Latest / Dear Son, / Father Wounds: I Just Wanted to Make Him Proud | Ep 214 | The Dear Son, Show

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Father Wounds: I Just Wanted to Make Him Proud | Ep 214 | The Dear Son, Show · Dear Son,

• 0:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: So sometimes I see people that are positioned to become fathers later in life and have reached a level of maturity that some of us drag our family through that process with them.
• 0:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: Are you even conscious of that?
• 0:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not trying to make light of it, but I like it.
• 0:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm very proud of hearing for that.
• 0:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: I couldn't imagine
• 0:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: 28-year-old, 27-year-old Billy versus 45-year-old Billy, trying to be a father.
• 0:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I feel now so confident in myself and my ability around communication, open communication, accepting fault, saying I'm sorry to my kids and stuff like that versus.
• 0:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well even just say 30-year-old Billy who was cocky, felt like he knew everything, had the biggest integrity issues when it came to like, you know, responsibility and accountability for the things he was doing.
• 0:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: When you have that level of awareness and you have that clarity about yourself now, like, me now is so clear.
• 0:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, is there going to be a level of who my dad was of like,
• 0:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: a very an iron standard of who we are and how we move through life and what we do and how how you will be raised and how you will act and not act in level of manners and stuff like that time still old school like somebody's kids nowadays I hear I'm like this who you don't say yes ma'am no certain like you know what it's it confuses me
• 1:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: Alright guys, let's get it welcome to the Dead Sun Show.
• 1:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: We have meaningful conversations about light through the lens of Fatherhood.
• 1:24
  [SPEAKER_02]: It is four fathers, those with fathers, and the fatherless, so nobody is left out.
• 1:29
  [SPEAKER_02]: These are the conversations I want my sons that access as they grow through life in the manhood, so no toppings are off limits.
• 1:36
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm your only host today, Dean Johns, but we get that say the amazing Billy Grubbs in the building, how are you doing my brother?
• 1:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: Man, I'm doing good, glass feeling good.
• 1:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like we talked about earlier.
• 1:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: get through this Texas heat, but I didn't have those in the boys good, man.
• 1:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's crazy.
• 1:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like I'm real quick.
• 1:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's funny.
• 1:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's talking about the intro and stuff like that about like the finalists, those that have, like have a father stuff like that in my father who passed away in 2021.
• 1:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: His birthday was like three days ago.
• 2:01
  [SPEAKER_02]: So I don't, this is not happening.
• 2:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's the last guess that I had this conversation is doing.
• 2:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: The conversation being received works.
• 2:09
  [SPEAKER_02]: I think all the conversations are intentional and purposeful.
• 2:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: his father's birthday was the day it was scheduled to release and it would like the timing of us recording didn't work out before it only worked out until then and didn't release on his father's birthday and he was able to get some things off.
• 2:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: in a way that he hadn't before.
• 2:30
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 2:30
  [SPEAKER_02]: So I don't take this.
• 2:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't take this like his father passed.
• 2:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: So I don't that's why I don't take it like even here in that.
• 2:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's just like to your point like nothing, nothing's by happens to us.
• 2:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Nothing is like if we hosted me two weeks ago, this is okay, I'm up and then like my worst guys are crazy.
• 2:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, all right, let's reschedule you jumped on the real quick.
• 2:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's at it is available.
• 2:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 2:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: And just so happens literally hit birthday was like on the 15.
• 2:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: 14th of the other guy.
• 2:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Wow, mine was on the eighth.
• 2:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: Wow.
• 2:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: So none of this like this this month every day is special.
• 2:59
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, through this lens and this phase of life period, but when you have those anniversaries, yeah, of course you start to factor in the the what is in the what work and
• 3:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like that what was up was Billy from that was home.
• 3:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, man.
• 3:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm a army brat So like everywhere so if those ask me where I'm from I always say watch the stakes I'm gonna swear with the high school that okay, and so I'm not one of them's cases like Oh, man for my come to California, but I lived it for a year when I was a kid
• 3:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, no, that always told me what people would say they're like, we're from, I'm from Florida, that's like, how long you live there?
• 3:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: All like a year or not, like three?
• 3:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: No, very not from there.
• 3:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, where'd you go to high school?
• 3:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: All I went to high school in Washington State, that's from from.
• 3:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
• 3:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's where I grew up, and that's where... See, I found myself.
• 3:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: I love you watching something like 45 minutes out the Seattle.
• 3:43
  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, okay.
• 3:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, what brand was that on me?
• 3:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, my dad was on me.
• 3:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: So like there's a joint air force on rebates like literally 20 minutes north.
• 3:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
• 3:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's where he retired my step on retirement there too.
• 3:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then he was like, I like it here.
• 3:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I know a little bit about military bases because of my, my form of work, but we've never did anything in Northwest.
• 4:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 4:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: So that whole area.
• 4:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't, I'm not familiar.
• 4:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: anything west like Montana.
• 4:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm coming down to clues when it comes.
• 4:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: What was what was life like as a military break man.
• 4:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: It was different because like you're I say like for myself, I had no problem meeting people.
• 4:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was one of the people like since we moved around a lot.
• 4:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: I had to keep recreating friendships.
• 4:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: I had to keep meeting new people in different areas and different like cultures and it's a for the most part.
• 4:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: I lived in Germany.
• 4:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: I lived in Korea.
• 4:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I mean, so like you're learning different parts about yourself and who you want to be and so growing up And it goes your about the one thing that was suck is though like I would be jealous of friends in certain places that were like I've known this person since third grade and this is but I'm 45 years old, so this is before social media Yeah, and so when you say buy to somebody You'd be saying buy it when you ain't gonna see me unless you happen across paths at some point.
• 4:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: But hey Did you?
• 4:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: Did y'all are you?
• 5:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Did y'all have fun that like you know to mean that's that's that's the era.
• 5:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: I come from
• 5:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I just turned 47, so I said that I grew up in one location my whole life and the flip side of that is the apprehension about moving away because I saw you know, my wife.
• 5:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: was in the military, before we got married, and she did her last couple years of her second, what's it called?
• 5:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: Enlistment, she ends up doing eight years, and then she got out.
• 5:32
  [SPEAKER_02]: So we never moved for her, but then my career as a government contract that took us everywhere.
• 5:37
  [SPEAKER_02]: So we kind of moved up around the East Coast when overseas for a little bit, and then we ended up here, I'm from Virginia.
• 5:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, man, you were really moving really.
• 5:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: So it was, when you said,
• 5:48
  [SPEAKER_02]: from everywhere.
• 5:49
  [SPEAKER_02]: I was projecting that because the joke with my children was my kids ain't from nowhere until we got here.
• 5:54
  [SPEAKER_02]: So this is the first time that they actually going through the same schools because I got two sets in terms of ages and it's interesting to see how
• 6:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: both sides of a work, because living overseas, they started to form a world view through their lens, not through propaganda and through other people's opinions of how the world works.
• 6:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: And we lived in Dubai.
• 6:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: So we lived in a Muslim country, which presents other opportunities to understand different aspects of life.
• 6:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: So when we came here, and
• 6:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: They were home school over there.
• 6:29
  [SPEAKER_02]: So when they came here and then went back into, you know, like traditional public schools and public schools are much bigger here than where I'm from, like just a, when I was run by seeing the football things up, but they were small.
• 6:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 6:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: But this is everything is literally bigger in taxes, man.
• 6:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: What, what are, what are, what are the benefits that that still help you today?
• 6:52
  [SPEAKER_02]: in terms of learning how to adjust quickly or just, I don't even know if disconnect quickly is the right word or like how does impact you today.
• 7:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Man, to be honest, it's like a given take because like the disconnect quickly, almost out of sight out of mind, and so that could work for you and against you in some aspect because like you want to say in contact with some people, some of my friends like, you know, every hit me up on like, oh, man, if I like, I hate saying the like, if I see you, but like, if I don't see you,
• 7:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of passive for me and it's not out of spider, you know, I was like, charge my, charge my head down the heart, you know what I mean?
• 7:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I'm good.
• 7:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm thinking about you, but like, when you growing up in that type of the atmosphere, I'm moving around so much and having to like, I don't want to say recreation because I always, I was always Billy, you know what I mean?
• 7:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: But at the same time, it was like, oh,
• 7:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is Billy from that that was in Korea.
• 7:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: They just moved to El Paso, Texas.
• 7:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now I'm going into eighth grade.
• 7:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: I got to find all new friends and all these kids grouped together.
• 7:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it means I got to try to find my way into it.
• 7:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so in a lot of ways, like, I don't want to say chameleon, but like in a way, a little bit, you know, like I was able to like blend in and I was able to like find my way into different circles and it's like, I've always been good about like,
• 8:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: being cool with everybody like not just like one set of group like not just the athletes I could go hang out with like a I'm for like a 45 I go hang out with the god kids Yeah, and what was cool over here I could have the kids that would would be considered nerdy or something like that But I did great so I guess I was a little nerdy too and then I could hang out with the athletes and I could hang out with the black folks I could hang out with the Mexicans like it was like I could move around in different groups and I was always showing love Yeah, I mean so like
• 8:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that was one of the benefits I got from being in the military, being a military brat is because you're around so many different cultures, so many different people that it forces you to like either kind of be recluse or kind of be open to.
• 8:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 8:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I was having to be the open to aspect of things.
• 8:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: Very dope.
• 8:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: What all of the change, what would you say?
• 8:42
  [SPEAKER_02]: ground did you throughout life?
• 8:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: Was it family structure like what what what was the thing that you could always this is going to be that no matter where I am I'm grounded to this.
• 8:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah I wish I had that like I I come from a broken home in the sense of like my dad was married that he got married
• 9:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Three times, like, well, it's in my mom, then he got divorced, then I had a stepmom for like five years, then he got divorced, then he there, my current stepmom.
• 9:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so like, I didn't really feel like I had that.
• 9:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that also kind of sucked because like,
• 9:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm walking into these new situations with this new woman per se, and it's like, all right, well, like I learned who this person is, and he's saying like, call her mom.
• 9:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know what I mean, it's like, well, how does that work?
• 9:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so like, when it came to family, like, being my brother were closed, we were still close to this day, obviously.
• 9:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: But like, when it came to having something strong and like hard and like, hold on to, I can say that's why also why kind of, I grew attachment issues with like people,
• 9:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: I see you for, I'm in a military battle, but around, yeah, I got to learn how to detach.
• 9:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: But at the same time, though, if homes die to stabilize you, want it to be, you started attaching to your friends.
• 9:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then two years later, a year later, you're moving for your friends.
• 9:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so I would take that terrible.
• 9:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'd be, I was a kid that was crying like, I don't want to leave my friends.
• 9:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's like, I like my friends.
• 9:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to start over again.
• 10:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so like, the idea of having anything stable just wasn't stable, but I love seeing my cousins when I would go,
• 10:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: because my dad's from Bollywood or he's from Tulsa, Oklahoma and all our all our most of our families from Bollywood, like the deep country, like I call it Red Clay Country.
• 10:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know what I'm saying?
• 10:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like just the roads of Red Clay, it's just how much Red Clay and stuff like that.
• 10:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
• 10:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: But then like all of them, like my great Tulsa.
• 10:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: But like everybody, when I saw my family, I wanted that too.
• 10:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so I'm gonna visit him for a summer that I gotta go.
• 10:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: start over somewhere else.
• 10:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: So the idea of stability just wasn't stable.
• 10:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: So how long were your mom and dad together?
• 10:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, after you were born, I would say, well, I was born 81.
• 10:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: They divorced in 88.
• 10:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: 89.
• 10:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
• 10:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: And you went with your father.
• 10:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, for me.
• 10:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I'm like, then I'm really, we're like, I won my dad versus like my mom.
• 10:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to put kind of
• 10:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, pull that thread like what do you remember about why that happened or we even aware man.
• 11:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'd one day I always get my dad and like he did his he did his damn thing when it came to like never talking bad about my mom.
• 11:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, he's never to this day at least passed away.
• 11:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're like he's never talked about it about my mom and friend of me.
• 11:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: My brother, we he's never told us why they got a divorce.
• 11:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: He just said that you don't understand.
• 11:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: So whenever I had questions about it, it was one of those like that's our business.
• 11:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, because, and I also feel like he didn't want to shape our impression of her.
• 11:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: No, okay.
• 11:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: All I remember is that I was eight years old and about to be nine years old.
• 11:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: We dropped my mom and found a apartment and we were like, all right, where we're going, he's like, we're about to move, but mom's going to stay here.
• 11:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so we left and then he obviously had light on the other conversations like, oh, me and my heart together anymore eight years old, you know what that really means.
• 11:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's because my mom was still we were we moved from which talk, Kansas to similar like an hour away.
• 11:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: Some of them popped up on time.
• 11:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
• 11:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: So it was like she was still around, but they weren't living together, but then again, she was still around.
• 11:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: So we were at least I was confused on like have a dynamic work.
• 12:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like I thought you said you guys aren't together, but then like she stayed over this weekend.
• 12:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like how does that work?
• 12:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, like how what's going on?
• 12:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 12:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: And for my my my mom's point of view, she always wanted to get back with my dad.
• 12:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: But my dad wouldn't, he just wouldn't do it.
• 12:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 12:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so for her, she had a lot of frustration that she would express to us in a lot of ways around like, when you know, I want to be with your dad, but your dad's like, he just won't he just won't do it.
• 12:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like, okay, I don't know why, which created like a void between my dad and me, my dad.
• 12:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Why won't she be with mom?
• 12:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Son, you don't understand.
• 12:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Son, you don't understand.
• 12:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: I just mean, I was business.
• 12:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: What was the evo conversation about the understanding?
• 12:37
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, I don't know more information before he passed.
• 12:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: One thing with my dad, like, he was a lockbox, man.
• 12:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's, I hate saying it, but it is such when you find out more about your parent after they pass away than when they were alive.
• 12:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that kicked my butt because it was one of those things, like, I don't want to do to tell me that.
• 12:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to have that type of conversation with you.
• 12:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: I got here through third person or people who knew you that you had conversation with, and I'm your son.
• 12:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I also kind of feel like he was protecting us or protecting me my brother at that time from the truth of the what it was, but I did find out what happened.
• 13:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: I will never get I went to.
• 13:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want to go visit my mom's side of the family in, um, breathing.
• 13:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we were missing.
• 13:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: We went to, but by how you miss it.
• 13:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: Visit the family.
• 13:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're all hanging out stuff like that.
• 13:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: I got super sick when I was out there because I'm eating Southern food from South, greasy, and all that stuff like that.
• 13:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: That must have been said no.
• 13:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so me and my sister were outside talking because I was sick.
• 13:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, you know, I said something about my dad and she was like,
• 13:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Billy, you don't, you don't know what happened to you.
• 13:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, what, so what are you talking about?
• 13:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, all I know is I'm here and I want to be around family like this and dad wants to be up there with his new wife and stuff and this is the second one.
• 13:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm tired of having to do all this.
• 13:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: She's like, Billy's still understand.
• 13:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I was like, well, what don't understand?
• 13:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, mom, she didn't own dad.
• 13:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was like, what?
• 13:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so like that, like a piphany of like, you know, you have your mom saying one thing, like I want your dad, he's not taking me back and it's like playing victim in that some aspects.
• 14:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Versus like the truth, in my dad, protecting all everybody, even her in some aspects, like this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this
• 14:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: My brother is two years younger than me some 45.
• 14:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: He's about to turn 43 this year and y'all kind of moved through life Yeah, yeah, like who was who was your who was your person understanding a little bit more the dynamics that you Kind of oh not count up a two-out line
• 14:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: did you become a loner in a sense, like, or like, who did you gravitate toward in those times when the house, when the family was unstable?
• 14:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Black.
• 14:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: And China, like, that's a good question.
• 14:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: When I think about it, what's the loner that aspect?
• 14:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because I,
• 14:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: didn't trust what was going on in my house because my dad was, you know, moving around when it came to marriage stuff like that.
• 14:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then the second marriage, she had kids that were in the house with us.
• 14:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: And my year is a new family.
• 14:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, type deal.
• 14:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I mean, I got along with them.
• 14:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: Finally, my younger brother was he was a little kid.
• 15:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: So he's potato.
• 15:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so he would get picked on and bullied and stuff like that.
• 15:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's a whole, that's a whole crazy story about how that even like came around, like, cave out.
• 15:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: 2008 came that came actually to Dallas, Texas, ran into him.
• 15:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he gave us both
• 15:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, hey, now, how did y'all win when we were kids was not okay?
• 15:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
• 15:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that was like...
• 15:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like you remember, you know, the trip me at your dollar this out, you know, we're adults at that point in time, but then I'm going back then I didn't have anybody I wasn't on it because I didn't trust home, so I attached to everything that wasn't at home, I would attach to teachers, I'll attach to my friends, I would attach to everything that was, if you think about wasn't stable.
• 15:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 15:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so that now that I'm thinking about it's like damn you open some worms right now, it's like when I think about that right there, I didn't trust.
• 15:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't trust myself to share anything at home because well, these people are going to leave and like, I don't really like them anyway.
• 15:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're picking on my younger brother and stuff like that.
• 15:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't feel comfortable here.
• 15:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so I gravitated to everything outside the house that also would get me in trouble to let me to like hang up with everyone gangs and stuff like that.
• 16:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's crazy because like people always think on military bases, that's not there.
• 16:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, it is.
• 16:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's everywhere.
• 16:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: you can find people that were in gangs that are bringing gang stuff onto on to military bases.
• 16:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're on military bases in the States and right outside of military bases nine time that a tin is usually run down area and homes and stuff like that.
• 16:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: So it's right out there.
• 16:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's going to come inside there too.
• 16:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so I found my, I found my way through hanging out with the people I thought were cool to feel like I found some kind of family.
• 16:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: And this is no different
• 16:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: How's all about ass?
• 16:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, what did you pull your energy into?
• 16:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: So what, um, in terms of the gang proximity, how far did it go for you?
• 16:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, um, I didn't get, like, jumped in or anything like that.
• 16:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I hung out with, I mean, I mean, I mean, a lot of, I hung out with a lot of GDs and grips.
• 16:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so like, this is in Washington State, and so even meeting these people and stuff like that, because my dad's other notes here by now, by that point, we're living off post.
• 17:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: But we're obviously, we're not living off post.
• 17:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're living in Olympia, Washington, but like it's it's around, you know, we Washington is a melting pot.
• 17:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: So you have a lot of, you know, islanders, there was the island, the item boys, like Hawaiian, the Samoans, they had their own little click, you have bloods, you had crips, you had GDs, you had vice-lores, you had all these different little, these different things going on in this little part of Washington, and people like how games migrate, I'm sorry, people like wake up, like just because it's in, was starting to Chicago or started LA didn't mean it doesn't mean it's not all over the nation, we obviously know what it is.
• 17:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so when you're meeting these people, and those are people that feel like family, and now I'm in this position where wait, we might actually be in Washington longer than two years.
• 17:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, wait, this is actually home now.
• 17:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Are you actually going to stay with this woman?
• 17:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: Are you going to divorce her at some point in time?
• 17:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I don't know where stability was, and some stability became like the people outside.
• 17:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: It had to because that's what felt good.
• 18:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: I could create a fantasy around that.
• 18:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 18:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: How would you, um,
• 18:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: If you could relive through that last today, what was, what was your identity?
• 18:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, man, I fake it to you, make it.
• 18:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I want to be the star athlete, but I also want to be cool.
• 18:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I would hang out with the guys that were doing stuff bad things.
• 18:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't smoking and drinking and everything like that.
• 18:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to be everything for everyone else, but do the right thing in the house.
• 18:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I remember telling my dad, I was like, I thought you, I thought you looked at me and my brother, I was like, trophy kids.
• 18:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I had this, and to my family, that you took my mom, I had the biggest animosity towards my dad.
• 18:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was like, you just want us to be dressed.
• 18:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, again, my air and we got a church you could dress at a night.
• 18:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like you, you, you, you look good as a kid.
• 18:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: Your parents make sure you was dressed to the tea.
• 18:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so I always felt like my dad treated us like trophy kids.
• 18:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want you to be the best athlete.
• 18:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: So when I talk about y'all, look at my kids in the paper.
• 18:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: But then when we at home, you don't really have words for me like that.
• 19:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like he was,
• 19:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: He was a hard man, but he didn't really talk to us like that, you know what I mean?
• 19:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: He would talk to his wife and he would talk this passively and stuff like that when he wanted us to do something, but later on realizing he was just putting given us foundation of stuff to be like responsible, you know what I mean?
• 19:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: Was the animosity resolved before he passed?
• 19:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh yeah, there was a...
• 19:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: I went to this person of element training, and I got the one in Washington.
• 19:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I went to the one in Washington DC.
• 19:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: I went to this person of element training It's landmark landmark forms.
• 19:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: I went there and I'll never forget to do the first day or the second day.
• 19:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: He had to do this assignment where he was like, you know, Basically Joe two circles on the on the on the board was like there's things you know and there's things you don't know and there's things that you don't know that you don't know
• 19:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: and a lot of you live in the realm of what you don't know that you don't know and you've made a assumption about that and people in your lives and that's shaping how you move and he's like I never get used like you assume you're in there was a pair of ones my mother father wounds and stuff like that he's like you always assume that
• 20:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know what happened or why someone acted this way in nine times a 10 parents aren't given like when you had Joe kids You weren't given like this guy, but like here you go.
• 20:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: This had to be the best dad in the world to make no mistakes And you can you can rock it out their liberty literally figuring out every single day and when I had that like
• 20:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's like you know it.
• 20:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Don't know it.
• 20:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: I had that.
• 20:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, you know what?
• 20:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know that.
• 20:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I don't know that.
• 20:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like one I don't have kids and two.
• 20:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: I've created all these assumptions about why he acted the way he did, what he did, what he did, but he was doing the best he could with what he had with where he was at.
• 20:36
  [SPEAKER_02]: at the end of the day and both of those are truths to each person exactly what he experienced with you as soon becomes your operational truth exactly and you live that way how they're on but I had that conversation and it blew it blew it blew the top off things like
• 20:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: DJ, when I talk about, like, God was like, you know what, this go happen.
• 20:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, so I called my pops and I was like, hey, man, like, um, when they were called him, and he picked the phone, he's like, oh, it was going on with you.
• 21:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I just want to call him talk to you real quick.
• 21:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's like, oh, yeah, me and everybody had in the movies.
• 21:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was like, wait, what?
• 21:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: My dad is one of them do's like, when he doing something, he doing something.
• 21:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: He ain't picking the phone.
• 21:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: He got talking.
• 21:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: So like, the fact that he picked up, and I was like, oh, no, I can just call you later.
• 21:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: He goes, no, I said, like, you got to talk about something.
• 21:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: I can step out.
• 21:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: Wait, what?
• 21:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: You by the.
• 21:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Every Friday they went to the movies.
• 21:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: So you about the step out from going in the movies, come to have a conversation with me like that's crazy.
• 21:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: He never did that.
• 21:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so when he walked out, he's like, so what's going on?
• 21:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was like, hey, you know, I just want to let you know that like, I'm sorry, he's like, well, what are you sorry about?
• 21:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was like, well, when I was growing up, I created a lot of stories about you.
• 21:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I didn't know the truth and I never asked you.
• 21:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so I assume that you just,
• 21:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: thought me and Chris were my Chris and my brother.
• 21:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: We were trophy kids and you just wanted us to be some a talk it.
• 21:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: But well, well, let me stop you right there.
• 21:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let me stop you right there.
• 21:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, okay, my dad cut me off like always, boom, whatever.
• 21:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's like, Billy, I didn't know what I was doing all the time.
• 21:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's tough to admit.
• 21:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: What?
• 21:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 21:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: My dad, my dad's nickname was the ice man because he's always just cold.
• 22:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: He didn't, he didn't admit too many faults.
• 22:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know what I mean?
• 22:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so like, when he's like, tell I mean, this is like,
• 22:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't always know what I was doing.
• 22:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was just doing the best I could.
• 22:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I know it.
• 22:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I know for a fact that it always make the right decision, but you and your brother are my greatest accomplishment.
• 22:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: Bruh.
• 22:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Did John when I heard that, bro, it rocks me, bro.
• 22:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because we create these assumptions around our family, our parents and stuff like that.
• 22:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: And like he said,
• 22:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: What, at that time, I'm like 33, 33 years worth of stuff in like five lines, you know what I mean, and hearing that when I say rock me was like, man, I didn't, I felt stupid because like, was I wrong for what's I wrong for I felt no because I didn't know, but I felt stupid because like man.
• 22:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like you said, two truths can be, two truths can be, be, be, happens simultaneously.
• 22:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: But until you have the truth truth or the fact behind something, you're not going to close this door.
• 23:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: So when he did that, those five lines or whatever he said, close that up to for me so quick and released like a thousand patterns of assumptions that I made about him and how he was as a father, it rocked me.
• 23:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: What did that change about you immediately?
• 23:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: That's the disruptor to your identity in that moment.
• 23:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, what do you remember the immediate?
• 23:27
  [SPEAKER_02]: Not even take away is what that like.
• 23:30
  [SPEAKER_02]: ton of emotions hit you at that time.
• 23:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: How did life begin to shift for you from that point?
• 23:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: It shifted immediately because it's like what I thought was true is no longer true.
• 23:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so your whole world is different now.
• 23:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like the way I would handle certain situations shifts in a way because like that was a motivating factor.
• 23:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like I was raised by a hard man who just did it.
• 23:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that was still true.
• 23:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: But the stuff that I put behind the shifts now because like I had to add a massive behind that like that those thoughts You're making me do this because you want me to be dead at a you you didn't want me to you Told me my senior year attract and feel when I lost at state that like or I got third place of state like we don't when I start crying You don't do that min don't do that So like no like everything you do is to protect us
• 24:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, how do you move through life?
• 24:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: How do you keep moving forward with that, that's the truth?
• 24:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 24:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so in that for me, what opened up was like, I don't man like, shoot.
• 24:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't have to be so rough and hard.
• 24:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't have to be this tough guy.
• 24:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't have to be this guy that's emotionless.
• 24:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so for what opened up for me was like vulnerability.
• 24:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: the the doors of vulnerability completely open up because this man whose nickname is ice man is telling me this before he's he when he should be in the movie theater and more likely the conversation wouldn't happen but God is like ah y'all y'all y'all y'all don't sort this out right now because time opportunity plays you just create the space he's gonna walk through the door and I'm pretty sure when it's sick was me just creating the space for him to feel comfortable enough just to just say it because what he said he wasn't
• 25:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: You and your brother, my greatest accomplishment.
• 25:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't know we know what I was doing and I know for a fact that I'd make all the right decisions.
• 25:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I did the best I could because I want to draw.
• 25:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: I just wanted to be a family.
• 25:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: What?
• 25:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: And in my experience when I, like I only learned to appreciate my father when I became one.
• 25:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, when you become responsible for
• 25:29
  [SPEAKER_02]: the lives of others and not just in a protection, but in a how they're shaped, how they're grounded, what sees a planet and how they're cultivated, and you realize you don't actually have the tools or the answers on how to do that.
• 25:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: the gravity of that responsibility of leading a family.
• 25:52
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and my family grew quick.
• 25:54
  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it was a blended from day one.
• 25:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: We had three children within the first five years of marriage.
• 26:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: And then, you know, six years, seven years later, we had two children back to back.
• 26:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: Wow.
• 26:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: So I had created this space between me and my father.
• 26:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I had a great father.
• 26:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like he was,
• 26:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: He stood on certain principles, and I didn't understand the importance of having principles that are unwavering until I became, like I said, until I had a family.
• 26:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 26:27
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's the 80-20.
• 26:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 26:29
  [SPEAKER_02]: The 80 was the 80, as a child you focus on the 20.
• 26:32
  [SPEAKER_02]: But you're missing this.
• 26:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: But I created this gap.
• 26:36
  [SPEAKER_02]: And then I tried to prove to my father that I understood things by my actions.
• 26:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: So even having a great relationship or an accessible relationship and not using it, the gap is the gap.
• 26:51
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
• 26:52
  [SPEAKER_02]: So now I'm trying to be a man and I'm too embarrassed to ask my father because when he was trying to tell me, I didn't want the information.
• 27:01
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 27:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I'm just spiraling it.
• 27:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: And because of this show, not because of the show we talked, but
• 27:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: the wide behind this show as I saw that was duplicating between me and my son who didn't want distance.
• 27:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: I was just giving them distance because at that age, I wanted to be left alone, but he's not like that at all.
• 27:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: So for the accountability sake of me having conversations with my son, that's how this show started.
• 27:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: My father started having conversations that were 20 years
• 27:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: that we didn't discuss, when they would have been the most useful, is now why I have an appreciation for having these conversations with my son apologizing early.
• 27:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: So I didn't understand what I did yesterday.
• 27:46
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I ten years ago, like, yeah, yeah.
• 27:48
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yesterday, bro, I, I, I, I, I.
• 27:51
  [SPEAKER_02]: Here's what I was thinking, here's what I interpret it.
• 27:52
  [SPEAKER_02]: And we've had to have those kind of conversations.
• 27:54
  [SPEAKER_02]: They become less frequent.
• 27:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: But as a man, like the, when that responsibility hits you,
• 28:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: I understand what it is to lock in on a path that you think is the best.
• 28:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, only to find out it wasn't the best in hindsight.
• 28:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: So to have that level of grace and I'm glad that your story is you had it and it came into fruition before you were unable to have that conversation.
• 28:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: I've had conversations with guys that
• 28:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: When a time and didn't, didn't suit.
• 28:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 28:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: Man, everything you're saying and lands a thousand percent because that tier, even from the standard point would you, what you're saying.
• 28:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't understand my dad's principles and standards that he had for himself, that had him riding a certain amount of life, that would protect him and us, correct.
• 28:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know what I mean?
• 28:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: I just didn't get that, and not having children, like I haven't, well, I perfectly one day I will, it's just like the fact that,
• 28:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I get it now.
• 28:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: I get it from the a sons aspect of like, oh, man, to your point having that conversation with him and seeing like the greater scope of it was like, man, you do have to show up differently as a dad for your family and you're literally making these and that goes back to the manual aspect.
• 29:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: You don't, they don't, you don't get a manual when kids are born or when you get married like, all right, this is how this is how I need to do marriage, this how you need to be a husband, this how you need to be a father, this how you need to be a friend, this is there.
• 29:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: You don't get all that.
• 29:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so what I'm hearing him say this, it even here you say that it blows my mind because this is like, man, you guys literally just figure it out.
• 29:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like it's, it's crazy what you have to figure out.
• 29:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: And there's things that like, your kids will never know you have to figure out.
• 29:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it's not out of not one that's in them.
• 29:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's just because of whatever circumstances came up, a decision to how to be made, that really affected the whole family.
• 29:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it just didn't, again, the conversation just didn't come up.
• 29:42
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, what being my wife or intentional, more intentional about, as it should be generational generation is being more transparent about those situations sooner.
• 29:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: that my parents struggled until I was in the dog, right?
• 30:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: Because we didn't see it and they didn't present life to us in a way that they were frustrated about a thing or that we were never the energy of, if you weren't here, it'd be different that kind of thing.
• 30:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: So I try to add more to the side of,
• 30:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: leaving less for them to figure out than I figured out, then my parents figured out an appearance figured out.
• 30:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: To that end, do you know what the relationship your father had with his father was or that goes to the standards that he created for himself because his father wasn't around.
• 30:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so he was in a situation where he had different stepdads or men around that was with my grandmother.
• 30:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: and then it landed with her last husband in the name of James Hadley become a bullcum Graham.
• 30:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: We got him bread Eddie, but like James Taylor in the way he was and who he was, it was like he was a hard man too.
• 30:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: So he built a lot of his principles based off how my grandfather moved.
• 30:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that, you know, we weren't that age.
• 30:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: That error was completely different for our grandparents.
• 31:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: So with their standards of how they had to be and how they had to move.
• 31:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: And if you're about principle, you about principle.
• 31:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: and being a man is being a man and so he took that on and then again you just you don't do what some of the says you do what you do what you see and so he took that thought he was shaping certain things and until he became a father realized he was probably mimicking some of the things that he saw indirectly without even knowing he was doing it and then sometimes it's kind of like too late to fix it and the one thing before you pass I wish we would have had
• 31:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: That level of transparency that you have with your kids, you know I've had with your kids like it's not that he didn't do it.
• 31:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't feel he knew how.
• 31:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because all he knew was like a man's supposed to do this take care of his family.
• 31:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: Make sure everybody's okay and into your point I'm pretty sure he struggled.
• 31:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know what I found after he passed away.
• 31:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: He went through bankruptcy at one point never knew.
• 31:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: because our lifestyle for the most part didn't change.
• 31:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we weren't getting McDonald's or whatever.
• 31:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: If we wanted to go get a toy, he'd be like, no, we can't do that.
• 31:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then like, I never get hits me even thinking about like, I seen him drop a 20 in the collection plate and take 10 out.
• 32:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because that was probably the only house that's just last bit of money, but he wanted to get, he wanted to get to God so that he could receive, but he was, he was hurting.
• 32:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: But as a kid, I didn't notice that.
• 32:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't see him wavering with us in any capacity because he was still dead.
• 32:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: And like, that was a great dad.
• 32:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: He showed up.
• 32:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: He was always there.
• 32:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: He always had the words of tough love and encouragement, you know.
• 32:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: But at the same time, though, again, he's given me the best he had with what he would he knew.
• 32:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 32:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's the biggest, that's the crux of it all right there.
• 32:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: When you can get the real scope of what a parent has to go through and do, I'm I am a thousand percent positive when God gives me the opportunity to be a father one day, all the stuff I said I would never do, there's going to be something I end up doing without even thinking about it because that's what I saw and that's what I know and it's not because I
• 32:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want to be so held in on not doing something.
• 32:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's because you put in a certain situation, you're like, they're not at the same thing.
• 33:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're like, wow, it's natural.
• 33:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, she was like 10.
• 33:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes when I talk about my nieces and stuff, they're like, let me sit down because I sound like I am a parent.
• 33:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, let me stop.
• 33:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I'm not supposed to be the first.
• 33:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm supposed to be the fun.
• 33:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm the fun uncle.
• 33:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you're giving back.
• 33:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'm thinking for a day of giving back.
• 33:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: How much are you, how much are you adult?
• 33:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: Who is?
• 33:24
  [SPEAKER_02]: was framed out of spite and maybe a better with like, like, lacking what you didn't have from your father at that time.
• 33:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: Did you go into manhood with the chip on your shoulder?
• 33:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: That's true.
• 33:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: I, I went in there with fillings a week.
• 33:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: Men don't do that.
• 33:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like it's, it's the same with cheese most stuff that like, we say that it's, it's, it's stereotypical.
• 33:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 33:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: I follow those lines because that's, I was around friends that if you, you, you, you, you didn't stop stuff.
• 33:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: You got called out.
• 33:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: You got made fun of like, made ther suckin' up, you be right.
• 33:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: But that boy, that man over there hurtin'.
• 34:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: That boy over there hurtin'.
• 34:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: But we just don't know how to gear those conversations stuff like that.
• 34:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it wasn't till I found my own level of vulnerability that I've shifted me and a couple of my friends shifted the whole dynamic of our friendship groups.
• 34:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 34:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like we don't do that.
• 34:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: We don't tolerate that no more.
• 34:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like I, we're like, is you good?
• 34:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like because all it takes is one of your friends to commit suicide.
• 34:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: Someone to get into a situation where they lose it on their spouse.
• 34:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's my man's.
• 34:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: Did you do that to your wife?
• 34:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: T-O-R-T-O-Kid, like it didn't become it's it now it's not funny anymore it's not it's not a gaming anymore because us as friends weren't being good friends because a lot of times we just didn't know how to be good friends because how we how we were raised than what we were around man it's not talking more about that because that's so that's something that we touched on on the show in terms of picking friends is one aspect of it.
• 34:52
  [SPEAKER_02]: but deciding to be that friend.
• 34:54
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 34:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: First, yeah.
• 34:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: How was that for you?
• 34:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: You have to, in my opinion, if you choose to be that friend, you know your friends.
• 35:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, it mean you got years deep.
• 35:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know you.
• 35:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know what's going on trigger, you're not trigger you.
• 35:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I live by this saying, and I was talking to the cast last week.
• 35:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I always tell people this, you're not responsible for some of the takes that you're responsible for how you say it.
• 35:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: So if I'm saying something with love, because I love you, you're going to feel it.
• 35:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Even if it piss you off, you're going to feel it.
• 35:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: If you add a pocket on something, I'm not, where I think people fail sometimes, it's, you're not, the goal is to beat the person down.
• 35:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: You want them to have awareness?
• 35:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: That leads to clarity.
• 35:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: I need you to be aware of what your actions are creating for you.
• 35:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: I need you to be aware of how you're feeling, because I don't want to get a phone call out to my, my man's killed himself.
• 35:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: or words hurt somebody else, you know?
• 35:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: And the biggest thing to touch on your point is that like you have to be that unwavering friend to just be willing to step up.
• 35:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: A lot of people are scared of a reaction or how they're a view or if they're friends shun something up, I'm a believe in like, man, if I love you enough and I say it,
• 36:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's either going to land or it's going to sit with you and maybe hit you tomorrow, but the fact that I said something, it helps me feel better in some aspect that I tried.
• 36:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, even if the message doesn't reach the person I tried, but I'm also going to let my boys all know like, we all talk.
• 36:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: So like, if I, I mean, I talked to John, but like he, so I'm going on, man, but he, he's shift for me, we're like, tapping with him.
• 36:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's how we talk.
• 36:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then also realizing who ain't your friend
• 36:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's the hardest one.
• 36:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: Realizing that one for the stays on Joe time, you can love them.
• 36:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: But man, we might at least some distance, bro, because I don't, I'm not afraid to shed a tear no more.
• 36:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 36:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: But if I shed a tear, because we talk about some serious and you always go on Joe time, maybe it's time for us to separate that up a little bit.
• 36:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: How are you all, you mentioned the desire to be a father when God decides his time,
• 37:01
  [SPEAKER_02]: like for that because I think like I became a father early and I don't live through conversations with a grass or with if I get to see how I'm a different father with two like my kids that are adults and then my children are 13 and 11 today.
• 37:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: So I see that sometimes
• 37:27
  [SPEAKER_02]: but it couldn't have been it today without having gone through life with them to get to this point.
• 37:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: So sometimes I see people that are positioned to become fathers later in life and have reached a level of maturity that some of us drag our family through that process with them.
• 37:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: So true.
• 37:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, what is... Are you even conscious of that?
• 37:48
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not trying to make light of it, really.
• 37:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I'm very caring for that.
• 37:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: I couldn't imagine 28-year-old 27-year-old Billy versus 45-year-old Billy, trying to be a father.
• 38:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: I feel now so confident in myself and my ability around communication, like open communication, accepting false, saying, I'm sorry to my kids and stuff like that versus,
• 38:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, even just say 30-year-old Billy, who was cocky, felt like he knew everything, had the biggest integrity issues when it came to like, you know, owning and taking responsibility for his own accountability and accountability for the things he was doing.
• 38:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so it's just when you have that level of awareness and you have that clarity about yourself now, like, me now is so clear.
• 38:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, is there gonna be a level of who my dad was of like,
• 38:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: a very an iron standard of who we are and how we move through life and what we do and how how you will be raised and how you will act and not act in level of matters and stuff like that.
• 38:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: Some still old school like some of these kids nowadays I hear I'm like this who you don't say yes, man, no, sir.
• 38:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: No, like you don't say what it's it confuses me.
• 38:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: But that's the basis.
• 38:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: Not children or a few's and I've said it, but yeah, bear with my children would be a few
• 39:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: And there was a lot more freedom for children to move about, like, because there was like no crime.
• 39:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 39:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: So when you come from the States and you go somewhere with, with dramatically different things, look weird.
• 39:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 39:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: So if we go to the mall and kids are running around, that's not a cue for my kids to run around.
• 39:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 39:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: They look at me like, I'm going with this.
• 39:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 39:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: But I wouldn't, what is going on with that?
• 39:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: But you, I mean, you, you got to, you definitely got to have a standard, man.
• 39:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: You, um,
• 39:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: I assume that your desire structure is to have a family.
• 39:37
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I have a person with your children.
• 39:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like how is, how do relationships work for you?
• 39:43
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like what?
• 39:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: would have you become open to now in terms of trusting people as still a challenge or yeah.
• 39:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: I would say trust to people always be my biggest challenge.
• 39:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like I would take things even as recent as like last year.
• 40:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like year after two years ago, you know what I mean?
• 40:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like my level of blow up around like the smallest thing a partner would do would like have me go into like, I knew I could trust you.
• 40:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: And this is after I've had the conversation my dad, this after multiple seminars, multiple life-coach sessions with people and stuff like that, multiple conversations like this, there's still triggers that live inside of us that, you know, we try to work around them differently and better, but they still come up.
• 40:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm human.
• 40:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know what I mean?
• 40:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's my human.
• 40:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: It took me a long time to give myself grace around that.
• 40:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: But that would lead me to, and this is not like an excuse, but that would create a pathway for me.
• 40:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, man, this is going to work outside and you go find the next thing.
• 40:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so I had infidelity issues when it came to relationships because like the moment you do something that makes me feel like you are a liability I am looking for an out to the next thing to replace you like I have to because I want to dislike that aspect of how I grew up I don't like me alone.
• 40:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to be alone.
• 40:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want somebody.
• 40:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want to do life with somebody, you know what I mean?
• 41:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's also led me to some very bad relationships too.
• 41:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: That like tore me down, sent me to depression and stuff like that.
• 41:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then it's almost like, you keep praying for something you keep asking God.
• 41:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want this, I want this, I want this, I want this, I want this, I want this.
• 41:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he's like, I'm not going to give it to you in a bow.
• 41:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes I guess I got sent you to the path of learning and learning and teaching yourself certain ways of being so that you can be worthy enough and know you're worth enough of having that which you want.
• 41:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: But you're not realizing the lesson.
• 41:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: You mess up with that chicken.
• 41:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: You go mess up with this chicken over here too.
• 41:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I keep putting in the same situation.
• 41:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Did you ask, because you asked for something, and I keep putting in the same situation to power through it and get a different result.
• 41:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: And you keep doing the same thing.
• 41:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so for me, it was like, I would hold people to a standard.
• 41:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: They never knew they were being held to.
• 41:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it'd be the smallest thing.
• 41:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like when I moved to Texas, I was in a relationship.
• 41:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Which, one of the things that big time, there was a few things prior to that set me off, but I went through some of my felt great and we were rocking, we're doing those things, but before we moved, I had a trigger moment because I felt like I was doing the movie by myself.
• 42:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now I'm alone.
• 42:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: I thought I could trust you.
• 42:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: I thought we were team.
• 42:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: And this is like, now I'm spiraling out.
• 42:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm spiraling out.
• 42:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now I'm looking for
• 42:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: something to make me feel good that led me into getting caught up cheating again.
• 42:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then I say again because I had cheated before and she's still rocked out with me.
• 42:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then I'll hear we hear I am again.
• 42:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm mad about something and I'm not going about the way I should go about it.
• 42:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so to even answer your other question about like how I'm moving about life in relationship is different.
• 42:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: What I'm choosing differently, I'm choosing for the
• 42:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's just not an option for me and I needed my world to get completely blown up in ways that realized like man, I am that's how I'm like 43 years old or 44 or 43 43 43 whatever the one of the twenty something like I need this to be rock so bad in me to realize like I will never have the family that I want.
• 43:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: If I don't change how I see these things, if I don't change how I communicate, if I don't change how I'm wearing these masks, you know what, F the mask.
• 43:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: I can't keep doing this.
• 43:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like I got it, either on me, fully like, fully expressed me and accepted as me.
• 43:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm open to having the tough conversation.
• 43:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's where we'll get me.
• 43:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: I wouldn't have the tough conversations until some ish happened.
• 43:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 43:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now I want to, and I remember I was watching my home grocery has a podcast too.
• 43:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: And she's like, man, this is real mess up.
• 43:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Y'all want to mess up, but then you want to have the real conversations.
• 43:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then you expect us to hear, I can't hear you now.
• 43:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because you didn't, you didn't, you didn't broke the glass.
• 43:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now we have these cracks in the glass.
• 43:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now you want to have a real conversation about, what, what's up?
• 43:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 43:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: I can't, I can't even hear half the things you're saying to them.
• 43:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because you're like, buddy, you realize, which we, we could have did this before you did that.
• 43:46
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 43:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so that's the shift from, I don't want to live that anymore.
• 43:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it's causing the shift, when I say the ripple effect of my whole life, I feel free.
• 43:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's true.
• 43:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: I feel open.
• 43:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: So when you asked me, we were like, what's off?
• 43:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: Let me say, that's off limits.
• 43:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because I'm so fully expressed to myself, that
• 44:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: I feel that if I don't say the truth, I'm doing myself a disservice, if I don't keep it real with you, I'm doing myself a disservice.
• 44:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't want to keep doing myself a disservice in my life anymore because I've seen that this funny, because my mentor, my mentor at Garen Jones, always says like, when you say someone, how's that going to work for you?
• 44:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: And Amy work, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't
• 44:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: I did not make the shift.
• 44:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 44:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't choose honesty.
• 44:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't choose taking the mask off.
• 44:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're like, you know what?
• 44:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm struggling right now with how we communicate, how we are, I'm complacent or this is complacent or you know what being honest when something is not working anymore like this isn't working and being okay with walking away and walking alone for a little bit to get to the destination that I want to.
• 45:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I was so afraid of being alone that sometimes I was staying longer and sitting twice that I didn't need to stay in and all that did was like
• 45:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: and then in turn, pollute the relationship.
• 45:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now not only have I lost a friend, I've lost someone who was a good partner, and this is just not just, this is like, oh, I don't wanna say all that shit, but a lot of them.
• 45:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 45:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, one thing mean my boy always said like, you know, one thing about us, bro, like, we know how to pick good women, but we, we, I get our stuff together, bro, like this is, this is a problem.
• 45:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: And when I look at it,
• 45:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you're right.
• 45:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're the constant.
• 45:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you're the constant.
• 45:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's how to some of the days like, what's causing like, yes, me, you're right.
• 45:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: He read about that.
• 45:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: You referenced mask a few times, man.
• 45:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I'm glad that the perspective is that you took it off because the danger really is hard to recover from is becoming the mask.
• 46:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yeah.
• 46:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
• 46:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I've said it about my standing corporate, like I was,
• 46:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: thinking that I was putting the mask on to go to work and deal with these people and they come home and be frustrated with my family.
• 46:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: I became the person and I had to put the mask on to come home and try to be somebody, somebody different.
• 46:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: Masks your question, I never asked anybody because I think, and this is not a download from God, we haven't had any conversations about it.
• 46:36
  [SPEAKER_02]: I think it would be an interesting dynamic
• 46:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: and what you will see about you, oh man, I'm bothering a daughter.
• 46:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I would be, I would be mush.
• 46:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm talking about, the ask, when I even think about that, I gotta chill that with him up by him, like this right here, she don't mean, like she would run my life, like at the whole, a sense of my, like my little niece, like the cute little thing in the world, like hang in here in my wallet, just stay, do what you wanna do, you can have the world, you know what I mean?
• 47:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: Cause it's like, and even that though,
• 47:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: most of my, it's funny like the guys that ripping right and doing the most in them getting girls.
• 47:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so my mom, my dad before he passes like, you know, you don't get a daughter, right?
• 47:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like this, we should mean to like, yeah, and it just, how are you moving?
• 47:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, what you're talking about like him?
• 47:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it just always is not kind of laughing just talking about it.
• 47:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: But it would be an interesting not ever because I know that would even that would shift so much in me.
• 47:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it would keep going.
• 47:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it would break me.
• 47:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: When I said,
• 47:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that would be like the truest expression of my heart and human form.
• 47:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so the idea of who I was, who I was being, how I was acting or something like that, like seeing her or having that could, it would destroy me.
• 48:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: The moment she comes out, I'd be like, I feel like, I think about those movies where like, the baby comes out and you have that big light, you have this like, oh, and then you see, you have all these flashbacks of light that is almost kind of like,
• 48:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: like, I can't even be a sociator connected to who I was or how I thought or who, like, oh my god, and to that point, like that's why I said, I feel like it would break me because like, I feel like the the last layer or shedding of who I am who I want to be would be like, would just kind of fall off.
• 48:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he'd be like, oh,
• 48:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is true vulnerability.
• 48:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is the trueest form of your heart.
• 48:41
  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, let me, let me, let me off some hope that it's not going to break you, but the way that you appreciate a woman to be.
• 48:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: through that form, through that bond.
• 48:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: Not a woman you chose.
• 48:59
  [SPEAKER_02]: Not a woman that you, if it's not cool.
• 49:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, y'all can go your different ways, but somebody that didn't ask the be here shows up here and you understand life through that lens of what it means to protect this woman to be there entire life.
• 49:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I'm not suggesting that this an excuse for how you treat a woman before you have a daughter, if you have a daughter,
• 49:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: I haven't met a man that was able to, I don't have any friends, I should say that.
• 49:29
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm sure that a man out there that was able to to not see life differently, specifically after that.
• 49:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: I can't think of that.
• 49:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's not down playing, having a son, like I have girls for a girl, girl, boy, girl, boy.
• 49:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: And there's an aha moment that's unexplainable in that like,
• 49:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: you would never let somebody else treat her the way that you may have treated somebody else.
• 50:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's what you're emotion.
• 50:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's that's that's exactly what you're like man.
• 50:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: I wish I wish an injured would like, you know what I mean?
• 50:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like,
• 50:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: In granted, like my past relationships, I'm cool.
• 50:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: We're all cool, you know, to the screen.
• 50:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: We've had open conversation now that I'd like, I met that point of my life where I can one communicator sorry, a true, like an authentic, I'm sorry, and where it comes from, when it's attached to the Y and all that stuff like that, I couldn't imagine, like, how they're like, we know it.
• 50:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'd,
• 50:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: I always knew you could be better.
• 50:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: You just for whatever reason just kept getting your own way.
• 50:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so to think that like my future daughter could be dealing with some dude that just kept getting his own way and she just loves him with everything.
• 50:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because that's what it was like, it was like you're in these relationships.
• 50:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: They love you with everything and they're like, hope they're like, I know what you're going through something.
• 50:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're working through something.
• 50:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know there's like, you get caught up, you take like, I'm in this world.
• 51:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm in this world.
• 51:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm in this world.
• 51:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm kind of caught up.
• 51:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, but it's like sometimes like when you're like, can it cook you like, yeah, you right?
• 51:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: I messed up.
• 51:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I couldn't imagine being in a situation where I'm watching my daughter.
• 51:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: go through that and I know what that is and I feel helpless because there's only so much you can do in the loving disrupting way without doing too much or possibly pushing her away.
• 51:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's, that's, that's the, that's the, that's the, that's the, the sweet spot.
• 51:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like what, what's too much or what's too little and then you want to be the best representation of what a man is.
• 51:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: You are that.
• 51:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: So what a little like if like she's being raised and I'm, I'm dog her mama out.
• 51:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: She's not doing what they're not doing what you say.
• 51:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: They do what you do.
• 51:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: They see that and that becomes a reputation of a mentor.
• 51:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't want that reputation of that.
• 51:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know what I mean?
• 51:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: So it would even hurt for me to, and that's why like as something certain point, I stopped speaking, that didn't go place, do certain things because I was so out in integrity with myself, how could I be on a cast with you talking about real stuff and trying to be authentic, that's a mask.
• 52:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: circle.
• 52:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm back to put mask on.
• 52:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: They just look a little different.
• 52:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then that mask becomes my identity.
• 52:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't know who is who.
• 52:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I guess I got to a certain point after my father passed away.
• 52:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't know who I was.
• 52:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 52:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know which mask put on.
• 52:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then when I get to the point of like this, I said, this year has has peeled the onion of who I am back in so many different ways because I want a family.
• 52:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want kids.
• 52:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want to have a fruitful healthy relationship.
• 52:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I feel like
• 52:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: I fight with myself around perfection.
• 52:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: I want to be just right, but at the same time, knowing that perfection in his illusion, because perfection is the end of the eye of the holder,
• 52:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: It shifts you in a little bit so it's like all of what you know versus what you're doing and then also being like you know what I don't want to be that ninja anymore Who was doing that because I don't want to hurt me, but I don't want to keep hurting people when I don't want to keep hurting myself Yeah, because I keep I'm in the circle.
• 53:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: I keep doing the same is getting the same result look at what it's handy I'm sure I'm different and I'm doing the same is you know, I mean, that's the hard part and I'm I feel like I'm personally getting there.
• 53:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because I
• 53:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just in a stronger place now of receiving exactly who I am, and intentionally keeping the mask off in every setting.
• 53:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't need to be Billy the contact specialist, Billy the speaker, Billy the the boyfriend, Billy the the friend, I need to be Billy and be okay with being Billy and every setting.
• 53:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I got to talk differently at work, but I could still be me.
• 53:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 53:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's what I was that you start crossing so many different masks.
• 53:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: You forget who you are into your point.
• 53:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: because if I show up, I'm so upset with myself, I'm upset with myself, and I didn't like the person that I saw on the mirror at all.
• 53:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, man, there's the whole brush your teeth.
• 53:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: You look at yourself, but you don't look at yourself.
• 53:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 53:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I'm so disgusted with him, I'm not giving him any grace.
• 54:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Everybody can get it.
• 54:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Any, taking time by walking.
• 54:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: I get it, man.
• 54:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh.
• 54:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm glad we did this, man.
• 54:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: Heck yeah, glad we did this, and I don't think this is going to be the last time.
• 54:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: And my mind, you might be there for me.
• 54:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: No, I don't know.
• 54:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'll put it up.
• 54:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: But because this is your first time here, when it's fun to mind for me, I ask every first time, guess, full time on the show is this time when I wish my father told me, something you wish your father told you.
• 54:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: That is like a loaded question, especially with the birthday just coming up because when his birthday was super emotional that whole dad didn't know what that was going on.
• 54:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't even register what day it was and tell all the I kept looking at his picture.
• 54:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, what's going on?
• 54:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then it hit us all the show birthday.
• 54:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so like a whole flood of emotions of like conversations you, she would have had think to your point things you wish you could stay right now.
• 54:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so like, you know, if I could think of
• 54:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: anything that would want to ask him or talk to him about or just dive into, shoot like it always goes back to like the cliche like, are you proud of me?
• 55:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I can say before you pass, he was saying that to me, my brother like a proud
• 55:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: has a man who like is still growing his own because the growth has never is never ending.
• 55:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: I find myself with one in that simple thing.
• 55:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I do it all right.
• 55:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 55:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, somebody took this funny, he said it because, like, somebody thought they wanted to ask like, man, let's put an ass your advice, like, if I do it all right, like, how should I go about this, like, in my,
• 55:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, as I'm talking, it's all coming up.
• 55:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, that's what's showing up for me.
• 55:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, am I a good person?
• 56:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Am I a good man?
• 56:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, do you think I'm a good man?
• 56:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Am I doing okay?
• 56:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: Would you be proud of me?
• 56:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because I don't want to, for whatever reason, it's like, it's not wanting his validation or approval is just what I know that he sees me.
• 56:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, and then the biggest part, the hard part is like, it was got me.
• 56:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Or the years of stuff I think is the fact that like,
• 56:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: when I do have kids who never get to meet them.
• 56:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so it's just like, man, I just, I beat myself up because I feel like I'm behind and that's also the disruptor that would pop my relationships.
• 56:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I'm so behind.
• 56:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: And if this person is one thing, it sets me off.
• 56:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I need, I need, I need, I need to find something else.
• 56:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, that's not the way it, that's not how you solve.
• 56:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's not how you solve partnership.
• 56:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's one thing that I realized about my dad and all the relationships you had.
• 56:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: What got me was I finally started understanding, like,
• 57:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: it's not about just the marriage, it's not about just a title, where they were a partnership.
• 57:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's why I held my step on that.
• 57:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, they rocked because they were a team.
• 57:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I never put two and two together.
• 57:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: So like, knowing that I feel the way I feel, they had to feel the thing, man, I just wanna know that like, you think you see me and my mom, am I doing okay?
• 57:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Am I going down to the right path?
• 57:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, and even before I come on, anything I pray, I say, God, can you think of this hand?
• 57:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: Daddy, you date this hand?
• 57:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm still seeking this at that level of like, man, you got me, you see me, you hold it for me?
• 57:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because I would do it if they just fit that moment again.
• 57:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think it's cliche at all, man.
• 57:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: And I can tell you, from a different vantage point as the 47 year old my father's about be 78, the conversations I have with him now is,
• 58:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: I just want to make sure that you see it work.
• 58:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: What you did, yeah, right?
• 58:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: Not necessarily a conference, he seemed to do well in corporate, but it's the foundational like I care about you being proud of me.
• 58:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: And there's very few men, and I actually, I think I mentioned on the last episode, because the guest asked me a question, he said, who's your rat pack?
• 58:29
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, who would you, who would you want to do life with at 25?
• 58:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: And as I was answering, my answer was based on the people that I cared about being proud of me as an adult.
• 58:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: Two of whom have passed and my father is a remaining of the three that I named.
• 58:46
  [SPEAKER_02]: But that matters.
• 58:48
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 58:48
  [SPEAKER_02]: So I don't think it's not cliche at all.
• 58:51
  [SPEAKER_02]: In the fact that that's front of mine for you.
• 58:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, taking that into whatever the next phase of life, this phase of life and whatever family.
• 59:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, how that tree extends from you.
• 59:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: I think if you maintain that aspect of it, you would do his legacy justice.
• 59:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: I probably received.
• 59:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: I really, I really believe that man.
• 59:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh,
• 59:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: This is dope.
• 59:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: You said it sounded about contracts, but it's not through me because that's what I was in.
• 59:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, really?
• 59:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: In government?
• 59:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I worked for, I worked for level two.
• 59:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, level two, yeah.
• 59:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm a contract, well, I'm a senior contract contract specialist.
• 59:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I did that right, almost 18 years.
• 59:32
  [SPEAKER_02]: I did that for a while for DLA and then I went contract inside the equipment in supply chain.
• 59:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: So this time of year, I'm surprised.
• 59:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: That's why I'm tired.
• 59:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: like I'm a last week in Dries up to but yeah, that being my birthday, my weed be tracked in
• 59:51
  [SPEAKER_02]: a lot of the contract vehicles on vehicles.
• 59:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: We were on they dropped the task order releases the last two weeks of September every time.
• 1:00:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: So we just 12, 15 our days in a room, when the list.
• 1:00:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, man.
• 1:00:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then you on the other side.
• 1:00:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: I know both sides of it.
• 1:00:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, man.
• 1:00:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, now I'm on the contact to side.
• 1:00:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I'm not necessarily in the supply chain side of it, but I'm still working for the like I'm contacted in.
• 1:00:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
• 1:00:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like for
• 1:00:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: different agencies and stuff like that.
• 1:00:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so, like you said, like I am, it's always last two weeks.
• 1:00:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: So between like the mainly between like the 25th or the 30th, everybody is time my flipping.
• 1:00:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're flipping.
• 1:00:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: I need to follow on.
• 1:00:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: I need this.
• 1:00:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: I need that.
• 1:00:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so, like, a lot of anti-pages like this.
• 1:00:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: I can't.
• 1:00:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: I lasted because of that.
• 1:00:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, I'm going to get my stuff together this week.
• 1:00:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: Because last week, it was like a lot of mistakes.
• 1:00:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't know, I don't make a lot of mistakes in my, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh,
• 1:00:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: people are important to like, you could, you know, because like, you, you back to like, this show first day, like in, in contract, and I'm like, I don't know what school, but it's that season right now, you know, and so everybody that's been hitting me up.
• 1:00:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: And so to that point, even when we were talking, like, I'm, I'm having trouble getting away, because yesterday was clean, but today, it's, it's a storm, you know, I mean, that was my life for 2020, 20 years on a, on a contract
• 1:01:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: I rather than 1943, without that is, minus a year.
• 1:01:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: I had a year, I was in between stuff in that period.
• 1:01:18
  [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, man, believe me, I appreciate you.
• 1:01:20
  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm glad that I worked out here as I was supposed to.
• 1:01:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: I know this is going to help some people.
• 1:01:27
  [SPEAKER_02]: If you want to tap in with you, how can you, how can you find you if you want to be found out?
• 1:01:30
  [SPEAKER_02]: Man, uh, the best place to be like Instagram, be go zero four, like Billy goat.
• 1:01:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
• 1:01:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: Be go zero four, and I'm going to put now some more content as far as like on YouTube or stuff like that, but I don't think I'm on the Instagram and stuff like that.
• 1:01:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, just be the grubs on Facebook.
• 1:01:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay.
• 1:01:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:01:47
  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I, you, you, you, you, um, you're in a roller decks now.
• 1:01:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: So we got some panel stuff coming up on before the year ends that I think that you'd be a fit.
• 1:01:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yeah.
• 1:01:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: So, so, so pull up.
• 1:01:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, I'm terrible at this.
• 1:02:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, share the subscribe, post it at the beginning.
• 1:02:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, thank you for the support.
• 1:02:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: The channel is growing on YouTube.
• 1:02:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: If you're here, subscribe just because the fed to you doesn't
• 1:02:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: Confirm with YouTube, the discount and the valuable and that you want to see it again and other people like you want to see it again too, so With that, uh, that's gonna do it for this episode.
• 1:02:27
  [SPEAKER_02]: They're appreciate you guys God bless your peace