Latest / Mathis Family Talks / Code-Switching: Survival or Surrender? | Ep. 3

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Code-Switching: Survival or Surrender? | Ep. 3 · Mathis Family Talks

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  Speaker 1: And she sends me an email.
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  Speaker 2: She's like, I was thinking about our conversation and I
• 0:03
  Speaker 2: wanted to pick it up after you stormed out of
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  Speaker 2: my office.
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  Speaker 3: You haven't seen storm.
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  Speaker 2: And I realized in that moment, it doesn't matter what
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  Speaker 2: I do, this person's always going to see me as
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: an angry black woman unless I agree with.
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  Speaker 4: Everything they sing and do. And from that moment, that
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  Speaker 4: changed everything.
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  Speaker 2: When they saw me in the office again, I had,
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  Speaker 2: I had crochets in my hand.
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  Speaker 4: I done, I'm done.
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  Speaker 5: I'm judge Greg Matthews. I am Lynda Man. Welcome to
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  Speaker 5: Matthew's Family Talks.
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  Speaker 6: This is our episode code switching because last episode we
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  Speaker 6: had this moment where we talked about this, and so
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  Speaker 6: we wanted to expand on this with the professional and
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  Speaker 6: so what I'm gonna do is let Elliott introduce our guests.
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  Speaker 7: Yes, so we are fortunate to have with us tonight
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  Speaker 7: or today wherever you are. Latasha Gillespie, Now Latasha Gillespie
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  Speaker 7: is formally just an executive, but just not just not
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  Speaker 7: just an executive, but she's been able to sit at
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  Speaker 7: every table that we can even explain, at least from
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  Speaker 7: my purview of being in corporate America. She's a black
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  Speaker 7: woman who has felt the weight of being judged before
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  Speaker 7: she's ever opened her mouth. Sure, and she's a mentor
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  Speaker 7: who literally drove Howard students to their first interviews.
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  Speaker 3: And she pulls it. She does it as in like
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  Speaker 3: I change hearts.
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  Speaker 7: I'm not God, but I can change what you deserve
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  Speaker 7: to be doing between your nine and five.
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  Speaker 4: That's right.
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  Speaker 7: I like to really formally welcome Latasha galettes Ski to
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  Speaker 7: the Matthews family. Got a question for y'all, how do
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  Speaker 7: you all define code switching?
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  Speaker 5: By not saying y'all.
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  Speaker 4: You guys, you guys, how.
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  Speaker 5: Do we define code switching? Guys?
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  Speaker 8: No, I believe it's the being able to adjust your presentation,
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  Speaker 8: whether it's your language, your address, or other parts of
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  Speaker 8: your character and characteristics that fit the moment that allows you,
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  Speaker 8: if it allows you to better progress in society, unicate
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  Speaker 8: right to communicate.
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  Speaker 1: You can't use certain slang if that person you're talking
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  Speaker 1: to is not familiar with that slang, because you get
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  Speaker 1: a different type of response or answer from that person.
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  Speaker 2: It's what my children say, I'm doing, I'm on a
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  Speaker 2: professional call like mom has on her white voice.
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  Speaker 7: Definitely views that yeah, do you think like how with
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  Speaker 7: communication to your point, do you think it's like sometimes
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  Speaker 7: trying to connect and then it is like hiding sometimes
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  Speaker 7: when you're trying to build a code switch or you're trying.
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  Speaker 3: To build a rapport.
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  Speaker 1: Unfortunately, it is. You know, sometimes you're trying to connect
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  Speaker 1: with people who you might not have connection with, so
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  Speaker 1: you're trying to be somebody that you're not and behave
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  Speaker 1: in a way that you're not.
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  Speaker 9: Well.
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  Speaker 5: I'm big on people.
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  Speaker 8: Making people, getting people to like me, whatever that takes,
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  Speaker 8: whatever personality that takes. When I'm in the hood, deep
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  Speaker 8: in the hood, I can get them to like me
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  Speaker 8: because I speak their language and I identify with them.
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  Speaker 8: When I'm with studio execs, I have to try and
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  Speaker 8: get them to like me as well. When I'm pitching,
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  Speaker 8: I gotta adjust to what they want when we before
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  Speaker 8: we start to pitch, I gotta talk about sports or
• 3:36
  Speaker 8: I gotta talk about the weather, and I gotta make
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  Speaker 8: them like me. And it's the same when you're in
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  Speaker 8: the workplace, because no one will promote you. No one
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  Speaker 8: promotes someone they don't like.
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  Speaker 3: I don't understand, but that's true.
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  Speaker 2: I think I think all things are true right, And
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  Speaker 2: I think it is a great culture bridge builder when
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  Speaker 2: you're in environments that are not innate to you. So
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  Speaker 2: the question is not necessarily is code switching good or bad?
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  Speaker 2: The question is do I feel comfortable doing it? Or
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  Speaker 2: am I forced to do it?
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  Speaker 7: Right?
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  Speaker 2: Am I doing it because I want to be that
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  Speaker 2: bridge builder and I want to have that camaraderie with
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  Speaker 2: those folks? Or do I feel like I may be
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  Speaker 2: in jeopardy of harm if I don't.
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  Speaker 3: So it's almost a form of protecting yourself, right, And.
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  Speaker 2: That's when the trauma comes in, when you feel like
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  Speaker 2: you always have to diminish your identity in order to
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  Speaker 2: be accepted somewhere.
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  Speaker 4: And that's not a choice. It feels more forced.
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  Speaker 8: And see, I don't believe you're diminishing it. I believe
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  Speaker 8: you're just suggesting it to the environment that you're in.
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  Speaker 7: What have you experienced, like you're saying, in environments you know,
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  Speaker 7: like from you know, you've been everywhere, how you've seen
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  Speaker 7: people code switch? And when you're in a room by yourself,
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  Speaker 7: you know, like how you're talking about he was able
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  Speaker 7: to develop a rapport, yeah, when I was there, But
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  Speaker 7: what about you?
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  Speaker 4: You know, I think code switching is.
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  Speaker 2: One characteristic of a bigger concept of covering, right, And
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  Speaker 2: there's a study around covering that talk.
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  Speaker 4: But people cover in different ways.
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  Speaker 2: You can cover from an association standpoint, right, So if
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  Speaker 2: I'm one political affiliation, I might not want to let
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  Speaker 2: an organization know that because that organization might be leaning
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  Speaker 2: a different way. There's the appearance covering, you know, black
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  Speaker 2: women straightening our hair when we go on corporate environment.
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  Speaker 4: I remember earlier in my career having that debate. I
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  Speaker 4: remember wearing a perm for the first couple of years.
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  Speaker 2: I was like, they got to get to know me
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  Speaker 2: and like me before I can go natural. Yeah, yeah, exactly.
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  Speaker 2: So there's different forms of covering. There's even covering when
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  Speaker 2: it comes to social economic status. There's covering when it
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  Speaker 2: comes to marital status. All kinds of ways on which
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  Speaker 2: we cover and colds, which is just one element of
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  Speaker 2: that that we do. And then the question becomes again,
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  Speaker 2: are we doing it because we want to build bridges
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  Speaker 2: and camaraderie with folks? Are we doing it because if
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  Speaker 2: they know the truth, I might not survive in this realm?
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  Speaker 4: Right?
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  Speaker 6: So you know, I would love to steer this from
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  Speaker 6: the beginning. You know when you know, because when we
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  Speaker 6: grow up, our parents teach us, you know, how to
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  Speaker 6: act at church, how to do these things like that.
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  Speaker 6: Can we talk about when did code switching? When did
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  Speaker 6: we first learn that? And are some people taught it
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  Speaker 6: at a young age through different versions and things like that.
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  Speaker 6: Let's let's explore kind of you know, what our parents
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  Speaker 6: taught us and how that kind of affects it.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, I almost think as a parent, it's difficult because
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  Speaker 1: you want your kids to fit in with their peers.
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  Speaker 1: And so therefore, even in our situation, we moved from
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  Speaker 1: one area that was one black, yeah, and we moved
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  Speaker 1: our children they were going from middle school, I mean
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  Speaker 1: from elementary to middle school, yeah, and they moved to
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  Speaker 1: an area that was what ninety nine percent white?
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  Speaker 4: That's right.
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  Speaker 1: And so therefore, with our children, you want them to
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  Speaker 1: be able to make friends, but you want them to
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  Speaker 1: be themselves. You want them to come home with pride,
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  Speaker 1: and that was the biggest thing. Let them be able
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  Speaker 1: to be themselves and be able to be successful and
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  Speaker 1: being themselves.
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  Speaker 8: And let me say this about moving them into a
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  Speaker 8: ninety nine percent white neighborhood, it's because it was the
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  Speaker 8: number one neighborhood in the state of Michigan. I've gotten
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  Speaker 8: criticism before about moving into an all white neighborhood, even
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  Speaker 8: though I am an activist, et cetera. Well, the point
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  Speaker 8: is doctor King wanted us to live.
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  Speaker 5: The best, right, and.
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  Speaker 8: So they live in the best life, and we want
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  Speaker 8: to live it right there with ease.
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  Speaker 1: We all want our kids to have the best, whether
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  Speaker 1: be moving to a neighborhood where their schools are good,
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  Speaker 1: or whether we put them in schools that are good.
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  Speaker 1: And unfortunately most of those schools are not all of us.
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  Speaker 4: For sure.
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  Speaker 1: We have to learn how to, yeah.
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  Speaker 2: And we know that goes back to systems of inequity
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  Speaker 2: in terms of funding.
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  Speaker 4: And everything else. Right.
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  Speaker 2: And I think it's even you know, a merest question
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  Speaker 2: around when do we learn. I think it's kind of
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  Speaker 2: like generational right. So our parents, my parents and me.
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  Speaker 2: Talking about my parents, I don't know about everybody's parents,
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  Speaker 2: but my parents, you know, they grew up in the South.
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  Speaker 2: My mother was born in Mississippi, my father was born
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  Speaker 2: in Memphis, and they came up. My father remembers the
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  Speaker 2: time of segregated you know, water fountains and segregated movie theaters.
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  Speaker 2: So what they taught, and in terms of code switching,
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  Speaker 2: I think was out of survival.
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  Speaker 4: It was like, I need to keep you alive, and
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  Speaker 4: so you need to.
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  Speaker 2: Understand where you are at all times and how you
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  Speaker 2: need to act at all times. Whereas I think, you know,
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  Speaker 2: how I teach my children is slightly different. It's not
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  Speaker 2: from a place it let me take that back. I
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  Speaker 2: have two sons, so some of it is from a
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  Speaker 2: place of safety still today, right. But then also some
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  Speaker 2: of it is is just about how do you build
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  Speaker 2: those bridges to other places. I think I came out
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  Speaker 2: of the womb code switching. Why listen, I don't remember
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  Speaker 2: anybody ever sending me down telling me you act one
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  Speaker 2: way in this environment.
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  Speaker 4: But I grew up I lived in an all white neighborhood.
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  Speaker 2: I was always the only little chocolate thing in class,
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  Speaker 2: you know, and my parents stress education like you do,
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  Speaker 2: and so it was important for me to be a
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  Speaker 2: good student. I wanted to be a good student, which
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  Speaker 2: meant I had to read well, write well, those things.
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  Speaker 2: But I also spent a lot of time with my
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  Speaker 2: grandparents on that side of town that didn't look nothing
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  Speaker 2: like that, right.
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  Speaker 4: And one of the best examples when I knew I was.
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  Speaker 2: I was reflecting on that, preparing for this, and I
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  Speaker 2: was talking about code switching the other way.
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  Speaker 4: You know, when you're kids, you.
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  Speaker 2: Play games, you play house, you play whatever, right, you
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  Speaker 2: play whatever you see your parents do.
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  Speaker 4: So your parents go to the d n V.
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  Speaker 2: As kids, y'all pretend like we going to the DNV
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  Speaker 2: getting our driver's ice. Is your parents taking McDonalds. We're
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  Speaker 2: gonna pretend like we have McDonald's. I'm gonna take your order.
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  Speaker 2: You're gonna order your food. One day, while in my
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  Speaker 2: grandmother's neighborhood, the kids said, let's play Public Aid office.
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  Speaker 1: Oh wow, Because in that moment, I have no idea,
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  Speaker 1: but I knew.
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  Speaker 4: I wasn't gonna I wasn't gonna ask. I was just
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  Speaker 4: gonna figure it out.
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  Speaker 3: And go along.
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  Speaker 4: That was code switching. It was because there's socio economic
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  Speaker 4: code switching. There's all kinds of code switch. I wasn't
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  Speaker 4: there gonna ask because everybody in that group knew what.
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  Speaker 2: They were talking about except what you too good, you don't.
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  Speaker 4: Know what you know.
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  Speaker 2: It was years later before I even realized what they
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  Speaker 2: were playing.
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  Speaker 5: How about hair on the code switching?
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  Speaker 2: Listen, every black one has lived through this, you know,
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  Speaker 2: which is why I'm so grateful for the women who
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  Speaker 2: offer the Crown acts so that women can wear We're
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  Speaker 2: the only women on the planet who get criticized for
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  Speaker 2: how their hair naturally grows out of our heads. Yes, yes,
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  Speaker 2: everybody else, yeah, And so I'm really appreciative the Crown
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  Speaker 2: acting so that it, you know, causes companies not to
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  Speaker 2: practice discrimination against women who wear their hair in the
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  Speaker 2: natural state.
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  Speaker 4: But I mean, we know it still happens.
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  Speaker 8: Yes, and me and with dreads are so short discriminated
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  Speaker 8: because of their appearance.
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  Speaker 1: And they go back to our children, and our children
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  Speaker 1: have to be in environments where you're looking at hair
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  Speaker 1: that you don't have to cry when it gets comb
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  Speaker 1: and we have children that we have to do certain
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: things through our hair to their hair and them just
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  Speaker 1: feeling in a certain way where not the sling. I
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  Speaker 1: see it with my granddaughters, you know what I mean.
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  Speaker 1: And so keeping them strong and keeping them proud of
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  Speaker 1: how they look, it's a task for us mothers.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, or parents.
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  Speaker 2: Do you remember Whitney or Whoopy Gold Broadway show? Like
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  Speaker 2: it was the first thing that she came out with.
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: She had the special age build. This was like probably
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: thirty years ago, and she did the different characters, and
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  Speaker 2: one of them she does is she puts the shirt
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: on her head and she's pretending to be a little girl,
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  Speaker 2: a little black girl who's pretending to have long, flowing
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: blonde hair, and she does these different skits. And I
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  Speaker 2: remember watching that and feeling so seen because as.
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  Speaker 4: A kid, you know, the only.
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  Speaker 2: Images I saw exactly were that we didn't see black
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  Speaker 2: women with their natural hair looking beautiful and all of that.
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  Speaker 4: We didn't get a chance to see that.
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  Speaker 2: So I understood what that skit was about innately right,
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  Speaker 2: and that code switching of wishing you had that hair,
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: ending those things, which.
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  Speaker 4: Is why images matter so much.
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  Speaker 2: The work you do every day on television, the work
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: that I was doing and Amazon MGM studios, what we see,
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: those those images, the stories we tell matter more than
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: we think they do.
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  Speaker 8: As Linda was making reference to our grandchildren, we are
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  Speaker 8: so at least I am. I'm sure Lindia's as well.
• 12:02
  Speaker 8: Glad when they come to Detroit, and they come every
• 12:06
  Speaker 8: year for at least a couple of weeks or so,
• 12:09
  Speaker 8: and they are able to engage folks in a overwhelming
• 12:15
  Speaker 8: majority black city. We went to a great Juneteenth celebration
• 12:20
  Speaker 8: and they witnessed hundreds, if not thousands of people, and
• 12:24
  Speaker 8: they were there with the black mayor everybody that was black,
• 12:29
  Speaker 8: and everybody there practiced black excellence, and so we were.
• 12:33
  Speaker 8: So it was so fulfilling to have them. And they'll
• 12:38
  Speaker 8: learn by experience for sure. And so when you ask
• 12:42
  Speaker 8: did we have to teach the children, I think they
• 12:44
  Speaker 8: learned by experience more than what we say to them.
• 12:48
  Speaker 8: Because what we had all our children as well, our
• 12:51
  Speaker 8: boys and daughters. We had them even after we moved
• 12:55
  Speaker 8: to an all white neighborhood. I took them to the
• 12:57
  Speaker 8: toughest part of the town in Detroit playing a basketball league.
• 13:02
  Speaker 9: Yeah.
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  Speaker 5: Do you remember that of me?
• 13:04
  Speaker 9: Yeah?
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  Speaker 3: I do.
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  Speaker 6: And you know that's I really liked that you mentioned
• 13:08
  Speaker 6: that because I had a great call with Natasha earlier
• 13:10
  Speaker 6: this week and she was explaining how her sons, you know,
• 13:13
  Speaker 6: they grew up in very diverse communities and things like that,
• 13:17
  Speaker 6: and I'll let you share it about you know, their
• 13:19
  Speaker 6: college choice and how Yeah, good that, because I really
• 13:21
  Speaker 6: want to touch on the fact of how do you
• 13:24
  Speaker 6: prepare yet prepare your children and then into the real world.
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: But these environments, and I think judge exactly what you
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: were saying about giving them a strong sense of self.
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: So we moved around a lot. My company moved us
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: seven times. The two companies are worked for moved us
• 13:37
  Speaker 2: seven times. So my kids got very comfortable in environments
• 13:40
  Speaker 2: that didn't always look like them. They had friends of
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: every race ethnicity, which was wonderful. I remember one day
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: seeing them standing on the balcony. Looked like a skittle's bag, right,
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  Speaker 2: So that was great. But then shortly after that they
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: were playing in an AAU tournament and an all black
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: team comes in and instantly they said, oh, we're gonna lose.
• 14:00
  Speaker 4: And we said, what do you mean? They said, look
• 14:02
  Speaker 4: look at that team and we said, oh, so you don't.
• 14:06
  Speaker 2: They are you and you are them. Why are you
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: looking at them any different?
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  Speaker 9: Right?
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  Speaker 4: And so my husband and the light bulb went on.
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: We were like, yo, we let where urban League NAACP
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: church grew. We went to a multicultural church, but we
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: would often then go visit another all black church and
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: their community stuff and make sure the boys were engrossed
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: than that, because we need you to have a strong
• 14:27
  Speaker 2: sense of self.
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  Speaker 4: So when we were in Singapore. My oldest.
• 14:30
  Speaker 2: They both were in high school, and my oldest had
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: already decided where he was going to school. And I
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: was like, look here, I know you want to go
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: with your friends to Bali for spring break, but have
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: you met your mam machine, Finna, let that happen. So
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: what you are going to do is you're going to
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: go back to the States and the two of you
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: are going to go on to HBCU tour.
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  Speaker 4: The oldest was kicking and screaming, I don't know why
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  Speaker 4: I need to go. I've already decided where I'm going
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  Speaker 4: to school.
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  Speaker 2: I want to go with my friends, and you, Finna,
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: get on this plane and going back and you feel
• 14:58
  Speaker 2: about to do this HBS HBCU tour. When I picked
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: them up from the airport and they came home the
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: change judge, they got in a car talking about, yes, official,
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: we can't go to a PWI, said, I said, what's
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: a PWI. I don't even know somebo the predominantly white institution.
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: I said, oh, there's language. They got out there, they
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: started unpacking. There was a Howard hoodie, a famu, you know,
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: all this and that. And I was so grateful that
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: they came to it on their own. I didn't have
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: to force it down there. I forced it a little
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: bit down that throat, but they made the final decision
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: because it was important to us. We are comfortable and
• 15:35
  Speaker 2: confident that y'all will survive in any place in the world.
• 15:37
  Speaker 4: We've seen you do it.
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: We've seen you move seven times, We've seen you in
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: diverse environments.
• 15:42
  Speaker 4: You define. But in order to survive in this world.
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: I need you to know you are a black man,
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: and I need you to have the pride that comes
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: with that. I need you to have the sense of
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: self worth that comes with that. I need you to
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: have the identity that comes with that. And I think
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: the best place given you where y'all have.
• 15:58
  Speaker 4: Lived is at an HBC.
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: Now that might not be everybody's darting, but considering they
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: had done everything else but that, I felt like they
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: needed that.
• 16:07
  Speaker 4: Immersion, yeah, before they got to the real world.
• 16:11
  Speaker 6: But in here and just said parent appreciation because you
• 16:13
  Speaker 6: all did do a great job in terms.
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: Of you have to really put thought into it.
• 16:19
  Speaker 6: Yeah, Because we moved from a ninety nine percent black
• 16:23
  Speaker 6: school in Detroit and when I was in fifth grade,
• 16:26
  Speaker 6: Greg was in six, so middle school was a little
• 16:27
  Speaker 6: bit more diverse. I was the only black child in
• 16:30
  Speaker 6: my entire elementary school. And I remember the first day
• 16:34
  Speaker 6: of school. I told this girl, I won't say her name,
• 16:36
  Speaker 6: let's say ls. She knows who she might be. But
• 16:39
  Speaker 6: it's fifth grade. It's one of those moments that stick
• 16:41
  Speaker 6: with you. And she said, I said, oh, where do
• 16:44
  Speaker 6: you live? And I said, oh, I live. I told
• 16:46
  Speaker 6: her where we lived. We had a you know, really
• 16:49
  Speaker 6: prominent home on the hill. And she said, you don't
• 16:51
  Speaker 6: live there.
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: I said, I said yeah.
• 16:53
  Speaker 9: She said no, there's no way you could live there.
• 16:57
  Speaker 4: Wow.
• 16:57
  Speaker 5: And I thought about.
• 16:58
  Speaker 6: It and I was like and I was like, oh,
• 17:01
  Speaker 6: she's saying that because I'm different. Oh I didn't, you know,
• 17:05
  Speaker 6: quantify it down, but I'm different. I look around everyone's
• 17:08
  Speaker 6: white and Jewish and things like that. And so I
• 17:11
  Speaker 6: remember that's when my code switching kind of started, because
• 17:15
  Speaker 6: I in my mind, I said, well, what I'm gonna
• 17:19
  Speaker 6: do is I'm gonna make it so I'm not as
• 17:22
  Speaker 6: different and any anywhere that I go, I don't want
• 17:26
  Speaker 6: to be different anymore because that didn't make me feel good.
• 17:29
  Speaker 6: And so, but you all did a great job, because
• 17:32
  Speaker 6: you know, then you adapt to that community. Then you
• 17:35
  Speaker 6: got to go back, you know, your family. So one
• 17:39
  Speaker 6: crew saying that I pronounced ask different. They say, you're
• 17:43
  Speaker 6: saying as the other one talking about why you pronounced
• 17:46
  Speaker 6: and ask so.
• 17:49
  Speaker 9: But we always were back and forth, and I just
• 17:51
  Speaker 9: appreciate that.
• 17:52
  Speaker 8: Let me ask this, what do you do you're trying
• 17:56
  Speaker 8: to code switch, and you're trying to, like I said,
• 18:00
  Speaker 8: get people to like you and help you progress in life.
• 18:04
  Speaker 8: If they're racist, do you still try to play that
• 18:08
  Speaker 8: game or do you just reject it all together and
• 18:11
  Speaker 8: let the sack let it sacrifice.
• 18:13
  Speaker 7: Well, I mean, just with what we're talking about, with
• 18:15
  Speaker 7: my parents in particular, and even my grandparents right who
• 18:19
  Speaker 7: lived around from the South and South Carolina have seen
• 18:22
  Speaker 7: racist and racist code switch to so races will act
• 18:25
  Speaker 7: as though they are.
• 18:29
  Speaker 3: It's like, oh, I love back people.
• 18:32
  Speaker 7: Yeah, they will turn around and be like I hate
• 18:35
  Speaker 7: those and you know what I mean, right, So I've
• 18:37
  Speaker 7: seen that in person, where you know, oh yeah, Elliott,
• 18:41
  Speaker 7: oh that's great. But then when I'm around my family everybody,
• 18:43
  Speaker 7: when you see the full picture of the blackness that
• 18:46
  Speaker 7: we are, you can see the change in their faces.
• 18:48
  Speaker 3: So like I feel as though you should not hide that.
• 18:51
  Speaker 7: You should not allow yourself to connect to something just
• 18:54
  Speaker 7: because it may give you a moment of success or winning,
• 18:58
  Speaker 7: when in reality, it's a it's your culture, it's who
• 19:01
  Speaker 7: you are, And if somebody's the fame in that, like,
• 19:03
  Speaker 7: I wouldn't want to be a party.
• 19:04
  Speaker 5: Oh no, I wouldn't want to be.
• 19:05
  Speaker 8: I wouldn't let anybody no no in order to win,
• 19:10
  Speaker 8: not at all. If I were talking to someone and
• 19:12
  Speaker 8: I kind of felt they were racist, I would my
• 19:15
  Speaker 8: whole demeanor would change, and I would try to get
• 19:18
  Speaker 8: off of that call or that zoom or that meeting
• 19:21
  Speaker 8: as quickly as I can before things turn bad.
• 19:25
  Speaker 2: But now you have that luxury, what about the people
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: who show up at work every day, working at nine
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: to five, who can't get off the zoom, who are
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: not in a position to say I don't want to
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: do business with you. They have no choice but to
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: do business with those people.
• 19:38
  Speaker 7: Right, it's super uncomfortable. I've been around environments where I'm
• 19:44
  Speaker 7: trying to think how I can tell the story, but
• 19:47
  Speaker 7: where we're on a call, or you're in a room
• 19:50
  Speaker 7: where it is predominantly white or predominantly you know, with
• 19:54
  Speaker 7: a Southern act, and they say things that are not
• 19:58
  Speaker 7: I'll say corporate appropriate and you know art so for
• 20:02
  Speaker 7: me as we say, I've clocked it right there, and
• 20:04
  Speaker 7: I'm like, okay, I know how to handle this person. Yeah,
• 20:07
  Speaker 7: because in every environment you're not allowed to walk away,
• 20:11
  Speaker 7: storm out, because then they're going to look at you
• 20:12
  Speaker 7: as I feel as though as we been able to perform,
• 20:15
  Speaker 7: you know, all that type of all of that. But
• 20:17
  Speaker 7: it is your dude, I guess process whatever the case
• 20:21
  Speaker 7: may be, to be like, Okay, you know that was
• 20:24
  Speaker 7: i e. Disrespectful, whatever the case may be, but you
• 20:27
  Speaker 7: can still be able to perform.
• 20:28
  Speaker 3: And that's the hard line.
• 20:30
  Speaker 7: I'll say that I've had the balance a lot through
• 20:32
  Speaker 7: my career just to be able to be like, Okay,
• 20:34
  Speaker 7: I'm not gonna get pissed off, just ye this man,
• 20:36
  Speaker 7: just say it, but let me make sure how much
• 20:38
  Speaker 7: you know, how mat sure I am to still deliver
• 20:41
  Speaker 7: and address how I'm feeling about that. Early in my
• 20:44
  Speaker 7: career I was uncomfortable doing that. I was just like, oh, okay,
• 20:48
  Speaker 7: then go back to my desk. But now in my career,
• 20:51
  Speaker 7: knowing how much I know, understanding how much I've went through,
• 20:54
  Speaker 7: my parents went through everybody went through, Like it's really
• 20:57
  Speaker 7: important to stand on what you believe in.
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and you don't even have the luxury of getting
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: up said you what six' five.
• 21:04
  Speaker 4: Exactly the voice and darks end ready for anything comes
• 21:10
  Speaker 4: out of your.
• 21:10
  Speaker 9: Mind yeah.
• 21:11
  Speaker 2: Exactly you, know you, know you, know a certain demographic
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: in their tears will will point you out quickly.
• 21:19
  Speaker 3: Even if you didn't do anything. Right, yes you know
• 21:21
  Speaker 3: WHAT i.
• 21:22
  Speaker 4: Mean explain the second. Part when does the fitting in become?
• 21:24
  Speaker 7: Biased so when you are, saying like When i'm talking
• 21:27
  Speaker 7: about as far as having an executive, presence, right and
• 21:29
  Speaker 7: you are code switching in that sense to fit in
• 21:32
  Speaker 7: with the group versus really being able to get that
• 21:34
  Speaker 7: credibility and that that trustworthiness from. Them like where do
• 21:38
  Speaker 7: you where did you find that line in like Corporate?
• 21:40
  Speaker 3: America from your, PERSPECTIVE.
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: I THINK i code switched for the majority of my.
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: Career so definitely during the first twenty years In, CATERPILLAR
• 21:50
  Speaker 2: i spent twenty years with, them for, sure code switch.
• 21:54
  Speaker 7: That, Industry, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 21:58
  Speaker 4: And a lot of exactly, exactly, yeah for.
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: Sure and then In, amazon code switched early on in my,
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: career AND i, REMEMBER i remember the pivotal moment WHEN i.
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: Stopped it was a moment WHERE i was having to
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: have a hard conversation with the, leader my, leader my,
• 22:16
  Speaker 2: Boss and it was one of those conversations WHERE i was,
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: like this is gonna be, hard but it's one of
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: those opportunities WHERE i was, LIKE i have to speak
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: truth to, power, right and SO i want to be
• 22:26
  Speaker 2: graceful about. IT i want to be respectful about. It
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: i've practiced, it you, Know i've thought about the, Tone
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: i've thought about the, WORDS i thought about the. Volume
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: So i'm in the office having the conversation and it's
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: a tough conversation and the.
• 22:36
  Speaker 4: Leader is not really accepting of her.
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: Right But i'm standing on my, truth very respectful, again
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: very mindful of all of these.
• 22:44
  Speaker 4: Things you.
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: KNOW i KNOW i have colleagues outside the, door So
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: i'm even keeping the volume, down and you, know and
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: the meeting was starting to run, over AND i remember her, saying,
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: well you, Know i'm really, well that's not WHAT i.
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: Meant AND i, said, RESPECTFULLY i understand that was not your,
• 22:59
  Speaker 2: intention BUT i need you to understand that it was the, impact,
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: Right AND i, SAID i want to be respectful on my,
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: colleagues BECAUSE i know they've been waiting outside the. Door
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: they have a meeting with, you so we can pick
• 23:08
  Speaker 2: it back up later AND i. Leave later, ON i
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: guess she came looking for me AND i had already
• 23:15
  Speaker 2: left for the, day and she sends me an. Email she's,
• 23:17
  Speaker 2: LIKE i was thinking about our conversation AND i wanted
• 23:19
  Speaker 2: to pick it up after you stormed out of my.
• 23:21
  Speaker 4: Office oh my, goodness blah blah, blah blah.
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: BLAH i can't tell you what the rest of the
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: emails said BECAUSE i stopped that stormed out of my.
• 23:27
  Speaker 7: Storm, yes and so much self control that you probably
• 23:31
  Speaker 7: had when you were.
• 23:31
  Speaker 3: There you're, like you haven't seen, storm you.
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: Know WHAT i.
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: Mean but it clicked for me in that moment that
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: this PERSON i had been, PLACATING i had been soft.
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: SHOEING i hadn't been holding them accountable for the things,
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: that you, know in the POSITION i was, IN i
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: was trying to get them to come along and be
• 23:51
  Speaker 2: a better advocate for you, know AND i wasn't really
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: holding their feet to the fire LIKE i really.
• 23:55
  Speaker 4: Should, have just trying to trying to build a relationship
• 23:58
  Speaker 4: and slowly bring them.
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: In BUT i realized in that, moment it doesn't matter
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: WHAT i, do this person's always going to see me
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: as an angry black woman UNLESS i agree with everything
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: they sing and. Do AND i, said Now i'm mad
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: at them for not being able to see, me.
• 24:12
  Speaker 4: And i'm mad at.
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: Me i'm mad at me for being something that wasn't
• 24:17
  Speaker 2: authentic to WHO i was playking you all this. TIME i,
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: SAID i know what's gonna happen from here on. Out
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: i'm gonna be mad at one of, us and it
• 24:23
  Speaker 2: ain't gonna be. Me and from that, moment that changed.
• 24:27
  Speaker 2: Everything and WHEN i tell, you one of my coworkers
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: laughs at me BECAUSE i walked out look after that,
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: incident when they saw me in the office, AGAIN i
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: had crochets in my.
• 24:36
  Speaker 4: Hair, LISTEN.
• 24:39
  Speaker 7: I.
• 24:40
  Speaker 4: Done i'm. Done but WHEN.
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: I tell, YOU i had the Super bowl of my
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: career after, THAT i mean Super bowl in my. CAREER
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: i wrote the first strategy doc For amazon That Jeff bezos.
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: Blessed we hosted this conference At amazon Called Core conversations
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: On race And. Ethnicity this is right after A Philandel
• 24:59
  Speaker 2: castie And Sandra bland had got killed and we had
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: this amazing two day CONFERENCE i mean it was. Awesome
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: it was like thing after thing was happening at the
• 25:11
  Speaker 2: highest level of. Excellence AND i realized how much ENERGY
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: i had been putting into code switching or trying to
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: be pleasing to someone, Else and that's ENERGY i could
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: have been putting towards solving real, problems figuring out how
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: we were gonna win over more, customers how do we
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: make this business run.
• 25:29
  Speaker 4: Smoother and that's the.
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: Thing people don't understand the difference between doing it to
• 25:33
  Speaker 2: build bridges and doing it when it's a trauma, response,
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: right because one is depleting you of energy that could
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: be used for better, purposes.
• 25:41
  Speaker 3: Right and that's what you.
• 25:41
  Speaker 8: Felt that's very, interesting you, know with regard to my
• 25:46
  Speaker 8: career code switching within our, community the whole, city The,
• 25:54
  Speaker 8: detroit and the INTERACTION i had was all black folks
• 25:57
  Speaker 8: all my. Career detroit's the blackest big city In america
• 26:00
  Speaker 8: has been for dozens of years and so. Decades and
• 26:04
  Speaker 8: so WHEN i started came out of, COLLEGE i worked
• 26:07
  Speaker 8: at City, hall BUT i was still, rougher which was
• 26:10
  Speaker 8: all black and all. PROFESSIONAL i worked for the city
• 26:13
  Speaker 8: council and on the other, hand on the, Weekends lindy
• 26:18
  Speaker 8: can tell. YOU i was in the sweatsuits with, jewelry
• 26:21
  Speaker 8: with bracelets with, rings AND i was kicking the game
• 26:25
  Speaker 8: with my.
• 26:25
  Speaker 5: Boys it WAS i was a totally.
• 26:27
  Speaker 8: Different person BECAUSE i hadn't quite made the total transformation
• 26:33
  Speaker 8: from street. Kid because all my buddies four years, later
• 26:36
  Speaker 8: they still street guys AND i just didn't get engaged
• 26:40
  Speaker 8: in what they were engaged.
• 26:41
  Speaker 5: In and you, know BUT i had the code.
• 26:44
  Speaker 8: SWITCH i had to kick it with them LIKE i used,
• 26:47
  Speaker 8: to and then WHEN i got down the city, HALL
• 26:49
  Speaker 8: i had to have a different presentation for myself.
• 26:53
  Speaker 7: Kicking it with them to what you're, saying that mental
• 26:55
  Speaker 7: exhaustion probably finished Your, yeah like you know WHAT i,
• 26:58
  Speaker 7: MEAN i give you more energy where, YEAH i can
• 27:00
  Speaker 7: go back down to this.
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: Good, yeah that's a healthy strategic, yeah.
• 27:08
  Speaker 7: ABSOLUTELY I, well for, ME i think my biggest experience
• 27:14
  Speaker 7: is WHEN i first started, working and you, know a
• 27:16
  Speaker 7: lot of engineering, wise you have to have a lot
• 27:18
  Speaker 7: of proof of, concept, right so a lot of, reporting
• 27:20
  Speaker 7: a lot of data going, out and then WHEN i
• 27:22
  Speaker 7: had to present it in front of this, GROUP i
• 27:24
  Speaker 7: think that was the first TIME i felt like people
• 27:27
  Speaker 7: were looking at me, like, oh he can speak with you,
• 27:30
  Speaker 7: know edification or whatever and not really paying attention to the.
• 27:33
  Speaker 7: Report AND i could see it within their, faces, Right
• 27:36
  Speaker 7: and SO i was discouraged then to your point WHERE
• 27:39
  Speaker 7: i was trying to make sure, That, okay let me
• 27:41
  Speaker 7: make Sure i'm always like, this, yeah, right LIKE i
• 27:43
  Speaker 7: make SURE i always speak this.
• 27:44
  Speaker 3: WAY i can't say, y'all you know When.
• 27:46
  Speaker 7: I'm doing these types of, things, Right AND i think
• 27:49
  Speaker 7: it took me UNTIL i Really i'll, say met Like
• 27:57
  Speaker 7: greg and met like you, know people that really trusted
• 28:00
  Speaker 7: me to make me feel, like you know, WHAT i
• 28:02
  Speaker 7: don't have to fake or be a certain, way, RIGHT
• 28:05
  Speaker 7: i don't have to be in the silo to make
• 28:06
  Speaker 7: this person feel. Comfortable, yes you, Know i'll be authentic to,
• 28:10
  Speaker 7: me BUT i don't have to give myself away to, everything.
• 28:13
  Speaker 3: Right SO i think it's important to have that like.
• 28:16
  Speaker 7: That if it's not going back to those environments where
• 28:18
  Speaker 7: you can get, replenished make sure you make room for, yourself,
• 28:21
  Speaker 7: right so that you can feel the most.
• 28:23
  Speaker 8: Authentic let me give you an, example, however Of linda
• 28:26
  Speaker 8: in her career as a operator of five, preschools dealing
• 28:31
  Speaker 8: with hundreds of, parents no, Doubt AND i said to
• 28:34
  Speaker 8: her one, time.
• 28:37
  Speaker 5: Why you talk to those people so much nicer and
• 28:42
  Speaker 5: with such.
• 28:43
  Speaker 10: A different, tone and you talk to, me you, know she,
• 28:47
  Speaker 10: said she, said, well you ain't paying.
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: Me running those daycare center, Many.
• 29:06
  Speaker 6: Yeah explain on that, mine BECAUSE i don't think a
• 29:08
  Speaker 6: lot of people know about you, know.
• 29:10
  Speaker 5: You had a bunch of.
• 29:11
  Speaker 9: Personalities have you had your, kids you had other?
• 29:16
  Speaker 3: Kids you HAVE i.
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: Had five daycare sentence over one hundred and fifty. Kids
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: toldal with you, know so therefore you have all those
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: Parents AND i told people all the, time it's not the.
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: Children it gives you a headache at the end of the.
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: Day so, yes you do have to CoA. Switch you have.
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: To you have parents that come from the corporate. World
• 29:37
  Speaker 1: you have those who were a little less fortunate and you, know, economically, yeah,
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: economically so, no you. Do won't sell. Me it's our,
• 29:46
  Speaker 1: livelihood you. Know this is what we. Do this is
• 29:49
  Speaker 1: what we do in.
• 29:50
  Speaker 5: Life, YEAH i heard one of.
• 29:52
  Speaker 8: THEM i don't, know you might not have did right
• 29:54
  Speaker 8: on this one BECAUSE i heard of walking out there and,
• 29:56
  Speaker 8: say oh, Boogie.
• 30:01
  Speaker 5: I'm just.
• 30:02
  Speaker 4: Kid but.
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: It's ALSO i Think i'm listening to everybody's experience and
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: it's these experience that make us better. Leaders and a
• 30:15
  Speaker 2: lot of time you actually look at, data it will
• 30:16
  Speaker 2: show that typically people from marginalized communities tend to be
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: better leaders from a standpoint of engagement with their, employees
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: productivity from their.
• 30:24
  Speaker 4: Employees because we've been so.
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: Used to being othered and different that we kind of
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: have an advantage in leading across. Differences we tend, to you, know,
• 30:34
  Speaker 2: know how to work with people who are different than
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: us in the. Setting AND i REMEMBER i was telling
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: you guys the story about when my husband AND i
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: first when we had our first, son we weren't married
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: and we WERE i worked for very conservative, COMPANY i
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: mean so conservative that every executive who was also male
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: at the, time we didn't have any female executives at this.
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: Time every executive was a. Male they all were married
• 30:56
  Speaker 2: and as soon as one got, divorced within six, months
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: they be. Remarried so WHEN i found OUT i was,
• 31:01
  Speaker 2: PREGNANT i was, like, oh these folks aman to fire,
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: me and hid it as long AS i, could and
• 31:07
  Speaker 2: then covered by, saying, oh, well you, know we just
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: went and got, married you, know at the, courthouse and
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: we'll do something.
• 31:14
  Speaker 4: Later but we.
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: Hadn't AND i remember later on in my career WHEN
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: i had a young man who worked for me who
• 31:21
  Speaker 2: was gay and was coming out of the, Closet and
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: as he began to share with me his experience of
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: changing the, pronouns of changing the weekend, story of all
• 31:29
  Speaker 2: the things that he went, THROUGH i could understand one
• 31:32
  Speaker 2: hundred percent of how he felt because it was the
• 31:34
  Speaker 2: exact same FEELINGS i had as an unwed.
• 31:37
  Speaker 5: Mother, well now let me say something on.
• 31:39
  Speaker 8: That and my son in law or he, knows but
• 31:42
  Speaker 8: my wife and my daughter perhaps. Don't and that is
• 31:46
  Speaker 8: when my daughter was pregnant with her child prior to. Marriage,
• 31:54
  Speaker 8: Yeah SO i took him to the side AND i,
• 31:57
  Speaker 8: said what you're going to? DO i, said you don't
• 32:00
  Speaker 8: want to embarrass her in the workplace because there's a
• 32:05
  Speaker 8: stereotype about black men and black, women of, course and,
• 32:11
  Speaker 8: hey what you're gonna? Do and so he did the right,
• 32:14
  Speaker 8: thing AND i think that she was able to maintain
• 32:19
  Speaker 8: her dignity and avoid the stereotype of a black woman
• 32:24
  Speaker 8: who's pregnant and don't have a. Husband and SO i
• 32:29
  Speaker 8: had to deal with that in an actual. Way you're not.
• 32:32
  Speaker 6: Just buddying real. Quick that makes so much. SENSE i
• 32:35
  Speaker 6: was talking To ryan, Once, yeah, man you, know make
• 32:41
  Speaker 6: sure YOU i don't know IF i was ready for.
• 32:43
  Speaker 6: MARRIAGE i don't know if you KNOW i got married to.
• 32:45
  Speaker 9: You so WHEN i, said why'd you do? It see
• 32:47
  Speaker 9: your daddy.
• 32:48
  Speaker 3: Made me.
• 32:58
  Speaker 5: A little more. Time BUT i.
• 33:01
  Speaker 9: COULDN'T i couldn't resist myself with.
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: That when you think about the trauma of hiding being
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: an unwet, mother the trauma hiding being uh gay or
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: queer in the in the, workplace CAN i touch Your
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: hair's the job.
• 33:23
  Speaker 4: Having braids one day and not the. Other did your hair? Grow?
• 33:32
  Speaker 4: Yeah too? Much but, YEAH i think.
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: You know Everybody and this may be controversial to some,
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: people AND i really don't. Care BUT i had gotten
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: to the point WHERE i was, LIKE i don't even
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: care if we use the word diversity. Anymore there's such
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: a connotation around, it and everybody has a preconceived notion
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: and for some people it means something, good for some
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: people it means something.
• 33:54
  Speaker 4: Bad And i'm, LIKE i don't care if you call, it.
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: Frank at the end of the, day this is about
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: how do you understand WHOM i customers are, today who
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: my customers are, tomorrow who's not engaged with my business
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: because we haven't built a relationship with. Them who are
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: the PEOPLE i need at the table to help me
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: go understand who that customer group, is what they resonate,
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: with and how they can trust That i'm a good
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: business partner.
• 34:15
  Speaker 4: Or supplier to. Them, Right and that's really what diversity work.
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: Is and so if you allow people to bring their
• 34:20
  Speaker 2: lived experience to the table.
• 34:24
  Speaker 8: In such companies are more successful because they know that
• 34:28
  Speaker 8: if they Hire latino executives in the marketing, division well
• 34:32
  Speaker 8: That latino knows its people more than the white. Executive
• 34:36
  Speaker 8: the hire An African american, executive particularly focused on The
• 34:41
  Speaker 8: African american, market who can do it. Better so it's
• 34:44
  Speaker 8: really good business more than it is the right thing to,
• 34:47
  Speaker 8: do because it's hard to get people to.
• 34:49
  Speaker 5: Do the right things in many.
• 34:51
  Speaker 8: Instances but you appeal to you appeal to them on
• 34:54
  Speaker 8: the sense of you'll make more money.
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: For, sure and if nothing, else and, granted speak for
• 35:00
  Speaker 2: all black. People you can't speak for all gay. People
• 35:02
  Speaker 2: you can't speak for all, men you can't speak for all.
• 35:04
  Speaker 2: Women but we can help you avoid some of the
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: pitfalls y'all keep falling in because there's nobody at the
• 35:09
  Speaker 2: table with that lived, experience you. Know SO i used
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: to love when people used to tell, me, well this
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: is how we're gonna market this movie to women between
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: a certain demographic And i'm looking, Around so tell me what.
• 35:20
  Speaker 4: That's a good, idea, right you know WHAT i?
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: Mean, so, like at least for nothing, else they will
• 35:26
  Speaker 2: help keep you out of the pitfalls that we keep
• 35:28
  Speaker 2: seeing these folks trip into because there was nobody at
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: the table to pull the red flag and say uh huh.
• 35:34
  Speaker 7: Yes and it's People sometimes it's people at the table
• 35:37
  Speaker 7: but not feeling that may still be dealing with the
• 35:39
  Speaker 7: trauma you're talking about that won't speak. Up, YEAH i,
• 35:41
  Speaker 7: mean how do we convince those folks to feel? Comfortable
• 35:45
  Speaker 7: is that where it's that gap between, like, hey let
• 35:48
  Speaker 7: me tell you about my lived experience because, we're you,
• 35:50
  Speaker 7: know dealing with our. Trauma how have? YOU i know
• 35:53
  Speaker 7: you talked about how you after that you went shade your.
• 35:56
  Speaker 7: Hair you're, Like i'm, ready, yeah, yeah what would you
• 35:59
  Speaker 7: tell people?
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: In and that's that advocacy, covering, Right so If i'm
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: the only woman in the room AND i see a
• 36:07
  Speaker 2: policy that's gonna adversely impact.
• 36:08
  Speaker 4: WOMEN i don't want.
• 36:10
  Speaker 2: To speak up BECAUSE i might feel like they may,
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: think you, Know i'm only saying something because it's self,
• 36:14
  Speaker 2: serving or Because i'm.
• 36:16
  Speaker 4: The political, one Or i'm the.
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: Troublemaker so a lot of people don't feel comfortable speaking
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: up in those. SITUATIONS i think that's when you need
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: leader and leaders you don't have to be from a
• 36:26
  Speaker 2: marginalized community to be a good. Leader you just have
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: to be a good, human, Right and SO i think
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: leaders who have built the capacity to have empathy and
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: ask questions and be able to advocate for their people
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: is one. Thing, two when you find yourself as one
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: of only in a, ROOM i call it the onliest
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: because you're the only one and you.
• 36:46
  Speaker 3: Lonely you.
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: Gotta find if you can find at least three, advocates,
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: right so that you're not making the argument in.
• 37:03
  Speaker 4: Isolation. Right, Yeah so if two.
• 37:06
  Speaker 2: More people kind of chime in and thirty percent of
• 37:08
  Speaker 2: the room is all, like, well you, know we really
• 37:10
  Speaker 2: need to think about this, perspective, Right SO i think
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: that's helpful when people are willing to be advocates for,
• 37:16
  Speaker 2: OTHERS i think you create those spaces for, that and Then,
• 37:19
  Speaker 2: LASTLY i think you, know everybody's not ready to, Uncover
• 37:23
  Speaker 2: SO i don't ever want to rush to anybody into
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: that process because that's your.
• 37:27
  Speaker 3: Journey.
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: Right but if people can be comfortable living in their
• 37:32
  Speaker 2: authentic self and knowing that their lived experience actually is
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: not the problem in the, room it's the competitive advantage
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: in the.
• 37:39
  Speaker 5: Room that's.
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: Right because if you're the only one who has that lived,
• 37:42
  Speaker 2: experience we won't challenge.
• 37:43
  Speaker 9: You, Now, ELLIOT i have a question for.
• 37:44
  Speaker 6: You you know we spoke earlier in the week and
• 37:47
  Speaker 6: you were talking about you, know you dealing with code
• 37:50
  Speaker 6: switching professional and things like, that but also with your, sexuality,
• 37:54
  Speaker 6: right and you, know hiding that and then you know
• 37:58
  Speaker 6: it was a time where you were not as, comfortable
• 38:03
  Speaker 6: and SO i wanted you to kind of talk about,
• 38:05
  Speaker 6: that how you became comfortable and how that affected you
• 38:09
  Speaker 6: and how it is.
• 38:10
  Speaker 7: Now, RIGHT i mean to be fully, honest LIKE i
• 38:12
  Speaker 7: am still becoming, comfortable, Ye LIKE i, mean, like, YES
• 38:16
  Speaker 7: i am married To, greg and Like i'm happily.
• 38:20
  Speaker 3: With WHERE i.
• 38:20
  Speaker 7: Am BUT i will admit like When i'm in particular,
• 38:24
  Speaker 7: environments like it is me still, navigating Like i'm not
• 38:28
  Speaker 7: going to let you, say no crazy mess about my
• 38:30
  Speaker 7: sexuality or anything like. That but at the end of the,
• 38:32
  Speaker 7: DAY i am trying to navigate it. Right but to
• 38:36
  Speaker 7: answer your question to me, like, yeah INITIALLY i, was
• 38:38
  Speaker 7: that's kind of WHAT i meant within the.
• 38:40
  Speaker 2: SILOS i just needed to pause for a second and
• 38:42
  Speaker 2: just say thank you for saying, that because there's gonna
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: be so many people that watch this episode and see
• 38:46
  Speaker 2: you and see how professional you, are articulate you, are
• 38:49
  Speaker 2: and see your success and, think, well he don't have
• 38:51
  Speaker 2: the same STRUGGLES i. Got and so for you to
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: say in those, ROOMS i still have to, navigate that's.
• 38:57
  Speaker 4: Real, Yeah and that's going to help.
• 38:59
  Speaker 8: Somebody as a, FATHER i have to, navigate AND i
• 39:02
  Speaker 8: want these other fathers of gay sons to understand that
• 39:05
  Speaker 8: they too have to. Navigate and WHEN i go back
• 39:09
  Speaker 8: to around some black men and who are many of
• 39:13
  Speaker 8: them very very, Homophobic, WELL i talk about my son being,
• 39:18
  Speaker 8: married but no offense to. YOU i use the word
• 39:21
  Speaker 8: spouse because husband sounds inflammatory to. THEM i say everybody,
• 39:28
  Speaker 8: Else but there you. GO i can't reach them if they,
• 39:31
  Speaker 8: say WELL i got to call my, SON i gotta
• 39:34
  Speaker 8: say my son is a husband to ANOTHER i don't
• 39:37
  Speaker 8: know IF i want.
• 39:38
  Speaker 5: To say that spouse is, easier you.
• 39:41
  Speaker 4: Know so that's emotional.
• 39:43
  Speaker 2: Intelligence that's knowing your, audience and that's knowing your audience
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: and knowing how to not get the door closed before
• 39:49
  Speaker 2: you get.
• 39:49
  Speaker 8: Eaten, correct Because i'm trying to change their. Minds that's
• 39:53
  Speaker 8: about their gay sons. Away, No, no.
• 39:56
  Speaker 3: It's more in third and introduce.
• 39:59
  Speaker 7: It that's essentially WHAT i am doing, now, Right, Like
• 40:02
  Speaker 7: i'm just trying to in every way possible be my
• 40:06
  Speaker 7: authentic self and every you, know WHEREVER i am work
• 40:09
  Speaker 7: wise or outside of. It BUT i will admit at
• 40:12
  Speaker 7: work it was hard to, do, Right, like it was
• 40:15
  Speaker 7: really one of those things WHERE i cut off my personal,
• 40:17
  Speaker 7: life like if somebody asked about who you're, dating, like, oh,
• 40:20
  Speaker 7: yeah you, Know i'm just moving. Here i'm just getting, comfortable,
• 40:23
  Speaker 7: right like avoiding it or just talking about my. Family
• 40:25
  Speaker 7: so like you find other areas to pivot, in AND
• 40:29
  Speaker 7: i found myself pivoting so much THAT i was losing, myself, Right,
• 40:34
  Speaker 7: Yeah SO i think to your, point, like ONCE i
• 40:37
  Speaker 7: REALIZED i am out working myself of WHO i am
• 40:40
  Speaker 7: and WHO i move and even the people that loved, me,
• 40:43
  Speaker 7: RIGHT i was they were backing away because they're just,
• 40:45
  Speaker 7: like what's going?
• 40:46
  Speaker 2: On?
• 40:46
  Speaker 7: Right so it was that moment in time Where i'm,
• 40:49
  Speaker 7: LIKE i need to be, OPEN i need to be
• 40:50
  Speaker 7: more authentic WHO i am and what's going. On BUT
• 40:53
  Speaker 7: i think that helped me in the workplace to be
• 40:55
  Speaker 7: even more authentic and take a beat When i'm listening
• 40:58
  Speaker 7: to my, coworkers, right instead of coming with my own
• 41:00
  Speaker 7: judgment of WHAT i think needs to. Happen, Right but,
• 41:04
  Speaker 7: YEAH i, think, UH i know this is the little
• 41:07
  Speaker 7: the soap box with the. Workplace BUT i think even
• 41:09
  Speaker 7: with communicating right and speaking of like my, SEXUALITY i was.
• 41:14
  Speaker 7: Hiding so like when we think about, communication you, know
• 41:18
  Speaker 7: and you know becoming, Hiding, like where's that fine?
• 41:21
  Speaker 3: Line?
• 41:21
  Speaker 7: RIGHT i? Think and don't correct. Me what's the what's
• 41:24
  Speaker 7: the line between communication and? Hiding and when does it become?
• 41:29
  Speaker 7: Performative so?
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: QUIET i always told my, son you got you.
• 41:38
  Speaker 4: One THEN.
• 41:40
  Speaker 5: I guess you know you're scared around the.
• 41:44
  Speaker 8: Father the law's the nicest guy in.
• 41:49
  Speaker 5: The, world but he's. QUIET i, know he's. BRILLIANT i appreciate.
• 42:04
  Speaker 7: What's the line between communication and? Hiding and wind doesn't become.
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: Performative did you have a thought on, That, Linden i'm
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: thinking about.
• 42:10
  Speaker 1: That you, KNOW i just go back to WHEN i
• 42:14
  Speaker 1: we talked about being younger And i'm going from one
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: community to. ANOTHER i. WAS i was In detroit up
• 42:19
  Speaker 1: UNTIL i was in the fourth. Grade THEN i moved
• 42:22
  Speaker 1: to a predominantly white. AREA i think was three black
• 42:25
  Speaker 1: children in my elementary. School and just to what didn't
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: happen to, me it happened To who's my? Steal my
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: fifty plus year old best. Friend she was the other
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: black person in the. School and just as parents take
• 42:41
  Speaker 1: send their kids to, school and you're going to a
• 42:43
  Speaker 1: school where you think you're going to a different economic.
• 42:47
  Speaker 1: Level so she came to school in Her sunday best
• 42:51
  Speaker 1: and that's how she dressed for the first week of
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: school and Her sunday. Best and this, was you, know
• 42:55
  Speaker 1: we were. Kids we were in fifth, grade so we
• 42:58
  Speaker 1: had recess three times a, day so we were on the.
• 43:00
  Speaker 1: Playground she was in the patin of the shoe.
• 43:04
  Speaker 4: Dress and so all she.
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: Could do a stand up against the, wall you. Know
• 43:07
  Speaker 1: AND i was really a, tomboy SO i was doing
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: all kinds of. Stuff and the thing about it Was
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: what was so traumatic to me is they teased her
• 43:17
  Speaker 1: about her dress and about the way she talked To
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: her parents Were southern and she had A southern. Accent
• 43:23
  Speaker 1: and to this DAY i can see the difference of
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: how that traumatized her and made her a different.
• 43:31
  Speaker 9: Person did she change her speech.
• 43:36
  Speaker 5: And going back to preparing?
• 43:37
  Speaker 8: Children you know my mother all she, did or her
• 43:41
  Speaker 8: friends primarily when they came, over they would tell ME
• 43:45
  Speaker 8: i was so. Smart they would always say. Smart but
• 43:48
  Speaker 8: they say he's bad, Too, alice that boy is really.
• 43:50
  Speaker 8: Smart buddy.
• 43:51
  Speaker 5: Bad that was her. Comment what did that?
• 43:56
  Speaker 8: Do that gave me so much confidence in myself THAT
• 44:00
  Speaker 8: i NEVER i have never felt anyone could outperform me
• 44:06
  Speaker 8: or were smarter than.
• 44:07
  Speaker 5: ME i know they.
• 44:08
  Speaker 8: Are they probably the populations is smarter than, Me BUT
• 44:13
  Speaker 8: i don't feel that. Way i've always SMELLED i am
• 44:16
  Speaker 8: smarter than. Anybody so if you buttress your children with
• 44:21
  Speaker 8: that type of, confidence as perhaps her parents may have
• 44:27
  Speaker 8: done more of, than it's a little more difficult to
• 44:32
  Speaker 8: tear you down and to traumatize you because that self
• 44:36
  Speaker 8: confidence Says i'm better than all.
• 44:38
  Speaker 9: Y'all it really did work On. Greg your, sound.
• 44:42
  Speaker 5: That's, right that.
• 44:43
  Speaker 6: Genius he had AN adhd test when he was, younger
• 44:45
  Speaker 6: and they said as a genius, test and he was a.
• 44:47
  Speaker 9: Genius and he completely changed after.
• 44:50
  Speaker 5: That AND i would always remind, YOU i am a.
• 44:55
  Speaker 6: Genius WELL i got to act like a genius and
• 44:58
  Speaker 6: he completely.
• 44:59
  Speaker 8: Changed so, yeah but you send those kids with the
• 45:03
  Speaker 8: confidence they can they can operate in that environment at
• 45:07
  Speaker 8: a higher level without any self, doubt because that's one
• 45:12
  Speaker 8: of the things you receive when you have to code. Switch,
• 45:15
  Speaker 8: Ah i'm switching. Over are they gonna like the Way
• 45:18
  Speaker 8: i'm Sure are they gonna see through? This are they gonna, say,
• 45:20
  Speaker 8: oh he's faking trying to be white or are they
• 45:23
  Speaker 8: gonna say he's probably trying to assimilate to our culture
• 45:26
  Speaker 8: when don't really have. To we want you here so
• 45:29
  Speaker 8: that you can relate to black. Folks you can't out white.
• 45:31
  Speaker 5: Us so who you are.
• 45:37
  Speaker 3: The survival versus not to?
• 45:39
  Speaker 7: Surrender, Right like it's really, like you, know, hey this
• 45:41
  Speaker 7: is HOW i survived BECAUSE i Have LIKE i think
• 45:44
  Speaker 7: of my grandfather who used to, say, like if a
• 45:46
  Speaker 7: man made, it you can figure it out, right you, Know,
• 45:49
  Speaker 7: like AND i still remember. That now you're just doing
• 45:52
  Speaker 7: math problems BUT i was just, like, oh you know,
• 45:54
  Speaker 7: what that is something THAT i can carry me, right
• 45:57
  Speaker 7: teaching me not to. Surrender, yeah YOU i know with
• 46:00
  Speaker 7: your kids right, now how did you kind of give
• 46:03
  Speaker 7: them that type of like.
• 46:05
  Speaker 2: Encouragement, Absolutely and SO i think the biggest thing was
• 46:08
  Speaker 2: giving them a strong sense of, self right and making
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: sure that they knew who they. Were SOMETIMES i have
• 46:15
  Speaker 2: a sort of genius too WHERE i used to have
• 46:17
  Speaker 2: to tell him use your star power for, good now for,
• 46:21
  Speaker 2: good for, good for. Good but BUT i think giving
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: them a strong sense of self and that you are. Enough,
• 46:29
  Speaker 2: hey you as you are. Enough you don't have to
• 46:33
  Speaker 2: do anything. Else you don't have to be anything. Else
• 46:35
  Speaker 2: you are. Enough so that's. One so walk in the
• 46:38
  Speaker 2: room knowing you are. Enough and then, two they ain't
• 46:41
  Speaker 2: smarter than. You if they can learn, it you can learn.
• 46:43
  Speaker 2: It so the way you show up in that room
• 46:45
  Speaker 2: with the executive presence is knowing you are enough and
• 46:47
  Speaker 2: then coming.
• 46:48
  Speaker 4: Prepared did you do your, homework did you study ahead of?
• 46:51
  Speaker 4: Time did you come? Prepared because if.
• 46:52
  Speaker 2: So then you have you have the right to say
• 46:54
  Speaker 2: something in that room just like anybody.
• 46:55
  Speaker 4: Else, yes, Yes.
• 46:58
  Speaker 9: And we spoke about that in the. Week and you,
• 47:01
  Speaker 9: KNOW i want to give some.
• 47:02
  Speaker 6: Background, natasha when her sons were At howard had a,
• 47:05
  Speaker 6: program what was, it The Howard Entertainment.
• 47:08
  Speaker 4: So and it was actually separate from my.
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: SONS i started a program At amazon Called Howard entertainment
• 47:14
  Speaker 2: and it was the first major partnership between a major
• 47:17
  Speaker 2: studio and AN.
• 47:18
  Speaker 4: Hbcu and the.
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: Whole goal, was we had these brilliant, kids you Know howard,
• 47:23
  Speaker 2: produces you know The Chadwick, boseman's The taraji P, hensen's
• 47:26
  Speaker 2: the you, know all those folks who are, Amazing Anthony,
• 47:31
  Speaker 2: anderson's all the amazing. Performers but do we have enough
• 47:34
  Speaker 2: black executives sitting behind the table to make the decision
• 47:38
  Speaker 2: to make the, thing to greenlight the, thing to finance the,
• 47:42
  Speaker 2: thing to market the thing?
• 47:43
  Speaker 4: Appropriately?
• 47:44
  Speaker 2: Right and so this program was about taking students and
• 47:47
  Speaker 2: teaching them to be good studio. Executives and so we
• 47:51
  Speaker 2: brought them into this. Program we paid for their, tuition, room, board, books,
• 47:55
  Speaker 2: Fees they had a living, allowance a. Stipend we set
• 47:59
  Speaker 2: them up apartments WITH la because we also understood that
• 48:02
  Speaker 2: a lot of these kids are working and send the money.
• 48:04
  Speaker 4: Home so we had to level the playing.
• 48:07
  Speaker 2: Field my thesis, was if the playing field is, level
• 48:10
  Speaker 2: my kids are going to show up and show.
• 48:11
  Speaker 5: Out it's. Right we always.
• 48:13
  Speaker 2: Have, Yeah so if you take away the burden that
• 48:16
  Speaker 2: they might, have and all they have to do is
• 48:18
  Speaker 2: learn and come to work and do their, job watch my.
• 48:21
  Speaker 8: Kids we are us as we as a people have
• 48:25
  Speaker 8: dominated every single industry where the playing field was, equal
• 48:30
  Speaker 8: whether it's, athletics hard to discriminate on that, clod whether
• 48:34
  Speaker 8: it's where they've allowed us in the, politics, well we
• 48:38
  Speaker 8: went from not having the right.
• 48:40
  Speaker 5: To vote the fifty.
• 48:42
  Speaker 8: Years less than fifty years after getting the right to,
• 48:45
  Speaker 8: vote we took over the. Country it's been a black.
• 48:47
  Speaker 8: President so every door that we've been allowed to come,
• 48:50
  Speaker 8: in we. Excel And i'm so glad to hear about
• 48:53
  Speaker 8: training them for studio executives because that it's the most
• 48:58
  Speaker 8: important part of.
• 49:00
  Speaker 5: Entertainment it's the.
• 49:01
  Speaker 4: Most important absolutely.
• 49:03
  Speaker 8: Who is green lighting or participating in the green lighting
• 49:08
  Speaker 8: of any entertainment project that you See and.
• 49:11
  Speaker 7: SO i know you have your, program but go, ahead
• 49:14
  Speaker 7: go into. It it's called. Culture.
• 49:16
  Speaker 4: NO i was so earlier this Week amir AND i
• 49:19
  Speaker 4: were having a.
• 49:19
  Speaker 2: Conversation around you know sometimes people use coded language when
• 49:23
  Speaker 2: they don't want someone in their, Organization like we think you're,
• 49:27
  Speaker 2: great your education is, wonderful but you might not be
• 49:29
  Speaker 2: a good culture fit or you, know, right things like.
• 49:33
  Speaker 5: That they don't actually use the word culture for.
• 49:36
  Speaker 4: Sure so the THING i always tell, YOU i GUESS.
• 49:40
  Speaker 8: I wouldn't be able to do well white folks like.
• 49:49
  Speaker 5: They would not like. ME i try to get them
• 49:51
  Speaker 5: to like, me but NO i.
• 49:52
  Speaker 4: Would and that's a great. Question what does it mean?
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: Exactly what does that exactly?
• 49:58
  Speaker 2: Mean, listen it means whatever they want it to mean
• 50:02
  Speaker 2: in that particular, moment, right and, so AND i think
• 50:06
  Speaker 2: we got to be real, about you, know the environment
• 50:09
  Speaker 2: we are currently, in, right and we've seen.
• 50:14
  Speaker 4: Everything is under black.
• 50:16
  Speaker 2: People queer, People latino, People Native, american. Everybody poor people
• 50:21
  Speaker 2: are under, attacked moving backwards on the bullet trained.
• 50:26
  Speaker 4: On A t, shirt moving backwards on the bullet.
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: Train and SO i tell young people all the, time
• 50:32
  Speaker 2: whatever organization you are, in uh, know how they codify.
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: Culture it's usually codified in the mission statement and the
• 50:40
  Speaker 2: values and the leadership, principles whatever it is that they
• 50:44
  Speaker 2: have done to codify this is the culture of this.
• 50:47
  Speaker 2: Organization you learn, it you memorize, it and then you
• 50:51
  Speaker 2: weaponize it in the name of.
• 50:52
  Speaker 7: Good, YEAH i mean to your, point like weaponizing it
• 50:56
  Speaker 7: is the first TIME i heard it that, way because
• 50:57
  Speaker 7: it is for your, good that's.
• 50:59
  Speaker 3: Right if you're.
• 51:00
  Speaker 7: Trying to go in there just jumping in Like i'm
• 51:01
  Speaker 7: going to control, everything like you're setting yourself up for.
• 51:04
  Speaker 7: Failure like it's, So i'm glad you said, that because
• 51:06
  Speaker 7: it is really important for everyone young and even, me
• 51:10
  Speaker 7: like to understand, like all, right you know, what let
• 51:12
  Speaker 7: me not try to come in here and restructure this
• 51:14
  Speaker 7: based on HOW i perceive.
• 51:16
  Speaker 3: It that's.
• 51:16
  Speaker 7: Right it's really being able to understand, Like, okay this
• 51:19
  Speaker 7: is culturally where they. ARE i CAN i move them,
• 51:22
  Speaker 7: forward you, know in whatever.
• 51:23
  Speaker 2: Steps that whatever step you, Know i'm A i did
• 51:27
  Speaker 2: a session one time for spoke for THE nfl for THEIR,
• 51:31
  Speaker 2: ergs and you, KNOW i talked about this is the NFL's,
• 51:34
  Speaker 2: vision this is the NFL's, mission this is the NFL's leadership.
• 51:37
  Speaker 4: Principles so if you're working in these.
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: Walls every day and you're not seeing these things, happen
• 51:41
  Speaker 2: then that's a conversation that should be happening in the
• 51:43
  Speaker 2: meeting When i'm in an, Organization i'm gonna pick On
• 51:46
  Speaker 2: amazon for a, second even Though i'm not there. Anymore
• 51:48
  Speaker 2: we had a leadership principle that said leaders seek diverse
• 51:51
  Speaker 2: perspectives and work to disconfirm their own. Beliefs, right think about,
• 51:55
  Speaker 2: that leaders seek diverse perspectives and work to disconfirm their own.
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: Beliefs that last time you had an argument With linda
• 52:01
  Speaker 2: where you tried to convince her.
• 52:02
  Speaker 5: That she was, wrong probably the last couple of.
• 52:06
  Speaker 4: Days, no, sorry when was the last time you had
• 52:08
  Speaker 4: an argument with?
• 52:08
  Speaker 2: Her you tried to convince it that you were, wrong,
• 52:10
  Speaker 2: never never.
• 52:13
  Speaker 1: Right that's how the world.
• 52:15
  Speaker 4: Is, yeah.
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: Exactly so WHEN i would be challenging something in the
• 52:18
  Speaker 2: organization and, people you, know for whatever reason couldn't quite
• 52:23
  Speaker 2: understand it or get around, it or feel like they
• 52:25
  Speaker 2: wanted to warm up to her and, said you know,
• 52:26
  Speaker 2: will leaders seek the first perspectives and work to challenge
• 52:29
  Speaker 2: their own. Beliefs So i'm asking you to challenge your
• 52:31
  Speaker 2: own beliefs on this.
• 52:32
  Speaker 3: Topic.
• 52:32
  Speaker 7: Right it's not where you're trying to push them to
• 52:35
  Speaker 7: make them. Comfortable it is really trying to, expand like
• 52:37
  Speaker 7: where their their viewpoint.
• 52:38
  Speaker 4: Is i'm speaking your language back to. You. Correct SO
• 52:42
  Speaker 4: i tell young people all that all the.
• 52:44
  Speaker 2: Time when you in these organization, environments you got to
• 52:46
  Speaker 2: know the language where humility. Correct, yes, yes but also
• 52:51
  Speaker 2: when you're trying to you, know convey a hard thing
• 52:54
  Speaker 2: or sell a hard, idea or get people around. It,
• 52:56
  Speaker 2: like think about it in terms of if this is
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: who we say we, are how DO i present this
• 53:00
  Speaker 2: in that?
• 53:01
  Speaker 3: Way this is because they'll understand.
• 53:02
  Speaker 7: That it's, like of Course latasha would want to say
• 53:05
  Speaker 7: it this, way BECAUSE i Understand, Latasha SO i shouldn't
• 53:08
  Speaker 7: take offense to her saying it this, way, Right.
• 53:10
  Speaker 2: Or latasha is speaking the language of our, company SO i.
• 53:13
  Speaker 2: CAN i can overlook the fact That latasha's. BLACK i
• 53:16
  Speaker 2: can overlook the fact that she's a. Woman she's speaking
• 53:18
  Speaker 2: a common language because we both speak these leadership, principles
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: we both speak these, missions we both speak these principal, statements,
• 53:25
  Speaker 2: right because that's the company. Culture so that's a way
• 53:27
  Speaker 2: in which you can kind of code, switch if you,
• 53:30
  Speaker 2: will a little.
• 53:31
  Speaker 4: Bit, Right so like it ain't even about.
• 53:32
  Speaker 3: Me it's a company.
• 53:34
  Speaker 4: Company, yeah we're all on the organization, team.
• 53:37
  Speaker 7: Right, exactly, Exactly, Yeah, no that's fair that's really true
• 53:42
  Speaker 7: when when you're thinking about young, people what should they not?
• 53:45
  Speaker 7: COMPROMISE i know it's clearly, identity, Right but if you
• 53:48
  Speaker 7: were to think in, like say they're trying to learn
• 53:50
  Speaker 7: about a company and there's a value that they don't
• 53:52
  Speaker 7: really feel that comfortable, With, like where do you see
• 53:55
  Speaker 7: the limit in being like being able to compromise with.
• 53:58
  Speaker 4: A company ethicals and?
• 53:59
  Speaker 2: Morals, Right, like if you're gonna wake up tomorrow regretting
• 54:02
  Speaker 2: that you said or did, that then no. Integrity, yeah
• 54:08
  Speaker 2: that's a better way of saying, That, yeah have those boundary,
• 54:10
  Speaker 2: lines you can go to the company social but just
• 54:15
  Speaker 2: because they DO, x Y, z don't.
• 54:16
  Speaker 3: Mean that's WHAT i.
• 54:18
  Speaker 7: Mean, yeah what is something that we would tell the
• 54:20
  Speaker 7: young generation now that you've, learned, right like with what
• 54:24
  Speaker 7: you've been able to learn by winning people over or
• 54:27
  Speaker 7: understanding the different people you gotta, face or even being
• 54:30
  Speaker 7: able to lift other folks.
• 54:31
  Speaker 3: Up.
• 54:32
  Speaker 6: Something AND i would love everyone to answer this, one you,
• 54:35
  Speaker 6: know because this is SOMETHING.
• 54:36
  Speaker 1: I would just say that we mentioned this, before just
• 54:39
  Speaker 1: letting young people know that you are enough and when
• 54:42
  Speaker 1: you come to the table, prepared you have everything you
• 54:46
  Speaker 1: need and you have to be confident in, that and
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: you have to be secure in who you.
• 54:51
  Speaker 8: Are you got to get people to like. You people
• 54:53
  Speaker 8: don't want to work with people they don't. Like they're
• 54:57
  Speaker 8: not going to promote you to work side if they
• 55:01
  Speaker 8: don't like. You if they're THE ceo and they have
• 55:04
  Speaker 8: to work with THAT cfo every other, day they have
• 55:06
  Speaker 8: to like THAT.
• 55:07
  Speaker 6: Cfl you can't take it too far because you don't
• 55:09
  Speaker 6: want to try and please be a people. Pleaser it's
• 55:13
  Speaker 6: more just around around the. Lines That i've learned is
• 55:17
  Speaker 6: be a likable persons when you're by, yourself be the same, person,
• 55:22
  Speaker 6: like be a good, person, yeah because you can't fake those.
• 55:25
  Speaker 6: Things when you start faking, it that's when it becomes
• 55:28
  Speaker 6: so hard and so, rough and you have to switch
• 55:30
  Speaker 6: it on and, off pretend like you're happy but you're really.
• 55:33
  Speaker 6: Sad like do the things in your personal life that
• 55:36
  Speaker 6: brings out the good in, you and.
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: It's your professional.
• 55:41
  Speaker 9: Life it affects you, Everywhere, yeah.
• 55:43
  Speaker 2: Everywhere and what did you say to be enough and
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: that you are enough and come?
• 55:48
  Speaker 4: Prepared, oh, yes come.
• 55:50
  Speaker 6: Prepared that's just such a big one BECAUSE i, remember you,
• 55:55
  Speaker 6: know in my EARLY tv, DAYS i used to work
• 55:57
  Speaker 6: you know with him AND i was The Warner brothers
• 55:59
  Speaker 6: and a few. Project it was WHEN i was less.
• 56:03
  Speaker 6: Prepared that's WHEN i did more code, switches beaking it BECAUSE.
• 56:08
  Speaker 9: I had to like fake WHAT i didn't you.
• 56:11
  Speaker 6: Know, yeah you, know you really do learn throughout life
• 56:16
  Speaker 6: that knowledge is power and everything because you CAN i
• 56:19
  Speaker 6: have friends who worked With google who were dreadlocks and you,
• 56:22
  Speaker 6: know Uh, art there were artists and word rings and fingernail,
• 56:27
  Speaker 6: polish and that none of that mattered because they were
• 56:30
  Speaker 6: brilliant people.
• 56:31
  Speaker 9: And SOMETHING i like. That you said, that and you
• 56:33
  Speaker 9: also spoke about.
• 56:34
  Speaker 1: That and if you think about, that they're coming to
• 56:37
  Speaker 1: their professional environment in a way they feel. Comfortable you
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: don't have to think about, it but they can think
• 56:43
  Speaker 1: about what they need to do to make that company.
• 56:45
  Speaker 4: Successful that's, Right that mental energy is going in the right.
• 56:48
  Speaker 5: Place.
• 56:49
  Speaker 2: ABSOLUTELY i think the Thing i've learned the most about code,
• 56:52
  Speaker 2: switching you, know AND i think we've talked a lot about,
• 56:55
  Speaker 2: it what happens when it's a trauma.
• 56:57
  Speaker 4: Response but the best pieces or best Times.
• 57:00
  Speaker 2: I've had it is being bilingual in corporate environments and hood, environments.
• 57:07
  Speaker 4: But also even how to do business around the.
• 57:09
  Speaker 2: World SO i think early on in my career WHEN
• 57:13
  Speaker 2: i was in finance AND i was Covering, Argentina, Bolivia,
• 57:15
  Speaker 2: Chili peru And urguise or the southern cone Of Latin,
• 57:17
  Speaker 2: AMERICA i had to learn as An, AMERICAN i want
• 57:20
  Speaker 2: to jump right in and be, like, hey they're receivable
• 57:23
  Speaker 2: with sixty days past, due and we got to move on.
• 57:25
  Speaker 3: It we had to.
• 57:25
  Speaker 4: Dig BUT i had to learn When.
• 57:27
  Speaker 2: I'm Calling maria And, BOLIVIA i got to ask about
• 57:30
  Speaker 2: how how mama's. DOING i need to ask about that
• 57:32
  Speaker 2: kids soccer. GAME i need to do all of those things,
• 57:35
  Speaker 2: first and then we can do.
• 57:36
  Speaker 5: Business that's learning the.
• 57:38
  Speaker 2: Culture that's learning the culture and code switching because it's An,
• 57:41
  Speaker 2: AMERICAN i want to get right to the right, yes
• 57:44
  Speaker 2: and so code switching in those instances WHERE i have
• 57:48
  Speaker 2: built relationships and done business with people around the, world
• 57:51
  Speaker 2: that has been one of the most effective things BECAUSE
• 57:53
  Speaker 2: i can still call those people friends, today exactly right
• 57:57
  Speaker 2: and so and again that's the.
• 57:58
  Speaker 4: Difference when you're doing it to build the bridge into.
• 58:01
  Speaker 2: An environment in the community you're not, from versus doing
• 58:04
  Speaker 2: it to diminish who you are because you feel harm
• 58:07
  Speaker 2: or threatened that you have To.
• 58:09
  Speaker 3: I'm with you on. THAT i think everybody's response is.
• 58:11
  Speaker 7: Great the only THING i would say to add on is, respect, Right,
• 58:15
  Speaker 7: like make sure that you do become, likable, right but
• 58:18
  Speaker 7: also make sure that you're respecting the, company, right but
• 58:21
  Speaker 7: also make sure the company is respecting.
• 58:23
  Speaker 3: You.
• 58:24
  Speaker 7: Right that means not grabbing through your hair or you,
• 58:27
  Speaker 7: know making you, know whatever side joke just because of
• 58:30
  Speaker 7: what they assume they see on, television. Right, like it's
• 58:33
  Speaker 7: important for to be, respected and then even if you
• 58:36
  Speaker 7: don't understand, it have enough respect to walk the line
• 58:40
  Speaker 7: to be, Like, okay you, KNOW i don't know everything about,
• 58:42
  Speaker 7: this SO i ain't about to say what did you
• 58:44
  Speaker 7: say to that guy about your, like hey?
• 58:46
  Speaker 8: Gay it came across my best friend was.
• 58:55
  Speaker 3: Gay but it's having that even still you trying to
• 58:59
  Speaker 3: have a.
• 58:59
  Speaker 7: Respect it's more so walking it back to you're, like,
• 59:01
  Speaker 7: HEY i don't know everything about, this but you know
• 59:03
  Speaker 7: my brother was, gay, Right, like it's still you, know
• 59:07
  Speaker 7: kind of giving that.
• 59:07
  Speaker 3: Presence.
• 59:08
  Speaker 7: Right SO i think it's important for young people to
• 59:10
  Speaker 7: really don't lose that BECAUSE i lost it somewhat too
• 59:14
  Speaker 7: WHEN i. First because you want to, SUCCEED i got
• 59:17
  Speaker 7: to be an. EXECUTIVE i got to many as much. Money,
• 59:20
  Speaker 7: yes you get WHAT i. Mean so like make sure
• 59:24
  Speaker 7: in that trek that you're doing that you don't lose
• 59:27
  Speaker 7: the respect that you, earned, right that's.
• 59:29
  Speaker 3: Important BUT i.
• 59:32
  Speaker 7: Think that's WHAT i would leave with as far as
• 59:34
  Speaker 7: like what you know what young people should take, Now.
• 59:36
  Speaker 8: Well hope the viewers know and hurt what we are
• 59:40
  Speaker 8: saying and so that they can pass those pass these
• 59:45
  Speaker 8: words of wisdom on to some folks who might need.
• 59:48
  Speaker 8: It AND i think this is a great show on
• 59:51
  Speaker 8: which we could help folks do.
• 59:53
  Speaker 7: That, LATASHA i really appreciate you taking time to sit with.
• 59:58
  Speaker 7: Us thank y'all have me out. Here you, Know Matthew's
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 7: Family talks is not always. Me But i'm glad THAT
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 7: i would be able, to you, know at least speak
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 7: on my experiences BECAUSE i think it is, worthwhile you,
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 7: know for the.
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 3: World, latasha what.
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 7: Do you have coming up or are they other things
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 7: or programs people should be looking out.
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 2: For, yeah so you can catch me out do articles
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 2: on substack writing on the art of. LEADERSHIP i have
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 2: catch me on an upcoming episode Of Billion Dollar moves
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 2: podcast With Sarah Chin spellings and stay tuned For latasha's
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 2: figuring it. Out podcasts dropping, Soon So i'm. Excited it's
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 2: been an honor and privilege in your presence and in your.
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 4: Home thanks you so. MUCH i appreciate this so.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 3: Much appreciate.
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 1: You it's a, great great, podcast great. Conversation Mathis Family.
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 4: Talks now you have inviting me back with. Dinner, yes.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 8: Today we discussed code switching on the Mathis Family. Talks
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 8: and if you don't, know code switching is where you
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 8: have to adapt to the environment you're. In most of,
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 8: us As African, americans have to do that from day,
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 8: one particularly if we're born into a society and raised
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 8: in a society where the majority population is white Or,
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 8: european if you, will and that code switching sometimes is.
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 8: Necessary sometimes it's a survival. Mechanism but whether you want
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 8: to do it or, not in order to survive in
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 8: this society and perhaps progress and prosper you have to
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 8: adapt to the situations that you in many of us
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 8: think it's. INAUTHENTIC i don't want to be. FAKE i
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 8: don't want to play their. Game, well if that's what
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 8: you refer to it as playing their, game then win that.
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 8: Game play until you, win and then when you go
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 8: back to your, community to your, household to the, hood
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 8: wherever environment you live, in then you'll be. Yourself but,
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 8: UNFORTUNATELY i think not Only African, americans but to a lesser,
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 8: extent everyone has to adapt to the environment that they're.
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 8: In when white folks are at home talking, race they
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 8: talking very differently than they do when they're around, us
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 8: and vice. Versa so learn to understand that we have
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 8: to fit in with every culture that we come in front.
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 5: Of and that's my. Verdict