Latest / The Dr. Sarah Hensley Show / Episode 5, Season 1: Living in Victimhood

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Episode 5, Season 1: Living in Victimhood · The Dr. Sarah Hensley Show

• 0:08
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Love Doc podcast. I'm your co host
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: Raina Butcher here with your host, doctor Sarah Hinsley, the
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: owner and CEO of The Dating Decoder. Hi, Doctor Hensley. Hi,
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: all right, Doctor Hensley. So today episode five, Yes, we're
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: going to talk about something that again may or may
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: not be controversial, but we've already decided that we're here
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: because we want to be authentic, authentic, we want to
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: be our true selves. And the people who are here
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: for it will show up and the people who are
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: offended by it will go bye bye.
• 0:46
  Speaker 2: And haters drive traffic. So whatever, that's right, and haters
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: don't bother me.
• 0:49
  Speaker 3: That's right.
• 0:50
  Speaker 4: I know, And again I'm working on that.
• 0:54
  Speaker 3: You're like, they do a little bit.
• 0:55
  Speaker 4: I really I really like to be liked.
• 0:58
  Speaker 3: I've toltally.
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: You know what the crazy thing is, I have zero
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: fs to give about being like I know, like I
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: really it's gone.
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: I know from me, I know, and I'm sort of
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: envious of it. But at the same time, like I
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: I want to keep This isn't the subject of this episode,
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: but there's this part of me that I want to keep.
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: Part of it, I want to keep, part of wanting
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: to be liked because it's part of who I am.
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: So but that's not what this episode is about. This
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: episode I.
• 1:25
  Speaker 3: Really want to ask why, But well we shall move on.
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, and you know you can coach me later
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: on that this episode is specifically about victimization. It is
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: living in victimhood, staying in victimhood, and how that really
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: really inhibits you from reaching your attachment security. Absolutely, so
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: we can. There's so many directions this could go in.
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: We both have, of course, tons of personal experience from
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: our own victimhood and the victimhood of our parents. Yep.
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: But specifically within your practice, what do you usually see
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: within the dynamic of partnerships when one partner is maybe
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: living in their victimization.
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so it's, you know, all my partner's fault. Our
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: relationship sucks because they're awful. I contribute nothing bad, I'm
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: perfect and they're the problem, and I'm just the victim
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: of their crappy behavior.
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and really just no self reflection, none and none.
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: And when we talk about victimhood is complex, and that's
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: why I said it can go in so many different
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: directions because a lot of times people don't realize they're
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: living there.
• 2:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's the super glue to hell.
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: Doctor Henry Wright, who is a pastor and founded be
• 2:59
  Speaker 2: In Health Ministries, which was a ministry that changed my
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: life profoundly. A famous quote from him is like victimhood
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: and self pity is the super glue to hell. If
• 3:08
  Speaker 2: you want to stay stuck in hell, just be a victim.
• 3:13
  Speaker 2: And I don't want to offend people who have been
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: through trauma because I have had some trauma, sure, and
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: there's a time and a place to be a victim,
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: but you can't live there because you can't grow and
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: you can't move forward. And we've studied, for example, why
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: people can somehow experience trauma and move into what we
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: call post traumatic growth, where they integrate that trauma into
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: their nervous system in a way that allows them to
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: actually become more resilient over time and stronger. And then
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: the people that developed post traumatic stress disorder and complex
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: post traumatic stress disorder, where they are able to integrate
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: the trauma into the nervous system in a way that
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: promotes well being and functioning and growth, but instead inhibits
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: their growth and development and keeps them stuck in pathologies
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: of anxiety and depression and you know.
• 4:19
  Speaker 4: So what is that science? Do you know it?
• 4:22
  Speaker 3: Yeah? Absolutely, I think that.
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  Speaker 2: There's a huge component of how we both search for
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: meaning of what happened to us and how we solve
• 4:38
  Speaker 2: for solutions. Actually did my master's thesis partially on this topic.
• 4:44
  Speaker 2: So when we experience you definitely know, ok. Yeah, So
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  Speaker 2: I know from personal experience of being a trauma survivor
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  Speaker 2: and I've had some serious trauma. Yeah, there are times
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: when we spend our time after trauma searching for a meaning.
• 5:01
  Speaker 3: Why did this happen to me? What does this mean?
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  Speaker 3: You know? Why me?
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: What?
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  Speaker 3: You know?
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  Speaker 2: What could I have done differently? And there's a lot
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: of like these hypothetical elements. It's very abstract, it's very
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: you know, there's no definite answer right to that question,
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  Speaker 2: So you could ask it forever into eternity, right.
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  Speaker 4: And maybe never get the answer.
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  Speaker 2: And maybe never get a real answer that that fits
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  Speaker 2: with you, right, And then there's Okay, I can't change this.
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  Speaker 3: This is done. It's finalized.
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  Speaker 2: And if I spend all of my time feeling sorry
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  Speaker 2: for myself and blaming everybody else for what has happened,
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  Speaker 2: I rob myself of the chance to grow to become stronger,
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  Speaker 2: to learn from this, to help other people experience true
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: joy and experience true joy going forward. You're robbing yourself
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: of the opera tunity to experience joy in your life.
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: And I think it's I mean, if you really think again, physiologically,
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: it's the root of disease.
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: Oh, it's a big component of disease. And here's the thing.
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: Here's the thing about self pity, which is the main
• 6:16
  Speaker 2: component of the constructive victimization. It's an anesthetic. Self pity
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: is the best xan X out there, and so it's addicting. Sure,
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: right if you are, oh, poor pitiful me, I'm so
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: you know this happened to me and nobody understands. And
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  Speaker 2: it's a form of self soothing and that it's why
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: it's hard to step away from it, right, because we
• 6:41
  Speaker 2: soothe ourselves and we don't have to confront the ugly
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: truth about ourselves, about why we're stuck or about. And
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  Speaker 2: this is really hard. Even some of the things that
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: contributed to you being victimized. Now for some people there
• 6:57
  Speaker 2: was it was not one ounce their fault. They are
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: a true one percent victim.
• 7:02
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, we want to clear that.
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: Let me be extremely clear. There are people that are assaulted,
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: that are physically harmed, that are emotionally harmed, and they
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: had absolutely no role in them, right, But there are
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: others who did play a role in their own victimization,
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  Speaker 2: and that's hard to face, it is. And I will
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: say I played a role in my own victimization.
• 7:27
  Speaker 4: Same hands. I did both them.
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  Speaker 3: One because I chose to stay.
• 7:34
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I kept making poor decisions on.
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  Speaker 2: And on and on and on with someone who victimized
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: me over over and over again.
• 7:43
  Speaker 3: And I know all about battered woman syndrome. I know.
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: I used to work in the domestic violence field. I
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: am educated about why women's stay and abuse. I am
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: an expert on trauma bonding, and so I know why
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: I couldn't leave. But at the end of the day,
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: I eventually did so. And then when I did, and
• 8:06
  Speaker 2: there was the other side of that, there was this
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  Speaker 2: one day that I realized, like my participation in that
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: was always voluntary.
• 8:15
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yep, you are not a.
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: Victim at certain point in time. You're a volunteer in
• 8:21
  Speaker 2: that situation. And that is an ugly hard truth not.
• 8:25
  Speaker 4: A lot of people.
• 8:26
  Speaker 3: That is so hard to take.
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, and I know I mean, we were just
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: talking about this on the way here, because I think
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: it was it was episode three that I talked about.
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: I openly talked a little bit about my sexual permiscuity,
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: and then I actually went back and started thinking about, like, well,
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: was it permiscuity or was it really sexual trauma that
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: I experienced with my ex partner? And you know, I
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: even told you on the way here when I was
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: talking about it.
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  Speaker 4: It's hard for.
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  Speaker 1: Me to say that it was trauma even though it
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: was without getting too far into it. But I still
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: played a role, right, I still played a role in it,
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: and I can only take accountability for that portion of it.
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  Speaker 1: I can't take I can't take what he did right,
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: as much as it was very manipulative, I can't do
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  Speaker 1: anything about that part. All I can do is take
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  Speaker 1: account accountability for my role in it, recognize it, try
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  Speaker 1: to heal it. Most of all, try to release it.
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  Speaker 1: Try to release the.
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: Shame around Absolutely, and deshaming is a huge part of
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: being able to let go of victimhood. Yeah, and shame
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  Speaker 2: plays such a negative role in so many of our lives,
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  Speaker 2: and it is the block that prevents people from moving
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  Speaker 2: forward because there's there's shame when you're victimized.
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  Speaker 1: Er.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, but even when if it's zero percent your fault,
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  Speaker 2: even if you are one hundred percent of victim, they're
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: still shame that like like how did I end up here?
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  Speaker 4: Sure?
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  Speaker 2: Like you know, and people that are traumatized, like people
• 10:08
  Speaker 2: that have you know, have been raped, they constantly look
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: back and say, what could have I done different? Could
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: I have taken a left instead of a right? You know?
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: Should I have like remember to lock my door, Like
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: should I have not had that last drink? And that
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  Speaker 2: shame is so unwarranted and it is so harmful and
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: it keeps people stuck, and I really want people to
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: be able to heal that shame.
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, shame has been something that I feel like in
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: the past few years has really come to the surface
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  Speaker 1: for me in terms of like facing my own shame
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  Speaker 1: and really just trying to release it because as I
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: get older, I just recognize it so much more in
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: my body and how I like how my body feels
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: when it when it comes up. And so again, because
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: you're professional, we want to know, like we want to
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: know the secrets. I want to know the secret right
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  Speaker 1: of really how you release that shame, how you let
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  Speaker 1: it go once and for all, Like, because processing is
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: one thing.
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  Speaker 4: I process your shame.
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  Speaker 1: You think about, you know, the circumstance that maybe created
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: the shame and the map from that point to this point.
• 11:19
  Speaker 4: But how do you let it go?
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  Speaker 1: Because I mean I was laying in bed thinking about
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: this last night. It still lives in my body.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, I've made incredible progress.
• 11:29
  Speaker 3: It is a journey. Yeah, I have not reached the
• 11:31
  Speaker 3: final destination.
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because my body will flare up under stressful conditions
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: that I don't see coming right where I feel cognitively okay,
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: like I'm not stressed in my mind, but my body
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: is experiencing the stress and the symptoms.
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: And here's the thing.
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: We have to start to meet our basic needs in
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: order to release shame. We have to stop having shame
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: around the idea that we have basic needs. And this
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: is gonna sound wild, but it starts at you know,
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: like Maslow's fundamental bottom rung hierarchy of needs, even things
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: like eating when you're hungry, sleeping when you need to sleep,
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: when you need to pee, Like that's how your body
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: starts to trust you. And it will when your body
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: starts to trust you, you do release some of that shame,
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: Like it's not shameful that I, you know, I need
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: to get up and use the bathroom, or I could
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: sit here and pound out thirty more minutes of whatever
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: I'm doing on my computer, right, because I'm really in
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: the flow. Right, It's like there's this subconscious sense of
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: shame that oh no, I'm stopping my productivity.
• 12:46
  Speaker 3: I'm gonna go use the restaurant.
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: So that's at a very fundamental level of how we
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: heal the shame in our body. Okay, when we've been
• 12:55
  Speaker 2: we've been victimized, or we've had trauma.
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: That's really beautiful too, because it seems like that's really
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: simple to grasp, right, and people don't acknowledge it. Yeah,
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: Oh well, I'll just pee when I need to pee,
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: and go to sleep when I need to sleep, and
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: eat when I need to eat, and then my body
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: will feel better.
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: Right. But even we have so much shame even around
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: just eating. I mean, as women, right, Like I mean,
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: find a woman that hasn't been on a diet, good luck?
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: Right?
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Okay, so shame is just woven in so many
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: different aspects. But really, what I want people to understand
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: about healing from victimization because victimization is meant to be
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: a temporary state. It's meant to be a state where
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: you are processing shock and you are trying to find
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: your footing and you need love and support and tenderness,
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: and you know guidance and God and God, oh Gosh, yes,
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: God to do that. But once you've got your footing
• 13:59
  Speaker 2: a little bit, you are at a crossroads. And that
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: crossroads is am I going to continue to be angry, ashamed, doubtful, offended,
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: like all of these really negative emotions? Am I going
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: to live there and just continually try to seek some
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: sense of justice that I may never get because the
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: majority of traumatized people never get any justice. There's no
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: righting that wrong. I believe someday God does it for
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: us somehow, some way, because I believe we serve adjust God,
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: but most people never get any justice right And am
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: I going to seek something that I'm never really going
• 14:41
  Speaker 2: to get? Or am I going to make a conscious
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: decision to be an overcomer? I hate when people call
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: me a victim. It makes my skin crawl. I say, no,
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: I'm not a victim of trauma. I'm an overcomer of trauma.
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: I am an overcomer. I am always an active of
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: for comer well.
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: And that is justice, right, because if you really, if
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: you really think about justice and like the definition of it,
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: I mean you can go you know, the direction of
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: like civilly right, you know law.
• 15:15
  Speaker 4: But true justice is if you just overcome.
• 15:17
  Speaker 3: True justice is in her peace. Yeah, that's in her
• 15:19
  Speaker 3: peace man.
• 15:20
  Speaker 4: Yeah. And not being this.
• 15:23
  Speaker 1: You know, walking ball of resentment towards everyone. I mean again,
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: this was something we were talking about on the way
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: here with our parents specifically, because you know, I know,
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: my mother lived a life where she she felt life
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: had victimized her.
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: Yeah. That was my dad.
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: That was my dad too, And he was bitter and
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: he was angry, and he became a shell of a
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: human being and he died on that hill.
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Same your mom did too, Yeah, and and died
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: too soon as well. And and something that I mentioned
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: to you on the way here, she she grew to
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: resent her her own children.
• 16:01
  Speaker 4: Yeah, because of it, for sure.
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: The people that she loved like her children were her life.
• 16:05
  Speaker 4: The four of us were her life.
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: But she resented us, sure because in her mind she
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: couldn't see past the fact that when it came to
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: her and my dad's divorce. She couldn't see her role,
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: she could never acknowledge her role and take any accountability
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: for that. It was just that he had victimized her
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: that I mean seventeen, I mean four days before she died.
• 16:28
  Speaker 4: You know, she was talking about how you know it
• 16:31
  Speaker 4: was your father, did this? Your father?
• 16:35
  Speaker 3: Yeah, So there's some inter there's so many things. I
• 16:38
  Speaker 3: want to say.
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: My brain's gone ninety miles an hour here because I'm
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: so passionate about this topic. Yeah, there's something in psychology.
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: There's a psychological concept called locus of control, Okay, and
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: it's it's a it's a spectrum. And on one end
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: of the spectrum we have what's called internal locus of control.
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: And people who identify as having an internal locus of
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: control truly believe that their actions matter, that the decisions
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: they make and the actions they take produce the outcomes
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: in their life, right, that they are largely in control
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: of what happens to them in their lives and the
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: outcomes of their lives.
• 17:14
  Speaker 3: Right. And then we have on the other end of the.
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: Spectrum, external locus of control, and people who identify with
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: an external locus of control believe outside forces largely control
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: their life, like the government or more powerful people, or
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: luck or chance. Right, those are the factors that create
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: the majority of the outcomes of their life. And when
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: we look at their mental health, can you imagine who
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: has better mental health? H Right, Those with the and
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: who are ultimately on pretty much all measures of success
• 17:47
  Speaker 2: are more successful people that believe their actions matter, because
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: why would you try if you don't believe that you're
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: in control and that your actions actually create the outcomes
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: in your life.
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: And so people who have an external locus of control
• 18:03
  Speaker 2: really identify with victimhood. They score high end measures of
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: self pity and victimization and they're stuck. Yeah, they don't
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: make progress because if you don't believe that your actions matter,
• 18:17
  Speaker 2: that what has been done to you has ruined you
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: and there's no life after this, then I'm sorry, you know,
• 18:25
  Speaker 2: and you're not going to make much of your life.
• 18:27
  Speaker 4: Yeah, because it's the only thing you can control.
• 18:29
  Speaker 3: It is the one.
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: Thing you can control in your life or your is
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: one your your own actions into your your mindset, yeah,
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: your mental effort and your attitude. And I know that
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: sounds a little cliche, but it's true.
• 18:42
  Speaker 3: Gosh, it's so true. It's so true.
• 18:45
  Speaker 4: What did you say?
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: I can't remember a few episodes ago. Self reflection? Self
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: reflection was everything. It's everything, and it's I mean, it's
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: a huge component here too when when it comes to victimhood,
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: because I don't, I don't without throwing my mother completely
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: out under the bus because she loved beautiful, wonderful, loyal, gorgeous,
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: wonderful mother and maybe if you know she was still
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: living today, we would.
• 19:14
  Speaker 4: Have a different relationship.
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: But the reason why we were at odds when she died,
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: because this is something that I've had to process when
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: it comes to when it comes to my grief.
• 19:27
  Speaker 4: But the reason that we were at.
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: Odds is because I couldn't back down from her, or
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: I wouldn't back down from her when she would bring
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: up these points that she wanted me to agree with
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: and I couldn't because it was it was such a
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: victim mentality that I saw it right as her child,
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: and she couldn't stand it. She couldn't stand that I
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: would say things like, you can't stay here. If you
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: stay here, you're only hurting yourself.
• 20:01
  Speaker 3: You're only going to stay miserable.
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: Yes, and then you know she doesn't. She never really
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: got to fully enjoy these things. And it makes me
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: sad right again, processing some of this within my own grief.
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: It makes me so sad for her because she never
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: really got to enjoy her grandchildren, even because she even
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: resented them and she had no reason to. So it's
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: like there's this, there's all these things that come into
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: play when you live in that mentality, a victimhood, where
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: it just makes you this person that you can't see
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: or experience true happiness. And so it makes me really sad.
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: It makes me so sad for her, and I think
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: that ultimately it's what killed her.
• 20:42
  Speaker 3: Very likely, Yeah, very likely.
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Because when you're angry and you're bitter and you're anxious,
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: you produce stress hormones and chemicals that recavoc on your body.
• 20:54
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: I tell people all the time, I like, my mom
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: died of a broken heart, but she kept breaking her
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: own heart because.
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: She couldn't move past that she could And you know
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: what is intrical for stepping out of victimhood?
• 21:06
  Speaker 3: What forgiveness?
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah?
• 21:09
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that makes you want to cry.
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: And forgiveness is the most freeing, most beautiful, greatest gift
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: I ever gave to myself.
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because it was the one thing my mom couldn't do.
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: She could not forget my father. She couldn't and that's
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: why she was stuck. I'm sorry.
• 21:33
  Speaker 3: Sorry, that's okay. All emotions are welcome here.
• 21:36
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that's right.
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: Emotions make us human and we need to experience them
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: and we need to feel them.
• 21:42
  Speaker 3: It's okay to do that.
• 21:43
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and you're a human.
• 21:45
  Speaker 3: Don't you apologize for your tears?
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: And I mean, you know my story. Yeah, I'll kind
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: of recap it for people.
• 21:54
  Speaker 4: That's a beautiful.
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: But there's this fine line, right, there's this fine line
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: that I teet her. It's a tight that I walk.
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: The person that victimized me the most and hurt me
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: the most was my ex husband. He is also the
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: father of my children, and he's also dead. He's not
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: here to defend himself. There's always two sides to every story.
• 22:16
  Speaker 2: I'm not egotistical enough to believe that my side, in
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: my perspective, is the only reality here, okay. And what
• 22:26
  Speaker 2: he did to me as well as his death so
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: profoundly impacted me, first bringing me into the depths of hell,
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: but then ultimately leading to my comeback and my growth
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: and my amazing life, which I never would have found
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: without all of those experiences. And so I struggle to
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: talk about those experiences because I don't ever want my
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: children to ever hear me say a negative thing about
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: their father.
• 23:01
  Speaker 3: That is not okay, it is not what I want.
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: And how do I tell my truth and tell people
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: how those really awful things that happened shaped me and
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: helped me overcome and launched me into post traumatic growth,
• 23:19
  Speaker 2: which ultimately has led me to my best, happiest, most
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: joyous life that I could have ever imagined.
• 23:25
  Speaker 3: So how do I walk that tightrope? So I'm gonna
• 23:27
  Speaker 3: do my best.
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, Well I'm gonna leave a lot of the
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: details out.
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: You'd lead with how grateful you are for Jared, you know,
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: oh God, we're both going to cry today, how grateful
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: you are for Jared, because you know, he is ultimately
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: the point of what catapulted you to where you are now.
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: And I think that you know, the people that victimize
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: us in our lives, you know, I mean, our own
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: parents do it. So you know, I mean, I love
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: my mother and my add so much, but I mean
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: there's a level of victimization even within my own childhood
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: and everyone's and you know, you do walk that fine
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: line of being able to tell these stories from a
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: place of love. So we'll just preface it with that.
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: And these come from a place of love.
• 24:18
  Speaker 2: And I'll preface it what there is not a single
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: ounce of bitterness toward him, not a single ounce of hatred,
• 24:27
  Speaker 2: of any negative emotion towards him at all. And it
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: is also true that some of the things that he
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: did were horrible, and that even after his death, the
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: aftermath of his death was horrible. You know, again, getting
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: into specifics would be would be really hard to do,
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: but it was really bad. And like a lot of
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: things came to light that were really really hard and
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: when I okay, so context really bad marriage, there was
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: some really awful dynamics that were very hurtful, really ugly divorce,
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: lots and lots of money and family court addictions on
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: his behalf, which ultimately killed him. And that's public record.
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: I mean, people can google it like it's not well.
• 25:32
  Speaker 4: Most people know that, Yeah it's from a small town.
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: Everybody, yes, right, And that ultimately took his life accidentally,
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: and he had just been married for six weeks right
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: after he died. That was a huge complicating factor in
• 25:47
  Speaker 2: a lot of the aftermath of his death. Mom diagnosed
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: pancreatic cancer right before that. You know, my dad was
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: severely disabled, had dementia, wheelchair bound. So of course, you
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: know who has to step in and care for both
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: of them.
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: That was me.
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: I was with a dismissive.
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: Avoidant who we all know broke up with me right
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: when my mom was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer. Uh, you know,
• 26:14
  Speaker 2: I could be angry at him, but I'm not. I
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: became disabled with chronic bestibular migraine. That was it was
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: truly disabling, and it was truly disabling, and because my
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: nervous system just fell apart. You can only be you
• 26:29
  Speaker 2: can only have so many shock traumas in a row
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: where into and then your nervous system just says, and
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: there were so many shock traumas during our marriage, like yeah,
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: it was like for ten straight solid years, and then
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: my nervous system just went, you're done, you are absolutely done.
• 26:49
  Speaker 2: And I think it was one of those things where
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: my body just recognized, like, we have to give you
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: something so severe that you have to lay down in
• 26:57
  Speaker 2: the bed because you have used every resource we have
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: pulled from every last You have no serotonin left, it's gone. Ye,
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: there's not a single neurotransmitter that can help you left
• 27:10
  Speaker 2: in your body, right, Like we have to give you
• 27:13
  Speaker 2: something so disabling that it will force you to just rest,
• 27:16
  Speaker 2: to rest. But I had two young, grieving children and
• 27:20
  Speaker 2: a sick, dying mother and a disabled father and no one.
• 27:24
  Speaker 3: There was no one.
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: I mean you were there for sure, but you had
• 27:28
  Speaker 2: your own life and your own capacity. You know, you
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: couldn't be my twenty four hour caregiver either, right.
• 27:34
  Speaker 3: And I was broke. I was so broke.
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: I was living on credit cards. I was worried about
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: how it was going payment mortgage payment. I mean I
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: was no child sport, right, I mean, he's dead, it's
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: not coming. I mean, thank gosh for Social Security death
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: benefits when they kicked in. That was a saving, absolute
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: saving grace. And one thing that our ten year marriage
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: you know, gave to me was you know, that financial support,
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: and it was a lifesaver, you know.
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: Gosh.
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: I'm struggling to not give details. I'm really struggling to
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: not give details because it's hard to not give context.
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: But I wanted to die. I was this is so shameful.
• 28:21
  Speaker 2: But I've had to work through this shame because the
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: shame will kill you. But and this is like demonic level,
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: major demonic level. Okay, I wanted to commit suicide and
• 28:33
  Speaker 2: I was angry at my kids that I couldn't commit suicide.
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: I remember, yeah, I remember you calling me. I mean
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: I remember you called me one day and You're like,
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: I want I want to kill myself.
• 28:44
  Speaker 3: I'm so sorry, honey, And I'm crying because I'm sad
• 28:48
  Speaker 3: for that person.
• 28:50
  Speaker 4: Yeah, because it didn't need to be that way. Yeah,
• 28:57
  Speaker 4: but look at you now.
• 28:59
  Speaker 2: But then here comes the good part. Here comes the
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: good part. Now that we've depressed you, now that we've
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: made you in a terrible.
• 29:07
  Speaker 4: Mood, everybody's crime.
• 29:09
  Speaker 3: Let me tell you.
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: How I became an overcomer. Yeah, I had this chance
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: encounter with this. I just posted in Freaking lex Mom,
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: like the mom's group of Lexington, and was like, uh,
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: this is all the things that have happened to me.
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: And I'm in the pit of hell and I want
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: to die and I just need a mental health provider,
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: Like I need a therapist, I need somebody.
• 29:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah, like beyond desperate and Ashley my friend, Ashley. My
• 29:41
  Speaker 3: beautiful shout out to Ashley.
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: I love you so much, we love oh my gosh.
• 29:46
  Speaker 2: Talk about a believer, talk about a rock solid human being.
• 29:50
  Speaker 3: She took a chance, you know.
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: She reached out to me in a private message, and
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: she said, I have something for you. I don't know
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: if you'd be interested. She said, God put it on
• 29:57
  Speaker 2: my heart to tell you. I would just like to
• 30:00
  Speaker 2: talk to you about Jesus and no.
• 30:02
  Speaker 4: Lie.
• 30:03
  Speaker 2: My first reaction was like, irol, Yeah, how's that gonna
• 30:06
  Speaker 2: help me? Right?
• 30:08
  Speaker 3: What's he going to do? Come down from heaven and
• 30:09
  Speaker 3: save me from this? But then he literally did yeah.
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: And she gave me this challenge, and she said, this
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: is going to sound crazy, she said, but just take
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: ninety days.
• 30:23
  Speaker 3: And I want you to seek the answer to this question.
• 30:27
  Speaker 3: Who is God? She said, I don't care. She said,
• 30:30
  Speaker 3: definitely use the Bible for that.
• 30:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but look, go to sermons, like use people that
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: are knowledgeable about scripture, a look around, like just take
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: it from all angles. She's like, make scripture, you know,
• 30:42
  Speaker 2: take the Bible, make it your primary resource. But you know,
• 30:45
  Speaker 2: feel free to like browse around different ministries and what
• 30:49
  Speaker 2: people have to say.
• 30:51
  Speaker 3: And I want you to answer the question who is God?
• 30:55
  Speaker 3: And she helped me out.
• 30:56
  Speaker 2: She gave me some starting resources, and oh my gosh,
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: she was a lifeline. We Marco polo every day every
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: day and I would cry and she would lift me
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: up and she would speak the word of God and
• 31:07
  Speaker 2: to me over me, and I started getting better, I remember,
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: And then I was better enough to do the work.
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: I was better enough to do the work on my
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: attachment that I needed to do. But that was a
• 31:22
  Speaker 2: side by side journey of my faith, and so I
• 31:27
  Speaker 2: tried to answer the question who is God? So I
• 31:30
  Speaker 2: dug into the Old Testament. And there's a guy named
• 31:32
  Speaker 2: Tom Bradford who breaks down the Old Testament. He's an
• 31:35
  Speaker 2: amazing biblical scholar. Because I grew up Catholic and there
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: was so much guilt in that religion. No offense Catholics,
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: it's just it didn't sit well with me.
• 31:44
  Speaker 3: I know a lot of people.
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: My mom's a very devout Catholic and gets so much
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: out of it, and so, you know, it's we just
• 31:50
  Speaker 2: had a different experience, and.
• 31:53
  Speaker 3: You know, I missed. I did not understand the Old Testament.
• 31:57
  Speaker 2: My view of God was he was like this vengeful
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: punishing like God that just condemned you for not being
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: good enough and not being you know, and so I
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: just rejected that because I felt like, well, I'm never
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: going to be good enough for God, so why even
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: go there.
• 32:11
  Speaker 3: But the answer to that question who is God?
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: Is love. There's a one word answer to that question,
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: and it's love. And there's no other answer to that.
• 32:23
  Speaker 2: And once I truly understood the Bible, everything that God
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: does is loving. Everything he ever did for his people
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: was loving. Even the times where we hear about like
• 32:35
  Speaker 2: God's wrath that is completely misunderstood.
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: It's so misunderstood. And there's a lot of.
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: Translation and language barriers and things that play a role
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: in that. And that's why to seek somebody who's truly,
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: you know, an expert and have confidence that they are
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: a Biblical expert to help us understand a little bit
• 32:54
  Speaker 2: more because some.
• 32:55
  Speaker 4: Of it is complex.
• 32:57
  Speaker 3: I mean, I'm a New Living Translation Bible reader. Okay,
• 33:01
  Speaker 3: I need the New Living Translation, and I grow in.
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: Church, I'm a preacher's daughter, and I still don't fully understand.
• 33:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so you know, and then you know, when I
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: got to know God, all it was was I will
• 33:14
  Speaker 2: never leave in forsake you.
• 33:16
  Speaker 3: I will always work things for your good. I will
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: care for you.
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: I will feed you, I'll clothe you, I will make
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: sure you're okay. Bottom line, I will give you strength
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: to put one foot in front of the other until
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: you are better and so you don't have to be
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: strong and you are not alone. I am here and
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: like I didn't understand that level of faith, like I
• 33:38
  Speaker 2: didn't ever have that connection with God, and for the
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: very first time in my life, I found it. And
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: the peace and the safety that's there cannot be replicated
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: anywhere else. It can't be replicated through a friend, it
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: can't be replicated through a spouse, it cannot be replicated
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: through your children. It can't be replicated anywhere else. And
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: you could not have convinced me of that, or you
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: could have not brought me to this level of understanding
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: by talking to me. I had to be in the
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: pit of hell. I had to be in the I
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: had to be overcome with the most demonic which I
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: think suicidal ideation is the pit of demonic hell. That's
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: the most oppression, right, And he taught me. God taught
• 34:33
  Speaker 2: me about gratitude, and he taught me about trust, and
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: he taught me about faith, and he taught me about
• 34:38
  Speaker 2: my own strength. That he gave me power love in
• 34:41
  Speaker 2: his sound mind, and the Word of God spoke into
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: me and into me and into me and over me
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: until where I believed it with my very core. And
• 34:52
  Speaker 2: then I no longer identified as a victim. And you
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: don't even know this, not sure if I ever mentioned
• 34:58
  Speaker 2: this to you, but you said something really powerful to
• 35:01
  Speaker 2: me during that time. And there was a period of
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: time where you had to come to me with some
• 35:05
  Speaker 2: tough love at a very tough time because you were
• 35:09
  Speaker 2: like the only semblance of support that I had, and
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: I was holding on so tight to you and you
• 35:14
  Speaker 2: only had so much to give. And you said this,
• 35:19
  Speaker 2: and I've never forgotten it, and it was the absolute
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: right thing to say, even though it was hard to hear.
• 35:26
  Speaker 2: But you looked at me and you said, life traumatizes
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: us all. And if you haven't been traumatized yet, it's
• 35:33
  Speaker 2: coming for you.
• 35:35
  Speaker 3: I hate to be Debbie Downer, but it's coming for you.
• 35:40
  Speaker 2: I mean, you're going to lose somebody that you love.
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: You're going to get sick maybe someday, or something's going
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: to happen that is a trauma in your life. If
• 35:48
  Speaker 2: you've escaped it thus far, I'm so glad, Praise Jesus.
• 35:51
  Speaker 2: But it's coming for you because we live in a
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: fallen world and it comes for us all at some point, right,
• 35:58
  Speaker 2: And so you have to learn resilience and resurrection.
• 36:05
  Speaker 4: Yes, I mean, that's really what it's about, you know.
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: I mean, because I think we've both had these wonderful,
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: beautiful experiences, and I think you when you sought God
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: in those moments, you probably started to see Him in people.
• 36:19
  Speaker 4: Because that's what Ashley was.
• 36:21
  Speaker 3: Oh she was a walking light.
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he was, absolutely And she tells me that she
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: when I say, oh my gosh, thank you, thank you
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: for coming into my life, thank you for having the
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: bravery to talk to me that day, Like you profoundly
• 36:35
  Speaker 2: changed the trajectory of my life and my children's lives.
• 36:38
  Speaker 2: And then here I am this business and I speak
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: to millions of people every day, I mean, get millions
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: of views on my videos all the time, and so
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: and I get to speak the word of God, and
• 36:47
  Speaker 2: and so like that one message has had the ripple
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: effect that is beyond what we can even imagine, even.
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: For me, because in that moment it was difficult for
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: me just based on what you just said, because I wanted.
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: I knew that you had you were capable to pull
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: yourself out. But I didn't have the tools like Ashley did, right,
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: Like I wasn't that far into my my spiritual journey
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: like she was. And so it was like God gave
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: you these stepping stones of circumstance and people, because I
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: think I'd probably said to you a few times, like
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: when you got nothing left, there was nothing, the only
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: thing to lean on is your face.
• 37:28
  Speaker 3: There was nothing left. There was no money, yeah, there
• 37:30
  Speaker 3: was enough people, Yeah, there was no anything.
• 37:35
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And so you only have God to turn to.
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 37:37
  Speaker 4: And we've you know, we've both been there.
• 37:40
  Speaker 1: I mean I've I've shared my experience when you know,
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: I went through a terribly terrible custody battle with my
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: X and in a place where I had no support system,
• 37:49
  Speaker 1: and it was awful, and I was basically fighting city
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: hall because we were in a small town and where
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: his family rules, yeah, where they had deep roots, you know,
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: And I mean it was it was terrible. Without getting
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: into all the details here, but I remember, you know,
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: I remember praying to God to save me because I
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: felt like there was nothing left. And I still get
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: goosebumps every time I tell the story. But I remember
• 38:14
  Speaker 1: I was sitting out on my roof, you know, kind
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: of with my knees up on, you know, to my chest,
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: just bawling, crying, praying, and I that day I felt
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: the arms of God around me. And people can, I mean,
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: they can think I'm crazy, or they can say what
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: they want, but I felt an actual embrace. I felt
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: arms around me, and it was like from that that
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: point on, things you know, started to get better. Right,
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: And it's this gradual process. But you know, I always say,
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: you know, asking you shall receive and do time because
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: God will always bring it to you.
• 38:55
  Speaker 2: Right. And here's the thing, here's what I want people
• 38:57
  Speaker 2: to know. The biggest question that people who don't have
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: strong faith, you know, usually ask as well, then why
• 39:04
  Speaker 2: is there so much evil in the world. And here's
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: what I will say about that. And I made a
• 39:08
  Speaker 2: TikTok video on this, and of course it went went
• 39:10
  Speaker 2: pretty viral and I think it resonated with a lot
• 39:12
  Speaker 2: of people.
• 39:12
  Speaker 3: So I'll repeat it here.
• 39:15
  Speaker 2: God is love and God is everything that is good.
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: God made the laws of the universe in a specific way.
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: We have a little law of opposites, and we have
• 39:26
  Speaker 2: free will, and free when I mean we have free will,
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: we have total and complete free will.
• 39:32
  Speaker 3: And so there's a law of opposites. So for the love,
• 39:34
  Speaker 3: there has to be the evil.
• 39:36
  Speaker 2: Right, there has to be an opposite entity to that,
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: because that law of the universe is peripherates throughout the
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: entire universe of all mankind. Right, there's an opposite to everything.
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: And and so for the good, there is the evil.
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: There is the fallen evil in the world. And evil
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: is just the absence of God. Right, It's just the
• 39:57
  Speaker 2: absence of God. And Satan chose to make himself absent
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: from God. So it was his choice. He used his
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: own free will to separate himself from God. Right, And
• 40:07
  Speaker 2: so all the evil in the world is from the enemy.
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: And people use their free will to align with God
• 40:14
  Speaker 2: or align with the enemy every moment of every day.
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: We make that choice a lot of times unknowingly, right,
• 40:19
  Speaker 2: because we're not aware. And so God doesn't make any
• 40:24
  Speaker 2: of these bad things happen. But he also doesn't interrupt
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: our free will when we choose the enemy. And that
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: has a big butterfly effect, right, a huge huge butterfly effect.
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: And so we even think about like, oh my mom,
• 40:39
  Speaker 2: you know, she's having a really hard time wrapping her
• 40:42
  Speaker 2: head around this, and she's like, well, what about little
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: kids that get sick and die? How is it? How's
• 40:46
  Speaker 2: that you know, their participation with evil? And I'm like,
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: it's not their participation with evil, somebody else's right. And
• 40:54
  Speaker 2: so we created a world full of toxins that have
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: altered our DNA. We have you know, generational trauma through
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: epigenetics that modifies our DNA that creates you know, birth
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: effects and chronic illness. So you have to see this
• 41:11
  Speaker 2: as a very far reaching ripple effect, right, And so no,
• 41:15
  Speaker 2: did that little child that got sick and died? Did they,
• 41:19
  Speaker 2: you know, participate in evil? Most likely not right now,
• 41:21
  Speaker 2: they're they're child. But mankind has participated in evil, and
• 41:28
  Speaker 2: that often affects innocent people. And because God can't interfere
• 41:34
  Speaker 2: with our free will and the effects of our free will,
• 41:36
  Speaker 2: he does not because if he did, then we would
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: just be robots that he controlled and made us like
• 41:44
  Speaker 2: love him? Right, I mean, God does, God don't play.
• 41:48
  Speaker 2: Free will is free will, right, and it is absolute free.
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: Will encircling that back to victimhood, you know. I mean,
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: victimhood is free will, right because you choose to live there.
• 41:58
  Speaker 2: That's right, that's right. And here's the thing about God.
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: God is soon as we sin and participate in evil
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: and screw things up, God loves us so much that
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: he jumps behind the scenes and starts trying to pull strings,
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: trying to speak to our spirit, trying to speak into
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: the spirit of other people. That is going to create
• 42:22
  Speaker 2: a butterfly effect that is going to work it for
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: our good. And if we turn to him and we
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: listen to his voice, I firmly believe God speaks to
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: our spirit. The enemy speaks to our spirit and manifests
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: in our thoughts. And I talk a lot about, you know,
• 42:37
  Speaker 2: metacognition and observing our thoughts, you know, in my coursework
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: and in my coaching. But we can choose to listen
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: to God's voice, and we can choose to step out
• 42:47
  Speaker 2: of victimhood and step into the power, love, and sound
• 42:50
  Speaker 2: mind that God gave us. And then we receive the
• 42:53
  Speaker 2: blessings because God's directing our steps to get there, to
• 42:55
  Speaker 2: get them to receive them.
• 42:56
  Speaker 3: Right, He's like, go here, do this, say this thing.
• 42:59
  Speaker 4: Do this and you're actually listening, and you're.
• 43:01
  Speaker 2: Listening, and you go do it, and then you win
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: the prize. Right, you get the blessing. It's like he's
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: like trying to bring us there, but we can intentionally
• 43:08
  Speaker 2: turn our back on that.
• 43:09
  Speaker 3: Listen to the enemy.
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: Stay in bitterness, stay in victimhood, stay in self pity,
• 43:14
  Speaker 2: stay in jealousy, stay in rejection, stay in all of
• 43:18
  Speaker 2: the evil things that Satan brings us, and we don't
• 43:20
  Speaker 2: hear the words to lead us to the blessing, and
• 43:24
  Speaker 2: then we get more bad stuff. Right, So, bad things
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: happen to good people because we live in a fallen
• 43:30
  Speaker 2: world and it's not just us that participates and evil directly,
• 43:33
  Speaker 2: but other people do as well, and that has a
• 43:35
  Speaker 2: gigantic ripple effect on our world. And so how do
• 43:39
  Speaker 2: we protect ourselves from that? As much as humanly possible.
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: We turn towards God, and we hear the voice of God,
• 43:45
  Speaker 2: and we obey the voice of God, and it does
• 43:48
  Speaker 2: not lead you astray. Right, it doesn't mean that we
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: won't fall victim to suffering from messing up and aligning
• 43:57
  Speaker 2: with the enemy on occasion or you know, somebody else
• 44:01
  Speaker 2: doing it. That comes back to us in a ripple effect.
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: But what it does mean is that you're going to
• 44:07
  Speaker 2: live an overall, peaceful, mostly joyous life right in whatever
• 44:12
  Speaker 2: circumstance you find yourself in that feels like the pit
• 44:15
  Speaker 2: of hell. He will pull you out and he will
• 44:17
  Speaker 2: help you put one foot in front of the other
• 44:19
  Speaker 2: until it gets better.
• 44:20
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and listen, A great place to start.
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: Is the Word, because I've learned that if I spend
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: time in the Word, then I can hear God's voice
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: more clearly.
• 44:32
  Speaker 4: Just so about my day to day life.
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: You know, if you're if you know and listen, I know,
• 44:36
  Speaker 1: when it comes to spirituality and faith, it's intimate, right,
• 44:41
  Speaker 1: It's very intimate. And everyone's journey is different and looks different.
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: And you know, again we're here as really doctor Hensley's here.
• 44:52
  Speaker 4: I'm just here.
• 44:53
  Speaker 3: You're here.
• 44:54
  Speaker 1: I'm just here to agree and not no, but you
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: say some really beautiful, profound things, but you know we're
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: here to guide you, you know, and and hopefully push
• 45:05
  Speaker 1: you in that direction. And and again you know, if
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: you if you want to learn more about doctor Hensley's services.
• 45:14
  Speaker 4: It's not all a spiritual stand secular.
• 45:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I always say all faiths are welcome in my practice,
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: except maybe Satanism, because.
• 45:23
  Speaker 3: That probably wouldn't it wouldn't.
• 45:25
  Speaker 4: Go over well.
• 45:27
  Speaker 3: And sorry, you know that's a tough thing. But it
• 45:32
  Speaker 3: wouldn't be any good. It wouldn't work, it wouldn't be
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: any good.
• 45:34
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: But I give a purely psychological, secular perspective, and then
• 45:39
  Speaker 2: I give a spiritual perspective alongside of it, and I
• 45:42
  Speaker 2: tell people like and I make them, you know, all
• 45:44
  Speaker 2: very separate. So I sort of like even in my
• 45:47
  Speaker 2: courses that I do, my online courses, it's like, these
• 45:50
  Speaker 2: are if you don't want to watch these modules, you
• 45:51
  Speaker 2: don't have to. Right, here's the spiritual perspective. You can
• 45:53
  Speaker 2: skip right over those. If that doesn't that doesn't land
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: with you, Right, there's I have all the psychology in
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: the world.
• 45:59
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 45:59
  Speaker 4: I think it's really beautiful.
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: I think that that's wonderful that you give those options
• 46:02
  Speaker 1: so that everybody feels really welcome and comfortable. And so
• 46:06
  Speaker 1: if you want to learn more about doctor Hensley's services,
• 46:08
  Speaker 1: visit her website at the Dating dcoder dot com and listen, guys,
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: we get deep today.
• 46:14
  Speaker 4: We cried and you.
• 46:16
  Speaker 2: Know, I even thought, how can we make this a
• 46:20
  Speaker 2: little bit more lighthearted, but it just doesn't.
• 46:22
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 46:22
  Speaker 4: We just kind of go with the flow.
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: However it happens, happens, and that's really the beauty of it,
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: and that's really what we're here for. Again, we started
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: this out like we want to be as authentic as possible,
• 46:31
  Speaker 1: and you know what, right, the tears are as authentic
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: as joy. I always say, absolutely, feeling sorrow is as
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: normal as an emotion as joy and happiness, and we
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: should welcome it because it doesn't really helps us release things.
• 46:43
  Speaker 1: So we just are so honored and grateful for everybody
• 46:47
  Speaker 1: who's tuning in and listening, and please you, if you
• 46:50
  Speaker 1: like the content that you're hearing, continue to tune in
• 46:52
  Speaker 1: because we have so much more to come, and like, subscribe, follow,
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: share all the things, go follow doctor Henson on all
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: her social media platforms, and until next time, peace, love
• 47:04
  Speaker 1: and perspective.