Latest / Beyond The Horizon / Murder In Moscow: DNA, Cell Data & a Crumbling Defense

Transcript

Murder In Moscow: DNA, Cell Data & a Crumbling Defense · Beyond The Horizon

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: What's up, everyone, and welcome back to the program. Now,
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: I don't know if you've heard or not, but there
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: has been quite the document dump up in Moscow. And
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: as part of that document dump, we've already been through
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: some of the different orders that have been rendered by
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: Judge Hippler. And over the next few days, we're going
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: to dive into the transcripts from the IGG hearing as well.
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: But before we get there, why don't we dive into
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: this article from the Daily Mail and get an overall
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: look at what's currently going on up in Moscow. And
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: to do that, we have an article from the Daily Mail. Headline,
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: Bombshell Brian Koberger Court Filing Says Relative Refused to Hand
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: Over DNA. This article was authored by Rachel Sharp. A
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: relative of Brian Koberger refused to help investigators as they
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: worked to identify the suspect in the brutal murders of
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: four University of Idaho students, it has been revealed. Hell
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: of a person, huh? Nah, I'm not going to give
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: you any DNA. My relative's such a scumbag that I'm
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: so scared to give this DNA over because I think
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: he'll get nailed. I mean, what? Imagine somebody showing up
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: at your pad talking about four kids have been murdered
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: and we need some help. We're wondering if we can
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: get some DNA to see if your cousin Joe was involved.
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: That's some wild work. I would think that people would
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: want to get to the bottom of what happened. And honestly,
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: if you know your relative and you think that they're
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: a good person, you want to make sure that they're
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: not caught up in this, right? Sure, let me help out.
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: But no, I guess not. The distant family member, who
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: has not been named, was contacted by Idaho State Police
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: in November or December of 2022 and asked to hand
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: over DNA, according to newly unsealed court records. At the time,
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: law enforcement was desperately working to identify the individual whose
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: DNA was found on a knife sheath left under the
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: body of victim Madison Mogan. Koberger was not yet on
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: the radar of police or a suspect in the case.
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: And right here in the third paragraph of this article
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: is what it all comes down to. The fact that
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: his DNA was found on this knife sheath that was
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: found under a murdered girl. He has no explanation for it.
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: There's no excuse for it. And that's why his team
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: is so adamant about getting this thrown out. They know
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: that this is the path to victory for the prosecution.
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: And not only is it the path to victory, it's
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: strong as hell. We're not talking about a little bit
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: of piecemeal evidence here. We're talking about a lot of
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: evidence that is tied together by the strongest piece of evidence,
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: which is the DNA. So until you can explain that,
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: forget it. Now, you can attack some of the other stuff, right?
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: Of course. You can attack the cell phone records. You
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: can attack the digital records, all of that. But until
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: you can explain how his DNA was found on that
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: knife sheath underneath a dead girl, I really don't want
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: to hear anything else from you, honestly. Now, of course,
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: I don't mean in the courtroom. I'm talking about people
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: who are running around, running their yaps like Brian Kohlberger
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: is an innocent man. because you have to be smoking
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: mushrooms to think that the evidence that they have collected
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: against Kohlberger isn't strong as hell, especially in light of
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: these new rulings by the judge that it's all going
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: to be admitted. Now, if they threw this DNA stuff out,
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: it would be a very, very tough sell, because the
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: rest of this evidence, for the most part, is circumstantial.
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: There is no doubt about it. And if you didn't
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: have the DNA at the crime scene... It would be
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: very difficult for me to sit here and tell you
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: that beyond a reasonable doubt, I think it's Brian Koberger.
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: But that's not where we're at. We're in a position
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: where we've seen court documents now for years. We've heard
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: many stories and we've heard from many sources about Brian
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: Koberger and his activity within the city of Moscow, including
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: going to the Mad Greek where he ran into Maddie. Now,
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: of course, that hasn't been confirmed, but that has been
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: the speculation. That's been the story that's been going around
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: from the beginning. And I believe it 100%. Kohlberger had
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: to run into these girls somewhere, right? Well, bro's a vegan.
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: He's going to the Mad Greek to get himself some food.
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: Sees the girls and boom, here we go. Certainly seems
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: like a plausible scenario to me. Now, of course, I'm
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: open to whatever the evidence says, right? But as of now,
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: that's where I'm at. That's what I think happened. That's
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: where I think he was exposed to these girls. And
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: under my working theory... He became obsessed, and unfortunately, in
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: my opinion, that led directly to the massacre that we
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: saw at 1122 King Road. According to court records, the
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: unnamed relative had previously submitted his own information into a
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: genetic genealogy database, and investigators had found that the suspect
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: was part of the same family tree. But when he
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: was asked to share that information with law enforcement, the
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: relative refused and told authorities to stop contacting him. Hell
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: of a person this relative is, huh? Covering for your
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: alleged murderer. That's nice. Again, we're not talking about somebody
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: who didn't pay their taxes. We're not talking about somebody
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: who might have stole something from the store. We're talking
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: about a quadruple homicide. You're that sure that your relative
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: wasn't part of it after they contact you and say
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: the DNA matches? That's some wild ass work to me
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: and to any of my relatives out there listening. If
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: your dumb ass goes and murders four people, Don't expect
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: me to cover for you, ever. I would think that
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: all decent people draw the line at murder, right? I mean,
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: you would think anyway. The new details about the uphill
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: battle to identify the DNA left behind at the scene
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: of the shocking murders were revealed in a newly unsealed
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: mammoth 175-page partially redacted transcript of a closed-door hearing in
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: the case. And we're going to start getting to that
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: today a little bit, but obviously, considering the length of it,
• 5:36
  Speaker 1: and the other projects I have going on at the
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: same time, we're not going to be able to get
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: all 175 pages done today. So we're going to do
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: a few pages a day until we have the entirety
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: of it into the catalog. But have no fear, we're
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: going to be diving in because it's important that you
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: folks have this information. I don't know how many times
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: I have to say it. I'll save the salacious bullshit
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: for other people. I know that that, you know, gets
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: you all the money, gets you the clicks and the
• 6:01
  Speaker 1: likes and the rest of it, but I don't care
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: about that shit. I care about bringing you the news
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: and the stories as best as I can, as well
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: as I know them. Besides that, whatever else happens, happens.
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: So if people want to talk about, you know, Bigfoot
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: or they want to talk about cartels or whatever the
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: fuck they want to talk about up here in Moscow, hey,
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: they can have at it. But here on the podcast,
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: we're going to be diving deep and we're going to
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: be continuing to do that deep dive into the court
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: documents because that's where the real story is happening. During
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: the hearing held back on January 23rd, 2025, Kohlberger's defense
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: attorney sought to undermine the credibility of investigative genetic genealogy,
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: a method which ultimately led to the arrest of the
• 6:43
  Speaker 1: 30-year-old criminology PhD student. And this is wild work considering Othram,
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: which is the industry standard when it comes to DNA,
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: was the one that was involved in doing this case
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: as well. So are you really going to tell me
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: that Othram had no idea what they were doing and
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: they missed the boat, they screwed up? I don't buy
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: that for a minute. Last week, Atta County Judge Stephen
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: Hippler responded to a series of motions which were argued
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: in the hearing, turning down the defense request to have
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: the critical IgG evidence thrown out of the case and,
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: in turn, dealing a series of blows to Kohlberger's team.
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: A series of blows? We're talking about big-time body shots
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: to the liver. Like no recovery from it. And there's
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: people out there that actually believe that this dude's getting railroaded.
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: It is wild to me to think that anyone could
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: look at what's going on in Moscow and think that
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: Brian Koberger is getting anything but a fair shake. And
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: even with all these things going in his favor, there
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: are still going to be people out there that say
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: that Brian Koberger is getting a raw deal. But the
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: truth is, he's not getting a raw deal, and he's
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: getting treated better than a lot of people in his position.
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: And I've said from the very beginning, the reason this
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: is happening is not because, you know, they want to
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: give him special treatment. It's because they know that there's
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: an appeal on the way, no matter what, and they
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: want to make sure everything's on the up and up
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: for that appeal. So they're going to go through the steps.
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: They're going to jump through the hoops. That way, later on,
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: when Brian Kohlberger goes and cries to the appeals board
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: about how he didn't get a fair shake, well, we
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: all know the deal. We all know the truth. So
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: have no doubt that the prosecution is very much aware
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: of that, and they're looking forward to that occurring. They
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: know what's coming, they know what Brian Kohlberger's team's doing,
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: and they know exactly what sort of strategy is being
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: used by Ann Taylor. She knows she's not going to
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: win this case. They all know that. So they're setting
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: it up for the appeal later on. Just days after
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: the ruling were handed down, the defense team then underwent
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: a major shakeup, bringing on board an attorney known for
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: specializing in forensic DNA evidence. Kohlberger is facing the death
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: penalty if convicted of the murders of Madison Mogan, Kaylee Gonsalves,
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: Zanna Kernodle, and Ethan Chapin. The four University of Idaho
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: students were brutally stabbed to death inside an off-campus home
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: in the college town of Moscow in the early hours
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: of November 13, 2022. Kohlberger, who was a Ph.D. student
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: just over the border at Washington State University at the time,
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: was arrested around six weeks later at his parents' home
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: in Albrightsville, Pennsylvania. A key part of the case against
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: Kohlberger centers on a K-bar knife sheath, which was found
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: underneath Mogan's lifeless body. Touch DNA found on the sheath
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: was found to be a match to the 30-year-old suspect,
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: according to prosecutors. The judge's ruling now paves the way
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: for the state to present this key evidence when the
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: case goes to trial this August. The newly unsealed court
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: transcript reveals new details about the lengthy IgG process and
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: how it ultimately led investigators to hone in on Kohlberger
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: as the alleged mass killer who sent shockwaves across America.
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: Kohlberger's lead public defender Ann Taylor had argued that the
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: evidence should be tossed from the case, claiming the use
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: of IgG violated his constitutional rights and that the state
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: neglected to document its use of the investigative method in
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: the search warrants. So that was their big contention, right?
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: That they didn't put all of this information into the affidavit,
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: that they didn't give all this information over to the judge,
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: over to the magistrate, And because they didn't do that,
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: Brian Kohlberger's constitutional rights were being stepped on. Well, we
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: all know that that's not the case. And we all
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: know that that's not true. Especially now that Judge Hippler
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: has made his ruling. According to witness testimony, the DNA
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: profile on the sheath was identified by November 22, 2022,
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: nine days after the murders. But both the Idaho State
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: Police Crime Lab and Forensic DNA Lab, OTHRUM, were unable
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: to determine who it belonged to. Matthew Gemetti, the Laboratory
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: Systems Director for Idaho State Police Forensic Services, testified in
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: the January 23rd hearing that Othram found several individuals that
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: had the potential to be of interest in this investigation.
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: He testified that the lab recommended police contact these individuals,
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: described only as four brothers, to see if they would
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: contribute information into the database that they were using in
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: order to further the family tree building and further the
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: geological work. The brothers did not have the last name
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: Kohlberger and, as Gamet testified, really had nothing to do
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: with anything in the case. Idaho State Police Detective Vicky
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: Gooch tracked down one of the brothers, Gamet testified. The
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: brother was believed to have previously submitted his information into
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: a genealogical database and was asked to put his DNA
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: into a database that law enforcement would then be able
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: to search. The man was skeptical of Gooch's request, so
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: Gamet said he joined a second call between Gooch and
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: the man for purposes of trying to validate this was
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: indeed a law enforcement investigation. This was indeed a legitimate request. Now,
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: that's a little different. I didn't realize that the guy
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: wasn't somebody related to Kohlberger, like, directly. So, yeah, if
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: somebody showed up and they were like, you have a
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: cousin named Bombino who is... Maybe, you know, involved in
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: a murder. Can we get your DNA? I don't know
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: how quick I turned it over. I was thinking that
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: maybe it was like a first cousin, shared last name,
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: that kind of thing, right? Because you show up and
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: somebody has the last name Cappucci and they're my relative
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: and you're looking at them for murder. Yep. Where do
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: I sign up? Where do you swab me? Let's get
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: this show on the road. But this is kind of
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: a different situation, honestly. You don't even share a last name.
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: You don't know the dude. I could see why somebody
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: would be reticent to hand over their info here. but
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: the man refused. At that point, that individual requested not
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: to be contacted again, was not interested in participating, Gamet testified.
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: On around December 10th, the FBI took over from Othram,
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: and following its own investigation of the DNA found at
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: the scene, the Bureau was able to identify Kohlberger as
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: someone investigators should look into. Moscow Police Detective Brett Payne,
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: who was assigned lead investigator on the case, testified in
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: the hearing. that the first time he had heard Kohlberger's
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: name was December 19, 2022, during a call with the FBI.
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: While Taylor sought to argue that the use of IGG
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: was intentionally left out of the affidavit used to obtain
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: search warrants in the case, Payne insisted that the IGG
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: evidence was only a tip from the FBI to look
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: into Kohlberger. And so this is where a lot of
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: people have a problem, right? They think that the FBI
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: was cutting corners here, And they might have stepped on
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: Kohlberger's constitutional rights, but I don't agree. And that's coming
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: from somebody who is not exactly a friend to the FBI.
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: If you've listened to this podcast, you know I'm not
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: a big fan of the way they go about things usually.
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: But in this instance, I don't think they did anything wrong.
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: In fact, I think they were doing everything on the
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: up and up. And looking at the documents, the ones
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: I've looked at so far, there's nothing in those court
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: documents to make me think that we were on the
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: wrong path here. The only thing that was given to
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: us was Brian Kohlberger's name. That was it. It was
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: conveyed to us by the FBI that it was to
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: be taken as no more than a tip. That was it,
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: he said, per the court transcript. So once we received
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: his name, we set about doing basically an independent verification
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: of whether or not he was involved in this crime.
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: Payne told the court that Kohlberger... had not been on
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: the police radar prior to that, and that based on
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: that tip, investigators followed several lines of inquiry into him. Well,
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: that's what you do. You build your investigation, it mushrooms,
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: it blooms, and you go from there. Among them, police
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: learn Kohlberger drove a white Elantra, matching the car scene,
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: leaving the crime scene at the time of the murders.
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: After Kohlberger was named a person of interest, items were
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: taken from the trash at his parents' home and tested
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: for comparisons to the DNA found on the knife sheath.
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: He was taken into custody on December 30th, 2022, and
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: extradited to Idaho to face charges. Well, here's an idea, Mr.
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: Criminology Student. Don't put your DNA in the trash can
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: where anyone can rifle through it. Thanks for coming to
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: my TED Talk. Judge Hipler ruled on the motion about
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: IgG evidence and several other motions last week, around a
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: month after the closed-door hearing. The judge dismissed the defense
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: arguments that the use of IgG was unconstitutional and that
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: investigators should have obtained warrants to analyze the DNA on
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: the sheath. After the rulings were handed down, Kohlberger's defense
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: team underwent a major shakeup. Yeah, they got hammered. They
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: knew they got hammered. They knew they had to change
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: it up. So they got rid of Jay Logsdon and
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: they brought over a Becca Barlow. Public defender Jay Logsdon
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: has been removed as trial counsel and will only continue
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: as consulting counsel according to a court order. He will
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: be replaced by Bica Barlow, a California attorney who is
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: known for her work on forensic DNA evidence. No reason
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: was given for the upheaval coming just months before the
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: trial is set to begin, but Barlow's expertise might suggest
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: that the defense plans to continue to attack the DNA
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: evidence in the case. That is all they have. Loopholes, technicalities.
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: There's nothing Brian Kohlberger can bring to the table that's
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: going to change it. So unless they get their Hail
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: Mary prosecutorial misconduct, forget it. Bro is cooked. Barlow has
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: previously been called as a defense witness in the case
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: during a past hearing, which argued against the use of IGG.
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: At his arraignment, Kohlberger stayed silent, leading the judge to
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: enter a not guilty plea on his behalf. In court filings,
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: he has claimed to have an alibi for the night
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: of the murders, that he was driving around looking at
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: the moon and the stars. Kohlberger is next due in
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: court in April. So look, that's where things stand, and
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: I had no doubt that this was going to be
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: the decision rendered by the judge. People can live in
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: fantasy land all they want, but I prefer to remain
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: anchored here in reality, and here in reality, the case
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: against Brian Kohlberger is strong as hell. All right, folks,
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: that's going to do it for this one. If you'd
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: like to contact me, you can do that at bobbycapucci
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: at protonmail.com. That's B-O-B-B-Y-C-A-P-U-C-C-I at protonmail.com. Or if you prefer,
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: you can find me on X at B-O-B-B-Y underscore C-A-P-U-C-C-I.
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: All of the information that goes with this episode can
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: be found in the description box.