Latest / ADHD with Confidence | Overcome Anxiety & Self-Doubt, Christian ADHD Coach, ADHD in Women / 147 // The ADHD Productivity Manual, with Dr. Ari Tuckman

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147 // The ADHD Productivity Manual, with Dr. Ari Tuckman · ADHD with Confidence | Overcome Anxiety & Self-Doubt, Christian ADHD Coach, ADHD in Women

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If you have ever wondered how to be more productive with ADHD,
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today is a conversation you are not going to want to miss.
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I had the honor of interviewing Dr. Ari Tuchman, a counselor,
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an author, a renowned speaker, about his most recent book, The ADHD Productivity Manual.
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So make sure you click that follow button and stay till the end as there is
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going to be a lot, a lot of helpful information in today's episode.
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Are you tired of feeling like you don't fit in like you're not good enough the
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way you are in this podcast i will give you the strategies to build god-centered
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confidence so you can know in your heart that you do belong you are enough and
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you are made on purpose and with a purpose hey i'm kelsey sprong.
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Hey friends, welcome to the ADHD with Confidence podcast. I'm your host,
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Kelsey, and today I am honored to be joined by Dr.
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Ari Tuchman. Welcome, thanks for being on the show.
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Glad to be here. So we have finally made it work, and I'm excited to hear all
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of the expertise you have to share with us, and in particular,
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your most recent book, The ADHD Productivity Manual.
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Can you start us off by telling us about your journey with ADHD,
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both personally and professionally?
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Sure. So I don't actually have ADHD myself, but many people in my life do.
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Now, the fact that I know a lot of people now with ADHD isn't surprising because
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like so many of my friends from the world of ADHD, right, they have ADHD themselves.
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But what's sort of funny is, you know, so when I was growing up,
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we didn't, obviously ADHD existed, but we didn't really know that much about it.
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But as I've sort of looked back on the people in the various stages of my life,
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so like, you know, K to 12 and then college and then grad school and then.
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There's a bunch of people who like clearly had ADHD or there's a couple of guys
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from high school where they actually told me, you know, as adults now that they had been diagnosed.
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I have a friend of mine from grad school who I will bet not only all of my money,
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but I will bet all of your money that she has ADHD, right?
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So it's just sort of like I've always kind of like resonated and been attracted,
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I think, to folks with ADHD, even though I didn't really know it.
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So, so yeah, it just kind of, it just kind of worked out that way.
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And then when I, you know, I came out of grad school in the late nineties,
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I was trying to figure out like, what am I doing here as a psychologist in the world?
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I kind of stumbled into adult ADHD, which was really kind of like ignored and neglected.
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So, you know, it was kind of easy to kind of make a name and do some good work
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and, you know, sort of promote more awareness about this.
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So, and it's, I don't know, it's been a good place to be, right?
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It's a nice neighborhood to hang out in.
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I mean, I would, I'm a little bit biased. I do have ADHD, but I would have to agree.
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I can, I can sense out the other people with ADHD. When I go to the coffee shop,
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we, we find each other, we see each other.
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I was actually curious when you said that, that friend from
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grad school where you could just you could bet your
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money my money what was it that that tipped
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you off to the fact that she has adhd so you
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know and again at the time wasn't on
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my radar right it wasn't really a thing we were thinking about
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but but like i mean she like great person obviously right i wouldn't be friends
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and hang out with her otherwise but like god was she unreliable you know like
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we made plans and then there was just oh not always but there was more often than for other people.
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Something happened right and it was
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either like you know she didn't finish
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her homework and needed to do it or other
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sort of mismanaging of time or i don't know like this one time she couldn't
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close her front door and she couldn't figure it out and then eventually figured
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out there was like a penny was like stuck in the like so wouldn't allow the
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door to close i lent her i don't know So how did this happen?
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Like I lent her my keys or something and she went to the local convenience store
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or whatever the brand was around here.
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And somehow like walked in with my keys, but walked out without them.
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She probably had to pick something up, you know? Right. Exactly.
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Right. And then like poof, gone. You know, so just like in like a thousand other
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examples like that, that just like now I know.
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Right in about two minutes I'd be like oh I think
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I recognize this pattern but of course at the time we
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didn't really know it so yeah yeah
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so it's just kind of that which you know in hindsight is kind of funny yeah
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no and that's the thing obviously for her she probably if at a point she found
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out got diagnosed she probably recognized a lot of different patterns and had
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better supports and I'm just thinking for anyone listening who is struggling
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with that feeling of being unreliable,
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just want to say there is there is hope and I know that's something that you
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talk about in the book as well as the social side.
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I don't know if you call it the social side of productivity or of ADHD but I
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thought that was really nice that you cover that aspect as well I'm a firm believer of,
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I don't think having ADHD means you can't succeed, you can't do well,
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you can't be, you know, a great friend and a great person and do well in life.
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But I think the fact that you talk about of even making sure people know your
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best of intentions to start off with, I thought that was a really helpful thing
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to point out and for me to think of as well.
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Because even when you talk about this girl from grad school,
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you know, I think back and I always just thought, oh, well, I'm just kind of bubbly and fun.
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But I would leave in the middle of my own sentence talking to somebody,
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not recognizing, and then I would just laugh about it later,
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you know, but then recognizing,
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okay, sure, there's the quirky, the fun, the spontaneous, and then there's also
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the people who are going to be upset if we, you know, bail on them or whatever it is.
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So, OK, so on to your book. So the ADHD Productivity Manual.
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What was it that inspired you to write this book in particular?
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Sure. So, well, so this is my fifth book.
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And, you know, so I've written a lot of other stuff and I presented a lot of other stuff.
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But I kind of feel like, you know, in a lot of ways, ADHD is really about productivity, right?
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Or things not, you know, being productive.
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So both in terms of the struggles that people have, again, especially if they're
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sort of undiagnosed, untreated, you know, they're sort of winging it in terms of managing it.
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But also in terms of like, you know, often what is the purpose of treatment
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and education and like, you know, like learning how to manage it more effectively
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is it ultimately becomes about kind of getting more done.
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And, you know, as a psychologist who spends all day talking to clients about this stuff,
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you know, what became clear is that there's no like one or two things,
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you know, it's not as simple as like set more reminders on your phone and your
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ADHD will be solved, you know.
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That there's a lot that goes into it in terms of like, are you getting stuff done or not?
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And some of it is, you know, like basic stuff, right?
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Are you taking meds? Are you getting enough sleep?
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You know, are you in a distracting environment? Do you have good tools like
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schedule to-do list, alarms, whatever.
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But, you know, there's also kind of the mindset part of it.
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So for example, you know what do you do when you feel
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overwhelmed are you being kind of
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perfectionistic are you sort of ambivalent like
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i don't know do i want to do this so i not want to do it
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is it sort of ambiguous like i don't
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really know what to do also by the way i feel embarrassed about asking because
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i think the other person told me but i forgot and i don't want to admit that
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so there's all of that there's the whole social piece of it of like you know
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what are my hopes here what are the other person's hope, should I do it anyway?
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Or, you know, do I have the social capital to say, look, I'm really not,
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I can't get this to you today, but hopefully tomorrow or maybe tomorrow,
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or even I don't, I choose not to do this thing.
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I'm sorry, you're disappointed, but I'm going to just choose not to do it.
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So like, so it's all of that stuff, right?
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And the fact that, you know, I mean, in the book, I have 36 short chapters,
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but like 36 areas, right? If productivity has felt hard, this is why,
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right? There's a lot to it.
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Yeah. And I appreciated that. I mean, I really enjoyed it.
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I started reading through the book and then realized this is the type of book
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where you need to pause after each chapter and reflect and, you know,
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kind of fill in the blanks. And I like how interactive you had it.
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And then the fact that you had it in these bite-sized pieces,
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you know, and I mean, obviously, I assume that was done very intentionally and it worked well.
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I enjoyed that. I think, too, just the fact that you talk about so much more
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than just productivity itself.
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I mean, something I was going to ask about as well, but talking about,
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you know, what are your goals?
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Are they the right goals? Are you focusing on the things that actually matter to you?
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Can you address that within productivity, that kind of focus on what are we
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being productive about?
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Yeah. And I think that that's an important consideration, right?
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I think that a lot of the sort of simple hacks don't get to the bigger picture
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because, you know, being productive is not simply doing more things.
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Right. That's just being busy. The better question is, are you doing the right
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things, you know, and how do you know if they're the right things?
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And part of what makes life so hard is that we all have a lot of goals that
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are kind of competing or a bit mutually exclusive. Right.
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As in like, I want to be a better parent, but I also want to be a better spouse.
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And also I need some time to myself.
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You know, I want to work on my career, but I should also get to the gym more.
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Right. It's like there's just always there's this dynamic sort of juggling act
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that we're doing at every moment of the day and the week and the month.
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And, you know, so part of the sort of challenge, I think this is sort of human,
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universally human, is like, how do I balance this all out, right?
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In this stage of my life, what am I doing here, you know?
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And ideally, we have some sense of what we're working on and where we're trying
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to get to, which then in some sort of a way filters down to like,
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here I am in this moment, in this minute. Now, what do I do?
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And that's easy to say, but it's hard to do.
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And if you feel like you're kind of scrambling just to stay ahead of the avalanche of your day.
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It just sets you up to be even more busy, but not necessarily doing the things that matter the most.
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And then certainly not feeling good about your day when you get into bed at the end of the night.
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And I think, yeah, what you just said, too, about that intentionality piece,
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because it is so easy otherwise with the chaos of life, how busy everything
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is for everybody, but especially for an ADHD brain,
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is that we can keep ourselves busy with that feeling of, you know,
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dopamine getting things done.
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And then at the end of the day or the week or the month or whenever it is,
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we realize, you know what, these were not actually the things that mattered.
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So as far as somebody figuring out what should we be working on, two questions for you.
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But first, I think something that stood out about what you said is stage, stage of life. Yeah.
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And I think that's a really big one, especially I look at my stage of life right
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now. my kids are three, four, and six.
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And I feel like, you know, I would love to just grow my career.
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I did as a dream, I would love to write a book one day and all these things.
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But right now is not the time to be adding that to my list.
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You know, there are things on my list that maybe aren't my favorite.
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But they are things that need to be done in order to take care of my family.
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And if I really look at what I value, my family, my kids are going to be, you know, top priority.
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But I really think that is It's helpful to have that perspective in mind of
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the fact that we go through different stages.
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Maybe if you're, you know, going to grad school might not also be the time to,
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you know, pick up a new instrument and try a new sport. Right.
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So as far as helping our listeners today, if they're trying to focus on trying
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to figure out what should they focus on, what advice would you give them as
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far as figuring out what matters most to them?
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I think it's to take the time to try to sort of carve out a little bit of space
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without your phone in your face and, you know, hopefully not too many interruptions
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to really sort of think about it.
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Like what, what exactly do I want to be doing here?
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And to, I don't know, maybe you talk to some folks about it,
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your spouse, a trusted friend,
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you know, a colleague, maybe, you know, a therapist or a coach if you have one,
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but to really sort of take the time and to think about like, what am I doing?
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What feels worth it? What do I want to do next?
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And, you know, we don't have to wait till like New Year's Eve to do this.
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And, you know, sometimes natural life transitions will sort of prompt some of
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that kind of like life review, you know.
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So, for example, you change jobs or you finish grad school or you start or you
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have a kid or your last kid starts, you know, preschool or kindergarten or something
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or your last kid moves away or, right, whatever.
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You know, so like we do have those natural moments as well, but you don't have
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to wait for one of those to sort of take the time, particularly if you feel
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like you're too much on the rat wheel,
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you know, like you're working hard, but you're not sure where you're ending up.
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That was part of a question I had for you was what should our end goal of productivity be?
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I think it's living a meaningful life, you know, and I sort of,
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I came to this in writing the book and I've been sort of preaching this a lot,
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but that the point of managing your ADHD or whatever, right?
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Like whatever it is that we're all kind of like all the busyness and struggle
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and strife that we all have in our lives.
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The point of it is not simply to avoid negatives, right? as in like,
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oh, good, I wasn't late, or I got that thing in, my boss isn't giving me a hard time about it.
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That like, that's a low bar, simply not having negative outcomes.
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And I don't know, I thought of this joke yesterday when I was talking to someone
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else, but that like, I've never seen an inspirational poster with like a kitten
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hanging off a branch that says, don't get in trouble, right?
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Like that's not particularly inspiring.
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So, you know, rather the whole point of it is to be living a good life, right?
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To be able to add more of the good stuff to your life, right?
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Not simply avoiding the negatives, but adding the good stuff.
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So what is important? What is meaningful?
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What is interesting? What makes your life feel richer and more fulfilled,
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Right. Like that is the point of productivity.
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And like, you know, so that I think is the question to be thinking about of
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like, how's, how are my days working out?
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Am I getting closer to where I want to be?
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Yeah. And I think that's, that's such a, it's a beautifully simple way of putting
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it is to live a meaningful life, right?
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Because I think so often we, we look at productivity as just getting stuff done.
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And like you said, we get caught in the busy versus doing the right things.
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I think, too, something else you talk about in your book is that some things
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are just going to be boring and accepting that.
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And I think also, too, when we realize that we have this autonomy to do things
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and we're not dealing with that demand avoidance, right, of somebody else imposing it on us.
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And we recognize that when we get through some of these boring,
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mundane things, some of these things that just need to be done,
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there's more space and opportunity for that good stuff.
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And that's where I completely agree, helping people to find what is the good
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stuff for them. Where is that purpose?
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Where is that passion? Because I really do believe everybody has a purpose.
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Everybody has things they're passionate about. And I love hearing about people's
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dreams, you know, whether they've kind of stuffed them down for a long time.
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But I think it can bring so much meaning and it can bring so much more drive
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to their life, which I think helps them get through that mundane.
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You know, the mundane, boring things of the day-to-day life.
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And I think it's important. I mean, I think about so kind of example that always
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comes to me is so like I like, you know, one of my hobbies is I is doing woodworking
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and, you know, talking about stages of life.
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Now that my son is away in college, I have a lot more time when he was two.
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I had much less time, you know, so that's the long view.
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But, you know, on a given Saturday, I've got the stuff I need to do,
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you know, so whatever boring things, household things or doing my billing or
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working on some slides or like whatever kind of obligation stuff I have.
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But I always try to get through that stuff as quick as I can,
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because whatever time is left over, that is the amount of time I have to do woodworking, you know.
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And if I drag it out, I'll have five minutes maybe or none, you know,
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which really five minutes is none.
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But if I just get it done, then I, you know, whatever that extra amount left
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over is more time in the shop.
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So, you know, so spending time being grumpy about it, spending time doing and
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being like, this sucks. Why do I have to do it? This is so stupid.
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Right. All of that, like, negative talk track. It just makes us more miserable
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while we're doing it. And it just burns more energy.
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So, like, you know, I sort of say, like, you may not have a choice about whether
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you do the task, but you do have some choice about how much you suffer from the task. Mm hmm.
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And even too, something you had said was options of, you know,
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doing smaller intervals of time or having an immediate reward right after.
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And you can kind of play with the factors of how, where you're going to do it.
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Maybe you can go sit outside if it's a nice day.
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Maybe depending on what it is, bring your laptop, go sit at the coffee shop
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and be around other people.
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The fact that it doesn't have to be, like you said, it doesn't have to be miserable.
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And it feels sometimes that we don't have that choice. Something that you Ted
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talked about as well was thinking about your future self.
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And I found this was really helpful as far as thinking about what matters most
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is, you know, thinking about in the next morning, am I going to be upset that
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I stayed up watching this show because now I'm tired, I'm getting sick.
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Maybe I'm snapping at my kids. I didn't exercise, whatever it is.
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And I think sometimes it can take a while because like you said,
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and you explain really well, I feel like obviously you've worked with a lot
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of people with ADHD because it feels like you see all the different parts that we experience.
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But the fact that in the moment, I want to watch that TV show.
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I want to stay up late. I want to eat the snacks.
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I want to do whatever I want. But time after time, when I'm angry with myself,
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I realize that, you know what, I need to put in the supports to make those changes
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so that I'm not living with all of that regret. Yeah.
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I mean, that's exactly the thing, right? Like, no discussion needed on,
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you know, potato chips are delicious or this show is fun, right?
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Like, we don't even bother, right? Like, it is.
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But it's, as you said, like tomorrow, how am I going to feel about this?
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Or afterward, like even right after, how am I going to feel about it?
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And that I think that like this idea of regret has really sort of resonated with me about that.
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Like, you know, if you if you're going to regret it later, like that,
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that's the important part.
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So it's not for other people to tell you how you should feel about it,
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but it's about regret. And the example I give is if I go to a concert and it's
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great and then I'm tired the next day, I don't regret it.
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Like that was totally worth it. I would absolutely do it again.
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But like if you stay up late looking at like stupid TikToks that you don't even
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remember four seconds later, right?
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Like then you do regret it because you're like, that was not worth it.
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Like the bang was not worth the buck.
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You know, like that was terrible. And now I'm going to have a long,
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hard day for something that, again, not worth it.
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So, like, so it's really about, like, how will I feel about this later,
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you know, and not just physically, like, that doesn't feel good,
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but there's also an element of, like, how do I want to see myself, right?
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Do I want to feel like here I am again, kind of letting myself down,
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you know, and like that, that kind of sucks. Nobody needs more of that.
22:14
Absolutely. Yeah. And something I've been kind of combining with what I've learned
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from your book too is the concept, the idea of the fact that we can only do one thing at a time.
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And that, you know, that's something that would paralyze me a lot was,
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you know, getting home, sitting in my car, scrolling on my phone because I didn't
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want to go inside and have to start my work. That felt overwhelming.
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It felt insurmountable, right? Just this idea, too, like you said,
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about thinking of my future self.
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My future self is never happy that I sat there doom scrolling on my phone.
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I'm never thrilled about it. But I think having that moment of recognizing,
22:51
you know what, I don't need to go inside and do 50 things. I need to go inside
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and do one thing, just one thing.
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And it feels so much better. And what you talk about too, right,
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is the way that we view ourselves and wanting to look back without regret and
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look back and say, you know what?
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I did my best and I focused on the things that mattered. And obviously that's
23:13
not going to be perfect. And I like that you talk about that here too.
23:16
You know, it's make it good enough, like in some areas, right?
23:20
Or set a good foundation and then do your best in these different areas.
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Or if you know, maybe you might, not that you might disappoint somebody,
23:30
but maybe their expectations will be different than yours.
23:32
Communicate early. Be upfront about it. And I think I really appreciated the honesty of it.
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Something else that I took out of your book here on page 33, it says,
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a lot of managing ADHD is about setting things up beforehand and creating a
23:46
good environment rather than trying to not be distracted by distractions and
23:51
tempted by temptations.
23:54
Absolutely. A hundred percent. And I think that's something that a lot of the
23:58
listeners, when I've had episodes that have to do with an ADHD friendly environment
24:03
and things like that have really resonated with them.
24:06
Would you have advice specifically for what would a good environment look like
24:12
for somebody with ADHD who wants to be productive?
24:16
So it's really about what is this stuff that's going to sort of pull you away,
24:22
that's going to sort of hijack your attention.
24:25
Maybe not every time, but at least often enough.
24:28
Right. So, for example, if you're getting pings on your cell phone and you're
24:32
always sort of like, you know, maybe most of them, you'd be like, OK, whatever.
24:36
But every I mean, first of all, every time is a roll of the dice.
24:40
Right. Is it am I going to get pulled off this time?
24:43
But it also like it burns up a
24:45
little bit of that sort of willpower energy that
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we have that like no not that okay no
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no la la la la look away don't like don't
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touch the phone right so the more of that that we get hit with the less willpower
25:00
we then have to persist with the thing that we're doing so you know so some
25:07
of this points to then you know silent environment no distractions lock yourself in an empty room.
25:14
But, you know, also people get insane and some people get, right?
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So, you know, so having, so I think if you're, I don't know,
25:21
it's that classic, that cliche of like work in the coffee shop and the buzz
25:25
and everything just drowns into white noise, great.
25:28
Or if you work better with music
25:30
on or, you know, TVs or something in the background, great, you know?
25:36
So I think it's, it's that thing of kind of knowing yourself and maybe it matters
25:40
on the task And maybe it matters on time of day and how much energy you have,
25:45
but doing the thing that's going to help you be most effective.
25:52
Mm hmm. And kind of playing around with that.
25:55
Yeah. Like you said, I mean, for me, having a TV on in the background would
25:57
be super distracting for somebody else.
25:59
It might be that white noise in the background. And I do.
26:03
I think I agree. I think it's that that balance of having enough that's stimulating
26:08
to keep you awake and focused while not having it overtake your focus and distract you.
26:14
And I think, I mean, I think what you said to rate phones is the classic example,
26:18
but something I was thinking about was just not lying to ourselves about willpower
26:24
and about how much control we think we have.
26:28
Like something I've accepted for myself is that I cannot just go on my phone
26:32
without getting lost in my phone.
26:34
So unless I want to get lost in my phone, don't pick up your phone because I've
26:38
told myself multiple times, you know, well, I'll just pick it up and I'll just,
26:42
whatever the thing is, I'll just check my email or I'll. Check my message.
26:45
It never, ever ends at that. And so I've stopped lying to myself.
26:49
And it's a bit of a relief, you know, to be honest with yourself and say,
26:54
this is not a character flaw or a moral failing of some sort.
26:58
This is a recognition of patterns for me.
27:02
And I don't want to, you know, lose that time that I don't get back.
27:08
Um a couple questions that i had
27:11
so as you've i'm imagining some of
27:14
your clients have read your book they you've worked with them on some of this
27:19
stuff about productivity what have been some of the hardest parts for your clients
27:25
the things that are still a struggle for them the biggest struggles within this yeah.
27:32
I mean, sleep is always a struggle, you know, and I mean, for some people,
27:37
they're not good at sleeping even when they're trying, right?
27:40
Can't quiet the mind or, you know, other stuff that disrupts sleep.
27:44
But it's really just the getting there, right?
27:47
In a consistent kind of a way of actually getting into bed on time,
27:52
lights out, like, let's do this, you know?
27:55
And there's a lot of reasons why that is so usually it's not simply a matter
28:02
of like you should go to bed earlier which is sort of like you should show up
28:06
on time earlier you shouldn't interrupt people you should remember stuff you
28:10
say like duh right but it's but rather,
28:14
like what is getting in the way like what's happening beforehand that's ultimately
28:19
ending up with you not being in bed on time.
28:22
And, you know, there's a lot of examples. I mean, some of it's there.
28:26
There's the cliche of like getting lost on your phone and losing track of time.
28:30
You know, a lot of folks with ADHD tend to be night owls. So if sadly your life
28:35
requires you to run on an earlier schedule, you're going to be,
28:38
you know, fighting the tide there.
28:40
But that just means unfortunately, you just got to be that much more consistent
28:44
about what you're doing.
28:46
Or, you know, maybe it's a matter of not getting enough done earlier in the
28:51
day and therefore, you know,
28:54
you're working on stuff later or you killed yourself all day and,
28:59
you know, now you're doing revenge bedtime procrastination.
29:02
Maybe it's a matter of not being able to set boundaries earlier in the day with
29:06
other people's expectations of you and now you have too much or having trouble
29:11
setting boundaries with, let's say, kids of getting them into bed on time and
29:15
then everything spills.
29:16
So like, there's a lot of ways to wind up in bed too late.
29:20
So let's figure out exactly what's getting in the way and then exactly what
29:24
we need to do to give you a better shot at it.
29:28
Gotcha. So you find that often people, things are stemming from that lack of
29:33
rest, that lack of sleep that I imagine pours into the next day of saying,
29:38
oh, I'm tired, but I'm behind.
29:40
And then they're not thinking properly, not thinking straight and then trying
29:43
to then, you know, do things as best as they can. But without a clear,
29:48
a clear mind, it's going to be a lot harder.
29:51
And yeah, I appreciate what you said, too, about the fact that it's not just the evening routine.
29:56
It's not the bedtime routine. It could be that they didn't take any breaks throughout
30:00
the day or that they're not scheduling anything that's life giving for them.
30:04
And then in the evening, like you said, that revenge, bedtime,
30:08
procrastination, they're trying to,
30:10
you know, and some of those things that it's not just about being irresponsible,
30:13
but sometimes it can demonstrate that there's a real need missing that wasn't
30:19
taken care of during the day.
30:21
I appreciate that. I mean, it might look like a 10 p.m. problem,
30:25
but it might really be a 10 a.m. problem.
30:28
Absolutely. Yeah, no, definitely. I was curious as well, what have your clients
30:36
found the most rewarding part of being able to implement some of what you've
30:42
taught us here in this book?
30:44
It's about it's I think it's what we talked about before, right?
30:47
It's being able to have more time and more energy for this stuff that really matters the most.
30:54
And related to that is just sort of feeling better about themselves.
31:01
You know, it's sort of the inverse of feeling bad about themselves for always
31:06
being behind, you know, always that day late dollar short kind of thing.
31:10
So you know i think that's the
31:13
thing right feeling just better within themselves feeling
31:16
a bit more grounded in their life and you
31:20
know some of that i don't know i'm just going to invent something let's say
31:23
70 of that is actually getting more things done but 30 of it is feeling better
31:29
able to say no to some other things you know being able to say i don't have to do that you know Like,
31:38
it is okay for me to say that isn't getting done and that's okay.
31:43
Whether it's a thing like for themselves of like, I've decided for me, I'm not getting it done.
31:48
But also, you know, being able to address it with other people in their life,
31:52
but doing it in a more sort of direct and honest way of like,
31:57
look, I'm not going to be able to do that versus, okay, I'll do it.
32:00
Hey, I thought you said you're going to do that. Oh my God, I forgot or I ran out of time.
32:05
And now you're the bad guy again, you know? So like preemptively,
32:11
assertively, honestly, directly dealing with it beforehand.
32:16
Yeah. And yeah, I hear within what you're saying, too, there's that piece of
32:20
self-awareness of understanding what is important to me. What do I want to make sure that is done?
32:27
And what are the things that don't actually matter or that somebody else has
32:31
imposed that I know I'm not going to have time for?
32:33
And then coupling that with the self-advocacy piece, like you said,
32:38
speaking up. And it's easier to speak up out of a place of understanding what
32:43
we actually need, what we actually want, what we're aiming for, right?
32:47
What you said about where are we trying to get to?
32:49
And I think that can be really helpful because otherwise there can be those
32:53
pieces of, you know, people pleasing, not wanting to upset people.
32:57
But once again, what you said about thinking about your future self and asking
33:01
yourself, if I tell them now versus if I don't do the thing,
33:07
they're still going to find out, but it's going to feel a lot worse if I,
33:12
you know, last minute don't follow through with that.
33:15
And so I think there's that freedom, like you said, in being able to say no
33:20
and set those boundaries.
33:21
Absolutely. Yeah. And not counting on that, like, good luck,
33:25
magical, somehow it worked out.
33:28
Because sometimes it does, right? Like, you know, once in a while,
33:31
it all does sort of break in your favor.
33:34
But like, if too much of your plans are based in luck and everything lining up.
33:40
Yeah, I'm not betting money on that. Absolutely.
33:44
I think, too, something I've realized recently with I do love to be productive.
33:49
Productivity is great, feels good. Something I've realized, too,
33:53
though, that can be beneath productivity can have.
33:57
And I mean, this is where, you know,
33:58
you book an appointment with your psychologist, your therapist, right?
34:02
To say, is there something beneath it where you're trying to fill some sort
34:07
of void? Or maybe you feel like you haven't lived up to certain expectations
34:11
and you're trying to meet that through what you're doing.
34:15
You know, just as an example, we're planning my dad's funeral and it's in just over a week.
34:19
And I decided that me with little kids, a busy life that I should take on way too much.
34:25
And I realized after, and I had to pass it back to the rest of my family.
34:29
And there was that shame and there was
34:32
that frustration of you know why did I take this on and so
34:35
I think sitting in that place and asking ourselves you
34:38
know being curious giving ourselves grace and compassion
34:41
I realized I'm the youngest of three and
34:44
I didn't want to be the youngest that you know just brings a salad to
34:47
the family get together you know what I mean that all the youngest just do
34:50
the little thing that you're capable of doing and so I
34:54
with that story in my mind I took
34:57
on much more than my fair share
35:00
and then had to pass it back so for
35:03
me like like you said right sometimes it's not a 10 p.m
35:06
problem it's a 10 a.m problem I had to move backwards and and
35:09
look at what was beneath me saying yes to all those things in the first place
35:15
yeah and I think that that like that insight and awareness is really helpful
35:21
right because what it means is that But you can then think about, is this really worth it?
35:28
Is it going to work, right? This thing I'm hoping to accomplish,
35:31
is it actually going to work out that way?
35:34
Is there another way that I could do this? You know?
35:38
And maybe even just being able to have that honest conversation with your siblings,
35:43
let's say, and just say, like, look, I know, like, I know I'm the youngest and
35:48
like, you know, maybe I, you know, would get a pass on things.
35:52
I really do want to carry this. But honestly, like with three young kids,
35:55
this is just not like this isn't a situation that I can do.
36:00
So or whatever. Right. And being able to have that honest conversation.
36:03
And, you know, it could very well be then that your siblings are more than happy about it, right?
36:10
If they think you're just flaking and don't care, they're going to be mad, obviously.
36:14
But, you know, I don't know, I sort of have this line, you know,
36:18
people hope for good outcomes, but they'll settle for good intentions.
36:22
So, you know, if you say like, I get it, I really do want to,
36:26
but this is just not the moment for me.
36:28
Right. They're probably more likely to be OK with it. Like the relationship
36:32
between you guys will be better for it.
36:35
Yeah, they even actually approached me and said, hey, I feel like I'm not doing
36:39
enough and you're doing everything. Can we take some of this off your plate?
36:43
And so I realized and I did apologize to them.
36:46
And I think, and we can move on after this, but I think that's a part two is
36:50
recognizing that when we have hurt people or we've let people down,
36:55
that it's not a reflection of our character and how good we are,
36:58
that it does not change my worth
37:00
or my value, but it will help repair my relationship with these people.
37:05
And I say, hey, you know what, I'm so sorry, I took on too much.
37:09
And I apologize, because now I have to pass it back.
37:12
Next time I'll try to, you know, better assess what I'm capable of doing, right?
37:17
But just to just to acknowledge that I think can be really helpful in repairing those relationships.
37:23
All right. Before we get going, where can people go to find out more about you
37:29
and all of the wonderful work that you have done around ADHD?
37:32
Sure. So best place is my website, Dr.
37:36
Ari Tuchman dot com. And I'm also on Instagram at Ari Tuchman P.S.Y.D.
37:43
So and I'm all over the Internet. So my name is friendly for Google and I'm all over the place.
37:50
So. So, yeah, I'm an easy to find kind of guy.
37:53
Good. And just just quickly, in case people are curious and I'll add this all below.
37:57
But what are some of the other books that you have written? So the book before
38:03
this one was called ADHD After Dark, Better Sex Life, Better Relationships.
38:07
So looking at, you know, well, what it sounds like.
38:11
Before that was Understand Your Brain, Get More Done, the ADHD Executive Functions Workbook.
38:18
Before that was More Attention, Less Deficit, Success Strategies for Adult ADHD.
38:24
And before that, my first one was a book for clinicians called Integrative Treatment for Adult ADHD.
38:31
Okay, so lots of different information that I'm very curious to check out.
38:35
So I will put the website below, any of the other social handles below as well.
38:41
And thank you so much for being here with us today. This was a really good conversation. Thank you.
38:46
Well, my pleasure. Thanks for having me.