Latest / 360 with Katie Woolf / NT Senator Jacinta Price says the Defence Force may need to be brought in to help address crime in Alice Springs

Transcript

NT Senator Jacinta Price says the Defence Force may need to be brought in to help address crime in Alice Springs · 360 with Katie Woolf

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Because we know the federal government is preparing to scrap
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: the cashless debit card. Now it is a compulsory income
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: management tool and the scheme quarantines eighty percent of people's
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: welfare pay onto the card, which can't be used then
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: for alcohol, gambling or cash withdrawals. So as I understand it,
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: there are more than seventeen thousand people in the territory
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: WA Queensland, South Australia as well that use the card.
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: But once it's gone, Labour says that income management is
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: going to be made voluntary everywhere except the Northern Territory
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: and parts of far North Queensland. Now, the colp's Senator
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: for the Northern Territory, Just Center Price, has spoken out
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: in favor of the cards during parliamentary debate yesterday and
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: she joins me on the line right now, good morning
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: to you, Just Center.
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: Good morning, Katie, thanks so much.
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: For your time. Firstly, how do these cashless debit cards
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: work from your perspective.
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: So in the Northern Territory, the cashist of a card
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: about four thousand people have opted to go on to
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: the cash list debit card in the Northern Territory. A
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: transfer over from the Basics Card in the Northern Territory,
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: fifty percent of your welfare payments are quarantined, so it
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: is only available in on sorry, through the card and
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: cannot be spent on alcohol gambling and yeah, alcohol and
• 1:26
  Speaker 2: gambling as well as you know, obviously can't be utilized
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: to purchase drugs with because it's not available as cash.
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: The other fifty percent is available in cash and it
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: provides an opportunitytunity for vulnerable people, you know, particularly Indigenous
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: welfare recipients, to be able to say no to family
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: when when they're humbugged from family members who are dealing
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: with alcohol addictions, to be able to say no to
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: them that they only got money less on their Basic
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: their cuts debit card. So the problem, however, is this
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: government is choosing to maintain the Basics Card, which is
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: an inferior technology to the casual Serbit card. The Cash
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: and Server card came about because they needed to be
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: improvements on the Basics Card and because it was claimed
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: there was stigma attached to the Basic cards, which easily identifiable.
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: So we don't understand why it is the government is
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: doing this where they're maintaining the inferior technology that can't
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: be used outside of the Northern Territory, and removing the
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: casual Serbit card, which many vulner vulnerable people have said
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: has improved their lives.
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: So what do you see as the benefits to the card.
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: So the many benefits that we've heard from from recipients
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: is that they're able to manage their money a lot better.
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: They can pay their bills on time, They have money
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: left over at the end of you know, the their wealth,
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: their pay cycle to be able to purchase extra things.
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: There are schemes set up so that people can save
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: that money little by little and purchase larger goods like
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: white goods for their homes. So it's been able to
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: support them in ways that otherwise just having a flow
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: of cash goes straight out out of their accounts doesn't
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: leave them with money that that meets them, you know,
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: to the next payday. That offers them the opportunity to
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: put away and save, to quarantine and save to purchase
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: those those larger goods, those white goods for their homes.
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: And as I said, the benefit of being able to
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: say no to addicted family members who are as you know,
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: the cultural obligation when your family demands something of you.
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: They can demand the shirt of you're back and you
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: have to you are obliged to say yes and hand
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: that over. It is considered, you know, disrespectful to say
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: no to your family. So it alleviates some of that
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: cultural pressure from family members.
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: So what do you reckon is going to happen or
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: what do you expect will happen if and when this
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: cash list debit card becomes voluntary.
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: Well, there are a number of concerns that if it's
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: made voluntary, then vulnerable people will be pressured to not
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: volunteer to go on it by family members who will
• 4:38
  Speaker 2: no doubt be aware that it's become a voluntary measure,
• 4:41
  Speaker 2: and so that creates more pressure on them to hand
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: over their income to those family members. And not only this,
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: but it appears to be an admission by this government
• 4:56
  Speaker 2: the fact that if they're removing the casuist debit card,
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: they're investing million dollars into drug and alcohol services, that
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: by removing that measure, that card, that things are going
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: to get a hell of a lot worse as a result.
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: But it's very vague what they're proposing at the same time,
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: because while they're saying they're abolishing the cashist debit card.
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: There are now talks of a new card with better technology,
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: which to me sounds as if all they're doing is
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: perhaps improving the cash a debit card and actually bringing
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: it back. But it is so vague to understand what
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: this government is actually doing. They don't seem to have
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: a plan. They seem to be just making things up
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: as they go along. And initially they had called it
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: a racist measure, but they're only they're removing it from
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: the rest of the country but leaving it in the
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: northern territory. And they say now Cape York, where you
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: have a very high population of Indigenous Australians, which is
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: quite hypocritical to what they were originally saying.
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it just seems so confusing to me. And I
• 6:01
  Speaker 1: guess that, you know, even for people listening this morning,
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: they'll be thinking to themselves, you know, they can't even
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: like they're not even sure sort of what the difference
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: is between the Basics card and the cash list debit card.
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: But then also you know, wondering if, like what you've said,
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: if if you know, for cultural reasons, if we're going
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: to have a situation where people are you know, having
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: to give up their money rather than spend it on
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: on their food, their children and their necessities.
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: Exactly. And you know, a lot of the argument we're
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: hearing from the Greens and from the government is that,
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: you know, this is a stigmatizing card and it makes
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: people feel terrible, but none of them mention the impact
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: of children. But the most important element of this card
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: the very reason why, and it was a grass through
• 6:46
  Speaker 2: its initiative in the very first place, developed by communities
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: in the Kimberley because it was called on by those
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: community members for a measure to curb alcohol spending on
• 6:58
  Speaker 2: alcohol and drugs and gambling. And the very fact that,
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: of course in a lot of those communities there are
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: the highest rates from the nation's highest rates of child
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: sexual abuse, and we know that alcohol is a contributing, huge,
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: contributing factor to those rates of child sexual abuse. And
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: this government can completely ignores this. I mean, we heard
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: from Senator Mullenderry who was complaining about the fact that
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: the intervention took place while she was in government and
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: the territory at the time. But Sales also mentioned that
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: it was her government at the time who held onto
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: and sat on the little children are Sacred Report, which
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: is the report telling us about those astronomical rates of
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: child sexual abuse in our communities and which was the
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: trigger for that federal intervention. So, you know, likening this
• 7:50
  Speaker 2: who taking away people's rights to be able to spend
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: their money, is actually disregarding the human rights of children
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: to be fed, to live, live free from alcohol related
• 8:01
  Speaker 2: sexual abuse, alcohol related violence, and all those things that
• 8:06
  Speaker 2: too this is supposed to support.
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: Well, I'll tell you what. It does sound like there's
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: going to be a lot more discussion in this place
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: just sin. Have we any idea sort of you know
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: when this is going to all change or you know
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: when's this new measure going to be implemented.
• 8:21
  Speaker 2: Well, the legislation comes to an end this Friday. Right
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: to be honest, I have no idea what this government
• 8:30
  Speaker 2: is proposing in terms of a transition off the card.
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: I know that there are a lot of people who
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: have those saving schemes in place, with income management measures
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: in place, and it just seems as though it's another
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: one of those policies where the rug is going to
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: be ripped out from underneath these people who who have
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: been on it, you know, on income management since two
• 8:58
  Speaker 2: thousand and seven. So you can't simply do that. We
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: can't make a change like this, such a rapid change
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: to people who are used to a system that has
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: been there for such a long period of time without
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: having the right frameworks in place before those changes come
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: into effects. I mean, we saw it with the listing
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: of the alcohol ban in the territory and now we're
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: experiencing the immediate impacts.
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: Of those Jasindra, I do want to move along, and
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: I want to actually ask you about something that we
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: spoke to Tourism Central Australia's Daniel Rochford about a little
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: bit earlier this morning. Now, I think you'd have to
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: say they've taken a pretty unprecedented step of basically moving
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: this motion urging the Northern Territory Government to take immediate
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: action to enforce law and daughter in Ourae Springs, saying
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: that crime is reaching crisis levels now. It follows a
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: shocking incident which saw a visitor browsing the local information
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  Speaker 1: center allegedly hit with the coward's punch by an offender
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: without any pre med citation. I mean it's something you
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: and I've spoken about before. The crime in Central Australia
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: but just how bad are things at the moment.
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: Oh, it feels unprecedented the level of crime that's taking
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: place in Central Australia. In Central Australia, we feel largely
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: neglected by the territory government. We know that our police
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: force feel like their hands are tied behind their back,
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: that they're utterly under the pump and can't chant seem
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: to keep up with the number of incidents that are
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: taking place. I mean, I'm sort of surprised that the
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: industry it's take them this long for the industry to
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: stand up, and I would urge the many industries, the
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: retail industry, the tourism industry, everybody should come together to
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: stand up, be heard, tell this government that they need
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: to pull their finger out. And of course, as the
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: Senator of the Northern Territory, I'm happy to support in
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: whatever way i can. I'm happy to bring it to
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: the flaw of the Senate their voices. I'm in the
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: midst of drafting a bill that would put a handbrake
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: on the flow of alcohol back out into these communities
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: until such time as a responsible Territory government puts the
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: appropriate consultation and framework in place to deal effectively with alcohol.
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: But you're right, much more needs to be done. We've
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: got a proposal from Yiparinia School to build a student
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: and staff accommodation that would actually speak to the fact
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: that some of those kids in the street are Ypperingia students.
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: If they had a safe bed to go and sleep
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: in at night time, with responsible adults to support them
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: in an educational setting, then that is a measure toward
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: curbing some of the some of the issues that we're
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: currently faced with. And the principal, Gavin Morris, has stood
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: up this week to urge the federal government to commit
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: to the commitment that I made of eight point three
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: million to be able to build that facility. So there
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: are gradual measures that can be taken in different Well, look, we.
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: Might see if we're able to get your Brina on
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: to have a bit of a chat to us about it.
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: But yeah, look, you know, I guess it's a tough
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: one as well where you sort of go. Even with
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: the Tourism Body and the Peak Tourism Body for Central
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: Australia coming out and saying that crimes at crisis levels,
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: you know there will be some people listening that think
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: to themselves. Oh, that is going to have a huge
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: impact on tourism. But the fact is crime's having a
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: huge impact on tourism and on locals right now.
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: It is an impact for some time now, and it
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: seems to be ramped up, and you know, we're looking at,
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: of course, as I mentioned, the immediate impacts of alcohol
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: availability again in a lot of those communities, and people
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: coming in and swarming the place to get their purchase
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: of alcohol, bring their kids in with them. We're seeing
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: the immediate impacts of that. We're seeing the transition into
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: the warmer weather as well, which usually there is a
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: spike around that time and around winter clime it usually
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: dies down. But we've not seen much of a die
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: down over the winter period, so that spike we're just
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: seeing the beginning of it now and if the government
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: doesn't step up, it's going to get worse. And you know,
• 13:41
  Speaker 2: I have to wonder at some point there's a community
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: call for you know, is it ADF that has to
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: step in, What is it the support that our police
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: need going forward?
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: So you reckon that it could be a point where
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: you literally could be at the point where the army
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: needs to be called in.
• 14:06
  Speaker 2: Well, that's exactly what it feels like, and you know,
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: and then you'll get the voices of people jump up
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: and down and say, oh, this is another intervention. However,
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: something drastic needs to happen because nothing is budging, nothing
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: is changing except for the fact that crime is increasing.
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: These are the things that we have to look at.
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: These are the things that we're being pushed into. We've
• 14:30
  Speaker 2: been pushed into a corner and now have to consider.
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: Well, just Enterprice, the COLP Senator for the Northern Territory.
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: We always appreciate your time. Thank you very much for
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: having a chat with us today.
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: Thank you very much for having me Katie.
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: Thank you