Latest / After Maghrib 🌙 / The dark side of Faith (ft. Sayed Jawad Elhassan)

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The dark side of Faith (ft. Sayed Jawad Elhassan) · After Maghrib 🌙

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conversation with the wonderful amazing brother Saeed Jawad Al
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Hassan Assalamu Alaikum Mahmatullahi or Barakat.
2:09
Saeedna. It's good to have you on here.
2:11
Thank you very much for having me.
2:12
It's an honour to be in After Moral Podcast as usual.
2:15
Habi Habi, the last time you were here, you were a guest.
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I was and it was in particular episode 95 and I think the
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discussion was how she are you or something along those lines
2:28
and you why are you a Shia accent and you are suited and
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booted. Me and Ahmed were wearing White
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Star shirt while you were here Marsha a lot.
2:37
You know, Noor and I don't know and I've got a question and you
2:42
went to a wedding. May Allah bless the brother.
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But but I genuinely rate you that you you went to the
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wedding, took a pause, came to the podcast, went back to the
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wedding. May Allah bless you.
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That's a commitment and a Hoff. And there's like The thing is,
2:57
in my head I thought how is this going to work out, but I
3:00
haven't. It worked out very well.
3:01
Had the wedding celebrated with my friend then, even though I
3:04
was stressing a bit. That's why even if you can see
3:06
the podcast like my mind wasn't 100% without podcast.
3:10
Neither was in the wedding but I felt.
3:12
Like it was my banal gender T1, not the.
3:16
Wedding wasn't that bad. La Habibi Habibi no, it was a
3:19
was a fantastic episode and I encourage all the viewers at
3:22
home. Please, please go listen to that
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episode. Episode 95 and Inshallah will
3:26
strengthen Yo Willaya and Amir al Mamunin Alihi Abdullah Salati
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waske Salaam. Say Joe, what?
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I've got a question. Go ahead.
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What's your question? What do you think about the
3:39
podcasts generically After Mahreb?
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And yeah yeah I would say you're a good friend of the podcast.
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The brothers behind the scenes were good friends, mutual
3:47
friends with you. How do you see After Mahreb?
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Like was 2 good things and one negative thing that we can
3:54
improve on Shalwa. OK, so do you think that I'll
3:57
say is the +1 of them is that shows how proud of your how
4:03
proud you are when it comes to become a Shah Muslim?
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Because if we think about it when it comes to social media
4:09
work, yeah, not a lot of Shia do publish something like this,
4:14
something that shows that you're proud Shia.
4:15
And he showed the world that we are normal people, we're normal
4:19
human being, not like how we've been patrioting social media.
4:22
Like if someone thinking who are Shia and what are Shia I think
4:27
it's after market podcast is one of the best examples to show who
4:30
she are. Shal shal.
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That's. Number one, Number two is the
4:33
the fact that you bring a lot of scorers from around the world to
4:37
share the knowledge and the teaching of Alberta Animosena.
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One negative thing, I don't think.
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There has to be. There is.
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Say it, say it, say it. All right.
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So I'll say is that. Open your ears.
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Say most of all. I feel like the element of
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having more like relatable things like yes, most of the
4:58
time I speak about is relating to people, but however is I feel
5:02
like there should be, maybe there's one more push to do to
5:06
make sure that the people that are following you or watch you
5:09
or would love to watch you is feel more related.
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Like especially when you talk about, I mean today's episode
5:16
maybe is one of them that when you talk about things that are
5:18
related to the problem that the youth have today, especially
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Shia youth. Yeah.
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That's one of the things I would say about.
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Inshallah, inshallah we're taking notes and we will improve
5:28
being Allah and I did mention, said Mushtabal.
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Shout out to said Mushtabal Hosseini who I'm still praying
5:34
inshallah Allah ransom a noble wife inshallah said Mushtabal
5:38
said he's 1 icebreaker for us so he set out some dilemmas for us
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to kick start the conversation, said Mushtabal.
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Hand over to you, I. Like to say it's suggestion of
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become more reliable. I.
5:50
Think it's definitely something we struggle with because like
5:53
it's hard to do it week in week out when people we have topics
5:56
that people relate to. Sometimes it works, sometimes it
5:59
doesn't. But.
6:01
It's definitely a struggle to start things off.
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I've pulled out three, three or four.
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I don't know. We'll see how many we get
6:07
through dilemmas that I came across on Shia Reddit.
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Shia Reddit. The first one, I'll go with
6:15
Salaam alaikum. Salaam alaikum, brothers and
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sisters. I'm a closeted A newly reverted
6:22
12A Shia Muslim from a Sunni family.
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Do you have any resources to help me out?
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Where? Where should I start?
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So. So in terms of like
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understanding religion more. Anything like if If you've just
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become Shia, what is a good place to start looking for?
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So this brother, he's become a 12A Shia Pandallah, may Allah
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bless him, and he's come from a background which is a Sunni
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family. Where does he start?
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I'd love to know how he became a Shia firstly but.
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He hasn't put that that. Yeah, he hasn't put that, huh?
6:56
No. OK, OK, where?
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Where do we begin? Say it.
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So I think one of the best ways to get in contact with the
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scholar that maybe look around and see like a centre that's
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local to you and meet the person in charge of the centre and they
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will help you. That's number one.
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Number two is also nowadays it's not very hard to gain
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information from the Internet yes from 1 bar and you can
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search in who is your Ali? Who is my man?
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Who is my Hassan No one Hussein why a Shia Islam the truth All
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this information will be in the Internet.
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So searching up will be good and there's one website that Islam
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the dog very very, very. Good.
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That's a very helpful resource. Yes.
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You can go to the website and Sharla will be helping him.
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Amazing, amazing. I like to say it's first point
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where reach out to a scholar, but I think more specifically
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you can reach out to someone you could meet online on Instagram
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like brother Mohammed Ali. I don't want.
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To put him on. The spot he gets a lot of people
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who. Reach out to him who ask him
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questions and people are normally open to like speak to
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new newly reverse online, especially on Instagram.
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And I think that that's really helpful to have a friend on
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hand. What about you said?
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Yeah, I would. I think that first point that
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said mentioned, which was to reach out to a scholar.
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I think that's the cherry on top because anyone can research into
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religion or anyone can open up texts and interpret it religion
8:27
as they seem fit. But when you go to a learner
8:31
scholar, he becomes the spiritual guide on your on that
8:35
journey. And I think he can answer all
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the questions you may have any doubts that you may have
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amicably and he without like if we if you go to any person or if
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you go online, you start debating polemics.
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And I think that's the worst place to start because you you
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will have a clouded mind. You won't be able to comprehend
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hack even if you see it or hear it.
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You wouldn't know if that's if that's the right way.
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When you go to a learner scholar, when you go to an
9:04
Harlem, they can, yeah. And based on my experience on
9:09
Hamdulham, Shia. But when I go to a scholar,
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compared to if I go to anyone else, when I speak to an island,
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he gives me the answer. I know full well I'm satisfied
9:17
with that, right. I can go home, sleep well
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knowing that you know what, I had that doubt answered or I had
9:24
that, for example. It's mainly historic.
9:27
I think when people come from Sunni backgrounds to Shia, any
9:30
historical differences we may have, they will answer it
9:33
correctly. Inshallah.
9:34
Inshallah. Yeah.
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Yeah. OK, the next one might be a bit
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more difficult. Maybe say that Ali is better.
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To answer this. If I'm living in a place where
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it's mentally exhausting, causing me to get further away
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from religion, whether it's like your in laws causing you trouble
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or your community affecting you, what advice do you have for
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someone in that position? So someone who's got like the.
10:03
The the the community they're involved in, where they're
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living, their living situation, their family might be causing
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them to get further and further away from religion.
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OK, I, I don't know the full circumstances, but I would say,
10:18
for example, change your community.
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Yeah. And if you feel like your
10:22
community is holding you back, if you feel like your community
10:24
may be toxic on your spirituality, on your faith, I
10:27
think you've got to change. And I think sometimes we find we
10:30
go to certain communities, we feel like something ain't right
10:34
there, you know? Yeah.
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It doesn't mean you stay there for the rest of your life.
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You know, Horosol, Allah left my care, went to Medina, right?
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So sometimes the answer is not by staying where you are, it's
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actually getting out of your comfort zone and going to places
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where you think they have the answers, the remedy or the cure
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to what you're seeking. And inshallah, I would say
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firstly, if it's Islamic issues. So I'm not sure full well what
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the what the brother was saying in terms of what the problems he
11:02
was facing. But this Islamic issue is going
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back to the first point you mentioned, go speak to a
11:05
scholar. That's the first thing you
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should do. If you have a good relationship
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with your family, speak to your father, speak to your uncle,
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speak to your grandfather. I'm sure though they will help
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you and aid you in the right direction and to the ways and
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the paths that one should take. But I would say find good
11:19
friends and you try and make good friends because a community
11:23
without friends, you're still lonely.
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I, I'll say this so loudly, I need you because we find many
11:29
people and this is a sad reality.
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And I think even during the month of Ramadan, said Mushaba
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knows this, that we know, for example, of a brother who's part
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of the community, but they're not friends with him.
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And he feels alone. He feels isolated.
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He feels like there's no way he can turn to.
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There's no one he can speak with.
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And I think if we find people like this in our community, we
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should reach out to them. We should say Salaam to them,
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extend our hands to them and invite them to our gatherings,
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to our homes, to any, how can I say discussion circles, one may
11:58
have events that we do. Yeah.
12:00
Yeah. And these things are important.
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So that keeps people, I think, in line and knowing Inshallah,
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what to do if they find themselves in that scenario.
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But I would say, you know, always reach out to experts in
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the field, yeah. I can't agree more.
12:15
Yeah, say that. What?
12:15
How would you suggest someone can learn to love their faith
12:18
without moving out? Without moving out as a bit.
12:22
So if you're in that environment, yeah, I think in a
12:25
way it's, for example, we can think about it like this, right,
12:28
in Iraq or in our background countries.
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Yeah. Religion is a is a normal thing,
12:33
like being a Muslim Shia, you're born as a Muslim Shia and
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everyone around is a Muslim Shia.
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But are they practicing Muslim Shia?
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Yes, they might be. But at the same time, because
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it's normal to them, they don't see the value of religion in
12:44
Islam. But us in the West, here, we see
12:48
the difference. We see that how corrupted a man
12:50
can be or a woman and without having religion, yet we stick
12:54
very strong literature because while you understand the value
12:57
that we have, so they can use that gain that understand that
13:00
or I am maybe the only one that's doing right here.
13:03
I might stick to my belief because at the end of the day
13:06
it's all about how strong is your willpower is.
13:09
Yeah. If you don't have willpower,
13:11
even if you move to the place where everyone is here and is a
13:15
good environment, you'll be corrupted.
13:18
So what you need to think of is how can I make this space fair?
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You need to try first. And if you if you did try and
13:24
you see that didn't work out, fair enough, you have to move
13:26
out. But you need to keep trying and
13:29
have your own effect in a way you.
13:31
Know. On that point, when I first
13:33
started working at my, the place I work at, I was very nervous
13:36
because everyone I didn't know who the people were there.
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And then when I, when I first moved there, Salah was like a
13:45
sort of, it's something that people avoided, although
13:48
everyone was there was, there was that was Muslim, it was an
13:50
Arab company, but people used to avoid Salah.
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And then there was me and another brother who we used to
13:56
go during the break time and pray.
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And the elders who were working there were all from back home.
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They were, as you call it, fresh off the boat.
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And when whenever they saw us, they're like back home.
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We never learnt. Oh yeah.
14:08
And Islam was part and part of our day, but we never
14:11
appreciated religion. And now that we see how you guys
14:14
appreciate it. And now it's become a thing
14:16
where during break time everyone does Jamaat or whatever, whether
14:20
they're Sunni or Shia or they, I mean, it's a respected thing now
14:23
and they've sort, we sort of like learned to love the
14:25
environment now because of that. Hello, hello, last one.
14:30
How would you respond if you saw someone disrespecting your
14:33
faith, a place of work or school?
14:36
Whether it be disrespecting the Quran, tearing pages out or
14:39
pulling the hijab or stuff like that, How do you approach them?
14:44
I don't know about putting the hijab.
14:45
I think I can't stop. No, like attacking back the
14:49
hijab is something else. But let's say Quran, it says and
14:55
the Quran says itself and talk to them in a better way, in a
14:58
better manners. You can't really curse them or
15:02
like install them in a way because the Quran says do not
15:04
insult their God as they're going to insult you back.
15:06
But you don't know any. Oh, you can't hear it, so it's
15:10
better way. It's just I think.
15:11
Yeah, it's a bad one. This, for example, if you find
15:13
or see someone there and there like you're out, someone's
15:17
ripping out the Quran or something.
15:19
I think it's a difficult place to be both mentally because you
15:23
want to do something, but you also want to represent the faith
15:26
in the best way that you can. And we see the examples of that.
15:29
What's that Iraqi guy that was burning Qurans in Sweden?
15:32
Salwan, his name was Salwan. He was going on like every
15:35
single week and I used to come across as videos and he used to
15:38
engulf me in anger and I was in rage.
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How can this individual do such a thing if a subhanallah has a
15:46
Messiah as well? He's no longer with us today.
15:50
Hamdallah Hamdallah the the burning of the Quran has ended
15:53
by that guy. Even the example of if you find
15:56
someone pulling off the hijab, I think that's like a red line
16:02
man. That's, that's that's something.
16:03
Even, for example, if the sister is not part of our woman folk,
16:07
any Muslim sisters, our sister. 100%.
16:09
And if something happens to them, it hurts us.
16:11
And inshallah, we will do as men, protect them and defend
16:14
them wherever the scenario takes place.
16:19
Say it's given us some hard. That's a good way to hard of
16:22
weaponizing religion. Yeah.
16:24
Weaponizing religion. Yeah.
16:25
It's a conversation I think we wanted to have.
16:28
Jawad. We spoke briefly before the
16:31
podcast, said today that we want to go over some points, maybe
16:33
inshallah we get the time to do so.
16:35
But weaponizing religion is where people, individuals who
16:42
are we're going to talk in a Muslim context, one Muslim that
16:45
use sometimes perhaps certain text such as Quranic verses they
16:50
come across or a hadith literature where they, for
16:56
example, want to assert control, be it through instilling fear in
17:03
them, the fear of God cause punishment or for example,
17:07
gaslighting them. And it comes in many forms, but
17:10
in particular always mainly happens at home.
17:13
Yeah. And when it comes to like
17:14
studies, when you when you when you see victims who speak about
17:19
this, it's normally done behind closed doors.
17:21
So normally you find, for example, mainly husbands.
17:25
And it's sad to say this. I was right.
17:27
Husbands, men use for example, the Quranic verse I think is in
17:35
chapter 4, verse 34, where for example, you know, you need to
17:41
obey me as a husband and you do whatever I want.
17:43
And if you don't, if you disobey me, then that's you're going to
17:46
end up in hell and you're not fulfilling your rights.
17:48
And XY is that's always, that's like one scenario.
17:50
Then another scenario is, for example, to find parents who
17:55
want to give religious upbringing to their children and
17:59
for example, say, you know what, if you're not praying, Allah is
18:02
going to throw you in the pits of Hellfire.
18:05
So these are certain scenarios where I feel like sometimes we
18:08
weaponize Islam and it is happening.
18:10
Sometimes we know of cases that happen from communities that we
18:15
are, we come from or for example, we know at times
18:19
friends who say, you know, I said this to my wife or later on
18:24
when we become fathers, we had how do you we'll say, for
18:28
example, how do you raise your child?
18:30
Sadly, some beat their kids to raise them Islamically, while
18:34
others show them the path of Allah Subhanahu and the love of
18:37
Allah, which is the right approach.
18:39
So it's weaponizing. Islam comes in many, many, many
18:42
different forms. You know, just last week we
18:43
spoke about, for example, spiritual abuse.
18:47
So it falls on the so much categories, but I think in
18:51
particular when it comes to this marriage, marriage, because I
18:54
think that's where it mainly happens.
18:57
Why do we think this happens? Why?
18:59
Like why do we see men use, for example, religious texts to
19:03
control their women? It's a mad question, but I but I
19:08
think we have to discuss it. It's very important and we to
19:11
also like make people aware of Amazon.
19:15
So to talk about this is a bit, you know, but I would say is
19:20
mainly mankind is selfish, especially nowadays.
19:23
We grew up in a culture, especially the UK culture.
19:25
It's all about me, me, me more than like the community, the
19:29
family. And one thing that you need to
19:32
understand that everyone is like going against us.
19:37
They're always focusing on family because why?
19:39
If you don't have a stable family, therefore you don't have
19:41
a stable community. You don't have a stable
19:43
community. There's no future.
19:46
You have an immoral society. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
19:49
And the basis of the Assas community is family.
19:54
Yeah, it's a family unit. Sorry.
19:56
And where there's no family, there's no, there's no
19:58
community. Therefore you can't control
19:59
people the way you want. I'm not talking about like
20:03
someone who has just sees the community.
20:06
And I'm talking about, for example, there's, we always know
20:08
that there's always people fighting Islam.
20:10
They want to destroy Islam. Now they do that that way they
20:13
go through families, I think. And the best way to do it is
20:16
always social media. That's why I see them
20:17
controlling social media. So do you, do you think that,
20:20
for example, men are consuming contents?
20:22
Yes. Coming across content, What,
20:26
what's that phrase we normally use like the red pill and
20:29
whatnot? Do you think like that's
20:30
creeping into our homes? It is.
20:33
The thing is, we don't the things we don't understand that
20:36
we are what we see, we are what we hear.
20:38
We are what we eat. I've heard you are what you eat,
20:40
but I've never. It's all of them.
20:42
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. All of them.
20:43
Yeah, yeah. Your brain is like a stomach,
20:45
any information that it comes, your brain digested just like
20:48
how it digest food in your stomach and you don't think that
20:51
would have effect on you now. But it's always about them
20:54
planting the seeds in your head over your mind and that's how it
20:57
goes. They think that that's normal to
20:59
do. They normalize it.
21:00
And that's how like man of nowadays, especially the most of
21:03
the man thinking like I can use Islam in my way to get what I
21:06
want. Oh, that's crazy.
21:08
You know, even like sometimes we have stories of marriages that
21:15
have been, you know, like 30 years, 25 years, 20 years.
21:22
And it's never at the very beginning.
21:23
It's normally like during a very rough, rough period or after
21:27
they've had like five children. Masha'allah does eventually, for
21:31
example, the mother or the wife come out and say, for example, I
21:36
need help and you know, my, my husband has been controlling or
21:41
my husband has been, for example, abusive towards me and
21:45
using religion to control my life.
21:49
Basically, I as an example, let's say for example, there is
21:53
this, you know how we know as men we are financially
21:59
responsible for our women, especially our, our wives,
22:04
right? We, we, we should provide them
22:06
with shelter, with clothing, with food, the whole 9 yards.
22:12
There's men this day and age and say, believe it or not, that
22:14
they will say, for example, you know, I've paid all the bills,
22:18
I'm bringing the food on the table, I'm providing the
22:21
clothes, I'm paying the rent or the mortgage for the roof over
22:27
your head. And I'm doing so much.
22:30
You can't listen to me. And that's the bare minimum
22:35
that. Should not knowing that, that
22:38
regardless, this is your duty and responsibility as a man, you
22:41
chose to get married. And I think many men don't
22:44
realize this, that when you say, you know, I'm getting married,
22:46
that's a choice you make. It's your fault not knowing the,
22:49
the terms and conditions. You know, whenever there's
22:51
contracts, we say, you know, let's read the small print and
22:53
none of us do. We're not signing our lives that
22:55
way, right? But that's the reality of, of,
22:59
for example, of the do's and don'ts.
23:01
And what's your rights? What's her rights?
23:03
These are things I think that's not discussed enough in our
23:05
communities. And I've always said that I have
23:08
friends at Hamdullah who I think are mutual in the way that we
23:12
were raised and the way we see a marriage and a family unit.
23:15
And, you know, ultimately it's, you know, raising a family,
23:18
pleasing Allah and Shallah, we all end up in gender.
23:20
I mean, that's, that's, that's like the 123 the aim, right?
23:23
But many people know they get married so that they can become
23:27
free from the home. Like, for example, they get
23:29
married, so they don't listen need to listen to Mama Mama
23:32
anymore, right? And then that that just affects
23:35
the entire the the entire, how can I say life at home, be it
23:41
with the children, be it with the with the spouse.
23:43
But moving on just from marriages, what about the
23:46
children, man? You know, the children who, for
23:48
example, I'll share something maybe to give the view, the
23:53
listeners a bit understanding and so you can understand the
23:56
point that I want to discuss here.
23:59
Back in the day when I was, but we weren't even ballet man, we
24:04
were like 9/10/11. I still remember I had some
24:08
friends who if they did not do Salah Jamar, the father would
24:15
come and smack them in front of their friends, in front of
24:19
everyone, in front of the whole community.
24:21
And it was like, what's going on?
24:25
You have a Baba Gumrah Salih. I was playing, I was doing
24:29
something. The guy's like 9-10 years old by
24:31
the way. But he got the biggest smack
24:33
across his face, across his cheeks.
24:35
At that time. I can, I can even remember
24:37
hearing it going thing. It was like surround sound.
24:40
So I don't want to make a joke on it.
24:42
But this is not how we raise children, especially not at that
24:46
age, right? So what approach should we be
24:48
taking realistically? And if we say, for example, we
24:53
want our children to be raised righteous, you know, we aim for,
24:58
for example, we want that righteous child that Inshallah
25:01
will aid us in the day of judgement, aid his children as
25:04
well. Inshallah because it's we see as
25:06
a continuous journey like Inshallah if our grandfathers,
25:10
our forefathers and our fathers, our uncles, our sons, our
25:16
nephews, all of this also that Kajaria and Charlotte and the
25:19
way that they're raised. Should parents change the way
25:25
they speak with their kids? Yeah, honey, back in the day.
25:28
I know I don't think it happens as much now, but that still
25:30
exists. It does.
25:32
That exists behind closed doors where, for example, parents.
25:34
They pay their kids. Would instill the fear of Allah
25:37
as a wedge and to their children if they don't get up and stand
25:40
for Salah if there's no establishing Salah on time,
25:43
Salah alone not praying, but they're not standing in the
25:46
Salah on time. And then Allahu Akbar if they
25:49
don't see their son or daughter praying within the next 30
25:52
seconds. That's when they get into them.
25:54
They. Yeah, What's happening?
25:56
Why are some fathers like this? I think some of them is also
26:01
like maybe past experience, the way that their parents raise
26:04
them thinking, OK, that's the right way.
26:06
I'm going to do it in my kiss too, which is the wrong way.
26:08
People inherit things, you know, and the thing they don't
26:12
understand is Quran said is of like rafidin.
26:15
There's no hatred and religion. If you raise your kids in a way
26:19
where they think these things that are forced upon them to do,
26:22
they will not. They will go straight straight
26:24
away. What I made it very simple.
26:26
Be gentle to people. Islam is religion of peace and
26:30
compassion, not of what hatred and corruption no black is.
26:36
You meant to find a way that's unique to you to teach your kids
26:41
or your get your kids a way that they should love Islam in a
26:45
certain way. Anyone could find it
26:46
differently. But one of the most important
26:49
thing that a person should have is always knowledge.
26:51
Knowledge is protected from everything and without it no one
26:55
would raise the kids right. And I think people are lucky and
26:58
gain knowledge more than just like hearing things from me and
27:02
then just applied in their life. No, you should have actual
27:04
knowledge and apply it in life. You know, like how you mentioned
27:08
that have knowledge and apply it because sometimes we we know
27:11
what to do, but we don't implement in our lives, let
27:14
alone in our children, right? And it's funny you mentioned
27:16
this because I think I came across a bit early on, you know
27:19
how we have Rasulullah sallallahu, Hawaii, Hawaii
27:22
wasallam. He explains to us the like the
27:25
three stages of raising the children.
27:27
Like I think it's 777, right? In addition to that there is
27:32
like 6 rights a child has over you and I believe one of them
27:35
was that you give them knowledge and and many of this is is the
27:39
father's responsibility. So rather than setting them the
27:42
fair of Allah, teach them religion, teach them the way
27:45
it's supposed to be in inshallah.
27:47
You know they'll grow up God fearing of Takwa not of his
27:50
punishment. And we, you know, whenever we
27:54
speak about punishment affair of Allah, I always remember when he
27:57
says, I don't find I don't worship Allah affair of his
28:01
punishment, rather I find him worthy of worship.
28:04
And imagine raising your children on the love of Allah.
28:07
Span of what Allah they grow and they blossom, this love.
28:11
The heart is more open, they look forward to it.
28:14
You know the Prophet said to Bilal Alchemist Allah and he
28:20
called for the prayer so we can be healed with it or like any
28:24
not to get rid like OK, get done.
28:26
And that's the goal in life. No, to enjoy it to have that
28:29
like uplifting spirituality from Salah.
28:31
Oh, and. That gives you so cool bro.
28:33
And all of this is all the care remembrance and we say Allah,
28:40
it's important, I think to have this remembrance of Allah as the
28:43
worst span of it Allah instilled in our children.
28:46
But they look at us and I've always said sometimes we find,
28:49
for example, parents. And it's funny because normally
28:55
these stories come from scholars.
28:57
And this one actually, I think I, I heard that from Saita
29:00
dealing with the Rasi. And he was giving a lecture
29:03
once, St. Rasul Adam here in London a few
29:05
Muharram's ago. And he said one day a father
29:08
came to him and he told them, my son lies.
29:12
And he chanted guy 24/7. He lies about XY and Z.
29:17
What do I do? I need this.
29:18
I've never told him to lie. Yeah, and I've always told him
29:20
lying as Haram, you know, God will punish you and whatnot.
29:25
So this said when I spoke to the son, like, why you like this?
29:29
So this guy goes, my dad's a hypocrite.
29:32
He goes, he's telling you he doesn't lie.
29:34
He tells you he doesn't lie. When his friends call him and he
29:38
sees ringing on the phone, doesn't want to talk to them.
29:40
He says, Baba, you pick up the phone, tell him Dad's in the
29:42
shower or tell him dad he's not at home.
29:44
He left his phone at home, so he tells me not to lie, but he
29:48
lies, so I see him lying. Why shouldn't I lie?
29:51
You see, as you said, you know, people inherit.
29:55
So if they see, for example, Mama or Baba, your father or
29:57
your mother doing one thing and you saying something else,
30:01
they're more likely going to do what you do rather than what you
30:04
say. Because if you don't practice
30:06
what you preach, it's hypocrisy. Washy, washy hypocrisy.
30:11
And that's the best way because at the end of the day, your kids
30:13
always look up to you. Like when I was growing as a
30:15
child, also my mum and my dad, as those who will never do
30:19
mistake, they're perfect. And that's how all of us are,
30:21
the kids. So whatever they do, OK, I'm
30:23
gonna do that. I'm gonna do this.
30:24
I'm gonna do that. But really, truly, when you grow
30:26
up with one son, oh, our person is like us.
30:29
No one is perfect. They do mistakes as well.
30:31
But obviously they try their best to, you know, raise us in
30:35
the right way. You know, I love you mention
30:37
that because Subhanallah, just the other day I was frustrated
30:42
about something and my my daughter, she came to me and she
30:48
said something and because I was frustrated, I responded
30:51
normally, but I had like a higher tone like I was a bit
30:55
louder than usual in my response.
30:57
So she was confused and she went yesterday.
31:01
So this was last week. Yesterday she came and spoke
31:03
with me and she said something She said, Baba, you spoke so
31:08
loud to me the other day, but I know you wasn't angry.
31:12
And it hit me that she's still feeling something that I've done
31:16
indirectly, right. And and I explained to her
31:19
sometimes as adults, we do wrong and I didn't mean to and I
31:22
apologized and and I was I was a very beautiful father daughter
31:26
moment, right? And and I realized sometimes we
31:28
have to be aware of how even if we're not doing something wrong
31:32
to our children, sometimes just the way we speak could affect
31:37
them. Yeah.
31:38
If if she thinks I was talking loud, she may grow up thinking
31:42
talking loud is fine with other people.
31:44
Right. That's the thought I had.
31:45
I just thought I'd bring that into conversation of Speaking of
31:48
us. Yeah.
31:50
Habibi. Allah, Inshallah, one day we see
31:55
righteous children, many say jawads, running around serving
31:59
this beautiful religion. Habibi, we spoke about something
32:06
else, said. We spoke about some people, they
32:09
have some signs of mental ill health or for example, they feel
32:19
like they're in a stage of the Walters against them.
32:23
The doors are closing upon them or for example, they're facing
32:28
extreme levels of depression or anxiety.
32:33
Sometimes we guess like these people, maybe not us, but we see
32:36
it happens. Say it where, for example, if
32:39
someone is have is going through something that's affecting his
32:43
mental states, We don't say how can we help you?
32:46
We don't take him to a professional, to an expert in
32:48
the field to help resolve and find remedy for whatever he's
32:51
facing. We tell them what, Say it.
32:54
Sign Just pray. Pray to Allah.
32:56
That's it, yeah. Which is not wrong.
32:58
It's not wrong at all, but. But we say what you lack faith.
33:03
Lack faith in Allah. We say you lack Tawakkul and.
33:05
Allah, I don't have lack of faith.
33:07
And I know many people who sadly sometimes do face these big life
33:12
struggles. It is it can hit you really
33:14
hard, especially when you are, let's say in your 30s and you
33:17
have so much responsibilities. You can't just tell the guy, you
33:21
know what? You don't have taqwa and Allah.
33:24
You don't have belief in Allah. How do we address this?
33:29
How should we address this? I think everything and
33:32
especially the mental health, there's always two side of it.
33:34
You got the spiritual side and the physical side of it.
33:39
A lot of heart acid in the Quran that do not worry that a half of
33:44
what it has an Android be sad. Yeah.
33:46
So from what I can get from this verse is the a lot of power
33:50
that's telling you that there's two things that needs to answer
33:54
about depression and anxiety. Depression is where someone is
33:58
stuck in the past. Come move on from the past
34:01
anxiety someone who does not or thinks about the future all the
34:04
time. But we need to understand as
34:07
human, the only thing that we should be focusing on to to
34:12
improve our status when it comes to mental health is the present.
34:14
Because if you really think about it, past future is a man
34:17
made concept. First, understand things that
34:19
happened that will happen, like the future you think about it is
34:22
99.9% imagination. Like I'm going to ask you what's
34:26
going to happen in the next 20 minutes?
34:27
Are you going to tell me what's going to happen?
34:29
In the next 20 minutes, either we're still talking, yeah.
34:33
Well, precisely, you don't know. We don't know precisely.
34:35
So 99.9% is imagination, Yeah. And the past is just you stuck
34:40
in something that shouldn't be really stuck.
34:43
You can then listen from it and move on, but you don't move on.
34:46
So you'd understand that. And last part of the alley done
34:49
like the thing that happened in the past is for him to give you
34:51
a lesson to learn from it and lots of panel that always tested
34:54
believers with what they are capable of they.
34:57
They doesn't offer burden. Yes, yes.
34:59
So you need to understand that a loss always with you, keep faith
35:02
in a loss of panel data and also change the environment there and
35:06
sometimes the environment there and that you're in affect your
35:09
big time when it comes to mental health.
35:11
So at least it's two things I would say.
35:12
What would be a good environment?
35:15
A good environment is a place where it does not corrupt the
35:18
soul. That's number one.
35:19
I want to make sure that it keep you in your belief.
35:22
It keep you on gods when it comes to faith, duty and Islam.
35:25
Duty as #1 #2 is also to like us as a human being also.
35:30
We have our own desires. Some of these no harm desires,
35:33
normal desires, eating, drinking, enjoying it life.
35:37
So find the place where it's like you can do the things that
35:39
you love to do and the things that you hate or give you burden
35:43
on upon yourself. You can't stay away from it.
35:47
That's the best way I say you can do it.
35:50
Shall and shall. I'll take down both for sure.
35:52
That's good, good advice, good advice.
35:55
And I and I think a good place to be is for example, firstly
35:59
having a good family support. Open up to your family.
36:04
Open up to your family. And do as men we don't open.
36:06
Yeah, we don't. And we've had previous
36:08
conversations about this, by the way, even I think an episode we
36:11
recently had a brother Laurie started out where we spoke, for
36:14
example, Lucky men need God or men can cry and men like all
36:20
these things. I mean, we ball up everything.
36:23
So and we we sort of indirectly effects ourselves and those
36:29
around us. We should be going, I think,
36:33
speaking to, I wouldn't always say speak to more lands when it
36:39
comes to, for example, mental things, because you need both.
36:43
You need to speak to the Maulana and you need to speak to the
36:46
expert in mental ill health, for example, or someone who's an
36:50
expert in the field of dealing with anxiety and depression,
36:53
because you need both in this world.
36:56
You need gods. As I said, yeah, you need to
36:58
side the spiritual side and the physical.
36:59
Side and you need the physical side, right?
37:01
So you need the spiritual cure and the remedy from from this
37:05
world Yeah, I think it's a good, good combo.
37:08
Reminds me of a conversation we had many, many months ago.
37:13
Part of Aftermarket wasn't a podcast.
37:15
There was a live discussion panel we had at university and
37:18
we were joined by a doctor as well.
37:20
And this whole point was raised as well and we spoke about so
37:23
many things. It was an eye opener.
37:25
And it's online on YouTube I'm not sure I've said much of.
37:28
I can find out what the title was and we can mention it for
37:30
the viewers to go search up and listen to it.
37:33
It really helped me as well because during that time,
37:37
believe it or not, I I didn't have problems in my life, but
37:41
the amount of footage I was consuming from a Gaza destroyed
37:48
me. I can't tell you how much that
37:51
affected me, affected my sleep, affected how much I was able to
37:55
eat. I lost so much weight.
37:58
And then I realized like, I'm in this sort of stage, not because
38:01
something's happening, just because I'm, I'm concerned about
38:04
what's happening in Russia, right?
38:05
And this had affected me. But when I spoke to people about
38:09
it, I felt like I was able to calm down, take it in right, and
38:14
sort of still live life because I was sort of not allowing me to
38:17
continue at home. I was someone else at work.
38:21
I can then focus because all I was thinking about how they are
38:23
these poor, innocent civilians, women and children.
38:27
It was a huge thing and it and it took a toll.
38:28
It took a mental toll and it still does.
38:31
But had I not had those discussions with the people that
38:33
I did? Stuck in your head and or would.
38:35
Have yeah or would have eaten me alive.
38:37
So it was good that we discussed I think with professionals in
38:40
this field and have especially from Islamic environment.
38:43
So you get both the spiritual and the professional
38:47
intertwined, and it does go a very, very long way.
38:50
I don't know if there's anything else you want to add to this, to
38:53
the discussion. Say it's.
38:54
The the the video was called stress overload and mental
38:58
health. Stress, overload and mental
39:01
health. Doctor Sarfraz Jiraj.
39:03
Please please, wherever you are around the world if you are
39:06
suffering from any mental ill health or know someone although.
39:09
The conversation was mostly about stress in uni.
39:12
Yeah, yeah. No, it was relatable, especially
39:16
like the advice coming from from the doctor himself.
39:18
I think we can all implement it in our lives and it goes in
39:22
every aspect of our lives, not just at university level because
39:25
I think we were in a university setting.
39:27
So surrounding exams, anxiety of, you know, uncertain futures
39:31
and things like this, this, I think, I think the advice that
39:34
day changed my life. And so this very day today.
39:37
So please, please give that episode a listen.
39:39
Say Joe, what? How's the conversation going?
39:41
I mean, it's, I feel like it's much, we're much better than
39:44
what I expected it was. What did you expect?
39:47
I mean, I don't. Know it's just because the topic
39:49
is so is a bit hard to talk about, but then yeah.
39:52
Well, that's the whole point of this podcast is that we don't
39:55
sort of shy away from difficult discussions because sometimes
39:58
the reason why I think After Muscle Up has continued until
40:01
today. After 130 episodes, excluding
40:06
any outside podcast environment discussions, we've had them
40:09
panels and events. And inshallah more.
40:11
Inshallah, many more with your duas and the duas of our
40:14
listeners is that we discuss topics that at times we feel
40:19
like our centres are not discussing.
40:23
Not because we're better than them or not because we are
40:26
replacing them in, but never no way.
40:29
But every conversation has its environment and why can't we are
40:33
Shia Muslims living in the West discuss matters that relate to
40:36
us, that matter most to us, right.
40:38
I don't think every discussion that we have here in the last
40:41
130 episodes can be discussed in the mosque in the Hosseinia.
40:44
Maybe it can, but we don't have that express discussing them
40:47
because mainly we get the Mashallah, the powerful life
40:51
changing speakers during the Ramadan and Maharam and we're
40:53
more focused about spirituality, social issues and things like
40:57
that. And all depends by the way,
40:59
which community come from. Like Muharram, Iraq is normally
41:02
it's all about marriage and things like this outside of the
41:05
Mossiba. Like part of the lecture we'll
41:07
talk about, for example, families, family issues, social
41:11
issues and things like this. So it's not always that we get
41:14
this in the centre. So I think This is why the
41:17
podcasts and Sha Allah. We'll continue to live.
41:20
That's why people should listen to every episode that comes up
41:23
from After more. Report Yes, yes, yes, Inshallah
41:26
every episode. And that means you need to
41:28
subscribe. Smash that subscribe button.
41:30
Notification on. Keep the notification on and
41:33
please, please, please, if you found this episode beneficial to
41:37
you, share it with your friends, share it with your family and
41:40
inshallah they can also benefit from it as well.
41:42
And the fact that I mentioned we've done 130 episodes, that's
41:45
a lot of talking. I love talking, I love talking.
41:48
But on top of that, inshallah a lot of beneficial wisdom and
41:51
wise words. We've had huh is in 190. 190
41:56
episodes. No, bro. 190 is it the
41:59
construction it's in 190? Oh yeah, you're right, 130.
42:05
Say which they went to 2027. What was in the future?
42:12
I said we've had episodes that we haven't aired, so I'm not
42:14
going to get into that. I.
42:15
Think I'm including all our videos on the channel.
42:18
Yeah. So you've got other videos as
42:19
well. So hey, So hey, and we also have
42:21
Inshallah, I think in Muharram say we have some content coming
42:25
that's been working on behind the scenes now.
42:27
Asking answering the questions that we get regularly.
42:30
Answering questions that we get from viewers after matter of
42:33
viewers. Like normally they ask us, we
42:35
don't have to answer them. So this Inshallah will be a
42:37
special show. We've still got a couple more
42:39
left to record. So if people do want to get some
42:41
questions in, although we haven't publicly announced it,
42:44
yeah, send it in and we'll see if we can get.
42:46
Slide in the DMS of Aftermath. He's feeling to answer them.
42:49
And inshallah we can answer them correctly with the best advice
42:53
possible. And on top of that, we're
42:55
getting closer and closer to the sisters podcast.
42:58
So stay tuned to that as well. Say jawads, you've been amazing.
43:03
Thank you. And I and I know and Charlotte,
43:05
we're going to have many more discussions together here on
43:08
After Maghrib. Thank you very much for having
43:10
me. Hi baby guys, Charlie found this
43:12
episode beneficial. Wherever you're watching from
43:15
around the world, please please please keep us in your duas.
43:18
Keep Say Jawads in your duas as well so that we get to see him
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43:25
Inshallah said that we can continue this journey together
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