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Embracing the Journey with Rachel Gorman - Symplicity Conversations · Symplicity Conversations

• 0:00
  Catherine Ripley: Welcome to Simplicity Conversation, the podcast where business, culture, and community come together to inspire and empower. I'm your host, Kathryn Ripley. Each week, we'll explore meaningful conversations about how today's business landscape is shaped by innovation, relationships, and the people behind the progress. From actionable insights and stories from industry leaders to topics like customer experience, fostering strong business relationships, and the role of automation, we've got you covered. Whether you're an entrepreneur navigating growth, a leader focused on building lasting connections, or someone interested in how culture and community drive success, Simplicity Conversations is here to guide you.
• 0:42
  If you're ready to turn challenges into opportunities and make meaningful strides in your business and community, subscribe now and join the conversation. Get ready to simplify complexity and make an impact with Simplicity Conversations. Welcome to Simplicity Conversations, where we explore the intersection of business, leadership, and community. Today, I'm honored to be joined by Rachel Gorman, President and CEO of the Muskegon Lakeshore Chamber of Commerce. Together, we'll discuss the journey, the unique character of the Muskegon Lakeshore, and how they're fostering growth and connection in the region.
• 1:17
  But first we're gonna start with simplicity insights. This is a quote that I'm gonna do each show that really kind of inspires. So today's quote is from John F. Kennedy, a rising tide lifts all boats. And I think this is so appropriate for this conversation because you can't make change with 1 person.
• 1:36
  You really need to have a village to make a change. And so I think we're gonna be exploring a lot of those changes that we see in the Muskegon area and the lakeshore. And it's pretty exciting what's happening. Be sure to subscribe to Simplicity Conversations to hear more from leaders shaping the future of business and community. So Rachel, thank you so much for being a guest on our podcast.
• 1:57
  Rachel Gorman: Thank you so much for the invitation. I so appreciate it with the opportunity.
• 2:01
  Catherine Ripley: Yeah. You know, we recently met each other on a pretty significant day for Simplicity Communications. We were at the Crane's Power Breakfast. Yep. And you weren't aware of it.
• 2:11
  But before the announcement was made, we were sitting next to each other at the table and explained that there was gonna be an announcement of our new iconic space at 60 Monroe Center Northwest, and we're moved in, and we're so excited.
• 2:24
  Rachel Gorman: Congratulations again. It's huge. It's huge.
• 2:28
  Catherine Ripley: You know, I remember when I started the company Mhmm. 18 years ago, and I used Select Bank as a bank. And I would go into this facility and look around at these 40 foot ceilings and think, oh my God, what an amazing place to work. And I think that these are some of the happy accidents that happen in business where you just never know the opportunity. And my lease is up in my my old space.
• 2:56
  It was up in January of 2025. And I was thinking, oh, just probably renew while maybe, you know, move to a little bit bigger space in the same building that I was in at Boardwalk. And the building owner came and said, hey, let me show you a couple of things. And he took me over and we were driving over. And and I know a lot of the addresses downtown from, the technology work that I do.
• 3:19
  So where are we going? And he goes, oh, it's, 60 Monroe. And I'm like, isn't that the old Select Bank building? And he goes, yeah. I said, wow.
• 3:26
  And I just, again, assumed we're gonna go up to a Sure. Second level, 3rd level Yeah. Whatever. And when we walked into suite 100 and he said, here, this is it. And I said, you're joking.
• 3:38
  Right. And he said, no. And I was just blown away. I felt like this moment of like, how did this full circle thing happen? How did it get to this point?
• 3:50
  And, you know, so when we quickly said, yeah, this is it. I thought my staff is either gonna think I'm crazy Right. Or they're gonna love it. And so the next day I took my staff. I took a little a couple of them over on a field trip.
• 4:04
  I'm like, come on, guys, let's go on a field trip. They're like, where are we going? And I was pretty cryptic. Yeah. Yeah.
• 4:09
  Totally. And we walked in and I said, this is, you know, on the outside of the building, you know, what comes with our suite is actually naming the building Simplicity Communications. Incredible. I know. Oh my gosh.
• 4:22
  I didn't realize that was a bucket list item, but it is. Yeah. Yeah. And it's one that I'm glad we're checking off. But, you know, I said that and they looked at me stunned and they're like, are you kidding?
• 4:34
  I said, no, let's go look at the suite. And we walked in and they were just in fact, one of my staff members said, Catherine, I'm over the moon. I can't wait to be here. And so now that we're in this space, it's just so, like, pinch me moment.
• 4:49
  Rachel Gorman: Oh my gosh. Yeah.
• 4:50
  Catherine Ripley: So you witnessed that, that moment Yeah. When John Rooks from Parkland was up on stage and announcing that Simplicity Communications is taking, you know, this iconic space.
• 5:00
  Rachel Gorman: Well, and it's so cool because we were there. I was at that breakfast because John was a featured panelist on the Greens Breakfast Panel and because of the work he's doing in Muskegon Oh my god. But as it relates to the lakeshore, which is super relevant to the conversation we're gonna have about the interconnection between Muskegon and Grand Rapids and West Michigan as a whole. So yeah. Well and
• 5:19
  Catherine Ripley: then you found out that I'm from Muskegon. I was Born in Muskegon Hospital. Love. Lived there for 5 years on Collins Avenue. And then then we moved to or actually, Ferriesburg.
• 5:30
  Rachel Gorman: Okay. I mean,
• 5:31
  Catherine Ripley: the Van Wagner exit area, Harvey. It used to be called Harvey's Bowling Alley. It's not even that kind of a building anymore. But when I was growing up, I lived in Fairiesburg. We had a spring like address.
• 5:42
  Rachel Gorman: Okay. And
• 5:43
  Catherine Ripley: I went to Grand Haven High. Right. Talk about Tri Cities. Right? Right.
• 5:46
  But, you know, that was kind of a moment when we, I was telling you that I have this business that's 18 years old and I come from Muskegon and you're like, oh my gosh, how did that journey happen? So I have this soft spot for Muskegon.
• 6:01
  Rachel Gorman: Right.
• 6:01
  Catherine Ripley: Because, my aunt Jackie, her name is Joan, but we always call her aunt Jackie. Joan Rapp is the clerk of Eccleston Township.
• 6:09
  Rachel Gorman: Which is where I grew up, which is even more crazy about this connection because when I tell people I'm from Muskegon, I live in the city of Muskegon right now, but, you know, so I say East Muskegon, which there's a east part of the city, but Muskegon County has 7 different local municipalities. And most people have no like, if you say Egleston, which oh.
• 6:27
  Catherine Ripley: No idea.
• 6:28
  Rachel Gorman: So the fact then that you were like, oh my my aunt is the township. I'm like, you know where I grew up, which is so cool.
• 6:36
  Catherine Ripley: Isn't this a typical West Michigan? You know, it's so typical when you meet somebody. This happens a lot in a group called Inforum, where you'll meet somebody new and all of a sudden you start connecting these dots. And it's like this past friend that is like, oh my gosh, you know, so it was such an amazing day. And then to have all these connections come together, it's been pretty cool.
• 6:57
  Rachel Gorman: Yeah.
• 6:57
  Catherine Ripley: So let's talk a little bit about your journey in becoming president and CEO of the Muskegon Lakeshore Chamber of Commerce. Sure. Because boy, there's a lot there. And really what drew you to that role? Mhmm.
• 7:09
  Thank you
• 7:10
  Rachel Gorman: for having me here and asking because I do, I found hearing others and yours, especially to career journeys, is just not only inspirational, but you learn so much. And there's so many takeaways, so I appreciate the opportunity, to share my story. And if it can put someone on a path maybe they weren't on before or inspire them to think differently about their career aspirations, again, I'm just super grateful for the opportunity. So so, yeah, I grew up in Eagleson Township, so that's the eastern part of Muskegon County. And I I'm starting there because it is relevant to how I got Yeah.
• 7:42
  To where I am now. But went to Ogert High School, which is a small public school. We were the large class at a 121 kids. So right. Like, growing up in this environment where everybody knows everything, and I joke now that, you know, I'll never know if it was, like, the angst of, right, being 18 and wanting to get out into the world.
• 8:00
  But where our community was, and I say our community, I mean, Muskegon was in 2010 when I graduated, was not the most desirable location. And so having grown up in Muskegon, I was really feeling these repercussions of not only just the significant recession our country was going through, but a real change in what our base industry in Muskegon County looked like. So historical manufacturing and the changes that were happening, but then more specifically that you understand our community in the early 2000 late nineties, early 2000, the destruction of the mall that was in downtown Muskegon. So for those that don't know, Western Avenue is really the main course of downtown Muskegon right now. When I was a little child, I have very fuzzy memories, that whole area was actually a covered mall.
• 8:44
  Yeah. And so I have some very, again, fuzzy memories of going there for Christmas, Christmas, and, like, how does he know my shirt is pink? And then that's kind of where those memories stop. And then flash forward to when my parents would take us downtown or my sister was a dancer going to the Ferro and Thal, just remembering sand piles around downtown. And I remember thinking, like, where are we gonna park?
• 9:06
  Yeah. And so there was this transformation that began that I was not aware of then from that time. And so when I graduated high school in 2010, the building I work in now was a year old. And I remember seeing like, oh, downtown looks different, but still had this years of like, I gotta get out of this town. There's nothing happening here.
• 9:24
  You know, just mentality. And so I left and, you know, I thought I wanted to be a pharmacist, and I was terrible at chemistry and all. So, like, that wasn't gonna work out. But my, you know, my work style then and still relevant now, like, I, you know, plan the work and work the plan. So coming crashing down to, like, that's not gonna be my career.
• 9:41
  Like, what do I do? No problems though. Coming home, going to Mesquite and Community College while I figure that out. And my mom, you know, kind of casually mentioned, like, you should go to school to be an event coordinator. And I was like, I don't think you go to school for that.
• 9:54
  She was like, no, really, Rachel. Think about, like, your high school, like, what you were interested in. But, like, you have this, you know, gift of, like, rallying people to, like, get behind a cause. Like, this is so much more of who you are than, you know, other opportunities. So at that point, I knew I was gonna finish my degree at Grand Valley.
• 10:10
  That was really important. And, like, sometimes things just happen where thank goodness Grand Valley has an amazing hospitality and tourism management program. I'm an alumni too. Oh my gosh. I did not know this.
• 10:19
  Catherine Ripley: Yes. And I went to Muskegon Community College. My first class at Muskegon Community College was French.
• 10:24
  Rachel Gorman: Oh, my gosh.
• 10:25
  Catherine Ripley: Yep. Oh, we took a semester?
• 10:27
  Rachel Gorman: Yep. Yep. So teachers That's how funny. No. This is this is so West Michigan.
• 10:31
  So so then you know. So that program, at least at that time, really was heavy on internship experience because of the nature of the field, like making sure graduates are graduating with this experience and, like, really bought into, like, yes, this is exactly what I wanna do. So I had to do 3 internships. And then I was in the middle of my second one working at Pines and Courts. Oh, actually, I was at Pines and Courts, but also interning at Muskegon Community College.
• 10:55
  And my boss at the college at the time left a postcard on my desk for it was what was then called the summer intern meet and greet, hosted by the Muskegon Lake Shore Chamber of Commerce. So it was a free event for summer interns to come to the chamber to meet each other, but then to also get a trolley ride around Muskegon. And I remember thinking, I should go to this. I really don't wanna go to this because I don't know anybody. But also, like, I don't need a trolley ride around my hometown, like, you know, but there was that little voice.
• 11:24
  I think it was one of those moments where something in your gut was like, I gotta do this. I don't know why I gotta do this. So I went, and one was just baffled by other younger interns in there. I'm like, where are all of you? Which was the point of this event to gather us and kind of get this like confirmation like, oh, there are other college aged people here, you know, looking for internship opportunities.
• 11:47
  And then we went on this trolley tour and there's a candid photo. That's what it's so funny now. So we get on the trolley and the person greeting us on the way to trolley, his name is Jonathan Seifer. He was then our downtown manager. He is now our city manager.
• 12:01
  So meeting him for the first time, but then having this trolley tour of downtown and then over to the Lake Shore to Pere Marquette and just seeing a young professional like Jonathan's like so excited of like, here's a transformation that's been happening in Mesquite and here's some cool things to do while you're here, while you're working the summer. And I just remember being baffled like, is this where I grew up? Because I it was like seeing my community through totally different eyes. So that was incredible. And then it just so happened then that this event ended at a business after hours that the chamber was hosting and it was the inaugural year of the chamber's Future 15 awards.
• 12:36
  So that's 15 up and coming young professionals under 8 40 being recognized for excelling in the workplace, but also giving back to their community. So then I'm at this event like there's a ton of people here and there are young people being recognized for being excited, you know, about working here and giving back to the community. So all these right little things were aligned up like this is not the Muskegon, right, that I was growing up and couldn't sprint far away enough from. So at that point too, I was interested in my final internship at the Muskegon Lake Shore Chamber of Commerce. So I met, Cece Riley, who was the Chamber's Communications Director at that time and it was her internship opportunity.
• 13:14
  So I went on to interview here and she hired me And then I was her marketing and events intern, the fall of that year. So still at Grand Valley at this point. And I was loving chamber work. It was just so exciting. 1, to be planning these business focused events, but it's our members, these business owners that I got to meet.
• 13:31
  And not just get to meet, but they were so interested in like, hey, what are you going to school for? What are you interested in? Like, here's my contact information. Reach out if I can ever be helpful. I'm just totally blown away by that culture.
• 13:43
  And it wasn't abnormal. I mean, like so many of our members still offer those kindnesses today. And that's what I think is so special about business owners in West Michigan. So mid that internship, Cindy Larson, who was the former Muskegon Lake Shore Chamber of Commerce President, just kind of asked like, hey, you know, like we really like you being here. Would you be interested in working at our front desk part time?
• 14:04
  And I'm like, yes, that sounds great. Until I kept working on the front desk, which also then provided this kind of crash course in Muskegon because people call the chamber for everything. Whether that's like what time is the farmer's market open? Where's this business? So then it was kind of nice for me to have this natural way of like getting caught up on my community of like, oh, I didn't know we had this or wait.
• 14:23
  I forgot we have Michigan Adventures. I forgot we have this amazing luge. Right? And, you know, sometimes just stars align. So the event director at the chamber at that time, who I worked closely with, was ready to retire.
• 14:33
  And so she talked to Cindy and was like, hey, I'm ready to go. And I think we have a wonderful candidate that could fill this role. So by the end of that semester, yeah, Cindy just sat down offering me opportunities to, you know, like, we've got some time with you. Are you interested in working here full time? And I remember not saying yes to the moment, going home to talk to my parents about it.
• 14:50
  I'm like, hey, they're offering me this job. I don't know. And my parents very, you know, polite. They were kinda like, well, I don't see why you wouldn't say yes to a full time job. Like it's your decision.
• 15:01
  But looking back now, I think my hang up was I wanted to leave Muskegon. I wanted to at least go to Grand Rapids or go to Chicago, you know? So I said yes, but all this kind of flux time of still finishing up my degree and then knowing full time. I took advantage of the members that had offered, right, to give me their insights and taking advantage of hearing how did you get to where you are? And so many themes of these stories were, I grew up in Muskegon, I left to go to a different part of the country.
• 15:31
  And I realized the life I was chasing and the life I wanted my family to grow up in and where I wanted to thrive in my next stage of career was in Muskegon. There's things in West Michigan that are available that aren't in other parts of the world. And so I'm so grateful still that so many of them just kind of said like, Hey, you can go and chase the stream. You're never gonna have the opportunity though to have the impact on your hometown like you are right now if you stick around.
• 15:57
  Catherine Ripley: You know, that's it's just so cool to hear your story because coming from Muskegon myself, and I did go off and was in different parts. My first daughter was born in Virginia Beach, Virginia. My ex husband was in the Navy. And then my other daughter was born in Newport, Rhode Island. And then I came back to Muskegon after 4 years.
• 16:17
  And so I've seen this view of West Michigan for sure. But even, you know, throughout my 18 years of my company, we do a lot of traveling for conferences and, you know, some of the service providers. And Michigan, you know, when I tell people I'm from Michigan, the first thing I get, oh, it's cold. Like, even in the summer, oh, it's cold up there. And it's like, we have 4 seasons, and it's pretty amazing.
• 16:43
  But, you know, this Pure Michigan campaign is it's so relevant because there's so many facets to Michigan, whether it's the lakeshore, whether it's Grand Rapids, which I call that a mini Chicago, because we're just so We have so many diverse restaurants, the art prize, along the lakeshore, we were talking a little bit about, I grew up in Grand Haven, the Grand Haven Beach versus the diamond of a Muskegon Beach. There's always parking. You're never, when you go to Grand Haven Beach, it's like quite fine parking.
• 17:14
  Rachel Gorman: Right.
• 17:15
  Catherine Ripley: But so much to offer, that massive restaurant running
• 17:20
  Rachel Gorman: down there. Off the deck. It's amazing. Yeah.
• 17:22
  Catherine Ripley: It's like we went there and I'm like, oh my gosh, just to navigate that with the boardwalk. And we did this little boat ride where we went out and watched the sunset cruise and come back. It was a couple of hours and it was amazing. And, you know, there's so much that is offered in Muskegon. And I think that in my experience, I was the 1st child to go to college Okay.
• 17:45
  In my family. And so I was kind of blazing a trail to, you know, how do I make a career? And my sister and my brother have since gone to Grand Valley as well and have their own, careers. But I really felt responsible for like, what do I wanna do with my life? And I think that there's a lot of young people that are lost because they don't know what they wanna do.
• 18:09
  And it's okay to start something and take a class. I mean, I think the average college student changes their major 3 or 4 times.
• 18:16
  Rachel Gorman: Oh my gosh. Yeah.
• 18:17
  Catherine Ripley: So to hear you say, oh, I thought I was gonna do this. And then, oh my gosh, what am I gonna do? I didn't start my business until I was 39. Sure. So I really didn't find my calling Mhmm.
• 18:27
  Until I had several careers. And even when I went to Grand Valley, I was a non traditional student. So I had my 2 daughters. I would go to school during the day. I'd waitress at night and I did a major and 2 minors in three and a half years.
• 18:43
  And I mean, one semester I had 26 credit hours.
• 18:46
  Rachel Gorman: Oh my gosh.
• 18:46
  Catherine Ripley: I had a seminar of 2 credit hours. I had an internship of 6, and then I had an 18 credit hour class load. Because I was a single mom. I was I needed to get to my career in a paycheck. Mhmm.
• 18:59
  And I think that I started in computers. I didn't know what I wanted to do, but I ended up international relations and French and Japanese were the languages that I studied because I knew I wanted to do Yeah. Something international. But I think that a message to to any, certainly, you know, West Michigan, you know, Muskegon Lake Shore kids, just start. Yeah.
• 19:22
  Just you can change your world.
• 19:24
  Rachel Gorman: I totally agree.
• 19:25
  Catherine Ripley: You can change your path.
• 19:26
  Rachel Gorman: Mhmm.
• 19:27
  Catherine Ripley: And even if you're not sure, take some classes, figure out what you're interested in, take some assessments, and really understand what are my strengths and weaknesses, because we all have them. And then just let your let the opportunities come because in your case, they did. Right. They do. They will.
• 19:44
  You know, the connections that you meet, you're gonna meet somebody that can help you. Right. But you have to show up and be prepared. And it's not gonna be easy. You know, my journey has been a lot about courage and grit.
• 19:57
  Right. You know, just working behind. Which is so Michigan too. Oh, my God. Isn't it?
• 20:02
  Isn't it? Totally. And so I'd love hearing our similar paths of getting to where we feel what our place is. And, you know, hopefully, kids that are listening that are in high school or college that they just dive in and take chances. And Yeah.
• 20:21
  Because I think, you know, the regrets are just the risks you don't take. Right?
• 20:24
  Rachel Gorman: Right. Well, and it is totally about the journey, not the destination. And I think you and I are like, we haven't arrived. We are here for the journey. To your point, I think younger people, it's the fixation on like, how am I going to get where?
• 20:40
  But like not enough of us saying like, you should enjoy the ride. Right. Because that's where the magic happens. And that's where, to your point, doors are going to open that weren't available before. And if you're not looking at those, you're going to miss it.
• 20:54
  Catherine Ripley: So Rachel, it's so funny. You know, people think, well, what's your degree in? Well, international relations and Japanese and French. And they're like and you're the phone guy? You sound technology.
• 21:04
  Right? And but when you really peel it back, 18 years in business, I'm, we're in our 19th year right now. We have an office here in Grand Rapids, and then we have an office in Salt Lake City, Utah. We have an office in in Ohio and in Dallas. Okay?
• 21:25
  So we want my 42 page growth plan of my company has about a dozen locations around the US and 5 international locations.
• 21:35
  Rachel Gorman: Yeah.
• 21:35
  Catherine Ripley: So it's taken me a long time. You know, I graduated in 1996 from Grand Valley, and here I am all these years later, that international piece is potentially coming to fruition.
• 21:49
  Rachel Gorman: Oh, probably more relevant than ever.
• 21:51
  Catherine Ripley: Exactly. So, I mean, I think the message is follow your passion. I was very passionate, but I didn't know. I had this faith of, I wanna do international. I love the French language.
• 22:02
  I feel home when I'm in Paris.
• 22:04
  Rachel Gorman: Right. You know,
• 22:05
  Catherine Ripley: it's just a home feeling, but I didn't know how I was gonna do that in business. And when I first graduated from Grand Valley, I did it so fast and so quick, not quick enough though, but Sure. Never. As quick as I could. Right.
• 22:17
  I said, what do I do now? Well, I went and got a job at Amway in the international PR department, and I had an amazing, amazing mentor there. Her name was Judy Jones, and she was just brilliant. She was the manager of the international PR department. And I just learned from her.
• 22:35
  And what could I take? What little nuggets can I take? And then I moved into a German company called SUSPA Incorporated, and I worked with them for a few years. And so each one of my stories that I had from those chapters, it all kind of builds into the tools that I use today. And your point of it's not, there's no destination.
• 22:56
  Even my company, it's not a destiny. It's like where I'm taking it, it's just gonna be constantly in motion. And when we meet some of the goals that we have of our big growth plan, there'll just be new goals beyond that. Right. So kids need to just try, work hard, prepare yourself.
• 23:15
  And if you're not sure, find a mentor, find somebody that's done it. Mhmm. And ask them for coffee, ask them for lunch, and just say, you know, let them tell you their story. And then you're gonna come out of that with maybe some nuggets that you could go, well, what if I tried that?
• 23:32
  Rachel Gorman: Right. And you just never know where your paths are gonna cross again. And I love I love talking to high school students, college students. But to your point, it's like take advantage of the opportunities. And, you know, when I was at Grand Valley, we had speakers come in all the time.
• 23:48
  And it is the little things like, hey, if they gave you their business cards, send a little email and say thank you. I'm shocked by the number that do, but it really differentiates them from the sea of students I spoke. And like those little things are the building blocks then to you know where down the line, and it has happened. I've students are now graduates reach out. It's like, this is so cool that we you stood out from that crowd, like, but you did you did that.
• 24:13
  Not I didn't ask you to do that. So, yeah, just those little reminders, I think, for younger people or people in their careers not like, don't forget those little touches Mhmm. Can make the biggest difference. And then especially in West Michigan For sure. It can make most incredible difference sometime of someone later on, in your career that might have an influence on positive change.
• 24:33
  Catherine Ripley: Yeah, absolutely. It's all about that. You know, it really is. So what excites you most about working with the Muskegon Lake Shore community?
• 24:41
  Rachel Gorman: Right now so the people, we our members, they're just the most incredible. And every day, even on tough days, I come home and I'm like, I just love my job. And that is such a such a dream, right? And it is. It's still hard work.
• 24:54
  There are still things that are tough. But knowing that we have this incredible vision as an organization of where we're going and being very clear of what our chamber does for our community. We like to say in the chamber industry, like when you've seen 1 chamber, you've seen 1 chamber. So like, we are not the Convention and Visitors Bureau. We have an amazing Convention and Visitors Bureau in Muskegon, right?
• 25:14
  But some smaller, especially Muskegon communities, their chamber may do both. We are here to serve the business community. We are here to support economic development and make our community a premier destination along the lakeshore. So that is, I mean, sprints me out of bed every day and just so excited to work with these business owners that now and that's, you know, kind of what we're talking about, have known me since I was 21. Right.
• 25:38
  And along the way have really helped support me and offer mentorship in different ways. And, you know, so when I was at the chamber, the first time I was there for about 4 years, and you know, kind of reached that point that you have to listen yourself to know, like, I have I'm really proud of the work I've done, but I can feel like it's time for something new. And being at the chamber before and around so many business owners and taking advantage of their mentorship, just again, this desire of, like, feel like I need to invest in myself and, you know, acquire some more education. So I was really motivated to get my MBA and but that came from mentorship of Mhmm. You know, if you wanna go higher, like, yeah, there are some additional things that you're gonna wanna learn.
• 26:18
  But again, who the access to information and others you're gonna meet. So I'm still very appreciative of those that push me like, also do it now before your life gets busy. I was, you know, single, not married and no kids. Right? And so I was like, Yeah, what?
• 26:32
  There's not a reason not to do it now. But even like throughout that journey, I'm in my current job, but my little little joke, my little side stand is, I serve as commissioner at large in the city of Muskegon as well. And throughout the campaign process of that, who showed up for me? So many of these owners, right, that have like, I've seen you, I know that you love our community and you're going to tackle another opportunity to serve your community. Like, of course, I'm gonna support you.
• 26:57
  And that, like, looking back is just Wow. So incredible. But it wouldn't have happened, right, if I would have saw that postcard of my desk and I'm like, yeah,
• 27:04
  Catherine Ripley: I don't wanna go. That one little thing, that fork in the road, and you never, you know, who would have guessed it? But I think that what I'm really hearing, and it's been true in my experience in my career, is mentorship and sponsorship.
• 27:18
  Rachel Gorman: Yes.
• 27:18
  Catherine Ripley: So when I get people that put their resume in Yeah. In front of me and want a job, You know, honestly, the resume isn't what I'm focusing on. I'm focused on extracurricular activities. What are you volunteering for? Because that takes ambition Right.
• 27:34
  And drive Right. To volunteer. But also, do you have mentors? Right. Do you are you mentoring anyone?
• 27:41
  Like even young people can mentor people younger than them. Absolutely. So a college student mentoring them, a high school. So there's no excuse for, well, I'm too young to mentor anyone. Nope.
• 27:51
  There's always the hands going both directions. Yeah. And so I think that, you know, we see that in our career and our journey, how important utilizing those opportunities and resources are. And, you know, kids just have to ask. Right.
• 28:07
  They have to have the courage to say, can I talk to you? And I think that that's that's been significant for both of our careers.
• 28:14
  Rachel Gorman: I think so. And I think one thing you and I have talked about too, especially women in leadership, I'm super grateful for those mentorships. Because women in particular that have were able to articulate to me the seasons of life that you might be in. And I'm truly talking about when I was in my 20s, you know, knowing I wanted children sometime in my life, but already being overwhelmed of like, well, am I gonna have to put my career aside? Mhmm.
• 28:39
  And I'm so grateful for this. I was like, no, do not do that. But also be realistic of there's going to be times in your life where it's just there's going to be a crunch and you're going to feel it. But so many incredible women that were early in the retirement and retirement like I'm in a season of life now, though, where I have more capacity to give. And so know that your current is not forever.
• 28:59
  So now as a mom, I'm so grateful that I don't have I don't feel like this burden of, like, can I do it all? No. I'm like, I'm doing exactly what I want to do. There's no guilt of pushing on my career because I know now is the time I want to sprint and also balancing out, like, when I can to be home with my 10 month old son. Right?
• 29:19
  Right. Right. And I'm so and I think if I didn't have those mentors early in my twenties to set me up for that, I would be a totally different person right now.
• 29:27
  Catherine Ripley: Yeah.
• 29:28
  Rachel Gorman: And I'm so grateful for those women that spoke to that to me when I needed it. That but also that I was open to hearing that and seeing that information.
• 29:35
  Catherine Ripley: Well, and I think technology has really afforded us the ability to work remote, or if somebody's sick and you gotta work from home, you can still be productive, but Right. But, you know, be where you're supposed to be to. Right. So how has your role evolved as you've led the chamber through some big changes Yes. In in Muskegon?
• 29:55
  And I was telling you that I love the slogan, watch Muskegon grow. Right? Watch Muskegon go. Watch us go. And that was so creative.
• 30:04
  Yes. So talk a little bit about how your role has evolved.
• 30:07
  Rachel Gorman: Well, so I've officially been in the role since October 7th, which these last two months have been incredible. But also I feel like because I was given such an incredible transition, we worked the plan. It went exactly how we had hoped. So we were very strategic about it. We being the chamber board of directors because that's who I report to.
• 30:26
  So they hired me as the chief operating officer in August of last year with the intention of we'll have this year long transition that I had with Cindy. So to have a whole year with her of learning those things that come up with like, oh, this is how we handle this and this is what you do. So it was a very seamless handoff. And I think our members have felt that and have communicated to me like this was incredible. And also again, just the members that we have that them themselves are in these leadership transitions to be able to see like, I can make this work.
• 30:58
  I can be empowered to help choose my successor and make sure my business that I've poured my life into is going to be in good hands. So nurtured
• 31:06
  Catherine Ripley: and taken care of.
• 31:07
  Rachel Gorman: Absolutely. But taking the time right to find someone that aligns with that vision and knows it's going to look different. But you know, your core values of your company are gonna carry on. So super grateful for that. But, yeah, so managing what I, you know, I've been asked like what do you think, you know, are the biggest challenges you see coming in?
• 31:24
  And it's managing growth. It's managing the growth of our community. It's managing the leadership growth for so many of our companies. And I feel super honored already to kind of be like the team captain of like our new leadership happening in Mesquite. And it's not just young leadership.
• 31:37
  I'm talking about leadership across the board, but being able to step in and share like here's the legacy of your company as it relates to our chamber. And I'm looking forward to how you're going to, you know, continue that path. But, like, your own unique mark you're gonna make on that. Mhmm. But then balancing where our community is going.
• 31:53
  So like you said, the Watch Muskegon campaign, that campaign is actually turning 10 years old in May, and I can't believe it. And having been there when it was revealed and, you know, what was important at that time, we had 3 pillars of the campaign, and it was the marketing promotion. So getting Watch Muskegon out there, we made that logo open source so people could grab it and add their kind of unique, you know, stint on it, but also promoting that like Watch Muskegon because things are changing. There was an education portion of it. So developing a Muskegon STARS program to get people empowered and informed about all these amazing great community assets that for those of us that grew up in West Michigan, it's like we knew, but like when you learn about it in a classroom site, it's like, oh my gosh.
• 32:32
  This is an amazing place. And then beautification just promoting how beautiful the lakeshore is and looking at areas of opportunity in our community where municipalities from all over Muskegon can come to opportunity in our community where municipalities from all over Muskegon can come together and kinda really own their part of Muskegon and showing it off. It's great. And so, yeah, we're at this really cool point now of, like, okay, watch is 10 years old. It's a really great marketing campaign.
• 32:52
  And it's funny that we're talking about Pure Michigan. Dave Lorenz, our former executive, who led Pure Michigan. He lives in Orange Shores in Muskegon, which is amazing.
• 33:00
  Catherine Ripley: Mhmm. Of course.
• 33:01
  Rachel Gorman: But Dave has told us, you know, like, when you have something very special like Watch Muskegon, like, don't let it go. Right. Like, keep there's a way to keep it alive. And so just that committee again, we're looking at there's still opportunity in Muskegon. So we're really excited to talk about what the immediate needs are in the next 10 years, 5 years.
• 33:19
  So to kinda reveal, like, this next phase of watch. So stay tuned. We have some news on that. But that like, that's the work that it's so great that I get to help lead, but also it's in the response of our chamber members that are like, yes. This is important to us.
• 33:33
  Because for them, it is about talent and retraction in this competitive market where so many, you know, are looking for really great talent to fill these open positions at their company. Mhmm. What's been cool is that Muskegon is part of the conversation because to your point, the technology and the remote working capabilities, these remote workers from all over the world, they're like, well, since I can work anywhere in the world, I would like to live somewhere where it feels like I'm on vacation every day. Yeah. And that's Muskegon, but also has this small town charm of we all know each other and, like and that, a human connection, right, is what I think more than ever people are desiring and having community, and that's what Muskegon has a great opportunity for so many.
• 34:11
  Catherine Ripley: Sounds so exciting. You know, as we were growing up, there were some manufacturers there. My mom worked at a manufacturing right down by the, you know Yeah. The harbor. That's not there anymore.
• 34:21
  But it just sounds so exciting of, you know, opportunities for newer businesses to come in and Absolutely. Small businesses, you know, to come in and and be able to work remote there. Are there any initiatives between, like, Muskegon and Grand Rapids that are significant that you're seeing as part of, you know, pulling in from the the amazing stuff that's happening in Grand Rapids that can help Muskegon?
• 34:42
  Rachel Gorman: Well, from I'll speak first from a chambers perspective, especially in West Michigan, because, you know, it's a niche industry. So we all know each other, but particularly with Muskegon and Grand Rapids, I'm super appreciative of the continued partnership we have between our chambers because we have so many companies that are members of both. Mhmm. So, like, in the chamber world, like, we're not really competition because, like, I'm not pursuing members right in Grand Rapids, but if they come to us, like, sure. But what's unique is just both of our chambers don't look at it that way ever.
• 35:13
  Mhmm. And then we see these opportunities for collaboration with our member companies that have locations in both and are rapidly expanding and looking for opportunities in both. But for them to support their employees from standpoint of, like, I wanna live here but work at this amazing company. Like, they can have it all. And then just leveraging resources, especially when it comes to government affairs and our advocacy work, just more opportunities of the Grand Rapids Chamber offering that support of we know what's important to the lakeshore.
• 35:39
  We know what's important from Muskegon. So when our teams in Lansing laboring for West Michigan, we can speak directly, especially to what's happening in Muskegon. Getting to know our members are like, hey, can you call this manufacturer? Like, if they can show up, that's super great. But beyond that too, we're seeing as the industry base in Muskegon has really shifted from just core manufacturing, this growing tourism industry Mhmm.
• 36:01
  How that relates to Grand Rapids as well. Because the drive from Muskegon to Grand Rapids is not dramatical. I don't know why we act like sometimes have this mental block, right, of like, it's so far. Far. It's no.
• 36:12
  It's really not. And so I'm so grateful for the new faces and families in Grand Rapids that just viewed us like, yeah, we're gonna pop up some skiing. We're gonna go to the beach. We're gonna we're gonna the deck. We're gonna go shopping, you know?
• 36:24
  And so that's been so great to to see that naturally happening. But like having these conversations like, oh wait, what other opportunities are there so we can make that collaboration even stronger. Because it's all about, again, just the people here that make all of us go, knowing that they're living and working in the best place in Michigan, in the country.
• 36:43
  Catherine Ripley: That's what I think
• 36:44
  Rachel Gorman: too. So
• 36:45
  Catherine Ripley: you work with a lot of business leaders of all kinds, different sizes, you know, companies. What leadership traits do you find most important in driving that change in a community?
• 36:56
  Rachel Gorman: I think unique to Muskegon business leaders, it's the call for excellence within their business. And then this added magic, you know, not even 10%, like 50%, they pour back into their community. And it's truly because they're owners like you that care about the people that help make their business go. And I think they were early to realize if my company is going to be successful, that means I care about the people I employ, which means making sure they're living in a community they're very proud of. So going the extra mile and then partnering with the Chamber of, like, okay, how can I support the Chamber to do this work to, you know, redefine Muskegon and do this community leadership work?
• 37:41
  Because we say, you know, it's always like that. Well, someone should do that. It's probably in our community. The chamber is that someone, but we can't do it without our member support. So the leadership qualities that I'm super appreciative of Muskegon County Businesses business owners is just their pride in community, their willingness to lead in their efforts because sometimes things, decisions that need to be made are not always popular because change can feel hard.
• 38:05
  Mhmm. But ultimately, you know, it's good for a community. And, you know, one example, again, 10 year celebration. You know, our farmers market was relocated 10 years ago from a was still within the city of Muskegon, but now it is on an anchor in Western Avenue, and it's the 2nd largest farmers market in the state of Michigan. That was a big, brave decision, though, that if you listen to the noise, it would have been, this is gonna be the death of the farmers market.
• 38:30
  The farmers aren't gonna go. This is gonna ruin our and now, I mean, that's like a what's a perfect day in Muskegon, Saturday morning farmers market day. But we couldn't have done that without the really brave leadership from the business community that sit alongside the chambers and know this is the right thing to do. But also then partnering with our municipal partners also support them of like, you know, they are civic servants that, you know, go with the will of the people. So we're not in it alone.
• 38:54
  Even if you're like, I wanna work by myself. We're all in this together. We need each other and it's a lot easier to work together when we can connect on a human level and know that maybe I'm not gonna agree with you, but I know your intentions are good. I know we're working towards a common goal. We're not seeing eye eye eye in this thing, but overall, we can move forward.
• 39:13
  And I think, to your point, the qualities of, like, leaders, like, that willingness to accept that is super, super important.
• 39:20
  Catherine Ripley: So what inspires you to keep your work and you motivated in in what you're doing to lead the chamber?
• 39:27
  Rachel Gorman: I think what you know, what's so motivating is the personal stories we hear of people that are moving to Muskegon because, you know, their access to Muskegon was maybe going to the deck and seeing this beautiful waterfront community on Lake Michigan and realizing like, wow, this is a cool place. And then coming back, right, and taking advantage of our arts and culture scene. We have incredible art museum downtown and just realizing, like, this is a really special place. But that is, like, so motivating to me of like, okay, if one person, person, you know, had that experience, like how can we impact more? And the ripples of that effect, like what we talked about with into Grand Haven, Spring Lake, Fairsburg, into West Coast, Holland.
• 40:12
  I mean, we're all in it together. And in West Michigan is just such an amazing place to do business, to live. So that's what is so motivating to me of, like, I can see things are going well now, but we're not there yet. And I'm just so excited about what the future looks like. So that's what somewhat of an image to me is like that I have an opportunity to help support the work to get us there.
• 40:34
  Catherine Ripley: Oh, very cool. If you could sit down with 1 or 2 leaders, past or present, who would they be?
• 40:42
  Rachel Gorman: So for sure, Charles Hackley. Charles Hackley, for those who don't know, was a lumberman and was, I think, Muskegon's first millionaire, but he made his wealth the lumbering era. But towards the end of his life, one knew he couldn't take his wealth with him and loved Muskegon and thought, you know, just had this incredible vision to invest in our community for generations to benefit from 100 of years later. But one thing being in this role that I've it's so corny, but like when we're in this work, like say it's like you can feel the spirit of Charles Hackley because he had this vision to know the lumbering era was coming to an end in his lifetime. And that he wouldn't be around to see what was happening.
• 41:27
  But knowing that investment would be critical to help the future of Muskegon. So being very intentional about investing in Muskegon Public Schools, in the arts, in economic development. And there's so much that has happened in Muskegon because of some of the seed money he left that responsible fiduciary responsibility has maintained that his legacy is moving on. So I would die for the opportunity to sit down with him and just kind of like feel like to be able to update him like, here's Muskegon today. Here's what has happened.
• 41:58
  And just, I don't know, see how he feels about I think would just be so special.
• 42:03
  Catherine Ripley: And I think one of our connections there is my uncle Buster, George Rapp. You know, my aunt Jackie's husband. He was, the Hackley Hume home there. He managed, you know, those in terms of, you know, keeping them. Those are just amazing.
• 42:20
  Rachel Gorman: They're beautiful. They're beautiful.
• 42:21
  Catherine Ripley: Yeah, definitely. Anybody traveling to Muskegon should take time to go through them.
• 42:26
  Rachel Gorman: We have Great Lakes cruise ships that dock in Muskegon now. So those are bringing folks from especially southern states like Arizona Right. Where they're just fascinated with the idea of seeing a Great Lake. Mhmm. But they're also great travelers, so they do their homework before they, you know, go to their ports.
• 42:40
  And we've heard from some passengers that are like, you know, we're really sure about Muskegon. And then it ended up being our favorite one because of these, like the Heclihun Homes, the art museums, like the arts and culture. I always chuckle too because, you know, when I run into them, you know, it's like, hey, you know, your chamber of president, right? How can I help? Whatever.
• 42:58
  But early days, some of these pastors are like, It's so clean here. I'm like, Oh, that's so nice.
• 43:04
  Catherine Ripley: That's crazy.
• 43:05
  Rachel Gorman: That was such a fun, fun one. Yeah.
• 43:07
  Catherine Ripley: Oh, very cool. You know, I want to wrap up with what's a book or a podcast or resource that you want to share with the audience that you think has been impactful? And then I'll share mine with you.
• 43:17
  Rachel Gorman: Yeah. I was thinking there's not anything in particular, but what I want to say and what I think is important is just, you know, locally, statewide, nationally, more than ever, finding a balance outlet, news outlet, and just hearing both sides and using my brain, right, to make my own opinions and decisions based on that research. I think that's because of technology too. Sometimes in a different way, we're able to segment and get the content we want so much that I think it's important as leaders to take a minute to look beyond that and hear the whole picture before to help us inform us and making the best decision moving forward for our companies, for our community. So that's really just absorbing as much content I can, but also from a balanced perspective.
• 44:02
  Catherine Ripley: Yeah, for sure. I think it's important for continuing education, you know, whether it's in little snippets of a 10 minute TED talk or if it's a book that you're reading. I know at our company, we read quite a bit of Patrick Lencioni, the ideal team player being hungry, humble, and smart. Mhmm. When anybody starts at the company, I give them that book and have them read because I want them to understand our core values and what's driving us because we can be very different individuals.
• 44:29
  Right. But you gotta have some core values that are shared so that you can drive towards those goals. Yeah. Absolutely. So do you have any advice that you'd give to young professionals or aspiring business leaders for the Lakeshore region?
• 44:42
  Rachel Gorman: Yeah. I think especially for young professionals, you know, what we've been saying is seek a mentor, but also speak up. And, you know, for me, you know, being at the chamber very young in my career, but moving on to the careers I had before coming back, I always stayed in touch with Cindy Larson. She will always be a mentor to me. Knowing that she was going to retire someday, right?
• 45:04
  There was something that just clicked and I remember just tossing and turning when I and coming to this realization that like, if I never tell Cindy I'm interested in that job someday, I can't be mad when someone else gets it. I had no idea that it would put me on the path that it did, which included that in an interview and dah dah dah. But I tell that to young people, especially like, if you never speak up or ask for what you want, it's not really fair then to be upset that you didn't get it. So especially women in leadership, I think it's just important to remember, like, we have a voice that is equal at every table and you should use it. But because be not using it, it's just silly.
• 45:45
  So always being clear about, you know, what you're working towards and why is I think a super powerful leadership lesson that has benefited me and I think is something everyone can appreciate.
• 45:57
  Catherine Ripley: And don't be afraid to know. Oh gosh. If you throw it if you have the courage to say I'm interested, and the answer is no, number 1, a no is just not yet. Yes. Not really no.
• 46:06
  Rachel Gorman: Absolutely. Absolutely. I think about that all the time with personal things, work things, but Mhmm. It's always more comforting to know the no because you ask and not wonder What would have happened?
• 46:16
  Catherine Ripley: What if. What if. Right? Those regrets. Right?
• 46:19
  So, Rachel, thank you so much for being here. Where can listeners learn a little bit more about what's happening at the Muskegon Lakeshore Chamber of Commerce?
• 46:27
  Rachel Gorman: Yeah. Or
• 46:27
  Catherine Ripley: and maybe even getting involved?
• 46:28
  Rachel Gorman: Yes. We would love to help anyone get involved. So our website for the chamber is muskeganot org, and then our social media handles are at Muskegon Lakeshore Chamber. Thanks for asking. Thank you so much for having me.
• 46:40
  Catherine Ripley: Oh, it's been a pleasure. I love hearing about that. I love, you know, just having that personal connection and kind of knowing and seeing how far it's coming, you know, we can make an impact. Well, I'm just
• 46:51
  Rachel Gorman: excited to cheer for you. And just please let me know how we can be helpful.
• 46:54
  Catherine Ripley: Oh, thank you so much. Thank you for listening to Simplicity Conversations. Be sure to subscribe, leave a review, and visit us at the simple podcast.com to connect and learn more about inspiring leaders like Rachel Gorman. Thank you, and see you next time.