Latest / The Wholehearted Enneagram Podcast / Everyday Holiness | a conversation with Ginger Harrington

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Everyday Holiness | a conversation with Ginger Harrington · The Wholehearted Enneagram Podcast

• 0:14
  SPEAKER_03: Welcome to the Simply Wholehearted Podcast.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_03: I'm Amy Wicks, your host, as well as our good friend Ashley Pettman.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_03: Here at Simply Wholehearted, we are sharing our journey as we discover how to better love the world of all of our heart, soul, mind, and strength.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_03: And even though you might be surrounded by a world of half-hearted, we hope to inspire you to living wholeheartedly.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_03: By inviting our different friends to share their simple ideas of how they live on purposeful and intentional.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_03: She has simple ways to encourage us to grow and enjoy our life.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_03: As usual, we'd love to hear what you think of this episode.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_03: And now here's a conversation with Ginger Harrington.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_03: So what is it?
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_03: What does your workout look like these days?
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_03: Do you go to a gym?
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_03: Is it walking?
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_03: What is it?
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_02: I water fitness.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_02: And so today I actually got to get in the pool with folks because I wasn't teaching today.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_02: I walked.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_02: I've been trying to get back into some strength training because writing a book has been, you know, just so much more time at the computer.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_03: Totally.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_02: I was not good about that.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_02: And I I've paid the price.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_02: I've like really need to strengthen my back again.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_03: No, it's true.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_03: I kind of even, um, my father-in-law so graciously building me a table for our podcast stuff that will because we're on a card table in like the middle of the house, and you know, it looks, but I I really thought about making a standing table because I feel like I sit so much and I'm not good at sedentary lifestyle.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_03: So anyway, but I get it, the whole like sitting and writing, and it can take a toll.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_03: You gotta be careful.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_02: It is, you know, it's I hate to tell tell people, yes.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_02: I I have a work injury from sitting at my desk.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_02: Like that sounds so lame.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_03: It's hard, it's hard, but it's real.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I love it.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_03: So you're teaching classes, so that's always good.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_03: That's a good motivator too.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_03: Keeps you accountable.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_02: It does, yeah.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_02: If you don't show up, boy, they're not happy with you.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, that's for sure.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_03: I actually certified like did a certification class to be a workout instructor.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_03: What?
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_03: Really?
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_03: I did.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_03: I did when I was like in my early 20s.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_03: But here's the thing.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_03: This is so embarrassing.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_03: I I could barely pass because I could not get the like stepping stuff, like you know, the more like high-energy cardio dancing.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_03: I and I couldn't get the reversal of it to lead it.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_03: I was focusing so hard on trying to make the right moves.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_03: I like barely pass.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_03: I think, I think they actually just made an exception and let me pass.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_03: So needless to say I've never taught.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_03: Like, I could see doing, I don't know, a strength training class, right?
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_03: Because it doesn't require.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_03: Anyway, so there you go.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_03: In case I don't think I've ever told you that, probably.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_00: I've never heard that.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_00: That's new.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't know you had that certification.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_00: So it was the left and right, like your left becomes their right.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_03: And trying to mirror them?
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, you have to be personally.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_03: You know what I'm talking about, right?
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_03: No.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_03: And you figured it out.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_02: I still get that mixed up sometimes.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_03: And then I just say, your other right.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, there you go.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_03: Surely everyone should just have grace because that is confusing.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_03: That's awesome.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I will I'll take a minute to introduce us really quick.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_03: We just, and I I try to always remember to put this in the emails back and forth, but we just push record and we start talking and we just are hanging out and we're just having coffee.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_03: And uh we in fact just got done with a re-recording because we had some tech difficulties and we were so sad because it was a great conversation that we had, and she very generously made it happen again today.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_03: But I was like, it's our second date.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_03: We're just, you know, we're getting back together.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_03: The first one went great.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_03: So here we go.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_03: So I am Amy, and I'm um now, you know, just like super great friends with Jeannie because you know, she's friends with everyone, and she is, and this is Ashley.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_03: Hey, Ashley Pittman.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_03: And uh, you sound like you have a southern, yep, like your fellow southern sister.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, when you popped on, you said hey y'all, and I thought, okay, where are you from?
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's not a good day if you don't say hey y'all to somebody.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_02: I grew up in Knoxville, Tennessee.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_02: But uh still hanging on to a little bit of that southern girl sweetness.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_03: Knoxville.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_03: That is um probably our if we were to move again, we're in Kansas City, Missouri, we would either move back to Colorado or Knoxville, maybe Nashville, but just gorgeous.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's a pretty area.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, Virginia's not too bad either.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_02: So that's beautiful.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_02: Um, my husband would like to retire elsewhere just simply because they tax his military retirement.
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, are you serious?
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_02: That's terrible.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, well, and we're close to DC, so you know it's a lot of less than hour and a half a day.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_02: It's brutal.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_02: So I don't blame him.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_02: Even though I don't like to move, I don't blame him for right, right, right, yeah.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_03: Now, how many years has he been in the military?
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_03: Career mil military, obviously.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, he retired at 24 and he now works with the Border Patrol.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so yeah.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, that's awesome.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_03: So when he where where's your dream retirement?
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_03: Like, where would that look?
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_02: Some place beautiful with lots of friends.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, that's great.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_02: You know, eye candy and and you know, the good things.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_02: Community.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_03: And you probably have a lot of community because all over the place because you it's you seem that warm, you know, you're just gonna bloom where you're planted, kind of thing.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_03: So, and you probably know about that.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_03: How many moves have you guys done in your marriage?
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_02: Oh gosh, I I don't even wanna wanna count.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_02: Not as many as uh probably made 10.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's a lot that is stations where we we were there for four or five years.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_02: Oh wow, okay.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_02: You know, some people on the two-year rotation cycle we can really rack up some moves.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, yeah.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_03: Well, one of our collective members, we have kind of a team of eight women right now who are just um kind of uh at we're kind of gathering around this message of living wholeheartedly.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_03: And um, one of them, um, she is uh stationed with her husband um out at the Air Force Base that's I don't know, what is it, like an hour from us, um south evil east of us.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_03: It's uh Whiteman Air Force Base.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_03: And so anyway, they've they've moved a ton.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_03: And um, she immediately went, um, she's kind of helps me with all the books that come across um my path.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_03: And she saw your book and read, you know, more about you and was like, oh, I've got to, I've gotta read this, I've got to meet her, I gotta find out more about her.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_02: Um well, I saw her stuff on your, you know, I've like I've been checking out yeah show notes and stuff like that.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, somebody's connected to the military.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, yes, definitely.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_03: And she, yeah, there's so much there.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_03: In fact, I think we're gonna have her um actually we will have had her um for our July, like fourth of July um kind of episode, just highlighting she has got quite a story and um and then also military life and um just well I would love to connect up with her with um the military ministry that I work with.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_02: We love to have her guest host or you know, share her story.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, that'd be awesome.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_03: And so maybe we should make that happen.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_03: She's great, she's amazing, and and you'll find out she actually um was a White House speechwriter um for I think at least eight years.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_03: And for Laura Bush um personally.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_03: Interesting background.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_03: So she's actually a very gifted writer, um, if you it which you've already seen um come through.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, we'll definitely connect you guys.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_03: Katie would love that.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_03: So um well, I know we wanted to talk about a couple of things, um, just getting to know you, some of your background, obviously, military background, lots of moves.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you're in Virginia, so tell us a little bit about um kids and writing and how that's developed for you and unfolded.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_02: We've been in Virginia here for almost seven years.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, wow.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_02: We um came to Virginia via Okinawa, Japan, which was one of those duty stations in the military that we didn't want to go to because our oldest was just starting high school.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_02: We've got three kids.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_02: And this was in 2007.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_02: He was going to be a freshman in high school, and we just weren't sure, you know, like how do you get ready for college when you're overseas like that, and we weren't really excited about the move.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_02: But once we got settled, it was our very favorite experience in the military, and we were there for four years.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_02: Oh wow.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_02: Our son got to graduate from Kadina High School in Okinawa, Japan.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_02: And it was just a nice piece of of you know, continuity to be there that long and have that um cross-cultural experience, and it was so broadening for our kids.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_02: Our children are now, um, our oldest is 25, and he just graduated from the University of Louisville and is gonna be a speech pathologist in Charlottesville.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, that's awesome!
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, we're so proud of him.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_02: And our middle daughter is uh gonna be uh 23 real soon, and she did two and a half years, she went to um school for a couple of years in college and wasn't sure what she wanted to finish her in.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_02: And she said, Mom, I think God's calling me to um do YWAM, which is youth with the missions Bible ship school.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_02: She said they have one in Australia, Australia, and um you could you go to unreached people groups, like where you have to ride in a Jeep off-road for days to get there.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_02: And that to her sounded like awesome.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, oh right, right.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_03: Wait a minute.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_02: You can follow God, but definitely an active save to release our grip on her.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_02: And she did uh she did a youth of the mission school there in Perth, Australia, and then she stayed on staff for a couple of years and just got back this year and um is regrouping and be heading back to school in the fall and wants to pursue Christian counseling.
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, good for her.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it was a direction changer for her and just such an amazing experience.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_02: And every time I would start to miss her, I would just say, Nope, Lord, I'm not even.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just gonna open my hand and praise you that she's doing this and that she's having these experiences.
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_02: And then our youngest is a nursing student, and she's also gonna be a junior in college this year.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_02: So we'll have two college juniors this year.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_03: Woohoo! The finish line is in sight.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_03: That's awesome.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_03: I love that.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_02: Anyway, that's what life looks like, you know, family-wise for us.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, for years I kind of looked toward those empty nest years and kind of went, Oh, I'm not thinking I'm gonna like that.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I had been all about being mom and um really, you know, invested heavily in my children, as we all do.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and that is is a letting go process, and God has been so faithful and it's been a good experience, even though I just kind of wondered what what will I do with myself uh when my kids are out of the house and write books now.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_02: That's what we do.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, that's so great.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_03: All these years of experience and living and raising, and um, and here you get to share um a lot of that wisdom.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_03: That's awesome.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it it is a privilege that uh I'm just absolutely thrilled to have.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_03: Now, what inspired uh holy in the moment?
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_03: Because that I mean, that it's not parenthood, it's not marriage, it's not military life.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_03: And we will talk more about what you are doing specifically for ministry connected with the military.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but what inspired um going down that road?
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, I think it's beautiful because I don't I don't think we hear about kind of that topic, holiness, too much in our culture anymore.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_02: So well, the book has an interesting genesis in I don't know if you've ever experienced those January blues at the beginning of a year.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_01: Oh yes.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_02: Um I was in a place, it was the year that we were going to be retiring from the military, and I had no idea what was gonna be happening next.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_02: Um moving transitions had been hard for me, and that is um kind of the anchor story at the first of the book.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_02: But I had really battled with anxiety a lot, and I wasn't looking forward to just this unknown of not knowing are we gonna be moving, are we gonna be staying?
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_02: What kind of career field are you going to do?
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_02: The kids are getting ready to leave.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_02: And we had also said, you know, I had mentioned to my husband that I wanted to publish and wanted to be a professional writer and speaker.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_02: And at that time I was professionally speaking, but the writing, um, the book deal hadn't come yet.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_02: And kind of said, well, hey, let's let's spend three years, you know, really invest three years, make that your full-time job, get serious about it.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_02: And I was approaching the end of that three-year mark, and I was like, Whoa, I haven't been able to accomplish this.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_02: So all of the that uncertainty was hanging heavy on me that January, and I was really kind of down, and just was like, Lord, I know that you've got a plan for this, and um I'm I'm struggling to trust you and just rest in the not knowing right now.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_02: But would you show me how you want me to navigate this season of unknown in my life?
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, I really this question, you know, the Holy Spirit just inserted this question.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_02: If you choose one holy thing, one whole thing, one thing that's good for you, one simple thing each day, what difference could it make?
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_02: And so that was God's way of just, you know, really focusing me on let's take care of now and make the best choices you can make today, and let me take care of the rest.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_02: And so as I began to do that, that began to become a book idea.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_02: And it I played around with that and tried to write it for years, and um, you know, never got farther than a couple of blog posts until God was ready for me to write it.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_02: And he really waited until he had done some internal work in me, where he had been writing that story in me.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_02: He introduced the idea in 2013, but he didn't open the opportunity to write it until 2017.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_02: And sometimes that can look like failure when it's a long, slow process.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_02: But what God has shown me is that that his timing is perfect.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_02: And if I had written that book in 2013, it would have been kind of a light and cute little devotional, which is a great thing to write, but not what he had designed.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_02: And so it was only after I had been through some counseling and some counseling training and really some intense study and um soul searching and and healing process of my own that he opened up the opportunity to write the book.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_02: And you write from such a different place.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, yeah.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_02: God's written the message in you and brought you through that process of healing.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_02: It in it, I don't know, it just it impacted the book.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_02: It's much deeper, it's much fuller, it's much richer than it would have been four years ago.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm grateful for that.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_03: That's beautiful.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_03: I think again and again, keep having these conversations about what the Lord does in the waiting.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_03: And it's so the wilderness, however you want to frame it, where it it just seems like what is going on?
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_03: You you feel like these promises or that direction, and you've been obedient, you've been faithful, and you wait and wait and wait.
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_03: But that the work, the the move of of you know, his spirit in the waiting is just it produces so many good things and allows us to be able to do what it was that he put inside of us long ago.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_03: Because wouldn't it be ready or equipped or or like you said, it would it it could be okay, but but was it all that it could have been or what it is now?
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, and that was such a beautiful picture to learn because I don't I don't know about you guys, but um for me sometimes when it feels like you're not when you've got a goal and you're not making forward progress on that and you're working and and you feel like life is a constant uphill battle you feel like you're just trudging and and when the end isn't in sight and the goal isn't in sight, it's so easy to be discouraged by that, to feel like that is failure or God saying no.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_02: And so oftentimes it is him waiting for the right timing, for him working within us, um, strengthening us, growing us, or for me also bringing us to a season of life where we have the time and the flexibility to fully invest in something.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_02: Um so for me, I think season of life was also a piece of that pie for entering into uh book writing and you know, I've done a lot of travel this spring promoting the book, and I would have been able to do that when my kids were at home.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, you know, God works it all out.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_02: So it's been a good lesson.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_02: I hope I can apply that the next same scenario, you know, it'll be a different context, but the same situation.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_02: We go through that pattern many times in our lives.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm I'm hoping and praying that this lesson has been such a beautiful lesson in that that I'll be able to really enjoy the process and rest in peace and and have that sense of expectancy that's happy to be where I am today, but still expecting God to work tomorrow.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_03: Oh yeah, that's so good.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, I love it.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_03: That's that's really beautiful.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_03: And we all know how much we've been trying to tell our friends again and again how much a book takes, you know, work-wise and people and all that time.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_03: And so it is it is really great.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_03: We really do need to be ready on so many levels and be in the right season, or at least, you know, at the very least, have the right community around us that can help us carry out such a huge task.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_02: Because that is another thing about writing a book is yes, it may come out of your uh out of your computer, but any Christian book that hits the market today is a work of an entire community.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_02: Or people who have you've learned from, people you've walked alongside, people who are helping you in the process, cheerleaders, the people that have taught you, you know, it's just not something that we do by ourselves.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_03: No, right.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_03: It's not an individual solo act.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_03: Just like, you know, the football analogy, football team analogy, right?
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_03: It's just not the quarterback, not just the kicker.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_03: It's everybody, all the players.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_03: That's so great.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_03: Well, what were some of the things that you would speak on before um this book?
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_03: What were some of the topics that were burning in your heart or that probably still are that um we probably have yet to see come to full fruition?
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_02: One of the things that is primary for me as a Christian content creator, whether it's speaking or writing, is to be able to connect God's word and with understanding and life application.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_02: So for years, my um my website was called Where the Spiritual Meets the Practical.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, like that.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_02: Um, in a practical way, has just been something that is I'm very passionate about.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_02: So I love teaching God's word.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_02: I love equipping people with tools to understand God's word in a way that they personally connect with.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_02: So um that application piece, you know, so what difference does it make?
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_02: How do you, you know, how do you be holy, you know?
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_02: Um just that application piece is so important.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_02: And it's that's a place where we a lot of times we get stuck.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_02: So that's one of the things that I'm very focused on.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_02: And the other um area that is just a real area of passion for me is encouraging people who feel stuck in in their in their faith walk.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um, maybe feel stuck struggling with anxiety or a difficult relationship or or just feeling like they're not growing, um, that they don't have the passion for God that they had in the past, and that hands-on boots on the ground kind of experience of how do you actually walk in the spirit?
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_02: How do you actually move forward when you're struggling with anxiety, things like that?
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_02: So that's something that I'm very passionate about.
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_02: And so that's all of my content will include those two concepts, practicality, and really being able to get um get some, you know, understand things that will help you gain victory over your flesh.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_02: Because our flesh really does it keeps us stuck in some some crazy places sometimes.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_03: Oh yes.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_03: And we actually, yeah, we talk about being stuck a lot.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_03: So I'd like to go there a little bit if we could.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_03: Ashley's rolling her eyes at me.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_03: Because we're the ones who talk about being stuck.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_03: Um just give some, yeah, just give a little bit of highlights.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_03: I know that's not necessarily part of this book though.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_03: I think Holiness does have something to do with it.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_03: Um give us some of the just the highlights of you know someone who's listening to this and they're like, yeah, I feel stuck right now.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_03: That's me.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_02: Well I think one of the things that I was very stuck in and on one level I knew it and the other level I didn't realize like maybe how deeply I was stuck.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_02: But I was really defining where I was spiritually and how I was doing spiritually and whether or not I was experiencing God's presence and things like that based on my emotions, whether or not I felt like God was close to me, whether or not I was able to feel um not feel anxious when we were move having a move or a significant life change.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_02: And you know when you struggle at times with a little depression or anxiety or um if you have an irritable nature you know or easily frustrated it's it's easy to feel stuck when you're trying to overcome those things and you're trying to depend on God but you don't necessarily feel like you are making progress.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_02: And that's easy to struggle with and that's by design God wants us to experience some of those struggles as we seek to grow in Him so that at some point in time we really get to that place where we realize oh I'm still trying to do some of this in my own effort.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_02: And so every now and then God allows us to get in this place where our strategies you know for being more patient or for being brave when we're struggling with anxiety that are the strategies that we've developed that have worked some of the times bring us to a place where they don't work anymore.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_02: And uh you know those sometimes those are faceplant moments but yeah um none of us like to be in those moments but we do they have a really powerful purpose in that it helps us to get past our emotions and our suck places and realize I do not have what it takes to overcome anxiety.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_02: I don't have what it takes to be patient when my kids are screaming.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_02: And so oftentimes that's exactly what we need to understand to fully surrender to the Lord and say I cannot do this in and of myself I must rely on you would you express yourself in me as patience or would you express yourself in me as faith right now I don't feel strong I don't feel calm but I'm gonna ask you to express yourself as faith in me.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_02: And that shift of perspective that shift of um source yeah the difference and I think for a long I think for in our Christian life it's real easy to think of um Christ as our resource where you go when you need the thing yeah whatever your thing is you know whether or not you need um generosity or graciousness or um wisdom you know whatever the thing is we kind of think that is the thing that's where where I go to get that Jesus is the source.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and so when we begin to realize that I'm stuck and my best efforts aren't getting me unstuck and God's got a purpose in this Lord I'm gonna take my hands off the wheel here and I'm gonna ask you to supply what I need even if it is just the desire to get unstuck.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_02: And that for me that has just made a powerful powerful difference because I like I said before I was still in some ways defining my faith um and where I was spiritually based on how I felt like I was doing how I felt whether or not God was pleased with me.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_02: And it's it's it's uncanny how you can know the truth and teach the truth but still have to learn the truth through your own experience.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and that's part of every believer's path uh to maturity and healing and freedom are these places along the road where you know it just doesn't work and the only recourse is to come to Christ as your source and if he's not gonna do it it ain't gonna get done.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah why we why he left us Holy Spirit to enable us to do these things or to to be in us and through us instead of just like take take and go you know run and go.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_03: It's running with um not just yeah that's awesome.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_03: I love it.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and we do we do we need those reminders because we can there's a difference there's the the distance between our head and our heart is sometimes in painful and difficult circumstances.
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't automatically become experiential knowledge and heart knowledge until the moments when God really puts you in a situation where He really wants for you to understand this next step this next thing or this place where you're struggling or the reason why this is so hard.
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_02: And uh why we struggle with the things that we struggle with.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_02: That's what after so oftentimes we want relief and he wants that growth.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah yeah that's a frustrating place to be when you realize and this is just me speaking personally when I realize I have all this knowledge in my head but it isn't working for me.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_00: It's so frustrating to think but I know I mean I know all the things so why isn't this working and and it's that it's because it's another area of growth it's another area that I need to understand who he is in me and through me and for me and all those things.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_00: And it doesn't happen it doesn't happen that way.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't happen I mean there's things we pick up by learning and of course you know reading scripture and all that stuff but then there's other things that come through very painful experiences.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_00: But then that's where it gets really rooted down deep if we if we walk through it the right way and we walk through it with him.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah it's generally painful so I know you share a lot of personal stories and and um experiences and prayers in the book uh Holy in the Moment but what was one of the one of the big ones maybe even one of the ones that you're like okay this is this is where the Lord's taking me on this writing journey because of the story and what I learned from this experience.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_02: Well I think the the story at the very beginning of the book tells about our move in our military move into the year 2000 from North Carolina to California and we had three small children just about a month before we left I got diagnosed with Graves disease which is a autoimmune disease.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_02: And you know I just thought now I don't have time to be sick and so you know they gave me some medicine and we hit the road and just hoped it would be okay.
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_02: And as we were coming into Monterey and getting settled in our house my thyroid levels just went into hyper overdrive and it was um it was months before my hands stopped shaking it was months and months before I slept more than an hour or two at night.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_02: It was it was it was big and we were brand new so continuity care in the military environment when you transition is difficult.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_02: Oh yeah you know it was months before I got in with the specialist and then they still have to you know figure out what's going on and so from August to December I was a wreck and I didn't know if it would ever clear up and so I would be awake at night and anxiety would just be just huge and I couldn't sleep I couldn't rest I it was just nuts.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_02: And so really learning to just to like the only thing the only way to get through was to hang on in the moment just like Lord I can't feel you I can't see what's going to happen next but I trust you and I'm gonna hang on to you that's all I can do right now.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_02: And that was you know the beginning of the journey where God was teaching me that faith is not an emotion um that you believe because it's true not because it feels true.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_02: And that was powerful journey of just the importance of learning to hang on in the moment.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_02: And so that's the you know this the chapter that kicks off a book on holiness and so right you know a couple of paragraphs into the book I say that was the year I thought I was going crazy.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_02: And you don't expect to just dive straight into that kind of of struggle when you pick up a book on holiness.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_02: But it's it's good it's where we're all at yes but the truth is holiness has everything to do with the things that we're struggling with because part of being holy is being whole healthy and whole and uninjured and everything working together also being set apart for the purposes of God.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_02: And so the verse that the book really is based on um talks about and God putting us together holy and whole and keeping us together spirit soul and body and coming to understand that that is the work that God is doing in our lives and so oftentimes I had been trying to make myself holy and whole and when you have experiences like that with debilitating anxiety or some you know some traumatic experience you can't make yourself holy and whole you can't you come straight you just slam into the door of what you cannot do for yourself and that is heal yourself make yourself holy and whole and so those are the things that God can do and learning to allow him to do those things and to trust him to do those things is the journey of a lifetime.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_02: And I can remember writing the back cover copy for Abingdon before I had written the rest of the book and I did not realize at the time that God was going to thread the struggle with fear the tension between holiness and faith um fear and faith throughout pretty much the entire book wow so I would have written the back cover differently if I had known that funny how that works it is but I really did not know that until I got to the parenting chapter and the Lord was revealing how much of my parenting decisions had been rooted in fear.
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_02: Fear of not being a good enough mom fear of failing my kids fear of disapproval you know just all the things I worried about it.
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_02: And I thought wow this is a thread that has run through my entire life and I hadn't realized it and that's part of God making us holy and whole is showing us the threads of those lifelong struggles.
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_02: And that's a very healing process.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_02: And now I have totally forgotten what question you asked me but I know Yeah no that's great.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_03: It was just kind of what what kind of prompted what was one of the bigger stories that prompted even you you know diving in to write a whole book about because sometimes it's a blog post.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_03: It's you know it's a talk that you give to different groups um it's not always a book and so um but it sounds like as with all of these things sometimes it was just about what the Lord wanted to do with you and you just got to carry it that way and then share it.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_00: I love I just wanted to say I love how you're bringing in the concept of wholeness and with holiness because it doesn't always that's not what people think when they hear holy they think perfect like which actually it actually plays in but not the way you're saying it it's it's like be perfect don't do that.
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_00: It's all the don'ts if you're holy it's all the don'ts you're not you're don'ting all these things and I think there's so much of what you're saying and one of the things I've I've learned is just the importance of integrity and what integrity is is that you're integrated.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's all your bits and broken pieces are being re-integrated together so that you actually are you have integrity because you're not broken.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's it's moving out of disintegration and into integration and which is wholeness and that is holy.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_00: And so I just I just want to point that out the diff the difference and the life giving difference of being whole versus just being clean on the outside.
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_00: That's a big difference.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_02: That is I love it.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and God is so faithful because so oftentimes we we feel like we need to help God do his work yeah I'll help you we don't have responsibility to make choices and to be obedient and things like that.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_02: But even in the work that God gives us to do and the responsibility that he gives us he is so faithful and wants to be the source of of the energy and the ability to do those things but so oftentimes we get separated from that oneness of with him that abiding presence with him and and somehow we find ourselves working to try to if I just work a little harder then I can overcome this.
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_02: And oftentimes the problem is not that we're not doing enough the problem is that we're not trusting God to work through our doing enough.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah I don't know if that makes sense total sense having having experience trying to do it myself and fix myself and I'm not doing enough yeah it makes total sense that's good.
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_02: One of my favorite quotes from the book is that um holiness is not a religious version of perfectionism which is what we think that.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_02: Right that's the definition.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah and that's how we operate in fact I think when we hear our culture hears the word holy we cringe and we think of angry people with signs.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_03: Right instead of wholeness.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_03: Right yep that's good.
• 38:23
  SPEAKER_02: Well a couple things um before we get on to our VBS after party performance yes um and I know you remember those days so um I wanted to give just our friends an overview of the book kind of how you've set up the book um the practicality part of it pieces um but then also to give you a minute to talk about the military ministry that you're a part of and I know that's a huge passion uh for you so sure well the book is in three parts to go along with the verse that I was talking about God putting us together spirit soul and body so that we are all about that around here as you know that first section is um moments to love God and it's about your relationship with God learning to believe learning to make holy choices learning to surrender and to abide and to rest in faith um to allow God to do the work through you and then as you do that um the second part of the book has to do with your soul and that includes your mind and your emotions how you interact with God uh through prayer and listening to God and your obedience and the last section of the book is um enjoying your life the life of Christ in you and how that works outward to your attitudes your friendships your parenting your relationships and your work then in each chapter how there are personal stories like that one I told you um when we're this moving story with that was the struggle of anxiety yeah there's all kinds of personal stories in there very transparent very authentic um and then there's also lots of reminders and practical ideas think things that are simple that you can put into practice to to help you in your process so I try to make the book very very practical.
• 40:18
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah that's great that's great we are all about those things practical spirit mind and body practical give me tangible you can't you know you can't um guarantee the outcome you can't even like you know you but you can set up anticipation and um you know go like this is this is biblical this is what the Lord promises as we position yourself for things exactly right exactly I love it okay and real quick share about your ministry that um yeah just with the military and all of that sure well I have the privilege to work with we have a staff of 35 volunteers that work with Planting Roots Strength to Thrive in Military Life we're uh located at plantingroots.net online and Facebook Instagram and what we are we're a group of women in the military both women who are prior active duty and those who are military spouses okay faith and life into women who are in the military culture whether they're spouses daughters active duty moms veterans speaking life and faith from the perspective of the experiences that a military life has challenged so it's military women speaking into the life of military women and it's a beautiful thing.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_02: It's huge two conferences we do a couple of conferences a year.
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_02: Okay two conferences in Germany this spring and our next conference is in Washington DC October 13th at McLean College and there are conferences that women in that region can attend and connect up with other military gals.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_02: They can um receive great teaching and fellowship and it's just a really great day and so that's what planting roots is we're just encouraging women to plant their roots in faith so that they can thrive and spread the gospel wherever God sends them and military women are all over this globe.
• 42:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yes oh that's powerful yes yes and then my personal writing and ministry is through gingerherrington.com.
• 42:28
  SPEAKER_03: That's awesome.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_03: Well we I have several many many friends um in the military all over the world because I did live in Colorado Springs for 11 years and as you know that's the hub for all the branches um pretty much and so um but anyway I just I know just you know firsthand through them of just what a struggle that is and that that concept of planting roots it's so beautiful you know you can do that even if it's for the two years or you know the short placements um but the it it can happen so much easier through the encouragement through ministries like yours.
• 43:04
  SPEAKER_03: So that's awesome.
• 43:05
  SPEAKER_03: And I can't wait to get Katie connected with you.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_03: I know that's gonna be sweet for both of you.
• 43:11
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah that can be that's gonna be really rich.
• 43:14
  SPEAKER_03: I love it.
• 43:14
  SPEAKER_03: I love like uh introducing my friends to other friends and it's just so cool.
• 43:19
  SPEAKER_03: I love it.
• 43:20
  SPEAKER_03: And it's just you know that's part of how God's family works and that's the beauty of it.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_03: You get to see that unfold.
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_03: That's what heaven's gonna be like it's gonna be so good.
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_03: Ginger thank you so much for your time we look forward to seeing just your ongoing journey I know that this is you know it's not the beginning because you've been working a long time towards this point.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_03: But um I just I know even more is going to unfold.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_03: So thank you for sharing and just your authenticity and your heart appreciate it.
• 43:51
  SPEAKER_02: Oh you're so welcome thanks for having me join you guys today this is a blast.
• 43:56
  SPEAKER_03: Oh absolutely but we look forward to hearing more from you soon.
• 43:59
  SPEAKER_03: Right okay have a good day you too ginger bye man I really enjoyed this conversation with Ginger.
• 44:07
  SPEAKER_03: What a beautiful word to call us and encourage us to holiness.
• 44:11
  SPEAKER_03: Consider her invitation a reminder to refresh your faith remember this is never about perfection it's just about offering ourselves to him.
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_03: For more rich content from Ginger be sure and follow her on Instagram and Facebook after you purchase her book of course holy in the moment and you can find it on Amazon or her website.
• 44:33
  SPEAKER_03: And for those of you who are touched by military life in some way which arguably is all of us be sure and check out cleaningbits.com I'm excited to see my cars feature in the future and for you moments out there we have so many ideas to create we have an already crap with 31 ideas we have we just have one coming out right before the end of the month as obviously comes here which means we're gonna be finishing those photos and preparing for the new school year.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_03: Friends thanks so much for not keeping this podcast all to yourself.
• 45:21
  SPEAKER_03: We really appreciate every reading review and share truly important and valuable be sure to subscribe to the actual podcast show so that we get the newest episode the most everything and your rating link out iTunes know that we've got a good thing going.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_03: So until next week we hope you'll be joining us as we discover more ways to live a simply heart of life simplify purposeful and intentional