Latest / Being Different Together / #36 - How to Compromise in a Relationship Without People-Pleasing or Losing Yourself

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#36 - How to Compromise in a Relationship Without People-Pleasing or Losing Yourself · Being Different Together

• 0:08
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome to Being Different Together, the podcast for people who want to make the world a better place, but no, they can't do it alone.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Dr.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_00: Kelly Brady, acupuncturist, psychotherapist, and certified dialogue therapist.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm Nissa Hanger, massage therapist, aromatherapist, coach, and real dialogue specialist.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_00: Together we'll explore how conversations can improve relationships, make work more joyful, and spark healing for ourselves and our communities.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_02: And listen, we don't shy away from the hard conversations.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_02: In fact, we welcome them.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_02: This isn't about being right.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_00: It's about being different together.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_02: This is episode number thirty-six of Being Different.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_00: Together.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_02: And here we are together once again.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_02: Recording this episode like last episode in the edition.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_02: The our air conditioned storage unit we have apparently built for ourselves.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yep, that's how it's currently that's the currently current utilization of the edition.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_00: That's funny.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_00: I mean it's a nice place to have a kind of like our morning uh uh we were talking last night and I was saying to you that I I'm like experiencing the podcast as like this little dream that I have every week almost.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_00: And because it's like it's in the morning and I I don't often wake up like I don't often I'm not in my work clothes, I'm usually in some form of pajamas.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: You know, um it feels early to me, like we're up having tea or coffee or whatever.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's dreamy.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_02: I don't remember you saying any of this last night.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it just feels like this little dream that I have once a week.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_02: Interesting.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like we're having coffee and tea and we're just talking about stuff.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm really liking it.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_00: Hmm.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_00: It's a really sweet time with you, you know.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's become a nice ritual.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's a really sweet time with you.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_00: I enjoy it a lot.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_02: Me too.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_02: And I enjoy you listeners tuning into our uh Thursday morning chats, as they were.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_02: Unless it's one of those days I don't hit record and then have to record a solo episode like I did two episodes ago.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: Totally.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_00: I think your idea for the episode today is really um really interesting.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_02: Shall we uh I find it interesting, yeah.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so today my idea was to talk about something that has happened for me in the so part of what happened that just if you've not been listening, the short of it is we've been building this room onto the house this year for my mom to come and live with us.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_02: She's fine, she's not sick, it's good, it's just like get in place.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_02: Um and with that, as home renovations go, they snowball.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_02: And so we also elected to replace the floor in the rest of the house, and that's sort of where we're at now.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_02: And so things have been moved around, blah blah blah.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_02: Um what happened when the flooring guys were done on Saturday?
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_02: Kelly wasn't here, and they were like, hey, you know, we'll um we'll put your couch back, where do you want us to put it?
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, ooh.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_02: Um where does the couch go?
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_02: And the choice is solely mine.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_02: And um and what had happened, I'm gonna see if I can explain this in a way to not belabor the details, but to kind of give you a you all a sense of why this is even a thing for me.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_02: Um and we're on podcasts, so I can't use diagrams, but if you just imagine our living room is kind of like L-shaped with its walls.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_02: Um it's like some of it is open.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_02: There's a natural corner in the room, and then it leads into the dining room.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_02: Like the dining area and the ki and the living room are kind of a big open area.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and for ever since we got this couch, which is uh like a sectional, that's equal on either side, um, we had put it in that corner, and it faced the the window, and it faced the rest of the living room.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_02: And I am somebody that has only moved a couple times in my life, so it is not unusual for me at a certain point in time to just want to rearrange furniture in the room that I'm in.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_02: That is that is a normal thing for me to do.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_02: And I think I brought up the idea of about it was at the end of last year that we had had the couch for a couple years, of maybe trying it in a different location.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_02: The couch.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_02: The c the couch.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_02: And so I had suggested that instead of it being in the corner, that we move it in a way that one part of the sectional, one part's against the wall and one part comes out from the wall, creating a separation essentially between the living room and the kitchen.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_02: And one Friday night is my memory of it.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_02: We talked about it and we you were like, hey, let's do it.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_02: Let's try it.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, all right, let's try it.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_02: And we move it.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_02: And my memory is you love it.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_02: You uh love it in this new location.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_02: And I uh do not love it.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm curious to hear what your experience of that was.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_02: I think I said it a couple times, but I was like, okay, Nissa, you you you gotta you gotta choose your battles in a marriage.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_02: And uh are you gonna, you know, she is really loving this whole little cozy vibe here where part of the couch faces the wall.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_02: And uh, you know, like I I just didn't want to be a pain in the butt about it, and was like, all right, fine.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_02: It was my idea, like, let's just have it here for a while.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_02: But I do think I remember being like, can we like have like a deal where, you know, maybe every so often we switch it the other way?
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_02: It's sort of like uh Persephone and um what was her mom's name?
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_00: Temeter I don't know.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know about your analogy, but I mean Well half the year, half the year it's here, half the year it's here.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_02: It's sort of like a shared custody of where the couch goes.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, okay, I can live with that, but I don't think I can live with it permanently in this place.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_02: So that's the background.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_02: So the couch guys are like, hey, where do you want it?
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, oh, can I put it back in the corner?
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_02: And I decide to put it back in the corner.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_02: Um, it actually took a while for it to get set up because we had to fix it for the floor, blah, blah, blah.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_02: But we set it up, I set it up in the corner.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_02: And maybe about a day later you're sitting there and you're like, I really like it like this.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_02: And I ha I just sigh with relief to hear you say that you really like it back in the corner.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_02: And then for days I found myself feeling such deep relief, and I brought this up to you last night and was like, oh, maybe we could talk about this.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I am surprised by how relieved I am to have the couch back in the place where I like it.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_02: So, I mean, I think this is the setup.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_02: That's the setup.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, I'm enjoying listening to you around this.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: So um But I thought I mean, I guess what I wonder is you know, just in listening to you right now, um like w where do you see this as fitting into an episode of being different together?
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_02: Like how do you Oh, I said last night I feel like this episode is at the heart of being different together.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_02: I know you did.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so last night I said that this I think that this episode is at the heart of being different together.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_02: The heart of this podcast.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_02: And the reason I don't know, for me it's a really interesting um entry point into like compromise in relationships.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, I mean, like we had or at least I thought we had different opinions on where the couch should go.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_02: And this whole idea of cohabitating, two people cohabitating, I mean, I think that it comes up in many aspects of cohabitating with the way that the way that things should go.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_02: And a lot of that with like design or picking paint colors and looking at do we how do we want to r arrange these rooms differently?
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, that's uh I find it coming up a lot for me.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_00: What kind what what do you find coming up for you when you what is the it?
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, the it is um yeah, being able to communicate with you about what it is that I want and what my preferences are, but also at the same time being able to be open to listening to what your preferences are.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_02: And then together making a decision on how we're going to take action.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_02: You know, what are we gonna decide together given our sometimes different opinions?
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_00: So for you, is it at the heart of the episode?
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_00: Is it at the heart of being different together because the couch is um kind of like a representation of our individual subjectivity.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_02: I guess.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_00: Like okay, so the couch is the couch, right?
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_00: And and I think that the the story is pro I mean, I imagine that the story is relatable to people listening because if you've been in a relationship or had a roommate, there's a conversation about where to put the couch.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_00: Where does where does the couch go?
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_00: Where does this picture go?
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um you know, like uh that's just that's a given.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um you know, I can kind of imagine people living in a urine like where do where do they put the sleeping roll?
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um so I think it's like we walked into the edition this morning and I I noticed that it was cold and and I found myself saying, This room is too cold.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_00: And it's kind of like Goldilocks saying, I was like laughing at myself a little bit.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_00: But it's like it's not the room that's too cold.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_00: I was cold in the room.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_00: Right, yeah.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_00: Another classic argument that couples have is the air conditioning.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: Totally.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: The you know, how to figure out the the thermostat setting.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, whether to have the fan on.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_00: And do you sleep with white noise?
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_00: Do you sleep with white Do you sleep under the same comforter?
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_00: I think that I mean, even car companies are on to this because like the air conditioning in my car can be adjusted side to side now.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_02: Uh-huh.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_02: Uh-huh.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_02: Uh-huh.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_02: You can have dual or individual.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_00: And somehow still when I get in the car with uh Vieira, my daughter, she's like, no, don't use the auto setting.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_00: Just turn up the fan.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_00: That's the way you do it, Mom.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_00: Why do you do It's like, how do you load the dishwasher?
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_00: You know, she can like, this is the way to do it.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_02: Uh-huh.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_02: Uh-huh.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_02: That there is some right way.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_00: And probably functionally that might be true.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, like, if we look back, there are probably some things where functionally it is the right way to do something.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know, if you're going to build something and you want it to work, then functionally, right angles might be your friend.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_00: Right angles might be your friend.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_00: Or like if you're trying to build a wheel, it being circular is going to be helpful.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I'll you know, it's it's like there are some things that are objective.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_02: Uh yeah.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_00: There are objective realities that have to, I think, be negotiated.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_02: But m a lot of things are subjective.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, but we're uh th this is where this is where I kind of do split that hair a little bit because uh are there objective realities?
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_02: We're only able to I mean I'm only able to experience objective reality through my subjective experience.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_02: So is it really an objective reality?
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_02: I kind of get stuck in that a little bit.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_00: Well, it is and it isn't.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_00: Because I mean to I can't.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_00: I mean the minute that you say it isn't, you make another category which proves that it is.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_02: I don't quite follow that.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I might not have had enough caffeine to be able to articulate this.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_00: But it's sort of like when it's sort of like when people when people get into when Westerners get into Eastern religion and they'll say things like, Well, you're missing the point that everything is one.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's like you everything can't be one unless things are also separate.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_02: I get that.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_02: I get that.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm I'm I'm kind of just playing that out a bit where you know it's sort of playing with dual duality.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_00: So right.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_02: So subjectivity and objectivity ex you know, they I guess if you have subjectivity, you have to have objectivity.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_02: I think that's a good thing.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_00: Is that kind of what you're saying?
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_02: So this idea of yeah, really just being able to compromise.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_02: It's it's like it's like, is there you know, the the classic argument about how to load the dishwasher?
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_02: And for one person there's clearly a right way to load the dishwasher, and the other person just doesn't see it that way.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, I and I think like a couch, something aesthetic, something that's semi-permanent in your space in your environment, like making choices about a an environment that you share where you might have different opinions about those things.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_02: And then how do you I mean I guess maybe some places there's a dictator.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, for lack of a better word.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_00: I think in many relationships there's a dictator.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that just there's one person that call that calls the shots.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_02: Um that's you know, I mean, uh and I suppose that that's one way of being different together.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, I I've I've heard this, um I heard a uh a woman who's a a teacher in the Enneagram world named Susan Stabil talk about her relationship with her husband one time and they were talking about how they come how they do decision making.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_00: And she was saying that their model is that they recognize that in a in a dyad, someone will have to have the final say.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_00: This is their uh belief.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_02: Uh-huh.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_00: That in a dyad someone will have to have the final say, a decision will have to get made.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_00: And that they look at the power differential in the relationship as being fifty-one, forty-nine.
• 15:24
  unknown: Uh-huh.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_02: Oh wow.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_00: He gets fifty-one and she gets forty-nine.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_00: And what she said is that she's comfortable with that because he's a better decision maker.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_00: They they didn't make that decision based on gender dynamic.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_00: They made that decision based on the fact that he's slightly more decisive and logical than she is.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_00: And so and she trusts that when she releases a decision to him, that he'll make the best decision for them.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: What do you think about that?
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_02: Uh I I can see how that would work.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_02: It's interesting, huh?
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I can see how that would work.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_02: Mm-hmm.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that that I think that that happens for us without discussing that, sometimes when it comes to ordering your food.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, how many times have I been like, when it comes to ordering food?
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_02: Please just just order.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_02: You know, one of Kelly's superpowers is that she knows the best thing on the menu.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_02: She can look at a menu and be like, that this is gonna be the best thing on the menu.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_02: Um and so because of that, if I just defer to you in those, I mean, if I'm like really craving something, then I just get what I'm really craving, you know.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_02: But if I don't really care and I just kind of feel overwhelmed by all the choices, and I just say, Hey Kelly, what you choose?
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_02: I end up eating some interesting things that I probably wouldn't have chosen for myself.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_02: And I do trust your that decisions.
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, I can totally see how that would that would work out.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know if I don't know for me in our relationship if it would work for a standard like I feel like I feel like there are certain things that you totally are good at making those decisions about.
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_02: And then I don't know if I I feel like I'm better at making decisions about certain things, but there are just certain things where like I uh have a stronger feeling and opinion on or something like that that I feel like I would kind of want a final say, which or don't feel a hundred percent being like blindly just being like, Okay, you get fifty-one from all decisions from here on out.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I mean, I I do think it's really like a a place where that I see where c where couples, you know, particularly couples who are well, only couples really, who are living together domestically.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_00: Is this a place where people really uh really have conflict?
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: Is a common hot button in relationship.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, what um how would you phrase it?
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_00: It has to do with division of labor and domesticity and uh and who gets the final say about things.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_00: Uh-huh.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_00: Uh-huh.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_00: And the division of labor, you know, like who does what around the house and um and who decides that.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and and how is the communicating about that?
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_00: And how is the communicating is there communication around it?
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_00: Is there communication around that is a is a beginning.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_00: You're right.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes there's not enough.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: There's a lot of expectations and ideas that get brought forward from childhood, and then there's not a real conversation about it.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, the thing that I really liked about Stabile's comment there is that that I r as I recall it is that um it makes something conscious that I think a lot of couples leave unconscious.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_00: Like they they they're talking about how they're doing it.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_00: And how they're doing it is something that they're w that they're aware of.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_00: It's not just they're not just running a background program around it.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_00: I like like going back to um your experience around the couch, something that I find really compelling about it is how meaningful that was to you.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_00: And like I just couldn't really care that much.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you were like, you said left.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, oh, you moved the couch on my radar.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, oh, you moved the couch.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_00: Well, alright, it's okay here.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sitting in it, I'm like, alright.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it is kind of nice when it's a little cubby over there, and I could see that happening, but this is fine too.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, whatever.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, maybe, maybe, maybe what I'm finding is that I have stronger feelings about it than you do.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_02: I actually have a stronger preference than you do.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_00: I I in regards to that, I think that might be might be honing in on something that's accurate.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_00: And also I just am kind of willing to live with things that I'm that I that I don't really like.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I think that I am too.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean, because I did live with the catch there for eight months, but I also know how long that I lived with it.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_00: Here's the interesting thing.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_00: I really didn't know you didn't like it.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_00: It's funny you don't remember me saying it.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_02: No, I totally blocked that.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_02: Like petitioning for, you know, when six months from now we can't.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_00: I totally totally just didn't hit my radar.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_00: Like I mean, I gotta say, I just I don't know.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_00: So that's kind of interesting.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_00: I don't really recall it.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it is interesting.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I yeah.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and talking about the foyer and how it like really I just felt like it was too close to the front door.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_00: It's like there was no matter how many facts you remind me of, this conversation that I don't remember.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to tell you right now, I'm not going to remember it.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I appreciate that.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but I'm bringing my receipts.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_00: I appreciate the play-by-play, the review.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_00: Let me play back the time for you all the memory of what I said, even though you don't remember the conversation at all.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's funny.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's it's so it's all it's all in that land of subjectivity.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_02: Well, and I think part of it is I also like I had strong feelings about it, but I also was really trying not to make a big stink about it because I felt like you really liked it the other way, and I didn't want to like harsh or buzz.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_02: I don't want to raid on your couch parade.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_02: It turns out there might not have been a parade.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it really I mean, it really kind of made me I was like, oh, okay, did I not like advocate for myself as much or like where this is this is where like last night I was talking about it and I was like, okay, well where does where does people pleasing end and compromise begin?
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_02: Because I think I was doing a lot of people pleasing around it also.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_02: Seeing as I felt like you had Stronger feelings about it than apparently f from what you're saying now, it seems like that you did.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_00: So Yeah, I mean that's where it's just great that you were able to check it out and you know, whatever.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_00: Just kind of and I just assumed you didn't care that much about it.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe that's why I didn't listen to you so much when you were talking about it, because I didn't care that much about it.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_02: And maybe I was trying to act like I wasn't caring about it.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, but I you know, but but uh maybe I was projecting onto you similar similarly, you know, like my level of care about it.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_00: I was assuming that you had a similar level of care.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, and then I was projecting on to you that you really did care about it.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_02: But I'm the one that really cared about it, and you're the one that didn't care about it, which is funny because then at that point then there's not a problem.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_00: Well, there wasn't a problem really.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_00: It was it it it you know, and that's the funny thing about the about bringing it up here as a topic, is that it it I think it kind of comes into, you know, in relationship, uh it's so easy to get into power struggles about whose reality is right.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_00: Whose reality wins.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, what do you what do you think about that?
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I just think exactly what I said that I think that's a commonplace in relationship where people get hung up.
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_00: What do you think about it?
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean I I agree.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_02: I agree.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_02: What do you do to keep yourself from getting less hung up on it?
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_00: Me personally?
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_00: I try and remember that.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_00: Like I really try and remember that uh everyone's reality is subjective and it's going on inside their own snow globe, it's going on inside their own mind.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_00: And um I really, really try and remember that mine is going on inside of mine.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_00: But it's it's uh something that I have to come back to over and over again.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_00: And and honestly, part of one of the things that helps me remember more than anything is paraphrasing the person that I'm listening to.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's not so much that you know I've had some big spiritual experience where suddenly I I recognize all the time the subjective and also you know, interdependent nature of my reality because that's the way that I see it.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_00: It is subjective, and I also am interdependent with you.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_00: My my reality is changing based on what's happening in our relationship, our nervous systems are or whatever we are, are you know, they're interacting with one another all the time.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_00: Totally.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_00: You can't they they're not really separate.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_00: We're influenced by each other.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_00: They're separate, but they're not.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_00: There's that whole place where we're influencing one another.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, it's like um in psychoanalysis we say the the client and and the analyst come together and they create what's called the analytic third.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_00: You know, not like a throbble third, but like it's like a disembodied like a yeah.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_00: The analytic third is really the relationship.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_00: And that gets kind of like factored into what's happening.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um and that and I think it happens in a marriage too.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_00: There's like there's what happens inside of me, there's what happens inside of you, and then there's the relationship, and that takes on its own um kind of like identity.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_00: Uh-huh.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_00: And and and you know, it's like if I was thinking about this from a Jungian angle.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, okay, Jung talked a lot about, and I know I've mentioned in this in the pod before that images and dreams of a house.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_00: Jungian analysts will often say a house is a representation of like your entire psyche.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_00: Your psyche itself.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_00: It has all these different levels, it has all these different rooms.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_00: I know you've told me that you've had dreams where uh you were in a house and all of a sudden you realize there were rooms there you didn't know were there.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_00: Totally.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_00: Or you're going up in a house, you're going up into higher levels of thinking, is what Jung would say about that.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_00: You're going down into the basement, you're getting closer to your shadow, closer to what's underneath, what's underneath, what's the unconscious, you know, of this house.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um and so if the house is a representation of the of the psyche, you know, I kind of found myself wondering in our personal mythology, if the couch is kind of like the hearth for us.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_00: Is it the is it the center of the house in a way for us?
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_00: The couch.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_00: I found myself wondering that.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_00: Like, is it the couch?
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_00: Is it the is it the stove?
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_00: Like I spend a lot of time creating alchemy in that kitchen, and so do you.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_00: Like, what really is the heart of the house?
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_00: The kitchen table, the couch.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I don't know.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_00: It's hard to pick Is it, I mean, without getting too personal, is it the bed?
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_00: Is it the marital bed?
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_00: Mm-hmm.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_00: You know?
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_00: It's like where we sleep and do the other thing.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_00: You know?
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, what what is the I don't well like what's your sense of that?
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_02: I'm kind of thinking I'm just sort of thinking like spatially and um and yeah, where things happen or whatever.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_02: I almost feel like like what if it's the when you walk into our house, we have uh it's not an island, it's more of like a peninsula.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_02: It's like a counter that comes out.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_02: A pinch.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know what those are called, but it's like a high counter.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_02: Um you know, I feel like a lot of things happen there.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_02: It's sort of like where things are naturally put when you walk in the door.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_02: How many times have we stood around that talking?
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_02: Um, although I can see the coach the c the couch, the couch is being um one of those places too.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_02: You know, the first time we recorded this podcast, we started recording on the couch.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_00: We did.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, uh, what is a couch?
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_00: It's like it's where you settle.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_00: You don't like mostly if I'm gonna sit on the couch, I'm gonna be there for a minute.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_02: And it's cozy.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and it's like where we receive people also.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_02: Uh-huh.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_02: Uh-huh.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_02: That's the other thing I l I like better about where it is now.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_02: It's like you you walk in the door and you can just naturally go to the couch.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_02: You don't have to walk around the couch to get to it.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_02: Which to me just feels more inviting.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_02: It's also really nice to just sit there and look out the windows.
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it changes the center of gravity.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_02: It does.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_00: I think part of the reason that I had enjoyed it when we made that little nook out of it was that we we had disc we'd been discussing whether we're gonna put a TV in that room on the wall.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_00: And we still don't have a TV in the house, listeners.
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_00: We we, you know, right shortly before Nissa and I uh started dating, um, I stopped watching TV.
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_00: And it it was really in a um in a way for me to retrieve my ability to sleep because in the couple of years prior to Nyssa and I being together, I had been married um to a woman who um got terminally ill with uh cancer.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: And um and my sleep got really disrupted, particularly the last couple of years of her life and our marriage.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um there were lots of just disruptions in the middle of the night.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_00: And um, it was very uh, you know, my my sleep just was wrecked basically, uh also just due to the stress of the situation and the sadness of the loss and et cetera.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_00: So part of my journey of healing was to recover my ability to sleep.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_00: And so I got these glasses that blocked out blue light, and at seven o'clock at night I would put them on and walk around in these crazy red glasses, which made everything look red.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I did this for months um to reset myself because I had been exposed to so much uh false light, I think, in the hospitals or whatever it was.
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_00: I was just doing shit.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_00: So I I stopped watching TV entirely.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_00: I got rid of my couch, I stopped sitting on the couch.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_00: I would only sit on the floor for a period of time because I was trying to rehabilitate my ability to get up off the floor.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_00: Which by the way, now I can do beautifully.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_02: We're sitting on the floor right now.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_00: But back then was not so easy for me.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um so I really was working on getting grounded.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_00: And um, and so still now, almost however many years later, five years later, um, I don't have a TV.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_00: And and uh you had one in the house here when we moved in together, and it was a little bit janky, is my memory.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_00: It was kind of like a little bit broken.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_02: But it just the I don't know, it stopped working.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_02: It was like a little bit both old.
• 30:21
  SPEAKER_02: So we just took it off the wall.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_00: Which was great.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_00: And so now if we want to watch programs together or whatever, we just do it on our little laptops.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_00: We we huddle together like so then the couch can be anywhere.
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_00: The couch is and the TV is not the center of the house.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I think I actually really like that.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_00: I do too.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um I do too.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_02: And that was one of the things with the couch being in that place, is it it it sort of sets it up, even though there were a couple different places we could put a TV with it there, it it really kind of makes it the center of the house.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_02: Um whereas with the way that the couch is now, it literally faces the rest of the room.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't face a natural wall.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um well, and just as I'm thinking about it now, it's like my journey around couch and TV and all those things.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's very much a I hadn't really thought about this until we sat down to do this episode.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_00: It's like kind of like a review of some of my psychological change in the last few years.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_00: You know, like am I gonna reorient the couch towards the TV?
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_00: And we played around with that and ultimately I'm I'm happy with it.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_00: Not I you know, we never did it.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it was looking at the wall, and I had a beautiful Tibetan Thanka there of uh the medicine Buddha, and that's what we were looking at.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_00: We weren't looking at the TV.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um Yeah, no shade on TV, by the way.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_02: Oh no, I love some TV.
• 31:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I I just really think it was like something I was going through personally.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_00: And it really did help that blocking of that of the blue light and um and also getting up in the morning, taking a walk as the sun was coming up.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um really did help me to restore my ability to to enjoy the to really to to go into sleep with a sense of peace and like oh, I'm resting now, like this is a refuge.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_00: You know, like sleep sleep feels just like a this beautiful refuge now.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't, you know.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_00: Like I don't want to bring the stress of my life into my sleep.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_00: I just don't want to be able to really let it go and sleep.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_00: You know, um happily do my dream yoga and sleep yoga practices happily without a great sense of stress with w I found that again.
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe the couch had something to do with that.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_02: So maybe it's good that we moved it back.
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean, how do you how do you decide what you know, I I think part of what is at the the core of this for me is like, yeah, deciding what are when when we have a, let me just say, perceived difference in opinion.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_02: Um, how do I decide what I dig my heels in on and what I you know sort of compromise over.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_02: And I m I mean, my experience with marriage is that I'm gonna have to do that with things.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, there are some marriage counselors who don't like the idea of using the word compromise.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_02: Tell me, um what do you Yeah, you brought this up last night and I just was like, wait, what?
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know, the idea in a compromise is that there's a clear winner and a loser, probably.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_00: Uh-huh.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_00: And um, and so, you know, one idea is that you know, a as opposed to the idea of compromise, which is the stabil idea.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_00: And it is a you know, Susan Stabile, like I talked about, 5149, you know, like someone's gonna get their way.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_00: And um in the consensus model, uh, the way that that works is that however many people are involved in making the decision will keep going back to the drawing board until a creative solution is found in which both people's needs are met equally.
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_00: And the decision is not finalized until that happens, and there's a commitment to continue to work with it until both people have elements of what they want and they and they're they're satisfied, they're equally satisfied.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_00: They're equally satisfied with the trade-offs, you know, recognizing that of course there are trade-offs in any decision, but there's a there's a real emphasis put on, you know, that it's conscious and that um everyone is equally satisfied.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_02: Uh-huh.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_02: It's so that so it's not that somebody's going, okay, that's fine.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, whatever.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_02: I can live I end up whatever you decide.
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 34:36
  SPEAKER_02: It's not that.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_02: It's I'm imagining that that process takes longer.
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_00: It does.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_00: It does take longer.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_00: It takes longer.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_00: It takes longer.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_00: And it takes a willingness to not get your way.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_02: It takes a willingness to not get your way, but I'm thinking of in in contrast to I feel like there's something else there too.
• 35:00
  SPEAKER_02: In contrast to the okay, fine, whatever.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_02: You know, that's also that's also.
• 35:07
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so there so with that, there's some passive aggression.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_02: I think so.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_02: Even though it at least is seeming to be a willingness to not get your way.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_00: If said in that way, the way you said it, I I interpreted it that way.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_00: You know, like you sort of the listeners, you can't see, but Nissa just kind of like flipped her hand and rolled her eyes and was like, whatever.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_02: Whatever we can decide.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_02: We can just do it for the way.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_00: You can have your way like you always do.
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_02: Um Yeah, that's not the same thing as sitting with it for longer, continuing to, you know, work towards a solution where maybe you do get some things.
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_02: I think that maybe something that happens.
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know if this if you relate to this or if any listeners relate to this, but when I'm, you know, faced with those decisions, then um I can't somebody totally just walk by the window and I lost my train of thought.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_00: When you're faced with those decisions, what you were saying.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_02: When you're faced with those decisions, if I'm if I'm doing the work to create solutions and maybe that there are trade-offs, it's like I'm investing my time and energy into it.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_02: Like it's a little bit harder.
• 36:25
  SPEAKER_02: Sometimes it's easier to just do the passive aggression, whatever you decide.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_02: Now I don't have to continue to work to not totally get my way to only get some of my way.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_02: Like I can see how it it would be easy to just fall into okay, it's fine, just do whatever you want.
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_00: Working within a consensus model takes a great deal of dedication and patience.
• 36:51
  SPEAKER_00: In my opinion.
• 36:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 36:52
  SPEAKER_00: And it's and it's not for everybody.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_02: It's not for everybody.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think there's I think that there are some people who just really won't do it.
• 37:00
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 37:06
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and there are those people out there.
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_00: There are those people out there.
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_00: And and I mean, you know, there's some people who are just like, no, my way is right.
• 37:13
  SPEAKER_00: Uh-huh.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I mean, no, no, Kelly, this this is not the way that things work.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_00: And in fact, there are right people and wrong people.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_02: Uh-huh.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_00: And right people get their way and wrong people don't get their way.
• 37:25
  SPEAKER_00: And that's the way it is.
• 37:27
  SPEAKER_02: Uh-huh.
• 37:28
  SPEAKER_00: And you're living in some kind of other reality that doesn't acknowledge reality.
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_02: There are people who would would really and their subjective reality is they think it's uh objective.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_00: That's correct.
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that they're that clearly this is the right way.
• 37:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 37:43
  SPEAKER_00: You're wrong.
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_00: And so maybe they're in a in a psychological developmental stage where there's more black and white thinking is what I would say.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_00: They're more conformist, you know?
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_00: And so there was more there's more black and white thinking there.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_00: And um, you know, that's that's just what's going on with that person.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_00: And I mean, something that that I've learned is that um I I I mean, I I when I see that, I I just kind of know that okay, that's not a person with whom I'm gonna be able to have a consensus type negotiation.
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's not gonna happen here.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_01: Right, right, right.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 38:18
  SPEAKER_00: You know, so then it's kind of like to what end?
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_00: This was Jung's being question about communication.
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_00: It's like to what end?
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_00: You know, like um to what end?
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_00: To what end.
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_00: To what end am I gonna have a dialogue about, you know, something like that, and um with a person that is kind of stuck in that space.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_00: You know, maybe it might be might be worthwhile for me in a way to just explore it for myself, n knowing that, you know, I I don't know, what am I doing in those moments?
• 38:48
  SPEAKER_00: It's not exactly like screaming into the abyss.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_00: I I think going to dry wells for water is another way of saying it, you know, like uh but you know, yeah, I think that um I think back to this idea that like relationship is is two two psyches growing together.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_00: No, he's not supposed to come in the house.
• 39:29
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_00: We can wrap it up.
• 39:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_00: Just figure out a good wrapping it up segue.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_00: And we'll wrap it up.
• 39:41
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so so relationship is about two psyches growing together.
• 39:49
  SPEAKER_00: I think so.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_02: Mm-hmm.
• 39:51
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_00: I was thinking about that, and I was thinking that the house, the way that we're uh adding onto the house now, you're you know, your mom's gonna come and live here.
• 39:59
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_00: And who knows, somebody else in our family might come and live here.
• 40:03
  SPEAKER_00: Who knows?
• 40:03
  SPEAKER_00: Someday.
• 40:04
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know?
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so that the so that the the yeah, the house being a representation of of all of that, just as a metaphor to play around with.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_00: And not that it actually is.
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_00: Because someday we'll we might move out of this house and and our relationship hopefully would continue even if we did.
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_02: Well, it's not about the house.
• 40:22
  SPEAKER_02: It's not literal.
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_02: It's not about the house.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_02: It's not literal.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, yes.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and just finding all these different ways to grow to grow together.
• 40:30
  SPEAKER_02: It's like two plants in a pot.
• 40:36
  SPEAKER_02: And they're having to negotiate, okay, my roots gonna go over here.
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, I'm gonna get a root over here, okay.
• 40:40
  SPEAKER_02: But I can get one, you know what I mean?
• 40:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that just made me think.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_00: We're just two lost souls swimming in a fishbowl.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_00: Year after year.
• 40:52
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe we're just two lost souls swimming in a fishbowl.
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yep, year after year.
• 40:59
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my goodness.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 41:01
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I uh I look forward to many years.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_02: Me too, baby.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_02: Swimming around this fishbowl with you.
• 41:07
  SPEAKER_02: Me too, baby.
• 41:08
  SPEAKER_02: It was a cool idea.
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_00: It was a cool topic to talk about today.
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_02: So I hope that listeners, you know, you can maybe more easily discern when you're faced with a conversation.
• 41:21
  SPEAKER_02: Is this something where we can work towards consensus?
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_00: Well, you know, it's just like there might not be a right way to put the toilet paper roll on.
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_00: There might just be a way that you're not.
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, I'm just sorry to tell you, but it might just be a right way to put the toilet paper on.
• 41:35
  SPEAKER_00: It might just be there is a way that you like and a way that you don't like.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_00: And um, and then so being able to say, well, this is what I like.
• 41:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 41:44
  SPEAKER_00: And as we know from intentionality, you know, if you know what you want and you ask for it, you're more likely to get it.
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the more I ask for what I want, more I ask for what I want, the more likely I am to get it.
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_00: But the thing about knowing what you want is you have to know what you like.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_00: And being able to identify it as a preference, i it is is it can really open up so much psychological flexibility.
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_00: Totally.
• 42:11
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that this is a preference of mine, and then owning that as something that's coming from within.
• 42:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 42:16
  SPEAKER_00: As opposed to projecting it outside.
• 42:18
  SPEAKER_02: As as the the the absolute right thing.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 42:23
  SPEAKER_02: Totally.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_02: It's like for I sometimes I phrase it in my head as like the difference between f something being right and then something being right for me.
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 42:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 42:34
  SPEAKER_02: This is right for me.
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_02: And um, that's been really helpful for me in times that I've been more rigid.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I like that.
• 42:42
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's like this is that's a good way of saying it, or maybe this fits for me.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_00: This resonates for me.
• 42:47
  SPEAKER_02: Or this is good.
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_02: This is, you know, it's not that something's good or bad, it's that this is good for me.
• 42:51
  SPEAKER_00: Or this is like, something's just ring your bell, you know?
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_00: Totally.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_00: For so many reasons, and other things just fall flat.
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's all okay.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_00: It's all okay.
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_00: It's all okay.
• 43:04
  SPEAKER_00: You can ring my bell.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_00: Ring my bell.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_01: Ring my bell.
• 43:11
  SPEAKER_01: Ring a ring a ring.
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_02: Well, thank you all for listening to another episode of our podcast.
• 43:19
  SPEAKER_02: If um this reminds you of someone, or you thought, oh man, I need to share this with my roommate or my husband, go ahead.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_02: Share, share away.
• 43:28
  SPEAKER_02: That's one of the easiest ways that we can continue to get our ideas out to people.
• 43:34
  SPEAKER_02: And if it is um brightening your day, it very well may brighten somebody else's.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_02: So share the love, and we love you.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_02: We will see you here next week on being different.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_00: Together.