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How could this recognition shape future research or innovation in immunology · THE DAILY BRIEF

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  Speaker 1: Well, this year's Nobel Medicine Prize has been awarded to
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  Speaker 1: three scientists for their work on the human immune system.
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  Speaker 1: The award goes to Americans Mary Brunko and Fred Ramsdal
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  Speaker 1: in Japan's Shimon Sakagucci, who told reporters that the honor
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  Speaker 1: came as a surprise. Their research looked at how the
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  Speaker 1: immune system fights invaders like bacteria and viruses without attacking
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  Speaker 1: the body's own cells. Well, I'm joined now by Gunilla
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  Speaker 1: Carlson Head his son, professor of immunology and part of
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  Speaker 1: the Nobel Committee of the Karolinska Institute in Stockholm, Sweden.
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  Speaker 1: It's good to have you with us. Tell us more
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  Speaker 1: about why you and the Nobel Committee why you selected
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  Speaker 1: Mary Brunco, Fred Ramsdal and Shimone Sakagucci for the prize.
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  Speaker 2: Well, this trio broke some new ground and they really
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  Speaker 2: worked out what is quite complex principle on how we
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  Speaker 2: recognize foreign versus self, as you just explained, and this
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  Speaker 2: is really not an easy fit. And it was a
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  Speaker 2: sort of a three step process where they eat contributed
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  Speaker 2: critical discoveries. So it's that is really what the Nobel
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  Speaker 2: Prize is all about, is making those groundbreaking discoveries that
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  Speaker 2: lead then many other researchers to kind of build and
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  Speaker 2: the field really expanded after they made their discoveries.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, and what impact does their work have on today's science?
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  Speaker 1: And we all know someone who has an autoimmune disease,
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  Speaker 1: be it diabetes, multiple sclerosis, Chrohn's disease. So how can
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  Speaker 1: people who are sick today, how can they hope to
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  Speaker 1: benefit from this?
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  Speaker 2: So I think this is now a very very active
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  Speaker 2: field and there is in fact only two hundred clinical
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  Speaker 2: trials ongoing where clinicians and researchers are trying to find
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  Speaker 2: ways to either expand the activity of these cells or
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  Speaker 2: increase the activity of these regulatory cells in diseases like
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  Speaker 2: autoimmune diseases and also in some skin allergies for example.
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  Speaker 2: So there's actually, you know, many diseases where there is
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  Speaker 2: potential for these treatments to provide new sort of approaches
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  Speaker 2: to handle them. And transplantation is of course also a
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  Speaker 2: classic example of where you may want to control the
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  Speaker 2: immune system. And this is what these cells do. They
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  Speaker 2: are and they are basically programmed to control our immune
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  Speaker 2: system so we don't respond too strongly to the wrong things.
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  Speaker 2: Another really interesting and important area is cancer, and that
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  Speaker 2: is actually the opposite. In those cases, you want to
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  Speaker 2: block the activity of these cells to enhance immunity against
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  Speaker 2: the tumor. So it really touches upon quite a lot
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  Speaker 2: of different diseases.
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  Speaker 1: Was there a particular moment or breakthrough in the research
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  Speaker 1: of this trio that the committee found especially compel it.
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  Speaker 2: Yes, I mean there's two parts to it. Really. Sakagucci
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  Speaker 2: did the first discoveries and he was very very persistent.
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  Speaker 2: He had a notion he understood that there must be
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  Speaker 2: a type of T cell. This is all about the
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  Speaker 2: white blood cells, the T cells, and he understood that
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  Speaker 2: there must be a sort of a guardian cell that
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  Speaker 2: ensures that we don't respond to the wrong things. So
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  Speaker 2: he worked in the eighties and the nineties and eventually
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  Speaker 2: it was able to show that these cells exist, but
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  Speaker 2: the sort of critical evidence didn't come until a few
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  Speaker 2: years later when Mary Bronco and fred ra cells were
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  Speaker 2: able to actually show what genes control these cells, and
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  Speaker 2: this together then really was sort of nailed the discoveries
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  Speaker 2: and showed that this is a very specific type of
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  Speaker 2: cell that is programmed to dampen the immune response in
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  Speaker 2: contrast to our other T cells that are there to attack.
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  Speaker 2: But it's too dangerous to have an immune system that
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  Speaker 2: doesn't have these checks and balances, because the immune system
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  Speaker 2: is very powerful. So to characterize this extra layer of
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  Speaker 2: the immune system was very important. And once we understand that,
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  Speaker 2: we can also then work towards using it.
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  Speaker 1: It's fascinating, and we understand there is a woman among
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  Speaker 1: the three winners. She's only the fourteenth woman out of
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  Speaker 1: two hundred and thirty two laureates to get a Nobel
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  Speaker 1: in medicine. What do we know about Mary Brunco?
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  Speaker 2: So this is actually a good question because we did
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  Speaker 2: not know much in terms of she has kept a
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  Speaker 2: fairly low profile. She has not had a classic academic career.
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  Speaker 2: She's working as a very distinguished SOFF scientist at an
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  Speaker 2: institute in Seattle, but not sort of having her own
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  Speaker 2: typical academic career, and she's not a professor, etc. But
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  Speaker 2: she did these extremely important findings and this is what
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  Speaker 2: she is awarded for, and that is enough for a
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  Speaker 2: novel price. It's exactly what Nobel prizes are for, is
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  Speaker 2: to pinpoint those very important breakthroughs that allow other people
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  Speaker 2: to then expand and build on that field. So I
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  Speaker 2: would say this morning, we didn't know much about Marie Bronco.
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  Speaker 2: Of course we in the committee did because we have
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  Speaker 2: researched everything that was done from the very early days
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  Speaker 2: of this field, but the world in general did not
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  Speaker 2: know much about her. But I think it has all
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  Speaker 2: changed today because I can see that she's already done
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  Speaker 2: a lot of interviews during the day, so it will
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  Speaker 2: be very exciting to hear what she has to say
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  Speaker 2: when she comes to Stockholm in December.
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  Speaker 1: It will be for sure, Vanilla crossam head us done.
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  Speaker 1: We appreciate your time and your insights tonight. We appreciate
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  Speaker 1: you taking the time to talk with its. Thank you,
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  Speaker 1: thanks very much and joining me here at the big table.
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  Speaker 1: Now is our science reporter Matthew war Ages. Matthew, it's
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  Speaker 1: good to see you again. A Nobel Prize in physiology
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  Speaker 1: or medicine for research on the immune system. How significant
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  Speaker 1: is this?
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  Speaker 3: Pretty significant when it comes to you know, the thing
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  Speaker 3: that's designed to protect us from getting sick, and of
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  Speaker 3: course for most of us it works pretty well, the
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  Speaker 3: immune system. Sometimes though it doesn't work quite the way
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  Speaker 3: we want it to, and people get things called autoimmune disorders,
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  Speaker 3: and we probably know these more commonly as things like
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  Speaker 3: diabetes or Crohne's disease or rheumatoid arthritis is just a
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  Speaker 3: few of many examples. Well, this research recognizes is understanding,
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  Speaker 3: foundational understanding of how the immune system sometimes gets the
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  Speaker 3: job done and sometimes isn't able to do so. In
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  Speaker 3: nineteen ninety five, they discovered that T cells, which already
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  Speaker 3: knew about, were regulated by something that is now called
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  Speaker 3: regulatory t cells. Imagine a traffic warden coming in and saying, Okay,
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  Speaker 3: these traffic lights are doing their job, but the traffic
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  Speaker 3: lights aren't always doing their job, and I'm going to
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  Speaker 3: fix those ones up, And in this case, regulatory t
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  Speaker 3: cells work out which immune cells aren't working and doing
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  Speaker 3: their job and gets them out of that situation. The
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  Speaker 3: other part of the research was to actually understand why
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  Speaker 3: that process is sometimes not working, and that is to say,
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  Speaker 3: there's a mutation on a particular gene, and if that
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  Speaker 3: exists in some people, maybe these regulatory T cells aren't
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  Speaker 3: able to function the way that we need them to.
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  Speaker 3: So ultimately it's an understanding or recognition of the understanding
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  Speaker 3: that this is how our immune system is able to
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  Speaker 3: work effectively the cells that are involved in that process
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  Speaker 3: and why sometimes don't work.
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  Speaker 1: So if we have at understanding of why the immune
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  Speaker 1: system sometimes breaks down and attacks itself, what does it
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  Speaker 1: mean for people with these oddoimmune diseases Like you said,
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  Speaker 1: people with Chrome's disease, multiple sclerosis. I mean, can they
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  Speaker 1: look forward to a future with perhaps better treatments or
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  Speaker 1: even a cure.
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  Speaker 3: I think that's the question that everyone is asking, isn't it?
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  Speaker 3: And the answer, probably in this case is a cautious yes.
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  Speaker 3: As I say, it's foundational, So we're recognizing the achievement
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  Speaker 3: and the discovery of how these things work. The next
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  Speaker 3: question is can we translate that into something that works
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  Speaker 3: for people. There are about two hundred or so clinical
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  Speaker 3: trials underway into various drugs and therapies that might help
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  Speaker 3: fix these malfunctioning regulatory T cell processes in people that
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  Speaker 3: need it to be fixed, but they haven't gone to
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  Speaker 3: producing these drugs, and for many of these clinical trials
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  Speaker 3: they're coming back negative. We're not actually able to say
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  Speaker 3: this is advancing us in the direction we want. So
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  Speaker 3: the promises in what could happen in the few future.
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  Speaker 3: Recognizing it's taken thirty years for us to recognize these discoveries.
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  Speaker 3: It could take twenty to thirty years more for us
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  Speaker 3: to actually get something people can use.
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  Speaker 1: That's a long time. And you know, we hear all
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  Speaker 1: the time how difficult it is to get animals to
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  Speaker 1: do these testing, to get people to do these testing.
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  Speaker 1: And at the same time we're hearing that EI is
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  Speaker 1: going to change everything, and that we're going to be
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  Speaker 1: able to have I guess, individually designed, genetically designed treatments,
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  Speaker 1: but we're not there yet. That makes me wonder the
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  Speaker 1: Nobel Prize for or in medicine, how relevant is it
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  Speaker 1: really now?
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  Speaker 3: I think it's always an interesting question to ask. We've
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  Speaker 3: got all these prizes that recognize scientific achievements. The Nobel
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  Speaker 3: Prizes are right at the top, and tomorrow will recognize
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  Speaker 3: the physics recipient and Chemistry on Wednesday. What is the significance?
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  Speaker 3: What is the relevance of the Nobel Prize? It acknowledges
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  Speaker 3: the work that in this case, three people have done
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  Speaker 3: in terms of discovery and understanding of this particular field.
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  Speaker 3: But ultimately, these are three people that are kind of
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  Speaker 3: totemic in a way. They represent many diverse contributions across
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  Speaker 3: this particular new field. Effectively that is being recognized today
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  Speaker 3: one hundreds thousands of scientists, all contributing over a very
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  Speaker 3: long period of time to say this is what we
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  Speaker 3: didn't know thirty years ago, and now we actually understand
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  Speaker 3: how these things work. The next step, as I say,
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  Speaker 3: is to translate that, and the Nobel Prize is really
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  Speaker 3: that opportunity to recognize for three people with a cash
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  Speaker 3: prize as well, what that achievement is.
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  Speaker 1: All right, our science reporter Matthew Ward ages, Matthew good,
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  Speaker 1: have you in the studio, Thank you, Thank you,