Latest / Aggressive Negotiations: A Star Wars Podcast / Issue 395: Andor: Season One - Nobody’s Listening!

Transcript

Issue 395: Andor: Season One - Nobody’s Listening! · Aggressive Negotiations: A Star Wars Podcast

0:02
Speaker 1: Welcome to the NED Party.
0:06
Speaker 2: Hi, this is Nick and Ostasu, story editor on Star Wars,
0:10
Speaker 2: the Clone Wars and Star Wars bad Batch, and you
0:14
Speaker 2: are listening to aggressive negotiations.
0:25
Speaker 3: We can do this the easy way, we can do
0:26
Speaker 3: this the hard way, but either way, we're glad that
0:29
Speaker 3: you're listening to aggressive negotiations. The Star Wars podcast here
0:34
Speaker 3: on the Nerd Party network that explores every aspect of
0:37
Speaker 3: the Star Wars galaxy that we can think of, that
0:40
Speaker 3: you can think of, that anybody can think of. In fact,
0:43
Speaker 3: somebody else is thinking of something right now having to
0:46
Speaker 3: do with Star Wars, but we're going to think of
0:49
Speaker 3: it first and talk about it. But for this episode,
0:53
Speaker 3: I am joined. I'm John Nils. I'm joined as always
0:56
Speaker 3: by my dear friend, my trusted compatriot, Jedi Master, Matthew Rushing. Matt,
1:03
Speaker 3: are you ready to record tonight or do I have
1:05
Speaker 3: to put the funky headphones on you? And have you
1:07
Speaker 3: listened to alien screams again until you say you.
1:10
Speaker 1: Are, John, The worst thing you could do right now
1:16
Speaker 1: is bore me.
1:18
Speaker 3: Well, we know that's never gonna happen, Matt. So everybody
1:21
Speaker 3: is safe and sound listening to this week's episode, Oh
1:25
Speaker 3: we are, we are, everybody is and everybody everybody. Of course,
1:31
Speaker 3: don't make us strap those special headphones on you and
1:35
Speaker 3: get you to go over and give us a star
1:37
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1:41
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1:44
Speaker 3: give this to you as an act of love. Give
1:47
Speaker 3: that back to us as an act of love as well,
1:50
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1:59
Speaker 3: I'm old. I'm an old man. I can't keep up
2:01
Speaker 3: with everything.
2:02
Speaker 1: There's too many networks, John, There's just too many networks.
2:05
Speaker 3: There sure are, and we try to contact them by
2:08
Speaker 3: climbing in a small, narrow tube and tapping out Morse
2:11
Speaker 3: code in hopes that the Empire doesn't hear us setting
2:15
Speaker 3: out on those networks. But Matt, here we are. Ninth episode,
2:20
Speaker 3: birthplace of a bunch of gifts and memes that have
2:22
Speaker 3: gone around the world. Nobody's Listening. Ninth episode of and
2:27
Speaker 3: Or in the first season, where we are seeing some
2:31
Speaker 3: things really starting to take shape, really in a sincerely
2:36
Speaker 3: interesting manner. And so we come into this episode and
2:40
Speaker 3: the thing is, I know that I know that we
2:44
Speaker 3: talk about the particular as we talk about the pacing,
2:46
Speaker 3: we talk about the cuts and everything like that. But
2:50
Speaker 3: from the very first viewing, the very unsettling way in
2:56
Speaker 3: which it starts, wherein we have the interrogation, see being
3:00
Speaker 3: set up with Dedre and Bicks, Yeah, and we have
3:03
Speaker 3: everything coming together. We see the mad doctor, the token
3:06
Speaker 3: mad doctor. He's always a skinny guy in a trench
3:08
Speaker 3: coat for some reason, you know, and he's always gleeful,
3:11
Speaker 3: he's always happy to be torturing people.
3:13
Speaker 1: They're always creepy.
3:15
Speaker 3: But the thing is, like, I guess you have to
3:18
Speaker 3: have been a person that found your life's calling to
3:20
Speaker 3: do these things. Like you'd hate to think that it's
3:23
Speaker 3: just you know, Johnny Punch the Clock is working this
3:26
Speaker 3: thing where he's like, Eh, yeah, I gotta torture you.
3:28
Speaker 3: What are you gonna do? I feel like you need
3:31
Speaker 3: somebody wired a certain way to do these sorts of things.
3:34
Speaker 3: I know I'm making light of it, but it just
3:36
Speaker 3: sort of like, is just to compartmentalize the horrible aspect
3:40
Speaker 3: of it that there are people like that in the world.
3:42
Speaker 3: But my question to you out of the gate here,
3:46
Speaker 3: is this too intense a way to open up a
3:52
Speaker 3: Star Wars show? And let me add context on that question.
3:56
Speaker 3: Something that people fall back on, whether they're criticizing Star
4:00
Speaker 3: Wars or they're loving Star Wars continually is to say, oh, well,
4:04
Speaker 3: it's a thing about space wizards for kids, right, And
4:07
Speaker 3: that's a way to deflect arguments, and that's a way
4:09
Speaker 3: to start arguments, and that's a way to be dismissive.
4:13
Speaker 3: But if we're talking about a franchise where everybody says, oh,
4:19
Speaker 3: it's about space wizards for kids, is this too intense?
4:22
Speaker 3: Does this opening cross any lines from your perspective?
4:27
Speaker 1: You know, it's it's very interesting to me that one
4:31
Speaker 1: of the things that Tony Gilroy has said in an
4:35
Speaker 1: interview about season two is this idea that he wanted
4:41
Speaker 1: to take this more seriously than anybody who had ever
4:44
Speaker 1: taken Star Wars seriously before. And you know, I think
4:50
Speaker 1: that the interesting aspect of that is that, you know,
4:55
Speaker 1: for the subject matter here and the the idea of
5:01
Speaker 1: of the rebellion, I think that this is the perfect
5:05
Speaker 1: opportunity to do that. You know, when when you're talking
5:08
Speaker 1: about the what we're discussing. You know, this is this
5:12
Speaker 1: is an incredibly dark and deep and like as we
5:17
Speaker 1: talked about last week, I think to great acclaim with
5:21
Speaker 1: our good friend Darren. So great to have Darren on
5:24
Speaker 1: if you did, if you missed that episode, you need
5:26
Speaker 1: to go find it. It was wonderful. We had a
5:29
Speaker 1: fantastic time with that. But this, this show really is
5:37
Speaker 1: is asking some incredibly big questions, right, you know, as
5:40
Speaker 1: we were talking about the the conundrum that Luthan finds
5:44
Speaker 1: himself in the conversation he has with Saw and here
5:49
Speaker 1: again I think we're really meeting the rubber meets the road.
5:53
Speaker 1: But at the same time, you know, one of the
5:55
Speaker 1: things that I was thinking of specifically as this episode
5:58
Speaker 1: began was we're seeing in perial torture. We're seeing what
6:02
Speaker 1: the Empire is willing to do to keep its power.
6:05
Speaker 1: We're seeing basically this this is the Gestapo at work, right.
6:11
Speaker 1: You know, Bix even says you're ISB, aren't you? You're
6:14
Speaker 1: the worst of the worst, you know, And just as
6:18
Speaker 1: the Gestapo was the worst of the worst for the Nazis,
6:21
Speaker 1: the ISB is the worst of the worst for the Empire.
6:25
Speaker 1: And you know, I mean they're working with a guy.
6:29
Speaker 1: As soon as that guy came on the screen, the
6:30
Speaker 1: doctor or whatever who created this crazy thing that like
6:34
Speaker 1: scrambles your brain, all I could think was doctor Vindy
6:38
Speaker 1: from the Blue Shadow Virus episodes of Home Wars, you know,
6:43
Speaker 1: and he's just so giddy about his creation and that
6:45
Speaker 1: it could destroy the entire universe if it got out,
6:48
Speaker 1: you know, like he just thinks it's the most amazing
6:51
Speaker 1: thing ever. And this dude is so enamored with his
6:55
Speaker 1: own creation and what it can do. There's no morality there,
6:59
Speaker 1: and that I think is incredibly terrifying when what we're
7:05
Speaker 1: really seeing here is that we're in a place where
7:10
Speaker 1: it doesn't it doesn't matter about what's right or what's wrong.
7:18
Speaker 1: It clearly is just about staying in power and being
7:23
Speaker 1: in power. Yeah, and so I think that's a crazy thing.
7:27
Speaker 3: Here, unquestionably, Yes, I think. I mean, I go back.
7:34
Speaker 3: Empire strikes Back sort of defeats the argument in the
7:37
Speaker 3: sense we see Han getting tortured. Yeah, we're physically tortured,
7:42
Speaker 3: but there is something that has even more men. It's
7:45
Speaker 3: one thing to see Darth Vader presiding over torture. Vader
7:48
Speaker 3: doesn't have a face. People forget that sometimes Vader's mask
7:53
Speaker 3: is not a face. It doesn't change. We have to
7:56
Speaker 3: listen for voice and look for body language. Abstracts it
8:00
Speaker 3: a little bit, is what I would say. This feels
8:05
Speaker 3: more adult because of the fact that you see the
8:12
Speaker 3: sickness in Deidra's face sure when she's interacting, Whereas with Vader,
8:17
Speaker 3: even as he's lowering han on, he's not saying anything
8:20
Speaker 3: to him, he's just they're lowering it on. We know
8:24
Speaker 3: Han's yelling. We hear han yell a little bit. It
8:27
Speaker 3: lasts not a very long time, whereas the build up
8:31
Speaker 3: to putting Bis in the the funky headset. That's the tension.
8:37
Speaker 3: That's the part that really takes it.
8:39
Speaker 1: And I think, well, and then they don't let you
8:42
Speaker 1: listen to it right, They don't give you right, which
8:46
Speaker 1: is even because we're terrifying. Then then you know the
8:50
Speaker 1: whole aspect, Like, I think that's the other genius there
8:53
Speaker 1: is that we don't hear that.
8:54
Speaker 3: So but I think that scene is also important because
8:58
Speaker 3: this is the moment at which Dedra goes from an
9:01
Speaker 3: interesting antagonist we've never met before, who's a career minded bureau.
9:09
Speaker 3: It's a career minded bureaucrat who is part of the
9:14
Speaker 3: machine and disconnected, and we find out, no, she's very
9:17
Speaker 3: personally evil. I think this scene and specific allows Dedra
9:23
Speaker 3: to have that turn into actual villainy. It's not. Yeah,
9:28
Speaker 3: And what's disconcerting about it is that you then wonder if,
9:36
Speaker 3: like it makes her play as worse even than her boss,
9:40
Speaker 3: who just seems like a really great paper pusher and
9:42
Speaker 3: people manager. Yeah, you could sit there and kind of wonder, well,
9:47
Speaker 3: what did he do to get up to the top
9:48
Speaker 3: of the ranks, But that doesn't matter. Dedre is now
9:51
Speaker 3: more personally horrific than he is even though he runs
9:56
Speaker 3: the entire bureau, or he at least reports to you.
10:00
Speaker 3: He's the boss that we encounter. Now. It starts off
10:06
Speaker 3: so strong with that. We switch to the prison where
10:10
Speaker 3: and Or is and we see him going day to
10:14
Speaker 3: day with everything. As we flip the storylines, we of
10:21
Speaker 3: course also bring Cyral back into everything because we you know,
10:26
Speaker 3: previously we talked about we brought him in. Do you
10:29
Speaker 3: think that first half of the episode, not the back
10:32
Speaker 3: half the first half of the episode, do you see
10:35
Speaker 3: any challenges with the momentum the handoff between those segments.
10:41
Speaker 1: So no, I think that And this is the interesting thing,
10:48
Speaker 1: you know. You know, we've talked about the whole serial thing,
10:51
Speaker 1: right and kind of how crazy it is and kind
10:54
Speaker 1: of how weird it is, and and yet you know,
10:57
Speaker 1: one of the things that happens in this episode is
10:59
Speaker 1: Seria himself just we realize, Okay, oh, he's a he's
11:03
Speaker 1: a crazy he's he's crazy, right, uh. And and not
11:08
Speaker 1: only is he crazy, but he's a crazy stalker.
11:11
Speaker 3: Uh.
11:11
Speaker 1: And And what I find to be fascinating about that
11:15
Speaker 1: is the way in which this, of course is going
11:17
Speaker 1: to then build with Dedre herself, right, you know, and
11:20
Speaker 1: and and it's going to tap into something with her
11:23
Speaker 1: which is going to be really fascinating. And so but no,
11:27
Speaker 1: I thought that that really played well because even though
11:30
Speaker 1: I don't necessarily still really care about the whole serial storyline,
11:35
Speaker 1: what's happening with mon Mathma is just so good, you know.
11:39
Speaker 1: I mean, we we we learn that, you know, she's
11:43
Speaker 1: related to Vow uh. And you know, we see Voo
11:47
Speaker 1: really taking to heart the conversation she had with Santa,
11:52
Speaker 1: and and she has very much kind of hardened and
11:55
Speaker 1: changed in that sense, and she's trying to galvanize mand
11:59
Speaker 1: for for that calling that they have taken up the
12:03
Speaker 1: vowels that they have made to the rebellion. And yet
12:09
Speaker 1: it's it's fascinating because you know, you can just see
12:12
Speaker 1: like nobody cares, nobody's listening. This episode is perfectly named
12:17
Speaker 1: because you know, what mon is talking about is so
12:19
Speaker 1: incredibly important, right, It's the most important thing that's happening
12:23
Speaker 1: in the galaxy. Everybody's freedom is being stripped away, and
12:26
Speaker 1: nobody seems to care. Why because nobody's listening, and they
12:31
Speaker 1: couldn't give to you know what. And then to see
12:36
Speaker 1: the weight of the mask that she's having to wear
12:41
Speaker 1: and what it's doing to her. You know, she has
12:45
Speaker 1: no connection with her family. Her daughter hates her, her
12:51
Speaker 1: husband is awful, and it treats her like dirt. And
12:57
Speaker 1: now she's learning that the only way that possibly you
13:00
Speaker 1: get out of the situation she's in is to apparently
13:05
Speaker 1: go to some shady chandrillin muddy laundering dude. So there
13:13
Speaker 1: will be no more veneer for her anymore in the
13:17
Speaker 1: sense that she's able to keep her hands clean whatsoever.
13:20
Speaker 1: Like she's gonna have to start playing dirty, and is
13:25
Speaker 1: she gonna be willing to do that, and so like
13:28
Speaker 1: that storyline to me, you know, obviously we'll get to
13:33
Speaker 1: what's going on in Narkeina.
13:35
Speaker 3: Five, but.
13:37
Speaker 1: That storyline to me just really brings home the cost
13:42
Speaker 1: you know that you're seeing for somebody like like man Mathma,
13:46
Speaker 1: who you know we know from from the prequels and
13:50
Speaker 1: the stuff that's come out with her in it. You know,
13:53
Speaker 1: whether it was in the Clone Wars, she was probably
13:56
Speaker 1: more like Padme kind of this idealist, you know, like
14:01
Speaker 1: thinking that that they could solve problems type of things.
14:04
Speaker 3: Hang on, it's solely being stripped away. I want to
14:07
Speaker 3: pull on that thread though. Do you think that had
14:10
Speaker 3: she lived, do you think pad May would have faced
14:14
Speaker 3: the same sort of crucible moment? Yes, perfect world situation,
14:18
Speaker 3: Padme goes into hiding, goes off, She continued, Do you
14:21
Speaker 3: think she goes down this road? Because the thing is
14:25
Speaker 3: this is where Okay, and I know you always knock
14:27
Speaker 3: me for like, oh, prestige television and stuff like that. Fine, okay,
14:30
Speaker 3: so let me conceide this all prestige television, long storytelling
14:33
Speaker 3: arc sort of thing. What feels disconnected at this point
14:39
Speaker 3: if I'm looking at it from like a macro perspective
14:42
Speaker 3: is very obviously, You're right. The point of what man
14:48
Speaker 3: Mathma is going through is that she has to come
14:51
Speaker 3: down and get in the mud with everybody else. She
14:54
Speaker 3: can no longer pretend that she can stay clean and
14:57
Speaker 3: do this quote unquote the high ground way. She can't
15:00
Speaker 3: be on the high ground anymore. I wish that we're
15:05
Speaker 3: better connected in this context right now with Saw and Luthen.
15:12
Speaker 3: It's a little too disconnect. Yes, I know her cousin
15:15
Speaker 3: is there. We know her cousin is tied. We know
15:18
Speaker 3: this from a macro perspective, it's just a little too
15:24
Speaker 3: distant from seeing Saw. It's a little too distant from
15:29
Speaker 3: some Luthen stuff to remind us that it's like she's
15:33
Speaker 3: part of that cadre of leaders that's discussing things right now.
15:39
Speaker 3: Is there a quote unquote solution to that. I don't know.
15:42
Speaker 1: I'm not saying.
15:43
Speaker 3: I think I'm saying, like, from a macro perspective, I
15:45
Speaker 3: would like to see that happening a little bit more compressed.
15:50
Speaker 3: Okay for those moments.
15:52
Speaker 1: No, I kind of get that, you know, I think
15:56
Speaker 1: that one of the things that h on the other
16:01
Speaker 1: side of that, why I think it works is because
16:04
Speaker 1: that's the difficulty with this. You know, when Man tries
16:07
Speaker 1: to talk about Luthen to vow, she shuts it down, right,
16:11
Speaker 1: because there has to be that distance between them kept,
16:18
Speaker 1: you know, because who knows who could hear. And so again,
16:24
Speaker 1: I think that that's the other thing is we have
16:27
Speaker 1: man Mathma who's being asked to do all these things,
16:31
Speaker 1: and yet she really is truly kind of isolated, right,
16:34
Speaker 1: she doesn't really have anyone, you know. Luthan has these
16:41
Speaker 1: other people that he is able to have conversations with,
16:46
Speaker 1: and he's not in that same position, like he's not
16:51
Speaker 1: in this completely alone, right, And I think that's something
16:55
Speaker 1: that makes the place that mon Mothma is uh specifically
17:06
Speaker 1: and uniquely different than kind of everybody else.
17:11
Speaker 3: I don't I don't disagree. I say you are.
17:14
Speaker 1: I'm saying, like I what you were saying where you
17:17
Speaker 1: were just kind of hoping it's it's closer and everything.
17:20
Speaker 1: I totally get what you're saying, and I can I
17:22
Speaker 1: can see how you know that would be really really interesting.
17:26
Speaker 1: I think that you know, with Ah, with the way
17:34
Speaker 1: that it's done, I think it's it's meant to make
17:37
Speaker 1: us feel that isolation for her.
17:40
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I I I get what you're saying
17:45
Speaker 3: with that, I don't know that I agree with it
17:47
Speaker 3: as an approach. I think that Additionally, this is one
17:52
Speaker 3: of those times where I think they could have they
17:56
Speaker 3: could have accelerated a little bit more. I'm not taking
17:59
Speaker 3: anything away from the Narkina five stuff. I think that
18:02
Speaker 3: stuff is absolutely engrossing. It's absolutely engrossing to see things
18:07
Speaker 3: coming together, to see the rumor spreading, to see Ken
18:11
Speaker 3: o'loy sort of struggling with his own loss of hope
18:15
Speaker 3: about everything, seeing seeing him realizing in real time, Oh
18:20
Speaker 3: my gosh, I've been lied to completely. Everything I pinned
18:24
Speaker 3: my hopes top is an absolute lie.
18:27
Speaker 1: Yeah, his world is shattered in this way and it it's.
18:32
Speaker 3: And the thing is again, I don't because I don't
18:34
Speaker 3: pay attention to this stuff, but like did Andy serkis
18:37
Speaker 3: at least get nominated for any acting awards for his
18:41
Speaker 3: appearance in the series.
18:42
Speaker 1: But because he's so great in this series.
18:47
Speaker 3: Denise Goff, I think golf is how you pronounce her
18:49
Speaker 3: last name, and he are phenomenal. The series doesn't work
18:54
Speaker 3: without the two of them. Yeah, I agree, I yes,
18:58
Speaker 3: I think that we have, you know, I mean we've
19:02
Speaker 3: talked about how you know, Diego luna Is is born
19:06
Speaker 3: to play this role. He inhabits it. Yeah, at this point,
19:10
Speaker 3: like you almost look at it and you like it's
19:11
Speaker 3: effortless for him. At this point it's obviously isn't, but
19:14
Speaker 3: it feels effortless for him. I see the character. I
19:17
Speaker 3: don't see him anymore. He is Cassie and andorm I agree.
19:21
Speaker 3: So let's set that. Let's box it up, Let's tie
19:23
Speaker 3: a bow on it. Let's set that over to the side.
19:25
Speaker 3: We've said it enough times. Denise Goff Andy serkis absolutely
19:32
Speaker 3: key to the success of this particular episode. This is
19:37
Speaker 3: where the casting director absolutely wins their paycheck forgetting these
19:42
Speaker 3: two people on the show.
19:43
Speaker 1: This is redemption for Andy Serkis and star Wars.
19:46
Speaker 3: Yes, but I'm also going to go out there and
19:49
Speaker 3: say that Christopher Fairbank, who plays Ouloff, the guy who's
19:53
Speaker 3: aged and having trouble with his hands and stuff like that,
19:57
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, that guy. Yeah, that's the type of
20:02
Speaker 3: role that's thankless because what the show tells us to
20:09
Speaker 3: care about is how people are reacting to him. But
20:14
Speaker 3: what he's giving the audience and the other characters is
20:20
Speaker 3: so key to what's happening right now, and it's unfortunate.
20:23
Speaker 3: I think probably something why. I think there could have
20:30
Speaker 3: been an opportunity to make some of these things work
20:36
Speaker 3: a little bit more smoothly, because we talked about this,
20:40
Speaker 3: the whole Clone Wars thing where he said, oh, well,
20:42
Speaker 3: you know you have the three arcs and stuff like that.
20:45
Speaker 3: I am going through Clone Wars, as I've talked about
20:48
Speaker 3: while we're recording this again with my youngest and as
20:53
Speaker 3: I hit these episodes. Here's the difference. And it's primarily
20:56
Speaker 3: a run time thing. The majority of those episodes can
21:00
Speaker 3: really stay tightly focused on a plot line, and maybe
21:04
Speaker 3: there's a b plot line, but primarily we're in one spot,
21:08
Speaker 3: one series of events, really tightly focused. And I think
21:13
Speaker 3: that Christopher fairbanks performance is a casualty of saying no,
21:19
Speaker 3: this has got to be forty five minutes to an hour.
21:22
Speaker 3: If this were a more tightly focused, like prison only episode,
21:25
Speaker 3: I think Christopher Fairbanks gets more spotlight on him. That's
21:29
Speaker 3: not me saying restructure the whole episode just for him.
21:31
Speaker 3: I'm not saying anything like that. I'm just saying, this
21:35
Speaker 3: is my way of heaping praise on him sure for
21:38
Speaker 3: what he did, is to say that he is a
21:41
Speaker 3: victim of the way they decided to structure the storytelling here,
21:48
Speaker 3: I think, at least, I mean, if I'm wrong, if
21:50
Speaker 3: there's like documented evidence out there that no everybody spend
21:52
Speaker 3: as much time going on about him as I did, Okay,
21:55
Speaker 3: I will gladly withdraw the point. But were there any
22:00
Speaker 3: other supporting performances that you looked at that you were like, yeah, yeah,
22:03
Speaker 3: that really made this work?
22:06
Speaker 2: You know.
22:06
Speaker 1: Strangely enough, the one that's that's that might be shocking
22:12
Speaker 1: to you is Cyril's mother, because like, how many how many?
22:19
Speaker 1: How many people have experienced that kind of in their
22:23
Speaker 1: life with a parent who has wrapped themselves into your
22:29
Speaker 1: life in this way?
22:32
Speaker 2: Uh?
22:32
Speaker 1: And where you know, and even if you haven't seen that,
22:36
Speaker 1: are haven't experienced it right, You may have seen it
22:41
Speaker 1: right with a friend of yours where that parent was
22:44
Speaker 1: so overly involved in their child's life because they were
22:48
Speaker 1: utilizing their life as a way to live vicariously. They
22:55
Speaker 1: had wrapped all of themselves into you. And I thought
22:59
Speaker 1: that that that portrayal of his mother was actually very
23:05
Speaker 1: well done, and it's just what's so well done about
23:09
Speaker 1: it is she's so grating, she's so frustrating as a character,
23:19
Speaker 1: and that's exactly what you need her to be. There
23:23
Speaker 1: really isn't anything likable about her and the way she's
23:27
Speaker 1: portraying it. I think that then makes it really well done.
23:31
Speaker 1: So I got to give her credit for being able
23:33
Speaker 1: to pull that off in a way that just kind
23:37
Speaker 1: of makes my skin crawl a little bit every time
23:40
Speaker 1: that she's on screen.
23:42
Speaker 3: You almost wonder in other series the serial character winds
23:46
Speaker 3: up being a serial killer. A serial killer.
23:49
Speaker 1: The guy feel Maybe that's why that's his name, because
23:52
Speaker 1: that's what he comes off as, right, he comes off
23:55
Speaker 1: as somebody who seems like at any moment he's going
23:59
Speaker 1: to snap.
24:01
Speaker 3: And this is gonna sound crazy. Maybe that's the frustrating
24:06
Speaker 3: thing about the ceial arc is we know we're so
24:11
Speaker 3: inculcated with knowing where it points in other series, but
24:15
Speaker 3: it doesn't go there.
24:16
Speaker 1: I mean, at least it hasn't there yet.
24:18
Speaker 3: Yeah, so well, I would be surprised if it did.
24:21
Speaker 3: But do you think there's something to that that? Like,
24:25
Speaker 3: sometimes we wind up so used to seeing certain characters
24:30
Speaker 3: go off in a certain way in so much other
24:34
Speaker 3: material that when it doesn't go that way in a
24:37
Speaker 3: piece of material, we react to it in a certain
24:40
Speaker 3: way where we're like, no, that's not right, that's not
24:42
Speaker 3: how you're supposed to do it, Like it's it's like
24:44
Speaker 3: seeing somebody make a sandwich in a different way. Or
24:48
Speaker 3: the kid in the Never Ending Story eat the core
24:50
Speaker 3: of the apple, which horrified me as a child, Like,
24:52
Speaker 3: that's the one thing I walk away with from The
24:54
Speaker 3: Never Ending Story as a kid eats the entire apple,
24:57
Speaker 3: including the cord. I'm like, I remember saying to my
24:59
Speaker 3: dad I was a kids seeing it. I was like, Dad,
25:01
Speaker 3: who who does that? And he was like, oh, well,
25:04
Speaker 3: you know some people do that. It's like what people
25:08
Speaker 3: eat the core? And like is that? Is this the
25:10
Speaker 3: same sort of thing where it's like we're reacting to
25:12
Speaker 3: cerial well, like, okay, come on, become a serial killer
25:15
Speaker 3: do something terrible. And he does terrible things, but they're
25:18
Speaker 3: all like sort of like intellectually terrible and not like
25:20
Speaker 3: killing people and keeping a trophy of their foot in
25:23
Speaker 3: his you know, in his bedroom somewhere.
25:25
Speaker 1: You know, I think too, you know, especially in this
25:28
Speaker 1: episode with his conversation with Deirdre, you know, we get
25:32
Speaker 1: this since that he is a fanatic, right he has been,
25:48
Speaker 1: he has been radicalized by the empire, and it's mission right,
25:57
Speaker 1: this mission of order at any cost, and that no
26:01
Speaker 1: matter what you have to do, you create that order.
26:04
Speaker 1: And honestly, that's incredibly terrifying, right, Like, I think that's
26:11
Speaker 1: what they are trying to do with him as a character.
26:16
Speaker 1: They're trying to show what happens when somebody becomes a
26:21
Speaker 1: sold out believer in an ideology to the point where
26:25
Speaker 1: it controls them completely and utterly and there's no other
26:30
Speaker 1: thought process happening in their brain. That's what's happened to Cyril.
26:35
Speaker 1: And you know, I think that it's the thing that
26:38
Speaker 1: we could relate to. Of course, in the time period
26:41
Speaker 1: that we live in, right we see that happening unfortunately
26:45
Speaker 1: all too frequently. But it's not just our time period
26:49
Speaker 1: to which that's an issue. This is something to which
26:51
Speaker 1: we have seen, you know, throughout history, which is again
26:54
Speaker 1: the type of thing that you know, Gilroy is pulling
26:58
Speaker 1: from on purpose. And so you know, I think that's
27:02
Speaker 1: kind of where that comes down for me.
27:05
Speaker 3: Well, I really think, honestly, the thing that I go
27:08
Speaker 3: back to is I think that again, going back to
27:11
Speaker 3: the opening of the show and the alternative form of torture,
27:16
Speaker 3: you would look at that and you would say, well,
27:18
Speaker 3: they're not harming Bis in a physical way. They're not
27:24
Speaker 3: beating Bis, they're not you know, fake drowning her, They're
27:29
Speaker 3: not doing these certain things. All they're doing is they're
27:31
Speaker 3: playing some noises that mess with your head. And what
27:35
Speaker 3: I think is really I mean, the reason I keep
27:40
Speaker 3: going back to it is because it's really hard not
27:43
Speaker 3: to feel like that is a very specific criticism of
27:50
Speaker 3: current times, specifically in Western culture, maybe global culture too.
27:58
Speaker 3: And I'm not saying that's a negative, but I'm saying
28:01
Speaker 3: the torture aspect of it, the quote unquote alternative forms,
28:06
Speaker 3: where oh, is it really torture? It's hard to describe,
28:10
Speaker 3: you know, because torture is usually this is usually that.
28:13
Speaker 3: I think. Maybe that's why I think it's so adult
28:15
Speaker 3: the way they do it is because in the aftermath
28:23
Speaker 3: of nine to eleven, those of us who are old
28:27
Speaker 3: enough to have lived through it and have a memory
28:29
Speaker 3: of it, these sorts of questions still rankle a little
28:33
Speaker 3: bit because of the fact I look at that scene
28:37
Speaker 3: and I do not sympathize with Deidre at all. I
28:40
Speaker 3: do not think she's doing anything correct. I don't think
28:43
Speaker 3: anything that they're doing is correct. Yeah, but you see
28:47
Speaker 3: how easy it is when you feel justified to do
28:53
Speaker 3: something like this because from ddrous perspective, Mix is a
28:59
Speaker 3: rep and lives depend on finding Cassian and Or and
29:05
Speaker 3: I have to do extreme means to find this man
29:08
Speaker 3: who's responsible for murder. Meanwhile, shelving in the back of
29:13
Speaker 3: my brain, Cassian is literally responsible for murder. Yeah, forget
29:18
Speaker 3: the heist. He's literally responsible for murder from the very
29:22
Speaker 3: first get go, in the very first episode. And it's
29:26
Speaker 3: so easy, because you talk about the radicalization of Cyril,
29:31
Speaker 3: it's so easy to find yourself justifying taking that extra
29:35
Speaker 3: little step. Well, I'm not hitting bicks, I'm just messing
29:38
Speaker 3: with her head, Shelby, Fine, as long as she talks
29:41
Speaker 3: to me. You see how easy it is to sell
29:44
Speaker 3: it to anybody who's willing to intellectually rationalize it that
29:49
Speaker 3: if you took this, say to Cyril, if you took
29:52
Speaker 3: this to the average person on Coruscant and he said,
29:55
Speaker 3: this is what I'm going to do is I'm gonna
29:56
Speaker 3: put these headphones on. It's gonna play a really unsettling
29:58
Speaker 3: tone and then I'll stop after a little bit and
30:02
Speaker 3: she can tell me what she's saying. It's really easy
30:04
Speaker 3: to present that in an abstract way because again, you're
30:08
Speaker 3: not leaving any marks on her body. Yeah. I just
30:10
Speaker 3: think that's I mean, am I am I pushing too
30:14
Speaker 3: hard into this? No?
30:15
Speaker 1: I don't think you are pushing too hard on that,
30:18
Speaker 1: you know. I think what's what's interesting is is the
30:23
Speaker 1: way in which we're seeing I think the terrifying thing
30:28
Speaker 1: that the Empire does not waste people if they don't
30:35
Speaker 1: have to, right, I mean that isn't that what we're
30:38
Speaker 1: seeing on our Quina five right, which you know they're there.
30:43
Speaker 1: Their big slip up on their Quina five is placing
30:48
Speaker 1: people back in the system so that other people can
30:52
Speaker 1: find out about it, right, and which is where everything
30:55
Speaker 1: goes to hell in a hand basket for them, right
30:58
Speaker 1: they they and so in that I find that really
31:02
Speaker 1: fascinating because they they aren't just necessarily about taking people
31:09
Speaker 1: out for no good reason. What we're seeing is is
31:13
Speaker 1: that they they are willing to utilize people's blood, sweat
31:18
Speaker 1: and tears to get what they desire from them. And
31:24
Speaker 1: two build their empire, right that it's built on the
31:31
Speaker 1: back of slaves basically, you know, you think of ancient
31:36
Speaker 1: Egypt with the is uh the Hebrews, right uh. And
31:43
Speaker 1: you know, and and that's but that's been happening ever
31:48
Speaker 1: since and and so this empire is no different and
31:52
Speaker 1: and and therefore I think it it subtly makes us
31:56
Speaker 1: kind of have to think about all of the uncomfortable
31:59
Speaker 1: places within you know, the recent past and even in
32:08
Speaker 1: our daily life now where it's like human trafficking. It's
32:13
Speaker 1: a huge issue, you know, and yet so many people
32:18
Speaker 1: don't seem to care.
32:19
Speaker 3: So that's one of the cheap goods from Timu, right well, I.
32:22
Speaker 1: Mean yeah, so isn't that just the empire to a
32:27
Speaker 1: t they are the ultimate bread and circuses?
32:34
Speaker 3: Yes, But tacking onto that as well, saying with the
32:38
Speaker 3: prison thing, once you have the source of cheap free labor,
32:42
Speaker 3: because if you think about it, people are the one
32:47
Speaker 3: thing that's perpetually replacing itself. It's a renewable resource, and
32:54
Speaker 3: you just keep finding reasons to keep people in prison.
32:59
Speaker 3: And I think again, I know, I made the glib
33:02
Speaker 3: comment about Timou and everything like that, but yeah, I mean,
33:06
Speaker 3: people are easier to maintain than droids. We know how
33:09
Speaker 3: to do it because we are people, and it doesn't
33:12
Speaker 3: require any skilled technician to keep a person running exactly
33:15
Speaker 3: because your food, here's your sleep, here's you're this, you
33:18
Speaker 3: need this minimum. And I know that doctors have told
33:20
Speaker 3: me that I know how to run you because I
33:22
Speaker 3: know how to run me, and running a machine requires
33:26
Speaker 3: a technician. Blah blah blah blah. Anyway, I think that
33:30
Speaker 3: it really is a it's just that unsettling. I mean,
33:36
Speaker 3: even in the United States, in these United States where
33:40
Speaker 3: you and I are, you know, in California, there was
33:43
Speaker 3: a big scandal because they were purposely keeping people in
33:46
Speaker 3: prison to keep cheap labor and such going. And so,
33:49
Speaker 3: you know, you talk about like there's stuff in current
33:52
Speaker 3: times and stuff in the past. We're talking about the
33:54
Speaker 3: torture and everything, and it's like it's so easy in
33:57
Speaker 3: modern times to say, oh, well, that's something somebody did
33:59
Speaker 3: back then, and then you turn around and you're like, oh,
34:02
Speaker 3: wait a minute, Oh no, somebody today is doing that.
34:07
Speaker 3: And that's that That's a question that seems to be
34:10
Speaker 3: inherent in the show. And I guess maybe it's a
34:12
Speaker 3: good it's a good one. To like sort of like
34:14
Speaker 3: start start rounding third on is do you see an
34:20
Speaker 3: underlying message similar to the original Guiding six films of
34:27
Speaker 3: Star Wars in this episode pointing toward hope because that's
34:34
Speaker 3: what we're always looking for. Is there any spark of
34:37
Speaker 3: hope within this episode or does or do you feel
34:42
Speaker 3: really bleak at the end of this show at the
34:45
Speaker 3: end of this ninth episode.
34:47
Speaker 1: You know, I think I think the beauty of this
34:50
Speaker 1: episode is that and Or has already been planning this
34:56
Speaker 1: idea of leading a rebellion, right, He's already been working
35:01
Speaker 1: on the plan, and what he's needed is to find
35:06
Speaker 1: a way to get ken O Lloy on his side. Yeah,
35:11
Speaker 1: and this is again, you know, I think we've talked
35:16
Speaker 1: about many times. Is in so many instances in Star
35:22
Speaker 1: Wars and in storytelling, and I think honestly even in
35:27
Speaker 1: just the world in general. And this is why stories
35:30
Speaker 1: reflect reality. Evil ends up defeating itself and that's and
35:38
Speaker 1: that's what happens.
35:39
Speaker 3: Right.
35:41
Speaker 1: The Empire overreaches on our Quina five in a way
35:45
Speaker 1: that leads them, and their over confidence is their weakness,
35:53
Speaker 1: and that over confidence being their weakness, and the fact
35:58
Speaker 1: that you have somebody like and or in there, who's
36:01
Speaker 1: ready to spark a rebellion here has been waiting for
36:05
Speaker 1: the right moment, and the right moment came and he
36:08
Speaker 1: took it, and Keino Lloy by the end of the
36:10
Speaker 1: episode is on his side, and with that you have
36:15
Speaker 1: this feeling you left with that hope of Okay, we
36:19
Speaker 1: are moving forward now and we're getting out of this place, right.
36:24
Speaker 1: And of course there's the meta knowledge that we know
36:28
Speaker 1: we're going to get out because we know he's in
36:30
Speaker 1: rogue one right, but the situation has been so dire
36:34
Speaker 1: here it really is down to okay, how does this happen?
36:38
Speaker 1: And seeing all of these pieces kind of on this
36:44
Speaker 1: moving chess board have been incredibly interesting in this series,
36:49
Speaker 1: and part of I think this is one of the
36:51
Speaker 1: things that I find so wonderful about the series, is
36:55
Speaker 1: allowing us then to just inhabit these places. Maybe you know,
37:01
Speaker 1: maybe we could be spending more time there than we
37:03
Speaker 1: necessarily need to be, But I think what it's allowing
37:07
Speaker 1: us to do is to truly be able to, as
37:11
Speaker 1: the viewer, marinate in the awfulness that it is to
37:17
Speaker 1: be under the empire, so that then as we move
37:21
Speaker 1: towards the second season, and then into Rogue one, and
37:24
Speaker 1: then into a New Hope. There is that celebration, right, Like,
37:30
Speaker 1: all of this actually makes the original Star Wars such
37:34
Speaker 1: a better experience because when that Death Star is destroyed,
37:41
Speaker 1: there's so much more to that now than there was
37:44
Speaker 1: back in nineteen seventy seven.
37:48
Speaker 3: Bite your tongue. There was plenty to it.
37:50
Speaker 1: No, I'm saying I'm not taking anything away from the start.
37:55
Speaker 3: You know that.
37:56
Speaker 1: I'm just saying now we actually.
37:58
Speaker 3: I don't more to it. I believe you just absolutely
38:01
Speaker 3: dismissed the original Star Wars.
38:03
Speaker 1: Yes, that is an absolute hater.
38:10
Speaker 3: It took more than three hundred and ninety episodes to
38:12
Speaker 3: get here, folks, but I finally exposed Matt he hates
38:15
Speaker 3: the original Star Wars. Mail. So let me ask you
38:22
Speaker 3: this question. And this is something where I think that
38:32
Speaker 3: this is something where I think the world building they're
38:34
Speaker 3: doing with like the Mandalorian and Ahsoka speaks to some
38:37
Speaker 3: of this stuff. I'm gonna ask you a question on
38:40
Speaker 3: our way out the door here or on the way
38:42
Speaker 3: back to the temple. I guess I should say what
38:46
Speaker 3: happened to Narkina five after the Empire fell? I want
38:52
Speaker 3: your thoughts on that before we close out what happened
38:56
Speaker 3: to Narkina five. The prisons are Narkeina five when the
39:00
Speaker 3: empire fell.
39:02
Speaker 1: You know, I think that's a great question because one
39:04
Speaker 1: of the interesting parts about that is that we know
39:07
Speaker 1: that they're there making parts for the Death Star, right
39:12
Speaker 1: They're they're creating the massive deflector Dish.
39:16
Speaker 3: So what I wonder.
39:19
Speaker 1: Doesn't really even exist after that project is done, you know, or.
39:24
Speaker 3: Or or considering they were building a second one too.
39:27
Speaker 1: Or you know, so how long does this exist?
39:31
Speaker 3: You know?
39:31
Speaker 1: I you know, this is one of the things where
39:34
Speaker 1: I think it would have been so fascinating to be
39:36
Speaker 1: able to have those stories about what happens after you know,
39:42
Speaker 1: Return of the Jedi, and you know, that could have
39:45
Speaker 1: been an incredible story of liberation of Kia five. Right
39:50
Speaker 1: this place that they find out is still there, and
39:57
Speaker 1: you know, so as the second Death Star deflector Dish
40:01
Speaker 1: is done, I honestly think probably what they do to
40:04
Speaker 1: it is they leave all of the people there and
40:09
Speaker 1: they just blow it up. They blow them all away.
40:12
Speaker 3: I think that's a valid take on things. My brain
40:18
Speaker 3: goes in a slightly different way. I I think Operation
40:26
Speaker 3: Cinder gets them, and I'm willing now that they've worked
40:30
Speaker 3: that reference in h they've taken it away from three
40:36
Speaker 3: really poorly written books and had a very excellent exchange
40:42
Speaker 3: about it with Bill Burr in The Mandalorian. I'm willing
40:47
Speaker 3: to accept Operation Cinder as a thing. And I think
40:50
Speaker 3: that part of Operation Cinder would have been to go
40:53
Speaker 3: around and incinerate the poor people on Narkeina five, because
40:58
Speaker 3: part of it would have been to cripple the New Republic.
41:05
Speaker 3: Going around and destroying the things that could have made
41:10
Speaker 3: it function for a little bit longer. Yeah, would have
41:14
Speaker 3: been one of the ways. You wouldn't have wanted to
41:17
Speaker 3: think that the New Republic would have kept Narkina five going,
41:20
Speaker 3: but honestly, I think it probably would have. It would
41:25
Speaker 3: have taken the bureaucracy too long to work through it.
41:29
Speaker 3: And I think the one tantalizing hint of what could
41:34
Speaker 3: have been if it's not Operations Center is in Tales
41:39
Speaker 3: of the Empire, when there were a New Republic, envoy
41:43
Speaker 3: goes to tell Morgan Elsbeth that the Empire's done and
41:47
Speaker 3: the New Republic is taking over. I could easily see
41:50
Speaker 3: a warlord with a New Republic envoy showing up and saying,
41:54
Speaker 3: the people of Narkina five, we have to give them,
41:56
Speaker 3: you know, full trials, and the and the guy basically
41:59
Speaker 3: the warden of planet or whatever being like, oh, oh,
42:02
Speaker 3: that's not going to happen. Yeah, Hey, Animation Department, there's
42:08
Speaker 3: your queue. We'd love to see things like this. Give
42:11
Speaker 3: us some short episodes that'd be really rad.
42:14
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think or or you or you can always
42:17
Speaker 1: you know, do a just a short season too, you know,
42:21
Speaker 1: I mean you can you can create you know, many
42:24
Speaker 1: seasons of things that we would all love to see.
42:28
Speaker 3: Our services are free. We give these ideas to you
42:32
Speaker 3: for free. Matt any last thoughts before we adjourn?
42:37
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I think this is a really good episode.
42:40
Speaker 1: And part of that is that I think it ramps
42:42
Speaker 1: up the tension. And what's kind of fascinating is is
42:47
Speaker 1: that this is actually the last part of this arc,
42:52
Speaker 1: because the escape plays into the last three and so
42:57
Speaker 1: really this whole arc has been about cementing the horribleness
43:04
Speaker 1: of the Empire in our minds and for everyone who's
43:09
Speaker 1: been watching, and I think it's done a really good
43:13
Speaker 1: job of that. I think this episode, though, it lets
43:18
Speaker 1: you know what's coming next in the sense that, yes,
43:21
Speaker 1: we are moving now towards rebellion, full on rebellion, and
43:32
Speaker 1: I can't wait, man, I think so, I guess if
43:35
Speaker 1: I gave this a rating, I think this is a
43:38
Speaker 1: really good, solid four out of five.
43:41
Speaker 3: For me.
43:41
Speaker 1: It's just a very well done episode and it leaves
43:46
Speaker 1: me kind of on the edge of my seat for
43:48
Speaker 1: the next episode, which is always a good thing in television.
43:54
Speaker 1: And of course, you know, with the way that this
43:57
Speaker 1: show was released, you had to wait the next week,
44:00
Speaker 1: right and so, and everybody was talking about it. So
44:04
Speaker 1: what about you, John, Where would you kind of put
44:06
Speaker 1: this on a rating scale?
44:10
Speaker 3: I think I'd probably end up at a four powered law.
44:15
Speaker 3: I think that my general reaction is it's like a
44:20
Speaker 3: three three and a half because I think that it's
44:23
Speaker 3: a little long in the tooth. I think that there
44:26
Speaker 3: are certain things that could be tightened up. I'm not
44:28
Speaker 3: talking about any cuts to Dedra or anything like that.
44:32
Speaker 3: There's just stuff I think could have been conveyed a
44:35
Speaker 3: little more quickly. But that's just because that's that's how
44:37
Speaker 3: I'm wired. You know, whatever, find fault with it if
44:41
Speaker 3: you want to. But and most listeners do, I think
44:44
Speaker 3: so you know whatever. I mean, listen, I don't have
44:48
Speaker 3: I don't have as many years left as I've lived through.
44:52
Speaker 3: So I got to get these stories faster, okay, like
44:54
Speaker 3: otherwise I'm going to start watching at one a half speed? Okay,
44:56
Speaker 3: like the kids do all right? Come on now, if
44:59
Speaker 3: they don't want to do it, why would it be
45:00
Speaker 3: an option on Netflix? Matt, That's what I'm asking. Why
45:04
Speaker 3: would be an option?
45:05
Speaker 1: Is the devil?
45:06
Speaker 3: That's why I don't know. I don't know. I must
45:11
Speaker 3: consume content like fast food. It's the only way to
45:13
Speaker 3: keep up with with everything and watch Real Housewives of
45:16
Speaker 3: Beverly Hills just as I'm going along. You know, I
45:21
Speaker 3: got it? Hey, you know what another story idea? Pitch?
45:24
Speaker 3: Real Housewives of Coruscant. Hear me out, Disney, you can
45:28
Speaker 3: tap into treads. So I went up with a four.
45:33
Speaker 3: It's a solid four and it is largely powered by
45:37
Speaker 3: I mean, I'll be dead honest. I think Denise Goff
45:41
Speaker 3: is just so stellar. She is so fantastic in her role.
45:47
Speaker 3: I can't sing her praises enough. She is just absolutely phenomenal.
45:52
Speaker 3: And that that's why, Like the the floor of this
45:55
Speaker 3: is a four. There's no way could I could even
45:57
Speaker 3: like pick it enough on certain things to be like
45:59
Speaker 3: a three and a half like bang, that is the
46:03
Speaker 3: that is the floor for it. So you know that
46:06
Speaker 3: being said, if people want to complain to you, Matt
46:08
Speaker 3: about the fact that I didn't give it a five
46:10
Speaker 3: and that I found any flaws at all.
46:13
Speaker 1: We rated it the same.
46:14
Speaker 3: So I don't know who's going on. But the thing is,
46:16
Speaker 3: so you came at it from a four from a
46:18
Speaker 3: positive angle. I came at it from a negative angle.
46:20
Speaker 3: We're balance of the forest, folks. If people want to
46:23
Speaker 3: complain about my dark side tendencies, Matt, where can they find?
46:26
Speaker 1: Oh man, Well, people should find and complain over at
46:30
Speaker 1: Kessel Junkie. All over social media. I'm sorry, I mean,
46:36
Speaker 1: Matt Rushing zero two is where you'll find me, and
46:39
Speaker 1: you can do that, like I said, all over social media.
46:42
Speaker 1: Would love to get a chance to catch up with you.
46:44
Speaker 1: Of course, you can find me as well on the
46:47
Speaker 1: network with a show called al Post with Dray Kaufman
46:50
Speaker 1: talking about every single chapter of the Harry Potter series
46:53
Speaker 1: one chapter of time. Over on the TFM network, we
46:56
Speaker 1: also find me doing a bunch of different shows with
46:58
Speaker 1: a lot of Star Trek Talk as well as the
47:00
Speaker 1: six or two Club, where John is a frequent guest.
47:03
Speaker 1: We talk about all of the franchises that we love,
47:07
Speaker 1: not just Star Wars, but we do talk a lot
47:09
Speaker 1: of Star Wars are there, so you can also check
47:11
Speaker 1: that out. But John, I mean, if people do want
47:13
Speaker 1: to catch up with you, see what's going on, even
47:16
Speaker 1: though you are going to be spending days as you
47:20
Speaker 1: look at all of your mentions. Once you're back after Lent,
47:23
Speaker 1: where can people find you?
47:25
Speaker 3: Oh? Well, just look for me at Castle Junkie. I'm
47:29
Speaker 3: on a couple of social networks whatever. Sure send a
47:31
Speaker 3: message to Castle Junkie if I'm on there after Lent.
47:34
Speaker 3: I'll respond to you. I promise. You can also find
47:37
Speaker 3: me here on the network on a show called house Lights,
47:41
Speaker 3: where we look at the work of different directors. It's
47:45
Speaker 3: challenging because it's three of us. I'm the only one
47:48
Speaker 3: with the correct rating and response to every movie. Strange,
47:53
Speaker 3: but it's a good baseline so that you can compare
47:55
Speaker 3: with whether the other two co hosts, Tristan and Darren,
47:59
Speaker 3: are correct. Sometimes they are, sometimes they are. I don't know.
48:03
Speaker 3: I don't control these things. It's science at this point.
48:06
Speaker 3: But Matt, you know, I think that it's time for
48:09
Speaker 3: us to get on program. It's weird that they instituted
48:13
Speaker 3: that at the Jedi Council. Just feels odd. But I
48:16
Speaker 3: think it's time to close these negotiations.
48:20
Speaker 1: Negotiations are clubs, Join the Revolution, join the Nerd Party
48:33
Speaker 1: on program