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The Man Who Saved Pitt Football · Pittsburgh Sports Memories

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_03: Hello and welcome to another edition of the Pittsburgh Sports Memories podcast.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_03: My name is Steve Wirt, and with me today is my co-host.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_00: Hi, I'm Tim Hannon.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_03: Alright, and uh for today's episode, we're going to be um reviewing a uh pretty giant in uh Pittsburgh sports in general, and especially uh Pit Pit football in particular.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_03: That'd be uh Johnny Majors.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_03: Um he was coach of the Pitt team for two different um, I guess, stints.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_03: And so we'll go over both of those.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_03: Um definitely his first stint was more successful than his last one.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_03: It's uh Johnny Majors was definitely the coach who uh brought the Pitt Football program back from the brink of extinction.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_03: Um uh when uh Coach Majors came to Pitt.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Pitt had not had a winning season in many years and had not won a national championship actually since 1937.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_03: And um he brought them back.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_03: By the end of his first tenure as head coach, uh Pitt would both have a national championship and a Heisman Trophy winner, which was another thing for all their success prior to 1937.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, Pitt had never had a even a Heisman Trophy winner.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_03: So to uh start the uh we'll uh start with what what state was the uh Pitt program, Pitt football program in prior to him arriving in 1972?
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_03: Well, they had a coach called Carl D.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_03: Pasquale, and uh in the prior four seasons, the Pitt program had had 13 wins and 29 losses, and in his final season was he was 1-11.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_03: So um the athletic department director at the time was Kaz Malinsky, and um so they defired him and they were uh looking for a new coach.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_03: They were actually looking for a new coach that whole season of 72, so I guess they knew they were going to get rid of uh Coach Deepasqua at that point.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_03: Um also there was very little fan interest.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_03: Um Pitt has always kind of like gone that way.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_03: Like there's probably not a big, it's not like the Steelers or even the Penguins or Pirates.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_03: There isn't as big a fan base.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_03: Um and there was no financial support from the donors or the administration.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Pitt always, the administration always kind of um, which I guess they're supposed to, they they have they kind of emphasize academics, so there's always been kind of a tension at uh Pitt over the academics and the athletics.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um the program, like I said, had not won a national championship since 1937.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_03: Um prior to 1937, Pitt had actually won eight national championships, and uh, and they uh had not won any since night until you know 1976.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Pitt had never had a Heisman Trophy winner.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_03: And according to uh there's a quote from a Pitt historian, he's written several books, his name is Sam Sasulo Jr.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_03: uh about Johnny Majors.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_03: He said he saved Pitt football.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_03: Pitt football was at death's door in 1972.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_03: They were close to pulling the plug on the thing.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_03: If they didn't make a go of it, Pitt might be playing Millersville these days.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_03: So the administration was literally thinking of like stepping down to like Division I double A or like basically being like on the level of Duquesne and Robert Morris, which is pretty interesting to think of.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_00: Well Steve, do you think that was I mean, one of the things back then is that Pitt was not in a conference.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_00: They were an independent, right?
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, yeah.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_03: Well, it was a little different, like the college football landscape was a lot different than it is now where you almost have to be in a conference and there's like kind of like the power fives where there was a lot of independent schools.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_00: But they weren't they weren't like if today if you're I don't know, uh what's a bad team in a power five conference?
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: Like Indiana or Vanderbilt or like teams teams that are maybe they don't have a lot of s success, but they're still in a conference.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_00: Even teams that are in the Mountain West or something, they're still in a conference and that kind of carries them.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_00: But pit football, like is an independent.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_03: Well, they didn't yeah, they relied heavily on the gate and there wasn't as much TV money because back in you know 1960s, 70s there were four, well not four, I guess, were there even three networks back then?
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not even sure AB was ABC around C was around yesterday.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_03: Was was around yeah.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, there wasn't a lot of TV.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so you know, you maybe get one, two college football games a week.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_03: So the it was back to kind of that old fashioned, let's put you know, butts in the seats and your gate and your concessions or how you support your football program.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_03: That and normally go into a bowl game, but I don't know if the bowl games paid out the way they do now.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_03: Once again, the the TV just wasn't what it became when cable came in in the 80s, and that cable kind of changed everything.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_03: Um, just to go in a little um, so Pitt decided to uh they focused on Johnny Majors, who would um so a little background on Coach Majors.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_03: He was the oldest of five brothers.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_03: Uh he was from a football family in Tennessee.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_03: His father was a uh high school football coach.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_03: Um Johnny Majors attended the University of Tennessee where he was an all-American.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_03: And uh he actually finished second in the Heisman voting in 1956.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_03: And he um and a funny story about that was um he finished second to Paul Horning, who's the only player to win from a losing team, because I think Notre Dame did not have a winning record that year.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_03: And Horning, you know, said to Majors, you know, maybe you should have won it.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_03: And Majors said, Well, I always thought Jim Brown was better because that's really the guy who got job that year for the Heisman Trophy.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_03: And one of the many reasons that I don't put any stock in winning the Heisman Trophy, it doesn't mean anything.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_03: It's a pointless award.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_03: You literally didn't give it to Jim Brown because you were a bunch of racists back then.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_03: So I mean, it's just so subjective, and there's, you know, we can bash the Heisman Trophy.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, like I said, they just they don't seem that like it's all for quarterbacks mainly.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_03: It's tough.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_03: Like you could be a really good offensive lineman, and I'm sure there's been a lot that, you know, are how do you compare like an offensive lineman to like a quarterback or a running back?
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_03: It's you know, it's just it's tough to do.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_03: So that's kind of the problems I have with the Heisman Trophy, just to go off of them.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_03: So uh, like I said, Kaz Molinsky, the AD of Pitt, he appointed a secret three-man committee to recruit majors during the 72 season.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_03: It was uh Sam Sasulo Sr., who was the other guy who wrote the Pitt historian, I guess his father, and two boosters, Bob Miller and Bill Barrel.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not sure if Beryl was the guy from the car dealerships, but uh sounds like a familiar name.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_03: So uh all 72, they go and they recruited.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Johnny Majors had uh actually coached, been a coach at Iowa State, and he had been there for five years, and he took Iowa State to their first bowl games in their program history in 71 and 72.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_03: So he was kind of an up-and-coming coach.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_03: And um so their efforts were rewarded, and they get their coach.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_03: So they come in, he comes in in 73, and uh Sam Sasulo Jr., I not as flawed, the guy who the pit historian uh said about Johnny Majors also that it was like that scene in The Wizard of Oz where Dorothy goes from the black and white of like Kansas to the color of Munchkin land or Oz or whatever, and that's what like what happened at Pit Football.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_03: They literally there was such a philosophy change and stuff, and we'll go through some of the philosophy change, like you know, what probably inhibited the other coach that was before him, you know, from succeeding.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_03: So the first big thing was back then, I guess there was no limit on like how many scholarships you can get.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_03: Like now there is, you can only give out so many.
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_03: So like bigger programs would give out like 50 a year, I guess, back then.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_03: And I guess you can't do that now.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_03: But um, so Pitt had signed an agreement with the big four, it was called the Big Four back then.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_03: It was West Virginia, Penn State, Syracuse, and Pitt, and they all agreed that they would only give out 25 scholarships a year.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know why they put that self-imposed limit on and why they set it so low.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but once again, that goes back to like the university really didn't take like athletics seriously, and I don't think they saw a benefit like financially to them, and maybe at that point it hadn't gotten to the financial benefit it is now.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_03: But um, so like I said, most big time programs were the 50, and um the university uh they got them to remove that self-imposed limit.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_03: So Coach Majors in his first recruiting class brought in 70 freshmen.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_03: So he even blew the 50 out of the water.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_03: So uh in his first year, and that that class included uh Tony Dorset and uh a couple other guys who ended up um I think I'll have them have some notes on them, but they you know all started contributed later as the uh team developed.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's that's odd that they had the self-imposed limit.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_00: I think, like you said, maybe it was just uh a way to save money because it's it's expensive to to give somebody a free ride at your university.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_00: But but now you more than make up for that with you know what they do for the football team.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_00: But back then maybe they didn't.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_00: Uh it's also interesting that there was no limit.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_00: It's almost like the pre-salary cap era of some of the major sports where like, okay, now whoever whoever the have and have nots are are just gonna dominate the landscape.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it's kind of it's just a weird one of those things.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_03: Like, I guess, you know, they they very much consider themselves amateur athletics, and there's you know, there really isn't any more than anything amateur about college football.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_03: It's really semi-professional.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_03: And um, you know, how long before they start paying the players, quite honestly.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_03: And um what was funny was the NCAA probably caught on, and probably people like our friends at Penn State probably got mad.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_03: And uh in 1974, the NCAA actually uh brought in a rule called the 9530 rule, which was you could only a school could only give out 30 scholarships a year in 95 in total.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_03: So you couldn't do what Johnny Majors did back then and just go and give like 70 people.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_03: Plus, like Pittsburgh was a different place, like there were the steel mills hadn't gone away yet.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_03: So that was still the 70s, so I there was a lot more population here.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_03: So and the football talent was deeper and you know, richer and whatnot.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_03: So he got that in just under the wire.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_00: Like, imagine if they would have hired him in 74 instead of 73, and then he wouldn't have been able to get on.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and I think they gave him a couple years to get down to that.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_03: Like you had to so that it took him a couple years to actually get down to that role.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_03: Um, another big thing that happened, um, and this is still in the offseason, was uh the previous coaching staff, I guess Coach Deepasqua said that Dorsett was too small to play running back.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_03: I guess I don't know if they wanted him to switch positions or just whatever.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_03: So the new coaching staff at Pitt was already kind of behind the eight ball because you know they were, you know, they they weren't even looking at Pitt at that point.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_03: So Jackie Sherrill, who's like a big time assistant under uh uh Coach Majors, um, he was assigned to recruit Dorset.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_03: And uh Cheryl said he he spent so much time at Alequippo High School that uh some people thought he was a substitute teacher there.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_03: So so I mean Jackie Sherrill ended up being a really great recruiter and uh eventually a head football coach.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_00: That's just amazing to me that some like Tony Dorset, you know, we'll talk a lot more about him later, but you know, probably the greatest player in the history of pitch football, and coaches thought he's he shouldn't be playing running back.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_00: Like, and and and and like man, you just wonder what what happens if the other coach was still there, you know?
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: Like it it's just amazing to me that you can two people can see the same guy and think completely different things about him.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_03: Well it kind of goes into like assessing talent, and you know, sometimes you think, you know, oh this guy maybe should play a different position.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it's just not that you don't think he's talented, maybe you think he's better at a different position.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know what other position, maybe they want to play defensive back or something, I don't know.
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_03: But um he wanted to play running back, and I think uh Tony Dorsett and uh Jackie Sherrill were probably joining me and probably right about that.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_03: Um more about Jackie Sherrill.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_03: Um during their they ran a they ran a really tough train, like they went in this training camp in the summer, and we'll talk more about that, up in Pitt Johnstown, I guess.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_03: And uh Jackie Sherrill was kind of the designated bad cop, and Coach Majors was more of the good cop, so they kind of did that, like good cop bad coped him.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_03: Although I mean I've read some stories where Johnny Majors could be pretty tough in his own right, too.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_03: Um they ran a really tough camp.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_03: It's like compare, they they compared it to um, I guess I don't know if you ever saw like a there's a book called The Junction Boys about Bear Bryant's camp at Texas AM where he just like ran those people in the grid, just was trying to make people quit.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_03: And uh Coach Majors like really ran a tough camp and they they went up five-minute roll had one player said they went up with like five buses and maybe came back with like two or something.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_03: Like so they they the every day people would just quit.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_03: Um and uh Johnny would say, those who stay will play.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_03: That was kind of his his mantra during that camp.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_03: Uh the Pitt Athletic Department Department came up with a cool slogan for the uh new season was uh this is gonna be a major change in pit football.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_03: So I see what they did there.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, clever, clever, yes.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_03: 1970s marketing, gotta love it.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_03: But um, so uh we go into the uh 1973 season and Pitt plays at Georgia again.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_03: And this is the first game of the season, and they got a uh 7-7 tie, which was surprising because Georgia, I don't I'm not sure if they were ranked at the time, but Georgia was a pretty good team.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_03: Um a lot of Panther players were playing their first college game, so we had a lot of young players, long players on the team.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and he coach major stated it was one of the best efforts he had seen by a team.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_03: And the Georgia fans were so mad.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_03: This was in Georgia that they booed the home team off the field at halftime.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_03: So this is back so long ago that two, you could still have ties.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_03: So a 7-7 tie, it's not uncommon.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but what's what's still true today is teams getting really angry when Pitt's giving them a game.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that has not game.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_03: Uh the next week, Pitt lost at home to Baylor, 20-14.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Baylor was not that good.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_03: They only won two games, so kind of maybe a letdown after the first week.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_03: But it's a young team, and you're probably gonna have some of these.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um the Pitt's first win of the season came the next week on the road against Northwestern in Evanston.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_03: Um, they beat a mediocre to bad Northwestern team, and Northwestern went four and seven that year.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_03: Um, another uh little fun fact about this this and this is 1973.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_03: So that was the last time Pitt played, and I guess the last time now Pitt beat Northwestern since the pinstripe bowl in 2016.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_03: So Pitt would not play Northwestern for a long time after that.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_03: Not not a common opponent for the Panthers there.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_00: And it was that memorable, memorable pinstripe bowl in 2016.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_03: James Connor got hurt, and yeah, yeah, and that's about all I remember of it.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_03: Peterman was Peterman was your quarterback, yeah.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_03: Um Pitt lost to uh 20 the next week, uh Pitt lost to Tulane, 24-6.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_03: Tulane was good that year.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_03: They finished 9-7.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_03: They beat LSU actually, which I guess Tulane played LSU regularly.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_03: I guess that makes sense because Tulane's in New Orleans, so that would be a rivalry game for them.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_03: Um so it wasn't a horrible loss.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_03: Tulane was ranked.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_03: They finished their season ranked 15th.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_03: Um, next, what happened is uh the next four games, Pit goes on a uh solid four-game winning streak, and that kind of solidifies their season as a successful one.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_03: So uh Pitt beats uh WVU in Morgantown 35-7.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_03: Um Tony Dorset had uh three touchdowns in that performance.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and uh Bobby Balden was the head coach at WVU that year.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I always forget that he was at WVU before Florida State.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, he was there for like the next four or five years.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_03: So he he saw, I guess they saw enough of Tony Dorsett and went to FSU.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_03: Actually, that's so funny.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_03: After one of the bowl games like WVU, actually, the the they ran him out of, kind of ran him out of town.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_00: So smart move on their part.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah, run a hall of fame coach out of town.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_03: There you go.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_03: It was uh brilliant.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_03: Um next up uh on the schedule was they defeated Boston College 28-14.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_03: Um they had uh two TDs, Dorset had two DT two touchdowns against Boston College, and uh Boston College that year was a respectable 7-4, seven wins, four losses, but they didn't get a bowl invitation.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_03: It was kind of a you know what what a concept seven and four team that's kind of mediocre, doesn't get to go to a bowl.
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_03: How times have changed.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_03: Um Pitt played Navy uh next the week after that, and they defeated Navy 22 to 17.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Dorset had 105 yards rushing.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_03: Navy was pretty not great.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_03: There was no Roger Staubach, obviously, it was the 70s.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_03: Staubach was long gone.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_03: Uh I think Navy Navy finished four and seven that year.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_03: So uh Pitt's kind of like developing a pattern.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_03: They're beating like the teams they should and losing the teams that are are that are better.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_00: Which for a young team is it's a good place to start, honestly.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's a good place to start.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_03: So they're building, and then the next was against uh Syracuse uh next game, and um they won 28 to 14.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_03: Dorsetta 211 rushing yards, but no touchdowns.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Syracuse was uh absolutely horrible that year.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_03: Uh they finished a year two and nine, which caused their legendary coach Ben Schwartzall.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_03: Schwartz Schwartzhall Walter, I can never pronounce his name.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_03: Ben, I'm gonna retire after the year, even though I like recruited two of the greatest running backs of Syracuse ever, which would have been Ernie Davis and Jim Brown.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_03: Ernie Davis died tragically.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Jim Brown didn't win the you know Heisman Trophy because you know the Heisman committee was a bunch of racists back in 1956.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_03: So, but uh two really good players for Jim Brown, and unfortunately Ben Schwartz and Walter uh rode off into the sunset after his uh two and nine season.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_03: Uh the Panthers, uh the next week they're they were ranked number 20th after their four-game winning streak.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_03: So now they're ranked.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_03: And they took on uh Notre Dame at Pitt Stadium, and Notre Dame was ranked fifth.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Dorset would rush for 209 yards, and uh that was Notre Dame had a top-ranked defense that year, so it was really good performance by him.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_03: And that was at the time it was the most yards given up to an opposing running back by Notre Dame.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_03: Uh what kind of killed Pitt there was this kind of maybe goes back to um a young team, and I think they still had some holes on offense.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_03: Um Pitt fumbled twice and they uh threw three interceptions, the quarterback, and they got stopped on the Notre Dame 7 on four downs.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_03: And for some reason, like they didn't give the ball Dorset on that sequence, so I'm not sure why you don't give the ball to your best player, but uh I don't know, it didn't fool Notre Dame apparently.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_03: Um even even um with the star uh running backs, uh Pitt lost uh 31-10.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Air Parsegion, who was the coach of uh Notre Dame, he was impressed by Dorset's performance.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_03: Uh he said, let me see, that uh he's a super football player, and I'm very impressed.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_03: And uh Dorsett's performance today was a tremendous accomplishment.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_03: And uh that's what Air Parsegan, who's a very successful coach at Notre Dame, and um Notre Dame actually was a very good team that year.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_03: They finished the season undefeated.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_03: Um, the Irish defeated the number one ranked Alabama over Bear Bryant in the Sugar Bowl to earn an AP number one in the national championship.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_03: So that was the top-ranked team in the country.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_03: Even though they did lose by like 21 points, they still gave them a pretty good game.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_03: And Dorset had a good game.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_03: It's just if they could have eliminated some of the turnovers, maybe they could have at least, you know, been closer, if not one.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_03: Uh pick gets back to its winning ways the week after they beat an army team that was 0 10.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Dorset's great.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_03: He's 161 rush yards and two D two TDs.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_03: You can see like Dorset's kind of the offense here.
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_03: When Dor when you shut Dorset down, you kind of shut down.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_03: Down.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_03: And at the end of the year, it's the big rivalry game, the game that makes Pitt fans see like Red more than West Virginia.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_03: And that would be Penn State.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_03: Unfortunately, Penn State would have Pitt's number for a couple of these early seasons here.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_03: This is one of those occasions Penn State won 35 to 13.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_03: Once again, Penn State was able to shut down Dorset.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_03: He only had 70-70, 77 yards and a touchdown.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_03: Penn State was pretty good that year.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_03: They went undefeated and they finished fifth in the AP poll.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_03: And that was, and this is the difference between like Pitt and Penn State here, especially back then, was Joe Paterno always scheduled a cream puff schedule.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah, that just that's just how Joe Paterno rolled.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_03: Well, you know, you wonder why you didn't win more national championships, play somebody once in a while.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_03: Don't just, you know, play your little cream puffs that you always play.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_03: And Penn State was an independent.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_03: They weren't in the Big Ten back there, back then, too.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_03: So they basically controlled all their games.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_03: So they they played only who they wanted to play.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_03: Um Penn State played uh Pitt was the highest ranked team that Penn State had played at that sea that part.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_03: Uh in the they ended up Penn State did go to the Orange Bowl.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_03: Pitt had played four teams that ended up being ranked by the end of the season.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_03: So you can see the difference in scheduling there.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Penn State played the Orange Bowl.
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_03: They defeated LSU, who was ranked 13th.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_03: So that was their second ranked team they'd beaten that year.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_03: Penn State running back John Capoletti uh rushed for 1,522 yards that season and 17 touchdowns.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_03: He also won the Heisman Trophy.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_03: Uh and another fun fact was uh Jerry Sandusky was a coach on this team and he would coach for Penn State until 1999.
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_03: During which time he did unspeakably horrible things over covered up by the university.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_00: But that's another story.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_03: But uh so uh yeah, a lot of stuff going on there with Penn State.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_03: It was a big rivalry.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_03: It still is if they would ever play each other, but uh but that's again this kind of goes back to the trend where you know, for the first couple seasons, like Pitt would beat the teams they should and lose.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_03: And this kind of reminds me of like Pat Narduzzi's first season where they did the exact same thing.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_03: Like anytime they played a team with like a competent quarterback, they lost.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_03: And I I get the feeling like this Pitt team in 1973, if you were able to shut down Tony Dorset, then Pitt's offense was kind of not that great.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_03: And their defense just hadn't matured enough yet.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_00: Well, it's amazing that he could have 200 plus yards in a game and they could get blown out.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_00: Because if if you know you would think the way to shut them down would be stop, you know, make them make them pass.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_00: Put put eight guys in the box, make them have to pass.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_00: But he was still like that's how good he was.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_00: He was still getting his yards, uh, but they were still losing.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_00: And and I'm sure you'll talk about it later, but in major second stit in Pittsburgh, he had a very similar player that would get a lot of yards, but they'd get blown out.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it in the like uh uh Pitt went to the Fiesta Bowl, they lost to a 10th ranked Arizona State in Sun Devil Stadium.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_03: Like, this is insanity.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_03: So it's like an Arizona State home game, okay?
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_03: So they just played Arizona State on the road for fun, and Arizona State was actually good that year.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Dorset did score an early touchdown, but uh Arizona State pulled away in the fourth quarter.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_03: It would the Arizona State won 28-7.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_03: Uh the nice thing was this was Pitt's first bowl appearance in 17 years.
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_03: So Pitt had been that irrelevant for that long, which is like scary to think about.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: And like you said, Steve, everybody needs to know that making a bowl game back then was not like it is today.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_03: Well, even though they're 6'5-1, you saw like Boston College was seven and five.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_03: I think Tony Dorsett was probably the big selling point that season.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_03: So everybody wanted to see who's this young up and coming freshman.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_00: Well, and there just weren't as many bowl games.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_00: Like now it's like there's a gazillion bowl games.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_00: Making a bowl game, you just have to be like 500-ish.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I think that and this is the what is this the Fiesta Bowl?
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think that was a New Year's Day bowl back then.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_03: I I'm not even sure that was played on New Year's Day.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_03: So I mean it it hasn't developed into what it quite became here.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_03: Um great first season for Johnny Majors.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_03: It was a big turnaround because just the season before they went, they had one win.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_03: And to go from one win to six wins and go to a bowl game was huge.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_03: And actually, like there's a lot of signs of like life on this team.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Tony Dorset actually finished with 1,586 yards and 12 touchdowns, which is actually more than the guy that won the Heisman Trophy.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_03: So there you go.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_03: You know, he didn't have as many touchdowns as that guy.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_03: Whatever.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_03: So Heisman Trophy again, whatever.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_03: It's meaningless.
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_03: It's like MVP awards.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_03: I don't really put much stock in them.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_03: If you vote on them, then what's the point?
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_03: A lot of flaws there.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_03: So uh Dorset's kind of the offense that first year, and people you kind of I think they surprised people.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_03: People hadn't figured out that, you know, like we said, like you gotta stop Dorset.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_03: So the second year is 1964, and uh, as we go through this year, you kind of see like I think teams kind of started to figure out like Pitt's offense, and that was like, you know, kind of the old, you know, like where like 2000, what was 2009 where it was LaShawn McCoy to the left, LaShawn McCoy to the right.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_03: This was kind of the same deal.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_03: It was like Tony Dorset to the left, Tony Dorset to the right, oh, we're gonna mix it up, sending them up the middle, you know.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_03: So it was more of the same in 74.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_03: Uh they they had a successful year that first year, and they kind of took a step back.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_03: And they did play three ranked teams that year.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_03: Uh they played USC at Pitt Stadium, and uh Pitt lost 16-7, which isn't that bad.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_03: USC was ranked 18th at the time.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Dorset only had 59 yards rushing and no TDs.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_03: Uh USC was very good.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_03: They finished 10-1-1 and ranked AP number two.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_03: Pat Hayden was their QB.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_03: Uh USC had an early loss to Arkansas and a tie to Cal that kind of cost them the national championship.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_03: And they did defeat third-ranked Ohio State in the Rose Bowl.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_03: Uh USC ended up being co-national championships with Oklahoma, with Oklahoma that year, co-national champions.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_03: So kind of cost them the outright shot at that.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_03: Uh next, boy, geez, they played such a tough schedule back then.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_03: USC and Notre Dame back.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_03: This is insanity.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, this is this is nuts.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_03: So they they they played Notre Dame, who's now ranked number five.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_03: So he played the 18th and the fifth-ranked team back to back.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_03: Pitt played them in South Bend and Pitt lost 10-14.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_03: It was a close game, close than the year before.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_03: But Dorset only had 61 yards rushing and no TDs.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_03: Notre Dame was the defending national champions.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_03: And uh they finished the year 10-2 and beat Alabama again and finished number four.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Notre Dame that year had a bad loss to Purdue.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_03: And they gave up a huge lead at the end of the year to rival USC.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_03: So I guess it goes back to the USC.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_03: That was a big game for USC, you know.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_03: And that cost uh cost uh Notre Dame a shot at the national championship.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_03: But like Pitt played like two like uh teams ended up being the top five, you know.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_03: It's kind of uh and they played him closer than the year before.
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Air Parsigean did retire after this season.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_03: So and he ne he never coached again after that.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_03: Except in the um they used to have this game called the Super Bowl versus the college all-stars, and that was in 76, and it's the last time so that was really like after that season, Air Parsegion never coached again.
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_00: I think he became an announcer after that, yeah.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_03: And another fun thing that happened was because Air Parsijan retired, it totally screwed over Rudy.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_03: So it's a good thing all those people can't at his name, but he never got into the game.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_03: So so uh poor poor Rudy, he got he got job there, but uh Pitt still hasn't beaten, you know, still kind of like losing to the you know good teams.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_03: Uh put Pitt ends up playing Penn State early in the season.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_03: They moved the game early, I guess.
• 30:21
  SPEAKER_03: But he once again, Dorset only has 65 yards rushing and one TD as Pitt loses in a blowout to Penn State 31 to 10 again.
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_03: Penn State was ranked number 10 and beat Baylor in the Cotton Bowl.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_03: Uh and they finished 10-2, so Penn State was also pretty good that year, too, and ranked seventh in post poll.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_03: Although they lost to uh unranked Navy in NC State, that was Penn State's two losses.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_03: Fun fact was NC State was uh coached by uh Lou Holtz.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe uh Lou Holtz's lisp distracted uh the Penn State team.
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_03: I I don't know, but uh Lou Holtz is a pretty good coach.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_03: So so you can kind of forgive that.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe uh Penn State played a little, although I mean Navy wasn't that good.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_03: Penn State's still playing their cream puff schedule.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_03: So Pitt uh did beat WVU, BCU, BC, and Syracuse.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_03: Uh BC was respectable that year.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_03: Dorset had like an unbelievable game against them.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_03: I guess they couldn't figure out how to stop him or just weren't able to.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_03: He had 191 yards rushing and three TDEs.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_03: So once again, you can see if Dorset rushes for like a lot of yards, Pitt wins.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_03: Dorset doesn't rush for many yards, Pitt doesn't win.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_03: Um, they had a head-scratching loss to North Carolina.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_03: Boy, that's been going on forever.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Pitt was actually got up to an 18th rank.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_03: They lost 29 to 45.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Dorset only had 59 yards rushing in a TD in that game.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Pitt ended up the year going 7-5.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_03: And um, like we said, just because you went 7-5, like nowadays you'd definitely be in like, you know, the car care bowl or you know, the whatever bowl that they did not get to go to a bowl game after that season.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_03: And like I said, teams were key on Dorset.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_03: They were definitely um stopped.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_03: His offensive stats went down from the year before to a thousand four yards, so from 1,500 to 1,004.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_03: And he had 11 touchdowns again, but um he he definitely had a big drop-off.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_03: I 500 yards is pretty significant, especially in the rushing.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_03: And back then, too, you it was harder to get yards.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_03: Um part of the problem was uh Bill Daniels was a quarterback.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_03: I mean he seems like a nice guy.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_03: He's actually became a financial.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, he became a finance, he had a successful career in finance and then became the head coach football coach at Ulsch.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_03: And uh he only threw nine touchdowns that year and eight interceptions, which was actually an improvement over the year before because he threw 17 the year before.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_03: But um, like they just needed more options on offense to keep the defense on us.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_03: So back to the recruiting trail, Coach Majors knows that he needs a quick B to balance out his offense.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_03: So we get into the 1975 season, and this is where like you really start to see.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_03: I think 1975 sets up 1976.
• 33:13
  SPEAKER_03: This is when, you know, this is one, two, this is his recruits are finally in their third year.
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_03: He's had two more years of getting really good recruits.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_03: So now the program is starting to really, you know, come into its own.
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_03: Uh he starts the year with two quarterbacks, Robert Haygood, who is part of the 73 uh big freshman class.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_03: And he was actually a kick returner his freshman year, and uh some guy named Matt Kavanaugh, who was who was a sophomore from Youngstown.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_03: So Kavanaugh came in the year later.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_03: Um Pitt starts off, they beat Georgia again.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_03: Like, what the heck?
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_03: Pitt does Pitt just always beat Georgia or like they always beat Georgia, they always lose to North Carolina.
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I don't know.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, weird.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_03: Weirdly enough.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_03: So and if Georgia was 11th ranked, and it was on the road.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_03: That was uh Georgia would finish the season nine and three, nineteenth in the ranking, so Georgia was pretty good.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Pitt did play the number one ranked and eventual national champ, Oklahoma.
• 34:12
  SPEAKER_03: Um, spoiler alert here, um, Pitt football is, if I remember correctly, as of now, and I'm pulling this stat off the top of my head, but I'm pretty sure it's right, 016-1 against number one ranked football teams when they played them.
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_03: So the O means they've never won.
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_03: So spoiler alert, Pitt lost to Oklahoma when they're ranked number one.
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_03: Pitt has never defeated a number one ranked team in football.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_03: They've tied Army in 1945.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_03: The last number one team I remember them playing was Miami in like 2002.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_03: That was the Yogi Roth game.
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah, yeah.
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_00: I if you play Pitt and you're highly ranked, you you want to be ranked number one.
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_00: You do not want to be ranked.
• 34:55
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, number two is the Jinx.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_03: Number number one, you're you're smooth sailing.
• 34:59
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, but if you're number two, you're you're just Clemson ranked number one when they played them in that they were ranked number two.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_03: In the coastal, in the coastal championship game?
• 35:07
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, in the championship game?
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know that.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_00: I guess when they beat them, they were ranked number two.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_03: If they were ranked number one, then yeah, it's oh seventeen and one.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_03: But add another loss to that one.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah, as of 220, I mean, I'm sure they'll play Clemson again this year.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe Clemson will be ranked number one.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_03: So we can make that 018 and one.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_03: Add another loss to that one.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_03: Uh uh 46 to 10.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_03: It was in Norman.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_03: So, I mean, it's number one tank team.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_03: It's in their house.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_03: Barry Switzer was the coach at Oklahoma at this time.
• 35:43
  SPEAKER_03: So uh fun, fun times for uh Barry Switzer.
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_03: How about them sooners, I guess you could have said after the game.
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Pitt goes on a four-game winning streak against the uh likes of Duke, William and Mary, and Mike Tomlins all in the water.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_03: Hey, they beat Temple, that's something, and Army.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_03: Um, all pretty bad.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_03: Teams and games Pitt should win.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_03: So once again, they're winning the games they should.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_03: They beat a mediocre Syracuse team 38-0.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_03: And they lost to a decent WVU team.
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_03: They played them top uh WV to 17-14.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_03: WVU was actually 9-3.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_03: And Tommy Balden, who actually would be the coach of Clemson and Tulane, if I remember correctly, was uh was on that team.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_03: He was a wide receiver because he was Bobby Balden's son.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, you know, I guess.
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_03: Oh no, they lost to WVU 17-14.
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_03: I'm sorry.
• 36:39
  SPEAKER_03: And uh so Couches uh did not see the morning in Morgantown.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so they're not a great loss.
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_03: Uh WVU was 9-3, like I said, they were a decent team.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_03: And uh here you go.
• 36:51
  SPEAKER_03: This is kind of like turning into your stereotypical like pit season, like you lose that game that you probably shouldn't win a game.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_03: That well, how did we win that game?
• 36:59
  SPEAKER_03: So here's your head scratching win of the year.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_03: We've had our head scratching loss.
• 37:03
  SPEAKER_03: Uh uh They beat Notre Dame 34-20.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_03: And um and this was at Pitt Stadium.
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, Notre Dame was ranked number one at the time, was uh coached by uh Rudy bad guy Dan Devine.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_03: Uh probably the biggest win of Majors uh era of the Majors' career of his career up to that point.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_03: Dorset had a huge game against um the Irish, uh 303 yards rushing and a touchdown.
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Notre Dame finished uh kind of a down year for Notre Dame by their standards, probably.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_03: 17th in a record of eight and three, and they lost to USC Pitt in Michigan State.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_03: So kind of a down year for Notre Dame, but still a good Notre Dame team.
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, poor Dan Devine gets a bad rap.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_00: He had the misfortune of coaching the Green Bay Packers after Vincent Bardi, and then of coaching Notre Dame after Ara Parsidian, and then 20 years later, like for no reason, he's made into like the bad guy that he really wasn't, too.
• 38:00
  SPEAKER_03: If you read, like he really did really like that was totally for the movie.
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_00: Those guys didn't all lay their jerseys on his desk, and he didn't he wasn't like opposed to playing Rudy.
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_00: They just they had to add some drama into the movie, and it just yeah, I felt bad for the guy.
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_03: I think this is I'm not sure if this is a season Rudy actually played, but this was Oh yeah, 75.
• 38:18
  SPEAKER_00: I can't.
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_03: I think it was, but this was at Pitt Stadium.
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_03: So this is at Pitt Stadium, so Rudy wouldn't have been there, yeah.
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_03: Well, and that's why they lost, because they didn't play Rudy.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_03: Well, my favorite Pitt like taunt t-shirt of all time was Rudy is offsides, but or was offsides, but that's always a classic to see around the stadium.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_03: Uh so Pitt follows up.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_03: Uh they had a disappointing loss to 10th ranked Penn State.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_03: They just can't, and it was a six to seven game.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Pitt scored first, but their kicker Carson Long missed the extra point.
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_03: And up to that point, Carson Long was the most accurate pick kicker in the history of the program.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_03: He missed two more field goals in the last 90 seconds of the game.
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_03: Dorset actually had a respectable 128 rushing yards, and that was his best performance against uh I have state pen, just like my uh channeling my inner dad.
• 39:13
  SPEAKER_03: He always calls him state pen uh to that point in his college career.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Chris Barr, and I don't know how this works.
• 39:22
  SPEAKER_03: Like, I I saw this, like this was in the uh New York Times article.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_03: Chris Barr was a professional soccer player at the time, and he was the Penn State kicker, and that was how Penn State won.
• 39:34
  SPEAKER_03: They kicked an extra point and Pitt didn't.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_03: So, how do you have a professional player on your team?
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_03: And that's not a violence.
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_03: Didn't they take away Jim Thorpe's medals for like taking money one time, you know, way back and they had to give them back to him?
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, that's a great question.
• 39:49
  SPEAKER_03: All you know is it just was in the New York Times, like, yeah, yeah, he's a professional soccer player.
• 39:54
  SPEAKER_03: Like, who cares?
• 39:54
  SPEAKER_03: It's like, wait a minute, isn't that against the rules?
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_00: All you know is that losing the Penn State at home because you missed the extra point and two field goals in the last 90 seconds is just such a classic, classic Pitt loss.
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_03: Well, you have your, like I said, your head scratching win, your head scratching loss, and your totally gut-wrenching loss.
• 40:12
  SPEAKER_03: So this is kind of your stereotypes.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_03: Things are going like just right on script for Pitt at this point.
• 40:17
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 40:18
  SPEAKER_03: We're having our season like we always do.
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_03: Um Penn State, they finished the year 9-3.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_03: They ranked 10th, they lost to Bear Bryant and Alabama 13 to 6 in the Sugar Bowl.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_03: Um, the addition of Matt Kavanaugh made a big difference.
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_03: And uh Haygood was a more of a running quarterback, so they were able to run the kind of that veer option, but then they could put Kavanaugh in and that gave him more of a passing threat.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Dorset's back, like you can tell, like, look at his yards this year.
• 40:48
  SPEAKER_03: It's fifth 1,1,554 yards and 12 touchdowns.
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_03: So his yardage is back up.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_03: So obviously, like having like more players on offense and you know more balance, or at least another threat with a running quarterback is helping Dorset out.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_03: And uh, like I said, the the recruits on this team are starting to set up like next year.
• 41:10
  SPEAKER_03: Like this team had 16 players on the roster that would play in the NFL, so that's pretty impressive.
• 41:17
  SPEAKER_00: That's pretty impressive.
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Pip plays in the Sun Bowl.
• 41:21
  SPEAKER_03: They uh they beat uh Kansas 33 to 19.
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_03: Kansas was 7-4.
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Kansas' big win was they had beaten national champ Oklahoma.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Kansas was ranked 19th.
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_03: Dorset had 142 yards and two touchdowns.
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_03: Elliott Walker, who was his backup, had 123 yards rushing.
• 41:44
  SPEAKER_03: And Robert Haygood, who had been kind of hurt the last half of the season, he started it's in the seventh game, he started and he had 101 yard rushing.
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so like you can see the balance of the three runners there.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_03: You know, they didn't Kavanaugh really didn't play much in that game.
• 42:02
  SPEAKER_03: They just were able to run the ball, and you know, Kansas was not able to adjust in time.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_03: Um, governor of the of PA at the time, Milton Schapp, got thrown in the shower after the game.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_03: And this was actually Pitts' first bowl win since the 1937 Rose Bowl win over Washington.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_03: And it was actually only their third bowl victory overall in the history of the program.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_00: Wait, I gotta go back to the governor of Pennsylvania getting thrown in the shower.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_00: What do you like?
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_00: You mean like the team shower, like he was in the top around?
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, like yeah, him and uh Wesley Potts far were both got thrown in the shower apparently after the game.
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_03: That was that was in an article from the New York Times, too.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_00: Like it was like were they mad or were they like celebrating?
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_03: No, they were celebrating.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it was like, hey, wait, let's throw the governor in the shower.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_03: Like let's throw Governor Wolf in the shower, yeah.
• 42:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's an odd way to celebrate a bull victory, but whatever.
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, I've heard of it happening before.
• 42:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean the 70s, you know, people just partied differently back then.
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I mean, I don't think they undressed that.
• 43:04
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, he was like obviously in his suit, you know, his little governor suit or whatever.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_03: Did the article say that?
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_03: Do you know that for sure?
• 43:11
  SPEAKER_03: The New York Times did not specify whether he was clothed or not.
• 43:17
  SPEAKER_03: Sorry, the Times didn't deal, it didn't detail that.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_03: We'll have to do some paper research to answer that one.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, sorry.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_03: But uh Pittens finished the season ranked 15th in the AP Wol, AP poll.
• 43:31
  SPEAKER_03: Uh the big win of the season was obviously beating Notre Dame.
• 43:35
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Robert Hagwood, who was their quarterback for the bull win, said we're going to be national champions next year.
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_03: That's our goal.
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_03: We're going to take it all.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_03: So kind of uh kind of prophetic there on Mr.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_03: Haegwood's part.
• 43:47
  SPEAKER_03: Wow.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_03: Turnamet esque.
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_03: So uh now we go into the magical season of 1976.
• 43:54
  SPEAKER_03: Probably is this the greatest season?
• 43:57
  SPEAKER_03: I guess they're undefeated.
• 43:58
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, it's the greatest season.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_03: the modern era of pit football is probably better than some of the teams that won national champions.
• 44:06
  SPEAKER_03: It's really hard to compare Yeah, because like in 1918 they won with like four wins because of the s the Spanish uh the influenza Spanish flu, whatever you want to call it.
• 44:16
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 44:17
  SPEAKER_03: So they had a flu epidemic back then too.
• 44:20
  SPEAKER_00: And then you like their championships in the 30s, some of those are even contested.
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like then you wonder like how many were there a lot of good college football players at the time of the Great Depression where people were going to college.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know, you didn't have you didn't have African American players, you know, at some places because of the racism.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I don't think Pitt Greer, Bobby Greer until 56.
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_03: I know he was one of, I think, one of the first at Pitt.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_00: So you were playing against only white players.
• 44:47
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, so it's really hard to compare errors and say that some team from the twenties or thirties is is better than certainly you're right.
• 44:55
  SPEAKER_00: From you know, World War II onward, the 76 is the is the greatest pit team, there's no doubt.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so uh just to set um this season up, Pitt had 18 of its 22 starters returning for the season.
• 45:08
  SPEAKER_03: Uh they were already ranked ninth to start the season, and they still had that two quarterback system of Robert Haygood and Matt Kavanaugh.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_03: And Dorset was back for his senior year.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_03: So all the elements are kind of in place.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_03: The defense is maturing.
• 45:22
  SPEAKER_03: They have a lot of, like I said, and this team still has all those players that would play in the NFL eventually.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_03: So it's a pretty good pit team.
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_03: Uh the game summaries of this I just uh I got from uh Joe Starkey from a trib article on August 27, 2006.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_03: Um it's a pretty good, uh, probably a little better summaries than I could have done, a little more detailed.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Pitt starts off on September 11th, uh 31 to 10.
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_03: They blow Notre Dame out uh by two touchdowns, three touchdowns.
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_03: Legend has it that the favored fighting Irish tried to slow him down, they let the grass grow high.
• 46:00
  SPEAKER_03: It worked.
• 46:01
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Dorset, they held Dorset to 122 yards, but uh the problem was he was still still managed to run for 1810.
• 46:11
  SPEAKER_00: So 122 yards than he had the previous year.
• 46:15
  SPEAKER_03: Down.
• 46:15
  SPEAKER_03: So but he still ran for 181.
• 46:17
  SPEAKER_03: So he didn't have like 300, sorry.
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_03: He only had 181.
• 46:21
  SPEAKER_03: Well he cut that number almost in half.
• 46:23
  SPEAKER_03: It kind of worked, yeah.
• 46:25
  SPEAKER_03: And it was in front of a national televised audience and uh 59,000 fans.
• 46:30
  SPEAKER_03: I guess this is back in no, this is in Notre Dame.
• 46:33
  SPEAKER_03: So Notre Dame um marched 86 yards for a touchdown on his opening drive, but Dorset sprinted 61 on his first carry.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_03: Dorset was always kind of like a home run hitter, like almost like a Willie Parker, you know, but you know, a little bigger.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_03: And um the ninth ring pickers, they got back in the game and they kind of cruised 31 to 10.
• 46:54
  SPEAKER_03: Um Pitt plays Georgia Tech on the 18th of September, uh 42 to 14.
• 47:01
  SPEAKER_03: Um, this is kind of like Pitt, they put this wasn't a smooth season.
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_03: Like this wasn't, you know, there were they had to overcome some injuries and some adversity here, and here's a big one was uh Haygood, part of their uh two-quarterback system.
• 47:14
  SPEAKER_03: Um he got a season-ending knee injury, and this is the second game of the year.
• 47:18
  SPEAKER_03: So uh junior backup Matt Kavanaugh stepped in and he connected with Gordon Jones on a 51-yard TD pass to blow the game open.
• 47:27
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Majors said that Hagood's loss is a tremendous blow to our team, and Major told told reporter, and that's an understatement.
• 47:37
  SPEAKER_03: So they got, you know, they they they still won.
• 47:39
  SPEAKER_03: They blew out Georgia Tech, but they uh definitely have some adversity now if they're one of their starting quarterbacks is hurt.
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and Haygood was the running quarterback.
• 47:48
  SPEAKER_00: So that was such a you know mix up kind of thing.
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_00: Like one guy could run, Kavanaugh was more the the traditional quarterback, the dropback quarterback, and and to be able to mix it up like that, you never knew it was coming now with only Kavanaugh in there.
• 48:01
  SPEAKER_00: You kind of could ease more easily predict Pitt's game plan.
• 48:06
  SPEAKER_03: Uh the next week, uh Pitt beats Temple 21 to 7.
• 48:10
  SPEAKER_03: Um it's 38,000 people come to see Pitt.
• 48:14
  SPEAKER_03: Uh they expect the third-ranked team to so Pitts ranked third to crush Temple.
• 48:19
  SPEAKER_03: Temple almost beat them.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_03: Several upsets, but uh Pitt had to overcome its only halftime deficit of the season.
• 48:27
  SPEAKER_03: They were down by a point at halftime.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_03: It did so uh the defense was good.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_03: Uh front line of Al Romano, Don Parish, Randy Holloway, Cecil Johnson, and Wilmakowski helped Pete Kitt in the game until Dorset broke loose and he had 112 yards.
• 48:45
  SPEAKER_03: So Pitt kind of survives a scare from Temple.
• 48:48
  SPEAKER_03: There's been a lot of games like that against Temple.
• 48:51
  SPEAKER_03: Pitt always seems they always seem to give Pitt a good game.
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_03: Uh next week, Pitt plays Duke.
• 48:57
  SPEAKER_03: They win 44 to 31.
• 48:59
  SPEAKER_03: Duke's defenders stacked up to stop Dorset only to see Kavanaugh torch them with the play action passes.
• 49:06
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Kavanaugh completed 14 of 17 for 339 yards and a school record five touchdowns.
• 49:12
  SPEAKER_03: That's uh pretty impressive.
• 49:14
  SPEAKER_03: But once again, now like you see, now when teams try and just key on Dorset, now they have somebody else that can beat you passing.
• 49:21
  SPEAKER_00: And that was probably the first time in Dorset's, you know, he's a senior at this point.
• 49:25
  SPEAKER_00: That's probably the first time in his time at Pitt where they had a quarterback that was capable of doing that.
• 49:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 49:32
  SPEAKER_00: Go ahead, you're gonna load up in the box, we'll we'll run play action and and burn you.
• 49:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 49:37
  SPEAKER_03: Um October 16th, uh Pitt plays Miami.
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_03: Uh they win 36-19.
• 49:43
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Majors changes his offense a little.
• 49:46
  SPEAKER_03: He adds the eye formation so that Pitt could run like the sprint draw and pitch it to him, which is basically like I always say they envision that like you're basically racing the linebacker to the sideline.
• 49:58
  SPEAKER_03: Like, and obviously Dorsetta is very fast.
• 50:00
  SPEAKER_03: So it's a nice adjustment.
• 50:02
  SPEAKER_03: You know, they're they're gonna take advantage of, you know, if the linebacker is slow, they're gonna, you know, make sure they run that with uh that.
• 50:10
  SPEAKER_03: Um uh Kavanaugh actually got hurt this game, so Tom Uick uh actually had to run the run the offense for a while.
• 50:21
  SPEAKER_03: Um Dorset kind of carried the team 227 yards on 35 carries, and he moved 152 yards with a breaking R.
• 50:30
  SPEAKER_03: G.
• 50:30
  SPEAKER_03: Griffin's NCAA record of the time, which was 5,177.
• 50:35
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Pitt blows in the out Navy 45 to nothing.
• 50:39
  SPEAKER_03: Uh national television audience watched Dorset become the leading rusher in NCAA history early in the fourth quarter.
• 50:46
  SPEAKER_03: Uh he only needed four yards, but at the Navy 32, he took a handoff and went raced to the end zone.
• 50:53
  SPEAKER_03: Uh I think the naval cadets actually set off the cannon that they normally do for a naval touchdown for him, so it was a nice thing for the you know Navy, Navy to do.
• 51:04
  SPEAKER_03: Uh he carried 27 times for 180 yards.
• 51:08
  SPEAKER_03: Um Pitt didn't seem to be unnerved by Pitt's dire quarterback sort of situation.
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_03: It don't make any difference to me who gets me the ball, the ball, who gets the ball to me.
• 51:19
  SPEAKER_03: And that uh was Tony Dorsett.
• 51:20
  SPEAKER_03: He said, whatever.
• 51:22
  SPEAKER_03: Hand me the ball.
• 51:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and that was a big deal.
• 51:24
  SPEAKER_00: And and he's still today, he's still second on the all-time rushing list.
• 51:29
  SPEAKER_00: Behind Ricky Williams, yeah.
• 51:30
  SPEAKER_00: No uh Rondane.
• 51:32
  SPEAKER_00: Oh Rondane, that's right, okay.
• 51:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 51:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um but yeah, he's still second on the all-time list, which is pretty impressive given how many guys have come after him.
• 51:41
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_03: So um 23-13 that is the next score against Syracuse.
• 51:47
  SPEAKER_03: Pitt defeats them.
• 51:49
  SPEAKER_03: Um a goal line stand preserved Pitt's closer than expected victory.
• 51:53
  SPEAKER_03: Um Bill Hurley for the Orangemen drove Pitt deep into territory, trailing 20-13 late in the fourth quarter.
• 52:02
  SPEAKER_03: On third and one from the 11, Pitt stopped fullback John Sessler, and he also got the call on fourth down.
• 52:09
  SPEAKER_03: Defensive tackle Don Parrish and Arnie Weatherton stopped him cold.
• 52:13
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Dorsett rushes for 241 yards.
• 52:16
  SPEAKER_03: So they have some quarterback problems here.
• 52:18
  SPEAKER_03: They got Kavanaugh and Hagu to hurt right now, but um they're playing, you know, teams that maybe just aren't good enough to stop Dorset.
• 52:26
  SPEAKER_03: And like you said, Dorset's in the senior year.
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_03: And I think they still had other running back too to complement them.
• 52:32
  SPEAKER_03: So definitely good.
• 52:34
  SPEAKER_03: A nice win there.
• 52:36
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, and Pitts defense is better.
• 52:37
  SPEAKER_03: You know, you hold a team to 13 points, you know.
• 52:40
  SPEAKER_03: That's that's a gonna be a good uh recipe for winning.
• 52:45
  SPEAKER_03: Uh November 6th, uh Pitt 37, Army 7.
• 52:49
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, we're number one was the chan at Pitt Stadium.
• 52:51
  SPEAKER_03: You don't hear that too often.
• 52:54
  SPEAKER_03: They uh smoked uh Army, Army uh Kavanaugh returned to the lineup.
• 52:59
  SPEAKER_03: Purdue upset top ranked Michigan 16 to 14, so that kind of opened the door for Pitt to become number one.
• 53:08
  SPEAKER_03: And then the uh Pitt after the game was ranked number one for the first time since 1937.
• 53:13
  SPEAKER_03: So a number one ranked Pitt team.
• 53:16
  SPEAKER_03: Who defunk it.
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_03: On November 13th, um Pitt played West Virginia.
• 53:22
  SPEAKER_03: There's a big rivalry game.
• 53:24
  SPEAKER_03: Uh 24 to 16 was the final score.
• 53:27
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Dorset's number 33 was retired at halftime, marking the first time a Pitt Jersey had been retired in the program's 86-year history.
• 53:34
  SPEAKER_03: He gained a 199 yards on a season high 38 carries.
• 53:39
  SPEAKER_03: Pitt held off a scrappy bunch of Mountaineers.
• 53:42
  SPEAKER_03: I remember this.
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I remember reading uh Dorset got ejected from the game.
• 53:46
  SPEAKER_03: I guess I don't know what he came up from a pile.
• 53:48
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe somebody did something to the pile and he he he threw a punch at somebody, so they kicked him out.
• 53:53
  SPEAKER_03: But not after he had 199 yards rushing and pit won.
• 53:57
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, West Virginia played him close, but Pitt was able to win.
• 54:01
  SPEAKER_03: And now the game of the year.
• 54:03
  SPEAKER_03: Penn State has their big opportunity to ruin Pitt's season and you know, keep Pitt in their place.
• 54:09
  SPEAKER_03: Pitt had not beaten Penn State.
• 54:11
  SPEAKER_03: They were 0- Coach Majors was 0-3 against them at this point, and none of the and only one of the games had really even been close.
• 54:18
  SPEAKER_03: So uh Pitt wins 24-7.
• 54:21
  SPEAKER_03: And uh, this is uh, of course, classic Pitt again.
• 54:24
  SPEAKER_03: Uh there were reports floating that Majors would uh leave for Tennessee after the season.
• 54:29
  SPEAKER_03: They played it, played this game at Three Rivers Stadium for some reason.
• 54:32
  SPEAKER_03: They had 50,000 people there, and uh Pitt beat the uh Penn State for the first time since 1965.
• 54:40
  SPEAKER_03: Um at halftime, Majors moved him to fullback.
• 54:44
  SPEAKER_03: Um that like you know totally crossed, you know, the Jerry Sandusky coordinated uh defense.
• 54:50
  SPEAKER_03: No, I don't think he was, I think he was just linebackers coach, but whatever.
• 54:52
  SPEAKER_03: It puzzled the coaching staff of Penn State, they couldn't figure it out.
• 54:56
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, he had 224 yards, and they they're saying that clinched the uh Heisman for um for uh uh Tony Dorsetto, obviously, because you know, if you had the most rushing yards all time, and that would be kind of I mean I can't I can't see how you could give it to anybody else.
• 55:15
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Bob Jerry on the pit defense, they suffocated Penn State, they picked two of their passes off.
• 55:21
  SPEAKER_03: Uh that guy had nine for the season, and now they had a date with Georgia in the sugar bowl.
• 55:28
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Dorset quote about the Penn State game.
• 55:30
  SPEAKER_03: One of my biggest assets as a runner was to see things and react in a timely manner.
• 55:35
  SPEAKER_03: Um I busted up there a few times, and I don't think Joe Paterno defense knew what hit him.
• 55:41
  SPEAKER_03: It took us four years to beat them, but we finally got Joe.
• 55:45
  SPEAKER_03: So uh Tony Dorsett gotta love him.
• 55:49
  SPEAKER_03: He's he's definitely a pit guy.
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_03: I remember even after the 2016 game when we beat Pitt, he was he was just, you know, chan he was there, and you know, it's nice to see that you know him get all excited.
• 56:01
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, he's always been a loyal pit guy for sure.
• 56:04
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so that that leads us to the bowl game, which was the Sugar Bowl.
• 56:08
  SPEAKER_03: And this was on January 1st, 1977.
• 56:11
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Pitt would um this game was over by halftime.
• 56:16
  SPEAKER_03: Uh they used four four half, first half interceptions to grab a 21 to nothing lead.
• 56:22
  SPEAKER_03: They had 76,000 fans at the Superdome, which the New York Times said would make all their stadiums in existence as obsolete as Rome's Coliseum.
• 56:33
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Pit 1, 27-3.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_03: Keith Jackson and Era Parsegion called the game.
• 56:38
  SPEAKER_03: There you go.
• 56:38
  SPEAKER_03: There's Era calling a game.
• 56:40
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Jim Lampley was working the sidelines.
• 56:42
  SPEAKER_03: Boy, wow.
• 56:44
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Dorset broke a 32-year-old Sugar Bowl record with 202 yards rushing.
• 56:49
  SPEAKER_03: Kavanaugh won the game's MVP.
• 56:52
  SPEAKER_03: He completed 10 of 18 passes for 192 yards.
• 56:56
  SPEAKER_03: Um, a good Johnny Majors quote I haven't all year long I haven't waved my finger in the air and I haven't worn a number one button, Majors said.
• 57:04
  SPEAKER_03: But after the game, I told the team it was number one, and they all agree that we are.
• 57:09
  SPEAKER_03: A few disagreed, include Bo Sham Beckler and John Robinson, uh coaches of Michigan and USC, respectively, because they're a bunch of sore losers.
• 57:18
  SPEAKER_03: Uh they're saying the winner of the Rose Bowl matchup should be the national champion.
• 57:24
  SPEAKER_03: Even though those teams had lost the game, what a shocker.
• 57:27
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I don't even know what their argument was.
• 57:30
  SPEAKER_03: Pitt Pitt had played a tough schedule.
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_03: Uh if it was undefeated, Pitt had won their bowl game against Georgia.
• 57:37
  SPEAKER_03: So I don't even know what their argument was.
• 57:39
  SPEAKER_03: The rest of the country knew better.
• 57:41
  SPEAKER_03: And the uh memorable covert of Sports Illustrated with Kavanaugh leaping in Dorset's arm saying Pitt is it.
• 57:47
  SPEAKER_03: And so the conclusion of a great, probably the greatest season in Pitt football history.
• 57:52
  SPEAKER_03: Uh national champs undefeated, uh, played a top schedule, beat Penn State and West Virginia and Syracuse.
• 58:00
  SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, I mean, can't they can't argue with that.
• 58:03
  SPEAKER_00: Dorset becomes the all-time rushing leader and wins the Heisman.
• 58:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, the the thing about the you know, the argument about the Rose Bowl champion should be the national champion, you know, you you you talked about the Heisman being subjective.
• 58:16
  SPEAKER_00: Well, unfortunately in college football, the national championship is also subjective.
• 58:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 58:21
  SPEAKER_00: And that's that's dumb.
• 58:23
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I'm not I could go on for an hour about how stupid it is that we have to.
• 58:26
  SPEAKER_03: Well, it's so easy like with everybody in conference.
• 58:29
  SPEAKER_03: Like back then I could see like it was probably tougher to do because there were so many independents.
• 58:35
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 58:35
  SPEAKER_03: Like back then there was like 15 or 20 independents.
• 58:38
  SPEAKER_03: So now you have a power five conference, you could have a tournament with a tournament.
• 58:42
  SPEAKER_03: You could easily, very easily.
• 58:43
  SPEAKER_03: You could have a power five plus one take one from the rest and have you know, and and if you know, if the second place SCC team doesn't like that, then move out of your conference if you think you're so great.
• 58:55
  SPEAKER_03: You know?
• 58:56
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 58:56
  SPEAKER_00: But they won't they won't.
• 58:57
  SPEAKER_00: And again, I I don't want to get us too off track, but that's that's the fact that the fact it's the only sport where there's an argument about who deserves to be the champion because in every other sport they play some sort of a playoff and championship game to determine that.
• 59:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 59:11
  SPEAKER_00: But college football has decided that they'd rather argue about it.
• 59:14
  SPEAKER_02: So it's every other division of college football plays a playoff.
• 59:18
  SPEAKER_02: That's that's the whole hypocrisy of it all.
• 59:20
  SPEAKER_00: But whatever.
• 59:21
  SPEAKER_00: At least Pitt, yeah, Pitt got it.
• 59:22
  SPEAKER_00: And that that sports illustrated cover that you mentioned, if you go in the Great Hall in Heinz Field, there's a whole like display setup.
• 59:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 59:28
  SPEAKER_00: They're gigantic version of that um sports illustrated cover in that display.
• 59:33
  SPEAKER_00: It's pretty cool.
• 59:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and uh, like you said, Dorsett won the Heisman Trophy.
• 59:37
  SPEAKER_03: He finished the season with 2,150 yards, actually his best rushing season of his career at Pitt.
• 59:43
  SPEAKER_03: Um disappointing, Majors did leave for uh Tennessee, and I think that was actually known before the game.
• 59:49
  SPEAKER_03: Talk about weird, but the team still went out and played hard and won.
• 59:53
  SPEAKER_03: And I think that just shows Coach Majors' respect.
• 59:56
  SPEAKER_03: And in the Coach Major's like, you know, credit, he said the only school he would leave Pitt for would be Tennessee, and that was because that's where his Alden Water was.
• 1:00:06
  SPEAKER_03: Um Jackie Sherrill returned to be head coach and would coach Pitt until what was it?
• 1:00:12
  SPEAKER_03: Until the early 80s.
• 1:00:14
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah, it was 82.
• 1:00:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and and they had some really good teams under Jackie Sherrow.
• 1:00:18
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, like normally you would see that as, you know, classic Pitt, win the national championship, and then your coach leaves because it's Pitt.
• 1:00:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:00:26
  SPEAKER_00: But Jackie Sherrill, I mean, I think I, you know, I don't know if this factored into the decision for majors.
• 1:00:31
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously, again, Tennessee was alma mater, but I think you also knew that Jackie Sherrill, the cave the program was going to be in capable hands with Jackie Sherrill, and it really was.
• 1:00:39
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you think about like pit basketball years later, whenever Ben Howen left, but the program was in capable hands with Jamie Dixon, and they had plenty of success under the under that guy.
• 1:00:49
  SPEAKER_00: You know, so I I think this was similar.
• 1:00:51
  SPEAKER_03: Now they didn't win a national championship under Jackie Sherrill, but Yeah, that was yeah, that's a big loss in was it 81, they lost to Penn State.
• 1:00:58
  SPEAKER_03: They didn't get up game.
• 1:00:59
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, the one loss.
• 1:01:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but they definitely came very, very close.
• 1:01:02
  SPEAKER_00: And you know very good teams.
• 1:01:04
  SPEAKER_00: And they recruited, you know, the Hugh Green, Dan Marino, like they recruited some of the best players in college football during that time, too.
• 1:01:10
  SPEAKER_00: So um majors leaving was definitely a huge blow, but um, like you said, it was his alma mater.
• 1:01:16
  SPEAKER_00: It was like a once in an opportunity, once in a lifetime opportunity, I think, for him.
• 1:01:20
  SPEAKER_03: Well, it was funny too.
• 1:01:22
  SPEAKER_03: Like I saw a quote by Joe Paterno who said, like, people would ask him why he wouldn't retire.
• 1:01:25
  SPEAKER_03: It said, What?
• 1:01:26
  SPEAKER_03: And leave this, leave, leave college football to the Jackie Sherrills of the world.
• 1:01:30
  SPEAKER_03: It's like, okay, okay, class, classy Joe.
• 1:01:33
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, well, yeah.
• 1:01:35
  SPEAKER_03: Well then they like tried to like they tried to cover, oh, they became friends afterwards and they dinner at his house, and like, yeah, whatever.
• 1:01:42
  SPEAKER_00: We we we one of these one of these times we need to do a Pit Penn State episode and just go off on Joe Peter.
• 1:01:50
  SPEAKER_00: I have lots of things to say about Joe Patern on that or not as long as we're gonna do it.
• 1:01:53
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I'm I'm gonna get to that at the end of this, too.
• 1:01:55
  SPEAKER_03: Like we still have that kind of coming.
• 1:01:57
  SPEAKER_03: Good.
• 1:01:57
  SPEAKER_03: So so Johnny Majors goes to Tennessee.
• 1:02:01
  SPEAKER_03: Um he had already taken the job before the Sugar Bowl game.
• 1:02:03
  SPEAKER_03: He was said it was the only job he would leave Pitt for.
• 1:02:06
  SPEAKER_03: And he ended up coaching at Tennessee for 15 years.
• 1:02:09
  SPEAKER_03: He won the SEC three times, but he never won a national championship.
• 1:02:13
  SPEAKER_03: In 92, he had a heart, heart surgery, and he didn't coach the first three games.
• 1:02:18
  SPEAKER_03: And this is like like kind of the bad guy in all this, is a guy named Phil Fulmore.
• 1:02:22
  SPEAKER_03: And by all accounts, Phil Fulmore is like the garbage can of college football.
• 1:02:28
  SPEAKER_03: If you want to know why, I this is totally unfoundable.
• 1:02:30
  SPEAKER_03: This is a Steve conspiracy theory.
• 1:02:33
  SPEAKER_03: I have no proof of this, but I'm totally convinced Michael Orr had to go through that ordeal with the NCAA because Phil Fulmore, who was known to do this, would call the NCAA to you know what you're doing down at Ole Miss?
• 1:02:44
  SPEAKER_03: They're having you know white families adapt kids.
• 1:02:47
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I could just see him on the phone because Michael Orr was from Memphis and that family was from Memphis, and they didn't go to Tennessee.
• 1:02:54
  SPEAKER_03: So Phil Fulmer's a jerk, and that's the bottom line.
• 1:02:58
  SPEAKER_03: There I said it.
• 1:03:00
  SPEAKER_03: He was the A D at Tennessee.
• 1:03:01
  SPEAKER_03: He was an assistant coach at at Tennessee.
• 1:03:05
  SPEAKER_03: He was not even the head coach, was it?
• 1:03:07
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 1:03:07
  SPEAKER_03: It was him in Cutcliffe was still was there actually.
• 1:03:11
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 1:03:11
  SPEAKER_03: The guy who had actually ended up like coaching Peyton Manning, not coaches Duke.
• 1:03:15
  SPEAKER_03: He's actually like Cutcliffe's actually a respectable guy.
• 1:03:18
  SPEAKER_03: Phil Former is not.
• 1:03:19
  SPEAKER_03: Trevor Burrus, Jr.
• 1:03:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and they forced him out.
• 1:03:21
  SPEAKER_00: And I wonder, you know, because it was only a few years later that Peyton Manning came to Tennessee.
• 1:03:24
  SPEAKER_00: And you wonder if Majors had still been coaching when Peyton Manning came in, what Tennessee would have done.
• 1:03:30
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I mean Well, did they they did win a national championship with T Martin?
• 1:03:35
  SPEAKER_03: With T Martin.
• 1:03:36
  SPEAKER_00: They always lost to Florida when they had Peyton Manning.
• 1:03:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:03:39
  unknown: Trevor Burrus, Jr.
• 1:03:40
  SPEAKER_03: And it's just a lot of like I read like there was a guy Ryan, because there's so many good stories about Johnny Majors.
• 1:03:46
  SPEAKER_03: Like, you know, you could read a lot of stuff, and there's a lot, even Bear Bryant, like, we'll do that.
• 1:03:50
  SPEAKER_03: Let's let's pull that off for the end.
• 1:03:53
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 1:03:53
  SPEAKER_03: So so Back to the Future, Pit cut Pitt rehires Johnny Majors 93.
• 1:03:58
  SPEAKER_03: He gets forced out for no good reason, and it's like a big ugly mess because Phil Former wants to be the head coach.
• 1:04:04
  SPEAKER_03: And there was a lot of division in the Tennessee program, so it really wasn't fair what they did to him.
• 1:04:10
  SPEAKER_03: So the promo line that was back to the future.
• 1:04:13
  SPEAKER_03: I remember that.
• 1:04:14
  SPEAKER_03: I think I used to have one of those little stadium cushions that set it on there.
• 1:04:17
  SPEAKER_03: I had a cup.
• 1:04:18
  SPEAKER_00: I had like one of the souvenir cups that had like that I got a Dai Coke or something, and they put it in a souvenir cup at Pitt Stadium.
• 1:04:25
  SPEAKER_00: So I had a Back to the Future Pit Cup, yeah.
• 1:04:28
  SPEAKER_03: No, the problem was I don't know.
• 1:04:29
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know, maybe Johnny was a little over the hill.
• 1:04:32
  SPEAKER_03: The the uh the population in Pittsburgh wasn't what it was in the 70s, the talent wasn't what it was.
• 1:04:38
  SPEAKER_03: So I I think like a lot of things conspired.
• 1:04:41
  SPEAKER_03: The administration just didn't really support him a lot.
• 1:04:45
  SPEAKER_03: So he was not able to recapture the success he had in his first in his head coach.
• 1:04:49
  SPEAKER_03: Um I'm not gonna go through like a season recap of these games because they're horrible.
• 1:04:53
  SPEAKER_03: I'll do I'll do kind of an overview and I were you and I were there for a lot of the things.
• 1:04:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so I'll do the ones that I personally remember just because it'll be funny and it'll be maybe Carthetic.
• 1:05:04
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I can tell you.
• 1:05:05
  SPEAKER_03: And all the Penn State fans are gonna watch me like be real disappointed, especially West Virginia.
• 1:05:08
  SPEAKER_03: There's one West Virginia game's really that that's probably one of the worst.
• 1:05:12
  SPEAKER_00: Well, when when he was when he came in, so so where Pitt was in the late 80s, early 90s, they were mediocrity.
• 1:05:19
  SPEAKER_03: They they would finish 6-6, 7-5 every yeah.
• 1:05:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, but they were not horrible.
• 1:05:23
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 1:05:24
  SPEAKER_00: And and so, because a lot of people forget.
• 1:05:27
  SPEAKER_00: So they hire him in 1993.
• 1:05:29
  SPEAKER_00: In night in November of 1991, they're the 12th ranked team in the country playing at Notre Dame.
• 1:05:35
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and and they lose to Notre Dame and they end up losing a bunch of games in the road at that 91 season.
• 1:05:41
  SPEAKER_00: But a season and a half before they hire him, they're the 12th ranked team in the country.
• 1:05:45
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of people would never remember that.
• 1:05:46
  SPEAKER_00: So they were they were like on the cusp of maybe starting to be good again.
• 1:05:50
  SPEAKER_00: They could, you know, they had they had like Alex Van Pelt was a really good quarterback in the late 80s, Ironhead Hayward was his great running back.
• 1:05:57
  SPEAKER_00: Like they had some good teams, like you said, very mediocre.
• 1:06:00
  SPEAKER_00: And so when Majors came in, it was like, oh, we're getting John, like the legendary Johnny Majors is coming back.
• 1:06:05
  SPEAKER_00: And I think there was a lot of excitement.
• 1:06:07
  SPEAKER_00: And I I had season tickets that first year in '93.
• 1:06:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um my dad got us season tickets, and my dad and my brother and I went to every home game that year, and we did not see them win one time that year.
• 1:06:18
  SPEAKER_00: Sounds about right.
• 1:06:19
  SPEAKER_00: It was really painful, and then it just got worse, believe it or not, after that, as you I'm sure you're about to go into.
• 1:06:25
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, he wasn't able to recra recapture the success.
• 1:06:28
  SPEAKER_03: So some players from that team, uh, we'll kind of briefly go over them and then maybe rehashed what like kind of do before and after.
• 1:06:35
  SPEAKER_03: Like Curtis Martin was a surprise success.
• 1:06:38
  SPEAKER_03: He Curtis Martin only played one year at Alderdice, if I remember correctly.
• 1:06:42
  SPEAKER_03: And he was like kind of a no-name because Curtis Martin had a rough upbringing, and he really I don't think Curtis Martin was like kind of one of those people like where what you're good at doesn't match what your passion is.
• 1:06:54
  SPEAKER_03: But you know, Curtis Martin went on to have a Hall of Fame career in the NFL.
• 1:06:58
  SPEAKER_00: And he was, I mean He kind of was the team.
• 1:07:02
  SPEAKER_00: That was the only reason I mentioned going to all those games in '93.
• 1:07:05
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, if you look at this like the scores from that year, it's it's like there were some games that they lost by literally like 60 points, like not even making that up.
• 1:07:14
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes the only reason to stay beyond halftime was to watch Curtis Martin rip off a 70-yard run.
• 1:07:21
  SPEAKER_00: Because that's what he was capable of.
• 1:07:23
  SPEAKER_00: He was so good.
• 1:07:24
  SPEAKER_00: And but he was literally the only good player they had.
• 1:07:27
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, he he was special.
• 1:07:29
  SPEAKER_03: Dietrich Gels he was a really fast receiver.
• 1:07:32
  SPEAKER_03: He actually finished his career at Pitt as the all-time leading receiver in yards and receptions.
• 1:07:37
  SPEAKER_03: And he still ranked sixth all-time in pit career receptions and third all-time in receiving yards.
• 1:07:42
  SPEAKER_03: So I mean, Dietrich Gels, you know, didn't do much.
• 1:07:46
  SPEAKER_03: I uh he he was kinda okay.
• 1:07:49
  SPEAKER_03: Uh John Ryan, I remember he was their quarterback.
• 1:07:52
  SPEAKER_03: He was not, he was a JUCO transfer, he wasn't that good.
• 1:07:55
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Anthony Dorsett, so he goes against uh Tony Dorsett's son, Anthony.
• 1:07:59
  SPEAKER_03: Um not not a great defensive back.
• 1:08:02
  SPEAKER_03: He got burned a lot.
• 1:08:03
  SPEAKER_03: My dad used to say, yeah, break out the Anthony Dorsett hot mitts, you know.
• 1:08:07
  SPEAKER_03: And uh he did work himself into a decent backup NFL player.
• 1:08:11
  SPEAKER_03: And we'll go more into what happened to some of these guys later.
• 1:08:15
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Billy Davis was a good uh receiver.
• 1:08:18
  SPEAKER_03: He torched All-American Aaron Beasley in the 94 WVU game, and Beasley was really good.
• 1:08:24
  SPEAKER_03: He ended up being like a 10-year pro.
• 1:08:26
  SPEAKER_03: And uh Davis ended up having a four-year NFL career, mainly as a special teams player.
• 1:08:30
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, Billy West, I remember Billy.
• 1:08:32
  SPEAKER_03: I totally I kind of forgot about him, and then this I brought me out because I remember how good he was, he was like pretty good.
• 1:08:37
  SPEAKER_03: He had 1,350 yards rushing his sophomore year in 94.
• 1:08:42
  SPEAKER_03: He was biggest co-over the player.
• 1:08:44
  SPEAKER_03: He got hurt in 96 and didn't play much his senior year, and I don't think he ever played in the pros.
• 1:08:48
  SPEAKER_03: I saw he's doing something in Florida, like an insulting job or something.
• 1:08:53
  SPEAKER_03: So in 93, Pitt only won nine three games, like you said.
• 1:08:57
  SPEAKER_03: I think I went to I remember going to the Boston College game that year.
• 1:09:00
  SPEAKER_03: Pitt lost 33 to nothing.
• 1:09:02
  SPEAKER_03: Uh a highlight was, like you said, an 80-yard Curtis Martin run that was called back on a hold.
• 1:09:07
  SPEAKER_03: Uh so that play didn't even happen for poor Curtis Martin.
• 1:09:11
  SPEAKER_03: And it rained the whole game.
• 1:09:13
  SPEAKER_03: We were soaked, we were drenched, it was Pitt Stadium.
• 1:09:15
  SPEAKER_03: The seats were like aluminum, so it was freezing cold.
• 1:09:19
  SPEAKER_03: It was that's probably one of the like just in general like nightmare things I remember happening.
• 1:09:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the the I like I said, I was at every home game that year, and it was in uh one game I remember was uh was against Ohio State.
• 1:09:34
  SPEAKER_00: We played Ohio State at Pitt Stadium, and literally half the stadium was red.
• 1:09:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I go into that, yeah.
• 1:09:40
  SPEAKER_00: I go into that later.
• 1:09:41
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, yeah, and and and they killed us.
• 1:09:44
  SPEAKER_00: The uh the the one thing I'll say about that team, they lost eight games.
• 1:09:48
  SPEAKER_00: They were three and eight.
• 1:09:49
  SPEAKER_00: Seven of those eight losses were against teams that were ranked.
• 1:09:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that once again, Pitts still played like even though they were in the biggest.
• 1:09:55
  SPEAKER_00: They were in the Big East, but the Big East the Big East was made up of these former independents, yeah, like Miami and Syracuse, like teams that were really good.
• 1:10:02
  SPEAKER_00: Boston College.
• 1:10:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:10:03
  SPEAKER_00: They're teams that were really good.
• 1:10:04
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know if Syracuse had McNat.
• 1:10:05
  SPEAKER_03: No, they had Marvin Graves back then.
• 1:10:07
  SPEAKER_03: Who was really good too?
• 1:10:08
  SPEAKER_03: Like Marvin Graves was a really good caller.
• 1:10:10
  SPEAKER_00: Syracuse was ranked, Miami, all those teams were ranked, and they played Notre Dame, and they played Louisville, who was ranked.
• 1:10:16
  SPEAKER_00: And they played Penn State, who was yeah, and and so so it was it was a really tough schedule.
• 1:10:21
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah and Ohio State.
• 1:10:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:10:22
  SPEAKER_00: And and Virginia Tech was the only loss that from a team that wasn't ranked, and and Virginia Tech was just starting to become a powerhouse team.
• 1:10:30
  SPEAKER_03: I think they had drunk maybe they drunken Miller back then.
• 1:10:32
  SPEAKER_03: It might have been before Drunken Miller.
• 1:10:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but that was that was when they were first starting to become a powerhouse team.
• 1:10:37
  SPEAKER_00: So so the you know, in fairness to Pitt, they yeah, they were miserable.
• 1:10:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, there were like huge blowouts at home.
• 1:10:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um but they also had a tough schedule.
• 1:10:47
  SPEAKER_03: Uh I I went to 94, I think it was the year I had season tickets, so I had the year after.
• 1:10:52
  SPEAKER_03: I remember the Texas game, Curtis Martin had 251 yards, and they lost like by two points.
• 1:10:58
  SPEAKER_03: I remember Johnny Majors on this was like back when they used to have the game on like 1250 on AM, and like he said that that the refs earned a Texas T their game, like for like a letter, because the refs were really biased that game.
• 1:11:10
  SPEAKER_03: Like that was pretty, pretty obvious.
• 1:11:12
  SPEAKER_03: Like if Johnny Majors is even saying it, it's it's yeah, probably pretty pretty rough.
• 1:11:17
  SPEAKER_03: But Curtis Martin, that was the only game he would play that year, and he was unbelievably good.
• 1:11:22
  SPEAKER_03: He played the Ohio game next week, and I remember he like got hit in the ankle, and like he never played.
• 1:11:26
  SPEAKER_03: Like I've seen stuff too where people said he was just holding out for the NFL, maybe, or I don't know.
• 1:11:31
  SPEAKER_03: His ankle was jacked up, and like you said, they didn't win many games anyway.
• 1:11:36
  SPEAKER_00: No, he he was not holding out for the NFL because he He ended up being a third round pick, and like he wasn't projected very high.
• 1:11:44
  SPEAKER_00: No, he was he was not.
• 1:11:46
  SPEAKER_00: He was not like a guaranteed first round pick, and like you said, he went in the third round.
• 1:11:50
  SPEAKER_00: He was Pitt's whole team.
• 1:11:51
  SPEAKER_00: That that Texas game was exciting because Texas was like the number 18 or 19th team in the country.
• 1:11:56
  SPEAKER_00: So that was almost a huge upset.
• 1:11:57
  SPEAKER_00: Then you then you beat the max school the next week, but but then when Curtis Martin got hurt, it's like, well, that's the end of that season.
• 1:12:04
  SPEAKER_00: You you knew there was no chance after that.
• 1:12:06
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, one of the the now this brings me to the WVU game that year.
• 1:12:10
  SPEAKER_00: Oh god.
• 1:12:10
  SPEAKER_03: And this is we could almost do a whole podcast on just this game because this is one of the more insane football games I've ever attended.
• 1:12:18
  SPEAKER_03: And it's like, like, remember Bill Simmons used to have like the levels of loss, like you know, the the gut punch.
• 1:12:24
  SPEAKER_03: This was like outside of the 2004 or like Sid Slid game.
• 1:12:29
  SPEAKER_03: I would even put this above like Sid Slid.
• 1:12:31
  SPEAKER_03: Not quite the 2000, like I didn't feel as dislike just absolutely despondent as I would did after this game.
• 1:12:38
  SPEAKER_03: Like this game was just a nightmare.
• 1:12:41
  SPEAKER_03: So Pitt was down their usual like 31 to 6 at one point, and that's because they went for two, and I think it was Sean Fitzgerald who was the quarterback.
• 1:12:50
  SPEAKER_03: He threw a two-point conversion that got returned the other way for a two-point conversion for West Virginia.
• 1:12:57
  SPEAKER_03: This game included two blocked field goals returned for touchdowns by both teams.
• 1:13:04
  SPEAKER_03: And so Pitt like take finally drives down the the lead.
• 1:13:09
  SPEAKER_03: Like I said, Billy Davis had an unbelievable game.
• 1:13:11
  SPEAKER_03: Billy West was really good in this game.
• 1:13:13
  SPEAKER_03: Like he they absolutely torched like Aaron Beasley every like for some reason that that quarterbacker pick was pretty decent at just throwing the ball deep.
• 1:13:22
  SPEAKER_03: I remember that like their offense just kind of evolved into the the Rex Grossman, we're going deep.
• 1:13:26
  SPEAKER_03: Like that, and if we're not running it with like Billy, Billy West.
• 1:13:31
  SPEAKER_03: So they come all the way back and they had they had 15 seconds left.
• 1:13:37
  SPEAKER_03: And I this is just like one of the most painful sports memories because there was a guy named Denores Mosley on that team, and he was the corner.
• 1:13:44
  SPEAKER_03: And I really I don't know why I liked the guy, I just liked him, okay.
• 1:13:48
  SPEAKER_03: My you know, whatever 17-year-old self thought this guy was a good player.
• 1:13:52
  SPEAKER_03: So I literally saw the future before it happened.
• 1:13:55
  SPEAKER_03: Like the West Virginia player, wide receiver runs down.
• 1:13:58
  SPEAKER_03: I'm watching him on that play because when you're at the game, you don't just have to watch the ball.
• 1:14:02
  SPEAKER_03: And so all of a sudden I see him and he like gets faked out on the sideline.
• 1:14:06
  SPEAKER_03: And the guy for West Virginia is literally wide open.
• 1:14:10
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm thinking, uh oh, well, maybe the quarterback doesn't see him.
• 1:14:14
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe he's gonna get sacked.
• 1:14:15
  SPEAKER_03: So I look up and the quarterback already has his arm like cocked and is throwing.
• 1:14:20
  SPEAKER_03: And as the ball's in the air, I'm thinking, drop it, drop it, drop it, drop.
• 1:14:24
  SPEAKER_03: Nope.
• 1:14:24
  SPEAKER_03: Catches it, waltz into the end zone.
• 1:14:27
  SPEAKER_03: Pitt loses after an amazing comeback and a two-point conversion, which they took the lead in the final minute of the game.
• 1:14:34
  SPEAKER_03: And that's just literally, I just ugh.
• 1:14:37
  SPEAKER_03: And that funny story about you is yeah, yeah, tell your side of that game too.
• 1:14:41
  SPEAKER_00: So my memory of that game will always be that I had I had to go to work.
• 1:14:46
  SPEAKER_00: I worked at a fast food restaurant, and um and I was driving, listening to the last few minutes of the game.
• 1:14:51
  SPEAKER_00: And it was on 12 15 on the crackling AM radio.
• 1:14:56
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm I'm in the parking lot of where I work, and I'm already late, like, which was bad.
• 1:15:01
  SPEAKER_00: But I was like, I gotta hear the end of this, I gotta hear the end of this.
• 1:15:03
  SPEAKER_00: And so I'm listening, I hear them score, I hear them score the two-point conversion.
• 1:15:07
  SPEAKER_00: And I even stuck around for the kickoff because I'm like, oh no, that maybe they'll return the kickoff all the way.
• 1:15:11
  SPEAKER_00: But they just they kicked off, they stuffed them at like the 18 yards.
• 1:15:14
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it wasn't, yeah.
• 1:15:15
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm just like, oh, they did it, they won.
• 1:15:16
  SPEAKER_00: You know, there's only 20 seconds left or whatever.
• 1:15:18
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, game's over.
• 1:15:20
  SPEAKER_00: And I went inside and I worked the eight-hour shift or whatever, and I came home, it was like 11 o'clock at night, because I I, you know, and I just and I saw um my brother at home, and I was like, Oh man, uh, what a game.
• 1:15:32
  SPEAKER_00: That's so awesome.
• 1:15:33
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's a bad season, but we beat WVU, how cool.
• 1:15:35
  SPEAKER_00: And he's like, What are you talking about?
• 1:15:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I said, We beat WVU, I heard the end of the game.
• 1:15:40
  SPEAKER_00: He's like, No, you didn't hear the end of the game.
• 1:15:42
  SPEAKER_00: And he told me what happened, and I'm like, No, no, I no, no, I heard it.
• 1:15:46
  SPEAKER_00: It was over.
• 1:15:47
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I I heard it, and it yeah.
• 1:15:50
  SPEAKER_03: So I Well, you lived in ignorant bliss for for eight hours there.
• 1:15:54
  SPEAKER_03: I did.
• 1:15:55
  SPEAKER_03: It's funny, that's before the internet, because now it would have come up on your phone or something.
• 1:15:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, that's all I had was the AM radio.
• 1:16:02
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, and I just I thought that whole night I was happy.
• 1:16:05
  SPEAKER_00: It was a nice night at work because I'm like, we beat WVU and I was so happy.
• 1:16:09
  SPEAKER_00: And then yeah, I found out many hours later that in fact they had lost.
• 1:16:13
  unknown: Trevor Burrus, Jr.
• 1:16:13
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, that that's one of the worst.
• 1:16:15
  SPEAKER_03: I I outside the Cincinnati pit game in 2009, that's probably the worst pit loss I've ever experienced.
• 1:16:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, it wasn't you you talked about like Sid Slade and all those games.
• 1:16:25
  SPEAKER_00: Like the the the there wasn't a ton on the line.
• 1:16:28
  SPEAKER_00: That was a bad pit season.
• 1:16:29
  SPEAKER_03: It was it just would have been like, well, we beat WVU.
• 1:16:32
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 1:16:32
  SPEAKER_00: But it was a rivalry game, it still meant something.
• 1:16:34
  SPEAKER_00: And in terms of if you take away like the like what they were playing for, you know, like no nobody's playing for a championship or a trip to the World Series or a trip to the Sugar Bowl or a trip to anything.
• 1:16:45
  SPEAKER_00: Like, if you take away all that and just the the like the loss itself inside a vacuum, it might be one of the worst.
• 1:16:52
  SPEAKER_03: Well, it's they were down 31 to 6 in the second quarter.
• 1:16:56
  SPEAKER_03: They returned a field goal like attempt for a touchdown.
• 1:17:00
  SPEAKER_03: That never happens in a never mind two of them.
• 1:17:03
  SPEAKER_03: I mean well, West Virginia did the other one, but you never like if you see like one in a season, you've seen like, you know, it's just the most unbelievable game.
• 1:17:12
  SPEAKER_00: I think at this point the shine's starting to wear off of the Back to the Future Johnny Majors return.
• 1:17:17
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and I forgot Ruby Brown, who was like ended up being a pro, he he punched uh one of the WVU players.
• 1:17:23
  SPEAKER_03: So Johnny Majors, like I remember him saying that in the interview, like, yeah, we had to sit him down for a series because like he got in a fight, which isn't, I mean, it's West Virginia and it's not that uncommon.
• 1:17:32
  SPEAKER_03: So move on to the 95 season.
• 1:17:34
  SPEAKER_03: I think like by 95, like I started to check out on pit football a little bit, like these last two years.
• 1:17:41
  SPEAKER_03: But I I I think I went to this, I think I did go to this 95 game, because that was at Pitt Stadium.
• 1:17:46
  SPEAKER_03: And that's the game where like there was like it was like in Columbus, there was a ton of pit uh ton of Ohio State fans, and they lost they only won two two games.
• 1:17:56
  SPEAKER_03: They went two and nine, and they lost 54 to 14.
• 1:18:00
  SPEAKER_03: And I mean that was that was bad.
• 1:18:02
  SPEAKER_03: Ohio State returned the opening kickoff for a touchdown, and it wasn't a game after that.
• 1:18:06
  SPEAKER_03: I just remember all the Ohio State, yeah, and it was like it was horrible.
• 1:18:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it was tough playing Ohio State back then because Well, they were good.
• 1:18:12
  SPEAKER_03: They were a good team.
• 1:18:13
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 1:18:13
  SPEAKER_00: But and they just Columbus isn't that far away from Pittsburgh, so they just all came and so 95 season, I that's the only thing I really remember.
• 1:18:22
  SPEAKER_03: I remember 96, um they they got blown out even worse, 75 to nothing.
• 1:18:28
  SPEAKER_03: That's that infamous game.
• 1:18:29
  SPEAKER_03: This probably is the game that ended Johnny Major's career, quite honestly.
• 1:18:33
  SPEAKER_03: They scored, like Ohio State scored on a punt return with only 10 players on the field.
• 1:18:38
  SPEAKER_03: Like that's and I remember Walt Harris said the year before he thought Pittwood at least tried and played.
• 1:18:44
  SPEAKER_03: He said that year they didn't even show up.
• 1:18:46
  SPEAKER_03: I remember Walt Harris who became the coach.
• 1:18:49
  SPEAKER_03: Um Curtis Martin was definitely the best player during his second coaching stint.
• 1:18:54
  SPEAKER_03: But the last two seasons, they really didn't have much talent.
• 1:18:57
  SPEAKER_03: I think the talent slacked off.
• 1:18:59
  SPEAKER_03: Like he just wasn't able to recruit anymore for whatever reason.
• 1:19:03
  SPEAKER_03: And um Anthony Dorset, uh Dietrich Gels was, you know, kind of still another, I think of who was the guy before Majors.
• 1:19:14
  SPEAKER_03: I I think he was the other guy's recruit, not even Majors recruit.
• 1:19:18
  SPEAKER_03: But Dorset, Matt Lytle, and Tummeldy only made it to the NFL.
• 1:19:22
  SPEAKER_03: Most of the I mean, Matt Light, I mean those three guys were what backups at best.
• 1:19:28
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, Tummeldee was always hurt.
• 1:19:30
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, Tummeldee was Big East co-player of the year in '91, but he was always injured.
• 1:19:36
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Dorset, if you remember in Super Bowl 34, he he because he was the backup to um, I forget the starter for Tennessee that year, but he ended up playing starting in the Super Bowl, and he got burnt by Isaac Bruce on that 80-yard touchdown at the end of the game.
• 1:19:52
  SPEAKER_03: Like you see, like number 33.
• 1:19:53
  SPEAKER_03: I think it was number 30.
• 1:19:55
  SPEAKER_03: I think he wore his dad's number, and he like was like standing there like as like Isaac Bruce like runs by.
• 1:20:00
  SPEAKER_03: It's like, hey, I remember that a lot.
• 1:20:02
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 1:20:03
  SPEAKER_03: Um, it was unfortunate.
• 1:20:05
  SPEAKER_03: He wasn't a bad player, he just wasn't as great as his dad.
• 1:20:08
  SPEAKER_03: Um Tom Lady was always hurt.
• 1:20:11
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Matt Lytle went on, and for some reason, Matt Lytle had like the most successful pro like he was like a four-year backup for Carolina.
• 1:20:19
  SPEAKER_03: And he he he was he was a backup on an NFL Europe team that won a World Bowl, and he was a backup for Carolina for years.
• 1:20:27
  SPEAKER_03: Um they they let go of Majors after the year.
• 1:20:30
  SPEAKER_03: They kind of like did what Penn Tennessee, if they wanted, should have done what Pitt did.
• 1:20:35
  SPEAKER_03: They just made him like an associate administrator.
• 1:20:37
  SPEAKER_03: So you just kind of gave him like a title position, like well, we'll you know, ask you to go out and like if we need donors and stuff to get money from people.
• 1:20:47
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Bino Cook called Johnny Majors the most beloved southerner of all time in Pennsylvania.
• 1:20:53
  SPEAKER_03: Beano Cook was a writer for Sports Illustrated or well ESPN, but Beano Cook's like well known.
• 1:21:00
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Bill Hoogroves on Playing for Majors.
• 1:21:03
  SPEAKER_03: Uh he he talked about uh he ran the tough camp, like the Junction Boys on Bear Bear Bryant's tenured.
• 1:21:11
  SPEAKER_03: Uh only a couple returned to those buses.
• 1:21:13
  SPEAKER_03: It was it was uh physically demanding.
• 1:21:18
  SPEAKER_03: Uh you had to be in super duper physical condition to play for him.
• 1:21:21
  SPEAKER_03: I'll never forget he took a sign with him.
• 1:21:23
  SPEAKER_03: It was behind his desk when he was uh the coach of Tennessee, and it said, if you can't run, you can't play.
• 1:21:30
  SPEAKER_03: Matt Kavanaugh uh said about him, he could be a tough character, but he was a master motivator.
• 1:21:36
  SPEAKER_03: But when the curtain was down, he could pull you aside and make you feel pretty good.
• 1:21:41
  SPEAKER_03: Um Dave Wanstadt said he understood the big picture and everything he did and made a pit a better football program, and that's what greater great football coach is all about.
• 1:21:51
  SPEAKER_03: Uh my dad, on an anecdotal note, my dad used to say during his first tenure, he used to actually do like film sessions at the student union after games in like the 70s.
• 1:22:02
  SPEAKER_03: Like and my dad learned a lot from football from coach majors.
• 1:22:05
  SPEAKER_03: He would just go up there and watch these film sessions that he would have he would answer all the students' questions and very yeah, I couldn't imagine like a coach doing that nowadays, even an assistant coach.
• 1:22:16
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, you couldn't even do it because like people would get up there and like just be total jerks.
• 1:22:21
  SPEAKER_03: I could see like people being like jerks to people, you know, like what you call, you know.
• 1:22:26
  SPEAKER_03: Anywho, uh uh coach major was a great guy.
• 1:22:32
  SPEAKER_03: He was a very coaching, very caring coach.
• 1:22:36
  SPEAKER_03: Uh he was like a teacher, he prepared his teams like he prepare someone for life.
• 1:22:40
  SPEAKER_03: That was by stressing the fundamentals and what many would think are the little things, and that was Billy West, who was uh running back later in Coach Major's tenure.
• 1:22:49
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Paul Rhodes, who ended up was a coach defensive coordinator of Pitt and ended up being head coach at Iowa State, so he kind of had ties to Coach Majors from two different places.
• 1:22:58
  SPEAKER_03: Uh he coach major had left him with like a bunch of three-ring binders, and uh he said it was neat.
• 1:23:05
  SPEAKER_03: He shared all of them with them.
• 1:23:06
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, he shared them with uh Paul Rhodes with his father, and they were able to go through and read them and you know gain some knowledge.
• 1:23:13
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, just you know, and Curtis Martin, you know, finished that up.
• 1:23:17
  SPEAKER_03: Uh I will Curtis Martin wrote a letter to Johnny Majors after his career was over.
• 1:23:22
  SPEAKER_03: I was a knucklehead in college.
• 1:23:23
  SPEAKER_03: What you said really helped me get my act together because I knew what you were saying about me was true.
• 1:23:28
  SPEAKER_03: Sometimes the things you want in life might not come packaged the way you would want them to, but they can package in the way you need them to.
• 1:23:36
  SPEAKER_03: And uh even Curtis Martin said later on, you know, that motivated him.
• 1:23:40
  SPEAKER_03: Like, I'm not gonna let Coach Majors be right.
• 1:23:42
  SPEAKER_03: I'm gonna be successful in the NFL because Johnny said to him, You can't even last uh a season in the college.
• 1:23:48
  SPEAKER_03: How are you gonna last you know a year in the NFL?
• 1:23:51
  SPEAKER_03: But so yeah, between him and um you know uh Bill Parcell's, you know, really probably Curtis Martin has a you know a lot to thank for those two coaches.
• 1:24:03
  SPEAKER_03: Uh another one was Tony Dorset, uh, who was more than just an integral part of my college football career.
• 1:24:10
  SPEAKER_03: He was a dear friend who continued his relationship with me far beyond my playing days.
• 1:24:14
  SPEAKER_03: He took a young high school kid and showed him how to be a leader and a man.
• 1:24:18
  SPEAKER_03: So a lot of great quotes, and you know, you don't hear that a lot about great coaches sometimes.
• 1:24:23
  SPEAKER_03: Um so it's we need to like what was his legacy?
• 1:24:27
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I see it's he he passed away this year.
• 1:24:30
  SPEAKER_03: Um he was a great relationship builder, although he knew his X's and O's too.
• 1:24:34
  SPEAKER_03: And um, and he I it's hard to find like anything negative about him really, like in the media or anything.
• 1:24:41
  SPEAKER_03: Um no scandals really.
• 1:24:44
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, they always said, oh, he recruited those 70 players, but that wasn't against the rules back then.
• 1:24:50
  SPEAKER_03: And like, oh, he might have paid for something for Tony Dorset.
• 1:24:54
  SPEAKER_03: Well, you know, compared to what went on with uh let's compare him to the to the other, you know, his contemporaries, and I put his contemporaries as Bear Bryant, Joe Paterno, and Era Parsija.
• 1:25:05
  SPEAKER_03: And Bear Bryant did win six national championships and had 232 wins, which I think was the most when he retired or was one of the highest.
• 1:25:15
  SPEAKER_03: Um there's also kind of that that segregation thing.
• 1:25:18
  SPEAKER_03: Like now he was in Alabama, and once again, that's another one.
• 1:25:21
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, he wanted to integrate the team.
• 1:25:23
  SPEAKER_03: Well, Bear Bryant didn't integrate the team until the 70s.
• 1:25:27
  SPEAKER_03: They did not have an African-American player on an Alabama team until the 70s.
• 1:25:31
  SPEAKER_03: That's they were like one of the last teams.
• 1:25:34
  SPEAKER_03: So whether he wanted to or not, he didn't.
• 1:25:36
  SPEAKER_03: He didn't, right?
• 1:25:37
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, Joe Paterno had two national championships and now has his 409 wins back because you know everybody from Penn State cried and whined about it.
• 1:25:48
  SPEAKER_03: So the abuse scandal, you know, which you know, I just remember Mark Madden saying, oh, well, Johnny, you call him Johnny Walker Red and you know, criticizes drinking and stuff.
• 1:26:00
  SPEAKER_03: And then, you know, oh, well, he doesn't, you know, and then talk about Joe Paterno.
• 1:26:04
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, you Pitt fans are just jealous because Joe Paterno doesn't have any scandals and his reputation is, you know.
• 1:26:09
  SPEAKER_03: Well, where were and this was like back when Paterno was still coaching.
• 1:26:13
  SPEAKER_03: You know, where were you, Mr.
• 1:26:14
  SPEAKER_03: Investigative Reporter, you know, when all this was still going on, you know, 99, I'm sure Madden was, you know, on the air doing something before then, you know, Zindusky was still the coach and that went on right under your nose.
• 1:26:28
  SPEAKER_00: So Well, a lot of people I mean, Paterno was just um worshipped by a lot of the local media and a lot of the the media in the state, a lot of everybody.
• 1:26:39
  SPEAKER_00: And everybody just yeah, turned a blind eye to any kind of scandal.
• 1:26:43
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and it's like and then I think that just reflects besides besides Philip Fulmer, everybody seems to like Johnny Majors.
• 1:26:51
  SPEAKER_03: And um Johnny Majors, his stat, he had one national championship, 185 wins and no scandals.
• 1:26:59
  SPEAKER_03: He had a lot of success with a lot less support at Pitt than resources and a lot of other coaches at other programs did.
• 1:27:06
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, there were stories about like people would think he's not paying attention up in the stands, and he'd be talking to somebody or they'd think he was asleep, and he'd come out of the stands and he'd be like, Oh, you gotta, and he'd like actually not just yell at him but critique them like on how they ran the route wrong or what the right like Billy West said that, and there was another story from Tennessee about that.
• 1:27:25
  SPEAKER_03: So I guess uh Coach Majors like to kind of fool you that way.
• 1:27:29
  SPEAKER_03: But um, as far as I can tell, like I well, like I said, I wasn't able to find anything negative, even out of the all the Tennessee stuff.
• 1:27:36
  SPEAKER_03: You know, there uh Phil Former didn't even if he had anything negative to say, he didn't publish it in the press.
• 1:27:43
  SPEAKER_03: So go figure.
• 1:27:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, he he was uh for by all accounts a really good guy and a really great coach.
• 1:27:51
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's important that we remember, like you said, the the fact that the Pitt program was almost dead when they hired him.
• 1:27:58
  SPEAKER_00: I think, you know, you and I are of the generation where we don't we don't remember that.
• 1:28:02
  SPEAKER_00: What we remember is going to all the games in the in the mid-90s where they lost by fifty points to Ohio State and Notre Dame and and Miami.
• 1:28:11
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, we don't we weren't there for the 70s when Pitt wasn't even and and in the 70s, you know, remember too, that was a time when the Steelers and Pirates were winning uh championships.
• 1:28:22
  SPEAKER_00: And so for Pitt football to make itself relevant during that era, they had to be really something special.
• 1:28:28
  SPEAKER_00: And he made them really something special.
• 1:28:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I think there's a lot of Pitt fans to this day.
• 1:28:32
  SPEAKER_00: Pitt still has a program to this day.
• 1:28:35
  SPEAKER_00: You know, like you said it earlier, Steve, maybe they're playing Division I double A or something.
• 1:28:40
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and that it was always yeah, that and I'm sure, you know, the academic side of because there's always like I always feel like there's this tension within the school between the academic side and the athletic side for whatever reason.
• 1:28:53
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, and it just depends on which way the chancellor and you know wants the side.
• 1:29:00
  SPEAKER_03: So but I think now there's so much money involved that you know it I think they see the you know, you gotta branding and you know, just the amount of money a football program brings in, you know, especially a successful one.
• 1:29:12
  SPEAKER_03: So but um be that as may, Johnny Majors definitely his legacy is you know, successful coach, better person, you know, and uh just all around you know good person and uh he influenced the lives of a lot of people and you know a lot of people are better for having known him.
• 1:29:29
  SPEAKER_03: I mean so uh well that wraps up our uh podcast and we're uh on the internet at Weebly.
• 1:29:37
  SPEAKER_03: What is it?
• 1:29:38
  SPEAKER_03: Weebly Pittsburgh Sports Memory and that's weebly.com.
• 1:29:44
  SPEAKER_03: Hey, I almost have it right.
• 1:29:45
  SPEAKER_03: One more podcast, I'll have it right.
• 1:29:47
  SPEAKER_03: But uh thank you for joining us and I hope you enjoyed that one.
• 1:29:51
  SPEAKER_03: Thanks everybody.