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Owning the Future: USVC Explained with Ankur Nagpal · In the Loop AI

• 0:00
  Josh: Right now, if you want to invest in the hottest companies in the world,
• 0:02
  Josh: SpaceX, OpenAI, and Anthropic, you really can't.
• 0:05
  Josh: It's normally an activity reserved for the ultra-wealthy who are accredited
• 0:08
  Josh: and involves a lot of jumping through hoops.
• 0:10
  Josh: Well, this week, there's a fund that enables you to invest in all three and more.
• 0:13
  Josh: And it seems like a pretty awesome deal, but the internet has some skeptics
• 0:17
  Josh: and questions about how it works.
• 0:18
  Ejaaz: Well, the good news is we have the GP of the fund here, Ankur Nagpal,
• 0:21
  Ejaaz: on the show to answer all these questions. Ankur, what's up, dude?
• 0:24
  Ankur: What's up? Excited for this. It's been a really, really fun week and yeah,
• 0:28
  Ankur: looking forward to digging in.
• 0:29
  Ejaaz: Okay, so the headline I keep seeing everywhere is with this investment vehicle,
• 0:33
  Ejaaz: now the average show can invest 500 bucks in their favorite company before they go public.
• 0:38
  Ejaaz: So if you have 500 bucks, you can invest in Anthropic and OpenAI.
• 0:40
  Ejaaz: But I want to take a few steps back because I think people are missing the wider
• 0:44
  Ejaaz: story as to why this makes sense now and why you're doing it.
• 0:47
  Ejaaz: So that's my first question.
• 0:47
  Ejaaz: Why does USVC exist at all? And why is now the right time for this?
• 0:51
  Ankur: So if you look at where most of the money is being made in private technology
• 0:57
  Ankur: companies now, Now, it's been happening before these companies go public.
• 1:02
  Ankur: Businesses are taking so long to get out there. And the result of that is the
• 1:07
  Ankur: average person misses out on that wealth creation.
• 1:10
  Ankur: So the goal with USVC is to build a vehicle for people to invest in the future
• 1:16
  Ankur: of American technology.
• 1:18
  Ankur: Now, it's easy to look at, you know, OpenAI, Anthropic, and all of that.
• 1:22
  Ankur: Those are the names we have today.
• 1:23
  Ankur: But a big part of this fund is investing in the companies of the future.
• 1:27
  Ankur: So it's not just late stage private tech of which, you know,
• 1:31
  Ankur: there are other products as well, but it's also backing the smaller companies
• 1:35
  Ankur: starting today that will be relevant three, five, seven years from now.
• 1:39
  Ejaaz: Okay. And how does USVC specifically solve this problem? Can you like walk us
• 1:43
  Ejaaz: through like if I'm someone that's investing 500 bucks today,
• 1:46
  Ejaaz: what is exactly happening with my money?
• 1:48
  Ankur: Yeah. So historically, the way investing in private startups work,
• 1:52
  Ankur: and this is kind of bizarre.
• 1:54
  Ankur: In the U.S., historically, you have to be something called an accredited investor,
• 1:58
  Ankur: which means you need to have a net worth of millions of dollars in order to invest in a startup.
• 2:05
  Ankur: And there's different opinions on why it exists, but it's a bit ridiculous when
• 2:09
  Ankur: you think about, you know, you can invest in any sort of derivative crypto product
• 2:12
  Ankur: without that. I can go gamble.
• 2:14
  Ankur: I can go bet on Polymarket on how long Donald Trump will shake his hand for.
• 2:19
  Ankur: But investing in Enthropic or OpenAI is illegal for the average person.
• 2:25
  Ankur: So the goal with US VC and, you know, we're SEC approved to do this is to offer a registered fund.
• 2:33
  Ankur: Again, you know, people should understand that this is investing in venture capital.
• 2:37
  Ankur: It is still a speculative asset class. We always say with VC,
• 2:41
  Ankur: only invest what you can afford to lose. It is an illiquid investment.
• 2:44
  Ankur: Like, do not think of it comparable to investing in the stock market.
• 2:48
  Ankur: However, if you're someone that otherwise has a balanced portfolio,
• 2:51
  Ankur: it could make sense to allocate, you know, 3%, 5%, 7%, something like that to
• 2:57
  Ankur: this basket of high growth technology companies and effectively own a piece of the future.
• 3:02
  Josh: Awesome. So I'm investing in this. I see a price on the page that says the NAV is $19.95.
• 3:08
  Josh: And I have a little bit of PTSD, right? There was a company that launched,
• 3:11
  Josh: or an ETF that launched a few weeks ago that went up like 10x in one day and
• 3:15
  Josh: then it crashed back down.
• 3:16
  Josh: But I understand that that's because the NAV was actually much lower than the
• 3:19
  Josh: company was trading for.
• 3:20
  Josh: I believe USVC is handling this a bit differently. So when I see the price $19.95
• 3:24
  Josh: on the screen, what is that getting me and how do you handle the pricing?
• 3:27
  Josh: Is it subject to that fluctuation?
• 3:29
  Josh: How would you explain NAV to a person who doesn't really understand?
• 3:32
  Ankur: That's a really good question, because ultimately, US VC is a fundamentally
• 3:36
  Ankur: different product from all the ETFs.
• 3:39
  Ankur: I believe there is, you know, Fundrise has an ETF called, can't remember the
• 3:42
  Ankur: ticker, Robinoot has an ETF as well.
• 3:44
  Ankur: And while these are trying to give the average investor access to private companies,
• 3:50
  Ankur: they're fundamentally different products.
• 3:52
  Ankur: And the reason for that is, their price is sort of divorced from the underlying
• 3:57
  Ankur: value of assets. So even right now, the Fundrise ticker VCX,
• 4:00
  Ankur: for instance, it's trading at roughly four times the price of the underlying companies.
• 4:07
  Ankur: And if you're an early investor, that's great. You're opting the money and it can work really well.
• 4:12
  Ankur: But in down markets, this can also sort of trade not in lockstep with the underlying companies.
• 4:17
  Ankur: So you could, as an example, buy this ETF, the companies could do well,
• 4:22
  Ankur: but you could still lose money because the pricing is sort of divorced from
• 4:25
  Ankur: the underlying value. Now, USVC is a different structure.
• 4:29
  Ankur: It is not an ETF, so it is not easily tradable. However, the price is determined
• 4:35
  Ankur: by the price of the underlying companies.
• 4:37
  Ankur: So the NAV that you see only changes if and when one of the underlying companies
• 4:43
  Ankur: has an updated valuation.
• 4:44
  Ankur: So it's a slower sort of moving NAV.
• 4:47
  Ankur: Now, in turn, you may wonder, okay, this is well and good, but if it's not tradable,
• 4:52
  Ankur: how do I actually get my money out?
• 4:54
  Ankur: And the way this works is quarterly, the goal of this fund, and we caveat it
• 5:00
  Ankur: with like, look, we aim to do this just because according to your perspective, it's not guaranteed.
• 5:04
  Ankur: But if we are to do our job well, we have to meet a quarterly redemption of
• 5:09
  Ankur: up to 5% of the fund at the actual NAV.
• 5:13
  Ankur: Now, that doesn't mean each investor is limited to 5%. it means 5% of the entire
• 5:18
  Ankur: fund will be made available for redemptions every single quarter.
• 5:23
  Ankur: So as an example, if we have 100 million in assets, we'll do 5 million every
• 5:27
  Ankur: quarter that'll be available to investors on a pro rata basis.
• 5:29
  Ejaaz: On the point of redemption, I understand that the shares obviously aren't listed, right?
• 5:34
  Ejaaz: So redemptions are quarterly, like you mentioned, but there's a cap.
• 5:37
  Ejaaz: I think it's like 5% of NAV at the board's discretion.
• 5:40
  Ejaaz: So a two-part question that I have for you is, in a real panic,
• 5:44
  Ejaaz: like what actually happens to someone who wants to get out of this vehicle, right?
• 5:48
  Ejaaz: Has the board already pre-committed to offering the tender every different quarter or can they skip?
• 5:54
  Ejaaz: Like what are people liable for? Who's liable for here?
• 5:57
  Ankur: So ultimately we or the board reserves the right to skip.
• 6:01
  Ankur: However, it is in our best interest. Our interests are aligned.
• 6:04
  Ankur: If we are a fund that is skipping tender offers, it becomes a less attractive
• 6:09
  Ankur: investment product and it ultimately hurts us quite a bit.
• 6:13
  Ankur: However, it's still important to anyone listening. Like, again,
• 6:16
  Ankur: this is venture. It's a different asset class.
• 6:18
  Ankur: Like, think about a venture fund. It is a highly illiquid investment.
• 6:22
  Ankur: This does have tender offers, which is typical, which is better than a venture
• 6:25
  Ankur: fund. In a venture fund, your money is locked up for 10 years.
• 6:28
  Ankur: You have nothing you can do about it.
• 6:29
  Ankur: However, like, you know, we're kind of repeating, this is an illiquid product.
• 6:34
  Ankur: Think about it like, you know, like similar to how you think about a venture fund.
• 6:38
  Josh: So there is a lot more stability than something that we saw with BCX.
• 6:41
  Ankur: Absolutely. Yeah. The upside is, look, like you're actually owning something
• 6:44
  Ankur: close to the underlying asset, which the ETFs, I think, are really fun.
• 6:48
  Ankur: I mean, I, you know, dabble in it myself, but I think of it almost like a speculative
• 6:52
  Ankur: ticker to kind of trade the sentiment on these names more so than anything else.
• 6:57
  Josh: So you mentioned owning the underlying asset. I guess I'm curious,
• 7:00
  Josh: how close are we to that underlying asset?
• 7:02
  Josh: And the question there is, I understand some of these are SPVs.
• 7:05
  Josh: They're not directly on the cap table.
• 7:07
  Josh: SPVs generally come with fees, which has been a big thing that I've seen people
• 7:10
  Josh: on the internet talking about is the fee structure, what you're paying for as
• 7:13
  Josh: a premium in order to access this.
• 7:15
  Josh: Could you speak to the fee structure a little bit here? Yeah, absolutely.
• 7:17
  Ankur: So our strategy is multifold. One of the tenets of our strategy is when it comes
• 7:22
  Ankur: to early stage investing, like pre-seed and seed, it's very hard for us to keep
• 7:26
  Ankur: track of what are the most promising companies.
• 7:28
  Ankur: So there, our goal is to find the most promising GPs that run these specialized
• 7:33
  Ankur: pre-seed and seed funds and be their source of capital.
• 7:37
  Ankur: The benefit of doing this is when they want to write a follow-on check,
• 7:40
  Ankur: like a series A or a series B check, we can be their source of capital. In terms of how we're
• 7:47
  Ankur: This is a very small seed portfolio. We'll hopefully be announcing a lot of new investments soon.
• 7:53
  Ankur: The early investments are largely through a single underlying fund.
• 7:57
  Ankur: However, moving forward, a lot of investments that are planned are direct on the cap table.
• 8:02
  Ankur: And this is important because if it's direct on the cap table,
• 8:05
  Ankur: it means there's no management fee.
• 8:07
  Ankur: But also because this type of registered fund doesn't charge carry,
• 8:10
  Ankur: there's no carry as well, which makes it very, very competitive from a pricing
• 8:14
  Ankur: and fee perspective for any of those direct investments.
• 8:17
  Ejaaz: Wow, that's great if you're getting the direct investment on the table.
• 8:21
  Ejaaz: But just to kind of step back for a second and kind of walk through maybe an
• 8:25
  Ejaaz: example, like I know a lot of the companies that you're investing in right now aren't public.
• 8:29
  Ejaaz: They're meant to, they're very highly valued. They've been valued maximally
• 8:32
  Ejaaz: over the last couple of months, especially in the AI world.
• 8:34
  Ejaaz: If we stepped back, say, a year ago, right, when OpenAI was worth a couple hundred
• 8:38
  Ejaaz: billion dollars or even a hundred billion dollars, let's say this vehicle existed back then.
• 8:43
  Ejaaz: Can you walk us through an example of if I'd invested a thousand dollars in
• 8:46
  Ejaaz: here, how much would I be up right now?
• 8:48
  Ejaaz: How much could I have taken out? Are you able to give us a kind of walkthrough?
• 8:52
  Ankur: Yeah, let me, we can try and work through this live, right?
• 8:55
  Ankur: So again, this fund took us a while to set up and we sort of don't control the
• 8:59
  Ankur: market conditions and they are what they are.
• 9:01
  Ankur: But theoretically, every time there's a markup, what happens is you look at
• 9:05
  Ankur: what that company size is a percentage of NAV and that markup is reflected in NAV.
• 9:11
  Ankur: And so that goes up and you could theoretically start redeeming quarterly based
• 9:15
  Ankur: on that sort of inflated NAV value.
• 9:19
  Ankur: Even now, part of our strategy is we believe there are opportunities to come
• 9:25
  Ankur: in and buy out certain positions at discounts.
• 9:28
  Ankur: These could be secondaries in funds, secondaries in companies.
• 9:31
  Ankur: And the benefit there is as a company raises a new brand of financing,
• 9:35
  Ankur: that's a little, that's a markup to NAV, which theoretically could benefit people.
• 9:39
  Ankur: Working backwards, it's tough to model out exactly what this is because
• 9:43
  Ankur: There's a huge sensitivity on position size and fund size, right?
• 9:47
  Ankur: Because as an example, if we own a SpaceX position that is 20% of our fund,
• 9:54
  Ankur: but then our fund grows, our position effectively gets diluted unless we're
• 9:57
  Ankur: kind of buying more to keep up with it.
• 9:59
  Ankur: And that sort of makes some of this math a little bit more complicated.
• 10:03
  Ejaaz: One thing that kind of stood out to me when I was digging into this and I tweeted
• 10:07
  Ejaaz: about this, you responded to me because you were like, some of these management
• 10:09
  Ejaaz: fee estimations are wrong, is this is happening on AngelList.
• 10:14
  Ejaaz: Now, AngelList is a widely successful platform, but why is it particularly suited
• 10:18
  Ejaaz: for this particular product?
• 10:19
  Ankur: For people who don't know about this, AngelList has been around for 15 years.
• 10:23
  Ankur: They're sort of, you know, at this point, they've had multiple sort of generations
• 10:26
  Ankur: of leaders and employees come. And, you know, it's been around.
• 10:28
  Ankur: It's been a fixture since...
• 10:30
  Ankur: I've now built and sold two companies and they are how I raised money for my
• 10:34
  Ankur: first company over 10 years ago. So they've been around for a very, very long time.
• 10:38
  Ankur: But the benefit of the AngelList platform is they are where the majority of
• 10:43
  Ankur: early stage investing happens.
• 10:45
  Ankur: They are the fund manager of choice for a lot of early stage investors.
• 10:49
  Ankur: They are the SPV tool for most companies.
• 10:52
  Ankur: And as a result, their platform has really good exposure to all of these early
• 10:57
  Ankur: stage assets, which is a very good vantage point for us if we're like,
• 11:01
  Ankur: hey, you know, we want to go acquire a stake in Anthropic.
• 11:05
  Ankur: Let's see, you know, there's a lot of Anthropic investors on AngelList.
• 11:07
  Ankur: We know who to reach out to.
• 11:08
  Ankur: So that makes it a very attractive sort of very logical institution to start a product like this.
• 11:16
  Ejaaz: So when I think about I saw someone explain this on X, there was a lot of activity yesterday.
• 11:22
  Ejaaz: So if you understand, right, the walkthrough, I put in 500 bucks and the way
• 11:27
  Ejaaz: I outlined it in my explanation yesterday over here was there's a 3% management
• 11:33
  Ejaaz: fee in total aggregated, not 1%.
• 11:35
  Ejaaz: It's a double layer vehicle. So you go at USVC at the top, you're paying them
• 11:39
  Ejaaz: a management fee. There's no carry.
• 11:40
  Ejaaz: So there's no necessary incentive for you guys to maybe like work on the or
• 11:45
  Ejaaz: like hold particular positions.
• 11:47
  Ejaaz: But then at the bottom, right, the layers that you guys are investing in where
• 11:50
  Ejaaz: these GPs are actually like putting in chunks on the cap table on L1 SPVs,
• 11:54
  Ejaaz: they then take a 220, right?
• 11:56
  Ejaaz: So in my mind, that made sense as 3%. But you clarified over here,
• 12:00
  Ejaaz: you said our management fee is actually 1% and the total expense ratio right
• 12:03
  Ejaaz: now is 2.5%. I think that's really important and people don't understand that.
• 12:07
  Ejaaz: Can you, would you mind like explaining how exactly you get to that?
• 12:10
  Ankur: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, that's a, it's a nuance that matters to people closer to this.
• 12:15
  Ankur: What investors care about is their expense ratio but that's different from a
• 12:19
  Ankur: management fee you know the idea because a 2.5% management fee looks like 2.5%
• 12:23
  Ankur: going into our pocket the reality
• 12:25
  Ankur: is the expense ratio which is the net percentage investors are paying
• 12:30
  Ankur: is 2.5% right now.
• 12:34
  Ankur: And the mechanics and the scare to some people is it's really right now 3 point something percent.
• 12:40
  Ankur: We subsidize it out of our pocket to make it 2.5%. Now you may wonder,
• 12:44
  Ankur: why are we doing it? Why is it so high?
• 12:46
  Ankur: The reason is when you start funds like these, they're pretty expensive to start.
• 12:49
  Ankur: So all these funds will have very high expense ratios up front because there's fixed costs, right?
• 12:54
  Ankur: And when you have like 10 or 20 or 30 million in assets, those fixed costs are really high.
• 12:59
  Ankur: However, we think the 2.5% is very competitive because again,
• 13:02
  Ankur: you know, if you compare this to a Vanguard fund, you'll be like,
• 13:05
  Ankur: this is like why 2.5%, that's crazy.
• 13:08
  Ankur: But venture funds typically are 2%. And Drees and some other funds are 2.5%.
• 13:14
  Ankur: However, if you're a venture fund of funds, which we partially are,
• 13:18
  Ankur: those are typically 3% if you include the underlying.
• 13:21
  Ankur: So this 2.5% cap, I think makes us very competitive, especially when you factor
• 13:25
  Ankur: in, we don't charge carry. Now, some of our investments are in funds and they
• 13:31
  Ankur: underlying have their own carry.
• 13:33
  Ankur: However, all the direct investments don't have that and there's no carry on our end.
• 13:37
  Ankur: The combination of that, I think, compared to the world of venture products
• 13:41
  Ankur: makes this very competitive.
• 13:43
  Ankur: And a big part of why even, you know, you're like, okay, why is it even two
• 13:46
  Ankur: and a half is when you try and distribute a fund like this to retail,
• 13:50
  Ankur: there's just operational fees that really add up.
• 13:53
  Ankur: But from a management fee perspective, I mean, you know, we were looking at 1% or 100 bps.
• 13:58
  Ankur: And within that, we're, you know, have to do sales and marketing and a lot of other stuff.
• 14:02
  Ankur: And right now, we're honestly subsidizing most of it.
• 14:04
  Josh: Awesome. Okay, so we understand why this works. The fund structure.
• 14:07
  Josh: Now, let's talk about the portfolio of what you actually get when you invest
• 14:10
  Josh: in this thing. I see XAI on there, Anthropic, OpenAI being three of the larger ones.
• 14:15
  Josh: And particularly when I see the largest holding, I mean, 20 and a quarter percent is XAI.
• 14:20
  Josh: Now, as most people know, XAI has been acquired by SpaceX on February 3rd at
• 14:24
  Josh: one and a quarter trillion dollar valuation.
• 14:26
  Josh: So that position now is functionally pre-IPO SpaceX.
• 14:30
  Josh: Is that kind of how you think about it internally? and are the people investing
• 14:33
  Josh: in that acquisition price or is this a higher markup closer to what it's looking
• 14:38
  Josh: like as it IPOs this year?
• 14:39
  Ankur: Yeah, so I think the most recent mark on this, and I think we've shared this,
• 14:45
  Ankur: was a few weeks ago based on some internal documentation. It's not the IPO price,
• 14:50
  Ankur: right? That's speculative. That hasn't happened. We don't know when that is.
• 14:53
  Ankur: My general caveat with all of this is like, look, some of this may look super
• 14:57
  Ankur: opportunistic. You can get in before certain marks and all of that.
• 15:01
  Ankur: I don't encourage that type of thinking in general. I think you should think
• 15:04
  Ankur: about this as a long-term investment.
• 15:07
  Ankur: Are you long-term bullish on venture as an asset class? If so, great.
• 15:11
  Ankur: I think these positions are great. I obviously like these companies.
• 15:14
  Ankur: However, this is such a small percentage of what we will and plan to do.
• 15:19
  Ankur: And something you'll see soon is we're going to be very public with our investments.
• 15:22
  Ankur: Hopefully as soon as next week, we'll announce newer positions.
• 15:26
  Ankur: And so people can kind of see the portfolio evolve in real time.
• 15:29
  Ankur: But my general guidance is like consider
• 15:33
  Ankur: investing in this if you're generally bullish about the asset class
• 15:36
  Ankur: you want to own a piece of the most important technology companies in
• 15:39
  Ankur: the future you can withstand the
• 15:42
  Ankur: lack of liquidity and the fact that it's a speculative asset class and do it
• 15:45
  Ankur: for that don't do it because you really like the SpaceX position or the Anthropic
• 15:50
  Ankur: position these are great companies we wished we owned more of them but right
• 15:54
  Ankur: now we've added a lot in cash these positions have effectively gotten diluted
• 15:58
  Ankur: and we think the future is not just these companies,
• 16:01
  Ankur: but the companies that everyone will talk about three years from now and five years from now.
• 16:06
  Josh: Awesome, so yeah, notably in the portfolio, 56% of the holdings,
• 16:10
  Josh: if you purchase today, are cash.
• 16:11
  Josh: So you're buying basically this potential upside opportunity for whatever the
• 16:15
  Josh: fund decides to invest in.
• 16:16
  Josh: How do you consider allocating that and what is the velocity people can expect you to deploy that?
• 16:21
  Josh: I found a lot of people were kind of mentioning they don't want to invest in
• 16:24
  Josh: something that's half cash.
• 16:25
  Josh: So what is the plan to deploy that and kind of how quick?
• 16:28
  Ankur: Totally. I mean, our goal is we'd want to ideally hold close to
• 16:33
  Ankur: 10 to 20 percent somewhere or maybe even a little bit less in cash and cash
• 16:37
  Ankur: equivalents and again the reason we want to do that is we have to quarterly
• 16:39
  Ankur: tenders right like if all your dollars are invested in venture that's very illiquid
• 16:44
  Ankur: and quarterly tenders become a little bit difficult so
• 16:47
  Ankur: ideally we would like to keep some kind of buffer in either cash or public equivalents
• 16:51
  Ankur: where we can go make our tenders however we intend to be deploying these dollars
• 16:55
  Ankur: quite aggressively and aggressive doesn't mean we're going to index all of late
• 17:00
  Ankur: stage private tech but you know we're going to be backing a lot of early stage fund managers,
• 17:06
  Ankur: a lot of companies directly on the cap table,
• 17:08
  Ankur: buy out some kind of fund positions as well.
• 17:12
  Ankur: There's a lot I can't talk about because these are deals in progress.
• 17:15
  Ankur: But again, we've been very active on the social so far and we will continue
• 17:21
  Ankur: to be when we announce each new position.
• 17:23
  Ankur: And what's cool is for a lot of these companies, they're pretty small.
• 17:25
  Ankur: So they will also announce it to their community and it could be a great way
• 17:29
  Ankur: to activate their community to own a small piece of the business.
• 17:31
  Ejaaz: A very important nuance that you've described several times on the show so far
• 17:36
  Ejaaz: is this isn't trading like a public stock, right? The VCE game,
• 17:39
  Ejaaz: venture game is very, very different.
• 17:41
  Ejaaz: It is more asymmetric. Deals are
• 17:44
  Ejaaz: kind of like aggregated and dealt with within a very few set of actors.
• 17:48
  Ejaaz: And these rounds of valuations can mark up pretty massively.
• 17:52
  Ejaaz: So it takes time and it's a long haul thing.
• 17:54
  Ejaaz: I get that. You mentioned like, it's the long game, right?
• 17:57
  Ejaaz: Three to five years is what you said. In three to five years,
• 18:00
  Ejaaz: or maybe even a decade, what's the best outcome for USVC?
• 18:05
  Ankur: So the best outcome for us is if you look at the data, venture capital as an
• 18:10
  Ankur: asset class has the potential to outperform public markets while also being
• 18:17
  Ankur: somewhat uncorrelated.
• 18:19
  Ankur: So if we can sort of index that, right, like I can't commit to an IRR, I can't commit to that.
• 18:24
  Ankur: But if we can effectively outperform while not being fully correlated,
• 18:30
  Ankur: that's sort of, that's why endowments invest in venture, right?
• 18:33
  Ankur: Like it's two things. It's the alpha and the lack of beta.
• 18:36
  Ankur: And that's sort of the goal here as well.
• 18:40
  Josh: Awesome. Well, thank you. Sadly, we are out of time. I wish we had more time
• 18:43
  Josh: to chat about this, but I very much appreciate you coming on the show to join
• 18:46
  Josh: us to kind of explain the perceptions around it, to give some clarity to this fund.
• 18:50
  Josh: Any final thoughts for anyone on kind of the steps they should take if they're
• 18:54
  Josh: interested in participating or just learning more?
• 18:55
  Ankur: Yeah, look, I mean, usvc.com is our website. At this point, you know, we've been,
• 19:01
  Ankur: the response has been phenomenal and it's honestly blown every expectation so
• 19:05
  Ankur: it's gone from like oh you should invest in usvc to all the reasons people should
• 19:09
  Ankur: you know be careful and think about liquidity and you know what they can afford
• 19:14
  Ankur: to invest and stuff but no check it out at usvc.com and thanks for having me guys
• 19:18
  Josh: Awesome we really appreciate the time thank you so much thanks.