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EP 92 Maintaining Healthy Boundaries - Staci, Jenifer, Mardelle · iRefresh Podcast

• 0:00
  Our motives for the boundaries that we set are so important because it's not about pouting and whining and trying to change the other person. It's simply about choosing to follow our peace.
• 0:39
  Ladies, welcome. We are so glad that you are joining us today for another iRefresh episode. And I am here with some very good friends of mine today. My name is Stacey McKee. I'm here with my good friends Jennifer Welch and Mardell Thomas. And we are going to be talking with you and just talking to each other about a topic that is very important to us that has impacted our lives greatly and that has impacted our
• 1:02
  and that we really strongly believe is very beneficial to us. And what is that topic? That topic is boundaries. So this is a huge topic and we understand that. So we really are just going to do our best to touch very lightly over how it applies to our life and how we've used it to benefit us and hope that you guys can get some tips and to take home to apply to your life so that you have boundaries in your life and they will benefit you as well.
• 1:31
  So let's start off with just each one of us maybe defining what boundaries means to us. And I know for me, as I was thinking about this podcast, I was talking with the Lord about it, and he gave me a couple, you know, I was continuing to take notes, and he continued to refine what it was that I defined boundaries as. So I wrote it down, and I'm going to read it so that I don't...
• 1:54
  misread what the Holy Spirit told me it was. He said that for me, a boundary is a choice that I make for myself that protects my inner peace. It keeps my mind in a safe place and it protects me from people, places, and things that would otherwise distract me from living my best life in Christ. So that's how I...
• 2:17
  think when I think of a boundary. So Jennifer, what would you say when you think of the word boundary? What does that mean to you? Well, I have a more, I think a more simplistic kind of explanation of what a boundary is to me. A boundary to me is simply where I end and another person begins or where they end and I begin.
• 2:38
  It's a separation of what I own, whether it's my feelings, emotions, my healing process, my experiences, and what I don't own, which is another person's emotions, responses, feelings, or choices. And so for me, that is, I think, great.
• 3:01
  the simplest way I can explain what a boundary is to me. I love that. I love that. Thank you for sharing that. So, Mardell, what do you think when you hear the word boundary? Well, I think it's important to discuss maybe for a minute what a boundary is not. That would be good. So a boundary can often be mistaken as the idea of getting another person to behave in a way that will then make us feel peaceful or whole or happy and,
• 3:27
  And that's actually not exactly true. Boundaries are way less about other people and more about us. I think of an analogy I got from somebody that I really admire on how they've talked about this subject on YouTube, and that is Julia Christina.
• 3:48
  She's a counselor, and she talks about this yard, that we all have a yard, and a beautiful yard with a gate. We let people in, and it's lovely and everything, but there are circumstances that arise, such as maybe the person wants to use our hose.
• 4:10
  And they use our hose, but then they don't wind it up and put it back. And that is, as we can think of in probably a lot of situations in our lives where we feel somebody has used our hose and not put it back. Sure. Absolutely.
• 4:25
  So anyway, the analogy is then that you make a request. So you first make a request, and that is that you say, oh, I'd really appreciate it if you put my hose back up when you use it. That is the request. A lot of people think that's actually the boundary, and that's actually not the boundary yet. That's a great point.
• 4:46
  So then if it happens again, that is when it's time to set a boundary. And that is about you. What is right for you? For some people, it may not be a big deal to somebody use your hose and not wind it back up and put it back.
• 5:01
  That boundaries are not universal across everyone's, you know, worlds. So that's when you can say, well, you know, it's important to me that the hose be put back. And so I'm going to ask you not to use my hose anymore.
• 5:18
  And that's the boundary. I love that. Simple. Very clear. Thank you for sharing that. So when we were talking about this the other day, you said something very important about the foundation of having a boundaries regarding your identity. Can you talk a little bit about that?
• 5:34
  Well, as my journey with boundaries has progressed and I've tried to understand it better, I realized that I never really was able to set and keep boundaries in my life because I had identity problems. And so for me, it was the journey of finding out who I am in Christ to begin with.
• 5:54
  And once we know who we are, we don't have to apologize to people for saying this is not right for me. And therefore, I'm not trying to change you. But for me, it's, you know, I need my hose put this way at this point in my life. And so, you know, I ask that of them. But there's a real problem, a disconnect and struggle to keep and do boundaries together.
• 6:24
  when our identity does not have a firm foundation and we don't know who we are. I really relate to that, Mardell. I was raised where there was a situation in our family that there was an alcoholic father and there was a lot of muddling of boundaries. So we as a family...
• 6:47
  focused around one person. And so as somebody who didn't really understand who I was in Christ, I was not aware of, you know, boundaries in this way and how to really own that part of myself. So I think that's very important.
• 7:04
  imperative. Yeah, absolutely. I would say for my own life as well. I know when I was having a really hard time and I had no boundaries, I had no respect for myself. And so I allowed people to treat me in a way that dishonored me because I did not see myself as valuable. But the closer I have drawn to the Lord and
• 7:24
  The more that he has showed me what a precious daughter of his that I am, the more I have respect for how I should be treated. And it's easier for me to set those boundaries because I have an understanding that this is who I am. And so I don't allow people to treat me in a way that dishonors who Jesus says I am.
• 7:46
  Absolutely. So I love that girls. So we're going to move on and we are going to talk about how do we use boundaries in our own life? So I'll go ahead and start. And I know that most of what we're going to be talking about today is relational boundaries and boundaries with people, which are very important. So I wanted to really quickly just add a few other areas that I use boundaries in my life that aren't necessarily people related. Yeah.
• 8:12
  And I wrote some things down. I wrote credit cards. I used to have a real problem with shopping and overspending. And I would use credit cards. And I got into a lot of trouble, but without even realizing it. And it caused me a lot of anxiety and it stole my peace.
• 8:30
  And so when I began to walk with the Lord and he began to show me how important peace is in my life, he said, Stacy, this is an area that you need to set a firm boundary so that you aren't anxious about money. And so I got rid of all of my credit cards. And the only card I use is my bank card.
• 8:48
  And I don't ever have to think about it. When I buy something, it's money that I have in the bank. I've already tithed. It's money that I have set aside. And my peace is there. And so I love that's been a boundary that has helped me so well. I have set a boundary with my cell phone. There was a time in my life when I was using my cell phone. I was on it way too much.
• 9:09
  And I wasn't always present with my family and people in places that I was at. And it was really disrespectful to them. And so the Lord showed me and it would cause me anxiety because I could feel the tension. And so the Lord told me, Stacy, you need to set a boundary with your phone. And so I'm not always on my phone. I leave my phone out in the open so that anybody can see what's on my phone in any place or time. So that's been an important boundary in my life, as well as places that I go.
• 9:36
  There are places that in my past have memories that maybe aren't healthy for me. And so I have set a firm boundary not to go to those places so that once again, I keep my peace. I don't get anxious. That's just not a place that I go because that's my past and I'm looking forward to my present. Absolutely. So Jennifer, I'd love to hear about some boundaries that you use in your life.
• 9:57
  Well, for me, I found myself to be a people pleaser. That was something I think that I got from some of my upbringing. As I started understanding boundaries, the first real discovery was really kind of a revelation is that I am not responsible for being a person.
• 10:21
  for another person's actions. And when I had my family with my husband and my children, when somebody would act...
• 10:30
  you know, badly or do something that I would cringe about, you know, sometimes initially I would take on that responsibility. Like it was my responsibility to, you know, control that person or to make sure that that would not happen again. And it was very freeing when I discovered that I was not responsible for another person's actions, that they, you know, take ownership of their own actions,
• 10:59
  So that is one thing that I had to really start practicing in my own journey of boundaries. I love that you said that, Mardell. It is a journey. It is a process. I know for myself, I have definitely not arrived, but I have grown a lot in this area.
• 11:16
  just the understanding that I don't have to fix another person. I don't have to control their behavior, that that is theirs to own. And so that is one way that I'm learning to use those boundaries is just to understand that. And another way is just as far as...
• 11:41
  as a, I'll say a recovering people pleaser, I'm still working on that. But I tended in the past to over agree to doing things, you know, being responsible to do things I would, thinking that that was just something that I needed to do, whatever anybody asked of me, specifically, you know, in my family, and I found myself being over responsible for too many things, and it was really hurting my relationships.
• 12:10
  And so I've found that being more aware of my emotions and what I can handle, what I can't handle, what I'm willing to participate in, and also what I'm not willing to participate in has been a huge help. And I think that those pieces for me really protect relationships. And without those protections on your relationships, you can really destroy
• 12:37
  relationships, I think. So that's one example for myself anyway. I love that. Yeah, I love that. So Mardell, what are some ways that you apply boundaries to your life? Well, I like to tell this story because I feel like it's not that big of a deal and it might be gentler to talk about. You know, there's some really tough stuff out there that we doubt will get to stuff like that on this particular talk. So I tell a simple story.
• 13:04
  from my own life. And that was, um, when my husband and I would get in the car to drive and I would be the driver. Um, there were times when he felt it was, um, um,
• 13:18
  something he wanted to do, and that was to make comments on my driving. Oh, no. Yeah. And I'm sure I'm not the only spouse, you know, situation that had that situation. And, you know, and I think sometimes he was thinking he was being funny. But I came to a place where I was not enjoying that. It was not working for me. And it was making me anxious. And.
• 13:44
  It was something I didn't want to continue. And I had come to a place where I had enough identity in who I really was that I gave myself permission to say, no, I don't really want that. And so if you'll notice, it's everything I didn't want, not about changing him. And I will tell you, it first started with a request that, you know, it stopped and it didn't.
• 14:08
  And so I set a boundary, and that boundary was that when we are in the same car together, I will no longer choose to drive. And if you can see that for what's so great about that scenario is because I didn't ask him to change.
• 14:25
  Yeah. I didn't say you become this different person so that I can feel good about myself. I didn't say negative things to him to get him to behave in a way. I just said this isn't working for me. And so I'm going to be the passenger from now on and you can drive.
• 14:42
  And that is what happened. It was crazy. I mean, like, I haven't driven much. Maybe since that time, and that was probably two years ago, I have probably driven one time since then. And nobody is upset. Like, this isn't a pouty, I'm not driving anymore, you know, stomping my foot kind of moment. Because that's not really effective either. Because that's still about...
• 15:05
  not being secure in who you are. So boundaries can be very reasonable things. And I tell that story because it's not a really painful one for me. Right. And I tell it because it's not difficult to talk about. There are other boundaries that can be very painful, that you feel hurt and you feel things that situations have come up in your life. Sure. So. Sure. Sure.
• 15:34
  I love that story. I think that was an excellent example that really very clearly showcases what a healthy boundary is. And I think what you said, it made me think that our motives for the boundaries that we set are so important because it's not about pouting and whining and trying to change the other person. It's simply about choosing to follow our peace. Yeah.
• 16:00
  You chose not to allow yourself to be subjected to what your husband had to say because it didn't give you peace. Right. And so you simply made a choice. Right. Absolutely. To withdraw yourself from that situation. Right. So I love that. Right. So thank you for sharing that. All right, ladies. So what would you say if one of our listeners asked the question, how do we decide who to set boundaries with?
• 16:27
  So I would say, you know, as we've been talking about, there's lots of levels of boundaries and we can, you know, you can find yourself in a situation where you need to have boundaries with a person that is unsafe. And I would suggest that you not start with that person. I know in my own life, I have a lot of wonderful, amazing women in my life that I consider safe people.
• 16:53
  And that is a really safe place to start practicing boundaries. Because if I mess up, if I do it wrong, you guys are going to not, you're not going to yell at me. You're not going to stop being my friend. You're going to speak the truth and love. And we're all learning. We're not always going to get it right. And that's okay. And so I suggest practicing with people that you know are safe, that is not going to, you
• 17:17
  you know, end to friendship. So what do you guys have to say about that? How would you, how do you decide who to set a boundary with?
• 17:25
  Well, I'll speak to that. I think there's lots of areas in your life that boundaries need to be practiced, including with your kids, with your husband, with friendships, with bosses and coworkers. I love how you talked about being safe, Stacey. I think that is imperative for people.
• 17:50
  the choosing of when and how to set boundaries. I do think practicing with safe people are important, but there are times when people,
• 18:01
  You know, people find themselves in situations that are serious boundaries that need to be set. Maybe there's emotional abuse, verbal abuse going on, certainly physical abuse or other kind. Those types of things I believe need to be only taken under the help of a counselor.
• 18:25
  people who can really help work through how it's going to look, what is said, how, you know, what actions are going to be taken. Right. Because those are, those types of boundary setting really require a lot of courage, an enormous amount of courage. Even small boundary setting, when you're not used to and practicing boundaries, can feel very scary. And it's,
• 18:52
  And even small steps in boundary setting require courage. So even little baby steps, I had a boundary that I needed to set. This was earlier on. I was formally married to a person in the medical field.
• 19:10
  and he would assess my face and say, you know, your face is a little fluffier around, or what, you know, he would talk about allergies, or maybe, you know. And at first, not really knowing how to respond to that, I got, you know, really insecure about my face, and is it, you know, puffy, or what's making it fluffy, or whatever.
• 19:31
  Whatever those things, you know. And I think other women have experienced this, or even men, you know, where people are commenting on their bodies or, you know, something about their looks. And I got to a place where I had decided to ask him not to.
• 19:45
  not to bring up my face again. And so that was, it took a little bit of courage because this is somebody who I deeply cared about. And I wanted him, you know, to be thinking good of me or well of me or thinking I was beautiful or whatever. But I decided to go ahead and kind of make that boundary. And I asked him to never...
• 20:07
  mention my face again. And it was a strong kind of a stance and it was a stern way when I said it. But I asked him to never comment about my face again. And even if his intentions were good,
• 20:23
  And I'll just, you know, I'll give the benefit of the doubt that sometimes those intentions are not meant for ill will or harm. But if as you as a person are receiving in that way, then I think it's important to make that step and take a boundary, you know, take the step to make a boundary. And I did that. And, you know, my face was not mentioned anymore after that. You know, only in good ways. Yes. Yes.
• 20:49
  So, Mardell, what about you? So what I think about is, I'm sorry, can you repeat the question? How do we decide who to set boundaries with?
• 21:07
  Okay, so I think for me the question might be more like, how do you know you need to set a boundary? Like what in your life is giving you clues that you might want to get curious and think about setting a boundary? Sure. Okay, so when you are anxious,
• 21:27
  when you feel lack of peace, when you find yourself complaining about a person or a situation over and over and over again, it can be a sign that you need to set a boundary. Because complaining about something doesn't fix anything, right? It's just you unloading your uncomfortable feelings that you have, right? So,
• 21:55
  That's a sign that you might want to get curious and dialogue with somebody about what am I feeling? Why am I feeling this?
• 22:01
  What do I want from this situation? With the knowledge about boundaries that we are not about, this is not about fixing another person. People are going to do what they are going to do. And many of them feel what they're doing is fine, perfectly fine. Right. And they are welcome to assume that. But for you, it might not be fine. And so we're not going to fix other people. We are going to do what we need to do for our own peace.
• 22:29
  But it's a difficult thing because Jennifer brought it up before. Myself, I'll speak about myself. I had problems with people pleasing also. I wanted people to like me. And sometimes setting a boundary means you have to say, I'm really not going to do that. Or I'm not really going to accept that. You are welcome to do what you're going to do. But this is what I'm going to do. Right. Right.
• 22:54
  If that's what you want to do, then this is what I'm going to do. And that's how it's even said. It's said in a way that isn't judging them or shaming them or anything like that. It's just you need to do what you need to do for your own personal peace.
• 23:09
  And we need to have an understanding that sometimes when we set those boundaries, it's not going to be, you know, a pleasant experience. There are going to be times when the other person doesn't respond in a way because we can't control how the other person responds. And so that's why what you were talking about, you know, maybe talking to a counselor first or, you know, writing it down before you have that conversation with the person. Right.
• 23:32
  talking to some safe friends about it just to make sure that... Can I speak to that for a minute? So one of the things I have done with friends is we've role-played the very thing you want to do, you know, the conversation you want to have. Sure, great idea. And because, and we, I remember doing this with somebody, and we did it over and over again because we would say things that we didn't really quite mean to say in a certain way. And that's what I mean about that we're practicing the art of boundaries. It is an art, and it does take a lot of things.
• 24:02
  It does take practice. It does. So if you find a safe frame where you can let that person be who you want to set the boundary with, you can practice and do it over and over again. Because it is not easy. Right. And you are absolutely right. It can be very uncomfortable. Very uncomfortable. I love that. Yeah. So about the question deciding who to set boundaries with, I think you had a great story to share about the laundry process.
• 24:31
  I love that story. Oh, yeah. That is a good story because it's not about me. I'm just kidding. This story came up in my memory when I was when you asked us to come on this podcast. And I'm like, OK, what do I know? Right. And what do I talk about? It's scary to talk about your own personal life. But anyway, I remember this story and it's a great one. And I had a friend who we were we were in our 30s and married and children and.
• 24:56
  she would tell me and complain about her husband leaving laundry all over the floor. And, you know, this is one of those things where many women are shaking their head going, yes, yes. You know, of course, they are the ones with all the bad habits, right? Right. I'm just kidding. So she had asked him not to, and he just kept doing it. And she's telling me about it, and I'm, like, listening, and I'm like, okay, all right. So she.
• 25:25
  What are some of your choices here? Since it's not something you enjoy or like, this behavior.
• 25:33
  And keeping in mind, it's not about changing them. Right. They may be perfectly fine with leaving dirty laundry all over. That is them. Right. So the idea that we talked about was after making their request and it's not met, the boundary would be, well, you are welcome to throw your clothes on the floor, but I'm only going to wash clothes that are in the hamper.
• 25:56
  And you do you and I'll do me, but that's something that's important to me. Right. And I'm not asking you to change. When I walk in, if it's on the floor, I'll just kick it out of the way of my foot. Just kick it out of the way and go on and peace immediately can come in. And we had that dialogue. And I cannot remember what she ended up doing. But I thought it was a great solution for her to do.
• 26:21
  follow the guidelines of boundaries. Right. So I love this story you're telling. I also knew a couple who had some similar issues, and they discussed it, you know, the husband and wife, and they came to a solution also where he needed space to be free to be messy. Oh, sure. So they came up with an area of the house. I don't know if it was a closet or a room.
• 26:50
  That was just his, where he could be messy and not feel like he was having to, like, not, you know, be who he was either. But there was a respect with, you know, what she needed, some order, and she, you know, and she's the one doing the laundry. And he also needed the freedom to, you know, have a place where he could really just, you know...
• 27:15
  have things thrown as he, you know, as he pleased. No coaster. Without judgment. No coaster. It is home. Right. So there was a mutual kind of understanding, which is, this is what I love about boundaries. Yes. Yes. Is as you practice boundaries with people who are important in your life, and these are usually who you're practicing boundaries with, people who you love or who you are in a relationship of some kind. Yes.
• 27:44
  it really creates a scenario where there's a deeper understanding of another person and respect. It allows respect to stand where it needs to stand.
• 27:57
  I have a scripture that I would like to kind of read. It's one of my favorite scriptures, and it reminds me of boundaries. It's John 10, 17, and 18. And it says, this is why the Father loves me, because I lay down my life so that I may take it back again. No one takes it from me.
• 28:18
  But I lay it down of my own free will. I have the authority to lay it down, and I have the authority to take it back again, this commandment I received from my Father. And it reminds me of boundaries because we can give of ourselves. We can choose to give ourselves.
• 28:36
  and do for others and serve. But we can also, you know, without being taken from us, but we can also choose to back up and say, I'm taking the, you know, I'm stepping back now. Right. And it's an ebb and flow, which I think that's what God calls us to.
• 28:53
  I love that. And I love that story that you shared, too, because I just feel like that is a great example, showing that we're not the only people that have boundaries. So, you know, in our home, you know, there could be several people that practice boundaries. And so we have an opportunity not only to set boundaries, but to honor other people's boundaries. And I have no doubt that this couple in their home where he had the messy room was,
• 29:17
  You know, that probably brought them even closer together because they both had perfect peace. They both got what they want in that situation because they respected each other's boundaries. So I love that example. And let me just say that I know for me in my life, I have had times where I have set a boundary and then the situation has come up.
• 29:39
  And I've not followed through on the boundary. I got scared or I just wasn't quite ready or for whatever reason, I did not follow the boundary that I had set for myself. So I would say that when that happens, I didn't really set a boundary that I had made a suggestion. Do you guys have any comments on that? I mean, don't you think that's prevalent? Yeah.
• 30:00
  So I guess what I would say to that is that that is very common. And when you're learning to set boundaries, you have to find out what a boundary is, what it's not, how do you set it, how do you follow through, how do you keep strong boundaries, and this becomes a moment where you need to get curious, you know, and reflect. What, did I really set a boundary? Did, or did I, did I make a kind of a suggestion, you know?
• 30:28
  That's something that takes some practice and thought and really speaks to a lot of things we've talked about already, about what it is and what it isn't. Sure. So, I mean, I think back to parenting, you know, setting boundaries. If you told your kid, you know, you're not allowed to touch that and they touch that, then the boundary is, you know, you will no longer be able to have that.
• 30:54
  Right. You know, kind of situation. So boundaries are all over the place. I think on that note, I think it's important also to continually being in a place of love when you're setting a boundary with somebody. You're not doing it out of a threat or out of anger. Like, if you don't do this, I'm going to do that. And it's a threat, you know. That's not a boundary. It's not a boundary. You know, it takes...
• 31:24
  an attitude and a heart posture of love for another person and for yourself. It's loving others and loving yourself and requiring from another person that they also treat in this manner, you know, of kindness toward another person and towards you and you toward them. So I think also as somebody is...
• 31:48
  as you are setting a boundary with another person, you can sometimes expect some pushback and maybe some all-out anger and some fierce backlash. And so I think it's also important to have an attitude of forgiveness, even though you're having to be firm in whatever it is that you're setting the boundary in. You have to be firm as you're even...
• 32:15
  following through with some consequences or the things that you've set up, but doing it in a heart, an attitude of love and continually forgiving so that the relationship is held as precious, not as something that's going to be tossed away if they don't comply, you know, but something, um, I just think, I think that's, uh, for me, an important aspect of it.
• 32:37
  I love that. That is so beautiful. Yeah. So ladies, like I said here in the beginning, that this is such a huge subject and we really have barely just scratched the surface. So we'd love to hear your thoughts. If this is something that you are interested in, maybe we could come back at a later time and go a little bit deeper into this topic. But I think for today that wraps up our time. So are there any closing thoughts or anything that you guys have?
• 33:02
  Didn't get a chance to say about boundaries? I mean, I could talk about this for hours. But no, I think we've done some good stuff. Had some good discussion about it. Absolutely. Ladies, we're so glad you joined us today. We'd love to hear your thoughts on boundaries. It is our hope and desire that you will find healthy boundaries for your own life so that you will have an understanding of your value and your worth in Christ. So stay tuned for another great episode at iRefresh.net.