Latest / Espresso Briefings by BusinessEurope / Looking back, looking ahead: Fredrik Persson reflects on four years as our President

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Looking back, looking ahead: Fredrik Persson reflects on four years as our President · Espresso Briefings by BusinessEurope

• 0:03
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to Espresso Briefings by Business Europe.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_00: Timely insights and expert perspectives served in short, sharp episodes to fuel your thinking.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_00: Hello and welcome to this special episode of Espresso Briefings.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_00: My name is Alan Sherlock.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_00: I'm manager of strategic engagement at IBEC.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_00: Next week, Frederick Pearson steps down as president of Business Europe, concluding a defining four-year tenure, leading 25 million enterprises through a pandemic, an energy crisis, and massive geopolitical shifts.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_00: He joins us today to reflect on his presidency and what lies ahead for European business.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_00: Frederick, a very warm welcome to this special episode.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_00: Delighted to have you here.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you, Alan.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_00: Frederick, as I said, next week you stepped down, ending that four-year tenure as president of Business Europe and being that spokesperson for 25 million European companies.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_00: Before you went into the job, what were your expectations and what did it actually turn out to be?
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_02: That is such a good starting question.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_02: I I honestly think that I came with the experience from being the president of the Swedish Federation and I'd attended numerous Business Europe events.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, I think I thought I had a view of the work, but but honestly, it turned out to be so much broader and wider.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_02: And I didn't expect Brussels to have such a defining influence on the national scene.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_02: So I think that is sort of a general reflection.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_02: We always stay in our bubble, and I honestly was a bit in my Stockholm bubble.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_00: I think I had a similar experience myself.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_00: I spent six months in Brussels, having been in IBEC and in the Irish institutions for a very long time.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I think it's only once you get in amongst the work of Business Europe that you truly appreciate the depth of the impact.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: It truly has been an extraordinary period.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_00: During your tenure, we've seen a pandemic, who forget that, the Russian war in Ukraine, an energy crisis, and now this fracturing transatlantic relationship.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_00: What does this turbulence tell us about what Europe actually needs right now?
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_02: I think Europe was coming out of a situation where Europe felt that we're in control, we're in a good place, uh, we're in the lead.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_02: But quite honestly, that was not the case.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_02: And that was not something that had happened in the last four years or five years.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_02: That had been a continuous process in the last decade.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_02: Europe has been falling behind in terms of growth.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_02: And growth is really the key here.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_02: Because if you don't outperform on growth, all and every ambition will be academic.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't matter what goal you set on the digital transition or the green transition, you will be falling behind.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_02: So I think that was sort of the awakening call for Europe, and that came through the Russian war in Ukraine, which hit Europe in an asymmetric way.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_02: In a sense, with the pandemic, the weaknesses were covered up because the pandemic struck all across the globe.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_02: But here suddenly we had something that hit Europe specifically, and that put into the spotlight the weakness of Europe.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_02: And that comes to my sort of key learning in these four years.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_02: Europe needs to focus on what we can achieve on our own.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_02: The rest we can adapt to.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_02: We cannot complain about it, we cannot use it as an excuse, but to get our own house into order.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: To pick up on something and a little bit kind of off script for a moment, but the pandemic, I think we saw an awful lot of businesses doing exceptional things.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um during that time, what are your kind of observations in terms of some of the really interesting things that were achieved at a national level with influence from business Europe during that time of the pandemic?
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_02: I think you can actually start on on the European level because it really pulled Europe together.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_02: And there were some extraordinary work done by the Commission, uh, by the Council, and by the Parliament.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_02: Because then we showed that we can actually prioritize speed.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_02: When the EU wants to move fast, it it can.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_02: But it moves so seldomly fast.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_02: So I think that was the key takeaway from it.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_02: When you're in a tough situation, that builds a stronger Europe.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_02: But as soon as that pressure goes away, we're back in the old uh tracks again.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_02: So I I would like to see sort of the urgency that the pandemic created, and honestly, the urgency that the Russian war in Ukraine created in the beginning, that urgency needs to be translated into the the economy and sort of the key question to getting growth back to Europe because that is what can protect our European values, that is what will create innovation and build a Europe for the future for the coming generations.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_02: And and honestly, uh with this now upcoming Irish presidency, that will set the tone in terms of competitiveness for generations to come.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_00: So it's an interesting point, though, isn't it, though, that essentially the the crises that Europe is presented with shows where the capability is.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_00: And the frustration from a business Europe point of view is well, why can we not just always show up like this?
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um with an interesting point.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_00: So this is something that I was unaware of today, on until today, but apparently earlier in your presidency, you were known as the Reaper for warning that Europe was falling behind as a place to invest.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_00: And then three years later, Mario Draghi published a 400-paid report saying essentially the same thing.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_00: So you're in ahead of that Draghi report.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_00: What has changed since then?
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: And do you believe that the bold ideas can actually move European policy?
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_02: Coming out of industry and business, and uh before becoming a business leader, I worked as a CFO.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_02: I'm a bit of a numbers guy.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_02: So I I thought, okay, let's bring the facts to the table.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_02: And that's what I spent my first uh six to twelve months doing.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_02: And uh, because of course when you when you spoke to commissioners and and they were saying business is always you're you're never content, you're always disappointed, you're just complaining and you're painting a grim picture.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_02: This is not the case, Europe is doing really well.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_02: And I said, okay, let's look at the numbers.
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_02: You are saying that investments are flowing into Europe.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_02: That is not the case, they're flowing into the US.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_02: And I guess that I I laughed when you said the Reaper, and that's what was whispered behind my back - sort of the bearer of incorrect uh bad news.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_02: But I in Business Europe just kept on pushing for the facts.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_02: This is the case.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_02: We're falling behind, and it's not uh caused by the current commission.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_02: This has been been going on for decades, and uh finally, and I think uh that that message it came across.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_02: And we also had a sort of a switch and turned into von der Leyen 2.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_02: And I think something changed there.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_02: And and I think uh the president uh uh acknowledged that okay, I I I hear you.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_02: We we need to get growth back, and the growth will back the ambitions we have on on the green transition and the digital transition and on the geopolitical transition, because of course that happened with the Russian uh war in in Ukraine, so we were adding uh a third third transition.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's difficult to be in that position, I suppose, sometimes delivering kind of the the bad yet kind of honest news.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_00: But nonetheless, I think that kind of furthers the opportunity for business Europe to be that kind of valued stakeholder to the Commission and to the Parliament and somebody that actually delivers kind of real insights.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_00: So, as difficult as it is, it actually reaps benefit, I'm sure, for the association.
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_02: But basically, I I always said we're the voice of 25 million companies.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_02: We know what's happening on the ground from Greece to Portugal to Finland to Ireland.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_02: We will tell you the picture we see, we will tell you what these companies are experiencing on the ground.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_02: We have solutions, how to change that.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_02: And we can always disagree which one is the best one.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_02: But you can never challenge the fact that we know we're bringing the facts to the table, and I think that's that's the trustworthiness and credibility of business Europe.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_02: We always bring the facts to the table.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_02: Then again, we can interpret it in different ways, but you can never challenge us on the picture.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_02: So the reaper was more the bearer of some tough and harsh news.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_02: And then again, honestly, the the true reaper became then uh Mario Draghi.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_00: So he he took he outpaced me big time, so to to look back on it, I suppose, in terms of your own experience, your own um the opportunity, I suppose, that that this is presented.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_00: Did you go into this uh tenure with a motto kind of for your presidency of four years?
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_00: Was there anything in particular that you had in mind?
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I I think you're alluding to uh uh uh unity and urgency.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_02: And that goes, of course, within the business Europe family, but also within within Europe.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_02: Uh Europe will be stronger when we're united as 27 countries.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_02: And I think being on the outside, uh the ones have left have have shown that that is not a good proposition.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_02: But it's also super important, of course, that um business Europe speaks with one voice.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_02: Probably the most common question I always got isn't it hard to reach an agreement uh with uh 42 member federations?
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_02: Uh it must be a nightmare.
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_02: Honestly, it's not.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_02: It can be a tad bit tricky, but I mean business is much more tricky, to be honest.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_02: And and it is the same challenge you have on a national level as well.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_02: But knowing that when we reach that common voice, uh it carries such clout in the discussions with the Commission.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, because we're not sectorial, we're not just representing the large companies, we're not just representing the the SMEs.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_02: We can hand on heart tell the commissions 25 million companies.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_02: It it it is a super strong voice, and also coming as one voice.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_02: They listen.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_02: They listen and they listen hard.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_02: So getting that unity, and then again as a business person.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_02: My god, things are always too slow.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_02: Uh uh so usually frustrated about that.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_02: We need to move faster, and the slowest day was probably today, or it was today.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_02: We need to pick up the pace.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_02: Why?
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_02: Because the pace we're seeing in the US, but also in in Asia, I mean they're running fast, and we need to get moving faster.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_02: And not doing things is a decision as well, and that's probably the worst decisions of all.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_02: So that I cannot sort of press hard enough.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_02: Urgency, urgency, urgency.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_02: And and urgency in itself, and and and I've sort of moved the you from unity to urgency into solidarity and speed.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_02: Um, because unity is something you create, solidarity is is is something you you live with, but but speed is in the execution.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_02: So now we need to move from urgency to to speed.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_02: Urgency about is about being aware, but I would sort of rephrase them now when I leave as solidarity and speed.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_02: That is what will get things uh done.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_00: And they need to get done now.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think like the certainly the time that I spent around the institutions, that that sense of kind of frustration from the business community in relation to the speed of change um was certainly palpable.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_00: But I do think, and I'm I'm perhaps an easy audience, but progress has been made in that regard.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_00: We are seeing kind of some progress on important files for business.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_00: There is a some more urgency, but perhaps not as much as we we might like to see.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um so that's interesting to see that that your motto over the time has has kind of evolved in that way.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_00: So to wrap up, I suppose, Frederick, um the benefit of hindsight is is a wonderful thing.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_00: And after four years at the center of European business policy, is there anything that you wish you knew then that you know now?
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_02: For first, uh I I'm I'm I'm happy I didn't know that it was um that um that that that the speed was lacking because then I would have been hugely frustrated at the start as a business person.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_02: No, I I I think it it is about being concrete.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_02: I think uh we have to call out the same standard on us as we do on the Commission and the Parliament.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_02: So so business needs to be more concrete.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_02: The time of sweeping comments like we need more competitiveness or we need lower energy prices, that doesn't help anyone.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_02: It just creates frustration.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_02: So from the business side, we need to be concrete and we also need to to do balance.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_02: I agree, and this is sort of good enough.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_02: Uh the last comma doesn't matter.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_02: So concreteness and and uh and being being faster because what has changed is when when I now sit in meeting, I sort of get the blank piece of paper pushed across the table.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_02: Because I also think there is a frustration among uh European leaders that help us, how can we do this?
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_02: Because it's tricky questions.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_02: It's like how do we lower energy prices?
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_02: How how do we open up new markets?
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_02: So I I think it's about a about a partnership and realizing that it's a give, it's a give and get, and setting sort of reasonable standards on on that because at the end of the day we have the same ambition and and goal, and that is uh a prosperous, secure, and flourishing Europe.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_02: Europe is a great place to do business, and that we want other countries to realize and to invest in in Europe, and we want companies to to stay within Europe because in the same way it's called business Europe.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_02: I hate when uh companies leave Europe in the same way that the Commission does it.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_02: So I think uh that for me is is really the essence of it uh all.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_02: So solidarity and and speed, get your things together and and and just pick up on the pace.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_00: Solidarity and speed, a really strong message to leave behind your uh presidency of business Europe.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_00: Frederick, it's been an absolute pleasure to help you reflect on the past four years and the impact that you've had um for those 25 million enterprises that you have represented at the highest levels in Europe and and indeed outside of Europe.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: For our listeners, if you've enjoyed this episode of Espresso Briefings, don't forget to subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_00: We'll be back very soon with more insights on the developments shaping European business.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks for listening and see you next time.