Latest / Under Pressure: Compressor Talk / Navigating the Oil and Gas Landscape with Marcus Jones

Transcript

Navigating the Oil and Gas Landscape with Marcus Jones · Under Pressure: Compressor Talk

• 0:02
  SPEAKER_00: This is Under Pressure, Compressor Talk by Midwest Compressor.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_00: Strategies, systems, and stories from the compressor world.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_00: With your host, David Abshire.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_00: And now, on to the show.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_01: Good morning.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_01: This is David Abshire with Under Pressure, the podcast.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_01: This morning we've got Marcus Jones on here.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you this morning, Marcus, for joining us.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, thank you for having me.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_01: Appreciate it.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_01: Well, we're excited for you to be on here this morning on this beautiful cold Thursday in January for sure.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so uh definitely, definitely excited to have you on this morning.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_01: And we'll just get started.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: Marcus, can you walk us through your background and how you got started in the oil and gas business?
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, sure.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_02: I I grew up in a small town in eastern Oklahoma with no oil and gas, but got recruited from the University of Tulsa.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_02: And one of the professors asked me, hey, uh, do you like money and big toys?
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_02: And I said, Well, yeah.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_02: And uh that's kind of how they got me.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_02: So I I was lucky enough to to get an internship after my freshman year and got to go to the field uh and just absolutely fell in love with everything about it.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_02: Never would have predicted I'd be here, but I'd love the challenges and it's just been a great fit for the past, you know, 20 plus years.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's that's awesome.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_01: I love to hear that.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_01: Now, what what city did you grow up in in uh eastern Oklahoma?
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_02: I was in Talquah.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_01: Talqua, okay, yeah.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_01: Home of the Cherokee Nation, yeah.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, I know where that is for sure.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_01: I actually grew up in Chickashay.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, Oklahoma.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_01: So I was there at to I was about probably about 18 and then moved out to this way and then went back for a little bit, then kind of went back and back in Texas now, but definitely familiar with Talaqual.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_01: That's a great, great area.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_01: It's pretty over there for sure, too.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_02: It sure is.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_02: I I didn't realize that there weren't trees and hills everywhere, and now I'm in Oklahoma City and know a lot about wind.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you're you're exactly right.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_01: You're exactly right.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_01: So you've had uh both corporate career and an entrepreneurial path.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_01: So what pushed you to go out on your own?
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's a a good question.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_02: I I kind of broke out with uh Questar, and it's um pretty well-run company.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_02: Um they let you dabble in reservoir and production and infrastructure, and uh in a lot of ways, the the way they brought people up was like kind of like what a major would do.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_02: You know, coming out of school, you don't know enough to do anything.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm really grateful to have, you know, those first seven years and all the field experience.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_02: They were very good about making you leave the office and actually get your hands dirty.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_02: And um I got my MBA during that time, and when I got done, I was like, I kind of I want to see how other people do it.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_02: And I I did a 180 and came to work for Aubrey McClendon at his startup, American Energy Partners.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_02: And that was absolutely wild.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, I think I inherited three frat crews on day one as as just me.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_02: And uh it's funny, it's I only worked there for you know two and a half years before they sold out, but and I did over 200 wells, and I was like, I I must have got 10 years experience in two years' time.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_02: Just complete opposite.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_02: But I really enjoyed the challenges we had and the opportunity to try new things without too much scrutiny.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_02: Really, if you had a good idea, you got to implement it within weeks, which is a lot of fun as an engineer, right?
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_02: Solving puzzles.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and then and then when that was over, had some friends that had kind of separated out into different groups, and they said, Hey, why don't you come run this completion program for a private equity?
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_02: And uh I said, Well, sure, I'm not doing anything right now.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_02: And so I started up an LLC and kind of got in the consulting world and just met so many great people and fell in love with different aspects of the business.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_02: I got introduced to my business partner through that, who is a geostud, and I've met land folks and just spent a great time pivoting from just you know a side load engineer into hey, how do you how do you make money?
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_02: What does the world need?
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_02: What's what's missing?
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_02: What what are people overlooking?
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_02: And uh, you know, again, that's just another puzzle, but it's a lot of fun mixing the business and engineering together.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_02: That's that's where a lot of the good stuff's at.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_01: I completely agree.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_01: And some of the some of the comments you made about Aubrey right there, I've heard anybody that ever worked for him, and I've got tons of friends that's worked for him.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_01: It's nothing but good and positive experiences, educational experiences, uh, trusts, uh, you know, just created such a good culture.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm I'm happy to hear that uh because that just reiterates what I've already been told over my career by people who are able to work with him.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_01: So that's that's a cool story for sure.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_01: Some of the main projects right now you're focused on.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_02: So I'd say the the biggest one right now is, you know, I continue to to wear five or six different hats during the day, which is what I like.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_02: I like the independence.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_02: You know, the the biggest one right now is uh my group Whitestone Resources put together a large prospect and we're in the process of developing the first well and uh trying to figure out what that looks like, but again, it's it's probably 25th plus um that we have held, and it's you know, probably covers 75 square miles of of rock that we like.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_02: And so um yeah, I kind of say it casually, but thinking back, like we started raising money to do this three years ago, and we spent a year actually picking up the leases, which was a miracle.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_02: It probably should have taken longer.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_02: We got kind of lucky.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and now to actually have a well on the ground, I mean it's it sounds like an overnight success, but it wasn't because we were we've been digging in there for five years now with minerals and other things.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_02: So it's um it it kind of feels like maybe the the ending of one giant project and but you know, maybe the start of something that's next.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_01: It's a really pivotal moment right now.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that's cool and that's exciting for you guys.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_01: Congratulations.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_01: That's a that's a big deal.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_01: And like you said, lots of times, you know, like people hear you talk or hear your group talk and they think it's overnight, and it's like, I've been working on this for no three years, yeah.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_01: Anytime you you get going on these big projects and people are like, oh, that's great.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like, yeah, but like this is what I've been doing.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, exactly.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_02: So they don't they don't talk about, you know, if you're raising money that you know you went on a roadshow that lasted six months and had all the rejections and the babies and you know the the anchor that was gonna kind of lay out the terms for everyone and then they disappear, and it's just like uh, you know, you keep it brief and speak to the good parts, but that's not how it works at all.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_02: You don't you don't want to see how the sausage is made.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly right.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_01: Well, uh, you work a lot in uh oil-filled chemistry and EOR.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_01: How does the chemistry actually improve wells in practice?
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_02: That's a good question.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_02: Back to my time working with Aubrey, you know, we were agnostic about what made a better well.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_02: We just kind of went through, hey, what are the 10 things that might help?
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_02: What what happens if we change the perf spacing or the the sand type, just the common sense knobs?
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_02: And we got focused on chemistry for a time and had some outrageous results with respect to surfactants.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_02: And so that's kind of been a passion for me because um it's not necessarily always just accelerating the oil flow or or you know affecting the stimulated reservoir volume, but it's actually recovery efficiency, which means you're getting more out of what you already have access to.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_02: And that's a big deal because uh we're leaving so much oil behind in these shelves.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, we're covering maybe 10%.
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_02: So if we can get it to 12% with chemistry, that's a massive, massive number.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_02: So I've been really passionate about, you know, areas that fit the profile of a good candidate for surfactant, which would be wells that are close to bubble point pressure, wells with low API gravity oil that's kind of stuck.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_02: There's all kinds of facets that I like to explore.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_02: And then on the flip side of this, there's the RD and the technologies of making these chemicals, and you can actually affect a lot in terms of those profiles.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_02: And so just marrying the two together and getting a field trial and seeing the results, it's comes with a lot of, I guess, joy just because I think all the good rocks have been found in North America.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_02: We kind of know where it's at at this point.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_02: It's already held by someone.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_02: So when we get to this tier two and tier three acreage and we start running out of inventory, guess what?
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_02: The next 20 years is gonna be refracts and getting those left leftover reserves.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_02: And so uh trying to be ahead of it, honestly.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_02: I I think I think this is gonna be a hot topic topic five years from now.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_01: And I I think everything you just commented on, I've heard over and over from people on that side with the chemical and the technology, of course, anymore.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_01: And just being able to know what works where and apply that.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, like you said, five years from now, go back in and do a completely different strategy.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_01: But of course, too, with technology, you know, chemistry just keeps advancing and people learn what works.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_01: And it's it's exciting to be able to see that.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_01: And too, it obviously keeps the decline curve down, helps as well, especially from you know, the production side and just being able to flatline that and keep it operating normally.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's one thing that you know lots of people don't understand is that decline curve that we're always chasing or trying to stay ahead of because we know it's there.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_01: It's just we have to constantly go after it.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_02: So well, it that decline curve from a traditional reservoir engineering perspective, it's a function of you know how big your drainage radius is, but it's also at the same time it's a function of the conductivity that you created, which fails over time.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_02: You get, you know, lost sand to the formation, you get clays that you know soften and you get all these different things that mess up your conductivity.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_02: And so these decline curves aren't purely just you know pressure from the size of the reservoir, it's actually you're losing these connections that you created.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, and so being able to understand where, hey, this was just our drainage area, or this is we actually have a problem with flow, finding those candidates.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_02: And then, like you said, I mean, the facilities are already there, it's already done.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_02: And so the intervention is really simple.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_02: And uh, I mean, we got clients that have spent a lot of money on chemistry and they are being paid back in you know, 30 days, 60 days.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's not hard to get approval on projects like that.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_02: So, like you're gonna see more and more of this.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: It's gonna be a hot topic.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_01: So, what's what's something people outside the industry completely misunderstand about what you do?
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_02: I would say the risk tolerance.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_02: I know when you're investing in a public company, you know, they're they're doing infill wells and they can kind of predict within 20% how good it's gonna be.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_02: But in reality, there are there are giant wins and giant losses out there.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_02: And so this reliability that people assume is there, it's it's really not.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_02: We work really hard to have that reliability, but the the risk profile and the changing of permit status and the price of oil and natural gas and tariffs and all this, there is so many risks involved.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_02: If you don't get a 20 or 30 percent ray return on average, you're not gonna make it because the downtime's will eat you alive.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_02: It's like for every every day you want to complain about a good time, just remember that oil was selling for negative$40 one day.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_01: You you hit the nail on the head.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_01: And I think too, with all the volatility in the market that we have to deal with on this side of the business, that nobody on the other side, you know, that owns a traditional style of business understands, like we've got a lot of moving pieces that affect our day-to-day.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_01: You know, what's oil at today?
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_01: What's natural gas at?
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_01: What's utility cost, you know, what's your chemical cost, you know, and then tariffs and you know, yeah, political agendas that affect us on the daily, where, you know, all of a sudden, you know, we're we're seeing, you know, political things going on and you know, oil and gas prices are dropping like crazy or skyrocketing like crazy.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_01: So uh I I appreciate you mentioning that.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_01: So you said, you know, modern engineers need more technical skills.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_01: What else really matters to succeed, in your opinion?
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_02: I think the way we communicate with each other, I don't mean to dog on engineers in general, but you kind of make assumptions, you live in your little world, you're in your spreadsheets, and uh kind of oblivious to maybe what your neighbor's doing or or you know, there's just people in your influence that if you talk to and ask questions, there'd be a lot less assumptions.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_02: And so it's been interesting to see after COVID, there's not nearly as much communication as there was before.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and then obviously if you have a neighbor nearby, uh they may not want to tell you all the cool stuff they're doing.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_02: And so it's just it's a personality trait that often occurs in engineers where they really just need to get out of their office and meet some new people and have better conversations.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_02: And so communication with purpose is one of the number one things I would tell, especially anyone graduating now, because the idea that you're gonna work at one company, maybe Chevron or Exxon, you'll get lucky, but for the most part, you're gonna be doing all kinds of different stuff and you need to have a strong network because there will be a time where you're gonna need a job and you're behind the eight-ball.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, absolutely.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, Marcus, I I'm glad you bring that up.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_01: That's one of the cool things as I've started this podcast.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_01: I've talked to several engineers, and one of the things they bring up is networking and communication.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_01: So that's an ongoing, consistent, you know, topic that gets brought up.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_01: And I appreciate you bringing that up today because it's so important and powerful in our industry.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, just being able to build those relationships with folks.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_01: And even yesterday I was on a podcast and we talked about just having a network of people that, you know, you have a frack guy, you have a compressor guy, you know, you have a water hauling guy, you know, you've got all these people that you need to have in your back pocket.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_01: When you need them, you can call them, right?
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_01: And they're gonna make you successful.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_01: So when you have your chemical guy that's really good at what he does and be able to pick up the phone and say, hey, I need this, you know, like tomorrow, right?
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so it's just another good example of, you know, getting out of your comfort zone and getting to know people and getting to see who's good at what they do because you definitely want the, you know, the A team to help, you know, operate and produce and make money because you have to have them.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_01: Um yeah, you know, that's that's cool.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_01: So you're you're passionate about getting more people into engineering.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_01: Where does that come from?
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I think it just comes from, you know, how I would grew up.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_02: It's uh, you know, my mom was a school teacher, my dad was uh worked for the health department, they were from Indiana of all places, and they've always had a strong kind of commitment to, you know, basically academics in general.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_02: But I really there's so many people out there who just are not aware of what they can be.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_02: My wife ran a nonprofit for five years that she founded, and these kids are like, I want to go to the NBA, I want to do this.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, you know, you can make six figures on day one.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_02: We can tell you what schools to go to.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_02: You can go to this school for two years and that one for two years, and you can have an incredible career that changes generations within your family.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_02: Just looking at some of the stats.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_02: If you don't have an uncle or a you know, relative that's in STEM, the chance of you going to STEM is close to zero.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_02: It's wild statistics there.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_02: So uh the other side is that we bring, you know, companies come here.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_02: You know, Tesla came to Tulsa to try to maybe do a deal back in the day, and the schools are up to stuff and they didn't have enough, you know, active workers.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_02: Um, it's one of the best things our state could do right now is really just take all of our resources, these kids, and just kind of point them in the right direction, show them what's out there.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, they're they'll have to take the next steps themselves, but um, it's probably the number one thing we could do to create wealth and change generations is to get people in these types of jobs.
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_01: I I completely agree and I definitely appreciate your perspective because so many times, you know, people people forget about the opportunity that's in these different industries and they kind of get stuck in the and kind of stay on the cycle.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_01: And just being able to get out of that comfort zone and being able to set yourself up for success, especially the youth today.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, you know, all of my kids, I've encouraged them, you know, to go to college or a trade school, right?
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, pick something that's you can come out and have a successful career.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_01: And not just a degree that, you know, you can't use in the in the modern day world.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_01: And I see it so much where uh lots of our youth, they come out with this, you know, a master's degree and they don't know where they want to work or where they can apply it in the day-to-day.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_01: So I I think you're exactly right, and especially the STEM programs and stuff are just amazing.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_01: Everybody that I know that's been involved with these programs, of course, have been successful.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_01: And some way or another, it's affected them in a positive impact.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_01: So I I'm uh with you 100%.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_01: So from your consulting perspective, what big challenges are operators and service companies facing right now, in your opinion?
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_02: Uh it's a few things.
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_02: I'd say one, um, we keep drilling and it hurts the price.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_02: And so the margins are small.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_02: And so now that the margins are small, we've got to get more efficient.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_02: So that's why we're seeing all these mergers, right?
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's gonna be shoot, maybe 10 or 20 companies at some point if we keep it up.
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_02: It's so it it's it's a different world.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_02: I'm trying to think, you know, what are we gonna do with all these layoffs and all the people that aren't gonna be able to find work because these massive mergers and you know what what are the big issues?
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_02: Well, one, we're running out of inventory.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_02: Um, all these big boys are gonna drill it all up, they're all in tier two already, heading towards tier three.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_02: You've seen a lot of movement towards international type work.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_02: Everyone's kind of looking over their shoulder, figuring out where they want to go.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know how we're gonna have sustainable careers for all these talented folks with all this chaos and transition.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_02: I don't see how it lasts because uh some of the finest people I've worked with in my career, um, they jumped ship and went to Amazon.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_02: They're running Amazon facilities and they're happy and they're making good money, but I was like, how do I how do I tell my kid to jump into this industry?
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_02: It it's hard.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_02: It's hard.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I think I think too, you know, with the with the mergers and everything, it's it's definitely changed a big dynamic.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_01: And like you mentioned on the margin side too, these folks obviously are making a lot less money, so it makes more sense to combine and cut costs and do everything they can.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_01: And I think too, there's a a big misconception lots of times with the oil and gas business.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_01: They just think, you know, we go out like I think of the Beverly Hillbillies.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_01: I use this example a lot where Jed shoots the, you know, shoots at the awesome and misses and oil comes out of the ground, and everybody thinks that's how we make a living, right?
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_01: And they were like, we whist, you know, but of course, too, all the industry volatility with the mergers and the overseas stuff.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_01: And you're exactly right.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_01: I've seen lots of good people, you know, transition out of oil and gas and move into Amazon type jobs or, you know, just different uh plant type work and kind of get out at the day-to-day production stuff.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: And it's a transition.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_01: And hopefully, uh, you know, is like you mentioned with technology and being able to get more efficient on how we, you know, operate and and drill and and keep wells living longer.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_01: I think we're gonna see a shift on, you know, the amount of people it needs, especially with technology, right?
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_01: Like we all know that, you know, with technology, it's really leading the way where you can monitor so much stuff remotely with technology anymore.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_01: So you don't need, you know, 50 pumpers, maybe you need 20, right?
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_01: So same way with course two with you know lots of different SCADA systems that you see on the big oil and gas companies where you walk in a control room and you're like, man, you just you know, it's like walking into NASA, right?
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's pretty high-tech and you get to see everything producing.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_01: They're monitoring temperatures and flows and pressures and anything you can think of.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_01: Uh even monitoring, you know, just uh the the time of day for utility costs to know when to turn stuff on and off to be able to, you know, reduce their utility costs.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's really impressive.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_01: So as far as bottlenecks, what have you seen shift like since COVID and the supply chain crisis?
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_01: What's your opinion on that side?
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean, we've we've seen a lot of chaos on the on the chemical side.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_02: A lot of our our raw materials come from uh China of all places.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_02: I'm lucky up the the company I work with, Elps Chemistry, and they make almost everything in-house comes a lot of it derived from corn or soy, so from kind of farmers in generals.
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_02: They don't get impacted as much, but um obviously the tariffs are a big deal.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_02: There's uh some bottlenecks in terms of infrastructure.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_02: I know everyone's very bullish on gas, and they were, you know, it's a start because the LNG, right?
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_02: We're gonna ship this over to South Korea or Poland or wherever it needs to go.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_02: We were just laughing a minute ago, my business partner and I, um, all that Marcellus gas, it doesn't make it up to New England.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_02: There's no pipeline.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_02: It literally comes down, gets built into an LNG terminal, ships back up north, gets unloaded, and that's how they stay warm up there.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_02: That's the most obvious bottleneck on earth.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_02: And then now we have the data centers, and you know, everyone's really bullish on on this natural gas of the future.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_02: But again, we don't really have the generators, we haven't built out everything the way it needs to be built out.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_02: It's like everyone says it's coming, but I I don't know.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_02: Uh there's gonna be a lot of investment just to get there.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_02: And of course, nuclear's coming too.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, exactly.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I was on a plane about gosh, it was probably about 10 years ago, head of Gillette, Wyoming.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_01: And of course, you know, Bill Gates have invested so much in nuclear in, you know, the Powder River basin, and the amount of technology and money's been poured into it.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_01: You're right, nuclear is definitely on the way.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_01: That's another big sustainable energy source.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_01: And you know what's interesting?
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, you know, you start seeing all the majors, they start to shift and diversify their portfolio to where, you know, obviously they're open minded to looking at other, you know, energy sources that's sustainable for the long run, which is smart on their part for sure.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and of course, too, the natural gas.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_01: I heard the same thing.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_01: I was at a conference, I think it was around six months ago, and they had A speaker come in that kind of talks to Wall Street, you know, and kind of gives them the bread and butter of what natural gas is supposed to do and on the LNG side.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_01: And one of the things he brought up, of course, was the shift in the market price of natural gas.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_01: And I had an investor guy tell me 20 years ago, you know, put all your money in natural gas because of LNG and you know it's it's gonna take off.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_01: And uh, you know, the infrastructure just, you know, from the political regime where they block it, don't let them build new LNG plants and all these things they do to slow down progress on the market.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_01: I think eventually, you know, I'm like, you would who knows when it's gonna, you know, skyrocket, even with the data centers.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_01: We have several uh that's getting built around us here.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_01: And I was up uh actually outside of Colorado the other day in Cheyenne, Wyoming, Meta's building their new data center there, and it's huge.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_01: And just to know the amount of natural gas they're gonna need to run this thing, uh, which would be great.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_01: But of course, too, I think to myself, hopefully uh over time we'll start to see it shift to where, you know, folks like us that are in the business, obviously it starts to pay off in the long run.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_01: And the tariffs, of course, too, uh just on the manufacturing side that we deal with, like steel jumped up 20%.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you know, you try to explain that to your customers.
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_01: I had a 20% price increase on steel to build, you know, the same stuff we was building five years ago.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_01: And they're like, and just trying to get everybody to understand the tariffs and uh, you know, all the moving targets that we have.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_01: I I completely hear you on every bit of that part.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_01: If you uh, you know, if you could fix one major technical mistake across across the industry overnight, what would it be on your side?
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I would probably say the the sins we have created on the completion side, you know, you get one chance at it.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_02: You know, when prices are low, you know, you cut cost.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_02: Let's uh, you know, you've got significant amounts of iron in your water, and the iron is not necessarily a good thing for your reservoir, but you just choose to not treat it, and so you just recycle it.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_02: Those types of things have left a lot of oil behind.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_02: And and I get the teams, you know, cut cut costs, prices are low, but the flip side of that, there's a point where oil gets to$80,$90,$100, and you don't want to leave any droplets behind.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_02: And so now, like, oh, let's do this fancy thing, let's spend some extra money here, let's do this, let's get, let's improve our recovery uh recovery efficiency.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_02: And so basically all the shortcuts we've taken during these low price environments, I think are going to come back to haunt us to the point where, you know, in the Hainesville, you know, you'll have parent wells that were holding leases and they don't even try to repair them anymore.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_02: We they drill a brand new well and they try to hit it.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_02: They literally build a new well right on top of it, and it's economic and it actually makes sense for them.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_02: And so essentially what we what we're doing to these reservoirs with chemistry and and the lack of recovery recovery efficiency is probably the biggest sin we have right now.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_01: So what does your what does your team structure look like today, Marcus?
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_02: So, like I said, I've I've got five or six different hats I like to wear.
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_02: For the most part, we just try to stay nimble.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_02: When I need land work done, we have a a brokerage that we hire out the services to.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_02: Um, when we're evaluating a prospect, we've got a a reservoir guy that we call and we kind of pay him the hourly rates.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_02: In terms of the business partners, you know, we try to keep it to three to five people in general.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_02: You know, one venture may have these four guys, and this one has these two guys, but at the same time, we're all sharing the same printers.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_02: The G and A gets shared, so we're efficient.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_02: But I really like the small and nimble.
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_02: You know, we hire out, you know, the the lawyers and the accounting and all that.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_02: We don't keep those in-house um because we just never know what we're gonna need.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_02: We just have people we like, we don't argue with the price they want because they're the best.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and uh, we just do what we do best, which is you know, create ideas.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_02: We got a couple of guys that are just awesome at thinking about the next thing.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_02: And I swear to you, they're always two or three years ahead of me who does kind of the more executive role where I've got to get this to the finish line and the exit.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm down in the weeds with lawyers and dot and I's and cross and t's, they're already over in a different state poking around, thinking about, you know, you know, the next capital raise, right?
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_02: And so I would say if you're gonna go out and do this independence thing and wear multiple hats, it's a it's a really good idea to have business partners.
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_02: You don't want to do this on your own.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_02: I I don't care what your cap table looks like, that extra 10 or 20% probably worth it if you got the right partner.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, exactly.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_01: I definitely appreciate, you know, you making the comment about the best people uh and being able to pick them best people and just pay them what they deserve.
• 26:39
  SPEAKER_01: And I think too, that's one of the things in our industry, you know, there's there's so many people that start a company and build it and which is great, and then they bring on a lot of people that are okay, and you know, the company kind of operates okay.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_01: But, you know, when oil prices drop, right, we know what happens, right?
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_01: You see the the huge layoffs and all those things that we go through and and it's just an up and down spiral.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_01: But I I definitely appreciate that because I always I'm a firm believer too of staying nimble and letting the experts do what the experts do and you know focus on what's important uh, you know, as staying profitable in our industry, which is hard to do sometimes.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_01: So for students listening this morning, what kind of mindset should they adopt if if they want to thrive long term in our industry?
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_02: That's a great question.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_02: Again, uh I was told this when I graduated, and I've already said it once the communication and actually networking is a big deal.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_02: And I don't think they they know how to do that well because there will be career days and conferences and stuff, and you know, you gotta shake people's hand, get business cards, send a follow-up email.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_02: It's like I'll never see this person again, probably, but you never know.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_02: It's a very small industry.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_02: If you make a bad name for yourself, it will turn up.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_02: It's we are one degree of separation from any interview you want to have, I promise you.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_01: You're you're exactly right.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_02: So thinking about people on your network, obviously you need to be talented in the engineering, but a lot of these good schools, if you got a degree and your GPA starts with a three, you've you've got the IQ.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_02: You've you've got it.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_02: You'll be fine.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you probably don't know anything on day one, but you know, get yourself a job for three or four years, you'll pick it up.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_02: The other thing is, as you're aware, like you're gonna get moved around.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_02: For some reason, oil and gas is never anywhere you want to be.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_02: It's always in North Dakota or somewhere like that.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_02: Getting your fingernails dirty, you're gonna sleep in a motel that smells like smoke, you're not you're gonna miss all your friends doing cool stuff.
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_02: But once you're kind of bona fide and know what you're doing and have some skill sets, it's just an amazing industry.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_02: There was a time where we actually knew how to fund and we would go play golf and have lunch.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_02: You know, the money can be good, the bonuses can be good, the equity can actually be worth something if you you know, your company can get bought and you can get a big check.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_02: So it's just like prepare for chaos, build your network, because when the chaos comes, you'll need it.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_02: And other than that, just know that your reputation will be known.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_02: You're not gonna hide, you know.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_02: You work at a restaurant, you can hide you got a bad you know, extent.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_02: You won't be able to hide it in our industry.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_02: Everyone knows.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you hit the nail on the head.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_01: I I think one of the things that, you know, the networking, the communication, and to just the volatility of our market that makes it exciting for me and folks like yourself as well.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, we really get to enjoy the good part of it too.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_01: And I think to the opportunity that's in front of anybody in the oil and gas business.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_01: I always like to tell everybody if you come in with the open mind and be willing to, you know, get your hands dirty, like you said, and stay in the crappy hotels like we all had, unfortunately, that smell like cigarette smoke or have uh little friends that visit you at night.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_01: Little hidden stuff like that.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_01: And it's funny too, you mentioned about oil and gas never being in anywhere nice.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I had a gentleman that uh when I first got in the business, he said, just so you know, I've never been anywhere where it's nice.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_01: Like I always go like North Dakota or you know, like a crappy part of uh New Mexico or, you know, in the desert or wherever.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's never nice.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, I was like, I wonder why that is.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_01: And they go, Well, if it's nice, I don't want you drilling for oil and gas.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, oh, okay.
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_01: So that kind of gave some perspective.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_01: Well, Marcus, thank you so much for joining this morning.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_01: I definitely appreciate it.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, I definitely love meeting new folks in the industry, and of course, too, being able to tell your story and of course to the you guys' success that's you know ahead of you guys, which I'm excited for you guys, of course, to be able to see to get out and have some huge acreage.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_01: Definitely know it didn't happen overnight.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_01: So the last couple years are starting to pay off for you guys, which is exciting.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_01: One of the things I like to do, of course, everybody that comes on the podcast, just when you get a chance, uh, no rush, just send me an email with your address.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, we like to send out some Midwest Compressor swag.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_01: So uh we have boxes made up that we send out.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_01: It's got hats and pins and all that cool stuff.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_01: And it's just a little thank you for saying, hey, coming on the show today.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_01: And uh we'll definitely email you too and let you know when it gets ready to get posted and go live.
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_01: Uh we, my marketing team, they'll post it on LinkedIn and different uh platforms and stuff, so you'll be able to listen to it and share it with your friends.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_01: So definitely, definitely appreciate you today.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, look forward to talking to you soon.
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_01: And you have a great rest of your week, buddy.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, Marcus.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_02: Appreciate you having me.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_02: I what I forgot to ask.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_01: What part of Texas are you in?
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm in Amarillo.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_01: My corporate office is.
• 31:41
  SPEAKER_01: We've got, of course, our manufacturing in Pampa, Texas.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_01: We've got about 20,000 square foot there.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_01: And then we actually have an office in Oklahoma City.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_01: It's technically in a Yukon address, but it's in Oklahoma City, just right there off of Morgan Road.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_01: So we've got Oklahoma's actually become one of our biggest areas uh for our rental equipment.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_01: So we've got tons of equipment on the ground over there, all in the all over scattered out all over that's great.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_01: So awesome.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_01: But definitely appreciate you, and you have a great rest of your week, buddy.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you again, Marcus.
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks, David.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_01: Appreciate you.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_01: All right, bye-bye.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_00: This has been another great episode of Under Pressure.