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How the Dog Meat Trade Changed Hailey’s Life · Under The Fur

• speaker-0: Under the Fur this week is a very, very special episode. And I cannot tell you, you can probably see by my face, if you're watching this on YouTube, how excited I am that we have the amazing, she looks shy, but she is amazing, Hailey from the Harbin Slaughterhouse Survivors Rescue Center in China, in Northern China. And it has been running for 10 and a half years. And listen to this. It has currently, and this is just currently, I don't know how much this goes up and down, 1500 dogs, 200 cats, 50 goats, 12 rabbits, five foxes, four chickens, four sugar gliders, three ducks, two meerkats, two horses, two snapping turtles, a donkey and a monkey. And speaker-1: And a pig. speaker-0: a pig, which I think you, you rescued from a nightclub. speaker-1: Yes. speaker-0: in a spare time, do you have any spare time? She's speaker-1: Yes, a little bit. speaker-0: also a mom. and she is responsible for the running of this entire rescue center with 42 employees. It's enormous. And all of these pets. How have you got the time to come on my podcast today? speaker-1: You forced me. speaker-0: Well, I feel very, very lucky that you are here. And so we met because I came there. Yes, you did. And I did not know what to expect. I've been to rescue centers before. Nothing, nothing on the scale of what you have got there. It's amazing. And speaker-1: Okay. speaker-0: thought maybe we would start with, how the hell did you get to that? Where did everything start? speaker-1: So how did I get to China? Yeah. My mother speaker-0: Your mother, aha your mother wins. speaker-1: So I was twenty one. Yeah. In speaker-0: Scrum. speaker-1: Ireland. Grew up in Ireland. And when I was twenty one, the recession hit. And all my friends were going to Australia and Canada, America, and places like that. And I wanted to go to Thailand. And I was like, I'll go to Thailand for six months and go live the dream. And at the time my mother was watching Banged Up Abroad, do you remember that T V show? speaker-0: Yep. speaker-1: And she was like, You are not going to Thailand because she thought I would end up banged up abroad. So she said to me, Why don't you go to China? And in her head I would be living in the mountains, playing with pandas, drinking tea every day. And she thought I'd be safe. Yeah. So we compromised. I said, okay, I'll go to China for six months and then I'll go to Thailand. She said, that's fine. So I went to China and I got stuck there now for sixteen years. So six months turned into sixteen years. Wow. That's how it all started. Wow. speaker-0: And what did you go to do initially, like to travel, to see things, to work, to volunteer? speaker-1: To work. To work. Yeah. Teaching. So I was teaching I s still now a little bit, but mostly online. But up until twenty twenty one I was full time teacher in a school. Yeah. Teaching English to Amazing kids and adults. speaker-0: Yeah. What did you prefer the kids or the adults? speaker-1: The adults. really? One hundred percent. At least you can have a conversation with them. Yeah. With the kids it was all A is for Apple and B is for banana. But with the adults I learned so much from them. Yes. Like they taught me about the country, the culture, everything like that. So it was interesting. speaker-0: Did you work by yourself? speaker-1: I went out with a friend. Okay. Yeah, and she stayed for six months and then went back to Ireland and then she ended up coming back out to China then for a year, year and a bit I think. So yeah. speaker-0: So you went out with the intention of being there for six months, teaching English, learning the culture, eating some good food. speaker-1: I had no interest in Chinese food and I still don't to this day. The cooking at Safe House is amazing. It was speaker-0: wow! I certainly had interest in it when I went. It was amazing. speaker-1: amaz it is amazing. The tofu and stuff is just divine. speaker-0: So can we talk about how we went from Hayley teaching English to Hayley rescuing thousands and thousands and thousands of animals? speaker-1: The Haley before rescue had an amazing life. Like in China, you can as a young girl, it's safe. You know, I was on really good salary. Yeah. In a country where my rent was two hundred pounds a month. Wow. You know what I mean? My Wi Fi electricity and water was about twelve pounds a month. Yeah. On Western s you know, salary as a teacher. So the quality of life you have is amazing. You got to travel, I got to party all the time. And then one day, it was in June. I was sitting in class and I'm not supposed to look at my phone. But this day I picked up my phone. I had a message from another Irish girl. Her name's Katie. It's all because of her. she was living in Shanghai at the time and she messaged me and she said that she just rescued a greyhound. his name was Legend. He actually just passed away a couple of weeks ago. I saw her on Instagram. And she said she just rescued him from a slaughterhouse. And I replied to her, and I was like, That's not true. Dog meat doesn't exist in China. Right. And at the time I'd been there six years. And I was like, That's a myth. It's a myth. Like, you know, 'cause you don't see it. You know what I mean? It's not there in front of speaker-0: it's not like on the menu or anything vegetarian speaker-1: I It could have been in the menu, but I wouldn't experience speaker-0: session anyway speaker-1: But even the characters, I wouldn't even know like dog meeting the characters back then. You know, I was more interested in my microcore's bags and, you know, my trips to Thailand. So I didn't, you know. Yeah. And she was like, No, it's true. And there's the slaughterhouse is two hours from Harbin, where I live, and I was like, Okay and she was like, Can you take some dogs? It's really close to you and I was like, Okay. send me Send me some. How many can you send? So she said, I'll send you six. So that night, my friend and I, we jumped in a little van and we met this truck on the side of a high on the side of a highway. And he opened the door and there were six half-dead dogs in there. We put them into our van and then we just drove around the city. We were like, okay, now what? I didn't know what to do. Like I, you know, I'd never done this before. speaker-0: Where were you going to put them? speaker-1: We had no idea. We drove around for a few hours. We were so confused. Yeah. we eventually found a clinic and we put them in the clinic. They all had C D V. Yeah. I think four I think three or four passed away out of the six. December, yeah. C speaker-0: Cdv is just K9. Everyone is listening. speaker-1: D V K9 December virus. And that's how it started and it just kind of escalated out of everyone's control, really. Yeah. And that's how it all began. Yeah. speaker-0: So you've got these dogs and so how is it escalating? Do you now start looking for them? speaker-1: No, we just worked with this slaughterhouse that was two hours away. So Chinese animal activists would go. Yes. Excuse me. And they would t take as many dogs as they could, and then give them to rescue groups that could take them, pay their medical bills and so on and so forth. Okay. And speaker-0: Did the slaughterhouses want to give these dogs? speaker-1: No, the Chinese animal activists would go and buy. They would speaker-0: Bye. speaker-1: this was ten years ago now and it was all starting and we didn't We didn't know what we would do. We didn't know what was right or wrong. We didn't know. We were just like, give us a dog. We don't care how we were getting them. Do you know what I mean? We just wanted to save them. We didn't know that these Chinese animal activists were online fundraising money, feeding money back into the trade. Yeah. you know, no one told us. There was no there was no handbook given to us, you know what I mean? Yeah. So we just kind of went with w whatever they said. And that's really how it started. And it becomes addictive. Like once you start, it's like You know, you close your eyes, you think the dogs had couldn't get out and th you know, the dogs they went back for they were already dead, you know, and it becomes right you know, quite addictive in that aspect. speaker-0: Wow, and I can't imagine you'd ever seen anything like that before. speaker-1: No, never. Never. speaker-0: And then obviously that's, that was six and you now have over 1500 dogs. How did you go from that to where you are now? speaker-1: It just kept getting bigger and bigger. And as the more support we got online and the more donations we got, the bigger we went. Yeah. You know, in the ideal world, we would have stopped at, you know, 700 dogs. Yeah. And kept all the followers we have and the donations. And we'd be laughing right now, you know. We'd have reserve money in the bank. We'd be comfortable. I wouldn't have stomach ulcers, stressing because but we don't. That's my problem. Yeah. The more followers we get, The more dogs we rescue. The more donations we get, the more dogs we rescue. It's speaker-0: So it just grows and grows. speaker-1: growing and growing and growing. Yeah. When it really needs to like a in a business point of view, it would be stop rescuing. Yeah. Get your followers up, get more donations steady in the bank, and then, you know, start rescuing again. But you know, we get 10,000 more followers. I'm like, great, we can rescue more dogs. Right. You know, that's how I yeah put it. speaker-0: How can you say no? speaker-1: It's very, very hard. speaker-0: You can't say no. speaker-1: Very ver I said, No, was it this year? I said, girl texts me and there's a detention center in the south and she messaged me, she said, Can you take this Samoid? Yeah. And he wasn't heard or anything like that. And I was like, Okay, I said, I can do, not right now. I said, Let's get, you know, the the ones that need medical attention out first. He seems okay. Yeah. She's like, Okay, okay. He was dead the next day. Do you know what I mean? So He got attacked. So when you do attacked? speaker-0: time. speaker-1: Yeah, it's a detention centre. They're awful. They're got like government shelters. speaker-0: So the dogs are just all out wild together and he's speaker-1: Yeah, yeah. speaker-0: just attacked by other dogs. speaker-1: Yeah. Right. I'm not allowed to talk about these places. Yeah. Sadly. they are slaughterhouses are better than them. If if I had to choose I would choose a dog to go to a slaughterhouse and go to these detention centres. So yeah. But they're government run, so speaker-0: Have been there? speaker-1: you're not allowed in. You can't get in. No, only special people are allowed in. speaker-0: And how are they getting the dogs out of the detention centers? speaker-1: game can speaker-0: We don't want to put anybody in jeopardy or anything and particularly to what you're doing next. It's so important. It's one of those things that I've had a conversation with a few rescue centers and the ones that have failed like certain celebrities that have thought to start rescue centers and have gone broke and then those animals end up getting rescued by other rescue centers because it does escalate, costs escalate. It is bottomless pit. And I know that you've actually done that for other people, haven't you? speaker-1: Constantly. speaker-0: I was there when you had a load of... speaker-1: Seventy dogs from that rescue. speaker-0: Right from another rescue that you brought in. And actually I thought I had cleared my surgical list for the day. I distinctly remember you turning up with a few more that needed help, which was obviously for me, it was amazing. That's why I become a vet. I was like, let's drop this and get on and... For me, it's exciting, it's fun, I'm doing it, I'm helping, but you're doing that every day. speaker-1: Yeah, it's those situations are really heartbreaking because you know the rescue started off with good intentions. I think everyone starts off with good intentions. No one wakes up and goes, Do you know what? I'm gonna start going to slaughterhouses and rescuing dogs. It's it's no one's dream. It's far from glamorous. Yeah. so I think everyone starts off with great intentions and I think it's very hard and it's very hard to say no when these trucks are outside your safe house gates. Yeah. You know what I mean? And that that's that was a big thing in back in twenty twenty three. We had a dog meat dealer and he was constantly parking outside our safe house. And it messes with your mind. You know what I mean? It's blackmail. It is actual blackmail. speaker-0: So the dog meat traders instead of selling them for meat are coming and selling them to you? speaker-1: No, they're selling them for meat first. Right. The ones they can't sell, they'll bring outside shelters. They do it to the Chinese shelters all the time. All the time. And they started doing it to us in twenty twenty three. Yeah. And it is one of the biggest the emotional break breaking points because you're being blacked ma blackmailed by the most evil scum. Yeah. You know, and no one's helping. Yeah. You know. speaker-0: and you don't want to give money to them but you cannot see those dogs go and speaker-1: Once my my rule is you no one should pay for a dog from the meat trade. You know what I mean? It feeds into the trade 100%. and it happens a lot. It really does happen a lot. And I see it happen with other rescue groups and stuff like that. And it really does jar me. But if I'm standing there physically in front of a truck, yeah, in front of a dog, and the last resort is money, yeah, it's going to be money. Okay. Do you know what I mean? I can't walk away. I can't live. With myself. Now, there's other rescuers out there, a few men in general who have said, No, you walk away, you walk that's great. You can walk away absolutely outstanding. Yeah. I can't. Yeah. You know, I will fight, I will scream, I will kick, I will throw myself in front of the truck, I'll hang myself off the truck. I've done it all. Yeah. but the last resort is paying, then I'm going to pay. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like the last dog meat truck. It was back in February. Like it's ridiculous. She and we got into a physical fight. I run into the kitchen and I said to my worker, give me a knife. He gives me the knife and I'm there cutting my finger, literally standing. Because the law is in China, whoever is physically hurt speaker-0: Right. speaker-1: is in power. Do you know what I mean? So she was saying that she was having a heart attack because I scared her. So I'm like in there like sniffing my own finger. Do you know what I mean? Like I will literally do anything to a point where I don't have to pay. And if that means slitting my own finger off, I'm gonna do it. You know what I mean? so yeah, paying is not the answer at all. But I understand if you are physically standing there, it is very hard to walk away and live with yourself. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. speaker-0: Wow, that's a lot. I didn't even know all of this information. What speaker-1: A volunteer was here at the time. What are you doing? speaker-0: is she doing? Yeah. So I did know that, you and some of the other, workers or volunteers go and, and I've seen you saying that's a truck. and literally throwing yourself in a road in front of a truck to stop it and to stop it from going to the slaughterhouse and fighting to get those. Dogs off of there, like I knew that I didn't know the extent of it, I think. I've been there. Wow. And now you have all of these dogs there. So we're doing this in a two part because you have so much to share. And I think we'll get into it a little more in part two about what exactly is going on and why and where. But I really wanted to talk a little more. about the safe house itself. First of all, I love the name, safe house, because that's what it is for them. It's a, finally we can go somewhere where we're okay. And how it works there, like how did you get, and by the way, this is my favorite pen, the large dog pen, big dogs. How did you get hundreds of big dogs to all? hang out with each other with very little drama. We in the UK can't even get dogs to play with each other in the park with acres of space without them having a drama. you walk in, so when I arrived and we walked in, there was just dogs everywhere. It was like heaven. I just thought I've just walked into heaven and they're all running around. They're coming up for cuddles. There's a couple that don't want to bother with you, they like even them, they're not stressed. They can find their own little space and everything. How did you do that? Tell everyone we all need this. speaker-1: I think the Western world have forgotten that dogs are pack animals. Yeah. I think that is and it's becoming I personally see it becoming a really big problem because I think someone is going to get seriously hurt one day on just randomly on the street if two dogs start fighting. Yeah. the West has forgotten that dogs are pack animals. They've forgotten what they need. think the West has put a lot of human wants and needs onto their dogs. And I I've I see that a lot. people always ask, like, how how come your dogs just get on so well together? So when they first come to the safe house, they're in the front yard. You know, the misfit yard we call it. The front yard. You see a big dog with a little dog and three legged dog and a no-eyed dog and you know, no leg dog. And and that's with I'm I don't wanna sound arrogant, but within Two minutes I know what yard that dog can go into. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. Within two minutes, you you just know. Right. Like Tutu, the massive Alaskan Malamute, the huge, huge one, he can't never go into A room. I can't explain to you why he can't go in there, but I know if he went in there, he'd either be bullied and or he'd be too stressed. You know what I mean? He's gorgeous. He's gorgeous. So gorgeous. Can't get him on a flight because he's too big. Yeah. speaker-0: You would actually be on my lap right now if you could. speaker-1: He is he's the biggest the biggest dog I think we've ever had. He's huge. Yeah. But he couldn't go in a yard, you know. Then we have little dogs who think they're, you know, Tibetan mastiffs and they think they're huge, massive dogs and they're little things. Yes. And if I put them in with the small dogs, they're just gonna bully everyone. Right. You know, and then some dogs they just need more time and I don't know what it is. I just think Like I said, I think people have forgot that they're pack animals and they can be together. Yeah. You know. And dogs figure it out. You know, our dogs have fights. They have arguments. I let them. Now we have a rule in our safe house and I need to maybe revise this rule with our workers. But the rule is if two dogs fight in your yard and one gets hurt, the worker gets fined. So the workers are very much on top of them. Right. But for example, if two golden retrievers start arguing, let them argue. They're not gonna rip each other apart. Yeah. They're gonna figure it out in a couple of seconds and they do. speaker-0: I literally just had this on one of my podcasts where we were talking about dog walkers that maybe are a little less experienced and not just dog walkers, this is just in general, like there's amazing dog walkers, obviously, but when dogs fight in veterinary, we don't step in. speaker-1: No. speaker-0: Well, we don't really let them cross this very low instance of veterinary, but we know not to step in because like you said, in general, obviously it's going to be one-off cases and they sort it out. speaker-1: If they're the same size, if they're the same in weight, they're gonna figure it out. And big dogs, nine out of ten times, they f literally fight for a couple of seconds and they're like, You done? Yeah, I'm done. No, do you know they just walk it off? Yeah. Now little dogs are a bit different, like a sea room dog, see ankle biters, yeah. They will fight and then they'll split up and they'll never talk to each other again. And that and they will carry that revenge and they'll pass that so if a corgi fights, say, a I don't know, a little mott, right? Yeah. That mutt will forever hate corgies. And that's and then you'll see little gangs. You'll see the corgi gang, the mutt gang, the poodle gang. Yeah. And they'll carry it on. But the big dogs don't. Now, if a big dog got onto a small dog one hundred percent, then we step in one you know, we break it up. greyhounds, if if a golden retriever is playing too rough with a greyhound, I have to step in because greyhounds are like paper. Yeah. You know what I mean? They just disintegrate. Yes. They're so thin. But nine out of ten times they they figure it out. Now I'm not sitting there watching dogs fight. You know, it's all under control. But I have to say to the workers sometime, let them if two collies are going at it, I'm like, just wait. Yeah. Wait. Yeah. Let them they they stop and then that's it. Because speaker-0: and they sorted it out. speaker-1: nine out of ten times when the human gets involved, the dog's like, Look at the attention I'm getting. look at the attention I'm getting. I'm protecting you. I'll go in again, yeah? I'll go in again. Yeah, yeah. I did well, right? I did well. Yeah. Yeah. You picked me up. Yeah. You p I got a you picked me up now. Yeah. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: So when you put me down, I'm gonna go again. Yeah. You know what I mean? So but don't take my advice. Like I'm not no but means a dog trainer. I have no qualification. speaker-0: wanted to know how you'd made it work there, because I've seen it with my own eyes. I walked through every pen there. You almost didn't get me out of there, honestly. And then the finale was like the big dogs and they were just amazing. Like it's a lot to walk through hundreds and hundreds of large breed dogs. And they were just, I mean, the Goldens are very keen. They're very keen. speaker-1: They they use use a bounce board, yeah. speaker-0: Yeah, they'll give you a lot of attention. Yeah, bruises. But it was just amazing. speaker-1: See as well, we don't have Samoids and Goldens together. So if you see our Samoids are not an A in Ayard, 'cause our Goldens and Samoids hate each other. Right. They always have. speaker-0: I didn't see them together, but I didn't clock it at the time. speaker-1: We don't have for some reason, I think because Goldens are like so happy and Samoids are so judgmental. Yeah. They're just like, Yeah. What are you happy about? You know what I mean? So they so there's certain, you know, personality traits that are there and that we we do follow. Yeah. You know, like the Chihuahuas, I wouldn't put a Chihuahua with, you know people. Anyone. They have their own special kettle. Yeah. So yeah. speaker-0: And then the other thing that I remember noticing was how many pure breed dogs you have. And I was extremely naive when I came, I hadn't got a clue what I was walking into. I was just like, hello, I'm here to help. Give me a name. Yes, send me orthopedics. And I just thought, how have you got so many pure breeds? speaker-1: So many. So northern China and southern China is very, very different. firstly, the in northern China where we are, the land is very cheap. Right. So in this in southern China, the land's more expensive. So all the breeding, most of the breeding happens in northern China. there's a place called Anshan, and any rescuers that rescue dogs from China, most they will know most of their dogs are from this place. It's hell on earth. It's between Harbin and Beijing. And it's just one massive puppy mill. It's huge. So what happens is is dog meat dealers are breeders in China. Right. There's no difference. You know what I mean? breeders love their dogs and that's a whole other podcast. But you know, breeders love their dogs and they would never dream of selling them into the meat trade. But in China I'll give you example. Chicken. Yeah. Right. In the West, people eat the thighs, the wings, the breast. Yeah. Right. The three main in China, they eat the whole chicken. Yes. Nothing is is wasted. No part of an animal is wasted. So when a breeder has stock, they are s it's stock that they can't sell for many different reasons, they are then sold as meat. Right. There's no sanctuary. These breeders have where the old mums and the dads or disabled dogs or dogs that can't sell in time and no longer cute puppies go to. Where do they go? You know, they're not walking around the street. Did you ever see a street dog in in Harbin? Not once. Not one. So where do they go? They go into the meat trade. Right. They go into the meat trade. So and in the South D's different. They have street dogs because it's warmer. speaker-0: Okay. speaker-1: So at the safe house I can tell you which dog is from the south of China. Just by looking at them, they have a special look about them. They're highly intelligent. Yuling dogs are mostly 99% of them are mixed breeds, and they're highly intelligent dogs. Then you have the golden, it's like you know what I mean? Golden retrievers, every time we rescue, I'm picking on golden retrievers today, I don't know why. But golden retrievers, you know, when every time we rescue a golden retriever, they turn around and they like hug the dog meat dealer goodbye. they're like, you know what I mean? But then the Yuling dogs and the Southern dogs and the mixed breeds, you know, they're more wary and so on and so forth. So the pure breeds all come from breeders. They all come from breeders. Stock they can't sell. Stock they no longer need. You know what I mean? And it's it's extremely, extremely annoying. Yeah. Very, very annoying. and whatever it breed is in at the time. So in 2018, 19, 18. I don't know, COVID. It was all bulldogs. Bulldogs and French cheese. They were the it breed. So we we rescued a truck l of like, I think it was like ten, fifteen bulldogs. Yeah. I think only one is still alive today. They're all in a ma they all went to America. this year it's blue myle collie's. Yeah. Everyone wants a blue myle collie. Yeah. So they're breeding them, breeding them, breeding them. People are buying them, and then they realise, this collie's actually smarter than me. I can't keep this collie. And speaker-0: Such an intense pet to have. speaker-1: It's highly intelligent and the average human can keep up with them. Absolutely. And then they put them in a crate at home. Yeah. And then they come home, they're like, Why is my daughter? And it's like speaker-0: My dog's neurotic because there's not a crate it needs to be wild and working as possible. speaker-1: So, whatever it breed, corgis, corgies p poodles are always in. Yeah. Because they're they don't shed. Yeah. You know what I mean? corgies were a big one. What what was last year? I can't even remember. Goldens were a big thing. speaker-0: I saw so many shibas speaker-1: Shebas, yes. Yeah. Shebas became speaker-0: Mala music speaker-1: no, so the Malamutes are different. The Shebas all came popular during COVID. Right. everyone had a Sheba. Yeah. Everyone, like you s go to a park and every family had a Shiba. The Malamutes all ex sled pulling dogs. and then it became illegal in Harbin. Became illegal in Harbin. Yeah. So they sold all the huskies and the malamutes off then to the dog meet dealers. But Malamutes are also used for car seat covers. You know the fur car seat covers. Yeah. So a lot of car seat covers. You know the fluffy car seat covers. It's malamute fur. It's malamute fur. So a lot of a lot of them are in that trade as well. And also like used for like fake fur and stuff like that would be the Malamutes. Yeah. So the huskies and Malamutes are from the sled pulling and fur. speaker-0: I can tell you've seen too much by the way that you can say this. You've speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: like, yes, that is what happens. speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: Wow. Onto cats. speaker-1: Biggest pain in my life. speaker-0: Where are the cats coming from? speaker-1: The cats are coming from so you know during COVID here everyone bought a dog. In China everyone bought a cat. Okay. Everyone bought a cat. speaker-0: Is that because of the, it's a lot of apartments, right? speaker-1: Yeah, a lot of apartments and I think it was just a lot of people they couldn't go out and walk their pet. We were padlocked in, you know. Yeah. We didn't have restrictions. We were padlocked. so people couldn't walk their their dogs, so they were buying cats. Right. so half half of our cats are street cats and then the other half there would be a lot of them left outside the safe house. Yeah. universities, young young Kids or adults go to university and they're lonely and they get a cat. Yeah. And then they get caught having cat in the dorm and they've kicked the cat cat out. we don't have cat meat trade in Harbin. Now, I know it probably does exist on some level. I've never been exposed to it. The only time I've ever been exposed to it was down in Yuling, but it is a huge industry in the south of China. Okay. But in northern Harbin, they they don't eat they don't. e cat now I'm not saying I'm sure there's one or two that do, but Yeah. so yeah. Okay. speaker-0: Snapping turtles. Goats. The monkey I met tickled his belly. speaker-1: Monkey. Yeah, and he's really cute. He hasn't been the same since. I speaker-0: Did he miss me? speaker-1: think we awoken something in him. Yeah. speaker-0: He he did a little frisky that time. We actually ran. He came speaker-1: We got to get speaker-0: alive and we were like, we need to leave. The meerkats. speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: So you basically, what I witnessed and I've only witnessed a small part of this. I imagine you've been doing this a lot more is you won't say no to an animal in need. Therefore you have a pig, some turtles, snapping turtles, some meerkats, a monkey, speaker-1: Raccoons. speaker-0: raccoons, chickens, goats, partridge in a pear tree. speaker-1: Rabbits everything. speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah. And so you said to me, so, I think you had another monkey long when I came out and you said, I actually don't know what I'm doing with this monkey, but I will find out. this monkey. will have a good life. If you say no to these animals, what happens? speaker-1: If I had said if I had said no to the monkey, I don't know what would have happened to him. The government came to us about him. Right. and I I thought at the time, why did they send him to a zoo? Now of course I don't agree with him going to a zoo, but I said, why and then after reading up and learning about monkeys, you can't just pick up a monkey and put him in with other monkeys. Apparently it doesn't work like that. Absolutely. because we're still waiting for the government to give us that female monkey and a Apparently we can. It was Callum. Callum was like, Haley, you can't just pick her up and be like, here's your new friend. Yeah. It doesn't work like that. So with the monkey, with any animal, you just if you say no, the outcome is so bad. You know, it's so bad. Would it be different if someone said to me, if you don't take this animal, he'll be humanely put to sleep? Probably not, because I'm like, no, you can't do that either. so I don't I d I don't know where the limit happens. I've never rescued in a Western country. I you know, like I don't I don't know how it works here. I don't know how rescuers do, I don't know how they pay their medical bills, but I don't know how they do it. You know what I mean? I don't know. speaker-0: I think the large organizations here that have people get their direct debits and they donate to them and they know about them. The other ones, they're just daily hustling, they're begging donations, they are getting shut down because they can't make ends meet, they can't buy the food. speaker-1: And they have a lot more rules as well that they have to follow. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like I'm sure if the RCPCA walked into the safe house they would have an absolute canary. You know, they're not the rest of their canary. Yeah. So you know, so but I ha you know, there are limits. There has to be limits because we're gonna turn into an absolute a worshit show than we already are. Yeah. but Any meat truck or any animal is always who I the one question that does annoy me on social media is when people see a truck and they go, Did you rescue all the animals? Every single animal is coming off that truck. Yeah. Or none of them, and I'm going to prison. Yeah. Like I'm not being dramatic, but that's the level it's at. Now do not get me wrong. When I w rock up to a dog meat truck and I see goats, I'm like, it's speaker-0: No more go. speaker-1: nothing against goats. I love them. They're funny as anything. But they've destroyed our cat base. They've eaten everything. It looks like Chernobyl. Our cat base looks like Chernobyl. They eat everything. They cost us an absolute fortune. all the males are spayed, none of the females are, because no one knows how to do it. Only one of our workers, C Room, Uncle, my main, he knows how to do it. So he is takes off their balls. Yeah. but when I woke up to dawn, I see monk and I see gold. Yeah. And then Tony will go, We're taking a ghost. I'm like, we're taking. speaker-0: it. speaker-1: We're taking everyone! you know, I'm not gonna sit and go, I'm like, yay, poor ghost speaker-0: Yes. speaker-1: and that's with you know with all of them, you know. Same with the rabbits, with the cats. The cats cost us a fortune. You you've seen our cats. Yeah. You know, our cats cost us probably I think our cats are costing like ten thousand dollars a month. speaker-0: So when Callum and I walked in there, thought, I'm sorry about this thought, but I thought, crazy lady cannot house this many cats together. They're to be stressed off. They're not, they're to be in terrible conditions. They're all going to have cat flu. And I walked in and I had this sense of zen come over me. speaker-1: Everyone says that about the cat room. speaker-0: you done that? It's beautiful. They're not stressed. They are living their best life. speaker-1: Yes. They are on every medication, vaccine, supplements. That's summer. That's summer. If if it it was up to me, I for financial reasons, I would I because no one rescues cats. A lot of rescues don't take cats. a lot of the Chinese rescue groups that I I know in China, they don't accept cats. Right. Because they are extremely expensive. Yeah. And keeping them zen and keeping them happy and giving them everything they need. Yeah. You know, one stressed cat stresses that cat out in the next thing you've cat flew with a hundred cats. Yeah. You know what I mean? And it's just an absolute nightmare. Yeah. So we're like, you know, chill, baby, be relaxed, be happy. It's like, come on. Yeah. speaker-0: You nailed it. speaker-1: but you know, but I'm hoping I'm hoping to start moving cats. Yes. You know, I I really we need to start getting into homes. But when they fly, they get stressed. Yes. So they leave Harbin and they're fine. They arrive in abroad and they're like And then the adopters are like, You just sent me your cat of rabies. We're like, No He's just stressed, give him a few days. So we're trying to find that buffer. speaker-0: how to get them unstressed. speaker-1: Yeah, so having a buffer house where they can go to de stress, you look at them, yeah, give them what they need, and then they can go into their homes. because we have amazing cats, you know. speaker-0: amazing. speaker-1: Absolutely. Instead of buying they can adopt. Yeah. You know, it might come a little bit but speaker-0: Just give it a day. Yeah. And then before we take a break for part two, there was a couple more questions I wanted to ask. Cause part two, we're going to get a little more down and dirty, nitty gritty. hope everyone follows along again next week, but warning, we are going to get into the bad stuff a little. It's going to be upsetting. I wanted to highlight what you do for these because people are nervous about adopting and they are nervous about adopting dogs from abroad. And I know, I'm telling you now, I've seen it with my own eyes. Every dog and cat is tested for viruses. Dogs are tested for brucellosis. Everything is done. They come with the correct paperwork. They have had their rabies vaccines. Everything is done. correctly above board and it is a huge expense for you. Even the transportation itself, but it is done and it is probably properly done. You flee and worm all of the dogs there. You vaccinate all of the dogs, whether they're traveling or not. speaker-1: Have to before they go into safe house they have to be fully vaccinated. speaker-0: down there quarantined, everything is done above board and that's a huge amount of work. I honestly, I really thought maybe you had been a vet or vet nurse because the standards and the quality of what's done there is amazing. You do dentistry on them, you neuter them there. Just outstanding stuff. And then just quickly, the the day to day, I remember you saying to us, don't come before 11. What is happening before 11? speaker-1: So the workers get there around seven half seven. Yeah. And everyone's on crack. Everyone speaker-0: I'm gonna crack. speaker-1: Everyone wants to get out of the room. Yeah. And it's like a kindergarten when you open the doors and just a load of two year olds just run out with no direction of where they're actually going. And it's insane. Yeah. And it's wild. And a few volunteers that do go there early and they see it, they're like, my God. Because by the afternoon they're all asleep. They're speaker-0: The Chillin'. speaker-1: chilling. Yeah. But in the morning they're like, We're free, we're free. And a lot of the time as well, like a lot of the dogs won't pee a poo in their kennels either. Yeah. they'll hold it so when they come out then and you know you know, you've seen the workers how obsessed they are with poo. speaker-0: doesn't even touch the ground Hayley they're catching it but as it comes onto the bumhole before it's the ground speaker-1: I think I scared everyone so much in the beginning with rules. They're just like so on top. But I've always said the day you if you ever come to the safe house and there is poo on the ground and you know I've lost it. I've given up. Do you know what I mean? Because I I will not be in that environment. I don't expect the dogs to be in that environment. I don't expect the workers to be in that environment. So in the mornings it's wild. They're getting the dogs out, they're picking up all the poo. and then it's just chill then for us today, really, isn't it? They just kinda everyone just hangs out. Yeah. Just you know, hanging out and volunteers always say, What would I do when I could just love on the dogs? Just love like if you're not you. Yeah. speaker-0: my God, I didn't get to do that. No, don't speaker-1: You didn't get you're looking at it like a speaker-0: give me a day off. Which is fine because I got the meerkat was doing my hair. you remember? speaker-1: Aggressive now. what did I do? No, nothing. She's gone into her like she's either on here or gone into her natural thing. So yeah, a couple of weeks ago she was like hanging off a volunteer's. Yeah. The baby's mine. She got she got her groove back, I think. And she's like, you know, she's like, This is my turf. Yeah. So we can't go in there now anymore to her. You were the last speaker-0: I've had my moment. I was groomed by a meerkat on my day off. speaker-1: So yeah, volunteers always they say what do we do? It's literally just loving on dogs. Yeah. That's it. Just hanging out with them, just being there with them. and they love having volunteers. speaker-0: love being brushed, don't they? So best thing about being in rescue. I would say just for me, who I'm not in rescue, I just dabble. The happy endings. I know that a lot of the people that read home send you videos and pictures and speaker-1: Yes, yeah. speaker-0: you share them on your Instagram. speaker-1: This part. speaker-0: I really stalk that. If you're not on Hayley's Instagram, please go on it. What's the name so everyone can follow? speaker-1: House Survivors. Under Slaughterhouse Unders Survivors, isn't it? Yeah. speaker-0: Yeah, yeah. And the worst thing. speaker-1: The begging. Begging. Begging. Yeah. Soul crushing. Yeah. speaker-0: You have to beg for donations. speaker-1: Yeah, but you're begging everyone. You stand for donations, you're begging for money, you're begging for help, you're begging for change, you're constantly begging. Yeah. You know, and I've it's one of the most humiliating parts of it. It's humiliating. I don't think any rescuer out there enjoys begging. Yeah you know. I call us glorified beggars. Yeah. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: You know, we're we're glorified beggars. That's all we are. speaker-0: It's been so hard because you're like someone that never asks for anything from anyone. speaker-1: You boys I'm constantly asking. speaker-0: But now you have to constantly ask. speaker-1: But speaker-0: I mean, we appreciate it. I'm sorry you're humiliated. We appreciate it. You have literally changed the world for thousands of dogs. speaker-1: I know. I never Let's see speaker-0: Right, alias tears in my eyes. speaker-1: what part two does to us. speaker-0: Yeah. Thank you so much for coming. We are going to take a break and we're going to do part two, but you guys have to wait until next week. So come back and join us then. Thank you, Hayley. speaker-1: Thank you.