Latest / Foul Territory / Theo Epstein shares keys to legendary career on Dirt From The Dugout

Transcript

Theo Epstein shares keys to legendary career on Dirt From The Dugout · Foul Territory

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: All right, let's let's bring in our guest of honor tonight.
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: He is the senior advisor part owner of Fenwick Sports
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: Group and now joins us on Dirt from the dug out.
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: That is my buddy, THEO Epstein THEO. Thanks so much
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: for doing this. We really appreciate and uh, and welcome
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: to the program.
• 0:17
  Speaker 2: Rabbie Justin, Thanks so much for having me on. I've
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: been looking forward to this, but you're trying to get
• 0:21
  Speaker 2: me post traumatic stress disorder right off the bat by
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: talking about Raja Davis.
• 0:25
  Speaker 3: That's that's cool.
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: I know it turned out well, it did turn out,
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: and I did see him today.
• 0:33
  Speaker 4: Gray went a little bit long on the Raji Davis
• 0:36
  Speaker 4: thing there. I didn't know what the slant was there,
• 0:38
  Speaker 4: and I.
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: Was getting the sweats just thinking about it. But he
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: is a great guy and a terrific ambassador for the game.
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: A great development story too. Yeah, working his way up
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: to the big leagues and having the career that he
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: had and is always looking to give back through the
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: role at MLB and and and all over the place.
• 0:54
  Speaker 3: So we'll talk Rai anytime.
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: Good. Uh, let's talk THEO for a secon. Could hear
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: and I know and everybody who's watching this nose that
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: you know you're the curse breaker, et cetera. But I
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: know you back from your days and I didn't know
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: you then, but I know your upbringing. Why don't you
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: share a little bit about the the sort of the
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: way that you got into sports and what the development
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: of theo Epstein was really like. Not that you have
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: to take me through to where you are today, but
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: what it was like growing up theo Epstein.
• 1:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean breaking into baseball.
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: I was just a kid growing up kind of in
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: the shadow of Famway Park, grew up less than a
• 1:30
  Speaker 2: mile from Famway. Was one of the tens of thousands
• 1:34
  Speaker 2: of New Englanders. They thought he was going to play
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: shorts up for the Red Sox some day. And uh,
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: I threw too many through way too many curveballs in
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: uh in Little Lea again in high school. So that's
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: that's one thing we have to cover today, is to
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: follow the protocols and say the breaking stuff for when
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: you're a little bit older. Because my arm was hanging,
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: but what it really got it was it was elbow
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: and shoulder by the time I got done with my
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: high school career.
• 1:59
  Speaker 3: So scouting report I ever made was on myself.
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: I got to college, took a look around and realized
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: I couldn't Unfortunately, could couldn't compete at that level.
• 2:08
  Speaker 3: But it ended up being the best thing for me
• 2:10
  Speaker 3: because I was from the.
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: Time I was like two years old, I was always
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: so passionate about baseball. I was telling my parents, I'm
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: going to stay in this game forever. And so at
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: that point, my only options were to, you know, try
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: to try to get a job with the team, not
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: playing in the front office. So I wrote letters to
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: every major league team, got a lot of rejection letters,
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: got nothing crickets back from a lot of teams, but
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: got a phone call from Calvin Hill, Grant Hill's dad,
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: who was a great NFL player, and he was working
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: for the Baltimore Orioles at the time, and he invited
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: me down for an interview and interviewed. Got an internship
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: with the Orioles. Somewhere after my freshman year in college
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: nineteen ninety two. First year came the yards, kind of
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: did a little bit of everything and just dedicated myself
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: to it because I knew it might be my one
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: opportunity to stay in baseball. So befriended Fred Dolman Jr.
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: And a lot of guys in the scouting department with
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: the Orioles. Kind of like worked my way a little
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: bit into baseball operations that did a lot of pr
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: a lot of everything, so intern of the Oriols my
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: three high school, my three college summers, got invited by
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: a few of the Orioles folks who went out to
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: the pot to work for the Padres right after the
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: lockout in ninety four. I got a job the day
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: after I graduated college, went out to work for the
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: Padres and got an unbelievable breakout there, getting mentored by
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: Kevin Towers, who at the time was just taken over.
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: He was a young general manager of the Padres and
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: he was also newly married, and so he took a
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: liking to me because he was kind of like getting
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: domesticated and I was twenty one years old and right
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: out of college. So he called me in his office
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: every Monday morning and say THEO tell me everything I
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: missed this weekend.
• 3:53
  Speaker 3: And that's how that's how we kind of hit it off.
• 3:55
  Speaker 3: But he saw something in me.
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: I think it was just my passion for the game,
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: and he would you know, we were in southern California.
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: So he was like, hey, do you know how to scout?
• 4:04
  Speaker 3: I said, no, I don't.
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: I mean, I watched a ton of baseball I played
• 4:08
  Speaker 2: through high school. I still try to play when I can,
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: but no, And so he took me under his wing.
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: He just take me out all over southern California. We
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: saw every good player in the Pac Ten. We'd go
• 4:17
  Speaker 2: see every good high school kid up and down southern California,
• 4:21
  Speaker 2: and he kind of teach me how to scout, and
• 4:22
  Speaker 2: then he and then he'd take me down to the
• 4:24
  Speaker 2: I didn't even realize he was doing this at the time,
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: but he'd take me down to the clubhouse with him
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: and teach me how players really think and what clubhouse
• 4:32
  Speaker 2: dynamics are all about, and what what a winning player
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: looks like, and what a good teammate looks like. And
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: throughout the whole rest of my career. Really, everywhere i'd
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: go after I set out on my own left the padres,
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: I'd meet people who I'd find out later on Kevin
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: had called ahead and vouch for him. He was a
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: good guy. Make sure you treat him right. And yeah,
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: it's unbelievable. Mentor to have so anyway, long story s
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: or padres to Red Sox, red Sox to clubs.
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: And there we are so well, there's a there's a
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: million things to cover there, and I know Justin wants
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: to get into the scouting side of it. But before
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: we I just want to focus on what you said
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: about rejection letters, because I think this speaks to the
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: entire pursuit of whatever it is that you're after. I mean,
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: I'd be honest with you THEO I started in a
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: cable station in Ithaca and and tried so hard to
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: find jobs, whether it be Springfield, mass or Albany or
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: it didn't matter. And it was like hitting a golf
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: ball into a lake when you'd send out what back
• 5:34
  Speaker 1: then was called resume tapes. I mean, I have a
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: rejection letter. It's it's wider than the Yellow Pages, which
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: I know people who are listening to this don't even
• 5:42
  Speaker 1: know what they all the Yellow Pages are, but let's
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: just say it was. It was thick. So what are
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: the qualities that afforded you the opportunity to plow through
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: the rejection letters? And I'm sure it connects with all
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: the players you had who fail, all the time and
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: keep plowing through.
• 6:00
  Speaker 5: What is that?
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you've drawn the first and most important parallel between
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: life and baseball, which is, it's not whether you get
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: a bad outcome, whether you fail, or whether you face adversity,
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: because you absolutely will. It's it's built into the game.
• 6:16
  Speaker 2: It's it's it's innate in the game of baseball failure
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: and in life. There's no such thing as as an
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: easy path in life. If you dig deep enough, I
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: like to say when we're talking about players in their backgrounds,
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: it's true of all of us. Like, if you dig
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: deep enough, everyone's life is like a Russian novel. You know,
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: there's there's there's always adversity, there's always failures, there's always disappointments,
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: there's always times you disappoint yourself. But it's in baseball
• 6:41
  Speaker 2: and in life it's it's it's how you handle failure,
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: how you handle adversity, And that's something that sometimes you
• 6:47
  Speaker 2: have to learn. And I think you've learned that through
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: observation of others, role models, and then also through not
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: handling it the right way. But you know, with time,
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: I think I already if you focus on it, you
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: can develop enough self awareness.
• 7:04
  Speaker 3: That's the most important relationship you ultimately.
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: Have is kind of with yourself and and learning to
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: be honest with yourself, develop enough self awareness where you
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: can take responsibility for your failures, where you can understand
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: your foundation as a person, as a player, what makes
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: you you, what your straints are, and then also what
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: your weaknesses are, and then come up with a plan
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: not by yourself, but taking advantage of the resources.
• 7:28
  Speaker 3: Around you to turn those weaknesses into strengths and develop.
• 7:32
  Speaker 3: And then the perseverance.
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: Which is just not accepting failure and continuing to come
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: back again and again and again as you work on
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: your adjustments, which is what professional baseball is all about,
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: until you ultimately get a different outcome.
• 7:47
  Speaker 3: So so many parallels between baseball and life.
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: I yeah, I got rejection letters, but I had I
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: had one person, And then ultimately.
• 7:54
  Speaker 3: You know a number of dolls who believe. I mean,
• 7:57
  Speaker 3: that's that's all it takes.
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: And then recognizing opportunity when when you see one, and
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: dedicating it off to it. And if you're lucky, and
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: a lot of people watching this podcast are lucky enough
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: to know their passion and know what's important to them,
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: and know what you care about, and you made a
• 8:13
  Speaker 2: great choice if baseball is a part of that, because
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: this game can open so many.
• 8:18
  Speaker 3: Doors for you.
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: You can you can meet so many incredible people, you
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: can make a life for yourself, not just a living,
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: but a fulfilling life where you you ultimately can be
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: connected with people in a special way that we often
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: lose after childhood and you go off on. You know,
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: into a career, you're an account and your lawyer, you're
• 8:41
  Speaker 2: counting widgets at a factor or whatever it may be.
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: Oftentimes it can be solitary, but in baseball you're always connected.
• 8:46
  Speaker 3: One of the things I love about the game.
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: It gives you a chance to be to feel like
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: you're part of something bigger than yourself. Every day you
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: go to the ballpark, whether you're working in the front office,
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: whether you're part of the team in the clubhouse, when
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: you're in your way up through amateur ball, through the
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: minor leagues, you're you're part of a team. And if
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: it's done right and you take that responsibility and teammate
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: of being a teammate seriously, you get that privilege of
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: feeling like you're part of something bigger than yourself. And
• 9:13
  Speaker 2: that's when great things happen for the collective as well
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: as for yourself and your own development. So if you're
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: lucky enough to have identified that passion early on, lean
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: into it, you know, lean into take really seriously the
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: things that you can do to handle the failure in
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: this game, and make the self assessments, adjust and prove
• 9:32
  Speaker 2: and persevere and continue to succeed in the game.
• 9:36
  Speaker 3: Ultimately.
• 9:37
  Speaker 6: Godfather, I'm a last minute guy. Sometimes you're a last
• 9:40
  Speaker 6: minutic guy where you all of a sudden see a
• 9:42
  Speaker 6: night open up and you want to go grab some tickets,
• 9:45
  Speaker 6: and you hadn't gotten them already, So you're going to
• 9:47
  Speaker 6: seek geek, and you're going to go look for a
• 9:49
  Speaker 6: green dot and see where the good seats are and
• 9:51
  Speaker 6: the good value is and have a little knight with
• 9:54
  Speaker 6: the fam.
• 9:54
  Speaker 7: Right without a doubt. And I'm looking for some of
• 9:57
  Speaker 7: the best feats. I'm looking for that green dot. When
• 9:59
  Speaker 7: I get that, it's a simple plug it in, use
• 10:02
  Speaker 7: your hands, go right on your screen, your phone, whatever
• 10:06
  Speaker 7: platform you can get it on. And it's so simple.
• 10:08
  Speaker 7: They make it so easy for you to do. Even
• 10:11
  Speaker 7: my son can do it if I ask them, Hey, Blikester,
• 10:14
  Speaker 7: let's go man, get on there for us, find us
• 10:16
  Speaker 7: a couple of seats so we can watch even that
• 10:18
  Speaker 7: subway series that would be fantastic. Seat Geek has it
• 10:21
  Speaker 7: all there for you.
• 10:22
  Speaker 6: Yeah, and the code for you. You should know it.
• 10:25
  Speaker 6: It's Territory ten. It just gets you ten percent off
• 10:27
  Speaker 6: your next set of tickets. It's EKE ten percent off
• 10:29
  Speaker 6: any tickets with promo code Territory one zero. Make sure
• 10:32
  Speaker 6: you click the link in the description, download the app.
• 10:34
  Speaker 6: Then the code is automatically added to your count so
• 10:36
  Speaker 6: you can use it later.
• 10:37
  Speaker 4: I just want to remind everybody if you have any questions,
• 10:40
  Speaker 4: go ahead and throw them, throw them in the Q
• 10:41
  Speaker 4: and H chat or in the Q and A and
• 10:43
  Speaker 4: we'll get to those.
• 10:44
  Speaker 5: But I want to go back to the scouting side.
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: Man.
• 10:46
  Speaker 4: This is it's super interesting because it's such an important
• 10:50
  Speaker 4: part of an organization, right, And I think in all
• 10:53
  Speaker 4: of the things that I'll just share my beliefs, I guess,
• 10:57
  Speaker 4: but I think it gets lost in the chatter a
• 10:59
  Speaker 4: little little bit of where we're going, which I'm also
• 11:03
  Speaker 4: supportive of. But I know you specifically, just having read
• 11:07
  Speaker 4: some things about you. It's such an it's such an
• 11:10
  Speaker 4: important piece of it for you. And your success and
• 11:13
  Speaker 4: now hearing kind of some of the things that you
• 11:15
  Speaker 4: went through to learn a lot of those things and.
• 11:18
  Speaker 5: To dive into the scouting side.
• 11:20
  Speaker 4: Can you just touch on that a little bit on
• 11:22
  Speaker 4: the scouting world and and scouting departments in general in
• 11:27
  Speaker 4: the lifeblood per se that they are when it comes
• 11:31
  Speaker 4: to building a franchise. Do you want to just touch
• 11:33
  Speaker 4: on that a little bit?
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's it's probably an important time in
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: the game to touch on that because we're right now,
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: we're a little bit out of balance.
• 11:43
  Speaker 3: You know, there's an equilibrium in the game where.
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, data is important, analytics and important, technology is important,
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: and you can use those tools to help you make
• 11:56
  Speaker 2: good predictions about how players are going to perform in
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: the few future. But if it's done at the exclusion
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: of the human element, and you know, the humanism essentially
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: human beings getting to know other people, understanding what makes
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: them tick, developing a connection with them, understanding them better
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: that way, and putting them in.
• 12:19
  Speaker 3: A position to succeed, then it's not worth it.
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: And and you can you can, you can fall out
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: of balance and and so you know, in some circles
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: they are you know, scouting and invest in and and
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: seeing beyond the status feet, seeing beyond the predictive model,
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: and understanding you know, what really makes a person tick
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: as a as a human, as a teammate and as
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: a player. Is becoming a bit of a lost art
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: and it really is the lifeblood. And I think one
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: one one thing that's important I think for young players,
• 12:55
  Speaker 2: youth players to know and parents to know, is that
• 12:58
  Speaker 2: you know in the draft room. Yes, sure, most teams
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: use models these days to help understand, you know, players
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: talent level, make a projection about his future.
• 13:10
  Speaker 3: There are a lot of measurables obviously.
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: In the game these days, far far more than there
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: used to be, and those have a place and those
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: are important. But even today, even with all the advancements,
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: I think parents and young players would be shocked and
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: how much of the conversation about a player in the
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: draft room, and this is true in college recruiting circles
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: as well. I know how much of the conversation revolves
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: around everything off the field and who that player is
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: as a human being, what kind of teammate they are.
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: Matt Dorry, your friend Justin will tell you time and
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: time again. You know, we wouldn't draft a player back
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: in the Red Sox days and then the Cubs days
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: without the scout putting in pages and pages and pages
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: of background information about the player, about what makes him
• 13:59
  Speaker 2: who he is is, so you know, three examples when
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: the players face adversity off the field and how he responded,
• 14:06
  Speaker 2: three examples of how the players face adversity on the
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: field and how he responded. What his teammates say about him,
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: what his friends say about him, what his girlfriends say
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: about him, his ex girlfriends say about him, How he
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: treats people when no one's looking, how he treats the
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: worst player on the tream, how he treats the equipment guy.
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: Does he act different in front of the camera when
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: he's not in front of a camera. Everything, obviously, everything
• 14:27
  Speaker 2: that goes on in the house that you can find out,
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: the family upbringing, like all the things that make an
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: individual unique and that ultimately represent his character. That's so
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: important when when you're trying to predict the type of player,
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: the type of member of an organization, this individual is
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: going to be five ten years down the line. And
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: obviously scouting and scouts do such a good job of
• 14:54
  Speaker 2: writing that part of the story and that's something that
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: you know, no predictive model can tell you. So you
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: just have to make sure the game stays in proper equilibrium,
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: that we're balancing, you know, both sides of the equation,
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: the analytical side as well as the human side.
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's such a that's a solid goal, that answer.
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: And I think for parents of players that are you know,
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: let's just say they're between the ages of seven and
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: twelve right now, This idea that you're not spinning it,
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: you're not throwing it as hard as you possibly can,
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: your exit lunacy like exit velocity on an eleven year
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: old makes no sense. But all these character traits can
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: be instilled in these boys and girls, if you will,
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: that are growing up and playing these sports. Where did
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: you get that stuff from? Where did it come from?
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: Was it as simple as mom and dad were there
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: were there KT's out there? Where'd you get it?
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: Well, let's let me knows that in a minute. First,
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: kind of just dig in on like the measurables you
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: just talked about, and young kids I've seen through my
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: own kids at practice and just like such young players
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: chasing vlow and spin ray and they v loo and
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: hitting exclusively off hit tracks and stuff.
• 16:02
  Speaker 3: I think what's important, There is a place for that.
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: It is important if you want to develop a skill,
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: understanding the components that go into that skill and then
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: training for them.
• 16:13
  Speaker 3: That's that's common sense.
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: And you know, there are a lot of advances, and
• 16:17
  Speaker 2: I think in general we train smarter now than we
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: used to. However, there's a cost associated with that too,
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: especially if you start at too young an age, Because
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: anytime you're chasing something, whether it's velo or spin or
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: exit vlo, when you're chasing something and so you're training
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: for it, and you're optimizing for it, and you're teaching
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: your body to produce it in a certain way, you're
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: also ignoring a lot of other things that aren't measured
• 16:49
  Speaker 2: quite as precisely just yet. And so a great example
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: if you think back to just you know, think about
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: what scouting was like before the radar gun, right before
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: you could precisely measure velocity. When a scout would write
• 17:01
  Speaker 2: a report and he'd describe the picture's fastball, he'd write
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: about the velocity, he'd describe it, but he'd also he'd
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: balance that and he'd also write about the deception and
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: the command and the movement and everything else that goes
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: into a great fastball. And back before the raidar gun,
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: we probably had it in better proportion. We're a better balance,
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: and velocity is important, but so is command, so is deception,
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: so is movement. And then once technology came along and
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: we had the radar gun, there became an over reliance
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: on velocity, where now a scout could just describe the fastball. Hey,
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: you know he tops out at ninety three point four,
• 17:41
  Speaker 2: I'm going to put him ahead of this other guy
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: who's ninety three point two. And what's lost in the
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: conversation or what do you sort of unintentionally ignoring everything
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: else that makes a good fastball, the command, the velocity,
• 17:56
  Speaker 2: And so this now sort of extrapolate that to the
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: development of a young player. And we are training for
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: certain outcomes that are very precisely measured, and so we
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: obsess over them. But just think for a second about
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: what else you're ignoring in that pursuit all the other
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: components that go into playing the game the right way,
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: important baseball skills, and then yeah, the whole human side
• 18:25
  Speaker 2: of you know, training yourself to be a good teammate,
• 18:28
  Speaker 2: training yourself to have like a you know, a sound
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: mental foundation that you can fall back on, you know,
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: to play the game successfully and deal with failure successfully
• 18:39
  Speaker 2: and be a good teammate. So it's just it's important
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: to even as you chase certain things that are measured
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: and we use technology in our training, don't lose sight
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: of the bigger picture. And other things can be important too,
• 18:54
  Speaker 2: even if they're not precisely measurable.
• 18:56
  Speaker 3: So it's had to kind of get that.
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: No, it's a good point. Your point is this ignoring
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: it or sacrificing the development of other you know, characteristics,
• 19:05
  Speaker 1: quality skills. This is the multi sport versus let's focus
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: on one, and if you focus on one, you sacrifice
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: the others, which could benefit the whole package.
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: But I hear you dynamic about Yeah, play play difference.
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: It's a lot healthier. I'm sure every guest has mentioned this.
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: But play as many sports as you can. Please play
• 19:25
  Speaker 2: three sports for as long as you can. It'll it'll
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: help your body, it'll help your mind, it'll maintain your
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: love and passion for the game longer as you don't
• 19:35
  Speaker 2: experience mental burnout or physical burnout. That way, it will
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: help you develop as an athlete as well. And teach
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: you a lot of lessons. But yeah, you're you're definitely right.
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: But you asked where where I've I guess, developed a
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: certain outlook on what's important in the game.
• 19:53
  Speaker 3: On the field and off the field. You know, I'll
• 19:57
  Speaker 3: give my dad a ton of credit.
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: Today is actually the one year anniversary of his of
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: his passing unfortunately, so we've been we've been celebrating him today.
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: But yeah, some of my earliest memories are going to
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: Famiway Park with him, and him and my twin brother
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: and my dad kind of teaching us what you call
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: the finer points of the game, and and and sitting
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: out there and as a young young kid looking out
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: at the field oft Family Park and just trying to
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: find something that I could notice about the strategy of
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: the game, or something I thought was going to happen
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: on the field, or something I noticed a player do
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: that I could I could tell my dad and kind
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: of impress him and and get awarded a finer point
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: that he would he would bestow upon me. And then
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: and he'd, you know, he'd show up. He was an
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: English professor and a novelist, so he'd show up to
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: every single one of my games. He was the only
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: one sitting there reading the New York Review of books
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: between and oftentimes during the innings. But I'd come off
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: the field no matter no matter what he would he
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: would tell me that was a major league curveball right there,
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: that that was you know, no one, you know, no
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: one could have made Glenn Hoffman couldn't have made that play.
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: Just incredibly positive, no matter no matter what was going
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: on on the field, and just you know, to have
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: have that solid foundation from your parents where they're fueling
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: your love of the game without forcing it on you,
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: where there's unconditional love and and support, I think is
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: like the foundation, the building block that kids need to
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: then find their own way in the game.
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: Positive reinforcement, Like your dad said, positive reinforcement.
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: Come on, there's going to be enough negative feedback. The
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: game is humbling enough. There's enough values out there. You
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: don't you don't need that from the place where you
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: kind of look for unconditional support right at home.
• 21:51
  Speaker 6: Right Hey, this is the mac weld In line that
• 21:55
  Speaker 6: resonates with me. The go to choice for guys who
• 21:58
  Speaker 6: want to look great without even trying. Hibernation time is over,
• 22:01
  Speaker 6: and that means it's time for a wardrobe change. Bye
• 22:03
  Speaker 6: bye layers, Hello shorts and breathable clothing. Discover upgraded basics,
• 22:08
  Speaker 6: fresh styles and more at macweldon dot com. Plus get
• 22:11
  Speaker 6: twenty percent off your first order of one hundred and
• 22:13
  Speaker 6: twenty five dollars or more with code foul. Mac Weldon
• 22:17
  Speaker 6: is effortless by design, always in style, versatile, and made
• 22:21
  Speaker 6: from the world's most comfortable performance materials. You should check
• 22:24
  Speaker 6: out the Ace collection. That's one of the items I
• 22:27
  Speaker 6: just got for super comfy shorts. It's closed for every occasion.
• 22:30
  Speaker 6: I like to keep it simple. This is for that
• 22:33
  Speaker 6: day to day classic look that makes matching easy. Get
• 22:37
  Speaker 6: moving with mac Weldon comfortable anywhere. Go to macweldon dot
• 22:41
  Speaker 6: com and get twenty percent off your first order of
• 22:43
  Speaker 6: one hundred and twenty five dollars or more with promo
• 22:46
  Speaker 6: code foul. That's m ack w E L d o
• 22:49
  Speaker 6: N dot com code f o U L Yeah THEO.
• 22:55
  Speaker 4: I'm gonna switch gears on you a little bit here.
• 22:56
  Speaker 4: There's been a viral video right with Anthony rizz and
• 23:01
  Speaker 4: Ross and Lester kind of sharing a story about a
• 23:03
  Speaker 4: negotiation at two am.
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 23:05
  Speaker 5: We won't get into the details on that.
• 23:06
  Speaker 4: But you know, after kind of watching something like that,
• 23:10
  Speaker 4: I think it creates a personal element of it, of
• 23:14
  Speaker 4: humanizing people in charge and leadership and things like that
• 23:18
  Speaker 4: that I really loved about it. And I think that's
• 23:20
  Speaker 4: one of the things that's kind of endearing about the
• 23:22
  Speaker 4: whole story is just it's there are things that happen
• 23:26
  Speaker 4: behind the scenes that a lot of people don't see, right.
• 23:29
  Speaker 4: But I will love your version of that story. You've
• 23:31
  Speaker 4: probably heard it and listened to it. What's your version
• 23:34
  Speaker 4: of that story?
• 23:34
  Speaker 5: Man?
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll tell you first. I'll say you're so right.
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: The game is all about relationships. And I'll be the
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: first to admit, like when when I first took over
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: as GM of the Red Sox, I was twenty eight,
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: I probably relied too much on being transactional with how
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: I was putting the team together and with decisions I
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: was making, and didn't invest enough time because I was
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: kind of underwater. I was just trying to drink it
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: from fire hose and just trying to figure it all out.
• 24:08
  Speaker 3: I didn't invest in enough time.
• 24:11
  Speaker 2: In getting to know the players and being real with
• 24:14
  Speaker 2: them and being human, and I quickly realized that I
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: was sort of cheating myself and cheating the organization. And
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: no matter no matter what, no matter how busy I was,
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: I needed to find time to just be around and
• 24:29
  Speaker 2: get and get to know the guys and be there
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: for them and be.
• 24:33
  Speaker 3: Supportive, be honest, which is another lesson I learned.
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: But develop relationships and it's everything in the game, it's
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: what those connections are what make a winning organization, and
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: then they can make your career too, like.
• 24:47
  Speaker 3: You know, if you do it.
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: Right, and you know justin for me in the game
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: and Rabbi too. You operate this way even from a
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: media perspective, like if you develop authentic, real relationships, you're
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: constantly all day long, it's picking up the phone, calling people,
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: checking in on him and getting and if you have
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: a question about a player or a situation or a team,
• 25:06
  Speaker 2: like you're constantly getting great information because you've developed these
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: real relationships and trusting relationships that sort of mean mean everything.
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: But so you know that story that was you know,
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: a couple of guys I'd just gotten to know over
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: the years from from being on the same side with him,
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: John Lester. I was there in the two thousand and
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: two draft when we when we chose this lanky, left
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: handed pitcher in first basement out of Washington and John Lester,
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: and people think he's from like the South because he's
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: like a self subscribed redneck and he lies as far
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: away from the South as you can get.
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: But getting getting getting.
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: To know him as as a young player, and then
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: obviously the character that he showed overcoming cancer in his
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: in his rookie year in the big leagues and coming
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: back and and and pitching the decisive game in the
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: World Series, and just the type of leader and teammate.
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: He's one of the most generous players with his time
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: and his money, and how thoughtful he is helping young
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: players break in, setting a great example and creating that
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: team dynamics.
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: So he's one I would do anything for. And then
• 26:17
  Speaker 3: you know, one.
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: Thing John can't do is control the running game and
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: throw the first base.
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: So he was someone who always needed his personal pitcher.
• 26:25
  Speaker 2: So when we were signing John as a free agent
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: with the Cubs, which is a great feeling because when
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: you're invest that much in a starting pitcher, having personal
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: history with him, you know how he takes care of himself,
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: how he trains us seriously, he takes things you're betting
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: on the health and the human being.
• 26:42
  Speaker 3: It was great to sign John.
• 26:44
  Speaker 2: We were out celebrating that night in Chicago after signing him,
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: and he started asking again about our backup catcher situation,
• 26:50
  Speaker 2: and we kind of already knew he was gonna want
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: David ross who handles him great and controls the running
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: game so well, to come and be a backup and
• 27:00
  Speaker 2: kind of be a bit of a.
• 27:01
  Speaker 3: Personal catcher form. And we thought it was a good idea.
• 27:03
  Speaker 3: I mean, we had a young team in Chicago at.
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: The time, and going into the twenty fifteen season. What
• 27:12
  Speaker 2: was going to finish that team off were the right
• 27:14
  Speaker 2: veteran leaders who understood the ingredients that create a winning
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: environment and are thoughtful in creating that type of culture
• 27:24
  Speaker 2: around the team, not letting any player sort of get
• 27:28
  Speaker 2: out on their own, fostering team dinner, create having team
• 27:32
  Speaker 2: dinners to foster connection, being holding players accountable on the
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: front step of the dugout when they don't run.
• 27:38
  Speaker 3: Out of ground ball. And that was Rossi to a t.
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: So Lester was saying, hey, we should sign Rossie. He said, yeah,
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: of course we should. We're working on it, and then
• 27:47
  Speaker 2: went out for a couple of adult beverages. And John's
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: not the most patient individual in the world. So he
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: got Ross on the phone. Next thing you know, he's
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: negotiating that contract. I wasn't getting to get on the
• 27:58
  Speaker 2: phone and go around the agent's back, but I was
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: willing to give hand signals about how far we'd go
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: on the contract. It was easy to hold the line
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: doing it that way, and so Lester ended up negotiating
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: that that two year, five million dollar deal from David Ross.
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: We all we were all having cocktails again a couple
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: of years later celebrate in the World Series that it
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: worked out.
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: Did he get did he get the suite? Did he
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: get the sweet that he was asking for to Yeah,
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: in the.
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: Suite on the road, which we were happy to give
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: him because, you know, being a veteran he was he
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: earned it. But also that's where players would assemble and
• 28:32
  Speaker 2: hang out and talk baseball, and rather them be up
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: in David Ross's sweet than be out somewhere else.
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: That's a great story. We got about twenty five minutes
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: left here. Twenty minutes left, so we're going to get
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: some questions here. Speaking of relationships, this is obviously front
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: and center but the question comes from Adam. What do
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: you hope MLB and the Players Association can agree on
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: during the negotiations this winter.
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I can't I can't talk in too
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: much detail about it, but I think read is the
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: key word there is that Obviously, the history of the
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: history of labor relations in baseball, there's just been you know,
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: too much of being on opposite sides of the table.
• 29:13
  Speaker 2: And ultimately, you know, if we could find a way
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: to get a deal done and become partners and in
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: growing the game and growing the pie, that that's really,
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: you know, ultimate the most important thing in the long run,
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: because you know, if you look at what what are
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: the commonalities between people who own baseball teams and people
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: who play professional Baseball's the love of the game and
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: and and there's so much interest that they have both
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: you know, pecuniary interest as well as emotional interest.
• 29:45
  Speaker 3: In in like the health of the game.
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: Yet the sides, you know, the way things have evolved,
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: the sides have obviously been it's been a lack of
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: trust and a bit of a toxic relationship. So whatever
• 29:56
  Speaker 2: the outcome is, and however we reach agreement, I hope
• 30:00
  Speaker 2: that it is a deal that aligns everyone's interests in
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: a real clear way so that there's collaboration, synergy, and
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: ultimately partnership in creating the healthiest possible sport, the widest,
• 30:18
  Speaker 2: you know, the biggest possible tent, so that everyone who
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: loves the game. And baseball means different things to different people.
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: It's a it's a livelihood for some, it's a hobby.
• 30:27
  Speaker 2: For others, it's playing catch with your dad. To others,
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: it's going to games, it's playing the little league. It
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: means so many different things to so many different people.
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: Some people watch every game, some tune and every now
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: and then, but that everyone who cares about the game
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: and loves the game can see the best possible version
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: of the sport and everyone sort of aligned to grow
• 30:47
  Speaker 2: the game because we're we shouldn't be in competition with
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: one another.
• 30:51
  Speaker 3: We're really in competition.
• 30:52
  Speaker 2: With football, basketball, all the other sports out there, with
• 30:57
  Speaker 2: the iPhone, with Netflix and.
• 30:59
  Speaker 3: Streamers, everyone who's algorithms.
• 31:01
  Speaker 2: Everyone is fighting for your attention and what's really become
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: like an attention economy and your time and your attention
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: or your most valuable assets.
• 31:11
  Speaker 3: Everyone's fighting for it.
• 31:12
  Speaker 2: And some of those you know, some of the things
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: that grab your attention aren't the most healthy and productive,
• 31:19
  Speaker 2: and I'd rather you spend your time ultimately watching baseball.
• 31:24
  Speaker 2: And when the game's healthy, I think our country is
• 31:27
  Speaker 2: healthy because there's so many lessons to be learned in
• 31:29
  Speaker 2: this game.
• 31:30
  Speaker 3: So I just hope we can agree and find a partnership.
• 31:33
  Speaker 6: AJ gave me a line on Blue Chew.
• 31:35
  Speaker 5: Well, do you need help with your love life, Scott?
• 31:37
  Speaker 3: Perhaps? Do you want a turbo charge your love life?
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: Yes, well, then you need Blue Chew Gold because it
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: has four active ingredients that help you not only two
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: turbo charge, but you can supercharge it if you take
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: one of these.
• 31:49
  Speaker 6: And AJ is talking about that new erasual boosting formula
• 31:52
  Speaker 6: that combines passion and performance into one tablet that dissolves
• 31:55
  Speaker 6: under your tongue for super fast on set. No more
• 31:58
  Speaker 6: waiting for a pill to kick in, no more moment
• 32:00
  Speaker 6: it's ruined by performance anxiety. Just the results you want
• 32:02
  Speaker 6: when you want them. Discover your options at blue Choo
• 32:05
  Speaker 6: dot com. A special deal is there for the ftfam
• 32:09
  Speaker 6: right now. When you buy two months of bluech You Gold,
• 32:12
  Speaker 6: you get the third for free with promo code foul.
• 32:15
  Speaker 6: That's promo code f o u L. Visit blue you
• 32:18
  Speaker 6: dot com for more details and important safety information. Thank
• 32:22
  Speaker 6: you to bluech you for sponsoring the show, and thank
• 32:25
  Speaker 6: you AJ for talking love life. The process is simple
• 32:29
  Speaker 6: and it's all online. Get started today at bluecho dot
• 32:32
  Speaker 6: com and go for gold.
• 32:34
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: I like when people watch the game too. That's a
• 32:36
  Speaker 1: very good answer to the Thank you very much. Hey,
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: you know you mentioned the word You mentioned the word trust,
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: And I'm curious when it comes to building championship teams
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: for the people that are on this and the parents
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: out there are what are the commonalities in traits and
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: qualities and where does trust rank on that when you're
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: considering how you want to build championship team clubhouse.
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well, trust means a lot of different things. One
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: way to answer that is like, as as as someone
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: is putting a team together or putting an organization, trying
• 33:14
  Speaker 2: to build the championship organization, there's nothing more important than
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: than players that ultimately you can trust two.
• 33:25
  Speaker 3: Do myriad things.
• 33:26
  Speaker 2: One players that you can trust to put the team
• 33:30
  Speaker 2: first over you know, put the team interest, the collective interests,
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: organizational interests sometimes above their own individual interests. Players that
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: you can trust to care about their teammates. Players that
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: you can trust to have good habits and take care
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: of their bodies and get their sleep and eat right.
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: And players they can trust to train hard. Players that
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: you can trust to be honest with themselves and and
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: and and to be open to feedback and open to partnership.
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: Players you can trust to have a growth mindset and
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: constantly be striving to be better. So when you have
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: those players, you can trust to post and play and
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: show up, and when when things get difficult, not not
• 34:12
  Speaker 2: find a way out, but take take responsibility and dig
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: in deeper and find a way to be there for
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: their teammates and for the team.
• 34:20
  Speaker 3: So that kind of trust is hugely important, and it
• 34:23
  Speaker 3: cuts both ways too.
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: I learned this lesson from Craig Shipley, who was on
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: we talked about the Padres. He was an infielder on
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: those Padres teams in the late nineties, and I learned
• 34:35
  Speaker 2: the importance.
• 34:36
  Speaker 3: Of of of of.
• 34:38
  Speaker 2: Complete honesty and candor and transparency with players in order
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: to develop trust you. I was sitting there in the
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: dugout before batting practice and ship and I were talking
• 34:50
  Speaker 2: about something and he was kind of explaining why a
• 34:52
  Speaker 2: certain player was upset with management.
• 34:54
  Speaker 3: I didn't get it.
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: And he remember, he looked me right in the eye,
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: almost like looked right through me, and said, don't you
• 35:00
  Speaker 2: understand every player out there? And he pointed out on
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: the field for batter practice, every player out there has
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: been lied to by management at some point in their
• 35:09
  Speaker 2: career or feels like they've been lied to. And it
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: just kind of shook me because I'd never I'd never
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: thought about you know that sentiment, and you obviously was.
• 35:22
  Speaker 2: He felt it and he meant it. And I said
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: to myself right then and there, and ultimately I said
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: to ship as if I, if I'm ever lucky enough
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: to be part of running an organization, I'm just going
• 35:33
  Speaker 2: to make sure we absolutely tell the truth at all
• 35:35
  Speaker 2: times to all players, even if even when it's inconvenient
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: or it's things they don't want to hear. It's just
• 35:41
  Speaker 2: so important that you're honest with your your your feedback.
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: You're honest in contract negotiations, You're honest with where they stand.
• 35:48
  Speaker 2: You're honest about their development and and and and that's
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: where individual player development plans came from.
• 35:54
  Speaker 3: And making sure.
• 35:55
  Speaker 2: You document the feedback and that there's buy in and
• 35:58
  Speaker 2: and that's type of honesty. Is what's what's essential to
• 36:04
  Speaker 2: building trust that goes both ways as mutual if you
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: if you have it go in both directions.
• 36:09
  Speaker 3: If you have players that you can trust to do
• 36:12
  Speaker 3: the right.
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: Things that we just articulated, and you've got players kind
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: of trusting their leadership both with their manager and uh,
• 36:19
  Speaker 2: the GM and the ownership, you're you're gonna have a
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: winning organization.
• 36:22
  Speaker 5: For a long time. Good, so good, man, so good
• 36:26
  Speaker 5: and and the know.
• 36:27
  Speaker 4: I guess as we kind of like move away from
• 36:31
  Speaker 4: you know, getting to back to youth sports here, I guess,
• 36:34
  Speaker 4: and Cooper has a good question here that I really like,
• 36:37
  Speaker 4: But what are your thoughts on on private equity? You know,
• 36:41
  Speaker 4: this is a loaded question, right, and this is we're
• 36:43
  Speaker 4: getting we're going down this road, I guess, And I
• 36:46
  Speaker 4: it's kind of a newer thing in then in the
• 36:48
  Speaker 4: last couple of years, right, where a lot of private
• 36:51
  Speaker 4: equities built buying up club teams, right and getting large
• 36:55
  Speaker 4: groups of club teams that they own, uh, just in general, Coop,
• 36:59
  Speaker 4: Cooper up, and I think it's a good question. But
• 37:02
  Speaker 4: do you think it's bad for the future of youth sports,
• 37:05
  Speaker 4: and what would you do to correct it.
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So it's funny you asked that because I actually
• 37:10
  Speaker 2: have a part time gig with Arcdose Partners that does
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: private equity, but only at the professional level.
• 37:16
  Speaker 3: They buy minority.
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: Interests in in Major League Baseball teams and NFL teams
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: and and HL teams, NBA teams, et cetera. And but
• 37:25
  Speaker 2: since I'm in those circles, I've I've certainly come across,
• 37:30
  Speaker 2: you know, private equities involvement in in youth sports. And
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: I agree with was a Cooper with his his concerns
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: that it's it's it's can be a bit scary that obviously,
• 37:42
  Speaker 2: you know, private equity gets involved in in in in
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: order to maximize profit. And you know, the youth sports
• 37:53
  Speaker 2: landscape has changed dramatically from when I was growing up.
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: It's it's, you know, it's it's it's a.
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: Lot more involved, it's a lot more expensive. There's sort
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: of this massive fomo involved where it used to be
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: pretty simple. You play in your house little league. You know,
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: maybe you'd be lucky enough to find a coach that
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: you believe in and.
• 38:17
  Speaker 3: And and him take some lessons.
• 38:20
  Speaker 2: And now it's you know, you every time you pick
• 38:23
  Speaker 2: up your phone, you feel like you're missing out on
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: the next big thing. And if I'm not doing this,
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: and if mom and dad aren't paying for this and
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: I'm on this travel team, I'm missing out. And you know,
• 38:33
  Speaker 2: some of that is is well intentioned. There's a lot
• 38:36
  Speaker 2: of people who want to help. But then there's also
• 38:38
  Speaker 2: a lot of money to be made in youth sports
• 38:40
  Speaker 2: or else you wouldn't see the type of capital running
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: into and there would private equity, you wouldn't be involved.
• 38:46
  Speaker 2: So I think this is a good reminder for parents.
• 38:50
  Speaker 2: Obviously you don't have to sort of get involved in
• 38:52
  Speaker 2: the understand what the cap table is or or get
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: involved in the private equity component at all, but just
• 38:59
  Speaker 2: ask yourself for the people that you're potentially getting involved with,
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: who are running your programs or your trainers, your coaches,
• 39:07
  Speaker 2: your lessons, or like, what are they in it for?
• 39:11
  Speaker 3: What are they in it for? And I think I
• 39:12
  Speaker 3: think we have good.
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: Radars as parents about the people working with our kids,
• 39:17
  Speaker 2: is like, are they in it for the right reasons?
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: Are they in it to make my kids better? Or
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: they're trying to make a quick buck. And look, obviously
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: everyone's got to make a living and it's part of it,
• 39:25
  Speaker 2: and it's a competitive landscape out there. But I would
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: just urge parents to kind of trust trust their instincts.
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: On a micro level, be selective with who your kids
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: are around and trying to grow in the game of baseball,
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: and I think if you follow your instincts, you'll end
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: up in a good place. On the macro level, Yeah,
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: it's important that we not prioritize. You know, capitalism is
• 39:45
  Speaker 2: a pretty powerful thing, but not everything should be optimized
• 39:48
  Speaker 2: for profit. And use sports trolley very much in that category.
• 39:54
  Speaker 5: Yeah, no one this question.
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: I'm sure I know you get this one often. I
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: do think that Mark's question is a little bit different
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: because it doesn't ask you to pick whether the Red
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: Sox or the Cubs sort of curse was your favorite.
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: It more ass which one felt like a greater feat
• 40:13
  Speaker 1: And uh, I think that seems like it's one that
• 40:16
  Speaker 1: you could probably come up with an answer, as opposed
• 40:18
  Speaker 1: to saying they both, yeah, great, we know that which
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: was the great answer?
• 40:24
  Speaker 2: Because it says which one felt like a greater feat
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: they wish was a greater feed, So I could be
• 40:28
  Speaker 2: honest with the Cubs one felt like a greater feet
• 40:31
  Speaker 2: just because of where I was in my life at
• 40:33
  Speaker 2: the time. So with the Red Sox, yeah, I was.
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: I was thirty years old, I was single. We had you,
• 40:39
  Speaker 2: you were around RAVI. You know, we had like a
• 40:41
  Speaker 2: tight knit front office. But we were all kind of
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: working hard and playing hard.
• 40:46
  Speaker 3: And everything happened.
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: So fast in two thousand and three and two thousand
• 40:49
  Speaker 2: and four, the whole ride through the four postseason, falling
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: down to the Yankees three games to nothing, then coming
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: back and sweeping the World Series. It felt like, you know,
• 40:59
  Speaker 2: a while all night out with your friends, that it
• 41:02
  Speaker 2: takes all these twisted turns, and you know you're not
• 41:05
  Speaker 2: even sure what's going on, and you don't even remember
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: a lot of it. You know, look at looking back
• 41:09
  Speaker 2: on it to these days, to this day, I see highlights,
• 41:11
  Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, yeah, I remember that, because it was
• 41:15
  Speaker 2: impossible to fully appreciate in the moment. I hadn't fully
• 41:19
  Speaker 2: paid my dues yet. I was still still so young
• 41:21
  Speaker 2: in an experience. By the time I got to Chicago
• 41:25
  Speaker 2: and twenty sixteen out at that point, I had two kids,
• 41:28
  Speaker 2: had a wife, and I got I had the privilege
• 41:31
  Speaker 2: of well and I knew how hard it was. You know,
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: we'd been through a five year plan rebuild with the Cubs.
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: I had better perspective on the game and how lucky
• 41:40
  Speaker 2: you have to be to you know, to be fortunate
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: to stay healthy and have a successful regular season and
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: win a few series in the postseason, even get a chance,
• 41:49
  Speaker 2: you know, to compete.
• 41:50
  Speaker 3: On the biggest stage in the Fall Classic.
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: And then I had the privilege of having my then
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: eight year old son with me for those World Series games,
• 42:00
  Speaker 2: and you know, if you go back and look at
• 42:01
  Speaker 2: the footage of Game seven, you can kind of see
• 42:03
  Speaker 2: him there sitting right next to me. And I got
• 42:05
  Speaker 2: to watch the game not through the cynical eyes of
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: of of a veteran general manager at that point, but
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: through the innocent eyes of an eight year old kid who,
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: you know, his favorite team had had a chance to
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: win the World Series. So I had greater appreciation for
• 42:22
  Speaker 2: how fortunate I was, and how how big a feat
• 42:25
  Speaker 2: that was, and what what that championship would mean to
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: so many people, having experienced the Red Sox one and
• 42:32
  Speaker 2: knowing that if I was really fortunate, I could again
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: play a small part in bringing so much joy to
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: so many people in a way that really mattered, that
• 42:42
  Speaker 2: connected generations, and that was intimate for families, and that
• 42:47
  Speaker 2: just meant so much and resonated. So yeah, that one,
• 42:50
  Speaker 2: in the moment, absolutely felt more just because I was
• 42:53
  Speaker 2: able to, you know, see it, see the game through
• 42:56
  Speaker 2: through through more your eyes and experience it through the
• 42:59
  Speaker 2: innocent eyes to my eight year old son who's now
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: eighteen and about to go off to college.
• 43:03
  Speaker 4: But.
• 43:06
  Speaker 5: Experience Yeah, congratulations on that.
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: A little less interested at eighteen years old than at
• 43:11
  Speaker 1: eight years old, but well.
• 43:12
  Speaker 5: Shit, yeah, great stuff, great stuff to you.
• 43:16
  Speaker 4: And I think when you you just kind of brought
• 43:19
  Speaker 4: something up that that I like to do in a
• 43:23
  Speaker 4: I like to venture out and just watch little random
• 43:27
  Speaker 4: little league games. If I'm driving by where I just
• 43:29
  Speaker 4: will pull over and just stop.
• 43:32
  Speaker 3: You know, it's such good medicine. I did that the
• 43:34
  Speaker 3: other day. I was I was back in Boston and
• 43:37
  Speaker 3: I went out for a run. On my way back, I.
• 43:39
  Speaker 2: Was sucking win to begin with, but on the way
• 43:41
  Speaker 2: back I passed myle literally feel and there was a
• 43:45
  Speaker 2: literally game going on. So I just I just sat
• 43:48
  Speaker 2: and watched a couple of innings and man, you just
• 43:51
  Speaker 2: you just leave there, You leave, you leave a couple
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: of innings a little game with such great appreciation for
• 43:56
  Speaker 2: getting to work in baseball for everyone is involved in
• 44:01
  Speaker 2: the game at every single level and what it means
• 44:04
  Speaker 2: to you, and it just brings you back to you
• 44:06
  Speaker 2: to your time starting.
• 44:07
  Speaker 3: Out in the game. So it is good.
• 44:09
  Speaker 2: It is a great medicine for a tough loss or
• 44:11
  Speaker 2: a tough season to go do that.
• 44:12
  Speaker 5: I agree, it fills you up.
• 44:15
  Speaker 1: And I can tell you having done all three of
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: those World Series, Major League, college and Little league, Little
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: league blows them all away. I'm sorry, it just it
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: blows them all away. For literally every reason that you've
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: sort of discussed tonight before we let you go. We
• 44:29
  Speaker 1: do this thing called the kitchen sink. I know you
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: can appreciate that from a pitching perspective. There's just four
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: quick questions that really don't have much to do with
• 44:36
  Speaker 1: baseball that kind of shed some more light onto who
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: theo Epstein is. I guess the first one I'd ask,
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: and I think we all have this particular person, THEO
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: best athlete that you remember growing up with, either being
• 44:48
  Speaker 1: a teammate or competing against. That name is always at
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: the top of your head.
• 44:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll go with Eric White, who is actually not
• 44:56
  Speaker 2: not baseball, but it was soccer, and he was the
• 44:59
  Speaker 2: one who was just sort of standard deviations above everybody
• 45:03
  Speaker 2: else and could do things with his left foot that
• 45:06
  Speaker 2: we couldn't dream of doing with our right and seemed
• 45:09
  Speaker 2: like ungodly.
• 45:10
  Speaker 3: You know. Then then you get older and you maybe
• 45:13
  Speaker 3: it wasn't that special.
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: You just weren't very good. So everyone seemed like he
• 45:17
  Speaker 2: was incredible. But that's the one, and then I'll give
• 45:20
  Speaker 2: you a baseball one. David Piken, who hopefully he watches this,
• 45:25
  Speaker 2: still living in the Boston area. But David Pike and
• 45:27
  Speaker 2: who went by Spike, was the kid who hit puberty
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: a couple of years before the rest of us.
• 45:32
  Speaker 3: So okay, big strong and harry and.
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: Was hitting hitting tanks that just seemed like they never
• 45:39
  Speaker 2: came down, and we were all scared to pitch to him.
• 45:41
  Speaker 3: So it was good. Good to have Spike on your
• 45:43
  Speaker 3: side and not have to face.
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: Someone I went to UH. I went to school at Nieda, Massachusetts.
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: One of my classmates was at that name Sonny Pandia,
• 45:53
  Speaker 1: who became Snita Williams, who went up in a rocket.
• 45:57
  Speaker 1: And I was just with some guys today from electric boat.
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: They built submarines for you if you could get into one.
• 46:03
  Speaker 1: Are you getting in a rocket or a submarine?
• 46:07
  Speaker 3: I'd probably get in a rocket, Yeah, I just I don't.
• 46:10
  Speaker 3: I don't.
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: I don't like being I guess they're both kind of confining.
• 46:13
  Speaker 2: But something about you confined and underwater, and after living
• 46:17
  Speaker 2: reading about that was a deep water horizons as I
• 46:20
  Speaker 2: was called. Yeah, I think I want no part of
• 46:25
  Speaker 2: those professional or especially amateur ones.
• 46:28
  Speaker 1: I know you have a great loaf of music. If
• 46:31
  Speaker 1: you could go back in time and sit with some musician,
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: who would it be.
• 46:39
  Speaker 2: I'll give you two answers, like maybe maybe Jimi Hendrix
• 46:43
  Speaker 2: right after he went to London was kind of bursting
• 46:45
  Speaker 2: on the scene.
• 46:45
  Speaker 3: That'd be pretty fun.
• 46:46
  Speaker 2: And then I'd like to hang out with the Stones
• 46:49
  Speaker 2: at Melcote in the summer of seventy one. It seems
• 46:53
  Speaker 2: seems like that would be that would be a pretty
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: good time, make an exile on main Street.
• 46:57
  Speaker 5: That'd be fun to hang awesome.
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: And then Ashley, is there is there a is there
• 47:03
  Speaker 1: a dream job that you still would like to pursue
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: and perhaps land in any facet of life.
• 47:12
  Speaker 2: I mean, I think I've kind of got the dream
• 47:14
  Speaker 2: job of you know, the one that you have to
• 47:17
  Speaker 2: appreciate the most is being dad, you know, and that's
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: the one that that you can't go back and do
• 47:21
  Speaker 2: it again.
• 47:22
  Speaker 3: You can't sign up for another go around.
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: So kind of kind of in the dream job now
• 47:27
  Speaker 2: and then I'm so lucky that I get to get
• 47:30
  Speaker 2: to stay in sports with a couple of these these
• 47:32
  Speaker 2: side gigs I have, and even a connection to baseball
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: with the Red Sox and some of the work I
• 47:38
  Speaker 2: was lucky enough to do it major League Baseballs and
• 47:41
  Speaker 2: and things like this, So I.
• 47:43
  Speaker 3: Know I got a pretty good balance going on right now.
• 47:45
  Speaker 3: I couldn't. I've been real lucky, so I couldn't ask
• 47:47
  Speaker 3: for anything more than I want to have.
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: I'll paraphrase ja Man's question where he says, do you
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: what do you think about the state of the Red Sox?
• 47:55
  Speaker 1: Where are you right now with with regards to the
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: the optimism and things turn around for them. I'm not
• 48:01
  Speaker 1: going to get into the specifics of the question about
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: Bregman and Breslo and all that stuff.
• 48:05
  Speaker 3: I don't think it's.
• 48:07
  Speaker 1: Appropriate for this forum, but just the Red Sox. You know,
• 48:10
  Speaker 1: the passion the fan base has Yeah.
• 48:12
  Speaker 2: I've done a really good job of staying out of
• 48:14
  Speaker 2: the media the conversation around the team. That's one of
• 48:16
  Speaker 2: the cool things about just get being an advisor, as
• 48:19
  Speaker 2: I can kind of get my opinion and I.
• 48:21
  Speaker 3: Don't have to be part of the public conversation.
• 48:23
  Speaker 2: But I'll say I was actually the first couple of
• 48:26
  Speaker 2: minutes I was watching the Red Sox to clean up
• 48:27
  Speaker 2: what looked like a get three to one win. But
• 48:29
  Speaker 2: I'll say the pitching and defense have been fantastic and
• 48:33
  Speaker 2: actually obviously everyone and that's not an easy feat, right
• 48:37
  Speaker 2: to have that foundation now, you know, having to figure
• 48:41
  Speaker 2: out the offense and fix it midstream is important.
• 48:45
  Speaker 3: But yeah, there's something to build around.
• 48:47
  Speaker 2: With the pitching and defense, and I know Bras and
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: the guys are hard at work on fixing the offense.
• 48:54
  Speaker 1: Hey, listen, man, I know we can't thank you enough.
• 48:57
  Speaker 1: You're a good friend and I appreciate the time you
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: give here. I certainly uh want to wish you and
• 49:03
  Speaker 1: uh Justin I speak for him as well. You know,
• 49:06
  Speaker 1: sympathies to your daddy year. This is a significant date
• 49:08
  Speaker 1: in your life. I know how important Leslie was to you,
• 49:11
  Speaker 1: so uh and I know this in a matter of time,
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: and it won't be a short time. But there's so
• 49:16
  Speaker 1: much more to get to with somebody like you. We'd
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: love to we'd love to have a reservation for you
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: down the road again to come back.
• 49:22
  Speaker 3: All of us. Yeah, you got it.
• 49:24
  Speaker 2: Well, congrats on on this project. It's it's filling an
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: important void in the industry. And hope a lot of
• 49:32
  Speaker 2: people tune in and I'll be tuning in in the
• 49:35
  Speaker 2: future to get you know, to get great advice on
• 49:38
  Speaker 2: the right way to develop young young baseball players. And
• 49:41
  Speaker 2: as I said, you know, when when baseball is healthy,
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: our country is healthy.
• 49:44
  Speaker 3: So you guys are doing a service. I appreciate it.
• 49:46
  Speaker 3: Thanks for having me.
• 49:47
  Speaker 1: Thanks you you're good man. Thank you so much for
• 49:48
  Speaker 1: being with us.
• 49:49
  Speaker 5: Thanks