Latest / 360 with Katie Woolf / Berry Springs Tavern Owner Leah Sloan says she’s putting her staff through personal safety training as the NT Government’s program would see workers off work for 4 days

Transcript

Berry Springs Tavern Owner Leah Sloan says she’s putting her staff through personal safety training as the NT Government’s program would see workers off work for 4 days · 360 with Katie Woolf

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Now we know that two rural pubs are rolling out
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: training for their staff in personal safety tactics. So while
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: the Northern Territory government did say or they committed to
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: staff training in their raft of crime measures following the
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: alleged murder of a bottel shop worker in Darwin, that
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: is yet to sort of be rolled out at this point.
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: So Berry Springs Tavern, Well Leasan and also Nunama's Tony
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: Innes there they are rolling out this training or they've
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: rolled out some of this training already for their staff.
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: Joining me in the studio right now is Leah Sloan.
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: Good morning to you.
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: Good morning high listeners, and.
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: I think we're going to try and catch up with
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: Tony as well a little bit later. But Leah tell us,
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: why did you decide to sort of go down this
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: path of offering your staff this additional training.
• 0:47
  Speaker 3: Well, Katie, look, obviously we're in a really unique environment
• 0:50
  Speaker 3: at the moment and to be honest, not a lot
• 0:53
  Speaker 3: is being done to support us quickly. We know there
• 0:56
  Speaker 3: was an announcement made around the propos delivery delivery of
• 1:01
  Speaker 3: training to our industry to support our team, and until
• 1:05
  Speaker 3: Friday we weren't given any information about that. By that stage,
• 1:08
  Speaker 3: Tony and I had already collaborated and gone to a
• 1:12
  Speaker 3: local business personal Protection Strategies and come up with a
• 1:16
  Speaker 3: six hour personalized specific de escalation and safe personal safety
• 1:22
  Speaker 3: strategy training which was perfect for our business times of.
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: The essence here, isn't it like not only in the
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: sense that there is very real and critical situations unfolding
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: right now, but also in terms of staff not being
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: able to have like a huge amount of time.
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: Away from work.
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:37
  Speaker 3: Absolutely, And the staff are nervous, you know, and they
• 1:40
  Speaker 3: need the schools right now. They don't need them in
• 1:42
  Speaker 3: a month or in six months, and they don't need
• 1:45
  Speaker 3: to be seeing in a classroom for four days learning
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: how to engage customers, which is what the anti government
• 1:50
  Speaker 3: have proposed.
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: Oh done so. The course that they've.
• 1:54
  Speaker 3: Proposed, which as I say, I didn't find out about
• 1:56
  Speaker 3: until Friday, once we'd already initiated our training, poses an
• 2:01
  Speaker 3: accredited course of over four days sitting in a classroom,
• 2:05
  Speaker 3: and one of the core units is how to engage customers.
• 2:09
  Speaker 3: I mean, I would question if I've got someone in
• 2:11
  Speaker 3: a customer facing role at this point, they should already
• 2:14
  Speaker 3: know how to engage customers.
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: That's not what we want to deliver to these people.
• 2:18
  Speaker 3: So basically, Tony and I sort of challenged the fact that,
• 2:21
  Speaker 3: come on, you're only going to support us with this
• 2:23
  Speaker 3: training if we're delivering something you're telling us that suits
• 2:27
  Speaker 3: our needs, you know. And sadly there's too much of
• 2:29
  Speaker 3: this that goes on, you know, and there has to
• 2:31
  Speaker 3: be someone that stands up and says, well, no, that's
• 2:32
  Speaker 3: not acceptable, it doesn't suit my business.
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: And look a part of that.
• 2:37
  Speaker 3: We had conversations with two representatives on Friday and said, well, look,
• 2:40
  Speaker 3: you know you're telling us we're only going to be
• 2:41
  Speaker 3: supported with funding if we're delivering what you're telling us
• 2:44
  Speaker 3: what we need. You know, what consultation have you done?
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: Who have you.
• 2:48
  Speaker 3: Spoken to to determine that this is the right thing
• 2:51
  Speaker 3: for our industry and our business. Apparently there was a
• 2:54
  Speaker 3: consultation done with over fifty businesses.
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: But you know, when I questioned, can you tell me
• 2:59
  Speaker 2: who that was?
• 3:00
  Speaker 3: You know, who determined that this was suitable to remove
• 3:02
  Speaker 3: someone from my business for four days to sit in
• 3:06
  Speaker 3: a classroom and learn a lot of what they should
• 3:08
  Speaker 3: already know at a large expense to the taxpayer.
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: As well as the business.
• 3:13
  Speaker 3: When you know we can achieve the same outcome, if
• 3:16
  Speaker 3: not a better outcome, in a six hour training session
• 3:19
  Speaker 3: at a lot less cost, it doesn't make sense. And
• 3:21
  Speaker 3: then when you challenge or you post questions about, well,
• 3:24
  Speaker 3: hold on, how did you get to this outcome that
• 3:26
  Speaker 3: you're enforcing on me, and you're only going to support
• 3:29
  Speaker 3: me financially if I deliver on that, then you shut down.
• 3:33
  Speaker 3: I was actually told that the Privacy Act wouldn't allow
• 3:35
  Speaker 3: me to know who they consulted with. Now I spoke
• 3:38
  Speaker 3: to just about every rural business, I spoke to most
• 3:41
  Speaker 3: city businesses. I've put it on a Facebook group chat,
• 3:44
  Speaker 3: and not one single person has come back to me
• 3:46
  Speaker 3: in a like business is said that they were consulted.
• 3:49
  Speaker 3: Not one single person in a like business has come
• 3:51
  Speaker 3: back to me and said that they're even aware of
• 3:52
  Speaker 3: this training program.
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: Because the reality here is is that it would be
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: really tough to have a large number of stuff or
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: any number of stuff out of action for four days
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: doing that training. And I get you know that that
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: training needs to happen, which is exactly why you have
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: embarked on that training yourselves off your own back, but
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: done it in a different way so that those stuff
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: then aren't out of action for such a long period
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: of time. Yeah.
• 4:15
  Speaker 3: Absolutely, And I think the really important thing to note
• 4:18
  Speaker 3: is this you on nine News last night, there was
• 4:20
  Speaker 3: a lot of physical stuff.
• 4:22
  Speaker 2: That's not what this course was about.
• 4:23
  Speaker 3: This course was about the primary goal of de escalating
• 4:27
  Speaker 3: and those techniques associated with that, including how you're poisoning
• 4:31
  Speaker 3: your body and your body language in your communication. So
• 4:34
  Speaker 3: it wasn't just rarah kongfu. It was how to have
• 4:38
  Speaker 3: these really good skills and apply them in most situations.
• 4:41
  Speaker 3: And look, you know they're not going to be applicable
• 4:43
  Speaker 3: to every situation. But when you've got a local company
• 4:46
  Speaker 3: that's prepared to come in come to you, that came
• 4:48
  Speaker 3: to us, and deliver a training that specific to your
• 4:51
  Speaker 3: needs right now and do it quickly, well, then that's
• 4:53
  Speaker 3: what we need. We don't need our team to be
• 4:55
  Speaker 3: sitting in a classroom for four days learning how to
• 4:57
  Speaker 3: engage customers.
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: Lee, talk me through what I did learn, Like, tell
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: me a little bit about some of the stuff that
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: your staff learned, because I know that you guys out
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: there at very Springs, same as Tony's crew out there
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: at the Nunama like a family. You know, everybody really
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: cares about each other and you look after each other.
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: So like, it's obvious to me that you're sort of
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: doing this because you want to make sure that your
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: staff are safe and you want to sort of arm
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: them with skills to be able to deal with different situations.
• 5:25
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Absolutely, And that's something I pointed out to the
• 5:26
  Speaker 3: antigovernment on Friday when I met with them. I'm not
• 5:28
  Speaker 3: here to argue with you, I'm not here to be difficult.
• 5:31
  Speaker 3: I'm here because I care about my community, i care
• 5:33
  Speaker 3: about my staff, and I want you to be listening
• 5:35
  Speaker 3: to the people on the ground who run business day
• 5:38
  Speaker 3: and day out and know how to do things costs,
• 5:40
  Speaker 3: cost effectively and time effectively, and they know how to
• 5:43
  Speaker 3: meet the needs of their team. Someone sitting behind a
• 5:45
  Speaker 3: desk coming and telling me what I need to deliver
• 5:48
  Speaker 3: to my staff to support them doesn't always work, particularly
• 5:51
  Speaker 3: when the consultation has not been appropriate.
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: So part of what they were taught was.
• 5:57
  Speaker 3: You know, being mindful of their physical attitude, the language
• 6:00
  Speaker 3: they're using, and visual cues to show that they're listening
• 6:03
  Speaker 3: those sorts of things which are really important and look,
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: you know, you should have certain elements of those in
• 6:08
  Speaker 3: your communication anyway, but when you're sitting down and you're
• 6:11
  Speaker 3: with a professional and being reminded.
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: Of those things, it's.
• 6:15
  Speaker 3: Really important and it triggers you just to really be
• 6:17
  Speaker 3: alert of how you're interacting with people and how you
• 6:19
  Speaker 3: might be able to easily de escalate something.
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: Not always, Like I said, it's not always going to work.
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: But the best we can do is support our team
• 6:26
  Speaker 3: and try and give them the tools to be safe
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: in their workplace. And I think, you know, we've done that,
• 6:33
  Speaker 3: and we've done it cost effectively, and we've done it quickly.
• 6:35
  Speaker 3: And we've got the anti government telling us that we
• 6:38
  Speaker 3: won't be supported financially because the training program that we've
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: chosen to use is not accredited, And.
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: Well are they from even getting a training program underway?
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: You know that would then take you out for four days?
• 6:52
  Speaker 3: Well, I believe it's in place, So they engage they
• 6:55
  Speaker 3: engage an interstate provider incidentally, to develop a three and
• 6:58
  Speaker 3: a half hour online training session.
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: So that's the first part of the course.
• 7:02
  Speaker 3: But when you register, you know, it's a fifteen minute
• 7:04
  Speaker 3: registration you've got to go through and you know, demonstrate
• 7:07
  Speaker 3: your mathematical capabilities and blah blah blah. Anyway, so you
• 7:11
  Speaker 3: go and do that, and then that leads on to
• 7:13
  Speaker 3: the CDU part of the program again. When I said, look,
• 7:16
  Speaker 3: I can't release my workers for four days, the solution
• 7:20
  Speaker 3: I was provided, well, look, why don't you space it
• 7:22
  Speaker 3: outo for over six months. It doesn't have to be
• 7:24
  Speaker 3: done at once. I said, that's not an adequate solution.
• 7:26
  Speaker 3: You know, I've got team members that need these skills now,
• 7:29
  Speaker 3: and your solution is to tell me that we should
• 7:31
  Speaker 3: space this out over six months. It's going to lose
• 7:33
  Speaker 3: momentum and it's not effective, you know. And I think
• 7:36
  Speaker 3: that's the issue that a lot of us are having
• 7:38
  Speaker 3: with government at the moment, is they actually don't want
• 7:41
  Speaker 3: to listen. So they sent people out to plicate me,
• 7:44
  Speaker 3: to sit down and tell me why I needed to
• 7:46
  Speaker 3: be doing this course. They were hearing me, but they
• 7:48
  Speaker 3: actually weren't listening to me, Katie. And when it was
• 7:51
  Speaker 3: escalated and my conversation was escalated to regional manager, the
• 7:55
  Speaker 3: conversation I had is you sent people out to talk
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: to me, but they were talking to me about why,
• 8:00
  Speaker 3: insisting why they're program they were implementing was right for
• 8:03
  Speaker 3: my business. They weren't listening to what I was saying,
• 8:05
  Speaker 3: and I said to them, look, I'm not expecting you
• 8:08
  Speaker 3: to introduce exactly what I'm saying, but at least listen
• 8:12
  Speaker 3: to me. Meet me halfway. I invited them to come
• 8:15
  Speaker 3: out and attend the training and tell me why it
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: was deemed too dangerous to personal safety, because that was
• 8:20
  Speaker 3: the other reason that they wouldn't support us with the training.
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: So there was two reasons. One it wasn't accredited.
• 8:25
  Speaker 3: The second reason was that it was it posed a
• 8:28
  Speaker 3: potential risk to personal safety, so the government could support
• 8:31
  Speaker 3: the training. And I said, as I invited them out
• 8:34
  Speaker 3: to attend it so they could say, look, tell me
• 8:36
  Speaker 3: exactly what's dangerous and look, maybe we could talk about changing.
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: After having staff attend that training, now, do you feel
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: as though it's been a helpful scenario for them? And
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: what's the feedback then from the staff?
• 8:47
  Speaker 3: Absolutely, on multiple levels, because we've collaborated with Nunamar, we've
• 8:51
  Speaker 3: got that cohesive relationship now that we've got the team
• 8:54
  Speaker 3: working together. And they all came back to work yesterday,
• 8:57
  Speaker 3: they were pumped and they were just pumped because they
• 9:00
  Speaker 3: know that we were investing in them. They know we're
• 9:02
  Speaker 3: actually caring about their real needs and the tools that
• 9:04
  Speaker 3: they need to best do their jobs and best keep
• 9:08
  Speaker 3: themselves safe. And you know, and we're taking action despite
• 9:11
  Speaker 3: the lack of government support. So you know, the staff
• 9:14
  Speaker 3: are feeling supported, they're feeling motivated. And I'll tell you what,
• 9:17
  Speaker 3: We're a short skilled industry. That's what they need. They
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: don't need to be taken out of an industry where
• 9:21
  Speaker 3: we can barely cover shifts and sit in the classroom
• 9:23
  Speaker 3: for four days and learn how to engage customers.
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: Now, tell me as well, because you guys, unfortunately have
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: been subjected to issues of crime. You know, it's very
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: well documented on this show. We've certainly spoken to you before.
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: We'd spoken to Ian last year when it was a
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: terrible situation where you had staff members, one including your daughter,
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: who were hiding in the office space as somebody ram
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: rated your business.
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: It was incredibly frightening, absolutely.
• 9:53
  Speaker 3: Katie, and I think that's you know, it is very
• 9:54
  Speaker 3: personal to me. We had two female staff on premise.
• 9:58
  Speaker 3: I mean, it doesn't matter a female male. We had
• 9:59
  Speaker 3: to staff on premises. They heard a noise. Our venue
• 10:02
  Speaker 3: was ram rated by ten men they had weapons, some
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: of them were intoxicated. My team, my two team members
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: had thirty seconds to get themselves safe and luckily they
• 10:16
  Speaker 3: had the smarts to run into the office lock the door.
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: But they stood in that office for six minutes, Katie
• 10:21
  Speaker 3: and watched the footage while ten men raided my venue.
• 10:25
  Speaker 3: Now they're both they're still in counseling those people, and
• 10:28
  Speaker 3: this is the thing that was six months ago. And
• 10:29
  Speaker 3: the government came out and met with me because again,
• 10:32
  Speaker 3: I you know, I had a voice, and sadly, the
• 10:34
  Speaker 3: thing is, you know, you have to.
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: Stand up and have a voice for anything to be done.
• 10:38
  Speaker 3: But you know, they came out and met with me
• 10:39
  Speaker 3: and said, oh, I'm so sorry, you know this has happened.
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: But I haven't had words, you know, back since I.
• 10:44
  Speaker 3: Actually gave them an a four handout and said, these
• 10:46
  Speaker 3: are all the issues that need to be attended to.
• 10:48
  Speaker 3: These are my concerns. You know, I'm giving you a
• 10:51
  Speaker 3: handout so you don't forget them. And I'm giving you
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: a handout so you don't forget to get back to me.
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: And you know what, I haven't.
• 10:56
  Speaker 3: Heard a thing, you know, So it's just it's just
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: a typical example of the you know, lip service that
• 11:03
  Speaker 3: we're getting and you know, the inaction and people are
• 11:07
  Speaker 3: sick of it. You know, we're trying hard to operate.
• 11:09
  Speaker 3: Good businesses, community businesses, support our team, and we're getting
• 11:14
  Speaker 3: lip service, Lea.
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: Based on what the government's announced as well, since the
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: absolute tragic loss of Declan lavity, do you you know,
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: based on what you're telling me this morning, but also
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: following on from the announcements that they've made, do you
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: feel as though the measures that they've put in place
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: are going to help you to be able to keep
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: your staff safe.
• 11:34
  Speaker 3: Well, my question is they've decided that it's appropriate to
• 11:36
  Speaker 3: have police at the bottle shops in Alice Springs, and
• 11:39
  Speaker 3: they determined that a long time ago because there was
• 11:42
  Speaker 3: you know, inappropriate behavior. But you know, it's not appropriate
• 11:45
  Speaker 3: for DULLM bottle shops to have that funding because what
• 11:50
  Speaker 3: someone's very very sadly has lost their life.
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: You know that they have decided.
• 11:55
  Speaker 3: Well, I actually again, I only found out yesterday because
• 11:57
  Speaker 3: I escalated a conversation and demanded some man. But I
• 12:01
  Speaker 3: was told, oh, look, we're going to fund forty five
• 12:03
  Speaker 3: dollars an hour for security guards in your venue. Or
• 12:07
  Speaker 3: a security guard for the time that you're open. But again, like,
• 12:10
  Speaker 3: where is the roll out of this? You know, I'm
• 12:12
  Speaker 3: only getting this information because I'm demanding it, But where
• 12:15
  Speaker 3: is this being rolled out? Where are we being consulted
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: with or communicated?
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: So it's all pretty slow moving by one hundred percent.
• 12:22
  Speaker 3: Is one hundred percent is And you know, as I say,
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: it's that just does not seem to be adequate consultation.
• 12:27
  Speaker 3: And if there is, nobody knows about it, and if
• 12:29
  Speaker 3: you dare ask about it, you're not able to know.
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: Well, the thing is, like you guys are one of
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: the bigger venues in the Northern Territory right now. You know,
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: you would think that you would know what is going on.
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: You would think, particularly the fact that you have faced
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: those issues of crime and ram raid, that you would
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: be communicated with.
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: One hundred percent. And you know what, we're owner operators.
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: You know, the government know that, they know we're passionate,
• 12:54
  Speaker 3: they know we're territory people, they know we've been in
• 12:56
  Speaker 3: business here a long time, you know, So why aren't
• 12:58
  Speaker 3: these conversations being It's because they don't want to listen
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: to anything that doesn't fall in line with what their
• 13:04
  Speaker 3: ideas are. And the minute you say something that that
• 13:07
  Speaker 3: is disputing anything that they're deciding to deliver or roll out,
• 13:11
  Speaker 3: then you're, you know, you're branded a troublemaker. And it's
• 13:14
  Speaker 3: ridiculous because these conversations. You know, these these people forget
• 13:17
  Speaker 3: that they're working for the tax payer, they're working for us,
• 13:20
  Speaker 3: they're working for the businesses that are paying their wages.
• 13:23
  Speaker 3: You know, they should be listening to us, they should
• 13:25
  Speaker 3: be consulting with us, and instead of you know, coming
• 13:27
  Speaker 3: up with ideas on their own, they should be actually
• 13:29
  Speaker 3: taking that and putting practical, cost effective and time effective
• 13:34
  Speaker 3: solutions in place.
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: And I'm not sure if.
• 13:35
  Speaker 3: You really quickly, Katie, I can mention the cost. You know,
• 13:39
  Speaker 3: the cost of the session that we're delivering. We delivered
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: was three hundred and thirty per person inclusive a GST and.
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: Rolled out over six hours.
• 13:48
  Speaker 3: The cost of the CDO course, from what I'm led
• 13:50
  Speaker 3: to believe, is one thousand dollars per person over a
• 13:55
  Speaker 3: space of four days. So we're having to remove our
• 13:57
  Speaker 3: staff from business. You know, the wages is nine thousand
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: dollars to get ten staff through that course. The wages
• 14:02
  Speaker 3: to get the staff through a six hour course is
• 14:05
  Speaker 3: seventeen hundred dollars, you know, So for what we've proposed,
• 14:09
  Speaker 3: what we're doing, it's a third of the cost to
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: business or taxpayer whoever foots the bill for the course itself,
• 14:15
  Speaker 3: and it's a fifth of the cost in wages, you know,
• 14:17
  Speaker 3: let alone having it done in a timely manner. So
• 14:20
  Speaker 3: I dare say it, but I think it's time that
• 14:22
  Speaker 3: the government is looking at the way they do things
• 14:24
  Speaker 3: from a business perspective rather than a playground.
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: Well, Leah, I really appreciate your time this morning. It
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: is good to catch up with you as always, and
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: you know, I actually think it makes quite a bit
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: of common sense to speak to the businesses that are
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: being impacted to find out, you know, whether it's going
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: to work for you, whether it is going to be effective,
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: because if it's not, it's not going to work, you know,
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: and this is where you do actually need to engage
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: with the community on the different decisions that you're making.
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: So I really appreciate your time this morning.
• 14:52
  Speaker 2: Thank you. Katie has engaged with customers.
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: That's one of the courses that they've suggested perhaps should
• 14:57
  Speaker 3: be rolled out internally.
• 14:58
  Speaker 2: Well, thank you very much.
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: For your time this morning, Leah Sloane, always good to
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: catch up with you.
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: Thank you,