Latest / Networking Unleashed: Building Profitable Connections / Networking Unleashed: S1E7 An Interview with Eric Eden and Michael A Forman

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Networking Unleashed: S1E7 An Interview with Eric Eden and Michael A Forman · Networking Unleashed: Building Profitable Connections

• 0:00
  Hello, and welcome to Networking Unleashed Building Profitable Connections.
• 0:22
  Welcome to the show.
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  I'm your host, Michael Foreman, and you're listening to the podcast where networking
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  is more than just awkward handshakes and bad coffee.
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  It's an art and a talent.
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  But here's the twist.
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  It's an art and a talent you can actually learn from.
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  Yes, even if you're a person hiding in the corner at every event pretending to check
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  emails.
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  Networking isn't just a nice skill to have.
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  It's a game changer.
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  When you get good at it, you wonder why it didn't start sooner.
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  More connections, more opportunities, more profits, it's like unlocking the cheat code
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  for life.
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  So whether you're the life of the party or let me stay in the corner tight, we've got
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  something for you.
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  So stick around.
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  Let's turn those awkward small talk moments into things.
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  Now I would like to introduce my guest.
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  His name is Eric Eden and Eric has been a chief marketing officer for 20 years and has
• 1:27
  always been with world of thumbies.
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  He has his own startup called World of Thumbs, which is focused on better business networking
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  and is the host of the Remarkable Marketing Podcast.
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  Eric, hi.
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  How are you doing?
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  What's going on?
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  You're doing great.
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  Thanks for having me on the show.
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  Glad to be here.
• 1:47
  Great.
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  I'm so glad that I have you because you've got loads of experience in networking communications
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  and you really tell it like it is.
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  So let's just start off with what was your journey and how you made it to now?
• 2:08
  Yeah, absolutely.
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  So I've had the privilege of getting to work in tech marketing for 25 years.
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  I'm very old, older than Google, older than the internet, but a big part of that journey
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  has been building a network.
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  So I was on LinkedIn when it first started way back in 2005 and I have built up like 10,000
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  connections.
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  Plus I have been big in events.
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  I worked for an event software company for 10 years as the head of marketing.
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  And so I've been to events all over the world and learned best practices for in-person event
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  networking.
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  And I think that I've worked for web-based software companies, software as a service for
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  the last 10 years or so, 10, 15 years or so, and I've really loved it.
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  And one of the things I'm working on now with my startup is how can we do better business
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  networking?
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  I think we deserve a better next generation social media experience for business networking
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  and that's what I'm creating with Workverse.
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  So happy to talk a little bit about that today because I think it has some foundational
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  things in what does better business networking look like?
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  That's great.
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  Okay.
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  So with all that, can you just share with me and with my audience what a personal experience,
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  how it affected your career?
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  Yeah, I think that a lot of really great experiences working for the growth companies
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  and also very difficult at times because working in fast-paced, high-growth environments where
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  they really push you every day.
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  And so I've worked in some really great organizations.
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  I've worked with some great people.
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  But I think what I've realized over the years is people's greatest weakness is always their
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  greatest strength.
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  And that's a very interesting sociological thing for me to realize as I'm meeting new
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  people and networking is getting to really know them and understanding what people's
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  strengths really are is really where it's at for me.
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  And I think that the personal experience that I've had from this is that I'm a driver of
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  growth.
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  I just drive, drive, drive.
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  And when I was young in my career, I would just write over people because I was so excited
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  about getting to the goal and I would do anything in my way.
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  And that was also a negative.
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  So that's what I mean by the biggest thing I've learned is that you have to sort of,
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  even with yourself, manage your greatest strength and your greatest weakness together.
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  And so I think I've personally made some progress on that.
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  And I've also just noticed this dynamic in other people, how they work on their strengths
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  and weaknesses.
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  And it's just a really interesting sociological thing to...
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  You hit on something big.
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  You hit on, first of all, building a personal relationship far outweighs building a customer
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  base.
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  So you're trying to get really involved with the customers, with those relationships.
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  But I think the most important part is that you're listening more, that you have to listen
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  to your prospective relationship or your prospective client.
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  And you really have to listen and see what they're saying because you can't sit down
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  at a table and just think about the next thing that you want to say.
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  But listen to what they have to say.
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  Pause, that's very, very important.
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  You're pausing and then you're responding to what they have to say.
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  So it means a whole lot more to somebody, don't you think?
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  Absolutely.
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  And I think this leads to quality is so much more important than quantity and networking
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  and connections.
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  When I've gone to events and people said, how many business cards did you come back with?
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  I'm like, it's not about the number, it's about the quality of the connection you had
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  with them people and is that really going to turn into a relationship or just free
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  chashkis you got like t-shirts and coffee mugs that you'll never use again.
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  So I just think that that's very interesting is that it's really these days, I think people
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  drive for the quantity of how many thousands of connections or followers you have.
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  And it's really not about that, it's about engagement.
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  So I think that's a very interesting thing for people to look at.
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  I used to go to networking events.
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  I was in a mortgage field and I used to come home with a shoebox filled with business cards
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  saying, look how great I did.
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  And when you really think about it, I didn't speak to anybody more than like two minutes.
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  So the whole idea, what I tell everyone now is when you go to a networking event, let's
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  say it's three hours, four hours, you shouldn't come back with more than 15 or 20 business
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  cards because those business cards are people that you sit down with, you talked with, and
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  that you'll follow up with because you know as well as I do, the follow up is more important
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  than actually meeting the person themselves.
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  So you really have to go through this.
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  Absolutely.
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  So with everything, what do you think your personal vision is?
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  What gives me excited every day to get going and run hard at it is I like to create something
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  and to grow it.
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  I'm a driver of growth and that's what excites me.
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  That's why I've always worked for private equity and venture capital back companies is
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  because I wanted to create something that has value for the people at the company, the
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  investors, the customers of the company.
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  I wanted to create that value.
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  I never really wanted a job that was like, oh, just maintenance mode.
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  You can go in there, you can grow it a little bit and get a paycheck and you can have good
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  life work balance.
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  For some people, that's what they want and that's great.
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  What I wanted is I want to work for high growth companies.
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  I want to work for companies that create a lot of value, double in size every year and
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  really deliver something that people find helpful in reducing their costs, doing things more
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  efficiently or driving more revenue.
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  That's really what software does.
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  Some people are like, how do you get so excited about software?
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  I'm like, it makes people's lives better.
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  And so that's my vision.
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  Yeah.
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  No, that's good.
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  That's good.
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  Well, you told me your vision, but what are some challenges that you faced and how did
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  you overcome those challenges?
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  Yeah.
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  So in the different companies that I've worked for, you're running the challenges of being
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  able to achieve growth and make it a win for everybody involved, the investors, the people,
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  the company, and the customers, all of those groups.
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  If you don't have good product market fit is one issue.
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  So you have a product that doesn't really solve the issues the right way.
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  And the best way to solve that is to talk to the customers and get their direct input.
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  The second problem I had is that certain products that were almost too niche.
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  So they were focused on one industry and maybe one part of one industry.
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  It's not necessarily a big enough idea in a lot of cases.
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  And so that was sort of limiting.
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  Other businesses were more limited by geography to not only a country, but even local areas
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  for different reasons.
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  And so those sorts of limitations on business, there's ways to always solve them.
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  But thinking through how to walk through those steps of overcoming those obstacles takes
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  a lot of practice and thought.
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  And some people just don't work through them and the companies just don't succeed.
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  And that's sort of hard to watch.
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  But when it does happen, it's amazing to watch.
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  It's really great.
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  It's really great.
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  So, all right.
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  So if there was one essential tip that you can give somebody to improve their networking
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  or sales skills, what would it be?
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  I learned this actually at a really young age.
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  There was a family friend who owned a car dealership.
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  And he used to always come and spend time with my family.
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  And I was like, wow, that guy is like really amazing.
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  What is it about that guy that is really amazing?
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  And my dad said, well, Eric, he runs a car dealership.
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  He sells cars.
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  He knows how to build relationships with people.
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  I'm like, well, what do you mean?
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  And he said, well, do you notice how he always takes an interest in you more than telling
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  you about himself?
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  And I thought about it.
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  I was like, wow, that's right.
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  And so I think about this in terms of networking because a lot of times, whether it's at an
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  in-person event or whether people call me or email me, a lot of people walk up and they'll
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  just start talking about themselves for like 10 minutes straight.
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  That's just very awkward.
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  Like, it's the opposite of my friend who ran the car dealership is that he would say, how
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  are you doing?
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  Tell me, why are you here?
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  What are you hoping to learn at this event?
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  And he would just really take a genuine interest in everything related to me.
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  And then once he had done that, I was completely willing to talk to him and hear about things
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  that was going on with him.
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  But people don't necessarily balance that properly.
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  I get emails from people all the time that it's just like, it's 100% about them.
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  I get phone calls where people just jump in and there's 100% about them.
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  And I even see it in-person events.
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  It's super awkward.
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  What happens?
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  Well, you know, there's a mantra in networking.
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  If they know you, like you, and trust you, they'll do business with you.
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  And I say this all the time.
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  I say, you know, to know you, well, you know, everybody knows you, but likes you.
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  Well, that kind of cuts the numbers down in half.
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  But trust you, that's the kicker.
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  That's what really will have those people purchase from you.
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  If they know you, like you, and trust you, they will do business with you.
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  So when you go to that networking table at your networking event, that's always in the
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  back of your mind.
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  But I use something called form, F-O-R-M, family, occupation, recreation, and a message
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  that you both can be on the same level at.
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  Okay?
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  So I'm thinking every time when I'm talking to somebody, well, tell me about your family,
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  about your husband, your wife, your sister, your brother, your son.
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  You know, once somebody begins to talk about themselves, they love it.
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  You know, they can talk about themselves for hours.
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  But you know what?
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  You're getting them to lower the wall that's between the two of you, and they're learning
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  to trust you and ask them questions about their occupation, what do they do, or, you
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  know, whatever, recreation, do they like to go skiing, do they like to play baseball,
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  anything like that.
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  Okay?
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  Get them to talk about themselves, and that feeling of trust will far outweigh any other
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  thing.
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  Right?
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  So that's what I've learned with networking so far.
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  Absolutely.
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  I agree.
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  100%.
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  That's great.
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  So it is.
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  So tell me, do you have something like that when you go to a networking event that you
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  employ?
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  Yeah, I would just say take a genuine interest in other people.
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  And I always start off very similar to the acronym that you have.
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  If I'm at a conference where people have traveled in, I always start off, where are you from?
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  You know, and then I can take clues from where they're from.
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  Are they in sports teams from that area?
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  Often you can tell people they're interest by different things that they're wearing,
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  that they have with them.
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  And you just take a general interest in other people.
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  And it's fascinating that if you get into the conversations like you were just saying,
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  and you let people talk about themselves for a majority of the conversation, when those
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  people walk away from the conversation, they're like, the other person's like, wow, that was
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  an amazing conversation because people love to hear themselves talk about themselves.
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  Whereas if the ratio is flipped, if you went in and talked 80, 90, 100% about just yourself,
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  people would be like, that was a terrible conversation.
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  So that's sort of my formula is let the other person do the majority of the talking, not
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  to the extreme where it's awkward, but I think you don't want to be like questioning people
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  and just asking question, question, question.
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  But having a good natural conversation.
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  And I think the real art form of that is just taking a genuine interest.
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  People can tell when you're genuinely interest or when you're just trying to say something.
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  Like if you bring up things like the weather, that's not super helpful.
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  Right.
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  Well, I always inject humor into everything that I do.
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  And when you have somebody who is not funny and they're injecting humor, they can always
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  tell when you're forcing the humor to come out because you're like, that really wasn't
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  that funny.
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  So I'm going to walk over this way.
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  So you really have to be careful with what you say and how you do it, but you're right.
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  Let them talk about themselves.
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  And I think the conversation will go in the direction which you would like it to.
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  And with everything that you've said, what's your favorite marketing tactic?
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  My favorite marketing tactic is really if I want people to spend time with me, then
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  there needs to be an offer of value for them.
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  And this is also my biggest pet peeve is when people ask me for my time and they're not
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  really offering me any value because I place a value on my time.
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  And most other people do too.
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  So if someone comes to me and says, for example, hey, Eric, we will do an assessment of your
• 18:13
  website with no obligation on your part.
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  Would you take 20 minutes to hear the result of the analysis that we did?
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  I'd be like, yeah, I'm interested because there's value in that for me.
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  They've made me an offer.
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  They're going to give me some insights.
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  I may or may not do anything with those insights, but they're made an offer.
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  What I really hate is when people are just like, hey, can you just give me 30 minutes
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  of your time?
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  And I'm like, no.
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  My time is $400 an hour.
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  So why would I just give you 30 minutes so you can sell me something?
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  No.
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  So I think having a valuable offer for people, it can be content.
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  It can be an analysis that you give to someone on a complimentary basis.
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  It can be some value that they would get from it, specific to the use case to what you're
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  selling.
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  It can be related to what you're doing.
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  You don't have to do things that are unrelated, but walk into it and give other people value
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  and don't require a commitment out of them to get it.
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  That always works.
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  100% of the times I've done that sort of marketing, campaigning program.
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  Okay.
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  So give me one takeaway that anybody who's listening, that they can use today or tomorrow
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  that they're going out, what's one takeaway that they can use right away?
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  I think the takeaway is be clear about who you want to serve as a customer and find out
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  how you can give them some value before you enter into a formal relationship where they're
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  paying you.
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  And if you can figure out something that would be truly valuable to the customer you want
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  and you can offer that to them, your conversion rates on networking and selling will go through
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  the roof.
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  Absolutely.
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  Absolutely.
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  I always felt that you have to find what their problem is.
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  You have to find because wherever you go to a networking event, they're selling something,
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  doing something, that is their problem.
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  And what you have to do is offer a solution to the problem and then everything will happen
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  almost immediately.
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  So it's a matter of you getting to that point of offering what you can offer, you can have
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  a solution to their problem, whatever it may be at the time, and it would go far.
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  Absolutely.
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  Okay, so let me ask you a question.
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  If somebody were to get a hold of you, how would they do it?
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  So they can do it on LinkedIn, of course, and they can also check out my company's website,
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  WorkForce.com.
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  They can connect with me there as well.
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  So either of those places is great and always welcome the opportunity to meet new people
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  and get to know them.
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  That's great.
• 21:25
  Eric, thank you very much.
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  I had a great time, a great conversation, and I think we'll both be doing a lot of networking
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  in the future.
• 21:33
  Likewise.
• 21:34
  Thanks for having me on the show.
• 21:36
  Appreciate it.
• 21:38
  Well, that's a wrap, folks.
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  A huge thank you to our special guests for sharing such incredible insights today and,
• 21:46
  of course, a big shout out to you, our amazing listeners, for tuning in and spending your
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  time with us.
• 21:54
  Remember, networking isn't about being perfect.
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  It's about being present.
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  So take what you've learned today, get out there, and make some meaningful connections.
• 22:04
  If you enjoyed this episode, don't forget to subscribe, leave us a review, and share
• 22:10
  it with someone who could use a little networking inspiration.
• 22:14
  Let's keep the conversation going.
• 22:16
  You can find me on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or my website, MichaelAForman.com.
• 22:23
  Remember, until next time, keep practicing, keep connecting, and keep building those relationships.
• 22:30
  This is Michael A. Foreman signing off.
• 22:33
  Take care, and happy networking.