doing?
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_02: is during the show,
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_02: that night,
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_02: we would tell them on Superstation TBS,
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_02: and we'd have 5 million people on there watching the beginning of it,
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_02: go to your phone and listen.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_02: And it's only $2 a minute.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_02: And I swear to God,
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_02: I mean,
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_02: it was 100,000 people every time I'd go on there on the phone and listen.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_02: They're not even watching video.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_01: And it would be the wrestlers talking smack to each other.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_01: Is that the idea?
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_02: They're crazy.
• 6:09
  You know,
• 6:10
  but that is a good example of finding another method of
• 6:13
  distribution.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_02: Another way.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_02: Attorney used to say, look, we've got this chicken here, right?
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_02: We're going to cut this thing into 20 different pieces.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_02: And that's what we did.
• 6:22
  right that was a good example of what you're talking about the
• 6:25
  beginning of our
• 6:26
  business uh when we bought mgm in 1986 was largely uh centered
• 6:32
  on rental and we
• 6:33
  would uh still are like gone with the wind and that kind of
• 6:37
  thing to blockbuster
• 6:38
  for like a hundred dollars a pop and that they in turn per
• 6:42
  cassette per cassette
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 6:45
  By renting it out 30 times and then they were in the black and
• 6:48
  then they would own it.
• 6:50
  And that went on for until about,
• 6:53
  I'd say,
• 6:54
  1987 when the beginning of DVD was introduced.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 7:00
  and it became a sell-through business and no longer really a
• 7:04
  rental business and
• 7:05
  people would begin to buy and uh collect movies like they
• 7:10
  bought and collect music
• 7:13
  and books for many years so what it was for us is another
• 7:17
  chance for us to rotate
• 7:19
  our content through a different distribution mechanism and
• 7:23
  that's why these these
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_02: studios are so valuable you know they they depend
• 7:29
  wholly on those libraries to generate the cash in between
• 7:34
  making new motion pictures.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_02: That's what it's all.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, that's the bread and butter.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_01: And they hope to make big money on top of that with the lottery,
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_01: the roulette wheel that is production of new motion pictures.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_02: I've had a lot of people ask me recently over the years and say,
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_02: Steve,
• 7:51
  do you think that you could oversee the distribution of a major
• 7:55
  theatrical motion
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_02: picture today?
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_02: And I say, no, I don't think I could.
• 8:02
  And then I stop and I say,
• 8:03
  by the way,
• 8:04
  I don't think the people that are doing it today
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_02: know what they're doing either.
• 8:09
  So this is the conflict that you're seeing recently with
• 8:13
  Netflix and Paramount and all that.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_02: You're disrupting the cycle.
• 8:18
  What they're saying is that we're going to make this motion
• 8:20
  picture and we're going
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_02: to go direct to Netflix.
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_02: And this is causing all kinds of habit within the entertainment industry.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_01: When you were at Turner,
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_01: it seems to me,
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_01: thinking about it,
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_01: we think about startups as being exclusively online kinds of things,
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_01: but a startup is really anything that disrupts an industry or creates new
• 8:38
  categories for which there isn't a roadmap on which to write a
• 8:45
  new business plan.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, Turner was a disruptor.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_01: Cable television didn't exist when he bought WTCG.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_02: That's right.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_02: And what he did is he figured out a way to put that up on the satellite.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_02: TBS was one of the very few cable networks that were at the beginning.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_02: And then he had all these,
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_02: like,
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_02: Leave it to Beaver and the Braze Baseball,
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_02: and that became America's Superstation.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_02: That's what it was called.
• 9:14
  And that gave us the monetary wherewithal to launch other
• 9:20
  networks,
• 9:20
  especially CNN.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_02: And you could not... Talk about inventing a category.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you couldn't imagine doing something like that.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, all news was coming out of New York.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_02: That's where the news center was.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_02: But because of satellites,
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_02: we were able to...
• 9:37
  They used to call us the Chicken Noodle Network because they
• 9:40
  laughed at us.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_02: And in the beginning, that's how I started my career there.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_02: In 1983, I was involved in cable sales.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_02: And we had to sell it like our networks,
• 9:51
  like you're going to a library and you have several books that
• 9:53
  you can sell.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_02: We would package them to the cable offers and give them discounts.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry, just to back up one second.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_01: You're going to the MSOs.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_02: That's right.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_01: Was it multi-service operators?
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_01: Is that what that stood for?
• 10:06
  And so this was the regional cable distributor that had a
• 10:11
  monopoly on all the homes
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_01: in that area,
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_01: right?
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_02: but back then when we were starting out,
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_02: in the early 80s,
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_02: 83 when I go,
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_02: you were dealing with thousands of cable operators.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_02: Today you're dealing with five.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_02: Right, right.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_02: So you had mask consolidation.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_01: It was a local utility, guys, with short sleeves and ties.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_02: Full-timers.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it was a utility.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_02: It's exactly what it was.
• 10:34
  And what they did is rally around Ted Turner because he became
• 10:40
  the face of a
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_02: utility that became something that consumers admired.
• 10:49
  And they got behind us and we launched all these networks and
• 10:52
  the rest is history.
• 10:54
  uh but those i i single-handedly give him credit because he is
• 10:59
  the one that rallied
• 11:01
  those people even in the darkest times when we bought mgm in
• 11:04
  1986 the truth is it
• 11:06
  almost bankrupted our company i think you know yeah and we had
• 11:10
  to immediately sell
• 11:12
  studio back to real estate technicolor which was a film
• 11:15
  processing company
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_02: All we were left with was the MGM Film Library,
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_02: and that was 5,000 motion pictures on MGM's side from 1980 back,
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_02: the pre-1950 Warner Brothers Library,
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_02: and RKO,
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_02: and altogether it was 5,000.
• 11:31
  So what Ted Turner was doing is stabilizing the cost of what
• 11:36
  he'd have to pay
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_02: syndicators for content for our entertainment networks.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_02: That was what it was all about.
• 11:42
  But what almost made us bankrupt is because we had 19 brand new
• 11:48
  motion pictures in
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_02: production and only two of them worked.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_01: Which were those two?
• 11:56
  Running Scared was one of the few that worked,
• 11:58
  I remember that one,
• 11:59
  and then one other one.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_01: Was that Gregory Hines?
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_02: And the rest all lost hundreds of millions of dollars.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_02: You're talking about a company that's,
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 12:14
  making hundreds of millions of dollars and then you're
• 12:17
  acquiring something that you
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_02: really don't understand from a cost standpoint.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_02: And so we went into an emergency mode and had to,
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_02: and Kirk Kikorian,
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_02: who was the person that we bought MGM from.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_02: Bought 90% of the stuff back.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_02: That's what it was.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_02: But it was ahead of its time.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_02: Ted Turner understood the value of content.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_02: He says it himself.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I'm not saying it.
• 12:46
  He said,
• 12:47
  I went to Los Angeles fully dressed,
• 12:52
  and I came back to Atlanta in a barrel.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_01: That's such a Ted Turner expression.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_01: What was he like to work with?
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_01: He was called Captain Outrageous.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_01: He was kind of a wild man, right?
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, he was.
• 13:09
  At the beginning,
• 13:10
  we only had a couple of hundred people,
• 13:12
  so it was all hands on deck.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_02: Today,
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_02: I guess 20,000 people,
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_02: but I ended up spending quite a bit of time with him,
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_02: and he is a mercurial person,
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_02: and you must understand that.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_02: You must understand also he's a genius.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_01: Those two often go together.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, I can't.
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I do things like, okay, Ted, I'm doing this.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_02: It's the 50th anniversary of the Wizard of Oz.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_02: And we're going to do it at the Plaza Hotel in New York.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_02: And I want you to be there because we're going to a press conference.
• 13:48
  And normally,
• 13:49
  you know,
• 13:49
  it's a nice thing,
• 13:50
  but it wouldn't draw that big of it.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_02: You'd have 100 reporters show up.
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_02: Not because they're interested in The Wizard of Oz.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 13:59
  They're interested in him saying something so outrageous that
• 14:04
  it's going to be front page news.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_02: And he doesn't care.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_02: He's one of these people.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_02: He doesn't have a filter.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_02: So whatever he's thinking comes out.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_02: And I'll tell you this.
• 14:15
  I mean,
• 14:16
  I know I read about every day about a person in our country who
• 14:20
  doesn't have a filter.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, no, no, no.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_02: I understand it perfectly.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_02: I saw him.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_02: It's been about 10 years ago,
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_02: but I wanted to get him in a deal with me and he didn't want to do it.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_02: But he had his secretary call me and asked me to come downtown.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_02: He just wanted to talk to me.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_02: So I sat in his private office with him and talked about old times.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_02: And I said,
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_02: you know something,
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_02: Ted,
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_02: no matter where I go,
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_02: people know that I work for Turner Broadcasting.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_02: But they want to know.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_02: Every single time did I ever meet you personally?
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_02: And he goes, come on, Steve, you're kidding, right?
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_02: I said, no, seriously.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_02: And what do you tell him?
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_02: I said,
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_02: well,
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_02: some days I might meet you 20,
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_02: 25 times because unfortunately I had an office right across from yours.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_02: So when you'd go off on a tangent,
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_02: you come in my office and start screaming,
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_02: I don't even know what you're talking about.
• 15:15
  So that's,
• 15:16
  that's kind of what it was,
• 15:18
  but you'll find this really interesting.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_02: He put me in a very big job at a pretty young age.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_02: I think I was 36.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_02: Made me executive vice president of the company,
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_02: head of Turner Home Entertainment,
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_02: five divisions,
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_02: very large part of our company.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_02: And I asked him so many years later, I said, why did you do that?
• 15:40
  I mean,
• 15:41
  my counterparts in New York and Los Angeles are much older than
• 15:44
  I am.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_02: Been in the business forever.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_02: Why did you do that?
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_02: And he said, well, I thought you were a smart kid.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_02: You did a great job for us in the cable sales side.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_02: And he said,
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_02: the most important thing about you,
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_02: Steve,
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_02: I knew that you would never steal from me.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_02: Of all the things that somebody could say about you, you'd say, really?
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_02: That's it?
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that's something.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_02: I thought about that.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_02: And he had reason to say that.
• 16:15
  because of going to Los Angeles fully clothed and coming home
• 16:19
  in a barrel.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_02: And I understand what he was saying.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_02: He's gonna get the truth from me, he's not gonna.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_01: well these special projects that you worked on,
• 16:31
  the through line from Turner to The Beatles that we're gonna
• 16:34
  talk about seems to
• 16:35
  start with you managing big projects like the 50th anniversary
• 16:40
  of Casablanca and
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_01: The Wizard of Oz.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_01: What did you do for those?
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_01: How did you make them special?
• 16:45
  Well,
• 16:46
  in the case of the first really big one we did was Gone with
• 16:50
  the Wind.
• 16:51
  And Ted just said to me first,
• 16:53
  I want you to run it,
• 16:54
  make it happen and make it big.
• 16:57
  And so what we did is Bob Wessler at the time was the president
• 17:01
  of the company.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_02: He commissioned a documentary on it, the making of Gone with the Wind.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_02: He attached to that as well.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_02: And we went back and as we do,
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know whether you know this,
• 17:13
  but although those films are stored in a salt mine in Kansas
• 17:17
  because of humidity
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_02: and things like that,
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_02: they grade over time.
• 17:20
  So we spent quite a bit of money restoring the film,
• 17:25
  you know,
• 17:25
  sound,
• 17:26
  film quality and so forth.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_02: And then we would get, like I rented out the Fox Theater.
• 17:34
  And then I got the biggest movie stars that were still alive
• 17:38
  from Gone with the Wind to be here.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_02: And then Good Morning America and all of them.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_01: And that's where Gone with the Wind premiered, right?
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_02: It was across the street, actually.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, what was it called?
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_02: We just had a frenzy about it.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_02: We recreated that time.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_02: We were sensitive to the racial issue with the wind.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_02: We brought the mayor in, calmed all that down.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_02: You know,
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_02: this is a story,
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_02: during this time period,
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_02: you can imagine the sensitivities to all this type of stuff.
• 18:10
  And,
• 18:11
  you know,
• 18:12
  we released it and it just went bananas,
• 18:14
  millions of copies.
• 18:15
  And,
• 18:16
  you know,
• 18:16
  I think in that case,
• 18:17
  we probably made $50 million,
• 18:18
  you know,
• 18:20
  re-release of it.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_02: Ted Turner didn't,
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_02: to his credit,
• 18:26
  he didn't understand home entertainment yet because that's not
• 18:29
  what he thought
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_02: about when he purchased MGM.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_02: He's thinking about television and controlling the cost of TV.
• 18:37
  It never occurred to him that the big money would be just down
• 18:41
  the road when home
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_02: entertainment would become front and center.
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_00: Hmm.
• 18:47
  that was the magic of it and he did it and so we did that with
• 18:51
  the wizard boss was
• 18:52
  another oh my god you know we would uh get a packaged goods
• 18:57
  company involved and do
• 18:59
  something like uh you buy this and you get it five dollars off
• 19:02
  if you're redeeming
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_02: we're using everything that is taught in in packaged goods
• 19:08
  um and we did it again and again and again so we had we had the
• 19:13
  format down we knew
• 19:15
  what worked we knew how to promote it right um you know it's
• 19:21
  you do it enough times
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_02: at anything you know there's trial and error but
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_02: You do it enough,
• 19:27
  you find your niche and you know where it's at and you know
• 19:29
  where the buyers are
• 19:30
  going to be and you know what tricks to use in marketing to
• 19:35
  create the most level,
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_02: highest level of awareness.
• 19:38
  And some of the things that many people just really don't know
• 19:41
  is there's a science
• 19:43
  behind a lot of this that even I brought to the Beatles and
• 19:47
  that science means
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_02: understanding who's most likely to buy this.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_02: And at what price point are they most likely to buy it?
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_01: Steve, I want to interrupt you for a second.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_01: An hour ago,
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_01: I was sitting here in the studio with an author,
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_01: Chris Pavone,
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_01: who wrote a book called The Doorman,
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_01: which I absolutely loved.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_01: And he was in publishing before he became a six-time novelist.
• 20:15
  And we were talking about the difference between structuring a
• 20:19
  book as a product
• 20:20
  that people like versus knowing who your audience is and
• 20:25
  understanding who your
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_01: buyer is and who you write for.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_01: Who do you serve in producing this content?
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_01: Did you understand who you served when you were producing this?
• 20:34
  Yeah,
• 20:34
  you do an awful lot of research,
• 20:35
  but you also must understand the customer.
• 20:38
  And that's when we understand where our biggest accounts are,
• 20:41
  like Best Buy.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_02: We're going to follow their lead and what they're saying to us.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_02: And we'll talk about this with the Beatles anthology.
• 20:50
  But you'd learn an awful lot when you talk to the people that
• 20:53
  are going to
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_02: eventually sell it and how they're going to sell it.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_01: So they might tell you what that they're interested in.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, I know they're interested.
• 21:01
  But they're interested more in DVDs than in audio CDs or they
• 21:04
  or they or they need
• 21:06
  they want to license content for their television commercials
• 21:08
  or something like
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_01: that.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, well, that could be.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_02: But in the instance, let's take the Beatles, right?
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_02: We knew,
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_02: even as I was writing this,
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_02: the initial business and marketing plan,
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_02: we knew where the buyers were and where they were going to buy it.
• 21:28
  There's seven major retailers that are going to count for like
• 21:31
  63% of our sales.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_01: God, that feels like a thousand years ago.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_02: Circuit City, Best Buy, who...
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_02: And what I, Virgin records.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 21:41
  And what I would have to explain to Paul McCartney and others
• 21:45
  that were questioning
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_02: what we were doing is I said,
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_02: look,
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_02: uh,
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_02: I'm first of all,
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_02: I'm your biggest fan.
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 21:53
  But retailing in 1995 is very different than when you guys
• 21:57
  ruled the charts in 1965.
• 22:00
  And I said,
• 22:00
  so today you're,
• 22:01
  you're not competing so much with other audio or music.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_02: packages, what you're really competing against is the movie business.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_02: And I showed him, I said, look, here's where Snow White's coming, right?
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_02: From Disney.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_02: Here's the slot.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_02: And then ET from Universal's coming right behind it.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_02: That's the slot.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_02: We have to be like threading a needle here.
• 22:31
  because it's called open to buy dollars they want to go deep
• 22:34
  with us but they want
• 22:36
  us to play in their world you know they got the bags of cash
• 22:42
  come get it when they
• 22:43
  have it don't tell us what it is and those are the things that
• 22:47
  i would have to
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_02: politely teach the reality of it
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_02: Other things like Paul McCartney would say,
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_02: well,
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_02: you better make sure,
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_02: Steve,
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_02: that this sells for higher than anybody's ever seen.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_02: No artist ever got.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_02: And I listened to him and I said, I hear you.
• 23:08
  And I said,
• 23:09
  let me tell you what's going to happen here with the top four
• 23:11
  retailers.
• 23:13
  And you're going to be mad if I don't tell you this because I
• 23:16
  don't know whether
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_02: you're going to be reading this when it comes out.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_02: You're going to open up a double truck in the L.A.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_02: Times,
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_02: which is a huge ad about the Beatles anthology,
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_02: Best Buy,
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_02: and they're only charging $16.98,
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_02: and you're going to explode and say that you just robbed us.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_02: I said, you haven't heard me out.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_02: They're using you as a lost leader.
• 23:43
  They're paying more for your record than they've ever paid for
• 23:47
  anybody's record.
• 23:50
  But they want people it's an event that want people to come
• 23:53
  into the stores by the
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_02: tens of thousands,
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_02: because once they're in there,
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_02: they're going to buy something else.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_02: That's what this is all about.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_01: Well, let's take a step back, Steve.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_01: You left Turner early or early mid 90s.
• 24:08
  How did you get how did you get connected with with the the
• 24:12
  music business?
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's a good one.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_02: I mean,
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_02: just after MGM,
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_02: another thing was put underneath me,
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_02: which I had no experience in,
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_02: and we didn't have anybody in the company that had music experience.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_02: And so within those 5,000 motion pictures,
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_02: there's a lot of music,
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_02: like Follow the Yellow Brick Road.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_02: Gone with the wind.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_02: You must remember this from Casablanca.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_02: And it's complicated.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_02: And so I ended up hiring this lawyer named David Simone.
• 24:43
  He was here in Atlanta,
• 24:45
  had a music publishing background,
• 24:47
  and he helped me straighten that out.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_02: And we just stayed friends.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_02: I think you hired him for like three or six months to set it straight.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_02: And once it was on, it was on automatic pilot.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_02: So David,
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_02: in the meantime,
• 25:04
  had moved to Los Angeles and had become the number three guy at
• 25:07
  Capitol Records.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_01: A division of EMI.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_02: Correct.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_02: EMI consisted of seven different labels.
• 25:15
  You have Capitol North America,
• 25:18
  which is the building you're familiar with in Los Angeles.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_02: You have Capitol Nashville, which is Garth Brooks and all of that.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_02: You have Blue Note, which is a jazz label with Nora Jones and on and on.
• 25:29
  And at the time,
• 25:30
  I think they're the third largest music company in the world.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_02: They're all over the world.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it's still pretty much the same.
• 25:38
  There's nine or 10 players,
• 25:41
  like Motion Pictures or anything else,
• 25:43
  that pretty much control 90%.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_02: of everything that you see and listen to.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_02: It's a fact.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_02: It's consolidated, but they're one of those.
• 25:51
  And so there was an article about me leaving Turner in the
• 25:55
  Hollywood Reporter and
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_02: Variety,
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_02: which is a trade publication for our industry.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_02: And David called me and he said,
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_02: What's going on here?
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_02: He goes, this can't be.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_02: Let's just cut to the chase.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it was time.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_02: It's a big management change.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_02: Corporate shenanigans.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_02: It was 11 years.
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_02: It was just my turn.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_02: He goes, I want you to come out here next week.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_02: I know you don't have any background in music, but I got something.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, come out here next Wednesday, Steve.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_02: So I flew out,
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_02: went to the Capitol building,
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_02: saw David,
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_02: and he introduced me to everybody,
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_02: the president,
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_02: all these guys.
• 26:39
  SPEAKER_02: And he said to me,
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_02: he said,
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_02: Steve,
• 26:42
  you have such value in the fact of your experience in taking
• 26:48
  these classic motion
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_02: pictures and reintroducing them to contemporary buyers.
• 26:54
  that's very valuable and we don't have that here and we're
• 26:56
  getting ready to do he
• 26:58
  said steve do you like frank sinatra i said man i love that guy
• 27:03
  he goes well we're
• 27:05
  right in the middle of he's right in the middle of doing the
• 27:07
  last two albums of his
• 27:09
  lifetime and they're called duets one and two right what frank
• 27:12
  is doing is teaming
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_02: up with barbara streisand and
• 27:15
  Aretha Franklin,
• 27:16
  Luther Vandross,
• 27:17
  Julio Iglesias,
• 27:19
  Bono and many,
• 27:20
  many more.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_01: By the way, I saw Barbara on the Oscars last night.
• 27:24
  She was not at the same level of performance as she was when
• 27:28
  she duetted with Frank.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_02: You know, you saw that on the tape.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_02: But anyway, I he said, you want to become a consultant to Frank Sinatra.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_02: We would like to sign you.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_01: Speaking of gangsters.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, man.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_02: And he said, you don't have to move out here, but we want you.
• 27:46
  And you report right into the family,
• 27:49
  Tina,
• 27:50
  and all of that that runs the show.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_02: And I just jumped at it.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I loved it.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_02: And I loved doing it.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_02: Had some input on it.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_02: I guess they thought I was valuable.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_02: And it, you know, went way up the charts.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_02: It was extremely successful.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_01: I remember that.
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_01: I absolutely remember that.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah,
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_02: and I remember I got invited to his 80th birthday party,
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_02: and so did 800 other people at the Shrine Auditorium.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_02: But it was a television special, but he was seated kind of near me.
• 28:24
  And,
• 28:25
  you know,
• 28:25
  I just always had this thing when I'm working for very famous
• 28:30
  people.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_02: It's not personal.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_02: I'm there to do a job.
• 28:34
  And but he was a very gracious guy and gave me the salute with
• 28:38
  his wife,
• 28:38
  Barbara.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_02: And then Tina, Dad, you know, Steve's all into this.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_02: You know, that's what it was.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_02: But I was not hired to be in their family or their best friend.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_02: I'm there to do a very specific job.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_01: Which is to sell a hell of a lot of music.
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_02: Bingo.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_02: That's it.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_02: And I know that.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_02: And so I had a great time and when it was over, it was over.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_02: And so I came back to Atlanta, my little house in Bucket.
• 29:07
  And I was producing some other directed video titles,
• 29:10
  children's stuff to keep me busy.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_02: But I am.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_02: I get this call,
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_02: Paul,
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_02: one day,
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_02: and it's from Charles Koppelman's office,
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_02: and I'd never met him.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_02: I obviously knew who he was,
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_02: but it's his assistant in New York,
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_02: and she said,
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_02: Steve,
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_02: Charles would like you to come up and meet with him two days from now.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_01: He's the head of capital or the head of EMI?
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_02: He's the chairman of the whole thing, EMI, worldwide, the whole thing.
• 29:40
  And that's important because there's different labels involved
• 29:43
  in the UK and Europe
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_01: than there are in North America.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_02: Correct.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_02: You know, they're selling, you know, the Middle East and Europe and all.
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_01: And there's different distributors and everything.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_02: But he is the man.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_02: He is it.
• 29:58
  I mean,
• 29:58
  if you're no matter what your business is,
• 30:01
  there are some one person that's it.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_02: That's it.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_02: He's that guy.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_02: And,
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_02: uh,
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_02: I said,
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_02: of course,
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_02: and I immediately call the guys at Capitol in LA and I go,
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_02: I get this phone call.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_02: You guys know what this is about?
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_02: I said, no.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_02: I said, okay.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_02: So I fly up,
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 30:23
  and I go to the big EMI building on Avenue of Americas and go
• 30:28
  up to his office and
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_02: I'm ushered in.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_02: And,
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 30:32
  a lot of these things when you're dealing with famous people or
• 30:34
  big executives,
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_02: they make you wait.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 30:37
  Kind of like,
• 30:40
  you know,
• 30:40
  I'm just sitting in his office for like maybe 15 minutes by
• 30:43
  myself.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 30:45
  i'm offered coffee and whatever he comes in 15 minutes later
• 30:49
  and he sits down he
• 30:50
  goes it's really nice to see you i um uh frank sinatra and the
• 30:56
  sinatra family think
• 30:57
  the world of you and that's a pretty good endorsement yeah he
• 31:01
  said we we so much
• 31:02
  appreciate what you did and um you know it was fantastic and uh
• 31:09
  and then he said uh
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_02: i guess you wonder why you're here today steve
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I am.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_02: He said,
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_02: well,
• 31:19
  we're getting ready to do the biggest thing we've ever done in
• 31:22
  the history of
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_02: music.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_02: And that's going to be called the Beatles Anthology.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_02: And the Beatles are recording against Steve.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_02: I said, really?
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_02: John's gone and he's starting to tell me about this.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_02: And he said, Steve, I got a big problem.
• 31:46
  The Beatles have been with us in 1962,
• 31:50
  and we have had a mercurial relationship with them.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_02: They don't trust us, and I've done everything I can.
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_01: Why didn't the Beatles trust their label?
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_02: Because they were all insiders with them from the very beginning.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_02: But they would say to me later on,
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_02: it's,
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_02: hey,
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_02: Steve,
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_02: it's the devil we know,
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_02: is what they would say about it.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_02: And so he said, I want you to come with me, Steve.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_02: So, I mean, it's one of those seminal moments, at least in my lifetime.
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_02: I'm walking down the hall,
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_02: and we go into this gigantic boardroom,
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_02: probably the biggest one I've ever seen.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_02: It looked like 30 seats.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_02: And in the corner of my eye,
• 32:35
  I could see that there were seven easels that were lined up
• 32:39
  blank on the side of
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_02: the wall,
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_02: and there was a woman sitting at the end of the table.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_02: Her name was Terri Centisi.
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_02: Terri was the CFO of all of EMI.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_02: So it's just two of them.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_02: So he starts to talk.
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_02: And he said, I'm just, the Beatles, Steve, are demanding.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_02: They're not asking.
• 33:01
  They're demanding that we bring in an outsider to quarterback
• 33:05
  this whole thing.
• 33:06
  Now I'm very much against it because I think we already have
• 33:09
  the finest music
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_02: executives in the world,
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_02: but they don't see it that way.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_02: And they're demanding it and I can't do anything about it.
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_02: And so you are being interviewed today
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_02: to be the head of the Beatles anthology.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_02: And he says,
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_02: so he handed me this magic marker and he said,
• 33:29
  so why don't you stand up and why don't you start drawing out
• 33:34
  what this is going to
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_02: look like?
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_01: What did they tell you the project was?
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_01: What was the anthology?
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_01: What did that mean?
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_02: Oh,
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_02: at that point I knew that,
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_02: I mean,
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_02: just in those milliseconds,
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_02: what it was,
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_02: it was three brand new double albums,
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_02: two new singles,
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_02: And a 10-hour home video series.
• 33:53
  It already just inked a deal with ABC television over the
• 33:57
  Thanksgiving of that year
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_02: for a multi-night debut of the series.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_02: And so, I mean, it was...
• 34:08
  It can kind of take your breath away when you're in that room
• 34:11
  when something like
• 34:12
  SPEAKER_02: that happens to you.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 34:14
  SPEAKER_02: It's kind of like being in the World Series in the ninth inning.
• 34:17
  SPEAKER_02: And it's either you know it or you don't.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_02: And I had to.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not sounding.
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_02: I don't want to sound egotistical.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_02: I don't.
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_02: But I just took that pen and I just started drawing it out.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_02: It was everything that I'd ever known and learned.
• 34:35
  And it all came back to my television days in being able to
• 34:38
  tell a story because in
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_02: that moment,
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_02: I realized I'm going to do a who,
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_02: what,
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_02: where,
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_02: when,
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_02: why,
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_02: and how,
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_02: and that's thematically how I'm going to write it.
• 34:50
  And I just started doing it,
• 34:53
  you know,
• 34:54
  and I guess I was up there for probably an hour.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_02: And then they asked me a half hour of questions.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_02: Then they had a beautiful lunch delivered.
• 35:06
  And then he asked me to go back to his office where I sat for
• 35:10
  another half hour.
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_02: And he comes back in and he goes,
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_02: okay,
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_02: what I want you to do,
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_02: Steve,
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_02: is I want you to fly to Los Angeles next Wednesday.
• 35:22
  I'm going to roll up all this that you've already written on
• 35:25
  these seven easels,
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_02: and I want you to represent it to the rest of the world of EMI,
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_02: Capitol Records,
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_02: at 3 p.m.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_02: at the top.
• 35:38
  And I'd met several of the guys because of Sinatra,
• 35:41
  so it wasn't like I was going to.
• 35:43
  SPEAKER_02: So you're going to find this funny.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_02: I did it.
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_02: I did it with the same matter of fact.
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_02: This is what I think.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_02: And this is what, you know.
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_02: And anyway, went through it all.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_02: And they asked 15, 20 minutes of questions.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_02: And Charles said, you got to remember, Paul, we didn't have cell phones.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_02: You know, we didn't have the internet.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_02: It was pre-internet.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_02: And so everything was, you know, analog.
• 36:13
  SPEAKER_02: And so he said, where are you staying tonight?
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_02: I said, oh, we're at Park Hyatt.
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_02: Century City.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_02: He goes, be in your room at 6 o'clock.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_02: I'm going to call.
• 36:24
  so that's what i did and um you'll find this funny i don't i
• 36:29
  still don't know why i
• 36:30
  did it but after the meeting i'm walking out and i closed the
• 36:33
  door and i waited
• 36:34
  like 15 seconds and i knocked on the door again and they're all
• 36:37
  in there still and
• 36:40
  i said can i just say one last thing i said you know you guys
• 36:44
  there's no doubt that
• 36:46
  you're going to number one no doubt i mean i think you can put
• 36:49
  it in a brown paper
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_02: bag and put the beatles in right
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_02: I said, you know what?
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_02: Going to number one isn't good enough for me.
• 37:01
  And going to number one for the Beatles isn't good enough for
• 37:05
  them either.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_02: And I said, have a nice evening.
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_02: I can't believe I did that.
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_01: That's a closer right there.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_02: That's what a closer does.
• 37:16
  SPEAKER_02: I knew there were other people being interviewed for this.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_02: And I just said, I can't lose this.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's great.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_01: So you got the gig.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_01: So you get the gig.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 37:24
  So he calls me at six,
• 37:25
  you know,
• 37:25
  and he goes,
• 37:27
  don't you think that was a little dramatic?
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_02: He goes, it's unanimous.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_02: You're in.
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_02: And he said, what do you want?
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_02: And I just threw out the number and he goes, okay.
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_02: And I went, you know, I should have.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_01: Should have asked for more.
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_02: But it wasn't about that.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_02: And he said, here's the deal.
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_02: You got to move out here right now.
• 37:46
  SPEAKER_02: Right now, like next week.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_02: And you got to be here for two years.
• 37:51
  And the Beatles are going to want to meet you personally in
• 37:53
  about 10 days from now.
• 37:55
  And I'm going with you to London and you're going to meet Neil
• 37:59
  and the rest of them.
• 38:00
  SPEAKER_02: And we got to go.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_01: Who is Neil?
• 38:03
  Neil Aspinall was Paul McCartney's great friend in high school
• 38:11
  in their old
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_02: hometown,
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_02: Liverpool.
• 38:13
  George knew him,
• 38:14
  and he became their driver when they first started in 1962.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_02: He bought a beat-up van that was gray and red.
• 38:24
  And he'd drive and the four Beatles sat on a wooden bench in
• 38:30
  the back with the
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_02: amplifiers and everything.
• 38:32
  SPEAKER_02: So he was the driver taking them to Germany,
• 38:36
  SPEAKER_02: Hamburg,
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_02: back in Liverpool,
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_02: Cavern Club and all of that.
• 38:40
  So what was happening here and what would stay till the very
• 38:45
  end was I was always
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_02: surprised at how small the Beatles circle was.
• 38:53
  SPEAKER_02: I really thought something this big would have 100 people involved.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_02: And it really wasn't in the end.
• 39:01
  I mean,
• 39:01
  it was me and four other people calling every big shot and
• 39:05
  that's it.
• 39:06
  Now,
• 39:06
  thousands of people would be involved around the world,
• 39:09
  distribution and so forth.
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_02: But the actual decisions, very, very close.
• 39:17
  When you pitched your plans to the band,
• 39:20
  what did you intuit that they wanted?
• 39:24
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't know.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_02: By the way, here's the plan itself.
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_02: I had one of the few copies that were made.
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_02: I think they only made 14 of them,
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_02: and each Beatle got one,
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_02: and then certainly the executives of EMI and others.
• 39:49
  SPEAKER_02: During that meeting that day,
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_02: it was in the EMI building where if you look at the Red and Blue albums,
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_02: they're standing in the stairwell.
• 39:57
  Red and Blue albums were early compilations or actually they
• 40:01
  were like after the band broke up.
• 40:04
  Capital put out these greatest hits records,
• 40:07
  which were the records I listened to.
• 40:09
  SPEAKER_01: The first albums I heard of the Beatles were those greatest hit records.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that's where they're standing.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_02: That's the EMI building.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_02: And that's where this meeting is.
• 40:18
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, they're on the balcony of the EMI building.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_01: And one's their early days and one is the later picture.
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm flown over, and some in there, and Charles Koppelman is with me.
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_02: Terry Santisi is with me.
• 40:36
  SPEAKER_02: And Gary Gersh, who is the president of Capital North America.
• 40:41
  SPEAKER_02: And me.
• 40:42
  SPEAKER_02: That's it.
• 40:43
  SPEAKER_02: And so we're sitting in the conference room.
• 40:46
  and here comes this guy and he's wearing like a lime grain
• 40:49
  turban on his head and
• 40:52
  that's neil and neil is the ceo of apple ltd their holding
• 40:57
  company and uh you know
• 41:00
  it's it's a long story but the beatles didn't trust outsiders
• 41:07
  and they went through
• 41:07
  SPEAKER_02: a lot of legal pain which you're aware of um and neil was in i mean
• 41:16
  You're saying things like,
• 41:17
  oh,
• 41:18
  you should have had a professional manager.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_02: You should have had a Harvard.
• 41:21
  SPEAKER_02: No, no.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_02: That's not who they were.
• 41:25
  SPEAKER_02: They're going with who they knew at the very beginning.
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_02: It's all about trust.
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_01: So how did you build that trust?
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_02: Well, Neil kind of built it for me.
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_02: That's the first time I'd met him.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_02: But let's be very clear here.
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_02: Capital didn't want me.
• 41:44
  SPEAKER_00: Mm-hmm.
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_02: EMI didn't want me.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_02: The Beatles demanded me.
• 41:49
  SPEAKER_01: But how did Neil know that he could trust you?
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_01: You didn't know him before that, though, did you?
• 41:54
  SPEAKER_02: I think, um, he had talked to various people about me.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_02: I know he did.
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_02: And I knew that Sinatra said something about me.
• 42:04
  And then he started looking at my career and he looked at gone
• 42:09
  with the way he
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_02: said,
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_02: this guy,
• 42:11
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_02: no joke,
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 42:14
  SPEAKER_02: and then I'd had a couple of phone calls with him.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_02: And so we started a wonderful relationship, but during that meeting,
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_02: I don't remember Paul being really nervous.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, this is the first one-on-one.
• 42:27
  SPEAKER_02: Neil comes in,
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_02: says what he's going to say,
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_02: how important this is,
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_02: and that he's reviewed the plan,
• 42:35
  SPEAKER_02: that the Beatles are very involved,
• 42:38
  SPEAKER_02: at least in reading the plan.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_02: He said, I was with Paul last night.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_02: It's his home.
• 42:42
  SPEAKER_02: This is on the desk.
• 42:43
  SPEAKER_02: He's reading it, and he has some things to say about it.
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_02: So during that meeting, the phones light up.
• 42:53
  SPEAKER_02: And the first one on is Paul McCartney.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_02: The second one on is Yoko Ono.
• 42:58
  And then the third and fourth are the business managers for
• 43:02
  Ringo and George.
• 43:03
  SPEAKER_02: That's who's on it.
• 43:04
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, Ringo was too busy.
• 43:06
  SPEAKER_01: He couldn't make the meeting.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_01: Paul McCartney can show up, but Richard Starkey doesn't have the time.
• 43:11
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, Ringo.
• 43:12
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 43:12
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 43:13
  And so I was pretty much doing all the talking because that's
• 43:17
  what this was about.
• 43:19
  I mean,
• 43:20
  Charles was there to support Terry and Gary,
• 43:22
  but I mean,
• 43:23
  this is what it's all about.
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_02: How are we going to sell this thing?
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_02: And there's a thousand things that have to be considered.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_02: So Paul's on there with me, and he said, this is very extensive.
• 43:37
  SPEAKER_02: I'm delighted with this, Steve.
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_02: I really know what you're talking about.
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_02: He said, I got the first question for you.
• 43:45
  SPEAKER_02: What do you think about the title, Steve, The Beatles Anthology?
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_02: And I said, well, any issue I have is it's been used before, Paul.
• 43:59
  SPEAKER_02: It was used by Marvin Gaye.
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_02: It's been used, I had a couple of other names.
• 44:03
  And I said,
• 44:03
  so it's not,
• 44:05
  you know,
• 44:05
  from that standpoint,
• 44:07
  there's precedent for it.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_02: So he said, okay, so what do you want to call it?
• 44:14
  SPEAKER_02: I said, well, I was thinking like the Long and Windy Road.
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_02: And you could hear a pin drop.
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_02: And he says to me,
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_02: Paul McCartney says to me,
• 44:25
  SPEAKER_02: Steve,
• 44:26
  SPEAKER_02: I don't care what you call it,
• 44:28
  SPEAKER_02: as long as you call it the Beatles anthology.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_02: And so I wrote that down.
• 44:33
  And Neil is kicking me underneath the table because that's the
• 44:37
  very first time that
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_02: I would understand really them as a unit.
• 44:44
  Because that song,
• 44:46
  Long and Windy Road,
• 44:48
  was a Lennon-McCartney composition.
• 44:52
  it was really paul's song wasn't it the band so i'm getting
• 44:56
  right i just stepped
• 44:57
  into the politics of this thing not knowing that um but i got
• 45:03
  the answer it was a
• 45:04
  beatles anthology from then on right but he would go on uh he's
• 45:10
  a smart guy i mean
• 45:11
  SPEAKER_02: um he was saying um and we talked a little bit
• 45:16
  SPEAKER_02: about the timing.
• 45:18
  I've already talked about when we're going to do it and why
• 45:22
  we're going to do it
• 45:23
  SPEAKER_02: that way and that it's a loss leader.
• 45:24
  And he talked about pricing and he was irritated at first a
• 45:28
  little about it being low.
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_02: I said, it doesn't matter.
• 45:32
  I said,
• 45:32
  what I know really matters to you is the check you're going to
• 45:37
  get.
• 45:38
  And the check you're going to get is bigger than any artist in
• 45:41
  the world ever got.
• 45:43
  SPEAKER_01: Is that what they wanted?
• 45:45
  SPEAKER_01: Was money the motivation?
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_02: Well, the money, because he thought traditionally.
• 45:50
  SPEAKER_02: He wasn't thinking what was getting ready to happen.
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_01: Neil or Paul, are we talking about Neil or Paul here?
• 45:55
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry.
• 45:55
  SPEAKER_01: Paul.
• 45:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_01: It's funny,
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 45:58
  SPEAKER_01: Peter Doggett,
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_01: the author of You Never Give Me Your Money,
• 46:01
  SPEAKER_01: who I interviewed,
• 46:02
  SPEAKER_01: this interview will air the week after that one interviews,
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_01: he said that Paul,
• 46:07
  SPEAKER_01: even at this age,
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_01: today,
• 46:09
  SPEAKER_01: still thinks about
• 46:12
  SPEAKER_01: the chart rate rankings of his songs.
• 46:15
  SPEAKER_01: Because that's how this guy,
• 46:17
  SPEAKER_01: who is a multi-billionaire,
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_01: one of the most legendary people who has lived during the past century,
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_01: and has a level of fame and adoration that all of us could only dream of,
• 46:32
  he still thinks about his rankings because that's how he
• 46:35
  measures his success.
• 46:36
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_02: I said, look, we're going number one.
• 46:41
  SPEAKER_02: That's get that out of your mind.
• 46:43
  What we're really talking about here,
• 46:45
  Paul,
• 46:46
  is how far this rocket's going to go.
• 46:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's what we're talking about.
• 46:51
  SPEAKER_01: And that was language that resonated with him.
• 46:53
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 46:54
  SPEAKER_02: And I said, and, you know, you wrote the song.
• 46:56
  And in the end,
• 46:57
  I said,
• 46:58
  this is all about final check of what's really given to you.
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_02: And I said,
• 47:03
  I don't even want to get into antitrust law and all this
• 47:06
  Sherman Act and all this
• 47:07
  SPEAKER_02: stuff,
• 47:07
  SPEAKER_02: but these retailers,
• 47:09
  SPEAKER_02: this is what they want to do.
• 47:11
  They're honoring you by making you an event big enough for them
• 47:16
  to lose a ton of
• 47:17
  SPEAKER_02: money because they're going to create store traffic like never before.
• 47:23
  SPEAKER_02: And that's what it's about.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_01: Now, you told me after this meeting, Neil, the head of Apple...
• 47:31
  SPEAKER_01: Drove you around London and gave you more insights into the- Yeah,
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_02: that was,
• 47:35
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 47:35
  I thought the meeting was over and we all went downstairs and
• 47:40
  everybody was
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_02: expected to get in the same car.
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_02: And then Neil said, no, you're coming with me, Steve.
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_02: And he had his driver there, like a Lincoln town car.
• 47:51
  SPEAKER_02: And I just said goodbye to everybody.
• 47:53
  SPEAKER_02: Neil said, get in, you know.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_02: So where are we going?
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_02: He says, we're going to drive around London for about three hours.
• 48:01
  SPEAKER_02: And so I just sat in the back with him,
• 48:04
  SPEAKER_02: and he said,
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_02: it's really important for you to understand the history here at Staple,
• 48:08
  SPEAKER_02: what's happening,
• 48:11
  SPEAKER_02: and the role that you're playing here.
• 48:13
  You must understand,
• 48:15
  you do not report to Charles Koppelman or any of those people.
• 48:20
  SPEAKER_02: You report to me and the four Beatles, their estates.
• 48:25
  SPEAKER_02: That's who you report to.
• 48:27
  SPEAKER_02: That's why you're here.
• 48:30
  SPEAKER_02: And you really need to understand that.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_02: And every single week,
• 48:33
  I want to know exactly what's going on because the fact is we
• 48:38
  don't trust them.
• 48:41
  And so you're our emissary,
• 48:44
  and we have demanded that you are here on our behalf.
• 48:49
  and that's what it was yeah um and he he would tell me the
• 48:55
  history you know of them
• 48:57
  together how far this went back uh all the things that had
• 49:02
  happened between them
• 49:04
  and why you know it was mal evans was the other guy that was
• 49:09
  the roadie and him and
• 49:11
  SPEAKER_02: then they
• 49:12
  Had Mount become the driver,
• 49:14
  and then they promoted the deal to a personal assistant.
• 49:18
  And then when everything went to hell,
• 49:21
  they made him the president of their company.
• 49:24
  SPEAKER_00: Mm-hmm.
• 49:26
  SPEAKER_02: That's the truth.
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_02: And they didn't want it any other way.
• 49:30
  They had another guy that brought in Alan Klein from the music
• 49:35
  business and created
• 49:36
  SPEAKER_02: a lot of turmoil between them.
• 49:39
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm not here to comment on any of that,
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_02: but I can tell you that was the time that we're not doing this anymore.
• 49:46
  SPEAKER_02: We're going back to our roots.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_02: It's kind of like Elvis Presley,
• 49:50
  SPEAKER_02: you mentioned,
• 49:50
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 49:51
  other people that these are people that were with us at the
• 49:53
  very beginning.
• 49:54
  SPEAKER_02: We didn't have anything.
• 49:56
  at each other did did did the four respective parties paul
• 50:02
  george ringo and john's
• 50:05
  estate were they aligned in terms of their goals and and
• 50:10
  desires for the project or
• 50:11
  did you have yes you didn't just have neil aspinall you had
• 50:15
  four different people
• 50:16
  SPEAKER_02: who no no and i i knew that no and they were all
• 50:20
  on the same page there was no arguing about anything you know
• 50:23
  the anthology was the
• 50:25
  last time that they would really work together and they decided
• 50:29
  then and there we
• 50:30
  better tell this story ourselves because if we don't somebody
• 50:34
  else is going to do
• 50:35
  SPEAKER_02: it
• 50:36
  SPEAKER_02: And they were the ones that actually financed it.
• 50:38
  SPEAKER_02: So I met the guys that were the producers of the series.
• 50:42
  SPEAKER_02: Actually, it was 10 hours.
• 50:44
  SPEAKER_02: I'd like to tell you another short story on that call.
• 50:48
  SPEAKER_02: After Zoe, Yoko really didn't say anything.
• 50:50
  SPEAKER_02: She introduced herself and she listened to them.
• 50:52
  SPEAKER_02: But it would be months later.
• 50:56
  SPEAKER_02: And this really wasn't my idea, but it came to me.
• 51:00
  SPEAKER_02: EMI wanted to do a theatrical release of the Beatles anthology.
• 51:07
  SPEAKER_02: They were only going to do one night.
• 51:08
  SPEAKER_02: It was going to be at the Sony Theater in New York.
• 51:11
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe you know where that is today.
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_02: And they said, you're the only one, Steve, that knows enough about it.
• 51:19
  SPEAKER_02: It's 10 hours.
• 51:19
  SPEAKER_02: You've got to cut it to 80 minutes.
• 51:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 51:22
  and i was i was in los angeles and and bruce kirkland came and
• 51:28
  said you got to do
• 51:29
  it steve and you got to go home right now and here's the
• 51:33
  address uh tomorrow and
• 51:35
  thursday they're waiting for you down in long beach and this is
• 51:39
  the production
• 51:40
  these this place was wild this is where they edit the biggest
• 51:44
  motion pictures on
• 51:45
  SPEAKER_02: earth like jurassic park and all that and
• 51:49
  I had all of the 10 hours,
• 51:51
  but the night before I was able to watch everything.
• 51:54
  And I don't know if you know film at all,
• 51:56
  but it all has time code at the bottom.
• 52:00
  So I'm able to look at the time code so I can understand how
• 52:05
  I'm going to do this
• 52:08
  and where I'm going to make the jump cuts and how the story's
• 52:11
  going to flow.
• 52:12
  SPEAKER_02: So it saved...
• 52:15
  something like that could take a month and this was going to be
• 52:19
  done in two days
• 52:21
  and the guys that were assigned to me were just the biggest
• 52:25
  badasses in the world
• 52:27
  and they were huge beatles fans and they just couldn't wait to
• 52:31
  do this with me you
• 52:32
  know and we i just had a ball doing it anyway the the following
• 52:37
  week we all fly to
• 52:38
  SPEAKER_02: new york
• 52:40
  and uh yoga ono is the guest of honor and there's like 800
• 52:44
  people there sold out i
• 52:46
  don't even know that they sold tickets i maybe it was a charity
• 52:49
  thing or something
• 52:51
  and and i was there and i'd never um spoken to her and i hadn't
• 52:57
  really i mean she'd
• 52:59
  SPEAKER_02: heard me do this but we didn't have any dialogue and um
• 53:05
  SPEAKER_02: I was brought down this corridor,
• 53:07
  SPEAKER_02: and I was oblivious to this going on,
• 53:11
  SPEAKER_02: but E,
• 53:11
  SPEAKER_02: the television network,
• 53:13
  SPEAKER_02: was live at the same time.
• 53:16
  And I'm introduced to Yoko as she takes me by the hand and
• 53:20
  moves me to a little separate place.
• 53:23
  SPEAKER_02: And she's talking to me.
• 53:25
  SPEAKER_02: And this is live on E!
• 53:26
  SPEAKER_02: Because a friend of mine in Los Angeles left it on my voicemail.
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_02: Steve, you're not going to believe this.
• 53:33
  SPEAKER_02: But what she said to me that night,
• 53:35
  SPEAKER_02: she said,
• 53:35
  SPEAKER_02: I want you to know how much I appreciate you,
• 53:38
  SPEAKER_02: Steve.
• 53:39
  SPEAKER_02: And I know all the hard work that you have put into this.
• 53:43
  And I want you to know that John would be extremely pleased
• 53:47
  with you and everything
• 53:48
  SPEAKER_02: that's happened.
• 53:49
  SPEAKER_01: I want you to know.
• 53:50
  SPEAKER_01: That's pretty great.
• 53:53
  SPEAKER_02: And I said, well, you know, it's a thrill for me to be here.
• 53:58
  SPEAKER_02: I loved every minute of it.
• 53:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 54:00
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
• 54:01
  So how big,
• 54:02
  how big were the album sales and how big was the audience for
• 54:05
  the millions?
• 54:06
  I mean,
• 54:06
  we ended up,
• 54:07
  I mean,
• 54:07
  I can't even,
• 54:08
  but it,
• 54:09
  it's staggering in terms of what it did.
• 54:12
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, uh, in that first pass over the $350 million in sales altogether.
• 54:20
  SPEAKER_02: And it just broke every record.
• 54:22
  SPEAKER_02: And, um, again, you know, I, I had,
• 54:27
  SPEAKER_02: a lot of help out there.
• 54:29
  SPEAKER_02: I can be the writer and I did write it over,
• 54:32
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 54:33
  SPEAKER_02: five days and nights at my little Buckhead home,
• 54:36
  SPEAKER_02: legal pads that were faxed to LA,
• 54:39
  SPEAKER_02: but it was Bruce Kirkland,
• 54:41
  executive vice president who served at Capitol as the editor
• 54:45
  and Ricky Mintz,
• 54:45
  SPEAKER_02: who was the genius creative director that put it all together.
• 54:50
  SPEAKER_02: So I can write all day.
• 54:53
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 54:54
  SPEAKER_02: and I know how to do that,
• 54:57
  SPEAKER_02: but it takes a village to kind of put it all together in a way,
• 55:01
  SPEAKER_02: in a sense that,
• 55:02
  SPEAKER_02: wow,
• 55:02
  SPEAKER_02: this is striking.
• 55:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 55:04
  SPEAKER_02: Those guys deserve a lot of credit too.
• 55:08
  SPEAKER_02: But it's like a,
• 55:10
  SPEAKER_02: It was a phenomenon.
• 55:12
  SPEAKER_02: And I'd like to,
• 55:14
  SPEAKER_02: one of the biggest things,
• 55:15
  one of the biggest reasons I wanted to do this with you is I
• 55:20
  wanted to tell you
• 55:20
  SPEAKER_02: what an interesting time it was.
• 55:26
  SPEAKER_02: 1997.
• 55:26
  SPEAKER_02: 1998 would bring devastation to the music industry with Napster.
• 55:32
  SPEAKER_02: And this was software that allowed millions of people,
• 55:35
  SPEAKER_02: primarily younger people,
• 55:36
  SPEAKER_02: to steal music,
• 55:38
  SPEAKER_02: digital music.
• 55:39
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 55:40
  SPEAKER_02: And I mean, go back.
• 55:42
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it was... No, I was there.
• 55:45
  SPEAKER_01: I remember.
• 55:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 55:47
  SPEAKER_02: So if Napster had been right in the middle of 1995 and the Beatles,
• 55:55
  SPEAKER_02: I think we'd still be very successful.
• 55:58
  SPEAKER_02: We wouldn't have done anywhere near what this thing was going to do.
• 56:02
  So what we did is,
• 56:04
  historically speaking,
• 56:05
  and that's why I want to talk about it,
• 56:08
  SPEAKER_02: It is history.
• 56:09
  It was the last time that you could market a mega,
• 56:14
  mega music property in analog.
• 56:17
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 56:18
  Just before digital,
• 56:20
  Napster,
• 56:20
  and then subsequently,
• 56:21
  you know,
• 56:23
  Apple,
• 56:23
  iTunes.
• 56:23
  SPEAKER_02: And because consumers...
• 56:25
  would would not purchase music going forward in that sense yeah
• 56:31
  so we position the
• 56:32
  beatles anthology as not a nice to have but a must-have for
• 56:39
  people who like you and
• 56:41
  me yeah it's a soundtrack of your life and it's important and
• 56:47
  it's happening the
• 56:48
  first part of it at thanksgiving so it's a gift yeah for
• 56:52
  christmas and so forth but
• 56:53
  SPEAKER_02: uh
• 56:54
  SPEAKER_01: Well, it's a great story, Steve.
• 56:57
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks.
• 56:57
  And I can see the through line from your days at Turner to this
• 57:03
  great project.
• 57:04
  SPEAKER_01: And I appreciate you sharing the story.
• 57:06
  SPEAKER_02: You're welcome.
• 57:07
  SPEAKER_02: I loved every minute of it.
• 57:08
  I think the Beatles are one of those acts that's just going to
• 57:11
  live 100 years from now.
• 57:13
  It'll be interesting to see today how many people qualify for
• 57:18
  that distinction.
• 57:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 57:20
  SPEAKER_01: Well, thanks for sharing with us, Steve Chamberlain.
• 57:22
  SPEAKER_01: Appreciate your time.
• 57:23
  SPEAKER_01: My pleasure.
• 57:23
  SPEAKER_01: Hey, everybody.
• 57:25
  SPEAKER_01: These are the takeaways from my conversation with Steve Chamberlain.
• 57:27
  SPEAKER_01: If you're watching,
• 57:28
  SPEAKER_01: you can see that I am now in the home office,
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_01: my very well-appointed home office that I like very much.
• 57:36
  SPEAKER_01: in our home on the Upper West Side.
• 57:37
  SPEAKER_01: So enjoyed that conversation with Steve Chamberlain.
• 57:39
  SPEAKER_01: You know,
• 57:40
  SPEAKER_01: it started as a,
• 57:41
  SPEAKER_01: hey,
• 57:41
  SPEAKER_01: let's do a follow-up on the Peter Doggett conversation with the Beatles.
• 57:45
  SPEAKER_01: But I found interesting Steve's early days at Turner Broadcasting.
• 57:49
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I grew up in Atlanta, as most of y'all know.
• 57:51
  SPEAKER_01: So I was on the other side of that television in 1983.
• 57:54
  SPEAKER_01: I was 14 when he joined the company.
• 57:57
  SPEAKER_01: And it's interesting to think about how primitive...
• 58:00
  SPEAKER_01: cable television was at the time.
• 58:02
  SPEAKER_01: I worked in digital media 15 years later in New York City,
• 58:06
  SPEAKER_01: and the world was a completely different place than where Steve started.
• 58:09
  SPEAKER_01: Not only was he hawking VHS tapes to Blockbuster,
• 58:13
  SPEAKER_01: You know,
• 58:14
  SPEAKER_01: they were building that company,
• 58:15
  SPEAKER_01: the distribution for the Superstation,
• 58:18
  SPEAKER_01: which was a UHF channel called Channel 17 in Atlanta.
• 58:21
  SPEAKER_01: They were building that one deal with one cable operator at a time,
• 58:25
  trying to get those guys to add it to their system and get the
• 58:28
  end user to pay,
• 58:29
  SPEAKER_01: who knows,
• 58:30
  SPEAKER_01: $2 a month or something like that for access to the Superstation.
• 58:34
  SPEAKER_01: And it's the reason why a lot of people regionally in the Southeast,
• 58:38
  SPEAKER_01: well outside of Atlanta,
• 58:39
  became Atlanta Braves fans back in the 80s because that's the
• 58:42
  team they could see.
• 58:44
  SPEAKER_01: And that was all Ted Turner.
• 58:45
  SPEAKER_01: And so Steve had a front row seat to that.
• 58:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I found that very interesting.
• 58:49
  SPEAKER_01: So a couple of takeaways, things you might not know.
• 58:51
  SPEAKER_01: Steve was my neighbor in Atlanta, lived down the street.
• 58:53
  We met through a technology incubator at Georgia Tech where we
• 58:58
  were both advisors
• 58:59
  SPEAKER_01: to some companies where we both spoke once in a while.
• 59:03
  SPEAKER_01: I've learned a lot from him over the last,
• 59:06
  SPEAKER_01: gosh,
• 59:06
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know,
• 59:07
  SPEAKER_01: 14 years or something like that since I've known him.
• 59:09
  SPEAKER_01: I've enjoyed our walks around the neighborhood.
• 59:11
  SPEAKER_01: He's a smart and interesting guy and I enjoyed our conversation today.
• 59:14
  SPEAKER_01: You know,
• 59:15
  SPEAKER_01: whatever you're doing in your career right now,
• 59:18
  SPEAKER_01: somebody's going to be interested in it in 30 years.
• 59:20
  I remember I played golf with one of the parents of some
• 59:23
  friends from grade school
• 59:25
  SPEAKER_01: and he worked for IBM and we were playing golf and
• 59:30
  A lot of kids from my grade school and high school,
• 59:32
  a lot of their parents worked at IBM.
• 59:34
  So back in the early 80s,
• 59:35
  there was a big IBM office in Atlanta and had a lot of
• 59:38
  transplants.
• 59:38
  SPEAKER_01: And a lot of these transplants were from the Midwest and the Northeast.
• 59:42
  SPEAKER_01: And they were Catholic.
• 59:43
  SPEAKER_01: And so they'd send their kids to Catholic schools, St.
• 59:45
  SPEAKER_01: Jude Elementary School and St.
• 59:47
  SPEAKER_01: Pius High School in Atlanta.
• 59:49
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of parents there didn't know what IBM really did.
• 59:52
  SPEAKER_01: They sold computers, whatever that was.
• 59:54
  So I had this really interesting conversation asking him about
• 59:57
  what they were
• 59:57
  SPEAKER_01: selling and what the environment was like in 1984,
• 1:00:01
  SPEAKER_01: 85 at IBM in Atlanta.
• 1:00:03
  But if you think back and how cool and interesting and
• 1:00:07
  revolutionary the personal
• 1:00:09
  SPEAKER_01: computer was that IBM was selling back in 85,
• 1:00:13
  SPEAKER_01: but also the big business mainframe stuff they were doing,
• 1:00:17
  SPEAKER_01: It was, it was pretty fascinating.
• 1:00:18
  So can you imagine what the dawn of AI,
• 1:00:21
  if you're working in AI right now,
• 1:00:23
  like
• 1:00:23
  how much it's going to change the world and how cool that might
• 1:00:27
  look 30 years in
• 1:00:28
  SPEAKER_01: the future to just understand what the world was like before AI.
• 1:00:31
  It's kind of the experience a lot of us had in the early days
• 1:00:33
  of the internet.
• 1:00:35
  And then lastly,
• 1:00:36
  I think Steve's journey tells us to say yes when opportunities
• 1:00:40
  come away.
• 1:00:41
  We didn't talk about his days as a news reporter in Biloxi,
• 1:00:44
  Mississippi or in Florida,
• 1:00:46
  but
• 1:00:47
  SPEAKER_01: You know, that's how he started his career.
• 1:00:49
  SPEAKER_01: And he said yes when opportunities in management came his way.
• 1:00:52
  He said yes to go to Turner and then embrace those
• 1:00:56
  opportunities and got after him
• 1:00:58
  SPEAKER_01: with a great deal of gusto.
• 1:01:00
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's why he was able to achieve all he did.
• 1:01:02
  SPEAKER_01: And certainly when the opportunity came along to work with Frank Sinatra,
• 1:01:06
  SPEAKER_01: well,
• 1:01:06
  SPEAKER_01: that led to the Beatles,
• 1:01:08
  SPEAKER_01: et cetera,
• 1:01:08
  SPEAKER_01: et cetera.
• 1:01:09
  SPEAKER_01: So pretty interesting career,
• 1:01:10
  SPEAKER_01: lots to learn from Steve,
• 1:01:11
  SPEAKER_01: and I appreciate him being a part of the show.
• 1:01:14
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 1:01:14
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks for listening.
• 1:01:15
  SPEAKER_01: We will see you next time.
• 1:01:17
  SPEAKER_01: Take care.
• 1:01:17
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.