Latest / The MeatEater Podcast / Ep. 064: Bozeman. Steven Rinella talks with Kevin Murphy, the world's greatest small game hunter, along with Helen Cho, Brittany Brothers, Michelle Jorgensen, and Janis Putelis of the MeatEater crew.

Transcript

Ep. 064: Bozeman. Steven Rinella talks with Kevin Murphy, the world's greatest small game hunter, along with Helen Cho, Brittany Brothers, Michelle Jorgensen, and Janis Putelis of the MeatEater crew. · The MeatEater Podcast

• 0:08
  Speaker 1: This is the me Eat podcast coming at you shirtless,
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: severely bug bitten in my case, underwear listening hunt Don't
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: Eat podcast. You can't predict anything. Now we can't be
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: all right? Where is good? If I said to you, like,
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: who not in the mood for Thai food right now?
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: I just got real sick, you wouldn't be like, oh
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: that's racist. No, I guess I thought like's like made.
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: I just I didn't. I didn't think that the beer
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: was associated with that. I would understand food, however, beer,
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: It's like, why aren't you just cutting out everything Mexican?
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: Right now? Yeah, this right here is the perfect snatshop
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: of their relationship. Yeah, perfect in that I say, I
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: say it perfectly reasonable, defensible thing, and then she questions
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: it in that car with them, and then talking about
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: about music. Don't bring music. Introduce everybody so we can continue.
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: Are recording alright? Ready? Start? This episode of the the Meat
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: Eater Podcast is brought to you by our own damn book.
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: Now everyone go introduce yourself and say your favorite thing
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: about the Complete Guide The Hunting, Butchering and Cooking Wild Game,
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: Volumes one and two. A lot of people don't realize
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: what's your problem. I don't want to start. You're you're
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: worried about that? Well, yeah, because that's like how you
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: deal cards. He's gonna go to I was like, I'm
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: the dealer, right, and I'm gonna deal to ni over
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: that way. Not you. Hellen will deal to you. So
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: a lot of people when you know these books exist,
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: but lifetimes lifetime's worth of information Kevin Murphy's in the book,
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: Yes I am, that's his favorite part life lifetimes of information,
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: seven d pages of hunting how to ranging from ranging
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: from navigating UH, permit draws, private land versus public land
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: management systems and and permission systems, how to chop stuff up,
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: how to cook it, how to think? How to read
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: a landscape? Yeah, how to think? Yeah, I need to
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: tell your favorite thing about the guidebooks. Wait, hold on,
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: you didn't say your favorite thing. Oh, but the dealer
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: never deals himself first. That would give me more time
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: to think of my favorite things. My favorite thing is
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: that Kevin Murphy. No, my favorite thing is that Kevin
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: Murphy's in it. Kevin Murphy is, in my opinion, who's
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: here today is the most uh. I think he's America's
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: greatest small game hunter. He's a hero in this office
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: national treasure. He is the world's greatest small game and
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: encumbered by the need to go shoot things with big
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: antlers on them. And I've got the trophy to prove
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: that trophy. And they did put antlers on the trophy.
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: You know. Fittex sent me this email said, hey, we
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: don't have your address. We've got a package coming to you.
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: I said, all right, my starter from a sixty six
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: Scout's gonna come in today. So I'm sitting there waiting
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: for that to come in. I come to the house.
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: Of course, I've got a sign on the doors says
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: put all the packages in the subar rout because if
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: you don't, the dogs will destroy everything on the place.
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: So I'm out in the subar rout and I come
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: in and I expect this package the way. Maybe they
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: put it in the f one fifty, So I'll go
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: over there. There's a package landing there about the size
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: of the starter in there, and there's a whole already
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: torn into thing from the dog. Well, I don't want
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: his dog shipping or what, but somebody's put it in
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: the truck. So I look in there and there's something
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: gold in there and I pick it up. That's not
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: heavy enough to be a starter, says I didn't be
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: made out of gold to be a starter. I thought, well,
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: maybe it's something that Mary Jane is ordered for the house,
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: some kind of gold ornament or something she's gonna put
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: on the front door. So are you Does that mean
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: are you living with U? We are living in sin
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: Kevin m I've waited all my life to do that,
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: Kevin girl seven. So I'm living in saw even though
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: you're trying to make me an honest woman. However, I'm
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: still living in scene. So I opened it up into
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: my amazement. Here's this trophy says best small game show
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: outdoor Sportsman channel there and I I was thrilled to
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: get that. And it's on the man the mantel. It's
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: gonna rotate between the man cave and the basement and
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: the mantel just depends on who I've got over that
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: day or that not. So we're gonna rotate it back
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: and forth. It's gonna be rotating trophies. Yeah, so a
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: little bankground. Kevin is the architect, was the architect. John
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: he was the producer, but Kevin was. Yanni was just
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: like a side note to Kevin's to Kevin's great effort
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: in designing the perfect Kentucky small game hunt where we
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: went down and hunted uh, regular cotton tail rabbits, swamp rabbits,
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: silver silver, silvel just aquaticus and squirrel and we did
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: a big old hunt and kind of highlighted Kevin Murphy's
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: life chasing um squirrels and various rabbits with dogs, with
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: various dogs species, did a hunt, did a show about it,
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: cooked up Kevin Murphy type food like cat heead biscuits,
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: for instance, and it was just this, It was this
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: great show we did and then we got an award,
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: um and and and Kevin gets the whole. We've got
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: two copies of the trophies, but Kevin holds one of
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: our trophies well deserved. Thank you, very dear. But back
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: to get more to that favorite part about the guidebook
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: series seven hundred pages. On the last page is a
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: couple of dedications that you wrote. And I'm real fond
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: of that one. So sweet. We should have gone first
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: rate you had the opportunity. Your favorite part is the
• 6:33
  Speaker 1: dedication that talks about you. Okay, I was just making
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: that funny joke. Um No. I mean my favorite part,
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: if you're looking at the holiest holistically like that, is
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: that we did have so many experts way in, you know,
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: so many people that just even use the word way
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: in we did. Would you weigh in on Kevin squirrel
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: landing with a doubt? Yeah, Robert Abernathy weighed in on
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: turkey hunting, Remy Warren mule deer hunting, a handful of
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: Ronnie Bam weighed in. Jay Scott weighed in so ship
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: like for instance. Kevin Murphy weighs in on the fine
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: art of squirrel hunting with a dog. Jay Scott weighs
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: in on how to tell if the big horn of
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: big horn Ram is bigg or not, which is not
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: easy at all. It's not as hard as hunting squirrels
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: with the dog, but it's not easy. Kevin, what's your
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: favorite thing about the Guy books? This is a very
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: long advertisement. You know. I had a friend that called
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: me up during the last hunting season said, Hey, I've
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: got a young man that I'd like for you to
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: go out and take him hunting. He said, he grew
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: up in a house with the non hunters, and he's
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: very interesting. He says, I'm older, I don't have a
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: whole lot of time. I said, I'll be glad to
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: take him. But I said, the very best thing you
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: could do for that boy is buy him volume and
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: volume one and volume two of the guide book. I says.
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: There's just a plethora of information there, small game, big game, whatever.
• 8:06
  Speaker 1: If he wants to be a hunter, it is in
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: that book. And that's what I like about it. It's
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: a it's a guide that the hunter with with little
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: or no skill at all can take that and start
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: his adventures in the outdoor and have a head start
• 8:21
  Speaker 1: over accomplish hunters that are out there. He'll take that now, Michelle,
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: who has never joined us before, And it is in
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: fact that a new employee um handling. If you write
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: in an email or if you comment on something, it's
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: and it's a real nasty comment on social media and
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: it gets pulled down. Michelle. Hey, everybody, so introduce yourself. Michelle. Um,
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: my favorite part of the guide books so far is
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: just the breadth of recipes and being able to, you know,
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: take a kind of meat that I'm pretty new to
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: wild game and like a big roast, and being able
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: to approach it and make something super delicious. Um, it's
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: it's been a lot of fun digging through the recipes. Good.
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: That was good, Helen. Mm hmmm, let's come back to you.
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: No no, no, it is it that there's too many things?
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: No no. I think to add to what Kevin was saying, Um,
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: I think if you're like me personally, having never hunted
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: growing up, it seems really daunting to learn how to hunt.
• 9:36
  Speaker 1: And the way it's written is in a way that's like,
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: you know, like a friend telling you, not like a textbook,
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: you know. And I think also what's helpful is in
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: the gear stuff like what you can buy now, like
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: what to spend on and what you can buy later.
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: Like that's that kind of stuff really helpful when you're
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: starting from no gear. Um so yeah, I'd say that's
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: my everything that it seems approchable when you read it.
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: It's like, again, it's not some like scientific textbook where
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: you're just like, I have no idea where to even begin.
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: You know, something is basically as like what to put
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: in your like med kit. I mean, it seems like
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: common sense. But I think that someone who's never really
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: been out camping or in the field, like it's very helpful.
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: We're telling me today that you used it, um to
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: get advice on your shotgun and purchase nice Britty Britty
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: had a real love hate relationship with the guide book. Well, yeah,
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: I had a very intimate experience with the guide book
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: work working on it. Um. My favorite part would be
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: the all the great photo organization and the way out
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: because somewhat amazing, but the oh my god, hundreds and
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: hundreds of photos. There are so many, and just to
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: go through all of them and they all have like
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: name is like d S c O five six seven,
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: and you're like, wait, was it five seven or was
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: it five six or was it to seven? Um no,
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: it was. It was a labor of love for everyone
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: I think involved. But um no, actually now I regret
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: going last because everyone else took all the things that
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: I don't wanted to say about it. A lot tons
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: of photos in illustrations and like charts and graphs right well,
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: And so actually what I was going to say was,
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: I think the one of the most the first times
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: that I really used it in one of the most
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: helpful times was when I went hunting with Annie and
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: we went out. We knew we were an area, in
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: an area where we could only hunt um male or
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: female white tail or male mule deer, and like we
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: we like showed up to this place and like just
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: right at shooting light, and there were just a bunch
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: of deer running across this field and we're like, oh,
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: Like we grabbed our guns and like ran out there,
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: and then we're like, wait a minute, are they white
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: tail or are they mule deer? And we didn't have service,
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: but I had the guide book in the truck, so
• 12:02
  Speaker 1: like we ran back to the truck and like flipped
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: through and like discovered what the differences between the two,
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: and we're like, those they are definitely white tails. Like
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: we ran back out there, and then they had all
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: jumped over the fence where we couldn't go and shoot
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: them anymore, but at least like we knew at that point,
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: and the guide book was really helpful and then almost
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: cost those their lives, yes, well it did eventually later
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: that afternoon. We just kind of waited for them to
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: like come back over the fence. But that was a
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: paragraph about patients. Have never found any information in there
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: about patients, because I still just don't have that yet,
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: so I don't want to play report, but you have it.
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: Pleak guy. The Hunting, Butcher and Cooking Wild Game Buys
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: one and two. You can buy them on anywhere you
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: buy books. You can buy it on Amazon. Dirt ass
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: cheap on Amazon. I don't know how they do it. Um,
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: that's one of the most important things. It is very cheap,
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: very raising getting for a gift to someone to give coffee,
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: table book, whatever. If you've got someone out there that
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: to hunter, wants to be a hunter, whatever you can,
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: you can buy one of those things. And it's not
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: gonna no Amazon, You're gonna get all. You're gonna get
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: both volumes, like all seven hundred pages for less than
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: thirty bucks put together. Now, what what's going on with
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: all this turkey missing? This turkey missing? How do we
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: know this would be the times that window? How many
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: days ago to the turkey missing? Okur? Exactly one day
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: ago for me, two days ago for John? Can you
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: lay a little? Can you what can you give me?
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: Can you set? Could you set the scene for me?
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: Because it's her spot, This is the spot you pioneered
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: on your own. Yes you pooed y? Okay, So we
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: all told each other what we like about the guy books.
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna tell what I like about Brittany. Brittany okay,
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: having an independent streak. Brittany has access to lord knows
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: how many people who would tell her where to go
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: find a turkey. But I didn't want to do that. Ship.
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: I wanted to go off and pioneer her own turkey spot.
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: Told me about said turkey spot. I told her I
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: would work. And then it goes out there and it's
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: got all kinds of turkeys in it. Yeah, we're like,
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: you found your own spot. We're on the road driving
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: where were we going somewhere, driving to go and we're
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: getting texts in Brittany and she's like, man, I think
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: there's birds gobbling like many this king were like ship
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: else because it involved like I was telling I was
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: texting the story to Helen and she was like the
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: way that you told me that, Like I heard Steve
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: saying that, and like, so what happened was, Yeah, I
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: found the spot just a lot of research on the internet.
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: And then I told both of both you and Honest
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: that like I found the spot. And then you said,
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: let me get this straight, like you meaning to tell
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: me that out of all the people that we know.
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: I can give you a spot, I can give you
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: roosting spots like GPS way points all this kind of stuff.
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: You're going to go out and board your own. And
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: I was like yep. And then actually, so that day
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: I texted honest, I didn't text you. I texted honest
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: like I heard gobble and I think I see a turkey.
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: You you called me instantly because you guys were sitting
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: in an airport like probably board waiting together somewhere. Yeah,
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: but like you called me. I didn't even text you.
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: I texted honest, and you called me instantly and you
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: were like, here's what you gotta do, not even And
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: I was like, wait a minute, can we just take
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: a second to appreciate what just happened here, Like, yeah,
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: you did what most people. You did what most people
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: just like for whatever reason, I don't want to do. Yeah,
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: And I mean it's it's still like no one's been
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: none of us have been successful there lately, but I
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: mean at all, but we've seen tons of turkeys. There
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: is there a lot of pressure, not at all. And
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: like the first time I went, the same things, they
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: seem hardcore. They just seem kind of like they're just
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: checking the area. They were like a kid who was
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: bow hunting, who was with his dad. I thought that
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: that actually had a rifle with him. I didn't even
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: think he was hunting turkey. Wouldn't be a rifle, be
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: a shotgun. He might have had a rifle to shoot at.
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: He might have been thinking he's going to shoot a
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: kyote or something. Um, did they look like, Yannie, did
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: you see these individuals? Did they look like they knew
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: what they were doing? They're passing through? Hard to say,
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: I don't judge like that, but our tree hunter had
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: shot three turkeys in that spot over the past. I
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: don't know how many years that he's been hunting there.
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: I didn't get that in. They had some very serious
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: he was pointing out face camouflage on they like, I say,
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: they see that they knew what they were doing or
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: passing through. I'm saying, you could see a cup guys
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: standing outside their truck and the trucks running and they're
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: blowing crow calls down into canyon and be like, oh,
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: they could have just I don't know, they might have
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: been passing through, or you could be that you saw
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: a mile away from any road carrying a bunch of
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: dead birds over their shoulders and be like, oh no,
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: there were serious turkey hunters. No. So the guy that
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: we ran into basically the first morning we went to
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: the spot, you honest, like when we first drove in,
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: you honest, just started like you know, crow calling basically,
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: and we heard like gobbls instantly. So that next morning,
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: my boyfriend and I went to that spot. We got
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: in kind of early. We didn't we didn't know where
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: the turkey. That's like a whole I've lost spots like that.
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: I know, I know, you tell me that it's fine.
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: Um anyway, uh so we The way it happened was
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: we ended up, unfortunately and unfortunately sat under a spot
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: where like the turkey was roosting like forty yards in
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: a tree away from us. Who who suggested that we
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: didn't know he was there. Yeah, we didn't know where
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: he was. He wasn't the one going off no, No,
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: So we sat down there and just started calling. We
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: called nothing. We waited ten minutes, we called again. We
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: heard it instantly and we were like, oh my god,
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: my god, and then he kept calling. We stopped. We
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: were like, we're just not going to call anymore. And
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: he would he kept calling. But then finally we were
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: looking around and we're like, oh, he's right there and
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: he can for sure see me. So like at that
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: point it was like I knew that we were blown.
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: And eventually what happened was that turkey and then there
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: were a couple other ones over here that we didn't
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: realize were there until they flew down. They flew into
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: this field behind us, and um so then we ran
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: into that guy a little bit, I don't know, maybe
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: like an hour later, and he was like, yeah, I
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: saw those turkeys fly off the roost. And then like
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: twenty minutes later, you guys like you know, came over
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: the hill, but they were like right over this hill
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: and were just right over here, and he was like,
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: I was trying to get your attention. He was just
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: doing some calls. But from our perspective, I heard like
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: hen calls and I was like, oh, that's someone else,
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: Like I don't want to go and try it in
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: their territory, like they're going in on saying he was
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: trying to notify you about the turkey's location. Yeah, which
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: I don't know how you do hear, I guess. So
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: he was like a nice guy. Suspicious you're not buying it.
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't know. He seemed like a
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: genuinely nice guy. I bought it for sure. How old
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: was he? He looks like he was maybe like early twenties.
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: He seems like, honest, was your boyfriend with you? Oh?
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: He's like, oh, you're usually run into like I was
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: trying to help her out. No, he's a nice guy.
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: If you could have seen what I was wearing, there's
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: no way you could tell that I was like a woman.
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: My whole like everything was covered up, you know. So, uh,
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: then how did it come to be that you missed one? Okay,
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: so I just had a bad distance judgment and yeah,
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: so we set up um and like long story short,
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: finally these turkeys started like coming into Oh yeah, this
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: is like this is the next day. So we we
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: like heard these goggles you know, from a distance whatever.
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: We kind of chase them around, and finally we figured
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: out like they were on this like I don't know,
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: a little finger um sticking out into this canyon. So
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: we kind of like crawled in and we spot I
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: gotta describe it for you. I mean it's like this
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: giant canyon at the head of it, there's just one
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: finger ridge that goes out three or four yards little
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: sandstone and bluff and then it just rolls out in
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: this beautiful grassy ramp that when you go out to
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: the end of it, it just drops off hundreds of
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: feet and the canyon it splits the canyon. And it
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: was the same place where we got into the burs
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: the morning before, but just a beautiful zone meadow. Yeah,
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: it was awesome. Yeah, So we like we set up
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: and and later we figured out there were two groups
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: like on the right and left side of like where
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: the meadow kind of like fans out. But so we
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: were thinking we were going to call in the left
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: group because we actually when we had like first walked
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: down there, Corey had seen like just like a turkey
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: with its fan out. Corey, my boyfriend, I was sorry.
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: So yeah we saw him with this with the turkey
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: fan out, but yeah, I didn't remember that being his
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: name anyway. Um, so we thought we were like looking
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: at those turkeys, and then suddenly like these turkeys came
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: over from the like on the you know, right side
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: of like this sort of like edge. You know, there's
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: a bunch of trees and then the meadow and so
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: like first like these you know, yeah, because so yeah,
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: so first like maybe three or four hens, you know,
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: came out first, and I was like, I know that
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: there's like gobblers behind them, and I could just barely
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: see like in the bushes in the trees. These like
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: first one gobbler, then two, then three. They were very hesitant,
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: but they were like behind them, and they were sort
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: of coming out, you know, very slowly, and they were grouped,
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: you know, kind of bunched together. After it doesn't had
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: to be that you were just there and they happened
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: to show up. They were yeah, yeah, exactly. They were
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: aware of the calling and well yeah they had their
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: fans out. Yeah, yeah, they were fanned out, but it
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: almost seemed like they were a little bit nervous and
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: they were kind of bunched up a little bit. So
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: like I wasn't going to take a shot until I
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: had one kind of separated and then one kind of separated.
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: But it was right in front of these hens, so
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: I didn't want to take a shot anyway, Like from
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: where they were, I was certain because like we had
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: been practicing, we had been shooting, you know, practicing it
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: like you know, thirty yards and again like bad distance judgment,
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: I was like certain it was between like maybe thirty
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: thirty five yards. So finally, like they were about to
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: leave take off back down this hill, and I was like,
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: I gotta take a shot now. Finally one like separated itself.
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: I took a shot and then they just flew away
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: and we looked and there was no like blood or
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: feathers or anything like. It was like, for sure a
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: clean mess. And then afterwards, after the fact, we ranged
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: it from where we were and it was forty seven yards,
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: so I don't know, but it was like for sure,
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: you know, they were gone. There was no sign of
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: any kind of like struggle or I don't know anything.
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: And were you calling? We had been calling, Yeah, personally, yeah,
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: I've been. I was doing like the I would do,
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: like the box initial like box call, like kind of
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: like see if there are any gobbles in the area,
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: and then yeah, and then Corey had like the slate
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: call and was kind of doing like a very quiet,
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: like a much quieter call, and we were trying to
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: be very like conservative about our calling. Is he is
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: he uh an experienced turkey owner. That was his first
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: turkey this was your third time? Was my third time? Yeah, um,
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: did you have the Jake decoy out? We had the
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: Jake decoy out too, so I would be curious and
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: they didn't run up to that decoy. I was curious,
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: like maybe if they I don't even think they saw it,
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: and they didn't even give it a second glance. But
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: I'd be curious that we had the hen decoy, like
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: maybe it would have been different, maybe it wouldn't have
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: I don't know, but um, yeah, that was a bummer.
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: But it was so exciting to see them because all morning,
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: like we had heard turkeys off in this sense, and
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: then we didn't hear anything. And I don't know, Like personally,
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: I realized, I think the more I like hunt with
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: other people, sometimes I have a tendency to, like, in
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: my mind, blame them for things that go wrong. I
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: wanted to go over here, and you wanted to go
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: over here. It's fault. But when I had by myself,
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: obviously it's like all my fault and there's no one
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: else to blame. But when I with someone else, so
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: I often just like sit there stewing, like we could
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: have done you know, we could have done this. My brother,
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: Matt talks about that a lot because he hunts more
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: and more and more, he hunts more alone, you know,
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: as he gets older and the loneliness kills him because
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: he has long periods of time, the loneliness kills him.
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: Body doesn't um. He doesn't like that, like that were
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: this sort of gentlemanly way where you try, what do
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: you think right? What do you think right? He doesn't
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: like he's want he knows what he wants to do,
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: you know, and he doesn't want to have to act
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: like he's open to someone. He doesn't want to pretend
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: like he's open to input and engaging in that kind
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: of conversation. Right from my like from my just personal
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: experience being a new hunter hunting with more experienced hunters
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: like the like the like the mentorship is invaluable, and
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: I like really really appreciate that. But what I do
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: wish I had more of was like given I would
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: wish I was often given the chance of like, well
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: why don't you you know, why don't why don't you
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: make a decision? Like it's more often like I'm like, oh,
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: I want to go check out this, and it's like no,
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: no, no no, they're not going to be over there, like
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: we're gonna go this way. It's like, well, I want
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: to make my own mistakes, Like why don't you let
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: me just check it out? Like maybe there are maybe
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: there aren't. You know what I mean, Like is a
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: less experienced hunter hunting with someone who is more experienced.
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: Often I'm I just want to be given the chance
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: to like do it on my own sometimes, you know,
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: make my own mistakes the flip side, not the flip side.
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: But another thing that could happen though, is you would
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: have been bearing down on that turkey and your more
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: experienced hunting partner might have went or some noise like that,
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: being like no, no, no, no, and then wait wait
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: wait wait wait yeah no, I mean absolutely filled that turkey. Right, No,
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: you're you're you know, you're totally right. I mean I think,
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: you know, I could be either situation. Yes, I wish
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: I had that chance more often doing right? How do
• 26:42
  Speaker 1: you do it? Shoot? Shoot? Right? No? I mean and yeah,
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: I mean anything could happen. I think that's the biggest thing,
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: is like anything that could happen. But sometimes I wo
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: just wouldn't make my own mistakes. And in that sense,
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: I did make my own mistakes. So when you say
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: it was your third turkey hunt, you went last year.
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: I went last year by myself to that spot, was
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: just by yourself. I was by myself. The second time
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: was with the Patelli's clan at that same spot, and
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: then the third time was with the Patelis clan, Corey,
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: my boyfriend, and Helen and John and that was the
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: most fun out of all the time. He what was
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: your take on all this? This is my first turkey
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: hunt and everything. I'm obsessed with turkey hunting now, even
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: if I didn't even get a shot at a bird,
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: I'm obsessed with everything that goes around with it. You
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: like it better and shooting cowell, surf caffer, like everything
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: from the names of things in turkey hunting, Like the
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: Honest was telling me, He's like, you know what the
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: big you know, big male turkeys, look, they're called Boss
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: Tom's roth trackers. Like you know the little dingle the
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: little dingle bell that hangs over a turkey's nose and
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: lays off to the side of his nose. It's called
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: You love this if you think if you like Boss Tom,
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: come on, you guys were educated on that the wattle no, no,
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: little dangler off his head. Oh called it danglar. No
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: in the guide book. I remember, you know what else
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: is in the guide book? No no, no, no, no
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: no snood Oh that's right, snoud hangs there's the little deally. Yeah,
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: the very first gobble. It's just it's addictive. I felt
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: like a cracky head. I was like, you know, you
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: would hear it and then it would go silent. You're like,
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: just one more couple, just want The thing is, man,
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: the thing is, you can't you can't like explain. You
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: could explain to those people. You cannot, like you can't
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: go to someone like, hey man, check on this picture
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: me and this turkey has shot. No, it's gonna be
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: like didn't get it before. It was like, I'm going, dude,
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: you know I'm the next guy that's in a picture
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: of the dead turkey is gonna be me. It's like
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: that doesn't speak to people. And it'll be all the
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: woods and here and just like the absurdly loud sound
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: of a turkey going off, and then all the calls too,
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: because we were with the Honest and Is doing all
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: sorts of calls. So the rhythm of calls, the different
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: kinds of calls. I mean, everything about it was just
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: it was amazing. It was so much fun. The call master,
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: it's kind of a columnaster. Yeah, you made fun of all.
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: I'm like a B. I'm like a B caller, but you,
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: honest is like an a caller. Interesting you don't agree
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: with that? Plays So does that bolt me down to
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: be mines? I like, I can kill turkeys, but like
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: I can call turkeys in. But I'm not like a
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: great caller, you know. I think I think I have more. Yeah,
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: I think I have more of a sense of rather
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: than having just the tremendous vocabulary of turkey sounds. I
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: feel that I have Probably I feel like I have
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: a pretty good sense of cadence, what's too much, what's
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: too little, that kind of stuff. But I don't have
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: like a great turkey vocabulary. But the calling part is
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: something like if I hadn't been with the Honest or
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: somebody who had experienced turkey hunting, you could buy all
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: the calls, but you wouldn't know necessarily. I mean, you
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: can watch YouTube videos and stuff too, some good stuff.
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: I feel that if you want to learn how to
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: use turkey calls, man, I don't know if you honest
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: would agree with this, but um, what one of working
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: for me is the stuff anything about Will Primos instructive
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: material because he is uh, he is just like a
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: like a very good clear communicator and he's a pleasure
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: to listen to, extremely knowledgeable and for calling how to
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: well Primo CDs no bullshit. Last night, my old lady
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: and I are in bed Bolden kids clothes, which I've
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: been lamenting lately to you, and we're watching amount of
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: clothes folding the like every night it's likely another basketball,
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: but we're watching Bill pre Bows and uh. Numerous times
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: I had to give Jenner for the old nudge nudge
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: and be like, hey, keep folding. I know Bill is
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: interesting at all, but keep folding. You need to go
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: to bed. She's a pretty good Colors last year she's
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: getting figured. Was she using a diaphragm or potton bag? Mostly?
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: But Turkey Hounting is like it's there's so much strategy
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: that's involved. You know, you think that you're like these
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: dumb birds, like, but they're they're like their site is
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: incredible and like also it's like chess. You're like, okay,
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: so you know we saw one that was really close
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: to camp and we're like, why don't we just go
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: over there? I'm like, kill a thing and yeah, and
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: Britney's boyfriend walked up the like path. As soon as
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: he started walking, which was like pretty far from the
• 32:09
  Speaker 1: field that they were at, they were like, nope, we're
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: camp signing bullshit. It was windy's all get out, so
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: we had quit it, like I don't know, six thirty
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: seven had an hour. Figure, let's get some dinner. Hopefully
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: we'll lay down, we'll go try roost a couple and
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: it's thirty minutes before dark and I look over and like,
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: what three golbers working up the edge of this PIDs
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: or something core. He's like, I'm gonna make a play.
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: I said, go for it. But if I was you,
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: I would go that way first, about a quarter mile
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: over the ridge and then come around on him. He's like, no,
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: let's go round the road and cut him off. He
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: didn't make it thirty yards away from our little group.
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: You know that turkeys were comfortable with and they're things
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: to have not have heard that. I'm like everyone else
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: let's thing about turkeys. Man is like, uh, you'll have
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: have that. They're out all day, you know, so dear,
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: you can be hunt white tails, and you hunt in
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: the morning, and then at some point the data changes, right,
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: like the light gets a certain way, the wind gets
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: a certain way, the data is feels like it's daytime,
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: and those sons of bitches are laying in the nastiest
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: hell hole right where you could walk ten ft away
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: from him, and you're not gonna see him. Oftentimes it's
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: like nothing you're gonna do. There's no tree you're gonna
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: be in to see him. You're not gonna find them.
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: It's like they don't. They kind of like cease to
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: exist and you gotta wait till evening when they marryatt
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: get up, you know, and make themselves approachable or findable again.
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: But turkeys, even when you're like pulling your hair out,
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: like they are out walking around. They are not hiding somewhere.
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: They're out eating bugs, eating grass, walking around. So when
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: you see one now and then, it's almost kind of
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: surprising when you just like randomly happened into a turn
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: seems so elusive. On this it was just like we
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: just saw it. Where did it go? It was right
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: and and like you could hear a gobble but it
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: sounds so close. But it was like on the other
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: side of the you know the canyon. Well, we saw
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: last year in New Mexico something I didn't know what
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: happened where we come and we were walking down a
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: canyon and came around a corner and it was a
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: tom in this where the canyon opens up and it's
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: like a grassy bottom and that something a bit laid
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: down and laid his head and neck out flat on
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: the ground. He got down like he pretended to be dead.
• 34:37
  Speaker 1: He tried to down. He laid flat against the ground,
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: just melt and he laid flat against the ground, stretched
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: his neck out and laid his neck and head down
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: on the ground to hide, and then realized he was busting,
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: stood up, ran off. There a lot of pusher in
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: that area or something of every other kind of pressure
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: that's so weird. In fact, there's uh where just based
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: on all the evidence laying around, we saw where a
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: lion had killed a turkey. I mean not a hundred
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: yards from there. They eat ship for turkeys there, I
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: tell you that. And the one that was there was
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: paranoid man. But people who think it would be easy
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: to hunt turkeys are based off of turkeys that are
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: in residential areas. That'd be like saying like, oh, elk
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: must be easy. I went to Yellowstone and the elk
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: were standing around. It's like, yeah, well you don't hunt
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: the Yellowstone. No, they're not easy hunting. They tune into
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: whatever like threat exists, and they know about hunting their paranoid.
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: I mean, I've been to that same spot three times
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: now and haven't killed a turkey. Yeah, that's because it
• 35:39
  Speaker 1: just takes a while. If you went out there with
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: Robert Abernathy, you'd have a pilot, you'd have a whole
• 35:44
  Speaker 1: pilot that turkey. It's just like it just takes time.
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: Kevin Murphy, I have no turkey hunting scales. There's no
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: doubt you killed turkeys, skilled turkeys. How win. Last Tuesday,
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: LBL I got drawn for the early hunt for Monday,
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: and Tuesday, my daughter came in from school, so we
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: had a jeep driving exercise that day. The girl had
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: never driven any automobile straight shift without pire breaks or
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: without pire staring, so I spent the day with her
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: driving the jeep. So I got up the next day
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: to go hunting, and it was coming to monsoon rain,
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: so when the rain came over, I decided I'd go
• 36:28
  Speaker 1: to L B l And between Lakes hundred seventy seven
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: thousand acres up there, and I decided to go out
• 36:35
  Speaker 1: and drive around look around while it was raining. They
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: finally stopped and I went up this row the Ivan
• 36:41
  Speaker 1: Rogers Road, and I remember about fifteen or twenty years ago,
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: I was riding a horse through their squirrel hunting and
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: there was a like a keep back because he was
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: talking quickly. I don't want to lose sight of your
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: how you came to be familiar with this particular piece
• 36:59
  Speaker 1: of ground you ride. But can you remind people about
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: like what you're the war horse? Well, I've got I
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: guess it was probably about nineteen eighty nine or something
• 37:14
  Speaker 1: that was on a big squirrel hunt on foot up there,
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: and I come on a gravel road and I saw
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: these three guys come by on horse horses with their
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: squirrel dogs, and they had saddlebags and there was tails
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: just hanging out all of these saddle bags. You know,
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: I'm out here walking, they're riding. I've got to get
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: some new gear. So so about a year or two later,
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: I got a job at city hall and there was
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: a boy in there. Paul, Paul Howry you've met Paul
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: was in there, and he had horses, and he no offense.
• 37:49
  Speaker 1: I wouldn't typify him as a boy. Everybody's boy. Ball's
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: sixty two now or something like that. So his babysitter
• 37:58
  Speaker 1: when he was a kid was a horse. When he
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: was five years old, his dad traded thirty five bales
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: of alfalfa for a pony. That was mean as Hall
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: already gave it to Paul. And everybody had ponies back
• 38:10
  Speaker 1: in the sixties. That was the thing to have. It's
• 38:13
  Speaker 1: iPhones now, it was ponies. So so he just grew up, right,
• 38:21
  Speaker 1: he just grew up riding a horse there. So I
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: was up there at city Hall work and he was
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: the engineering department. I was in the water wastewater department.
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: And his horse this and horse this, blah blah blah horses.
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: You said vision squirrels tales and said, I'm gonna come over.
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: We're gonna open up squirrel season in April. So we're
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: going hunting this weekend. I'm ringing my dog and the guns.
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: We're going over there. So we got out there and
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: he's got two horses in a lot there's a little
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: bit he pinto pony looking thing and a real nice
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: saddle horse. So he puts me on this little pinto horse. There.
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: I ride around a lot to three times, because I've
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: only been on a horse maybe three or four times
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: in my life, just never never been around onund him
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: just a little bit, so I didn't fall off. So
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: we go out there and I'm on the saddle. That's
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: about I don't know. Some kids scattle right here. So
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: we write it down the first hill, up the next hill,
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: and it's wearing his big blister on my backside there.
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: I said, okay, I said, I'm either gonna get the
• 39:16
  Speaker 1: big horse with the big saddle, or you're gonna carry
• 39:19
  Speaker 1: the gun. Well, he didn't want to carry the gun,
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: so so I got on the big horse with the gun,
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: and from there on out, I bought a horse, and
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: we hunted hard from about ninety two to just within
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: the last three or four years, and then just they
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: got older and don't hunt as much anymore, but they
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: go with Jodie. Jody's my new horse hunting buddy. He's
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: sixty seven and Leon is sixty four with a double
• 39:43
  Speaker 1: hip replacement. So that's they've replaced Paul pretty much. But
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: we'll go for a half a day's twelve iyers full
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: days twenty four is my buddy, Steve Doolittle sense when
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: he goes hunting. He was a city planner. He was
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: in city halled. He rears white start shirt every day,
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: had the big nerd pack on him, and he looked
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: like just a geek. And I finally found out that
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: the only thing between him and the north pole was
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: a bob war fence. He was grew up in North
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: Dakota and he hunted and messed around. So I recruited
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: him to go over and go squirrel hunting. And we
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: were around there and he was trying to whoever's new
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: on the board. We let them try to do all
• 40:18
  Speaker 1: the shooting, and we said, you know, you need to
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: bring a sandwich and some food and the twenty two
• 40:23
  Speaker 1: rifle with a scope on it. So we'll stay out,
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: you know, we'll do do half a day or so.
• 40:27
  Speaker 1: So he comes over the house at four thirty in
• 40:29
  Speaker 1: the morning. It's ire drive to Paul. So we get
• 40:31
  Speaker 1: over there at five thirty, get everything saddled up. But
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: so six thirty seven o'clock were out and about and
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: it's one of those days when the squirrels were out.
• 40:39
  Speaker 1: He's one of those rainy, misty days when they come
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: out and they're low, and we were stacking up squirrels
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: and we're trying to get Steve to shoot him with
• 40:47
  Speaker 1: his ted Williams twenty two automatic with the the the
• 40:52
  Speaker 1: optical about the size of a drinking straw on it.
• 40:55
  Speaker 1: He says, it's just not fair. Boy. He says, y'all
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: got thosehubble telescopes on. Y'all's good. It's not just through mac.
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: So the war horse developed into we went back our
• 41:05
  Speaker 1: grub on it. Maybe a baseball bat, so if they
• 41:09
  Speaker 1: go into a hollow tree or something, you can just
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: kind of ring it a little bit, beat out a
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: little bit and which works. And I didn't see Kevin
• 41:17
  Speaker 1: doing a baseball bat, but I just see him do
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: it with a stick. The squirrel goes into a hole
• 41:21
  Speaker 1: and just tap the tree and he would come out.
• 41:25
  Speaker 1: And then then he'll carry a shotgun to one scabbard
• 41:28
  Speaker 1: and twenty two and the other maybe a machiney or
• 41:31
  Speaker 1: chopping as the army getting pretty much. Kevin is another
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: trip man that blew me away. Was just cutting a
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: long sawtooth briar, sallow tooth briar. So he'll find a
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: big long sawtooth briar. It's like, you know, just vinds
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: that grow and he'll trim it up and get the
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: teeth off that thing, except leave a couple of teeth
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: on the end, and you can snake that up into
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: as like you're trying to clean the drain. Snake it
• 41:58
  Speaker 1: up into a hollow tree and you'll bump the squirrel
• 42:00
  Speaker 1: and he'll come shooting out. Lots of tricks, lots of
• 42:05
  Speaker 1: squirrel hunting tricks. I wish Montana had more squirrel hunting.
• 42:08
  Speaker 1: Correct me if I'm wrong, But I've been telling people
• 42:10
  Speaker 1: about heavy duty squirrel hunters and like that. I feel
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: like it doesn't really matter really what Like the total
• 42:18
  Speaker 1: at the end of the day is as much as
• 42:21
  Speaker 1: when you say zero got away. Is that true to you?
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: Like you're kind of more You're proud of the fact
• 42:27
  Speaker 1: if you can say zero versus five got away, but
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: we killed fifteen. I like both, like a big body
• 42:35
  Speaker 1: counting none get away. Now, the older the older I get,
• 42:41
  Speaker 1: you know, it's more enjoyable just to go now and
• 42:43
  Speaker 1: take somebody new. You know, that's never got to shoot anything,
• 42:47
  Speaker 1: do whatever, and kind of show them some things said. Okay,
• 42:50
  Speaker 1: and probably my pride of hunting is to see the
• 42:54
  Speaker 1: squirreld first. You know, if I'm if I'm riding two
• 42:58
  Speaker 1: rages over there and I'm they're looking, you know, I'm
• 43:01
  Speaker 1: hoping this horse didn't run me under a tree limb
• 43:03
  Speaker 1: or anything. So I'm riding there looking for him to move,
• 43:07
  Speaker 1: because a lot of times that's when they all when
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: you're riding up or the dogs are running around there,
• 43:11
  Speaker 1: that they'll move. So that's probably the thing that I
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: liked it that I don't have to kill any But
• 43:16
  Speaker 1: if I can spot the squirrel first before anybody else,
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: and I'm pretty good at it, then that's enough for me.
• 43:23
  Speaker 1: Now I want to get back to the what what
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: started this whole thing? But you told me if I
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: can't remember the answer, our squirrel hunters kind of not
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: just not just horse mounted squirrel hunters, but squirrel hunters
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: in general. Is that kind of fading out pretty much
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: in your area Kentucky? Or were you saying there's like
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: more dudes getting into it? Um? Probably as far as
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: the steel hunters when I was a kid. You better
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: have your spot staked out before way before daylight, because
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: you did, and somebody would come in. Squirrel season comes
• 43:56
  Speaker 1: in the third Saturday, but in August, and that's traditional
• 44:01
  Speaker 1: squirrel season for forever, and everybody in the country would
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: be out squirrel hunt that morning. Now, if you can
• 44:08
  Speaker 1: go anywhere you want to, there's not anybody out there
• 44:12
  Speaker 1: that has disappeared. Uh, squirrel hunting with dogs has probably
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: picked up more. Uh they're a little more prevalent out there.
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: With the Internet, people can find out who's got dogs.
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: There's a lot of competitions with dogs. Um. One of
• 44:28
  Speaker 1: my good buddies from West Virginia, he had a buddy
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: the other day and he said he saw it happen.
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: He sold a dog for twenty thousand dollars squirrel doll
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: the squirrel dog twenty thousand dollars, said some guy from
• 44:40
  Speaker 1: down south, lots of money, didn't even hunt his dogs.
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: He just boughted him to putting his ken on, paid
• 44:46
  Speaker 1: somebody else to hunt with his squirrel dog. And I
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: remember back in the eighties there was a squirrel organization,
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: American Tree and Fight Association, and they came to LBF
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: for like a competition squirrel where don't kill you just
• 45:00
  Speaker 1: go out and tree. And there was a oral dentist there.
• 45:07
  Speaker 1: He wasn't that hunt, but they told me about him.
• 45:09
  Speaker 1: Said yeah, I said he's got twelve squirrel dogs and
• 45:12
  Speaker 1: said they're all top notched, you know. And he says
• 45:14
  Speaker 1: if he finds it good when he just goes out
• 45:16
  Speaker 1: and by it. But the prevalence of squirrel hund with
• 45:18
  Speaker 1: a dog is probably came up more. It's not that
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: uh prevalent out there, but there is several several people
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: doing it. But the squirrel hunt still hunters. They go
• 45:30
  Speaker 1: out and slip through the woods hot summertime, waiting for
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: the squirrels to cut hickory nuts, pecans. That that is
• 45:40
  Speaker 1: that has gone down. Um, kids just don't do it anymore.
• 45:44
  Speaker 1: You know, it's hot, nasty out there. They don't want
• 45:46
  Speaker 1: to get chiggers on them, snake bit whatever, and they
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: just they just don't do that. You know, they can concentrate,
• 45:52
  Speaker 1: they concentrate on well you know then that's all we
• 45:55
  Speaker 1: had to hunt. We had squirrel and rabbit and quail
• 45:59
  Speaker 1: that no, no, no turkeysy no, speaking of turkeys. Um,
• 46:08
  Speaker 1: you were out there day and passed through an area
• 46:11
  Speaker 1: you had grown familiar with through your equestrian wanderings in
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: search of squirrels. Passed through it one time, maybe twice.
• 46:18
  Speaker 1: I went through their bird hunt one time when we
• 46:20
  Speaker 1: had some birds in LB was some quail, but I
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: decided that I was going to go in there to
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: see if I could find where that a refuge sign was.
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: It was pretty unique. I've never seen one like that,
• 46:31
  Speaker 1: So you wanted to steal it. I wanted to put
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: it in the man cave. So okay, okay, for prosperity,
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: say that's right. So I went back there looking for it,
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: and I heard a big gobbler and he out there
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: out there gobbling, and I thought, well, I sit down here,
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: because I had all my ear with me, Jim call.
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: I had a call at a little box call diaphragm.
• 46:58
  Speaker 1: All that, so I, no, I don't have I have
• 47:02
  Speaker 1: no skills, I have no skills. Doesn't really bother me.
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: So I got down. I could hear him gaming, and
• 47:08
  Speaker 1: I would just call a little bit with him, and
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: a little bit he would answer, and then I wouldn't
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: hear nothing from a long time, and then he would
• 47:14
  Speaker 1: answer again and I would call. But this one was
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: probably for like two hours. He was like four hundred yards.
• 47:19
  Speaker 1: I was done in the bottom, and he was probably
• 47:22
  Speaker 1: three or four hundred yards up on a ridge in
• 47:24
  Speaker 1: the LBL, you know the relief fire. He was probably
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: like a hundred feet above me. Why why didn't you
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: close the distance? Well I did eventually. I finally I
• 47:36
  Speaker 1: decided that I would go in there to him, and
• 47:39
  Speaker 1: went up through there, and I could still hear him,
• 47:41
  Speaker 1: and I could was pinpoint where it was. Like I said,
• 47:43
  Speaker 1: I was done in this ravine and he was up
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: on top. So he had advantage on me right there.
• 47:47
  Speaker 1: And it's pretty open. Our our our leaves were leaved
• 47:54
  Speaker 1: out about the size of a mouse's here, so he
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: could see. He busted me. He saw me coming up
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: through the got busted. So you didn't get him, didn't
• 48:03
  Speaker 1: get him. I'll be back though, I know where he lives.
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: How long has your season run for? UH to about
• 48:09
  Speaker 1: the let's see, I think maybe the fifth of May.
• 48:15
  Speaker 1: You need to get back after him. I'll go back
• 48:18
  Speaker 1: out there. I was just reading the thing in UH
• 48:21
  Speaker 1: National Wild Turkey Federations publication that kind of like some
• 48:25
  Speaker 1: alarming declines and turkey numbers around the country. Handful of
• 48:31
  Speaker 1: places they can't figure out what's going on. But it
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: might be that we like hit the That might be
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: that we like hit the apex. We were like hit
• 48:41
  Speaker 1: the good old days of good old days nineteen sixty
• 48:46
  Speaker 1: four sixty five turkeys, Well, they impounded Kentucky like cropping
• 48:51
  Speaker 1: numbers for the next ten years or so skyrocketed. They
• 48:56
  Speaker 1: just come up there and then they started plummeting down.
• 49:00
  Speaker 1: And I think that's what's happened to our turkeys. They've
• 49:02
  Speaker 1: came in good old mother nature gives them the instinct
• 49:07
  Speaker 1: to breed and multiplying. Uh, they produce offspring just left
• 49:13
  Speaker 1: and right there. Uh. Now after they've got established, Uh,
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: there's more predators probably hunting on them. I don't think
• 49:20
  Speaker 1: that instinct is there. So we are we're at the
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: not the caring capacity, but mother's nature's capacity of what
• 49:27
  Speaker 1: to have in those game works. That's what I think
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: has happened, because because I see it in my area
• 49:33
  Speaker 1: and I hear a lot of people talk about it.
• 49:35
  Speaker 1: Um as far as any disease or anything, I mean,
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: we got turkeys everywhere. There's some ideas floating around about
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: you know, some pathology. There's some ideas floating around about predation.
• 49:47
  Speaker 1: There's some ideas floating around and it's kind of almost
• 49:49
  Speaker 1: like a taboo subject with certain people. But over harvest
• 49:54
  Speaker 1: that we're seeing the impacts of fall hunting where you're
• 49:57
  Speaker 1: killing hens. There are many many ideas. I just think
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: that it's just like that, like I said, you even
• 50:03
  Speaker 1: pound any like whatever that first ten years ago, so
• 50:07
  Speaker 1: your animals take off and go, and then after that
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: it just it just seeks its own level of what
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: it needs to be out there. There's no instinct to
• 50:15
  Speaker 1: go out here and blaze new territory or whatever. They
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: turkeys are there, they're just not in those numbers that
• 50:22
  Speaker 1: they want to be. But we forgot, you know, boocoos
• 50:25
  Speaker 1: of turkeys out there. I mean they're everywhere. You know, Michelle,
• 50:28
  Speaker 1: what you think about all this so far? I'm taking
• 50:30
  Speaker 1: it all in cool everything. No one's upset anything that
• 50:33
  Speaker 1: upsets you, Okay, And then you want to ask about
• 50:37
  Speaker 1: our ad. We keep thinking on it. I saw that
• 50:41
  Speaker 1: you looked surprised when he said that someone bought up
• 50:43
  Speaker 1: two thousand dollar scroll dog. That's surprising information. Yeah, but
• 50:48
  Speaker 1: I mean I've seen him work on the episode. It
• 50:50
  Speaker 1: was it was really exciting, Yeah, because a lot of
• 50:53
  Speaker 1: times you're on the wood of some guy's hunting dog,
• 50:55
  Speaker 1: and I'm just really thinking, Man, we'd be doing a
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: lot better if this dog wasn't here. But those dogs,
• 51:00
  Speaker 1: that's not true. The best names, Kevin, Can you uh
• 51:09
  Speaker 1: tell me about all these big old crop ees you
• 51:11
  Speaker 1: were catching the spring? Well have been two places Kentucky Lake, which,
• 51:16
  Speaker 1: like I said, was impounded in nineteen forty five. I
• 51:20
  Speaker 1: think the Tennessee River. Uh we got Barkley Lake that
• 51:24
  Speaker 1: was the common river impounded in the in the sixties. YEA,
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: hold that thought for a minute. But when Kevin saw
• 51:30
  Speaker 1: a land between the lakes, it used to be land
• 51:32
  Speaker 1: between the rivers, and it was the big juncle like
• 51:38
  Speaker 1: an isthmus between where two rivers come. So those rivers
• 51:40
  Speaker 1: flow into the Ohio. Right, that's correct. The Cumberland and
• 51:43
  Speaker 1: the Tennessee flow into the Ohio as they approached the Ohio.
• 51:48
  Speaker 1: They're pretty close together. Between them was an isthmus like
• 51:53
  Speaker 1: or I guess yeah, an isthmus like feature between them
• 51:57
  Speaker 1: that had small community is an agricultural economy timber. Timber
• 52:05
  Speaker 1: agriculture pretty much in the river bottoms goes to the
• 52:08
  Speaker 1: land in between. Was pretty much Rolling Hills, Uh, pretty
• 52:11
  Speaker 1: much where Steele was invented steel. Yeah, but the Kelly
• 52:16
  Speaker 1: process that Bessemer was an Englishman that supposedly stole the
• 52:21
  Speaker 1: process from Kelly and took it back to England. After
• 52:25
  Speaker 1: several years, Um, they were in a lawsuit and finally
• 52:28
  Speaker 1: now you're looking Encyclopedia, Wikipedia or whatever, it's the Kelly
• 52:32
  Speaker 1: Bestment process. So, um, a lot of small other small
• 52:36
  Speaker 1: a lot of small arm furnaces. They had, uh small
• 52:39
  Speaker 1: deposits of arn ore seventy You can pick up a
• 52:44
  Speaker 1: chunk of arn ore and a creek bed or and
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: a boar shout somewhere and you're just about think it's
• 52:49
  Speaker 1: pure arn. So they had the arm there. Yea. And
• 52:52
  Speaker 1: I brought a chunk of that home that you gave me.
• 52:55
  Speaker 1: Uh the t s A guys are interested in that?
• 52:58
  Speaker 1: H Do you tell us a media? No? I told
• 53:02
  Speaker 1: him it was iron and he had a qualifying question
• 53:04
  Speaker 1: about it. I can't remember what are you asking? Suggested
• 53:08
  Speaker 1: he knew a little bit about iron ore, but no,
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: that they just wanted to pull out the bag and
• 53:11
  Speaker 1: ask you what it was. They had the timber there
• 53:14
  Speaker 1: also for the for the charco They made charcode to
• 53:17
  Speaker 1: ment them to stay only yeah, because there's still charcoal
• 53:20
  Speaker 1: furnaces out there and um. And it was like a
• 53:24
  Speaker 1: little bit like removed from because there was a ferry system.
• 53:27
  Speaker 1: So it's like a little bit it's a little bit
• 53:30
  Speaker 1: like a little backwatersh backwoods is And then they impounded
• 53:33
  Speaker 1: those rivers. He created two big gas lakes, and then
• 53:38
  Speaker 1: there was kind of a process of of people getting
• 53:43
  Speaker 1: bought out and leaving and now it's just a giant
• 53:45
  Speaker 1: patch of public ground about a d seventy seven thousand
• 53:48
  Speaker 1: acres runs from from Kentucky. They're starting at Lake City
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: down to Dover, Tennessee, with all the like the vestiges
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: of habitation. Though there's still you go there in the cemeteries,
• 54:00
  Speaker 1: old churches, charcoal. Yeah. Um. So there you're in those
• 54:07
  Speaker 1: lakes fishing croppies. We fished. There's some our limit. There
• 54:11
  Speaker 1: is a teenage croppie that you can then so ten inches,
• 54:14
  Speaker 1: you know, just a little bit bigger than your hand.
• 54:15
  Speaker 1: That's already a giant. So that's the minimum sized limit
• 54:18
  Speaker 1: for Kentucky. So when I was a little boy, like
• 54:22
  Speaker 1: the lake I grew up on before the crop, he's
• 54:24
  Speaker 1: kind of they kind of tapered off when they killed
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: all the ore lake had milfoil in it, and eventually
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: got after the mil foil, which is an invasive plant.
• 54:34
  Speaker 1: But when they got after the milfoil and got rid
• 54:36
  Speaker 1: of it, it really put a dent in the croppies
• 54:38
  Speaker 1: for a while because it took a long time for
• 54:40
  Speaker 1: the native weeds to get established and get gone good.
• 54:43
  Speaker 1: But that would have been a giant a teen inch
• 54:46
  Speaker 1: back home, Yeah, well giant. We made a trip down
• 54:50
  Speaker 1: to Oxford, Mississippi. Uh. There's four lakes down there, Granada, uh, Eden, Uh,
• 54:58
  Speaker 1: sardists in Washington, and we we fished Eden and the
• 55:04
  Speaker 1: minimum size there is a twelve inch croppy ship. So
• 55:09
  Speaker 1: one day that's the minimum size of them. That's what
• 55:11
  Speaker 1: that's what the minimum size of them for large mouth
• 55:14
  Speaker 1: bass was. Um. We caught seventeen one day the boat
• 55:18
  Speaker 1: I was in, and twelve of them were over two pounds.
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: I caught two ship you know, I don't know, we
• 55:26
  Speaker 1: just you know, we put them on them like that
• 55:28
  Speaker 1: laptop computer. Yeah, yeah, that's about like that. Yeah, that's
• 55:32
  Speaker 1: about that size. For really I caught to two fours.
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: One boy called a two six was in a boat
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: with me and they had the oldest organized croppy tournament
• 55:44
  Speaker 1: in the US on Sardists that weekend and they called
• 55:48
  Speaker 1: a three four I think on it. And the world
• 55:51
  Speaker 1: record came out of Sardists or Granada, one of those
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: lakes down there, and it is a five pounder really,
• 55:58
  Speaker 1: so it's it's no doubt. I don't understand how that
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: could be possible. It is everything is set up, you
• 56:06
  Speaker 1: know what the hell it look like. Just they're supposedly
• 56:10
  Speaker 1: flood control lakes and they were put in there, I
• 56:13
  Speaker 1: guess to capture flood water that was going to the
• 56:16
  Speaker 1: Mississippi River. Um. This was my first trip down there.
• 56:20
  Speaker 1: I didn't get to see the whole lake situation. We
• 56:24
  Speaker 1: stayed out in the deeper water uh fish anywhere from
• 56:28
  Speaker 1: ten ten to fourteen feet pretty much what we called
• 56:31
  Speaker 1: our creep, targeting old dead trees and shipped that are
• 56:34
  Speaker 1: down on the ball. They all the dead trees and stuff.
• 56:37
  Speaker 1: We're in the back of the lakes. They hadn't started
• 56:38
  Speaker 1: to what they call the boke yet, you know, they
• 56:41
  Speaker 1: getting ready to go on spawn. They were they were
• 56:42
  Speaker 1: coming up and starting to school and the tender twelve
• 56:46
  Speaker 1: foot water I think one day, the last day it
• 56:49
  Speaker 1: warmed up, we actually caught some in four or five
• 56:50
  Speaker 1: ft of water. But in the backside when the bode
• 56:54
  Speaker 1: is on, they put on a pair of chest waiters
• 56:58
  Speaker 1: like you go waterfowl hunt and with a take a
• 57:01
  Speaker 1: jake po out there and a stringer and just waite
• 57:03
  Speaker 1: around the slakes a lot of cypress stumps and trees
• 57:07
  Speaker 1: and stuff, and they will just wait around and catch
• 57:10
  Speaker 1: catch their limit. We had We had like two um
• 57:15
  Speaker 1: in the lake that I grew up on where I
• 57:17
  Speaker 1: did the crappy fishing I've ever done. We had two structures.
• 57:21
  Speaker 1: We had a stump kind of off our dock to
• 57:24
  Speaker 1: the right a few hundred yards away, and then we
• 57:28
  Speaker 1: had a some Christmas trees we wired together and sunk
• 57:32
  Speaker 1: down with some sment blocks, and those be the two
• 57:35
  Speaker 1: good places to catch crappy until the weeds came out.
• 57:38
  Speaker 1: Then the weeds and the spray would come up, and
• 57:40
  Speaker 1: then at the mill foil would just break the surface
• 57:42
  Speaker 1: of the water. We go out with live mentals and
• 57:45
  Speaker 1: just knocked the ship out of them, or in the
• 57:47
  Speaker 1: winter through the ice, go out at dusk and take
• 57:51
  Speaker 1: live mentals blow of You almost want to find a U.
• 57:56
  Speaker 1: So you have a live mental and a piece of
• 57:58
  Speaker 1: split shot two ft above the men know, and in
• 58:00
  Speaker 1: a weight that was effectively at equal librium, almost at equilibrium.
• 58:06
  Speaker 1: It's buoyancy with the weight of the shot, so that
• 58:11
  Speaker 1: if you blew on that bobber, it would go into
• 58:14
  Speaker 1: water and you'd set that thing up out and you know,
• 58:18
  Speaker 1: twelve thirtet of water several feet off the bottom and
• 58:22
  Speaker 1: they would take it. And you just watch that float go. Honestly,
• 58:25
  Speaker 1: if you picked it up too fast, you would not
• 58:27
  Speaker 1: hook him. You have to watch that float just go
• 58:29
  Speaker 1: out of sight and wait and wait and wait, and
• 58:32
  Speaker 1: then pick up. They'd be there. Guy used to love that. Man.
• 58:35
  Speaker 1: I haven't called a cropp in twenty years. That's too long.
• 58:40
  Speaker 1: Damn right man, you were mentioned an Oxford. Um, yeah,
• 58:44
  Speaker 1: I know you read a lot. Are you fire with
• 58:45
  Speaker 1: the right I met this guy and hung out them
• 58:48
  Speaker 1: a little bit, and he was a very avid like
• 58:49
  Speaker 1: he liked the hunt squirrels with dogs. That the novelist
• 58:53
  Speaker 1: Larry Brown not familiar with his. He passed away some
• 58:56
  Speaker 1: years ago, but he was a fight. It's a cool
• 58:58
  Speaker 1: story is Larry Brown was a was a fireman in
• 59:02
  Speaker 1: Oxford and there's a big literary community there. Um. And
• 59:07
  Speaker 1: then he he wanted to be a writer. And I
• 59:10
  Speaker 1: remember he wrote I think he said he wrote seven
• 59:12
  Speaker 1: novels before he sold one. His first novel was about
• 59:16
  Speaker 1: a man eating grizzly and Yellowston National Park and he said,
• 59:19
  Speaker 1: at the time I had never seen a grizzly and
• 59:20
  Speaker 1: I've never been yells though. But then later became you know,
• 59:26
  Speaker 1: he has many novels, and his novels has been like
• 59:28
  Speaker 1: made you know in the movies Father and Son, Big Bad,
• 59:31
  Speaker 1: Love on Fire, great writer. But he was a he
• 59:34
  Speaker 1: was a like fish calffish, like fish crop. He's like
• 59:37
  Speaker 1: to hunt squirrels. Many novelists, not many novelists hunt squirrels.
• 59:42
  Speaker 1: There's a thing I found to be true in my life.
• 59:45
  Speaker 1: Always like reading William Fauldener. And he had the war
• 59:50
  Speaker 1: horses and they would go down in the river bottom
• 59:54
  Speaker 1: saw hunted squirrels off horseback. Any stories in the in
• 59:58
  Speaker 1: the stories. And they was clan of old civil wars, generals,
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 1: colonels whatever, from the last of the days there and
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 1: they would get the clan together, load up the wagons
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 1: and horses and they would go to the river bottoms
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 1: and you hunted one afternoon. We didn't do any good,
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 1: but we want of the pause and hunted Ohire river bottoms.
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 1: There two live there and that that place I always
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 1: reminds me of what I think about William Faulkner deer
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 1: hunting and bare hunting with with horses and dogs, then
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 1: the river bottom. So he's he's my fault now. Not
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 1: until later on. I didn't read anything growing up. I
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 1: hated to read because they always made us read something
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 1: that we didn't want to read, like you know, Shakespeare
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 1: or something like that. So I was never never. My
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 1: parents didn't read a lot. My dad in later in
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 1: life he read just immensely there but just you know,
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 1: if it was reading, it was something for a grade.
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 1: And I was pretty much just say, blessed man. Maybe
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 1: I didn't hear anything about reading. I had to study
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 1: Shakespeare so much through college, through college and graduate school,
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 1: and like what what I eventually developed was if you
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 1: say you don't like Shakespeare people, there's this thing that
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 1: people be like, oh, you know, you're not You're not
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 1: like an intellectual fella. When I and when I'm older
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 1: in life, like when I'm beyond my productive years I'm
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 1: gonna write a book. You know, in Shakespeare, like when
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 1: someone's mad at someone they call him a nave. People
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 1: are saying nave. I'm gonna write a book called Knaves.
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 1: It's gonna be in defense of not loving the Bard,
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 1: and it's gonna be like a It's gonna be like
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 1: a literary audite. Uh defense of disliking Shakespeare. Then, one
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 1: of the main things I want to talk about is
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 1: that I feel that Shakespeare stole a lot of his
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 1: plot conventions from Three's Company, where like Shakespeare's comedies are
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 1: like where someone overhears a little snippet of conversation and
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 1: misconstrues what they're talking about. And I think, and I
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 1: feel like he got that from Jack Roper and Mr
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 1: Mr Furley. But uh so, how did you discover fault?
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 1: And You're like, I'm just curious, Like did you? Okay?
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 1: I when I was a kid, if I read like
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 1: we read Hemingway, we read Old Man in the Sea,
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 1: not because it was Hemmingway, in because it's important literature.
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 1: We are like our old man read it to us,
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 1: Remember all I mean, I can tell you right where
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 1: he read it to us, um camping one time. But
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 1: read it to us because it was a fishing story,
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 1: not that it was like this is Heavingway and everyone
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 1: should you know a great you know mind and literature
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 1: and all that Pulitzer prized. It was like, oh, there's
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 1: an old guy goes fishing. Let's hear what happens to him. Right,
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 1: So when you discovered Faulkner, was it like, oh, there's
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 1: a dude that writes about all kinds of old hunting
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 1: ship down south or were you like, oh, I'm gonna
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 1: brush up on the literary canon. It was just my accident.
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 1: I found a book I think it was in a
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 1: a discarday being at a bookstore or something, and just
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 1: kind of thumbed through it and said, hey, this looks
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 1: pretty good. And it was his book of hunting stories,
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 1: The Big Woods, I think is what it's called. And
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 1: did you or did you not know that it was
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 1: the cannon like that it was part of the American
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 1: literary canon, like it was part of like the literary
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 1: tradition of America. I can remember that they made us
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 1: read Faultner in high school or great school, but I
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 1: couldn't remember what book it was. It was not a
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 1: hunting book, you know, as I lay dying or something
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 1: of that s worth there. So had you read them
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 1: where the red fern girls? Oh? Yes, had you read
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 1: Light in the Forest? Not that one? You know that
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 1: one is no dude, that's a gutting book. Man, it's
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 1: a kid. I think it's Conrad Richter was the writer
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 1: Light in the Forest. It's a story of a boy
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 1: who gets captured by Indians in the Eastern settlements and
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 1: raised up by Indians. And then there's a tree he
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 1: struck by which they need to give all their captives back.
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 1: And so the boy gets separated and sent back to
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 1: the settlements and then escapes and gets back to the
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 1: Indians just when the Indians are fixing to go raid
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 1: the settlements. And his him being for young adults, him
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 1: being torn about, you know how where where he fits
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 1: into this? Where he fits into this. It's a solid book.
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 1: And then old Yeller, what else, Because when you look
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 1: at cartoons and ship Man, cartoons have just eviscerated hunters
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 1: through the history of cartoons, you know, like hunters are
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 1: always assholes. But when you look at the American literary canon,
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 1: it's just full of these amazing hunting stories. That's an
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 1: interesting way thinking, I don't know, it's a good idea.
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 1: I mean, like, like, why don't I like really, or
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 1: why don't I like, Yeah, it's a good idea. Children's
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 1: book children thought about that. I thought about that a
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 1: whole bunch because now that I read two children's books
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 1: every night, now three children's books every night that I'm home. Wait,
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 1: so other cartoons that you don't let your kids watch
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 1: because they have bats because I'm not like, I don't
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 1: like practice censorship, you know, I mean I try not to,
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 1: like like, I try to like our kids. You know,
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 1: our kids already know all about penises and vaginas and
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 1: sperm and stuff like that. They know about bad mopos um.
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 1: They know what animals are bad mo pos when animals
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 1: are not bad mopos And so I don't want I
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 1: don't want to be like, uh what I see him
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 1: watching something like they're into this show now they called
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 1: Trapper Wolves, or they watched it a couple of times.
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 1: It's like, you know, the hunters have Southern accents, real
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 1: assholes and after these wolves and uh, they're watching it
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 1: and I'm telling me, yeah, I said, you know, here's
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 1: the problem with this cartoon man, And I tell him,
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 1: but I don't like. But I don't say that we're
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 1: not watching this because this doesn't agree with my worldview,
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 1: you know, because I think like in some ways they're
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 1: smart enough, Like there's obviously something I wouldn't let them watch,
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 1: but I'm not gonna I'm not gonna like censor them
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 1: on that grounds. But so then do you explain? You
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 1: do explain then, like why this is? Yeah, my kids
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 1: are like very interested in hunting and fishing. Do they
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 1: watch the show? Yeah, they love the show. I can't
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 1: stand it. They watched on Netflix. It's like it's nothing worse,
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 1: you know, when you'rey're supposed to be like they can
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 1: only watch TV two days out of the week, like
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 1: in the morning, they can watch the TV. Their mins
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 1: real strict about TV and sugar. But in the great
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 1: traditions of moms, right but now and then they'll turn
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 1: it on and I don't like here and yeah, but
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 1: um no, they're like way ass pro hunt. So if
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 1: it was going to be that they weren't, then that
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 1: would maybe her tail it. But I just noticed in cartoons,
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 1: like the other day I was watching and I was
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 1: on a plane and some gal in front of you
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 1: a growing up to which was alarming was watching Beauty
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 1: and the Beast. Why is that alarming? It just doesn't
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 1: seem like a like a good use of an adult.
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 1: She's really into Disney. It's like nostalgic. Yeah, I don't know.
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 1: I didn't like it. I judged her. And the Hunter.
• 1:07:26
  Speaker 1: There's a dude there who's a hunter, who's a real
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 1: Aholes that's his name. It's not bad because he's a hunter, though,
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 1: he's bad because he's a misogynist. He's vain. He's like
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 1: very vain and a massogist. But they're like, well, how
• 1:07:41
  Speaker 1: can we make them extra assholen? Have you a hunter too?
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 1: But yeah, but then if you go look at the
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 1: like the really high minded art, you know, they're really
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 1: like high minded art. That the um fucking Mark Twain
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 1: hook A very finn and Tom Sawyer, great fisherman, you know,
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 1: Hunger games, great the people. Yeah, she hunts for deer,
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 1: all sorts of food. All right, so there's a good one.
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 1: I mean a lot brave, like the Disney Pixar film
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 1: Brave where the young girl she's also an archery hunter. Alright,
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 1: I'm wrong, I think so. Yeah, but you have like oh, yeah,
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 1: you have all these you know, there are some good
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 1: depictions of hunting, hunting for food. That's a good point.
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 1: That's a good point. Um, what's next, Kevin. Kevin hunts
• 1:08:45
  Speaker 1: and fish is more for a guy that doesn't get
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 1: paid to hunting fish. You're hunting fish more than anybody.
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 1: I know. That would ruin everything if I got paid.
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 1: But it's kind of amazing how many days out of
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 1: the year you're hunting fish. That's I'm very fortunate in
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 1: my life. You know. I grew up with My dad
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 1: was a state policeman, and there was always a gun,
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 1: you know, in a corner. Thompson most submachine gun in
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 1: the and it flows it. You know. We went to
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 1: the movie theater. He had a gun on his ankle.
• 1:09:13
  Speaker 1: It was just a tool, you know. And and like
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 1: I said, we went honting. When I was a smile.
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 1: We'd go out in target practice year round. Go to
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 1: my grandparents. They did way out in the country, my
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 1: mom's parents. It was a gravel abandoned gravel pit. Like
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 1: there used to be thousands all over the United States
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 1: and everybody would targe it. Every one of them was everybody.
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 1: We're up in Toklaska, and I'm like, hey, I want
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 1: to check my I want to send my rifle and
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 1: you know, and he's like, hey, if you just go
• 1:09:40
  Speaker 1: down a little you know, go down a mile out
• 1:09:42
  Speaker 1: of town and just watch on your right, you'll see
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 1: a little turn off. I mean, it was just wild
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 1: ass to last you go. I'm sure enough it's a
• 1:09:50
  Speaker 1: gravel quarry for shell casings and shot up TVs, but inescapable.
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 1: You know. I just grew up hunting in fishing and
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 1: my dad had bird dogs when I was a small kid,
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 1: and the birds were kind of starting to disappear and
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 1: quail quail, yes, And he got a squirrel dog and
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 1: we just I just started hunting with him, and not
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 1: as much as I do now, but then after I
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 1: got older and stuff, I just enjoyed it. And this
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 1: is the four deer in Turkey, before deer in Turkey, yes,
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 1: we like, you know, the first deer I ever killed
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 1: was in Florida. I mean, there wasn't that many deer
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 1: in Kentucky. We were just starting to get them back.
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 1: And what happened to the quail? Why are the quail gone? Habitat?
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 1: Habitat is a lot of it uh, past the sides
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 1: the apartment. I think there is something that came through.
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 1: I don't know if it was West Nile virus that
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 1: came through, and the nineties that came through. They were
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 1: gradually declining. But you know, quail takes certain habitat where
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 1: you have to have weed, seeds and briers. And with
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 1: the farming methods that were coming in in the seventies,
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 1: a lot of those, the little bitty small farms were disappearing.
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 1: And I know and in fact that they were some
• 1:11:09
  Speaker 1: of the Amish people live. There's no predators. They all
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 1: have chickens. They kill all the predators. Quail could come
• 1:11:15
  Speaker 1: back there if we had if we had a hate
• 1:11:19
  Speaker 1: a pool. Jean stock stock to bring back again. He
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 1: saw a quail on Amish farm. No. Never you commenting
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 1: about how how much game was on the Amish property,
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 1: because they have practiced. If they had different practices, dirtier rows,
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 1: left more stuff underground, big gass fence, rolls full of
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 1: briers and brush. And you said they're pretty hard on predators. Yes,
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 1: because like I said, they all have chicken. They killed
• 1:11:47
  Speaker 1: the predators that come in there. They have a small
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 1: farm areas. You know, fifteen probably fifty acres would be
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 1: a big giant farm for the Amish people over there.
• 1:11:56
  Speaker 1: So they have the small little beaty farms, lots of fence, rows, defenses,
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 1: and just you know, if they're gonna mole field, they've
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 1: got to either pay somebody or hook up the horse
• 1:12:06
  Speaker 1: to a mowing machine and mow it with with a
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 1: horse drawn piece of equipment. And so they just let
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 1: it grow up foula and there a lot of times,
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 1: and it replenished itself, so they don't break break crop
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 1: around up every year, you know, turn it over. They'll
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 1: let it go back to to mother nature. And lots
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 1: of weed seeds and briars grew up there. But I
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 1: think the quail we It's after ninety four and I
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 1: got on the internet a few years ago. I was
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 1: reading in with some guy in Texas, and that's when
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 1: he thought that he saw a big demise in them.
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 1: Something came through in the early nineties and just knocked
• 1:12:41
  Speaker 1: him in the head. But you know, it's it's this
• 1:12:45
  Speaker 1: unbelievable that you could go out and see turkeys just
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 1: about anywhere, and every word. If somebody told me, I'll
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 1: give you a thousand dollars if you take your bird
• 1:12:55
  Speaker 1: dogs and go out and and kill kill a bird,
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 1: and if you don't, you have to give me a
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 1: hundred dollars. I probably wouldn't. I would have to really
• 1:13:04
  Speaker 1: think hard about it before I take that challenge to
• 1:13:07
  Speaker 1: go out Quail lbl They used to be on you
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 1: in the early nineties where there were a few covees
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 1: still left up there. But now I know, supposedly down
• 1:13:17
  Speaker 1: in the Buffalo Piens there's some in there, but I
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 1: know of no other places that there's any any birds
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 1: up there there all, it's pretty much gone. Um seventy seven, Uh,
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 1: Mississippi River froze over. We had an influx of counties.
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 1: The counties were gone pretty much before that time, so
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 1: they came in in the seventies after the river froze over.
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 1: The first thing they wiped out was the groundhogs. Remember
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 1: you're talking about that, man. You just felt like the
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 1: groundhogs vanished. They did. I mean, we've got some left
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 1: around in the rock bluffs and are close to town,
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 1: but that used to be the Sunday afternoon sport for
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 1: a lot of people go out to the hayfield soybean fields,
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 1: and you know, shoot shoot groundhogs. Um, there was a Um,
• 1:14:02
  Speaker 1: that's what my dad he had a couple of armat rifles,
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 1: two horning into two, which is equivalent to fifty. Lots
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 1: of people around town had had groundhold guns and that's
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 1: what they would do. But like I said, the counties
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 1: came in with it. Just a matter of a few
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 1: years they wiped them out. Um, we've got the influx
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 1: of armadillos now, that's that's come in. Now Armadilla is
• 1:14:24
  Speaker 1: pretty prevalent LB and now the last two winners we've
• 1:14:27
  Speaker 1: had of not really knocked them in the head. Um,
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 1: they're not not as prevalent as what they were. But yes,
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 1: we have armadillos throughout the western state of of of Kentucky,
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 1: pretty pretty prevalent. One up into tenn Illinois now ship
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 1: and they first started coming in in the early nineties.
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 1: I squirrel hunted over in Donovan, Missouri, over the Mark
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 1: Twain National Forest. They started moving in over there at
• 1:14:51
  Speaker 1: that point in time. Of course, you know, they're kind
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 1: of an opportunities. They will eat quail eggs and metal arcs.
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 1: We how the meadow larks that we used to have,
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 1: they're they're not out there. You know a lot of
• 1:15:03
  Speaker 1: our bird numbers all over our our way down. You know,
• 1:15:08
  Speaker 1: historically raccoons which are now far north, but raccoons, opossums
• 1:15:17
  Speaker 1: and have alna um are are all things that in
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 1: Colombian times have have made mass northern migrations. I didn't
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 1: know that armadillos were in there as well. They did
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 1: this work with Burmese pythons that you know, everyone knows
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 1: they through the pet trade and other ship got went
• 1:15:38
  Speaker 1: feral in Florida and the Burmese pythons and areas in
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 1: the Everglades where the Burmese pythons have really taken off, um,
• 1:15:46
  Speaker 1: there is a virtual absence of a certain size class
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 1: of mammal where you know, raccoon sized mammals, smaller smaller
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 1: up to racoon sized mammals have like honestly vanished from
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 1: some areas from from predation by Burmese pythons. They were
• 1:16:07
  Speaker 1: doing work to find like what right now would be
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 1: the northern limit, the northern expansion limit of Burmese pythons.
• 1:16:16
  Speaker 1: And to test this they would build these enclosures, uh
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 1: and put the pythons in there and let them win her.
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 1: And I remember, uh, our friend Robert, Robert Abernathew saying
• 1:16:29
  Speaker 1: he I can't remember what he said the line was,
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 1: but it's it's people believe that the python would not
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 1: find suitable habits, suitable habitat even into South Carolina. That's
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 1: I've read read an article two on that count. But
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 1: they used to say the same ship about wild pigs.
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 1: So now you have like a handful of populations of
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 1: wild pigs in Michigan. But other people say that a
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 1: bad winner is gonna come that when we get some
• 1:16:58
  Speaker 1: bad winners back like we had in the seventies, the
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 1: little knacktor dix in the dirt and they'll be gone
• 1:17:02
  Speaker 1: to I don't know, because they're sure like the snow
• 1:17:05
  Speaker 1: in Siberia where they're from. Now, I don't see that
• 1:17:07
  Speaker 1: happen with the with the wild ferrel pigs. But do
• 1:17:11
  Speaker 1: you guys have many of those in Kentucky. We had
• 1:17:14
  Speaker 1: some of the densest population in the US. They brought
• 1:17:18
  Speaker 1: the gun shopping, as I like to call it, the
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 1: helicopter seven hundred dollars an hour, and the first year
• 1:17:24
  Speaker 1: they killed three hundred and fifty from the gun ship.
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 1: And then what happened, and then the next year they killed,
• 1:17:32
  Speaker 1: I think it was like less than two hundred than
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 1: the third year it was like less than fifty. So
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 1: they feel like they're getting on top of them, they
• 1:17:41
  Speaker 1: are knocking them down. They're still there. They hired a
• 1:17:43
  Speaker 1: professional trapper also, but uh, there was some swamp ground
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 1: u u um what is that bout to shay in
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 1: that area far west Kentucky hard to get into. Lots
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 1: of crop land around and um someone introduced them down
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 1: there and they took off. Someone put them in there
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 1: because you still gonna be fun to go hunting for us.
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 1: That's that's the story that I hear. You know, some
• 1:18:09
  Speaker 1: states are getting out ahead of that ship, and they're
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 1: banning wild pig hunting even in the absence of wild pigs,
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 1: because so many areas where wild pigs are coming in.
• 1:18:21
  Speaker 1: They're coming in because people are bringing them in to
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 1: establish a little pig hunt, even thinking that they're gonna
• 1:18:30
  Speaker 1: they're they like, they feel like they're going to contain
• 1:18:32
  Speaker 1: them in fences, and they bring them in to sell
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 1: hunts and and then not inevitably, but almost inevitably, some
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 1: of those pigs get away and start new populations. So
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 1: a way to get out ahead of that that some
• 1:18:45
  Speaker 1: states are doing. It's just like banning the hunting gift
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 1: pigs before pigs come, because that winds up being one
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 1: of the biggest causes of them spreading. There's people trucking
• 1:18:53
  Speaker 1: them around. I remember in Michigan, UM when they were
• 1:18:57
  Speaker 1: trying to ban bringing in wild pigs, and there was
• 1:19:01
  Speaker 1: a there was a spirited debate about what was a
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 1: wild pig, and they had had to define it in
• 1:19:07
  Speaker 1: various ways with colouration, hair growth, attributes, all this other
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 1: kind of ship Because like every pig in North of
• 1:19:15
  Speaker 1: every pig in North America, but every pig outside of Africa,
• 1:19:19
  Speaker 1: um is just one species suits scraffa. So the little
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 1: pink farm pig, right, it's all the same species. And
• 1:19:29
  Speaker 1: what's unusual with pigs, I don't know if you talk
• 1:19:31
  Speaker 1: about have we talked about this before. What's unusual with
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 1: pigs is that is that the actual old wild version
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 1: exists contemporaneously with the feral creation. So the cattle we
• 1:19:49
  Speaker 1: now have are um, what's that critter? The cattle came
• 1:19:54
  Speaker 1: from orc. Yeah, that's what they tried to grow in
• 1:19:59
  Speaker 1: German a U R O c H. The oracx is
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 1: what cattle were domesticated from but then the oracs is
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 1: now extinct, so we have the domestic offshoots of it,
• 1:20:14
  Speaker 1: but we don't have the actual thing. With turkeys. Turkeys
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 1: were captured in the New World, captured in the Western Hemisphere,
• 1:20:21
  Speaker 1: brought back to Europe, bred into the domestic turkey that
• 1:20:25
  Speaker 1: we now think of as a domestic white turkey, which
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 1: was then brought back to the US. So in existence
• 1:20:32
  Speaker 1: in the US, you have the ancestral bird, the wild turkey,
• 1:20:36
  Speaker 1: and the domestic spinoff the turkey. With wild pigs in
• 1:20:44
  Speaker 1: all over years. I mean this animals native in Italy,
• 1:20:48
  Speaker 1: certain Greek islands, um all over Asia, Eurasia, Russia, souscrafa,
• 1:20:54
  Speaker 1: and then it was also brought by like Polynesians into
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 1: Hawaii eleven years ago. Some bitch is everywhere, and it's
• 1:21:03
  Speaker 1: all still just one thing, one species. So people talk
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 1: about razorbacks or Russian wild boars. It's all sue scraffa.
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 1: So it's hard to want to stay want to say
• 1:21:13
  Speaker 1: no wild pigs, it's hard to say. It's hard to
• 1:21:15
  Speaker 1: make a farmer's pigs illegal because wild pigs often are
• 1:21:19
  Speaker 1: just escaped domestics, but they were trying to find a
• 1:21:23
  Speaker 1: way to rule out the bad home raise um the
• 1:21:26
  Speaker 1: like souped up Russian boars, and they got some resistance
• 1:21:32
  Speaker 1: from like, uh, they got some resistance from like artisan
• 1:21:39
  Speaker 1: butcher type guys who were trying to make who are
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 1: fancying themselves making these products with you know, Russian wild
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 1: pigs and doing like wild boar sausages and stuff. And
• 1:21:51
  Speaker 1: they got um blowback from certain very high calibers, a
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 1: certain very high caliber celebrity hunter who was selling wild
• 1:22:03
  Speaker 1: pig quote unquote hunts and wanted to be able to
• 1:22:07
  Speaker 1: continue to do so. And now Michigan has wild pigs
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 1: and the shipload of counties. I'm pretty sure they didn't
• 1:22:14
  Speaker 1: come in. They didn't come walking in from Florida. I'm
• 1:22:16
  Speaker 1: pretty sure. In the said of Kentucky, if a pig
• 1:22:20
  Speaker 1: escapes the farmer from the fence, he's considered a wild
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 1: pig then and can be shot when he gets outside. Um.
• 1:22:31
  Speaker 1: We have a young biologist that's in charge of the
• 1:22:36
  Speaker 1: wild pigs in the in the in the state, and
• 1:22:40
  Speaker 1: there's been some probably to three years ago. I asked
• 1:22:43
  Speaker 1: him to come to our sportsman club and give a
• 1:22:46
  Speaker 1: little speech about what I was going, and he went
• 1:22:49
  Speaker 1: into great detail until that inn um went into detail
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 1: about a lot of states, like you said, they're declaring
• 1:22:57
  Speaker 1: all wild hug hunt hug illegal, And he had said
• 1:23:02
  Speaker 1: they had trail cameras and pictures set up where they
• 1:23:04
  Speaker 1: were paying people to trap the wild hawks, and they
• 1:23:08
  Speaker 1: would actually see a group of hunters come in with
• 1:23:10
  Speaker 1: their dogs, catch dogs, and the armored vest, you know,
• 1:23:14
  Speaker 1: looking at their traps. So you know they were they
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 1: were hunting that area, and they knew that they were there,
• 1:23:20
  Speaker 1: or they had turned hawk loose or whatever. So, uh,
• 1:23:24
  Speaker 1: when I was younger, I always thought that would be
• 1:23:26
  Speaker 1: a great thing to have. But I made a couple
• 1:23:29
  Speaker 1: of trips to St. Vincent's Island down and at La
• 1:23:32
  Speaker 1: Chicola Musloon and hunting down there, and saw just how
• 1:23:35
  Speaker 1: destructive the wild hogs were on the island, eat up everything,
• 1:23:41
  Speaker 1: you know, everything on there, the sea, turtle, eggs, whatever,
• 1:23:44
  Speaker 1: and just realized that, hey, that's something that we do
• 1:23:47
  Speaker 1: not need. From time to time, they tried to introduce
• 1:23:51
  Speaker 1: them into to land between the lakes on the Tennessee
• 1:23:53
  Speaker 1: inn Um, they've got a trapper up there. Yeah, you know,
• 1:23:57
  Speaker 1: they've turned some loose up they had some sightings. I
• 1:24:00
  Speaker 1: didn't know where if you not state sanctioned, state sanction,
• 1:24:04
  Speaker 1: I'm just just just Joe trying to get them up there.
• 1:24:09
  Speaker 1: But that's something we do not need anywhere in the US.
• 1:24:12
  Speaker 1: When my when my parents, I can't remember, it was
• 1:24:14
  Speaker 1: right when they were married or when they were dating.
• 1:24:16
  Speaker 1: My dad took my mom wild pig hunting and my
• 1:24:18
  Speaker 1: mom got chased up a tree my pig. My dad
• 1:24:21
  Speaker 1: was out of arrows, and I think some about my
• 1:24:24
  Speaker 1: mom liked I don't know. I had to arrow them
• 1:24:26
  Speaker 1: through it to them. It's something I can't I should have.
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 1: It's one of those stories I should have gotten more
• 1:24:29
  Speaker 1: detail on. Um, you're honest, you've been awful quiet? What's uh? Nothing?
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 1: Just nothing stories, just your little brain. Nothing that was awful, anything,
• 1:24:44
  Speaker 1: the nothing you're thinking about. Yeah, the pigs. I'm surprised
• 1:24:49
  Speaker 1: how many people don't get like when we we post
• 1:24:52
  Speaker 1: something about pigs and everybody's like, I can't believe it.
• 1:24:55
  Speaker 1: There are problems, but you can't hold them. That makes
• 1:24:57
  Speaker 1: no sense. I just want to like clarify how that works. Right,
• 1:25:02
  Speaker 1: It's like they're they're banning it so that no one
• 1:25:06
  Speaker 1: has the incentive to like bring any in or have haunts,
• 1:25:11
  Speaker 1: or you can never outfit it or guide it legally. Um,
• 1:25:17
  Speaker 1: So I don't know how else can we clarify that,
• 1:25:19
  Speaker 1: because it just seems like we It's like it should
• 1:25:21
  Speaker 1: be pretty easy to understand why they're just saying, like,
• 1:25:24
  Speaker 1: like we we can't hunt them at all. A lot
• 1:25:26
  Speaker 1: of fisheries would be in better shape if someone had
• 1:25:29
  Speaker 1: a long time ago said it is illegal to fish
• 1:25:33
  Speaker 1: for northern pike, because that would have prevented a lot
• 1:25:36
  Speaker 1: of guys from saying like, man, I should bring a
• 1:25:39
  Speaker 1: couple of these pike home and let it go on
• 1:25:41
  Speaker 1: my lake. These are great, right, Yeah, It's just it's
• 1:25:45
  Speaker 1: just how pigs are gonna get around. And I like, see,
• 1:25:47
  Speaker 1: I'm on the side where I like to hunt wild pigs,
• 1:25:49
  Speaker 1: but I do understand the problem. I do not want to.
• 1:25:51
  Speaker 1: I don't I like to entertain thoughts of what it
• 1:25:54
  Speaker 1: would look like if we were to lose our bio
• 1:25:57
  Speaker 1: diversity and some of our ground nesty game birds and
• 1:26:01
  Speaker 1: ducks and all the other ship. You're gonna get severely
• 1:26:05
  Speaker 1: damaged and knocked back when pigs come in. But where
• 1:26:07
  Speaker 1: do stuff gets interesting is in Hawaii. You have like no,
• 1:26:12
  Speaker 1: no humans lived in Hawaii till around years ago, no
• 1:26:18
  Speaker 1: people had found it. The first people that found it
• 1:26:20
  Speaker 1: were seafaring Polynesians, and they brought with them dogs and
• 1:26:25
  Speaker 1: pigs and and many many species of edible plants and
• 1:26:29
  Speaker 1: got all this stuff established in Hawaii. So now we
• 1:26:31
  Speaker 1: have like Native Hawaiians right, and Native Wilans are are
• 1:26:34
  Speaker 1: an indigenous group, and they have sets of rights, and
• 1:26:37
  Speaker 1: it uh claims to the land, to some of the land,
• 1:26:40
  Speaker 1: and claims of certain practices. And it's insulting to them
• 1:26:45
  Speaker 1: when some are insulting to I shouldn't say to them
• 1:26:49
  Speaker 1: insulting to some of them, particularly a group of guys
• 1:26:53
  Speaker 1: that I had spent some time hunting with, to say
• 1:26:56
  Speaker 1: to them, you are a native people, but this pig
• 1:27:00
  Speaker 1: that you brought with you is del eterious, introduced non
• 1:27:04
  Speaker 1: native and should be eradicated because they think, well, if
• 1:27:08
  Speaker 1: we showed up here together at the same time, how
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 1: am I okay? But that pig is bad. So people
• 1:27:17
  Speaker 1: do hang onto it um. And I remember even like
• 1:27:21
  Speaker 1: a friend of mine in California who's a cattle rancher
• 1:27:23
  Speaker 1: and has pigs and has a lot of pigs, and
• 1:27:25
  Speaker 1: sometimes to a problem level, And I said him, if
• 1:27:28
  Speaker 1: you could wave a magic wand and have all the
• 1:27:30
  Speaker 1: pigs be gone, would you wave it? And he thought
• 1:27:32
  Speaker 1: about and said no. He kind of likes them, just
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 1: not so many of them. But with pigs, you don't
• 1:27:42
  Speaker 1: always get to choose in the disease they can't bring.
• 1:27:47
  Speaker 1: That's one of the big issues. He's rolling in poison ivy.
• 1:27:53
  Speaker 1: I don't know if that comes the car they carry
• 1:27:55
  Speaker 1: poison ivy. Yes, would you like to explain your your
• 1:27:58
  Speaker 1: T shirt? Yeah, golf artsy you think so? Yeah, we're
• 1:28:05
  Speaker 1: going for like a not artsy, but you know what
• 1:28:08
  Speaker 1: I'm saying, a scientific plate. Does that make sense when
• 1:28:11
  Speaker 1: I say that image in your head like an old
• 1:28:14
  Speaker 1: book that would have plates exactly. Steve is going to
• 1:28:17
  Speaker 1: post a picture on Instagram. So yeah, it's like a
• 1:28:20
  Speaker 1: doozy small game design cotton tail. Now on the cotton tail.
• 1:28:28
  Speaker 1: Why did you not spell out why did you not?
• 1:28:32
  Speaker 1: Why did you do the abbreviation for the second part
• 1:28:35
  Speaker 1: of his lenaean name? Well, you caught me off guard
• 1:28:39
  Speaker 1: because I should know what the SPP stands for. But
• 1:28:42
  Speaker 1: it's like the overarching species, right, because there's so many subspecies,
• 1:28:48
  Speaker 1: so it's all the silver allogies. Yeah, exactly. How do
• 1:28:50
  Speaker 1: you I don't know how to pronounce that word. You
• 1:28:51
  Speaker 1: not to pronounce that word. You did a pretty good job.
• 1:28:55
  Speaker 1: Then you got the old rough grouse with his Latin
• 1:28:57
  Speaker 1: Linnaean name yep, and then we did choose fox squirrel.
• 1:29:03
  Speaker 1: Did you know when you get into those Linnaean names
• 1:29:05
  Speaker 1: now Linnaean, Now Linnaeus was the fellow that came up
• 1:29:09
  Speaker 1: with species names, right, the Latin names. When you get
• 1:29:15
  Speaker 1: into subspecies and you want to having to do three words.
• 1:29:19
  Speaker 1: I just learned today that that's called trinomial nomenclature. Bison, bison, Athabaska.
• 1:29:28
  Speaker 1: It's the it's the naming of subspecies. So you have
• 1:29:31
  Speaker 1: genus as your first word, species, second words sub subspecies
• 1:29:38
  Speaker 1: when you start tagging on and then it becomes a
• 1:29:41
  Speaker 1: real unwieldy string, unwieldy string of words, and that's called
• 1:29:44
  Speaker 1: trinomial nomenclature. I read it today. This is Steve at
• 1:29:49
  Speaker 1: a party. I don't think I heard of that about
• 1:29:54
  Speaker 1: thirty seven years clature I learned the day reading Nash
• 1:30:00
  Speaker 1: of All Turkey Federations magazine that comes into mail. I
• 1:30:04
  Speaker 1: think I think I did um but I remember seeing
• 1:30:08
  Speaker 1: that and thinking that I was gonna remember it. Does
• 1:30:11
  Speaker 1: it go any further down? Can you go more than try?
• 1:30:14
  Speaker 1: I've never seen it. I want to seek that out. Yeah,
• 1:30:17
  Speaker 1: quadnomial nomencla. So it'd be like a branch off of
• 1:30:21
  Speaker 1: a subspecies. Huh um, all right, that'll make the lumpers
• 1:30:27
  Speaker 1: freak out. So uh any concluding thoughts, brittany, Um, I
• 1:30:36
  Speaker 1: don't know. Next time, I'm gonna range distance before I shoot.
• 1:30:41
  Speaker 1: You use a range finder? Yeah, oh, I got a
• 1:30:43
  Speaker 1: clearly thought about your Oh yeah, that's fine, that's fine. Um.
• 1:30:49
  Speaker 1: I would recommend you go shoot a big piece of
• 1:30:53
  Speaker 1: paper at forty seven yards because you might not have missed.
• 1:30:59
  Speaker 1: I mean, you might have missed the old fashioned way
• 1:31:00
  Speaker 1: by not having your gun point where you wanted it
• 1:31:02
  Speaker 1: to hit. May just be good education, you know, shoot
• 1:31:06
  Speaker 1: at fifty to shoot at as well, you know, because
• 1:31:09
  Speaker 1: I can tell you if you were aiming, if you
• 1:31:11
  Speaker 1: were legit aiming at his head, you damn sure hit
• 1:31:14
  Speaker 1: that bird with pellets, but not enough to get through
• 1:31:17
  Speaker 1: the feathers, would be my guess. No, it's just not
• 1:31:21
  Speaker 1: you don't don't. You didn't do anything to him. It's
• 1:31:24
  Speaker 1: hard because you didn't do anything to him. It's hard
• 1:31:27
  Speaker 1: to get through those feathers. It would have made a noise.
• 1:31:30
  Speaker 1: I've heard it. It's like not that noise, but it
• 1:31:33
  Speaker 1: makes a noise. Just hits them if you ever Probably not,
• 1:31:37
  Speaker 1: But sometimes someone takes a real hill Mary. At ducks.
• 1:31:40
  Speaker 1: You'll see a doctor a goose and someone take a
• 1:31:42
  Speaker 1: hail Mary abbot, and you'll hear it on the feathers
• 1:31:46
  Speaker 1: on the breast. You'll hear it. But that doctor doesn't
• 1:31:48
  Speaker 1: even change tune. It's just yeah. But it flew away.
• 1:31:53
  Speaker 1: I'm saying she didn't hurt it. I'm saying if she
• 1:31:56
  Speaker 1: was aiming true, aiming at its head, what would I
• 1:31:59
  Speaker 1: believe happened was that distance and gravity, Right, What I
• 1:32:04
  Speaker 1: believe happens is the pellets dropped will lost a lot
• 1:32:07
  Speaker 1: of velocity in the upper part of her pattern. Probably
• 1:32:11
  Speaker 1: still spattered the bird in the same way that I've
• 1:32:15
  Speaker 1: been shot by shotguns really far away, and you hear
• 1:32:19
  Speaker 1: it and feel it, but I can't even get through
• 1:32:21
  Speaker 1: your clothes. Yeah, I mean, have you anybody that's done
• 1:32:25
  Speaker 1: any amount of general general shotgun and dove hunt has
• 1:32:30
  Speaker 1: been hit by pellets? I mean I've been hitting the
• 1:32:33
  Speaker 1: bare skin with them and had it not even have
• 1:32:35
  Speaker 1: enough ohm to go in. I mean, just think, just imagine,
• 1:32:38
  Speaker 1: like all the things little kids play with and stuff like,
• 1:32:42
  Speaker 1: there's an enormous gray area between it going into you
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 1: and killing you and it like bouncing out. You know
• 1:32:52
  Speaker 1: what I means. Just hit stuff gets hit by pellets
• 1:32:53
  Speaker 1: all the time. We shad have baby gun fights and
• 1:32:56
  Speaker 1: only rarely, like I remember Tris Night and I are
• 1:33:00
  Speaker 1: one time. It's like we used to play that. You
• 1:33:02
  Speaker 1: can only pump once, but if there are people were
• 1:33:05
  Speaker 1: far away, you tend to pump a little more. And
• 1:33:08
  Speaker 1: I remember someone storm Tris Knight and iers a will
• 1:33:10
  Speaker 1: hide out. Tris Knight and I tried to storm someone's
• 1:33:14
  Speaker 1: hide out who was pumped up for a long range
• 1:33:17
  Speaker 1: shot and shot Tris Knight Nier and it hit him
• 1:33:21
  Speaker 1: in the ball of his finger and exited out his finger. Now, yeah,
• 1:33:27
  Speaker 1: I always think of when I think of BB gun shots,
• 1:33:29
  Speaker 1: I would think of the Royal Tenant bombs that we
• 1:33:31
  Speaker 1: were seeing that movie where he has like the who
• 1:33:38
  Speaker 1: the how are we just oh yeah, okay, speaking of that.
• 1:33:44
  Speaker 1: A friend of mine just tell me the story A
• 1:33:46
  Speaker 1: long time ago he as a joke, picked up a
• 1:33:49
  Speaker 1: baby gun and acted like he was gonna shoot himself
• 1:33:51
  Speaker 1: in the roof of the mouth of it when he
• 1:33:52
  Speaker 1: was in high school. Okay, in high school, but I
• 1:33:58
  Speaker 1: had a baby in it. Yeah, And he didn't even
• 1:34:01
  Speaker 1: know it. He thought that it was just air but
• 1:34:04
  Speaker 1: no baby. So he thought it was just pumped up
• 1:34:07
  Speaker 1: but no baby. And so he when it hit him
• 1:34:09
  Speaker 1: in the roof of the mouth, he could feel the air.
• 1:34:12
  Speaker 1: Years ago by and he's getting dental X rays and
• 1:34:17
  Speaker 1: this thing is still lodging the roof of his mouth
• 1:34:21
  Speaker 1: and just like, point blank, just did it pretty much.
• 1:34:24
  Speaker 1: I can't I'm not even to get into the y
• 1:34:27
  Speaker 1: in the world you do such a like whatever, right,
• 1:34:29
  Speaker 1: I'm just saying everybody everybody was doing, like go right
• 1:34:32
  Speaker 1: through his brain and lodging the roof of his mouth.
• 1:34:35
  Speaker 1: Pellet baby gun baby. And they were like, it's good
• 1:34:38
  Speaker 1: to know because if you were to go in and
• 1:34:39
  Speaker 1: get certain scans and ship with magnets, you know, pull
• 1:34:43
  Speaker 1: that thing right back out of there. Maybe I don't
• 1:34:46
  Speaker 1: know it's copper, but um so, yeah, next time you
• 1:34:50
  Speaker 1: shoot at a turkey, you're going to hit it. That's
• 1:34:51
  Speaker 1: your concluding thought, um, if we can go back to
• 1:34:56
  Speaker 1: squirrels for a second after that hunt, because yeah, um,
• 1:35:03
  Speaker 1: I'm about to go on my first hunts, I guess
• 1:35:06
  Speaker 1: in New York, in my home state. So I was
• 1:35:08
  Speaker 1: wondering if you personally had hunted in other places outside
• 1:35:12
  Speaker 1: of Kentucky, or like, what would be your advice for
• 1:35:15
  Speaker 1: hunting in new areas? Hunting squirrels in new areas? Advice
• 1:35:21
  Speaker 1: I've been Illinois, Tennessee, Oklahoma, Michigan, uh, South Dakota, try
• 1:35:32
  Speaker 1: to get one in Africa, but I couldn't get a permit.
• 1:35:36
  Speaker 1: You've got to have a permit to shoot anything over
• 1:35:39
  Speaker 1: there and everything. But new advice or like a new territory,
• 1:35:44
  Speaker 1: you know, advice for places that just go in there
• 1:35:48
  Speaker 1: scout you know you're still hunting, I guess is what
• 1:35:51
  Speaker 1: you're gonna be doing belief zone or what time of year?
• 1:35:55
  Speaker 1: I think hunting season New York starts in September. Yeah,
• 1:35:58
  Speaker 1: it goes through the end of February. That time of year.
• 1:36:00
  Speaker 1: You want to look for the food source their masks,
• 1:36:03
  Speaker 1: so acron trees, hackor nuts in New York. When when
• 1:36:09
  Speaker 1: I was hunting squirrels in New York, a little bit.
• 1:36:10
  Speaker 1: We're hunting on uh In Beach. Beach Beach is a
• 1:36:14
  Speaker 1: very excellent Yes, see what's in season and look for
• 1:36:18
  Speaker 1: the food source. Are you guys getting an egg land? No,
• 1:36:23
  Speaker 1: it's like game. Well, first of all, in New York,
• 1:36:25
  Speaker 1: we don't have a spot yet because we haven't met
• 1:36:28
  Speaker 1: I mean, we don't have anyone who knows a spot
• 1:36:30
  Speaker 1: or whatever. So we were just going to do our
• 1:36:31
  Speaker 1: own scouting and find a place. I I got a body,
• 1:36:35
  Speaker 1: I I got a couple of bodies. I need to
• 1:36:37
  Speaker 1: talk to you for you. Britty doesn't like this kind
• 1:36:40
  Speaker 1: of ship for eastern trees now, because now I will
• 1:36:47
  Speaker 1: get you a squirrel spot. Does they have to be
• 1:36:50
  Speaker 1: It does have to be what like what's your what's
• 1:36:53
  Speaker 1: your rank? Like how far are you willing to travel?
• 1:36:56
  Speaker 1: Willing to drive? So for squirrels. Yeah, listen, I'm gonna
• 1:37:01
  Speaker 1: get on the phone and I'm gonna pound it and
• 1:37:04
  Speaker 1: I'm going to get you spots. There are spots in
• 1:37:08
  Speaker 1: this phone waiting to be had. But now I'm publicly
• 1:37:11
  Speaker 1: I am now interest in going to eastern Montage. Honestly,
• 1:37:14
  Speaker 1: I can't do that for you because they just figure
• 1:37:16
  Speaker 1: that out. But I can get you spots, it won't
• 1:37:19
  Speaker 1: matter because no one's hunting the public land for squirrels.
• 1:37:21
  Speaker 1: But that's what's so like that if you don't mind,
• 1:37:24
  Speaker 1: if if you don't, if you don't mind, I would
• 1:37:26
  Speaker 1: get I would find you some I will find you
• 1:37:29
  Speaker 1: some private land farms where you can add into the mix.
• 1:37:33
  Speaker 1: And I think you also ought to explore public land
• 1:37:35
  Speaker 1: locations too, because then you kind of own them, you know,
• 1:37:38
  Speaker 1: because in New York they're like, I mean, you know,
• 1:37:42
  Speaker 1: they're like city rats or something, so no one's to
• 1:37:46
  Speaker 1: go in and hunt them hopefully. Yeah. I like your idea,
• 1:37:53
  Speaker 1: but but I could also supplement your I can supplement
• 1:37:57
  Speaker 1: your roster of locations with some private landlord tls. Michelle.
• 1:38:06
  Speaker 1: I want to hear more about war horses in future.
• 1:38:10
  Speaker 1: Do you like to ride horses? I want to see
• 1:38:13
  Speaker 1: it happen. Um see the horses. No, we used to.
• 1:38:18
  Speaker 1: We should do a gear breakdown of your war horse.
• 1:38:21
  Speaker 1: Oh man, a graphic exactly coiled up sawtooth briar over. So,
• 1:38:30
  Speaker 1: so your family stown horses, Yeah, we had to Shasta
• 1:38:33
  Speaker 1: and there were quarter horses. Yeah, and Grandpa used to
• 1:38:36
  Speaker 1: get out and hunt with with both of them for
• 1:38:39
  Speaker 1: big game though. Yeah, yeah, a little bit um out
• 1:38:42
  Speaker 1: in western Montana. And yeah I wrote them growing up.
• 1:38:45
  Speaker 1: It was a lot of fun. But now they're long gone.
• 1:38:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah they're gone. Still got photos. This is like so
• 1:38:50
  Speaker 1: long ago that they're no longer alive. Yeah, so I'd
• 1:38:55
  Speaker 1: like to see your setup. And if you had a horse,
• 1:38:57
  Speaker 1: then you'd go get a squirrel hound. Oh oh man,
• 1:39:04
  Speaker 1: because Yanni's really doing. Yanni's taking it upon himself to
• 1:39:08
  Speaker 1: identify um, unknown squirrel locales in and um the inter
• 1:39:14
  Speaker 1: Rocky Mountains. I got a hot tip. Just I'll tell
• 1:39:19
  Speaker 1: you something. Anyone out here who's been reading outdoor magazines
• 1:39:22
  Speaker 1: their whole life will know the name Jim Zumbo and uh.
• 1:39:29
  Speaker 1: And turns out we have on good authority that Jim
• 1:39:32
  Speaker 1: Zumbo is a very avid squirrel hunter. But he likes
• 1:39:36
  Speaker 1: as he likes to clarify that he's interested in fox squirrels. M.
• 1:39:40
  Speaker 1: You notice that he doesn't say squirrels. That was great.
• 1:39:45
  Speaker 1: I don't even know where that came from, because we're
• 1:39:46
  Speaker 1: saying by to Mr David Allen from the Rocky Mountain
• 1:39:50
  Speaker 1: ELK Foundation. He's like picked his brain about squirrels. But
• 1:39:54
  Speaker 1: he's like, I know, but He just like gonna start
• 1:39:57
  Speaker 1: the Rocky Montain squirrel founding. He said, live in Billings,
• 1:40:01
  Speaker 1: and Billings is kind of like the cut, like I
• 1:40:03
  Speaker 1: haven't yet to hear of a squirrel around Billings, Like
• 1:40:06
  Speaker 1: everything is still even there. And so I'm like, oh, hey,
• 1:40:10
  Speaker 1: you're big hunter. You've been around the woods a lot,
• 1:40:13
  Speaker 1: you know, living on the Yellowstone Corridor. What about squirrels?
• 1:40:16
  Speaker 1: And he kind of gave me that I don't give
• 1:40:18
  Speaker 1: a flip about squirrels, but you know who does, Mr
• 1:40:22
  Speaker 1: Jim Zombo, let me hook you up. And immediately I
• 1:40:25
  Speaker 1: had an email from Jim Zombo, which is awesome. I'll
• 1:40:27
  Speaker 1: tell you what you need to do. This would be
• 1:40:30
  Speaker 1: good for just America in general. Is So, the Yellowstone
• 1:40:35
  Speaker 1: River is the longest free flowing river in the United
• 1:40:38
  Speaker 1: States and the Yellowstone Heads. It finds its source in
• 1:40:44
  Speaker 1: three forks, Montana, where the Gallatin, Madison, and Jefferson come together.
• 1:40:51
  Speaker 1: Lewis and Clark named those three rivers. Madison was secretary
• 1:40:55
  Speaker 1: named him after the Secretary Treasury Secretary State can remember
• 1:40:59
  Speaker 1: who else, and and they form, yeah, who's Gallant? No,
• 1:41:04
  Speaker 1: I'm messing this up. I'm talking about the head of
• 1:41:05
  Speaker 1: the Missouri, so uh, here you are. But anyways, those
• 1:41:12
  Speaker 1: three rivers form the Missouri and three forks, and the
• 1:41:15
  Speaker 1: Missouri arch is way around and eventually, you know, eventually
• 1:41:21
  Speaker 1: starts swinging down and where it picks up, the Mississippi
• 1:41:24
  Speaker 1: becomes a Mississippi. But the Yellowstone kind of parallels it
• 1:41:29
  Speaker 1: and flows into it. And of course the Missouri, you know,
• 1:41:32
  Speaker 1: flows all the way across the whole damn country and
• 1:41:34
  Speaker 1: and absorbs the Mississippi, and the Mississippi steals its name
• 1:41:38
  Speaker 1: and it flows down, and so it creates this long corridor, right,
• 1:41:43
  Speaker 1: and squirrels and other species I was gonna get at
• 1:41:47
  Speaker 1: his like Walleyes. Walleye seem to kind of taper out
• 1:41:52
  Speaker 1: right around where squirrels taper out. As you ascend the
• 1:41:58
  Speaker 1: Missouri and ascend the Yellowstone, you get to a point
• 1:42:03
  Speaker 1: where it ceases to be warm water a warm water fishery,
• 1:42:10
  Speaker 1: and becomes a cold water fishery. Right, So if you
• 1:42:12
  Speaker 1: go to Livingstone on the Yellowstone, it's child country. You
• 1:42:18
  Speaker 1: go down to buildings, and you're in that middle ground.
• 1:42:21
  Speaker 1: You go east to buildings, you're down into small mouth
• 1:42:24
  Speaker 1: sager Walleye channel cats, and I feel like squirrels and
• 1:42:33
  Speaker 1: walleyes must need each other. No, I'm joking, but they
• 1:42:38
  Speaker 1: like they peter out in the same place. And what
• 1:42:41
  Speaker 1: Yani's trying to do is he's trying to explore the
• 1:42:45
  Speaker 1: western terminus of fox squirrels who have headed up the
• 1:42:50
  Speaker 1: Yellowstone following the the Riparian area there because they live
• 1:42:55
  Speaker 1: in the cottonwood and Russian olive groves. And so far
• 1:43:01
  Speaker 1: he's got them located in Forsyth, Montana. I have it
• 1:43:06
  Speaker 1: on good authority that they're not in Big Timber. But
• 1:43:10
  Speaker 1: here's where the picture gets weird. They're in Missoula, Montana.
• 1:43:15
  Speaker 1: That's that's that's like a weird jumping introduction. And they're
• 1:43:19
  Speaker 1: in there, in there in the residential areas there where
• 1:43:22
  Speaker 1: people have planted ornamentals, so ornamentals they're being maples and
• 1:43:27
  Speaker 1: oaks and ship like that, where there's like a lot
• 1:43:28
  Speaker 1: of non native trees. But in those places where they're
• 1:43:33
  Speaker 1: living on native trees like native habitat, he's trying to
• 1:43:37
  Speaker 1: find them closer to his home. Is this right, that's right?
• 1:43:42
  Speaker 1: I went I want in on that when he finds it.
• 1:43:46
  Speaker 1: Oh we never finished up about your so, yeah, did
• 1:43:49
  Speaker 1: we fished about your shirt. It's a new hunt each shirt, Kevin,
• 1:43:55
  Speaker 1: Do have a favorite subspecies of squirrel? Oh, that's not
• 1:43:59
  Speaker 1: how that works. Oh, it's not. Those are species. Oh
• 1:44:02
  Speaker 1: they're species. There's um, what the gray squirrel and then
• 1:44:09
  Speaker 1: the black squirrel. That's well, the black squirrels are great.
• 1:44:13
  Speaker 1: Gray squirrels, pine squirrels out there, red squirrels called red squirrels,
• 1:44:18
  Speaker 1: some people called pine squirrels. Uh. We have some up
• 1:44:22
  Speaker 1: in the mountains. Ferry doodles, timber doodles, timber, timber, timber
• 1:44:27
  Speaker 1: when it's a timber doodle is uh? Oh, what do
• 1:44:33
  Speaker 1: we call them? Timber or something? I can't think. We've
• 1:44:36
  Speaker 1: got some of them in the in the eastern part
• 1:44:39
  Speaker 1: of the state. Yes, yeah, the pine squirrel. But we've
• 1:44:41
  Speaker 1: got fox squirrels and gray squirrels in the western end.
• 1:44:45
  Speaker 1: But do you have a concluding thought. Concluding thought, Oh,
• 1:44:49
  Speaker 1: if you get a chance to take someone new out
• 1:44:51
  Speaker 1: hunting and fishing, and if you've got any institutional knowledge
• 1:44:55
  Speaker 1: in your head, don't let it go to you with
• 1:44:56
  Speaker 1: the grave. Share that with someone. Good words, Kevin, Yeah,
• 1:45:01
  Speaker 1: should no, no, after that, yeah, I reiterate, don't take
• 1:45:11
  Speaker 1: it to the grave, and thank you for listening,