Latest / Dear Chelsea / Drunk Vegas Confessions with Chelsea + Catherine

Transcript

Drunk Vegas Confessions with Chelsea + Catherine · Dear Chelsea

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Hi Catherine, Hi Chelsea, how are you.
• 0:02
  Speaker 2: I'm great, Thank you. I'm been in my worka Oh delightful.
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: I love it, Simon, It's wonderful.
• 0:08
  Speaker 2: I know.
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: Well, I have an update for us, Chelsea. This is
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: from Ali. She called in on our Monica Lewinsky episode
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: and she was about to have a birthday, but her
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: father had died when she was very young and kind
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: of like around her birth Yes, I remember it, yeah,
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: reminded her. So Ali says, Hi, Chelsea, it's been a
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: couple months since I came on to chat with you
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: both and Monica about grieving my dad while celebrating my
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: thirtieth birthday. I took your advice of focusing on celebrating
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: him his thirty eight years on this earth and really
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: finding that distinction between grief and suffering. I'm a recovering
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: Irish Catholic from Boston, so I love an Irish week
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: style of celebrating someone who's past. My friends and I
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: toasted him and welcomed his energy into the birthday weekend,
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: and they reminded me that celebrating me inherently includes celebrating him,
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: because he brought me here. Thank you for giving us
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: of quote unquote permission to approach it that way. The
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: weekend was joyous and felt revolutionary. I absolutely turned over
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: a new leaf, and I'm ever grateful to you for
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: your help in that. I cannot believe I forgot to
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: tell you this, Chelsea, but my dad's favorite activity in
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: the world was skiing, particularly in Whistler. When he's not
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: hanging around us in day to day life, that's definitely
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: where he is. Maybe I know, maybe next year I'll
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: spend my birthday there. I know many folks right into
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: the show about grief, so I wanted to also share
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: an incredible nonprofit and Power. They provide one on one
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: mentorship to children and young adults navigating the loss of
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: their mothers or fathers. Grief is so many things, and
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: our mission is to show children and youth that loss
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: is survivable. If anyone listening wants to share with a
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: grieving child or youth they love or has experienced parent
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: loss at any age and wants to become a mentor,
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: they can head to we are empower dot org. Thanks
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: again for your advice and for what you do each week.
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: Ali, that is so sad, that's so great. That part
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: is great. That makes me cry thinking about children grieving.
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: They're my parents. I can't even.
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: Watch an old season of Master Chef Junior, and one
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: of the kids had lost his dad, and it was
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: kind of amazing to see how he was dealing with it.
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: You could tell he had processed it a lot because
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: when he talked about it, there was just sort of
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: like he seemed okay, you know, he seemed like he'd
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: done the work. And even though he was like an
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: eleven or twelve year old. You know, having a kid
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: go through therapy and talk about this stuff can be
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: really helpful when they lose somebody else.
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: And also to know how resilient the you know, human
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: spirit is like, you don't know how resilient people are
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: until you have to be resilient, right, So that's it's
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: so hard to teach that to someone like you're going
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: to survive almost anything that happens emotionally or you know,
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: or any losses, like you're going to go on. It's
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: a hard concept, especially when you're a child. Your world
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: is even smaller right than it is as an adult.
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: You don't even think about all the moving parts that
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: are happening totally.
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: So thank you Ali for updating us. And I'll make
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: sure that this empower is in the show notes, so
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: if anybody wants to check that out, there will be
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: a link there.
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: So I missed Doug. I miss Doug so hard. It's
• 3:08
  Speaker 2: just at home.
• 3:09
  Speaker 3: I know.
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: I didn't want to bring him to Spain because he's
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: gonna be so fucking hot here, but now it's not
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: that hot, and now I'm like, fuck, I can he
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: take a flat without me? Just get his own private chat?
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: I diaged that once with a dog. I s flew
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: him privately without me. Oh no, which was really stupid.
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: I don't do things like that anymore.
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: Doug will be amazing and you'll just have to reconnect
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: with him and separate him from Mabel.
• 3:33
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: I know she went to a FaceTime with me.
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: Yes, here's your mother.
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: She's like, oh, sorry, we fell asleep. I'm like, I
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: bet you did. I also believe she gives him CBD
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: because he's so oh, he's so calm when I come
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: back from being away. Yeah, and I know she's up
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: to something, you know, because she doesn't want to deal
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: with his lunacy. And I saw the CBD and I
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: was like, who is that for? And she's like, oh,
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: if we're doug sometimes I'll make sometimes or all the
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: time like are you she's All of my dogs have
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: been drugged. And this is just another example of how
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: it happens.
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: You know what my aunt used to do with my
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: nephew who's like very hyper, when she would take care
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: of him, instead of like, you know, giving him a
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: CBD or something, she would say, hey, let's have a
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: cup of tea together at the beginning of their time together,
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: and she would give him sleepy time tea and then
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: he was like totally manageable.
• 4:21
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, I.
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: Mean sleepy time tea and like an eleven year old boy,
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: it's a matchmain heat.
• 4:26
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: Melatonin is good for kids too. My friends are always
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: slipping their kids melatonin. I mean only the good parents,
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: though I would make them snort melatonin if I had children.
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. Okay, well, should we get into questions jelse?
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: Yes, please, let's move it. Let's move it along, let's
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: do it. Today's a solo episode. That means Catherine and
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: I are here alone.
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: Yes, full of our own resources only.
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that means they could take more callers. Oh, by
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: the way, tell our audience about the many episodes that
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: we're doing. We're adding ten minute minisodes.
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: They'll come out every other week, and it's.
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: Gonna be different. It's gonna be counseling from me with
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: a group of people or a couple like friends, sisters,
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: people in a relationship. I'm going to counsel them and
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: we're gonna break them into little ten minute episodes. So
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: that's gonna be great. I can't fucking wait. It's gonna
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: be So we're not gonna I mean, I want people
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: to bring really stupid problems to me. So if you're
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: in a relationship and it's not a serious issue, if
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: it's your friend, or if it's your with your mother
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: or your sister or your lover, and you want you
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: have something really stupid that you want to bring. Please,
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: this is our reprieve from the seriousness of the show.
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: We want to get I want to get silly.
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, these minisos are going to be perfect for like
• 5:42
  Speaker 1: if you have that argument with your spouse or with
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: your best friend that you like just need a tiebreaker on,
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: like who is right here? Chelsea is the person who.
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: Can to help? Yeah, I love that shit, guys.
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so right in and I actually have on our
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: next couple solo episodes. I have two couples calling in.
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: Oh I love finally fly. Oh my god, this is
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: exactly what I've been wanting. I've manifested it exactly.
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: You know, what happens a lot of the time is
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: a person will be like, I'm going to get my
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: husband to come on and talk about this with me,
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: and the person who wants to call into a podcast
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: inevitably marries the type of person who would never do
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: such a thing. So then they come back to me
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: and they're like, just kidding, forget ever emailed you, forget
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: my name, But today we have one and it's very,
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: very exciting. Actually, should we take a little break.
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: Okay, let's take a break first.
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: This week, we're looking for a relationship advice. If you're
• 6:37
  Speaker 1: having a problem in your relationship, want to know how
• 6:39
  Speaker 1: to do better, or need Chelsea to weigh in on
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: whether you're right about something. Right into Dear Chelsea podcast
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: at gmail dot com. Okay, we're back. We're back with Savannah.
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: Savannah says Dear Chelsea. I'm a thirty one year old
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: woman living in the Midwest, and I've had the craziest
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: three hundred and sixty five days of my life. I
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: went into rehab in July of twenty twenty three, and
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: I'm just over a month out of rehab, intensive inpatient,
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: and then out patient in that order. I'm just about
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: to get my first year of sobriety. I'm reacclimating to
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: the world, and I'm figuring out where my story fits
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: in my day.
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: Today.
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: I'm currently on the job hunt and I'm having anxiety
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: over how to address the year ish gap in my resume.
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: I work in marketing and have grown to love it,
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: mostly excluding the fifteen percent of the job that is
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: crazy stressful but chock full of adrenaline. I know I'm
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: good at my job and it's pretty much all I
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: know professionally, so switching careers is out of the question.
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: So as I begin to coordinate interviews, I'm wondering what
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: the fuck to say in my interviews about the gap
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: in my resume aka rehab. I've played with the idea
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: of semi fibbing and saying I was taken care of
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: a loved one to just being straight up honest about
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: going to rehab. I know I can hide behind hippa,
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: and I'm conflicted about what to say during the interview process.
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: Am I going to be met with a negative bias
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: and be dismissed because rehab could be a misinterpretation of
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: my character or my worth ethic? Or should I just
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: be honest and leave it up to fate and hope
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: that my interviewers will be understanding. I want to be
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: honest and I don't mind talking about it, but I
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: also want a job, Savannah.
• 8:06
  Speaker 2: Can't you just say you were traveling for a year,
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: that you took a year sabbatical. There's no reason to
• 8:11
  Speaker 2: tell them rehaby because people are fucking stupid. I would
• 8:13
  Speaker 2: hire somebody because they went to rehab. I'd be like,
• 8:16
  Speaker 2: oh great, completely, so I can.
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think there's no reason to give them any
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: reason to doubt you in the interview process. And like,
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: like Chelsea said, a lot of people just like can't
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: get it together, and.
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: Taking care of a loved one is a good one
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: because that obviously makes you look good.
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: Exactly, and you can even specifically say you can say
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: I was caring for someone who was ill, that someone
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: was you. Let's straight up the truth. And also, you know,
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: I don't think a gap on a resume matters quite
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: as much as it used to.
• 8:41
  Speaker 2: Does it not as resume world? So I don't really
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: know what is going on out there in the business
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: world because I'm not a business woman. You are, you know,
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: you're a I'm a different kind of businesswoman.
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: You have IMDb in that arrest.
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: I like the word two to four hours a week
• 8:57
  Speaker 2: and that is it.
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: And we make it work. So I think they or
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: less than they used to, especially like pre pandemic and stuff.
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: But another good trick for this too is rather than
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: saying like I worked here from like January twenty twenty
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: one to like June twenty twenty three, just use years
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: I was here from twenty twenty one to twenty twenty three.
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: We're barely into twenty twenty four, so then you only
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: have a you know, few months gap on your resume.
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: And I think if they do, if they do ask
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: good advice, Yeah, you just say you took some personal time,
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: or you say I was caring for someone who was ill,
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: and I think you leave it at that.
• 9:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think. I think if you say caring
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: for someone who was ill, you're not going to get
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: one and more question about it.
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because they're really not supposed to be like so
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: how's your mom doing with that? You know, whatever? Does theseanse?
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: Well, obviously, if you were caring for someone that was
• 9:42
  Speaker 2: ill for that period of time, they're probably dead, So
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: there's a dead end er conversation, exactly. Perfect.
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and then if you just change the subject right
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: after that, I think approach it with confidence and boys
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: and like move on after that, I think you'll be
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: just fine. And also like congratulations and good work.
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 10:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we love rehabit. We love when it sticks. Right
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: mm hmm.
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: It works if you work it works if you work it.
• 10:08
  Speaker 2: I do not work it. I've been smoking a ton
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: of marijuana lately, actually smoking he or have you been
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: doing I've been smoking it because my doctor gave me
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: these pills for my throat, so it doesn't bother me anymore.
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: I know I'm on a bender right now with marijuana.
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: I just need it, Like I'm like, oh, where's a joint? Okay,
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: let's well, because of my kids, you know, I'm around
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: the kids, so I can't be soberdoing.
• 10:29
  Speaker 1: That right right. Well, our next question comes from Emma.
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: It's kind of a tricky one. She is thirty five.
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: Emma says, your Chelsea, my fiance and I are getting
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: married in September of this year. A couple of years ago,
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: his mother had a stroke and started needing round the
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: clock care, mostly provided by his eighty year old father,
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: as we live three hours away. A few weeks after
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: visiting to do our engagement photos, we received the most
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: earth shattering call. My fiance's father had died by suicide
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: and was found in the house. His mother immediately had
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: to go into long term care. We're so filled with
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: grief and stress, having just bought a house and planning
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: a wedding, Driving back and forth to tackle things, it's
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: so overwhelming. Life just truly feels irrevocably changed. I'm grateful
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: to feel sure about marrying my fiancee, but our relationship
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: has been rocked and the cracks are definitely there. We
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: have so much to figure out, with the estate emptying,
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: their packed house, selling everything, and now taking care of
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: their very, very loud dog. I miss our lives, and
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: while I'm trying my best to be a fully supportive partner,
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: I feel myself failing daily. My fiance is doing the
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: best he can, but I miss his level of engagement
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: in our relationship and life. And while I know I
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: need to give him grace. It's difficult day today. There
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: are things I was already sad about during wedding planning
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: as I lost my mom ten years ago. Overall, I
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: feel like the focus is the horrible situation we're in
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: rather than being a happy time, and my feelings are
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: lost in all of it. I'm in therapy working through
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: forgiveness and letting go of anger, but it's so hard
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: not to feel like our wedding will forever be linked
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: to this horrific time in our lives. Thanks Emma, Hi, Emma, Hi, Chelsey,
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: how are you?
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: Oh? Wow, that was very moving your story.
• 12:08
  Speaker 4: Yeah, lots of stuff this year, a lot of things
• 12:11
  Speaker 4: we're trying to kind of move through while also enjoying ourselves.
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: Right, can you tell me where you are, like with
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: your wedding planning with all the you know, emptying out
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: the house now.
• 12:21
  Speaker 4: Yeah, so we're pretty much everything is set. We're just
• 12:24
  Speaker 4: kind of in those last few months of figuring out
• 12:27
  Speaker 4: like little stuff. So everything is you know, moving ahead,
• 12:32
  Speaker 4: is planned, and he unfortunately was going to be our
• 12:35
  Speaker 4: efficient Bob's dad, so we ended up finding a new
• 12:37
  Speaker 4: efficient and all of that. So we're in a good
• 12:40
  Speaker 4: spot with all that, and honestly, Bob and I are
• 12:42
  Speaker 4: in a really good spot too as a couple. It's
• 12:45
  Speaker 4: just that it's very hard to not associate these two things,
• 12:51
  Speaker 4: and especially our wedding will be near the end of September.
• 12:55
  Speaker 4: This event will be, you know, just a few weeks
• 12:58
  Speaker 4: after it, like the first your anniversary will be a
• 13:01
  Speaker 4: few weeks after it, So it's kind of hard not
• 13:03
  Speaker 4: to have those two things tied together.
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: So are you and your fiance like communicating about how
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: you're dealing with all of this stuff.
• 13:10
  Speaker 5: Yeah, we are.
• 13:12
  Speaker 4: I'm definitely more communicative and a lot more open about
• 13:16
  Speaker 4: how I'm feeling day to day.
• 13:19
  Speaker 5: He I think to get through things.
• 13:23
  Speaker 4: I think he shuts down a little bit and isn't
• 13:26
  Speaker 4: not that he needs to like lean into the feelings
• 13:28
  Speaker 4: of everything that's going on, but I think that sometimes
• 13:31
  Speaker 4: it's easier, especially with going to work, he just kind
• 13:33
  Speaker 4: of shuts it down a little bit. So I just
• 13:35
  Speaker 4: worry about him a lot that you know that this
• 13:39
  Speaker 4: is a really big thing, an event that's happened in
• 13:43
  Speaker 4: both of our lives, but definitely in his life, So
• 13:46
  Speaker 4: I just worry, like where that will bubble up, right,
• 13:49
  Speaker 4: you know, in the future.
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: Can you would he be open to talking to a therapist?
• 13:54
  Speaker 4: So he does, he does see somebody, not I think
• 13:57
  Speaker 4: like I think he wants to see somebody more in
• 14:00
  Speaker 4: the future, but he does talk to somebody yet.
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Like it sounds like what you guys really need
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: to do in this moment. It's a period of time
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: in your life that wasn't planned, so it's a little
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: bit difficult and harry, but in this moment you need
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: to double down on like talking and being communicative with
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: each other, even when he doesn't want to be. You
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: have to be like, listen, this is this We're going
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: to go through this together. Like this, I'm having a
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: really difficult time on certain days and certain days you're
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: doing better. It sounds like, but we have to be
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: helping each other get through this time because obviously this
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: is trauma and you I am going to you know,
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: insist that you are talking to somebody on a more
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: regular basis. For him, he needs to talk to someone
• 14:41
  Speaker 2: on a regular basis during this time because what you said,
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: where where is it going to bubble up later? Like
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: it is going to bubble up later, So you have
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: to in the moment you're in, like really double down
• 14:52
  Speaker 2: on both of your therapists and talking to each other
• 14:55
  Speaker 2: about what's happening and taking each day at a time. Yes,
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: this wasn't what you pla. But what is a way
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: to differentiate your wedding day from the anniversary of his death?
• 15:04
  Speaker 5: Yeah?
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: Why not make that a celebration of him? You know,
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: why does it have to be the anniversary of his death.
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: Why can't it be a celebration of his life? Why
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: can't it be an extension of your wedding anniversary in
• 15:13
  Speaker 2: some regard, like maybe you can tie those two events
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: together in a positive way rather than looking at it
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: in the way that you're looking at it because it
• 15:20
  Speaker 2: just happened, so I understand, but you can adjust your
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: framework on that and have a better way forward, and
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: also sharing that with your fiance, Like I'm thinking about
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: these things. This is how I think we can make
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: peace with this. I mean, obviously it's very early on,
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: but that's why talking is so important, because things get
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: so built up. There's resentments. You don't know what people
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: are dealing with on their own, you know for sure.
• 15:44
  Speaker 4: And I think that's one of my biggest fears too,
• 15:46
  Speaker 4: is that because I would say my emotions are a
• 15:49
  Speaker 4: little bit louder than his is. Make like, again, even
• 15:52
  Speaker 4: though this is something that you know, we're going through
• 15:54
  Speaker 4: together and I'm going through, I don't want to take
• 15:57
  Speaker 4: away the fact that this is something that he's going
• 16:00
  Speaker 4: through with his parent and his other parent. We're kind
• 16:03
  Speaker 4: of on a knife's edge too with her care and
• 16:06
  Speaker 4: when we might lose her. It is kind of like
• 16:08
  Speaker 4: that we're kind of just like on this edge through
• 16:11
  Speaker 4: this whole next few months of oh is she gonna
• 16:13
  Speaker 4: make it? You know, So it's hard not to be
• 16:15
  Speaker 4: in that like constant kind of fear stress stat of, yeah,
• 16:18
  Speaker 4: are we going to be going through another loss in
• 16:20
  Speaker 4: the next few months that we're going to have to
• 16:22
  Speaker 4: deal with, And you know, there's a lot of selfish
• 16:24
  Speaker 4: feelings of like, oh, please don't.
• 16:25
  Speaker 5: Let anything happen by then.
• 16:27
  Speaker 4: But also we don't know if she's even going to
• 16:29
  Speaker 4: be in a state where she can come, so you know,
• 16:31
  Speaker 4: it's hard to reconcile out of that.
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but those things are important to talk about. But
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: you know what I mean, when you're you know for sure,
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: all of that stuff is really important and it will
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: bring you guys closer. And when I say you don't
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: know what the other person is thinking, Like he could
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: be resentful of his parents for pulling this shit at
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: the most important moment in his time. He could be
• 16:49
  Speaker 2: resentful of you for some some weird reason, Like that's
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: why it's so important for him to talk, because you
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: don't want that to fester. Whatever his reaction to their
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: death is.
• 16:57
  Speaker 4: Absolutely you know, we haven't really approach the topic of
• 17:02
  Speaker 4: because I have anger towards his dad that like he doesn't.
• 17:05
  Speaker 4: You know, I have so much empathy for that he
• 17:08
  Speaker 4: was in this position and this was where he ultimately,
• 17:12
  Speaker 4: you know, his path led him to so I you know,
• 17:15
  Speaker 4: I loved this person, but I also still have a
• 17:18
  Speaker 4: lot of anger about the situation, and he hasn't really
• 17:22
  Speaker 4: gotten into that. Like he at least does not expressed
• 17:24
  Speaker 4: that he has any anger that this happened.
• 17:28
  Speaker 5: So that's hard.
• 17:29
  Speaker 4: Like I think he's very very protective of his dad,
• 17:32
  Speaker 4: and I understand that, but also it's like trying to
• 17:36
  Speaker 4: make sure he knows that.
• 17:37
  Speaker 5: There's space to be angry about it, and that's okay.
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: Everything that is going to come up for him is
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: going to come up for him over time with him
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: actually having an outlet for his feelings. You can't direct
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: his emotional you know what's happening, of course, but you can,
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: but you can be there and be honest with each
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: other about it, which is leveling up your relationship. Actually,
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: it's going to bring you closer to get if you
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: guys can get together on this and you having your
• 18:03
  Speaker 2: frustrations are fine, That's okay, that's totally honest. Like what
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: you just said and everything you know you are angry
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: about it, that's okay too. We're all human beings. We're
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: all experiencing feelings that we don't want to be feeling.
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: And I think Chelsea, you are right, like really strongly suggesting,
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: like verging on demanding that he be seeing somebody at
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: least once a week, even if it's not twice a week,
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: so that he does get to the point where he
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: is processing things like anger, things like you know, resentments
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: and getting them out.
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And there's no like argument for not doubling down
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: on therapy when your father committed suicide.
• 18:36
  Speaker 4: Honestly, it's financial. Financial is the argument, which sucks that
• 18:39
  Speaker 4: that has to be an argument. But like I think
• 18:41
  Speaker 4: that especially like with the wedding, like that is part
• 18:44
  Speaker 4: of it. Too, which, like I would argue, like, obviously
• 18:46
  Speaker 4: the investment is totally one hundred percent worth it. It's
• 18:49
  Speaker 4: just finding where that monetary balances with having a new home,
• 18:53
  Speaker 4: doing the wedding all that.
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: So and totally understand that. But that is where group
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: therapy is going to come in. So Heed, you need
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: to you find him a support group for I'm sure
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: there's a specific one depending on the size of your city. Yes, no,
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: for sure, and those are usually free or like somebody
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: you bring donuts.
• 19:10
  Speaker 5: Yeah, no, those are much more affordable.
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly.
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, So I mean doubling up having therapy when you
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: can afford it and doing something that's a no cost
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: thing as well, I think would be that the way
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: to kind of get that and so we can start
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: processing or continue processing.
• 19:24
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I agree.
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: I think for the wedding, what I would suggest to
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: is people who come to your wedding are going to
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: know that this is a part of your experience, and
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: I think one of the best things you can do
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: is allow people a moment to experience that to really
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: like hang a lantern on it. Either you know, your
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: efficient can mention something about those who can't be here
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: with us today. But I also think, especially since you
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: lost your mom, one really nice thing that you can
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: do is have a table where maybe it's everybody's wedding photos,
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: maybe it's parents and grandparents wedding photos, maybe it's just
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: a photo of each of them, but including everyone at
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: least in some way in your ceremony. I think will
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: will allow people like a place to put that sort
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: of curiosity and grief for you, and also give you
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: an outlet where, like you guys don't have to say
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: it and be crying about it, but like heavy efficient
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: mention it.
• 20:17
  Speaker 4: I think it is something that we probably will incorporate,
• 20:20
  Speaker 4: which will be nice.
• 20:21
  Speaker 5: It'll be nice to have that.
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: And then during the ceremony too, I've seen people will
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: have like a chair reserves, like one for your mom
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: and one for his dad too.
• 20:28
  Speaker 4: So yeah, and I asked him about that and he
• 20:30
  Speaker 4: was kind of I think it's funny, like he just doesn't.
• 20:34
  Speaker 4: I think that that almost like made him sadder to
• 20:37
  Speaker 4: think about doing something like that. So it's finding like, Okay,
• 20:41
  Speaker 4: what feels like honoring and nice without necessarily making you
• 20:45
  Speaker 4: more upset.
• 20:45
  Speaker 5: But you're gonna be thinking about it, like obviously.
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: On the day exactly and that's one of those things
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: about grief is you know, we've talked about this so
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: many times, it's like the more you push it away
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: sort of like the larger it looms. And Chelsea, you've
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: brought this up several times recently to where grief isn't
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: something that you're constantly going through, right, but it is
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: always sort of under the surface, and so it's like
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: it comes up and bubbles up at the weirdest times.
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: Then the thing is like, it's your wedding. People are
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: gonna be crying anyway. You're gonna be crying anyway.
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: You know, It's okay, yeah, exactly. And the good thing
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: is once you let yourself cry, then you're good. You know,
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: fighting crying is harder than the crying itself.
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: Yes, yes, yes, yeah.
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: And it doesn't look cute either when when.
• 21:27
  Speaker 5: You're trying it almost worse.
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 21:31
  Speaker 5: Yeah, no, definitely.
• 21:33
  Speaker 4: I think I just I think with like going through
• 21:35
  Speaker 4: losing my mom, even though it was obviously in a
• 21:36
  Speaker 4: very different way she was ill, she had cancer, I
• 21:39
  Speaker 4: think like once we entered this phase of things that
• 21:42
  Speaker 4: was like, oh, maybe I'll be like equipped to help
• 21:44
  Speaker 4: somebody through their grief.
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: No, not now, not now, Yes, and it's suicide just
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: is a different experience.
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: It is, it is, but it's also like listen, I
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: know it's hard to say to celebrate that, to celebrate
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: a life that ended in suicide, but I would still say, yes,
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: celebrate the life. If they were in pain and they
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: had to remove themselves from this earth, then they are
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: in a better place and they didn't want to be here,
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: and celebrate the life that they did have and the
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: happiest moments that they know that you shared with them.
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: And that's how you can frame it for yourself, because
• 22:16
  Speaker 2: what's the point of any other framework when you're talking
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: about suicide.
• 22:20
  Speaker 4: Absolutely, and we did have like a really great relationship
• 22:24
  Speaker 4: with him, so like I'm very grateful for that as well.
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, well I think you should talk to your
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: husband more, you know, fiance, Sorry what you're saying to us,
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: like be open with him like this. I'm sure you are,
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: but really like get the communication flowing because it's really
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: good to get it out and you want him to
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: get it out too.
• 22:43
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: No, I agree for sure, even if he's not as
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: forthcoming as you are, like be there with him and
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: be there just.
• 22:51
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think it's finding the balance too, between making
• 22:54
  Speaker 4: sure he knows like where I'm at, but like not
• 22:56
  Speaker 4: feeling like I don't want.
• 22:57
  Speaker 5: To overwhelm him with write your grief emotion through it.
• 23:00
  Speaker 4: And it's like if he's having a good day, you know,
• 23:02
  Speaker 4: not wanting to necessarily feel like, oh he on top
• 23:05
  Speaker 4: of his feelings have to like not that, like I
• 23:07
  Speaker 4: worry about him having to deal with my feelings. We
• 23:09
  Speaker 4: do have like a good partnership with that, but not
• 23:12
  Speaker 4: wanting to necessarily like add my grief to his grief,
• 23:16
  Speaker 4: even though they obviously are intertwined.
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I wouldn't worry about that. I would worry just
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: about being honest and stuff.
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, sometimes guys need a push, you know.
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they really do.
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: So you know you're not going to demand, but like
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: I would really tell him this is what I need
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: from you.
• 23:32
  Speaker 5: Yeah, no, that makes sense. Yeah, I think so too. Well.
• 23:35
  Speaker 5: I appreciate it very much. Thank you, thank you.
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: Okay, yes, we'll be thinking about you.
• 23:40
  Speaker 5: Oh, thank you so much.
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: Shoot us an email after the wedding. Okay, I will.
• 23:44
  Speaker 5: I will thank you so much.
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: Bye, but bye. What a sweetie. Oh yeah, I'm jealous
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: of people who can look just very beautiful when they're
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: in tears, but she's one of them. One thing I
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: wanted to say too, is for anybody who's caregiving. I
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: used to work with Alzheimer's caregivers, family caregivers, and one
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: thing that can happen a lot of times is you
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: have the ill parent and then either you know, because
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: of depression, suicide can happen with someone who's caregiving, whether
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: that's a daughter, a son, a spouse, but also illnesses
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: can happen because the caregiving person is under so much stress,
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: they can like up and have a heart attack or whatever.
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: Like sudden death is very common amongst caregivers.
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: Sudden death.
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: Sudden death. Yeah, I mean I know someone who was like, yeah,
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: my fifty year old sister was the caregiver for mom
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: while she dealt with dementia and just like died of
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: a major heart attack one day, you know, And that's
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: really really common.
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: I just you said fifty year old woman. I'm like, oh,
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: that's so much older, and then I realize I'm forty nine.
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: I mean, I just turned thirty nine, and I'm like,
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: it's it's just it just goes fast.
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: It goes faster and faster the older you get yes, yes.
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: But so if you are caregiving, get some respite care.
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: There's lots of resources for this. But like take advantage
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: when someone says how can I help? Say here's how,
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: and give yourself some time off. Yeah, And of course,
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: if you or someone you know is dealing with depression
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: or suicide, please reach out. Help is available at nine
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: to eight eight. That's the number for the Suicide and
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: Crisis Lifeline nine eight eight. Let's talk to Tanya, shall we.
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: Tanya has sort of a tricky interpersonal thing with a
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: family friend. So I like the sound of that, yeah,
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: she says, Dear Chelsea. About ten years ago, my best
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: friend set me up with her brother. It was supposed
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: to be just a hookup, but I ended up falling
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: in love. We saw each other off and on for
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: almost three years, and during that time I found out
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: he was married. I was not only heartbroke friends brother.
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: Yes, I found out was married.
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: Yes, she did not know beforehand, but found out during
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: that time. I was not only heartbroken from his deception
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: and that my friend would deceive me, but and that
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: she put me in that position. So I never said anything,
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: but I stopped talking to them both for two years
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: fast forward, and we've all moved on and reconnected as friends.
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: He is now married to someone else and they have
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: a child, but it's still uncomfortable for me when we
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: see each other. There's a lot of sexual tension, and
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: his sister my friend, mentions it and talks about how
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: she doesn't like his new wife and so on. He
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: tries to hug me or comes in for a kiss
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: when no one is sorry, I think she means a
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: kiss on the cheek. He tries to hug me or
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: comes in for a kiss when no one is looking,
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: and while it's nothing overtly sexual, he lingers a little
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: longer than normal.
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: Well, if he's kissing you, wait, why I don't.
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: Like this must be a kiss on the cheek.
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: So we'll clarify who comes and kisses someone on the chee?
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: Right, that's like sort of an old school moved and yeah,
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: I have no desire for a relationship.
• 26:32
  Speaker 2: If he's doing that and loitering, when, of course that
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: goes together lingering, wingering, Yeah, lingering. If he's kissing you
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: on the cheek, he's definitely lingering.
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: Also, like he's standing right outside.
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: She's surprised by that, but not the first part.
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: So she says, I have no desire for to have
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: a relationship with him, but he still lights me up,
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: so to speak. The sex was amazing, after all, So
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: the complication comes now. Last December, I was with all
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: of the women in their family on a trip, and
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: one of them brought up my previous affair with their brother,
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: but made it sound as if it was a one
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: night stand. We were all drinking, and I started crying
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: and defending myself, saying that I had a relationship with
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: him and even loved him, even if maybe he didn't
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: feel the same. I was just a little shocked that
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: the sisters knew, and that all these years they thought
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: it was a one night stand, when for me it
• 27:20
  Speaker 1: was so much more. It felt embarrassing. Now I'm being
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: told that I'm not allowed to come to any family
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: events because one of the women and in law thinks
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: I might tell his new wife, which I have no
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: intention of doing. It feels so weird to me that
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: they're inserting themselves into something that happened so long ago,
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: and that without even trying to clarify with me. They
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: made this decision. Months later, following a drunken conversation in Vegas.
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: We're family friends, we travel together and we see each
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: other around town. So I don't know how not to
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: be a part of this family. How can I mend
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: things without it blowing up in my face? Tanya, Hi,
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: Tanya Hi? How are you?
• 27:54
  Speaker 3: I'm good?
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: How are you good? It got some drama happening.
• 27:58
  Speaker 2: Okay, so that happened in Vegas where you started crying,
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: defending yourself and explaining to them that it was like
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: an actual affair. Right, What happened after that? What length
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: of time did you get uninvited?
• 28:09
  Speaker 3: Or it was months later and nothing was ever really said,
• 28:13
  Speaker 3: and then all of a sudden, it was like a
• 28:16
  Speaker 3: thing out of the blue, which I was so surprised
• 28:19
  Speaker 3: by because I thought, Okay, I thought we were close
• 28:21
  Speaker 3: enough where if it was an issue, somebody would have
• 28:22
  Speaker 3: said something right away or maybe the next day even
• 28:26
  Speaker 3: or yeah, nothing was ever said and it was months later.
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: So it just feels like to me, it feels like
• 28:31
  Speaker 3: it's something else or I don't know, it just seems
• 28:34
  Speaker 3: so odd.
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: No, I could see it being about that. Yeah, yeah,
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: because if you like finding out if they thought it
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: was a one night stand and they're finding out that
• 28:43
  Speaker 2: it was a long term affair while he was married.
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: He's not married to her anymore.
• 28:49
  Speaker 2: No, So yeah, I think you should just address it
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: head on obviously and say, guys, listen, I understand that
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: night in Vegas that I told you stuff, but like
• 28:59
  Speaker 2: that was a long time time ago, and I have
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: no intention of ever sharing anything like that with his
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: current wife. The problem is is that you do still
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: have this like sexual chemistry, and that's a problem for
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: you because people can sense that.
• 29:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, no, totally, I think that. I mean, obviously, I
• 29:18
  Speaker 3: try to stay away as much as possible and give
• 29:21
  Speaker 3: respect the relationship, and I definitely don't want anything to
• 29:27
  Speaker 3: do with that relationship negority Shire.
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: But when you say he's coming and kissing you on
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: the cheek.
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, is it cheek kiss when he tries to
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: sneak a kiss or is it?
• 29:36
  Speaker 4: Yeah?
• 29:36
  Speaker 3: I mean, but it's like and then there's like the
• 29:39
  Speaker 3: hugs maybe a little bit too long, and you know,
• 29:41
  Speaker 3: there's been a couple of situations where he'll ask, like
• 29:43
  Speaker 3: to walk me to my car, like let me owe
• 29:46
  Speaker 3: your car, and it's just like it's just not appropriate.
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: He's trying to find me times to be alone with you.
• 29:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and to me, it's like I don't necessarily think
• 29:55
  Speaker 3: he's looking for an out or anything, but it's just like,
• 29:58
  Speaker 3: you know how when you're married for long times. I've
• 30:00
  Speaker 3: been married, and it's like, you know, it's like that
• 30:03
  Speaker 3: secret thing is always kind of exciting and and I've
• 30:06
  Speaker 3: been a secret before and it's like it's so.
• 30:08
  Speaker 2: Disrespect but yeah, it is disrespectful to you. And you
• 30:11
  Speaker 2: do need to like set a boundary so that he
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: doesn't even think he can walk you through the car.
• 30:15
  Speaker 2: You can't like allow him to be coming in and
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: steal it. What do you mean by kissing you, like
• 30:19
  Speaker 2: kissing you on the cheek? Yeah, yeah, gross? Gross? Though,
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: why is he doing that? That's not okay? Like right, so,
• 30:28
  Speaker 2: and he's a problem because they're worried. Now I see why,
• 30:31
  Speaker 2: Like you're they're worried that you're gonna like like have
• 30:34
  Speaker 2: another romance with him, right and ruin his marriage.
• 30:37
  Speaker 3: But isn't the problem with him?
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: Why is it me? It's not there's two people, you're no,
• 30:42
  Speaker 2: it is your it's your responsibility to to set a
• 30:45
  Speaker 2: boundary because then he has a parameter if you if
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: you don't say anything, then he just thinks he can
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: keep trying until you give in if you say stop,
• 30:54
  Speaker 2: I'm not interested, please stop, Like be firm. You have
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: to be firm with him. Unfortunately, as women, that's how
• 31:01
  Speaker 2: we have to be with men like that.
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, like he's totally a fault too, but like, yeah,
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: but you're not completely helpless.
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: You have agency. You can stand up for yourself and
• 31:12
  Speaker 2: say no, don't kiss me like that, it's gross. I
• 31:15
  Speaker 2: find that gross. That'll stop him.
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: I don't think he necessarily need to hug him at all,
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: Like give him an off for high five. Next day
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: he tries to come in for a hug.
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know, but with regard to you're not seeing
• 31:27
  Speaker 2: him at all right now, right, No.
• 31:29
  Speaker 3: We don't talk. It's not even like there's any type
• 31:32
  Speaker 3: of communication. And really it's like random once in a
• 31:36
  Speaker 3: wild type thing. So it's not like he's making an
• 31:39
  Speaker 3: effort to see me. I don't feel like.
• 31:41
  Speaker 2: That's his goal at all. And how many like are
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: you really you're upset about missing out on all these
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: like family things.
• 31:47
  Speaker 5: Not at all.
• 31:48
  Speaker 3: No, I feel like it's putting my friend, my girlfriend
• 31:51
  Speaker 3: in an odd position with her family. And then also
• 31:54
  Speaker 3: we do have like where we normally a couple times
• 31:58
  Speaker 3: a year we all hang out until like, so, now
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: what she's just not supposed to.
• 32:03
  Speaker 2: I think you can just send them an email and
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: be like, guys, whoever this needs to be addressed to,
• 32:07
  Speaker 2: can we please get over this? Like, I'm not telling
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: his wife. I have no intention. I what's your situation
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: right now? Are you married?
• 32:14
  Speaker 5: No?
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: I'm single, but you're single, okay. I have no intention
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: of pursuing anything with your brother. That would That was
• 32:19
  Speaker 2: a very long time ago, and that was a very
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: drunk night in Vegas. You know, what happens in Vegas
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: is supposed to stay in Vegas, right.
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: I almost just like with an asterisk, I almost wonder
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: if it shouldn't be something that gets put into writing,
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: just like in case the wife picks up a phone
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: of someone or someone shows her. I almost wonder if
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: it's like a phone like a series of phone calls,
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: or like, hey, gals, can we all please get lunch?
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: And you like address it. I'm a little scared about
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: putting into writing.
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: Do you feel comfortable calling them all and just saying
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: can we get lunch?
• 32:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah? I mean I can. I feel like well I
• 32:56
  Speaker 3: did initially reach out since this conversation. I did text
• 32:59
  Speaker 3: my sitch to them all and just say, I feel like,
• 33:02
  Speaker 3: maybe there's something you guys are upset about, or if
• 33:05
  Speaker 3: I've done something, I would love to have an opportunity
• 33:07
  Speaker 3: to make this right. And they didn't respond, so I
• 33:11
  Speaker 3: was like, okay, but my girlfriend is the one who
• 33:14
  Speaker 3: called me. She's like, yeah, it's about the whole thing
• 33:17
  Speaker 3: with that half a long time ago, and they're afraid
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: maybe you're gonna say something to the wife. And I'm like,
• 33:21
  Speaker 3: that's ridiculous, and she's like I know. She's like I
• 33:24
  Speaker 3: know you wouldn't.
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: She's but that's like their thought or whatever, And how
• 33:28
  Speaker 2: well do you know those women because those are her
• 33:30
  Speaker 2: those are her relatives right right.
• 33:32
  Speaker 3: I'm gonna be I've done them for years. It's been
• 33:34
  Speaker 3: a long time now, for a long long time.
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: Maybe just have to let the dust settle and like
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: when it comes time to see them again, maybe your
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: best friend can be your biggest advocate and you know,
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: kind of smooth things over with the other girls.
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: The when did this happen?
• 33:48
  Speaker 3: Maybe like six months ago now, I don't know.
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: It sounds like a while. I don't know either. I'm like, fuck,
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: I don't know. This is a hard one. I would say,
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: fucking who gives a shit? Like just don't out with them.
• 34:00
  Speaker 3: But that's kind of where I'm leaning, Like, Okay, I feel.
• 34:03
  Speaker 2: Like when you have that attitude, people kind of get
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: in vibe with Like, if that's your vibe and you're
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: not thirsty to try to get back into that scene,
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: it usually comes to you more easily, you know what
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: I mean, Like the invite will return. So I would
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: just say I amend when I retract what I said earlier.
• 34:20
  Speaker 2: Don't do anything. Just let the dust settle and be
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: your cool self and and and know that you're gonna
• 34:25
  Speaker 2: set a boundary with that guy the next time. He's
• 34:27
  Speaker 2: not allowed to come up and kiss you on the cheek.
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: That's molester behavior, right, kissing on the cheek, Get off
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: of me. That sounds good.
• 34:35
  Speaker 3: I like that better.
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like I don't I wantn't want anyone kissing
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: me that's not kissing me on the mouth.
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: I have been thinking about that recently, and like cheek
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: kisses cowing of the movies all the time, like stupid
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: in real life, as if you would ever say goodbye
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: to your boyfriend by kissing him on the cheek, like
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: the time that I have done is right. I'm like,
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: I feel so weird, like kissing him.
• 34:53
  Speaker 2: On the cheek, and it's also a weird introduction to
• 34:56
  Speaker 2: a person like, yeah, that used to be the thing
• 34:58
  Speaker 2: you hug, Like now, why am I kissing stranger? Anyway? Anyway,
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: good luck with your situation.
• 35:06
  Speaker 1: Let us know if people come around.
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: This is a tricky one. Yeah, let us know when
• 35:10
  Speaker 2: they come around that that would be an interesting timeline
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: for me to know about that. Yes, all right, we
• 35:14
  Speaker 2: can help other callers with that.
• 35:16
  Speaker 3: Thank you so much.
• 35:17
  Speaker 2: Okay, bye, thanks time. Okay, so we're gonna take a
• 35:19
  Speaker 2: break and come back.
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, perfect, and we're back. We have Jane and Johnny
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: calling in. Oh we have a couple.
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: Oh a couple. Oh hi, okay, great, let's go.
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: Jane and Johnny have a question. This comes from Jane.
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: She originally wrote in and Johnny is joining, so she
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: says to you're Chelsea, I heard you wanted to have
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: a couple on and my husband and I have two issues. First,
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: I've just entered my fifties and I suddenly feel invisible
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: within the family. I sometimes feel I'm being excluded. Even
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: the dogs like my husband better than me. In particular,
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: I have an eighteen year old stepdaughter who has lately
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: been kind of an ass, and she's coming home from
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: college soon. While I'm dreading it, my husband is very excited. Specifically,
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: she recently introduced only my husband to her friends when
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: we were at an event standing next to each other,
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: and failed to even send a text as thanks for
• 36:13
  Speaker 1: a gift. I spent months preparing to send her off
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: to college with Despite my best efforts to be a loving,
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: fun participant in my family, I'm starting to feel like
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: no one really likes me or I'm majorly taking for granted.
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: But is it them or is it me? Much love?
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: Jane and Johnny?
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: Hi, Hi, Hello, Hi, look at you two cuties. I
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: love this.
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: So when I talk to you last, Johnny, you were
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: actually picking up your daughter from school, right, Yes, it was.
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: How's that going?
• 36:44
  Speaker 6: I think pretty well?
• 36:46
  Speaker 7: And Jane, it's fine, you know, like on the surface,
• 36:50
  Speaker 7: it's fine after about ten months. And I'm not a
• 36:53
  Speaker 7: numbers person, so when I start recognizing patterns, there's like.
• 36:57
  Speaker 6: A big one.
• 36:59
  Speaker 7: I don't her.
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: That's how I'm feeling.
• 37:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that doesn't feel good. What's her situation? With her
• 37:05
  Speaker 2: birth mother.
• 37:06
  Speaker 5: Oh, it's good.
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they have a good relationship. Correct And okay, what
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: Johnny what they have some challenges. They have some challenges too.
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: So what's your view of the situation, Johnny, what do
• 37:19
  Speaker 2: you think is happening?
• 37:20
  Speaker 6: Well, I feel like put it in the middle, and
• 37:24
  Speaker 6: I'm very i think my daughter's doing very well and
• 37:27
  Speaker 6: I'm very proud of her. But I know that, you know,
• 37:31
  Speaker 6: she can be a shit. She didn't send a thank
• 37:34
  Speaker 6: you note for the birthday gift, which was rude, and
• 37:37
  Speaker 6: she didn't introduce her when we went to visit her
• 37:39
  Speaker 6: at college to her friends, which was very awkward for
• 37:43
  Speaker 6: me and I, you know, and I felt really bad.
• 37:46
  Speaker 2: And did you step in and introduce your wife?
• 37:48
  Speaker 6: When that happened, before I had a chance, Jane jumped in.
• 37:52
  Speaker 7: She goes, hey, everyone, this is my dad, and then
• 37:56
  Speaker 7: everyone said hey, what's up? And then everyone was kind
• 37:59
  Speaker 7: of looking over me and I said I'm her stepmom.
• 38:03
  Speaker 7: It was very awkward. And then later Johnny said, you know,
• 38:07
  Speaker 7: that was kind of weird. Why wouldn't you And she's like,
• 38:09
  Speaker 7: I don't know, like whatever, And it's sort of how
• 38:13
  Speaker 7: it read to me was that it was more of
• 38:17
  Speaker 7: a reactive statement about how she feels rather than a
• 38:21
  Speaker 7: mismanners moment that didn't come to the surface.
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it sounds like to me, Johnny, that you need
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: to have a conversation with your daughter just about general
• 38:30
  Speaker 2: courteousness and respect, Like this is your wife, and I
• 38:34
  Speaker 2: know you might be dealing with a difficult personality, but
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: these are skills that she's going to need for the
• 38:38
  Speaker 2: rest of her life. So you're a conversation with her
• 38:42
  Speaker 2: is going to yield more benefits than it will initially,
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: I'm sure, But down the road she will remember a
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: meaningful conversation about treating people with respect. Never mind her
• 38:51
  Speaker 2: stepmother who's in the house, you know, with you every day,
• 38:55
  Speaker 2: and it is your job to have that conversation with her.
• 38:58
  Speaker 6: I did have a conversation about that particular incident, and
• 39:01
  Speaker 6: how did that go? It went well, she felt really bad,
• 39:04
  Speaker 6: she remembered it, and then I said, well, can you
• 39:07
  Speaker 6: let Jane know? And she's like, yes, I'm definitely going to.
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: But and then did she address it with you?
• 39:14
  Speaker 6: I'm assuming not.
• 39:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah, right, that's good that you did that. Thank you
• 39:21
  Speaker 2: for being a stand up, responsible man. Father.
• 39:24
  Speaker 6: Yes, Well, I don't want my daughter to be a jerk.
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: No, of course not.
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no, And Jane, I think there is a little
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: bit of a deeper issue, so obviously lingering resentment, since
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: like I know, the gift was like at the beginning
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: when she went to school, and she's just back from
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: school and you're still feeling kind of nasty about it.
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: So I wonder if there's a way to kind of
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: get some positive vibes going there, just to be like,
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: I'm going to be a bigger person. I'm going to
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: invite her on a little date, will go out well,
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: you know whatever is sort of like a really fun
• 39:54
  Speaker 1: special thing the two of you can do together. And
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: I think during that time, if you want to address it,
• 39:59
  Speaker 1: after you've sort of establish some good reports, is that a.
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: Reality of you guys doing something together, Jane, you and
• 40:05
  Speaker 2: your stepdaughter, Oh okay, and that's great.
• 40:08
  Speaker 7: And I agree that I have to rise up for
• 40:11
  Speaker 7: this and not be like and your little dog too,
• 40:14
  Speaker 7: you know what I'm I can't go down.
• 40:18
  Speaker 1: But I don't think that means ignore it. You know.
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: I think, you know, since you're still feeling yucky, I
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: think you probably should address it, but not like Hi,
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: you're back from school. Let's deal with this yucky thing.
• 40:28
  Speaker 1: Get some good stuff going, get some good juices flowing there.
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: And I also think maybe just let go of the
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: thank you for the gift for this round. I think
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: it's more important that she's introducing you to people than
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: writing you a thank you note.
• 40:39
  Speaker 7: Wait, wait, I need to clarify though, what that was.
• 40:41
  Speaker 7: It wasn't a birthday present. It was I got her
• 40:44
  Speaker 7: a tackle box for going to college and filled every
• 40:48
  Speaker 7: slot with special things for being in her dorm for
• 40:53
  Speaker 7: the first semester in a really really well crafted, thoughtful,
• 40:57
  Speaker 7: meaningful note and all their gifts in there. That like,
• 41:02
  Speaker 7: she read the note and she uses the stuff in
• 41:04
  Speaker 7: it and never acknowledged this very thoughtful gift that after
• 41:08
  Speaker 7: giving to her, Like I know, she's on her phone
• 41:10
  Speaker 7: twenty hours a day, not even a gift.
• 41:13
  Speaker 2: Emoji with you. You have to let go of that.
• 41:15
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 41:16
  Speaker 2: She is eighteen years old and she is in college
• 41:18
  Speaker 2: and she is not thinking about writing thank you cards
• 41:20
  Speaker 2: to her stepmother. Okay, she is about to embark on
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: like the greatest adventure of her life and she is
• 41:25
  Speaker 2: So you have to let go of that. Girls between
• 41:27
  Speaker 2: fifteen and like twenty fuck their manners like they don't
• 41:31
  Speaker 2: have them. You know, they're all self consumed and self
• 41:35
  Speaker 2: absorbed in everything that's happening to them. So let go
• 41:38
  Speaker 2: of the thank you note. Please just let go of it.
• 41:40
  Speaker 2: You don't have to revisit that that would be annoying
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: for you to bring up. At some point. I promise you,
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: she will acknowledge that you sent that to her at
• 41:48
  Speaker 2: some point. So asking for a thank you is not
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: a good way to deal with an eighteen year old,
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: I don't think. But I do think if you have
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: the opportunity to spend time with her, spend as much
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: time with you her as she'll allow you to spend
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: with her. You know, like, do it as much as
• 42:03
  Speaker 2: you can. Because you can't tell somebody that you're valuable.
• 42:07
  Speaker 2: They have to understand your value. And you know what
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: I mean. And I think for you, Johnny, you can
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: even be more demonstrative of your appreciation and adoration of
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: your wife in front of your daughter so that she
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: understands how important she is to you.
• 42:22
  Speaker 6: That is a very good point. I realize I have
• 42:26
  Speaker 6: not been doing that enough.
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: There you go.
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: I love that. Like, if you get to the point
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: of being affectionate and your kids are like ew, that's
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: when you know when you're doing okay, you're doing it perfect.
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: You want to make sure she knows how much you
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: like your wife, never mind love, but like and respect
• 42:44
  Speaker 2: and how much you like and respect each other.
• 42:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's awesome advice.
• 42:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, don't try and have sex or anything in front
• 42:51
  Speaker 2: of her. That's not what we're talking about. Guys. All right, Johnny,
• 42:55
  Speaker 2: I can tell by your background what you're thinking about
• 42:57
  Speaker 2: right now. That took a turn. Well, this was fucking awesome,
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: you guys. I love the couple. Y, this was great.
• 43:08
  Speaker 2: Thank you Johnny for doing so open minded and coming
• 43:10
  Speaker 2: on the podcast in the first place. Good for you.
• 43:13
  Speaker 2: You're a real man. Way to go.
• 43:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you two are really cute, So thanks for joining us.
• 43:20
  Speaker 6: Bye, bye bye.
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: Good luck.
• 43:23
  Speaker 2: That was fun. Yeah, great, great, Caul. I love that couple.
• 43:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah, let's bring it on.
• 43:29
  Speaker 2: Okay, Well that was a great episode. I love the
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: way that ended. And if you if you're a couple
• 43:33
  Speaker 2: out there, do not forget to convince your husband to
• 43:36
  Speaker 2: come on. See how gentle I was with him.
• 43:38
  Speaker 1: She were so nice.
• 43:39
  Speaker 2: Yes, it's easy, it's pleasant and it's fun. Or if
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: you're having problems with your friends. I like that too.
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: Yes, friendship ones actually friendships, friendship couple soon too. Sisters
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: is good.
• 43:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, sisters is good.
• 43:52
  Speaker 1: This is just really good.
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: All right. Everybody get your tickets at Chelsea Handler dot
• 43:55
  Speaker 2: com if you're coming to see me on the road,
• 43:57
  Speaker 2: and other than that, I'll see you next week. Okay.
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: So upcoming shows that I have you guys, Auckland, New Zealand, Wellington,
• 44:04
  Speaker 2: New Zealand, Melbourne, Australia, Brisbane and Australia, Sydney, Australia. We've
• 44:09
  Speaker 2: added second shows to places that have sold out the
• 44:11
  Speaker 2: first and then I'm going to be in Hawaii on Maui,
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: Kahului and Honolulu. I will be there in July. Also
• 44:18
  Speaker 2: in July, I'm coming to Niagara Falls on July twenty seventh.
• 44:21
  Speaker 2: I'm coming to Hollywood, Florida for my only show in
• 44:23
  Speaker 2: Florida on July twenty eighth. I'll be in Auburn, Washington
• 44:27
  Speaker 2: on August first, and then Santa Rosa, California for my
• 44:29
  Speaker 2: second show August second. August seventeenth is the Santa Barbara
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: Bull You do not want to miss that. And then
• 44:36
  Speaker 2: I will be all over Maine, Charlotte, North Carolina, Charleston,
• 44:41
  Speaker 2: South Carolina. I'm coming to Texas. I'm coming to Saint
• 44:44
  Speaker 2: Louis and Kansas City. I'm coming to Brooklyn, New York
• 44:47
  Speaker 2: at the King's Theater on November eighth, and I have
• 44:51
  Speaker 2: tickets on sale throughout the end of the year in December,
• 44:55
  Speaker 2: so if you're in a city like Philadelphia or Bethlehem
• 44:59
  Speaker 2: or Santa Diego or New Orleans or Omaha, check Chelseahandler
• 45:03
  Speaker 2: dot com for tickets.
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: Okay, if you'd like advice from Chelsea, shoot us an
• 45:07
  Speaker 1: email at Dear Chelsea podcast at gmail dot com and
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: be sure to include your phone number. Dear Chelsea is
• 45:13
  Speaker 1: edited and engineered by Brad Dickert executive producer Catherine Law
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: and be sure to check out our merch at Chelseahandler
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: dot com