Latest / The Gill Athletics Track and Field Connections Podcast / #196: Carol Lawrence-Johnson C. Smith University

Transcript

#196: Carol Lawrence-Johnson C. Smith University · The Gill Athletics Track and Field Connections Podcast

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  Track and field coach, the ones that point
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  people most every season. He's the voice of reason.
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  Speaking, the growth gotta prep for you carry the load.
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  Talk to the stove. For those of us, stay on the go
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  pop, the handle, staying in the zone.
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  What you packing for the role is more than one way to go taking
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  those tests. And you told it ain't practice
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  it before it became clear. You can't happen to you.
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  Listen with both ears, can't Mentor, without a mentor, kids
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  of experience, you can reinvent those kids.
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  Every plans got to stand and deliver in the price sacrifice,
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  can you give up Hugh its choice and to fight not to win or lose?
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  It's not a boy, but if I see, y'all can make more movies, not
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  about how to All about why you don't know what you're you know
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  who you are inside. Six, many ways to die.
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  The work ain't done. So we learn from the experts to.
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  It's all about Connections put together for the profession to
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  every track coach could be blessed.
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  All right, it's rock and roll time.
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  We're back. We're another edition of The
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  Gila FedEx track and field connections, podcast, more
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  importantly, your back here for another episode.
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  We have had some since we started season for here in 2023,
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  we might have had some one of the best lineup that we've had
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  here in the last January, and here, as we anchor, February
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  going into March, and which means it's Championship season
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  everybody. So I'm excited.
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  This is just going to continue this trend of just amazing.
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  Amazing people who choose to be track coaches.
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  That were just going to uplift and honor and explore their
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  great journey. So let's get into it today.
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  Help me welcome the head track and field coach for men and
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  women at the great Johnson C Smith University in beautiful
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  beautiful, Charlotte, North Carolina help me.
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  Welcome the wise, the wonderful Miss Carol, Lawrence, Carol, how
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  are you? I'm doing great, thank you for
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  having me. Oh, it is my pleasure.
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  This is one of those interesting ones for me.
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  I've said this before, you know, a lot of guests, some are like,
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  dear friends of mine, like, I've known him since I coached way
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  back in the day. Things like that.
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  Some are, you know? I kind of know them.
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  We've done, business together, whatever.
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  And then there's others, it's like, I don't, we've never met
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  now, we're not that far you, and I from not meeting, we did meet
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  a few weeks months ago, and had just a brief conversation on
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  your track. And I was so, like, I'm so
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  excited for you to be listening today because Carol story just
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  from the, I mean, we talk maybe ten, maybe 10 minutes, you were.
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  So kind of been a little practice starting in, was just
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  Blown Away about the uniqueness. Enos of your journey, Carol.
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  And that's what I love to share with listeners, because we all
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  come from different backgrounds, to get to seemingly the same
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  career and job coaching track and field.
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  But we have such diverse unique ways of getting here and I like
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  to share that. So other people can see like, oh
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  wait a minute, Carol could do that.
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  Well then I should be able to do that too.
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  So super super excited to delve into it.
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  Let's do that. Let's let's hop right into.
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  There's no time to waste here. We got a lot to get into, I bet.
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  So Carol talk to us, you know, at some point assuming you were
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  an athlete and I know you and I know you were coaching as an in
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  your brain switched from not just something that happens to
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  you, go run this lift this etcetera, but something
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  somewhere and had to like flip the switch for you, like oh wait
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  a minute. Like this might actually be a
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  career for me. Where does coaching and track
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  and field begin for you? I'm funny of might say that back
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  in high school in Jamaica I wasn't coach to be a hurdler,
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  right? But I taught myself how to her
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  by just watching and then I had another young lady who joined
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  the team and I said, well, let me show her how to hurt as well
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  and she listened and we're out there.
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  Figure things out by ourselves, our coach at the time, was a
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  Sprint sky and he was just that you had a lot of people of
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  coaching. So let's figure this out and we
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  went ahead and she end up Doing real well, at the girls
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  championships, right? I said, okay, this is good
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  stuff, good stuff. So after I graduated from high
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  school, I taught fourth grade for a year and that was in one
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  of the poorer neighborhoods in Jamaica.
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  And from fourth grade, I was the not coaching this teaching
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  because my first time teaching. So teach a fourth graders, how
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  to read write handle themselves and then afterwards, I said,
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  okay I'm still training, let me start training still and then I
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  kept going kept going and then And of mine said, hey Carol New
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  York Institute of Technology is interested in having you coming
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  there. So okay, wasn't thinking about
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  going to college for track or just training and getting ready
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  to be a teacher, officially a teacher, right?
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  Teacher and Coach, because there's a college in Jamaica
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  called GC Foster college. So, at that time, I was getting
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  ready to enroll that she supposed to college.
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  So I can become a PE teacher and a coach.
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  There we go. So here I am making a trip of
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  course to the US so different different chapters of my life.
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  So curl pause there. Last week we had Aaron
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  Robertson, the associate director of Penn relays and one
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  of the topics that we discussed. There was the Jamaican culture
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  within pin relays and you know, the importance of it in regards
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  to recruiting for young kids and things like that.
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  And I admittedly, even though, when I was at Mississippi State,
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  we had a really good athlete from Jamaica.
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  Steve Mullins, but I wasn't as he came from the Junior College
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  route of America so it's not like I had to got to go to
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  Jamaica and recruits, I don't I know very little about Jamaica
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  talk to us about. You talked about the girls
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  championships. He talked about coaching and
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  culture can you just give us a little bit of a, how does
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  Jamaica work in regards to the differences in amer we we
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  understand air quotes, the American system ninth grade
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  through 12th grade, you know, state championships, Varsity,
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  all that kind of stuff. Can you give us a little bit of
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  background Jamaica as it relates to school?
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  Cool and track and field well into makeup we eat breathe and
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  live track and field. My new track and field is not
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  our number one sport is Cricket. Oh is that right her kid is our
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  number-one sport, right? But apart from that we live
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  breathe and eat everything track and field apart from that.
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  So a lot of the kids there is a lot of intrinsic motivation.
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  Not what can you do for me, right?
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  It's a lot of intrinsic motivation.
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  And I remember after practice, I live on this hill.
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  I mean this tell me about two miles from the main road,
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  walking there, it was so bad. We couldn't drive up that hill
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  because you know, God lives and everything.
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  So we have walked from the top of the hill down to get to the
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  main road. Right now, what I did on the
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  weekends I make myself a workout One bump of the he'll walk back
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  down to bumps up the hill. Walk back down.
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  This is me in high school making working for myself one time of
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  the said, Okay, I want to do long jumps.
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  I went and I dug a pit in the front of my yard.
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  I don't a long jump pit in the front of my yard, right?
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  He's just mean that we can't digging that pit in America.
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  We will hit a tennis ball up against the garage.
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  We will throw the baseball and football with our Ends forever.
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  You Doug, first off the back, you designed your own work out
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  based on the bumps of the he'll love that bug.
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  Your own long jump pit. I dug my own lunch a right.
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  But here's here's the funny part after I finish digging that pit.
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  I said, let me test it out, I hit that little Mark that I made
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  for myself, got in the air. I said, Dad, I'm a I'm afraid of
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  heights. Afraid of heights.
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  Whoops, I didn't know before. So you must have been real low
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  on the hurdles when you started hurdling and think I'll stay
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  low, but I hit that. Fun, electric colors, and whoa,
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  no not for me. So that was it.
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  So, but but they take it seriously back home, you know,
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  and a lot of times, their tickets years because it's a
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  means to an end for a lot of people, right?
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  That is the way to get to College, because we don't have a
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  lot of colleges and universities there.
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  And the ones that we do have, they're so competitive to get
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  into. You could be a straight, A
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  student, that doesn't guarantee you get a spot at one of those
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  colleges. So you have to figure out a way
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  to To get your education elsewhere, right?
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  Because it's competition because even through seventh grade you
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  get into high schools at 7th grade back in Jamaica and we
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  have to take the common entrance exams at seventh grade and
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  before you get to seventh grade is fifth and sixth grade.
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  And if you don't perform well in the common entrance exams might,
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  do you have up to sixth grade to get, get it right?
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  And you choose which two schools or three schools you want to go
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  to and if you don't get into any of those three schools, you
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  gotta go back. So your middle school that he
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  call it here and do another year.
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  So if you take if you take your common interests in the fifth
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  grade, then you're cool. You and your past, you're good
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  to go sixth grade and you don't pass it again for your sixth
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  grade. You don't go to the regular high
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  schools. You go to technical high
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  school's, right? So that's the way it is.
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  So it's competitive every which way you can think about it very
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  competitive. So I was lucky to pass when I
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  was 11 so that was good. So I was I got into the school
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  that I wanted to go to and with that sleep and breathing track
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  and field. So when you do make it to the
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  high school and I can think of a few like maybe jogo and they
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  rotate off and Jayco and beer right there.
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  Yeah. Okay.
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  So when you get to the high school level, if there's a
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  thousand kids at the high school, what percentage actually
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  go to do track, do a lot of them do track.
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  Well, at my school, it was maybe, maybe 5% because there
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  are so many other sports had netball.
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  You had Some people did swimming wet field.
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  Hockey. There's a lot of different
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  sports they can go into right? But maybe I think, maybe about 5
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  or 10% of my high school, but that went to st.
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  Andrew High School for Girls and that was a big-time schools,
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  corporate school back in the day.
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  But right now, the main thing is hydel and that's a, that's a
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  woman big schools right now. Hidell they're really doing
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  well. So, yeah, so that's the whole
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  thing. So we take it, seriously and
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  some people that just use it for fun, but you don't find that, In
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  all the time. So when I came here and started
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  my high school coaching carrier and the kids walked in and think
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  it's for fun. I said, what the heck is this
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  fun? We don't do things for fun,
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  right? And I told him up the total kids
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  at one time. I said no having fun is winning
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  right and ik. I started coaching here at the
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  Collegiate prep school. So it's a very affluent prep
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  school, and these kids came up It's for fun.
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  That's a No-No. Winning is fun for me.
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  So we change our whole mindset for the kids and they started
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  thinking like like you know this time of year a sheep or a wolf.
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  So they started thinking like Wolves at that time and it's
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  really great that culture that was developed over the years
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  from the high school and younger ones came in and assess and saw
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  what was going on and it just jumped right in.
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  So that's why I think we're so successful.
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  At winning nine straight state championships on the girls side.
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  Side. You know the guys won eight out
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  of nine so it was just that was a whole mentality.
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  You're coming they have a lot of fun.
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  Yes, but here's a kicker when you walk onto the track, I never
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  had to be there. When it was time for warm ups,
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  all the coaches from the other programs would say, man, we
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  always think there's a coach watching your kids but no
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  they're everybody's in command and I could stand in the
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  building and watch what's going on.
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  And I say yeah this is it this is really good.
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  It sounds like there's a Since when you're running and study in
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  your academics because you don't, there's not a lot of
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  options like you either make it or you don't, or do you go to
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  this good? We're versus like oh there's a
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  lot of options if I don't make it in track, that's okay because
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  I'll just go become a student in college like that.
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  Tell us about the high school time for you as an athlete.
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  You mentioned kind of learning hurdles on your own.
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  Yet a coach, but was more Sprint based and so maybe didn't spend
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  a lot of time there and you found some success and enjoyment
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  out of working with a teammate and seeing her have success.
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  That that's a different mentality.
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  You know, there's one of I want to be successful and then
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  there's, it's a different in. This is the Jean.
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  I think coaches have. Oh, I want someone else to
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  achieve success. How did that manifest itself?
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  As you continue through high school and then started looking
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  at New York Tech. And here's the thing, I wasn't
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  even looking at coming to college here, right?
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  So that was just an icing on the cake for us.
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  So and I was okay because I had plans to go after GC faster
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  college. So that was my ultimate goal
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  that I had a great that everything needed.
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  So, I was getting ready to go there.
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  So you know and here's another thing too is that we have shift
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  system set up in Jamaica my school.
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  So either morning shift or you're in the evening shift and
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  then the next year you switch, because it's so big.
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  So half the school population will come in the mornings and we
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  overlap somewhere around the time.
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  But then at in the evening section, everybody with me, For
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  practice. So I would start my day at 6:30
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  walking down to catch a bus 6:30 in the morning to catch a bus
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  and back home in the morning at 6:30 when they have to do
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  outside and everything so you can forget about whatever here
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  do you have right because by the time you get to the bus it was
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  non-existent, right? I have that same issue today.
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  Practice starts at 5:00 in the evening, you know?
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  So I'm there from leaving the house at 6:30 in the morning.
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  I don't get back home until 8:00 at night.
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  Sometimes I don't have to go home.
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  I just did a friend's house because I, like I said, I lived
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  in the countryside, right? So that's an hour-and-a-half to
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  school. So I just stay at my friend's
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  house, sometimes, you know, and it was so great seeing at my
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  friend's house. Because, and here's another
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  story with that my friend. Every encounter was our knees,
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  our name and I say that her house during the week sometimes,
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  right? My mother didn't even meet that
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  family until. Yeah, believe it or not, until
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  maybe a year and a half. After I started going there and
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  coming back and I said to my mom, no God.
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  Rest, her soul. I said to myself moon.
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  It's so crazy. How you never once asked me?
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  Where were you staying? Who are these?
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  People, but all I know and for all, you know, I could be With
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  some old man, somewhere, just a not trusted you.
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  Yeah, my, my wife won't let my kids go outside of that.
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  Where you going. All you gonna be who you is?
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  I want to see the resume. I want to see some history.
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  Yeah no, no, take it further. When my daughter was growing up,
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  I would volunteer to her classroom every Friday so I can
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  know the kids in her class from she was three years.
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  All the way up. So that would volunteer in her
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  class. I know who the bad kids are.
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  I didn't they invite her to my birthday party?
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  That's, I'm so sorry, but she's visit at weekend, but that was
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  me. I was a momager from day one
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  momager. I love it, I love it.
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  Well, tell us before, we flip over coming to United States, I
• 16:30
  have seen a video or two of the Jamaica, I would call the high
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  school Champs. You did you call it all
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  Champions, or whatever boys champion?
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  The boisterous chatter and this looks like a madhouse and I
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  mean, that all the good ways like there are the best thing
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  understands people are going drums, drums, you would think in
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  America, you would say, oh, this is like looks like a football
• 16:53
  game and here it is for a track meet.
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  Tell us about that, culture of the, the all chant the
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  championship meet. I think that sets up everyone
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  who competes at the boys and girls chance for anything.
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  If you can go through the boys and girls championships, you
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  can't survive any me. Because man that meat put some
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  hair on your chest. Yeah, not so that if you survive
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  that, oh, you can do anything. It's like going to say, if you
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  can make it in New York, you make it anywhere.
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  If you can make it at a boys and girls championships, you're
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  good. Is it just because of the
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  pressure or the shop and try to share the competition or all of
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  it together, everything people are in the stands and they're
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  rooting on you, and then the betting against another person.
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  So it It's at the old boys come down from all over the world.
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  Do you see people from wrecking their color still, you know, and
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  they come in and they rep and it's just the best feeling ever
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  wonder. You have to really get in chance
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  and go to the boys and girls Championship you'll never forget
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  it. Yeah, a lot of people have like
• 17:55
  the Olympics or World Champs on their bucket list.
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  The Championships in Jamaica are on my bucket list.
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  Looks like I've heard it's nothing but just amazing chaos
• 18:05
  with a track meet you mentioned. You know, if you can make it in
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  New York, you can make it anywhere.
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  What a great. I don't know if you did this,
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  set me up on purpose or not, that was awesome.
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  How does it again? I've never been to Jamaica.
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  But here's what I assumed and what I've seen in pictures and
• 18:20
  videos is, it's a beautiful island.
• 18:23
  It's hot beaches Etc and I don't know exactly where New York Tech
• 18:28
  is in New York but New York has a winter.
• 18:31
  No beaches. Yeah.
• 18:33
  How did you survive? I'm from Alabama and I don't I
• 18:37
  couldn't I barely survived here in Illinois.
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  Let me tell you something. When I first came to this
• 18:43
  country, it was in a January in. One of the worst blizzards in
• 18:47
  January, the worst blizzards, right?
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  My mother had to work. So she was already living here
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  and I came up in January started, my semester in January
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  and she took me and she didn't have a car, so it was a two
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  buses know, a bus, a train and another bus we were in Queens.
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  And we had to go over to Old Westbury in Long Island as the
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  next next one over and it was a bus, a train and a bus.
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  And that was me and her and we had to register because school
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  started, right? So she went and she took me over
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  and she said, I've got to go to work.
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  First week in this country first baseball, I'll be off.
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  I got to go to work. This is a bus schedule.
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  This is this is this, and after I register for classes and did
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  my practice for that day, I had to find my way back home.
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  We scared her, like I said, I survived boys and girls times.
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  Wow. And I had my MetroCard and
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  whatever I needed and I got home.
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  But here's the thing, my final boss, I didn't know how to
• 20:10
  transfer. So I sat on a bus after he got
• 20:13
  to the station and said, okay, where you going?
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  And I told me address, he said, okay you got to transfer to
• 20:16
  another bus to get to where you go and I made it, I made it.
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  You know, all of 19 years old, but I made it at 46.
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  I struggle from getting to my house to work sometimes GPS.
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  Yeah. Oh yeah. 100% know that thank
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  God for GPS on phones. I thought I would struggle.
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  I couldn't imagine new country navigate cold freezing.
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  You're already to your ankle already in stress mode and
• 20:45
  you're trying to figure out what bus is what trains to get that
• 20:48
  goal and knowing in the back, your head, like man, if I don't
• 20:50
  figure it out, well then I got to figure out where to They for
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  the Nike. That's right, because I didn't
• 20:54
  know anybody on the team. Right, buddy.
• 20:58
  Carol, that is a crazy. And that's why I tell people
• 21:01
  that if I can move from Jamaica to Queens, New York, I can move
• 21:06
  to from New York to North Carolina, right?
• 21:09
  It's not even the same country. It's not moving out of the
• 21:11
  country again, right? It's the same country.
• 21:14
  Yeah, I believe that. If you could do what you did,
• 21:17
  good Lord, what what is going to stop you?
• 21:18
  What's gonna get in your way here for a raise, my daughter
• 21:22
  like this, too. You know, she is she don't like
• 21:24
  to let me to tell her age. So her stage age is 31.
• 21:27
  Hmm, the hurry Angels or stage age.
• 21:31
  Yeah, so talk to us about your time at New York.
• 21:35
  Tech, what did you study? What was the plan for a career?
• 21:39
  Was it always to be a track coach?
• 21:41
  Or what did you think about doing?
• 21:42
  No, I wanted to be a child psychologist when I started New
• 21:46
  York Institute of Technology, right?
• 21:48
  And after maybe semester, I You know, something, if I become a
• 21:55
  child psychologist, I'm going to take everybody's problems on my
• 21:58
  head and I will, and I'm not type of person.
• 22:01
  I will take everybody and I will try to find a solution.
• 22:04
  I'll be in the madhouse. So, I stopped and I love and
• 22:09
  back in Jamaica, we weren't exposed to computers because
• 22:11
  back in those days, they didn't have the technology that they
• 22:15
  have. No.
• 22:16
  So we had one class for computer science at night, but computer
• 22:20
  science, just information systems learning about the
• 22:22
  Pewters, that's what that's a special class.
• 22:24
  So I took one class in that and when I came to New York,
• 22:27
  Institute of Technology, I said, okay, I love math, love English.
• 22:33
  I like computers to but because we didn't have the resources of
• 22:37
  programming so it was an ingrained in my system to be a
• 22:40
  programmer. So I'm more off the information
• 22:43
  systems type not data analytics, but more information systems
• 22:47
  people person and computers combined.
• 22:49
  So that's what I did. So I majored in Information
• 22:52
  Systems M minored in math. I had 24 credits and math.
• 22:56
  So that was it at 24 credits, in my English classes that just
• 22:59
  love to learn. So, you know, while we were
• 23:02
  there we were, we were allowed to do summer classes, so I did
• 23:06
  summer classes. Every summer, I did art class at
• 23:10
  it, everything just interesting classes, right?
• 23:13
  Because it was being paid for. So I just, I just did it.
• 23:16
  So, by the time, I was finished with college, I grinded with
• 23:18
  140-something credits, its lack of love.
• 23:22
  To learn you know, thinking credits every semester, you
• 23:25
  know, working on campus plus full time with track.
• 23:28
  So we did everything. I went to college in Alabama, I
• 23:31
  think I had 47 credits is what I ended up with.
• 23:36
  This will give me a degree so they can't take it back.
• 23:38
  Now y'all, where did this, you know, care when you think about
• 23:41
  this like really learning posture from to, from you.
• 23:44
  You know, I would like to learn. I want to learn about new
• 23:47
  things. Where does that come from was
• 23:49
  mom? A teacher family teacher, where
• 23:51
  does that kind of? Curiosity, if you will come
• 23:54
  from, my mom was a supervisor for the tax department in
• 23:58
  Jamaica. So that was her job and she
• 24:00
  loved to learn herself because when she moved to this to the US
• 24:03
  she moved here when she was maybe 50 days.
• 24:08
  Maybe 55 durables, right? And she came here and she
• 24:12
  switched her career she end up going to nursing school you know
• 24:16
  at that stage so she was always a lifelong learner herself and I
• 24:20
  remember back in back home home I wasn't in the science track in
• 24:25
  high school because he get picture.
• 24:27
  I call it pigeon-holed, you get pigeonholed in different kids
• 24:30
  are. So I was in the business section
• 24:32
  and I am, I love science. So I had a physics book at home
• 24:37
  in my shelf and I went through that thing and I was teaching
• 24:40
  myself physics, you know, teaching myself as its.
• 24:43
  I really love to learn. So that was it.
• 24:46
  That's really interesting that you're in the business track.
• 24:50
  But you had this passion for the sciences and Physics, love that.
• 24:55
  So, besides being on the track team, nothing.
• 24:59
  So far, as telling me like, oh yeah, Carol's gonna be a track
• 25:02
  coach, what did you do after you finished with your information,
• 25:05
  science and math, minor here. Okay, so after I was done with
• 25:08
  that, I went to Domino's Sugar Corporation, Domino's Sugar, you
• 25:14
  know, the ones. You have an issue, shells, all
• 25:16
  the time. They had this major Factory in
• 25:19
  Williamsburg in Brooklyn. So that was my big major job.
• 25:24
  So it was me my supervisor to supervisors and at that time,
• 25:29
  that there was no networking from the factory itself to the
• 25:33
  offices, and we didn't have a real Network system either back
• 25:36
  in those days. So we lost three people, we are
• 25:40
  rent, Category, 5, cables, get all of that thing going hooked
• 25:44
  up the server's, got all the people in the offices connected.
• 25:48
  It was the best first job ever. / coming out of college.
• 25:53
  So that was my job. I'm working for a while and we
• 25:55
  design that we, you know, upgraded a computers.
• 25:58
  But computers and I brought into interns one from Brooklyn
• 26:02
  College and one from Polytechnic interesting to know that the one
• 26:07
  from Brooklyn College is Corey Bennett who is a head coach at
• 26:10
  hidell, right? So I brought in Hindi was
• 26:13
  running at Brooklyn College, so I brought him as my intern to
• 26:17
  learn about computers and he said, this is, I've learned
• 26:19
  everything about computers in once.
• 26:22
  And then he went back to Jamaica and set up his whole network.
• 26:25
  I just found his mom school, right?
• 26:28
  They said of all of them soak or embedded had his first learning
• 26:31
  through me, at Domino's Sugar Corporation, what a small world
• 26:36
  without yes, because to me it sounds like track is out of the
• 26:39
  picture at this point, but yeah, it really is.
• 26:41
  I have no intention of coaching is I'm coaching these interns on
• 26:46
  how to be computer technicians, how to set everything up, how to
• 26:50
  upgrade computers. How to upgrade hard drives and
• 26:53
  everything of the sort. So that was my job is just, you
• 26:56
  know, making sure the company was in line with the technology
• 27:00
  and then after everything was done, then we hold classes to
• 27:03
  teach the employees, how to use the software how things work.
• 27:07
  So it was great first for it was a big job to.
• 27:11
  There's that teaching seems to be staying closer and closer.
• 27:14
  It's like, oh yeah, we got to do that but then we had to teach
• 27:16
  people coaching his teaching. So we had to coach people on how
• 27:20
  to use it. Exactly.
• 27:21
  Besides Corey who I love that. You know, here's this intern for
• 27:25
  this computer job for Dominic Dominic Domino's or Domino's
• 27:29
  Sugar, Domino's Sugar. And he's a track guys.
• 27:33
  That's the only real track connection.
• 27:34
  Where you at this time? As you're going through this
• 27:37
  time there with them, setting up these computers and systems and
• 27:41
  then teaching them what we're was tracking your life.
• 27:43
  Are you still like trying to catch track on TV or you still
• 27:46
  are you and Corey talking track because that you have that in
• 27:49
  common or coronated? It helped with his starts, get
• 27:54
  it because it was a sprinter. So he needed help with his
• 27:56
  starts. So I have come with a starts
• 27:58
  even though we're there or talk about that, helped him with that
• 28:01
  part and I was still, I was still working out, I was still
• 28:04
  working on that. I'm still staying in shape and
• 28:07
  still running on attached for club, right.
• 28:11
  So I was still into it because I still love the sport, so still
• 28:14
  training, still competing, nothing on nothing big, but the
• 28:18
  still get not there. So after I was With that summer
• 28:23
  with Corey, I decided to move on to higher level, not for to not
• 28:26
  nothing with sport, still Cinemas in the corporate world.
• 28:29
  So I'm still in the carpet. So I moved on from there to ABC
• 28:34
  News. ABC News Midtown Manhattan right
• 28:39
  from Midtown? Manhattan, I was same thing
• 28:42
  working with with networking and the teaching the staff and we
• 28:47
  were help deaths of people need help go and figure out what what
• 28:50
  their problem is. So that was that still no
• 28:53
  Sports. I mean, everybody.
• 28:55
  Listen right now is going, wait a minute, she does coach at
• 28:57
  Johnson C Smith, right. She's ahead cut.
• 28:58
  Where we at where at ABC News were to Sugar Company and I know
• 29:02
  we still don't the next position.
• 29:04
  Still isn't in track and field. Where do we?
• 29:08
  Where do we go after ABC? After ABC, it was JPMorgan Chase
• 29:13
  on Wall Street. For JP Morgan State, and that
• 29:16
  was a great job to Jason Morgan's at a time.
• 29:19
  My daughter was here as well. She was.
• 29:22
  She was maybe five at a time about five years old at the
• 29:25
  time. So she was going to school in
• 29:27
  Brooklyn. And I have no inkling to push
• 29:29
  her and track and be either I couldn't swim.
• 29:32
  So my thing is to get her swimming so that was that was
• 29:36
  almost forced to us as I was interested in having her.
• 29:38
  Do learning how to swim playing the piano.
• 29:41
  Those were things that I think every little person should
• 29:44
  learn. So that was what she was doing.
• 29:46
  So I JP Morgan Chase. I was a server engineer.
• 29:50
  And what the server Engineers do is that we mirror, whatever is
• 29:54
  in the corporate world, so whatever is in each segment.
• 29:58
  So my support area was Bournemouth in England, Hong
• 30:02
  Kong, and of course Northeast. So if any servers go down, then,
• 30:09
  you know, that's millions of dollars lost right there.
• 30:11
  So we had to have, we have our own lab, and in our lab, we We
• 30:15
  mimic what goes around and everybody server.
• 30:18
  So if we need to put a new software on any of these servers
• 30:21
  are an update, we run it through the lab first test it against
• 30:25
  every other application that sits on the server so that make
• 30:27
  sure nothing breaks. Right?
• 30:29
  So we do all of these things and we try to crash the server to
• 30:32
  see what would crash the server and we have to figure out how to
• 30:35
  fix that crash and what bug fixes we needed.
• 30:38
  So we did all of that all thread.
• 30:40
  I work with all men which is even a bitter thing too.
• 30:43
  Because we can argue You about everything and after we're done
• 30:47
  arguing, okay. Who's buying lunch right?
• 30:50
  We don't take things personally accept it.
• 30:51
  Who's buying lunch, right? It was great.
• 30:54
  So we had to do that and of course when we roll out anything
• 30:57
  to London or two for murder and where we have to stay behind and
• 31:01
  make sure that okay everything is working, right?
• 31:04
  And another good thing is we have to make sure write detailed
• 31:07
  documentation about how you do it, how you put this on your
• 31:12
  server, how to work if you this happens, this Is a solution and
• 31:16
  we had to Do complete, documentation, and have the
• 31:19
  package and should talk. So that was my job, that sounds
• 31:23
  fascinating. I mean, literally what you're
• 31:25
  talking about, you know, you have mirrored servers and you're
• 31:28
  trying to break things, things like that.
• 31:29
  Now you lost me when you went to documentation, I'm not really
• 31:32
  good at that, but the rest of this technical writing back in
• 31:35
  the New York Institute of Technology, right?
• 31:38
  I did a lot of technical writing so I had a minor in technical
• 31:40
  writing. So you're doing these.
• 31:43
  I mean, really cool. I mean this is a fascinating
• 31:46
  career path that you're on. Your you continue to add more
• 31:50
  responsibilities bigger responsibilities.
• 31:52
  I mean, working for one of the largest banks in the world.
• 31:55
  You're right. You won one mistake.
• 31:57
  Not only could cost the company Millions but you know, our 401ks
• 32:01
  markets are. Right.
• 32:03
  Exactly. So you'll the responsibilities
• 32:05
  are tremendous and and track is nowhere in your mind.
• 32:11
  Just No, we're still nowhere. You know, I like to watch a
• 32:15
  sport. Yeah, but that's just about it
• 32:18
  so I can send my daughter. The only thing I needed for her
• 32:20
  to do is learn to swim, right? So put her in swimming classes,
• 32:25
  make sure she's and intellectually developing and
• 32:29
  that's my man. That was my main focus, you're
• 32:31
  not volunteering at the local high school.
• 32:34
  You're not. I own the volunteer in her
• 32:36
  classroom, so I do Junior Achievement.
• 32:38
  So I take the Junior Achievement packages and I go to her
• 32:41
  classrooms and I teach them about business and finance and
• 32:43
  all of those things for the little ones coming up.
• 32:46
  So that was all Junior Achievement of New York.
• 32:49
  So that was all I was in every Friday.
• 32:51
  I took my lunch time but I go over to her school and I teach.
• 32:54
  Okay Carol the podcast is called the Gill tract infield
• 32:59
  connections podcast. How where does track?
• 33:04
  I mean I feel like every listen going.
• 33:05
  Well man. Mike's branching out to non
• 33:07
  track coaches I guess we're in the world and how because I
• 33:11
  still can Like to me, you disgusting there yet, know you
• 33:14
  have a huge Chasm between JPMorgan, Chase and coaching
• 33:19
  track and field like how do we connect the dots are?
• 33:21
  How does this happen, Okay? So now 9/11 happened, right?
• 33:26
  And that was a turning point. So I said, okay, I'm doing so
• 33:31
  much making good money. Yes, you're not gonna deny that
• 33:35
  I'm making all the money. My daughter is doing great, but
• 33:38
  at one time, I said, hey, no, the time I've got to figure.
• 33:42
  Go out. What is more important?
• 33:43
  Right? What is more important?
• 33:45
  So I say it's at the money. I know she's getting to be nine
• 33:48
  years old coming on 10. This is going to be the critical
• 33:52
  point in these kids lives, right?
• 33:54
  Where I have to be there. So this is a myth almost because
• 33:57
  she was she was always a bright kid.
• 33:59
  So I 10 years old, she's in sixth grade Right Said, sixth
• 34:03
  grade at 10 years old. Yeah, I did think it's like my
• 34:06
  son is in sixth grade. He 810 he's 12.
• 34:09
  Okay, so she's advancing very All right, but she started
• 34:13
  reading chapter books when she was five.
• 34:16
  Right? So, so she's now 10 in the sixth
• 34:19
  grade great, I'll go in this and I had to call her back a year
• 34:22
  because I held her and I had to repeat a grade spray for because
• 34:26
  she was just it was just she was asking too much and I said and I
• 34:30
  said to her I want to explain it to.
• 34:31
  I say do some aerial I said you're going to go to the mall
• 34:34
  with your friends when you're in middle school and high school,
• 34:37
  you're going to want to talk about Rugrats.
• 34:39
  They're not gonna want to talk about Rugrats.
• 34:42
  Right. Especially almost up.
• 34:44
  And I held her back for in fourth grade for a year and even
• 34:46
  though he'll their backs was till I had of the game, right?
• 34:49
  So she was just going on and say, you know something, let's
• 34:52
  figure it out so far year, I took a whole year do research on
• 34:55
  where to move next but she has never been in public schools
• 34:59
  before. So I want to make sure that the
• 35:01
  right place. I'm going to the right place and
• 35:04
  make sure that there's a great swim program there for her as
• 35:06
  well so I've got nothing more track yet so make sure there's a
• 35:09
  good swimming program. She's can Intellectually
• 35:12
  developed and the whole nine yards.
• 35:14
  So I did a whole research is what's either?
• 35:17
  North Carolina or Florida. That's okay.
• 35:22
  We're in North Carolina. So did research demographics.
• 35:27
  Air polluted air quality School. Swim Clarkson, how close it is
• 35:35
  to New York because I still have to make to have ties to New York
• 35:39
  so I said okay let's figure it. Also did all the research
• 35:42
  quality of life. I said okay Charlotte it will be
• 35:46
  because Charlotte had swim Mac you know Mecklenburg Aquatics
• 35:49
  Club, big-time Swim Club. That's how I would get there.
• 35:53
  It was too late for me to register had either one of those
• 35:56
  three Public's private schools. Charlotte Latin Providence, they
• 35:59
  are country day. So okay fine I'll get you into A
• 36:02
  good school. So she was zone for our maybe,
• 36:05
  you know, it wasn't the top tier middle school but it was a good
• 36:08
  middle school. But she said Mommy, what's the
• 36:11
  best middle school in Charlotte? So I said, well, the research
• 36:15
  shows that it's so short and middle school at a time.
• 36:18
  So she said, okay can you drive me over there?
• 36:20
  That's okay. Didn't know what was coming.
• 36:22
  Wait, this is a ten-year-old. Yeah, she didn't ask who has the
• 36:26
  coolest playground where closest to the mall?
• 36:30
  I don't know. I'm thinking that my son.
• 36:32
  Ask for, wow. Okay.
• 36:35
  Who has the best and what she used to do?
• 36:37
  They still have a pink portfolio.
• 36:39
  She has a pink portfolio that she kept all her best work all
• 36:44
  her and I still have that. It was it was amazing her best
• 36:48
  work. So she took that pink portfolio
• 36:50
  on her arm and I drove her off to so Charlotte Middle School
• 36:54
  and as I asked him, it was in the summertime.
• 36:56
  They still had office hours and I said to him, I said on my
• 36:58
  daughter, would like to speak to someone about transferring and I
• 37:02
  I never run things for her. Right.
• 37:04
  So I sat in the waiting room and I let her go do her thing.
• 37:08
  She came back out with her signed paper signed for transfer
• 37:12
  to South Charlotte, Middle School.
• 37:14
  Yeah. That's because from day one, I
• 37:16
  did I believe in letting her advocate for herself.
• 37:20
  So even with as a six-year-old we would go to the pediatrician,
• 37:23
  she would take her little list that she needs to speak to her
• 37:26
  pediatrician about and I don't speak for her.
• 37:28
  I said, I let her speak for herself so she can talk about
• 37:31
  what's going on. Yeah, I think I'm sure thinks
• 37:34
  that was it as good. Say Carol, we should retitle
• 37:37
  this to how to parent. I mean, because this is a direct
• 37:41
  reflection on you and how you interact, how you lead, how you
• 37:47
  step away and let her lead at a young age?
• 37:50
  This is, I mean Bravo mom. I mean, come on, I know it takes
• 37:54
  a village, there's a lot of other teachers and things, but
• 37:57
  there has to be a leader, and it has to start my opinion at the
• 38:00
  house here. What a job you have done.
• 38:04
  And are doing is a parents. Yeah.
• 38:07
  So she went and she got her thing signed and I said, okay,
• 38:10
  so we just have to drive her to school, you know.
• 38:12
  And there's no bus service because this is what she chose a
• 38:15
  my mother. She said she was the best of
• 38:18
  grandmother. So she was driving her to school
• 38:22
  picking her up and at the same time, my nephew who was 14, he
• 38:25
  moved in with me from New York because he was getting himself
• 38:28
  in trouble in New York. So I moved him in with me when
• 38:30
  he was 14 as a freshman in His high school.
• 38:33
  So he blossomed when he came because he said he didn't want
• 38:37
  to disappoint me. That's what I said.
• 38:38
  That's good to know. That's good to know, he's
• 38:41
  married, know with with kids, you know.
• 38:43
  But that is good to know that he didn't want to disappoint me.
• 38:46
  Yeah. So so that was a.
• 38:47
  But we haven't gone to track it. As I see it in, you care, you
• 38:52
  have to make money. So what job would call.
• 38:55
  Yeah, exactly. So the good thing like I said,
• 38:57
  is that I was making quite a lot of money in New York working
• 39:01
  there. So, I was good with my savings.
• 39:04
  And when I sold my house in New York, I just came and bought a
• 39:07
  townhouse here. So I don't have to worry about
• 39:09
  mortgages and anything of us. All right, so that's Ed me up
• 39:14
  where I can, you know, find my my time where I want to go and I
• 39:19
  walked in Providence day school and I walked in off the street,
• 39:23
  but my resume and I said, hello, I'm Carol.
• 39:27
  Lawrence. And do you have any openings?
• 39:31
  And I said, they looked at, I said, oh my gosh, you're so
• 39:33
  super qualified and I said, but mrs.
• 39:36
  Freaky down there, she has a opening for a field.
• 39:41
  Hockey coach. I said okay.
• 39:44
  Oh yeah, that was my second sport.
• 39:46
  Well, I okay, let's say you would not mention playing or
• 39:49
  yeah. That was my S given even said
• 39:51
  the word feel like. Okay.
• 39:52
  So you did play field hockey. Yeah, doesn't care.
• 39:55
  If you tell me, you walked up the street started coaching
• 39:57
  field hockey. I'd like unbelievable.
• 40:00
  Okay? I had a field.
• 40:02
  Hockey experience. Okay good.
• 40:11
  I found that you are not Superwoman good.
• 40:13
  It's that's a good. That's a good quality.
• 40:16
  All right so first of all I can only imagine someone looking at
• 40:20
  your resume going. You want to teach here?
• 40:23
  Yeah. Like what are you and then it
• 40:25
  going? Yeah.
• 40:26
  Miss perky needs help in the field.
• 40:27
  Hockey. And you're like, shit.
• 40:30
  I mean, there were the sweetest people on this planet are
• 40:33
  Providence a school. So I walked down met Barbara
• 40:36
  Fricke and Sue Fitzgerald right there.
• 40:39
  So they're like, you know, buddies, so mr.
• 40:41
  Spitzer. Our soup is Gerald Annette and
• 40:44
  Barbara Fricke. And what we say, yes we could
• 40:46
  use them and it was such a great thing.
• 40:48
  We can borrow for kids. Well, because of mrs.
• 40:51
  White who was Computer science, Computer Applications teacher at
• 40:54
  Providence, a school that time. She was getting ready to retire
• 40:58
  and Barbara says, she just called me when I was an audit of
• 41:01
  the, he said, mrs. White G know what is going to
• 41:04
  retire. Jenny white, so go up and get
• 41:07
  that and get a job that was like, fate right there, right?
• 41:11
  That's what I was thinking. I was like, wow, it was meant
• 41:13
  for you to go and why? So I went there and I coach the
• 41:19
  hockey mites in the fall and then we Add track in the spring.
• 41:23
  Of course, that's that much money exporters when a coach
• 41:25
  that you say doesn't have openings for track as well.
• 41:28
  So it's like that, perfect. So using my knowledge from back
• 41:31
  in high school and college and the whole nine yards.
• 41:34
  You know, I'm coaching and kids and you know, the thing they
• 41:38
  having fun and I said, guys, we got to take this seriously.
• 41:41
  I'm not gonna come on here if you're not taking this
• 41:43
  seriously. And the kids said to me, you
• 41:46
  know, something coach Lawrence, you are the first coach that
• 41:49
  we've had in a long time who worries about the people at the
• 41:52
  bottom. Well, I thought, yeah, I believe
• 41:55
  in potion from the bottom up, right?
• 41:58
  So we are as strong as our weakest kid on his team.
• 42:02
  So if I can't make that weakest kid on the team, be better than
• 42:07
  somebody else's team over there and I'm not doing my job.
• 42:10
  So I make sure that everybody from the bottom up, guess what?
• 42:14
  They need to be successful and I don't know what success for each
• 42:17
  person is but I'm coaching them up to what I think but their
• 42:21
  success should be which is where Bob here, a lot of people said,
• 42:23
  no, you haven't, those are too high, go for some nice.
• 42:26
  Not just how I have to apply yourself yet, right?
• 42:30
  So I said, just jump on and you'll see that you'll get
• 42:32
  there, so there's kind of, you know, not being a you, you
• 42:36
  weren't either an education major, but my understanding a
• 42:40
  little bit is, you know, there's kind of two philosophies,
• 42:42
  there's probably 20, but, you know, there's coaching down to
• 42:45
  the lowest denominator, so you have 20 kids, you make sure the
• 42:48
  20th person. And so, the, the fear there's IO
• 42:52
  wil Top at just use an academics here kids will, they don't get
• 42:56
  taught very well because you're teaching down to the 20th and
• 42:59
  there's the reverse it's like no you teach to the top called 10%
• 43:02
  and the bottom kids will follow up right after the whole thing,
• 43:05
  right? Or fall off, yes, right.
• 43:08
  They'll either. They'll either follow up or they
• 43:10
  will fall off. Tell me a little bit.
• 43:12
  I want to dive into that because the that was very interesting.
• 43:14
  What you said of, I believe coaching from the bottom up.
• 43:18
  So how does that manifest itself knowing that we don't talk about
• 43:21
  X's and O's. Right, right, right.
• 43:22
  But talking about that philosophy.
• 43:24
  How does that manifest itself with how you coach the kids?
• 43:28
  Then, if you're if you coach from the bottom up, what does
• 43:30
  that mean? Expound more on that.
• 43:32
  All right, so the top have their, everybody have the
• 43:34
  workouts, the top people in this group, they're the ones that's
• 43:39
  going to always, fighting always going.
• 43:42
  They always have that, but the bottom needs a little bit more
• 43:44
  product, right? A little bit more encouragement.
• 43:47
  Now, I'm giving this top of the group, they're just workouts.
• 43:52
  But I'm making sure that these people at the bottom, try to get
• 43:55
  up there as well, right? There's not a matter.
• 43:57
  If I'm going to give them the hardest work out.
• 43:59
  And then they're going to say, I'm going to quit because I
• 44:01
  can't handle this. Now, I'm designing the program
• 44:04
  where the people at the top have what they need as well to be
• 44:07
  successful and the perfect on the bottom have what they need
• 44:10
  as well to come up. Right?
• 44:12
  Some that's my bottom up approach.
• 44:13
  I don't like to leave anybody behind and and I know and a
• 44:17
  Cockerel is the is my most The highest level athlete does
• 44:22
  coach, right? And she would tell everybody
• 44:25
  that you can coach treated me special.
• 44:27
  Hmm. She didn't.
• 44:31
  Right? So I don't leave everybody
• 44:33
  behind to go. Focus on Anna.
• 44:35
  Cockrell all Gracie. Waylon right.
• 44:37
  Gracie, Belle is another great one that came out of here or
• 44:40
  I'll give you a heel. She's now at Princeton, you
• 44:42
  know, I don't believe all the these kids Behind to say I'm
• 44:45
  going to focus on these only. So everybody feels like they're
• 44:49
  wanted and everybody felt that everybody felt that there were
• 44:53
  my, I was their favorite are, they were my favorite, so it
• 44:56
  sounds like intentionality, like, I'm being intentional with
• 45:00
  what, Either twentieth of their first, you're going to get
• 45:04
  instruction and Care a from me. Exactly exactly.
• 45:09
  So, how did it go? You're in Charlotte, you're a
• 45:12
  new city, a new state, a new career.
• 45:17
  How did this go for coaching? I am, it took it took maybe two
• 45:22
  years from that point because I told people I'm very direct, I
• 45:26
  don't like to sugarcoat things, you know.
• 45:28
  Like to tell you straight, I like to make.
• 45:31
  And some people can handle it, some people can but at the end
• 45:34
  of the day, all them kids man. They say you know some coach
• 45:37
  that was the part that I love most that you were so honest in
• 45:41
  what you're telling and I don't mean I don't do it to be mean
• 45:43
  spirited. You know I just do it because
• 45:46
  you have to know you have to know that this is not and I've
• 45:50
  been doing this for so long that I can tell which kid belongs to
• 45:52
  wear. Right?
• 45:54
  So now you can this is still early in your coach and we've
• 45:58
  now got into coaching. What were you?
• 46:02
  So you obviously had your experience to fall back on from
• 46:06
  high school and college track and field.
• 46:09
  What were you doing? I always like to talk about
• 46:11
  coaching education, it was it was a big deal for my career.
• 46:15
  Are you doing any to me? There's two types of coaching
• 46:18
  education. There's form also usatf level
• 46:20
  ones and things like that and then there's in formals.
• 46:24
  Yeah, I buddied up with the coach at such-and-such
• 46:27
  University and their ear for everything.
• 46:30
  What were you doing to me? Yourself a better track coach
• 46:32
  coaching education wise, you sat love.
• 46:35
  Dom level 1, my a.d.d. Barbara Fricke.
• 46:39
  No, actually, it wasn't for forget this time, not all worth
• 46:42
  it, nice abating. I have some great 80s, right?
• 46:45
  So I think is maybe nice abating.
• 46:47
  It's always helpful. Yeah, I know right.
• 46:50
  Always helpful. So Nancy ar-ar-ar-ar-ar Barbara
• 46:54
  one of those two ladies they paid for me to do my level 2
• 46:57
  certification at Villanova so after they my level R2.
• 47:01
  And then, you know, a lot of times when you think that, okay,
• 47:05
  it's a cookie cutter program, everybody, it doesn't work like
• 47:08
  that because everybody's different, you know, I look at
• 47:11
  some kids walk like one kid, she came out and as she was running,
• 47:15
  I said no, no front side for a week here there, whatever.
• 47:20
  So, for almost an entire season, all that kid did was walked.
• 47:27
  I have her for four years. Right sir, sir freshman year
• 47:33
  mechanics we walked for for a couple weeks and then we started
• 47:37
  doing running and then we just started building on that.
• 47:40
  And and you know that kid. Now she want to have at Brown
• 47:43
  University Brown when we had the covid shut down.
• 47:48
  Right? So she want to happen to 400,
• 47:51
  I've grown. So it's a lot of a lot of
• 47:55
  different, you know, I have to look at every kid like one can
• 47:58
  escape not. I can walk that leg is a pushing
• 48:00
  of, right? And I'm looking at how they were
• 48:02
  walking. And, and I'm guilty of this all
• 48:05
  the time. I'm looking at kids walking
• 48:06
  around school and I can know the kids by how they wore.
• 48:09
  I don't have to look at their face.
• 48:11
  I look from behind us. Okay, this is this is Tom, this
• 48:14
  is I don't even have to know who they are from the front, because
• 48:16
  I know how they walk. Right?
• 48:19
  So I look at every kid differently, like even right,
• 48:21
  you know, they're, I'm designing a program for the team but I'm
• 48:26
  breaking it down per student so I could come in and this is a
• 48:30
  general workout, yes, but have to pull aside a little bit and
• 48:34
  do a little bit different for the skin, a little bit different
• 48:36
  for that get. So I'm more and I go to bed at
• 48:39
  12, 1 o'clock at night thinking about the different kids and
• 48:41
  what needs to be fixed for this kid and I go home and I do self
• 48:45
  evaluations at the end of the, I don't know.
• 48:47
  Wait, For the end of the season, I do self evaluation in the
• 48:50
  middle of the season are two or three weeks later.
• 48:52
  I said, you know, this kid might be the wrong event, you know?
• 48:56
  Let me see if this is the right one, like one prime example, I
• 48:59
  have a young lady who, you know, she's think she was a sprinter
• 49:03
  and a hurdler, I mean, sure, on 14 changing hurdles, right?
• 49:07
  But when she did her bounding, I said, whoa, dibona looks really
• 49:11
  nice. Let's try trouble.
• 49:13
  And she's at UPenn right now, for triple.
• 49:16
  Alright, so let's try trouble for this.
• 49:18
  She had 39 feet, if I heard junior in high school.
• 49:21
  So yeah, I'm looking at what they're doing.
• 49:23
  It's okay, let's try this. Let's try that.
• 49:25
  And it's like a lot of trial and error for some people and they
• 49:29
  are never bored at the thing. Is they trust that I that I have
• 49:32
  their best interest at heart? They trust the process and it
• 49:35
  shows that I am going to get them at the right spot for that
• 49:39
  specific athlete. Did you say she was running 14
• 49:41
  points in the hurdles before you You.
• 49:43
  So a lot of coaches, I was going to say High School coaches bit
• 49:48
  maybe, as, you know, as you move down, from College High School,
• 49:50
  it may be, you know, 14 point is more valuable in the sense of,
• 49:53
  you know, winning more conference championships points.
• 49:57
  Yeah. And stayed even, you know, a lot
• 49:59
  of coaches would be like, hey, you know, the whole don't broke,
• 50:04
  it ain't broke, don't fix it, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
• 50:09
  This seems good, because that's risky, right?
• 50:11
  When you get a 14-point kid for an inch, Young.
• 50:13
  She's probably doing that either.
• 50:14
  Sophomore. Junior year.
• 50:15
  It was like, oh man, maybe she'll run 14 low or even 13
• 50:18
  senior year in college. But you asked the question, you
• 50:21
  saw something in a drill call it, you know Bounty.
• 50:25
  Yeah, work out and you were willing to take the risk of
• 50:28
  like, hey, let's yeah. This seems a little bit better
• 50:30
  but let's, which could have blew up in your face.
• 50:33
  She gave it a triple triple triple jumper and then that
• 50:36
  would have deterred her from being a good hurdler.
• 50:39
  Right? Right.
• 50:40
  Does that come from the information science business?
• 50:43
  Part of life of looking at things and asking questions of
• 50:46
  like a baby. Yeah.
• 50:48
  And I love to do a what-if analysis with a kid.
• 50:50
  I loved to do what if analysis is whether the kids.
• 50:53
  So and for her and I know that she wouldn't win the state
• 50:56
  championships for the hurdles because confession we had three
• 51:02
  more hurdles besides her was running 13 points and 14 points.
• 51:06
  So she was that's helpful. Yeah.
• 51:08
  Right. She wasn't gonna win the state
• 51:10
  championships in this but I know she can win the Triple A So
• 51:14
  let's focus there and it worked out great.
• 51:17
  And during this time there at Providence day, any mentors and
• 51:22
  coaches at your? You know, when I'm, when I'm
• 51:24
  trying to figure out, should I take her to the trouble job?
• 51:27
  Should I, what should I else? How do I get these 13?
• 51:29
  Kids 213 low. Anybody you're bouncing ideas
• 51:31
  off of now, I'm bouncing ideas off of people.
• 51:37
  Like Brooks Johnson. Hmm.
• 51:39
  You know, I'd bounce ideas of him, Carol.
• 51:42
  Sweet Gilbert Love the person she would call and check in on
• 51:45
  me sometimes to so bounce ideas, you know, so Ben Sanderson love
• 51:50
  bouncing ideas and for him that he and he's always quick to
• 51:53
  respond, and I say, hey, coach Vince, and he was QuickTime text
• 51:56
  back and say, okay, this is it. So in all those are the three
• 51:59
  big ones that I have and, and, and, and even talked about how I
• 52:02
  even got here. But after winning the ninth
• 52:07
  state championship of Providence day school, and taking so many
• 52:10
  kids to them to, you know, to the next level I said, okay, I
• 52:14
  want to go back to corporate. Yeah, I want to go back to
• 52:18
  corporate. That's a let me get my resume
• 52:20
  and Order and start going back. Okay, how am I going to get back
• 52:24
  to Corporate America? Because I'm I was really missing
• 52:26
  the the interaction with grownups.
• 52:29
  You're right. Every coach has to admit that
• 52:37
  come on you've got like it's great working with 14 18 year
• 52:40
  olds and 18 my God there's a lot of value it keeps us young and
• 52:44
  all that kind of good stuff I know I know But I was teaching
• 52:52
  AP Computer Sciences or some still in my comfort zone.
• 52:55
  Alright, AP Computer, Science principles, web designer,
• 53:00
  Computer Applications. That still teaching all the
• 53:02
  computer stuff. I said, I really want to get
• 53:05
  back to corporate. So, at the end of, you know, was
• 53:09
  end of last school year. I said, I told I told my, I
• 53:13
  don't know where I'm gonna go, I'm gonna be, but I'm not
• 53:16
  resigning. My contract to come back to
• 53:19
  Providence Day School to teach art to coach now, hold on Carol.
• 53:23
  I'm just done. You might be one of the riskiest
• 53:26
  people. I know you, you did a great job
• 53:30
  with your finances, so you're able financially and the
• 53:32
  decisions you made to go from New York to show that without
• 53:35
  having a job lined up. Now, you still don't have a you
• 53:38
  just know like I'm gonna go back to corporate.
• 53:40
  You don't have anything lined up, you're like yeah be fair
• 53:42
  with you guys. I'm not going to resign but you
• 53:44
  don't you don't have the thing in the vision or not the vision
• 53:48
  divisions there. The reality.
• 53:50
  The next step is not. You can't see that next step.
• 53:55
  And I like all this to my daughter.
• 53:57
  I said just jump and a parachute will open Right?
• 54:01
  I always tell her that jump. First of all, that is terrible
• 54:05
  advice. If you're actually going to play
• 54:10
  I want to give you know, there's gonna be disclaimers here.
• 54:12
  Please do not go and have the parachute have someone smarter
• 54:17
  than you. Check that parachute.
• 54:19
  Please. Please, please Daryl.
• 54:46
  Assistant coach at Georgetown, she touched us.
• 54:50
  A call said camel, there's an opening at Johnson C, Smith
• 54:53
  University. I think you're perfect for that
• 54:56
  job. All right, let me just send my
• 54:59
  resume and and it's let's pause there because that's that brings
• 55:04
  us to the present you know, spoiler alert she got the job
• 55:08
  right. But you mentioned three truly
• 55:12
  amazing people that I'd like to touch on real quick.
• 55:14
  So you mentioned Vince Anderson who come on man?
• 55:17
  I mean if he needs an introduction you need to do more
• 55:21
  history, checking of track and field.
• 55:23
  Vince's amazing amazing person. Just got to see him.
• 55:27
  Last month and down in Texas. So got the speaking very briefly
• 55:31
  but man just love him. You mentioned Carol Smith
• 55:33
  Gilbert one of the, I don't know how to describe her because
• 55:38
  words can be adjusted. I just believe in her so much,
• 55:41
  you know, she and I have worked together for a long time through
• 55:45
  many, many different universities.
• 55:47
  And you know, she's the type of person.
• 55:49
  No matter where she goes. Success happens.
• 55:52
  Yeah. Like she's the type of person.
• 55:54
  I think if she decided to go, you know, I'm going to coach
• 55:57
  field hockey next season. I think that field hockey team
• 56:00
  very quickly would be a national champ or cut state champions.
• 56:04
  She's just a leader, who knows, how to get things done.
• 56:06
  So I love Carole and and those made sense because I still want
• 56:10
  to touch on some of the athletes, especially Anna.
• 56:13
  Because, you know, I always hate to call any athlete, a
• 56:16
  once-in-a-lifetime athlete, right?
• 56:18
  Because you hope to always have more and more of, but I do want
• 56:21
  to touch on Anna here in a second.
• 56:23
  But to like a person, like Vince, and Carol makes sense
• 56:26
  because Is of, you know, you had a lot of kids get recruited.
• 56:28
  You mentioned Brown and Princeton things like that.
• 56:30
  So you always had a lot of interactions with college
• 56:32
  coaches, but you said another person who's a gill podcast
• 56:35
  Alum, by the way, and I highly recommend ladies and gentlemen,
• 56:37
  if you haven't listened to, this person's podcast.
• 56:40
  You have to because it is I don't want to do too much
• 56:43
  hyperbole, but it's life-changing.
• 56:45
  It really is interesting to see his journey.
• 56:49
  How he came through for Trek coaching and his experiences,
• 56:52
  which are off the charts. You mentioned Brooks Johnson,
• 56:56
  now, Brooks And coaching college.
• 56:57
  So, how did you get introduced to Brooks?
• 57:00
  Because that I mean, like I said, I don't want to over
• 57:02
  Hyperbole and say it's life-changing.
• 57:04
  But you know, when you have a conversation with Brooks, it's
• 57:06
  different than even events in a Carol and I hold them to high
• 57:09
  esteem. Yeah.
• 57:10
  How did you get introduced to Brooks Johnson?
• 57:13
  I kind of remember, I can't, I really can't remember, but I
• 57:16
  remember. I don't remember how it happened
• 57:21
  but you know something, here's a Vince Hall.
• 57:24
  Nothing Brooks. Hold these sessions on Wednesday
• 57:27
  nights. I can remember name of the
• 57:28
  session but I dropped in on one of those sessions usatf.
• 57:32
  Yay, Paca. I'm not sure.
• 57:38
  So I jumped in one Wednesday night and I still do that every
• 57:42
  now and then because when I don't have to go too much
• 57:44
  paperwork, so I still jumping every now and then.
• 57:46
  And you know, when he looks at my question, And I were
• 57:50
  answering the question and he said to me, he said, Carol don't
• 57:53
  ever think that you're just a high school coach.
• 57:56
  You are a phenomenal coach, amen.
• 58:00
  Amen, amen. I who I want is, I must say that
• 58:03
  I'm gonna say they hate the H word.
• 58:05
  I hate, I hate the word just it. Yeah, it bead Littles you.
• 58:11
  I'm just a high school coach. No, you're not.
• 58:14
  You are a high school coach. You affect 14 to 18 year olds
• 58:19
  and up? Of the manor.
• 58:20
  I'm just a track coach who are not wor a track coach.
• 58:26
  So he said Don't Say You're Just Too Hot.
• 58:29
  You are a phenomenal Coach Wright and I said, and then when
• 58:32
  I told him, I'm moving over to hear from from high school.
• 58:37
  He said, don't forget, I started in high school too, right?
• 58:40
  So he said, you know, your stuff.
• 58:43
  So go ahead and do your stuff. See ladies and gentleman, you
• 58:46
  gotta go listen to Brooks Johnson whatever app you're
• 58:48
  listening to this podcast. Right now just type in Brooke
• 58:51
  John's Golf a textbook Johnson whatever it it really.
• 58:54
  It was so interesting interviewing him and he was so
• 58:57
  gracious. I mean now we're at episode
• 59:00
  we're getting really close to episode 200 here we're in our
• 59:03
  fourth year and so you know we had a lot of amazing amazing
• 59:07
  people but when we first started you know it wasn't legitimate
• 59:10
  like no one knew of the Gill connections podcast.
• 59:13
  So people early like had to take a real chance.
• 59:16
  Like, do I trust Mike too? You know.
• 59:19
  Honor me and mixed and Brooks was an early person to trust me
• 59:24
  and to trust us here at Gulf headaches and his journey was so
• 59:31
  not inspiring or awesome. It was, it was all those things.
• 59:35
  It was so personal to hear the things that he went through
• 59:38
  person, because of his time frame here in America.
• 59:41
  And then his, it's his thought process.
• 59:44
  It is exactly what you said there about, like he would get
• 59:47
  on you. Go.
• 59:47
  Holding a no, don't say just Like that's not that that
• 59:50
  belittles you and the actions that you take that his whole
• 59:53
  thought process really changed me and how I think about how I
• 59:58
  do in serve coaches through my role here at guilt but it
• 1:00:01
  clearly was phenomenal. Really was I think that's why
• 1:00:04
  when you mention his name was like, oh we gotta touch on a
• 1:00:06
  Brooks. I mean he is a guy that and it
• 1:00:09
  has done so many things that he deserves every time.
• 1:00:11
  His name comes up, he deserves to be.
• 1:00:13
  Yeah, uplifted. It's quite amazing.
• 1:00:15
  So, tell us you had a lot of success there.
• 1:00:18
  Amazing. Eats and you know, Anna
• 1:00:20
  Cockerel, who me come all man? I mean, it was phenomenal, high
• 1:00:25
  school, you know, had great coaches in college care.
• 1:00:28
  Yeah. And continue doing that.
• 1:00:30
  What was it like? You know, we go through coaching
• 1:00:33
  high school and we run the gamut, right?
• 1:00:35
  We're going to coach girl, 13, flat hundred meter girls and in
• 1:00:40
  the 100 meters. Not the, under her eyes.
• 1:00:44
  We're going to coach. No, 14 foot, long jumpers.
• 1:00:47
  And as we continue to get better at Our craft and we get lucky
• 1:00:51
  with genetics. We get the kid who has the jaxa
• 1:00:53
  to we're going to coach 20 foot long jumpers, 19 feet, long
• 1:00:56
  jumpers. We're going to coach 13-9 High
• 1:00:59
  hurdlers 43. Second $300 Anna was very, very
• 1:01:04
  gifted. I think she would have done,
• 1:01:07
  well, no matter who was coaching her, because she had the
• 1:01:10
  god-given talent. However, it took a coach who
• 1:01:12
  knew how to a have a coach and how to coach her to get some
• 1:01:16
  phenomenal performances out there.
• 1:01:19
  Yeah, what's it like when you have someone on the on the team
• 1:01:22
  like that the responsibility of you as a high school coach to
• 1:01:26
  nurture that talent and advise as they start looking at
• 1:01:30
  colleges Etc? By doctors about that process
• 1:01:33
  and then you talk about responsibility when she came in
• 1:01:36
  the ninth grade you know we had a conversation where she said
• 1:01:41
  that she doesn't want to do the 400-meter hurdles.
• 1:01:45
  She's only here for the 100-meter hurdles and I said
• 1:01:49
  Really. Okay.
• 1:01:50
  So we just go through and after freshman year, even during her
• 1:01:54
  freshman year, and I'm realizing how she's locked in how
• 1:01:58
  dedicated she is to the sport and she should, you know, she
• 1:02:02
  didn't think about going to that next level.
• 1:02:04
  She just, she didn't even think about the Olympics or anything,
• 1:02:06
  but, but I had that Vision. Okay?
• 1:02:08
  This is, this is the mentality of a champion right here, and
• 1:02:13
  here's the thing, she had the best parents, her parents were,
• 1:02:16
  drop her off at practice and then be Fievel come back and
• 1:02:20
  pick her up and don't even interfere what goes on.
• 1:02:23
  They did not interfere a lick in anything that goes on a practice
• 1:02:28
  in her freshman year. Was she running superb times?
• 1:02:32
  Meaning like was she was she had developmental.
• 1:02:36
  They were all developmental but it means.
• 1:02:38
  Yeah yeah okay tell us about can make the 4x4 team.
• 1:02:42
  Her freshman year. Oh really?
• 1:02:45
  You could not make the for whatever the freshman team her
• 1:02:48
  freshman. And hurdles was 106.
• 1:02:52
  Well, okay, but you're not running for the hurdles in high
• 1:02:53
  school in North Carolina but they're running the 300s for
• 1:02:59
  State you come, okay? So so she won everything I
• 1:03:03
  freshman year, okay? That's our conference.
• 1:03:05
  You want everything, but the fact that she couldn't make the
• 1:03:08
  4x4 relay team. So, what this is a lot, yeah,
• 1:03:12
  that Penn relays she was in the stands watching the 4x4, but she
• 1:03:16
  ran out of four by one. So she she worked and she And
• 1:03:21
  and, and when you explain something to her one time, you
• 1:03:24
  don't have to rehash it and that was how she developed so quickly
• 1:03:29
  because you're a, you explain Rhythm and Tempo and everything
• 1:03:32
  to her that one time, you know, I said, this is what we need to
• 1:03:35
  work on. So when she first came, I gave
• 1:03:36
  her a list of things that we need to work on because I like
• 1:03:39
  to give them a list and we can check things off.
• 1:03:41
  And then the next year, the list might grow.
• 1:03:43
  Again, you know, based on what we had, what we saw the furtive
• 1:03:46
  previous year, it would grow again, but then we're going to
• 1:03:48
  talk about responsibility as a coach So I knew what I had when
• 1:03:53
  her freshman year and I said, okay, I can't just sit back on
• 1:03:57
  just a level 2 certification, right?
• 1:03:59
  I had to take it a step further. So I went and I did the iwa of
• 1:04:03
  level 54 Sprints hurdles and relays and down in Florida and
• 1:04:08
  you sat of level 3 and that was 2013, 2014, no 2013.
• 1:04:15
  I did that, you know, and then how to make sure.
• 1:04:19
  And I did a lot of research about Step patterns and they
• 1:04:22
  know bought all these books from man, you know, Ralph man to make
• 1:04:26
  sure we looked at her by mechanic.
• 1:04:28
  So I did a lot of study, a lot of research and it's not, it's
• 1:04:31
  not only for Anna but for everybody that company but she
• 1:04:34
  is the one that let me raise my game as a coach because of who I
• 1:04:39
  had, who I was responsible for. So I had to raise my level as a
• 1:04:43
  coach, right? And we never look back and never
• 1:04:47
  look back. Was there a practice a Station
• 1:04:51
  or maybe a meet result. That if a kid can is good enough
• 1:04:58
  to compete in the college level, regardless of level, by the way
• 1:05:01
  NAIA division, three division 2-1.
• 1:05:03
  You are, you know, we tend to forget that that kid is in a
• 1:05:06
  very small percentage. There's not at all the kids that
• 1:05:10
  participate in high school track and field a very small
• 1:05:12
  percentage. Go on to the next level, Juco,
• 1:05:15
  Etc. So those kids are special.
• 1:05:17
  I take that away. And then there is, I don't know
• 1:05:20
  every year Maybe there is maybe 20 kids across the entire
• 1:05:25
  spectrum that are just like man if they don't make it to the
• 1:05:29
  Olympics. Yeah injury or something had to
• 1:05:32
  have happened. Was there a practice a
• 1:05:35
  conversation meet result where it was like?
• 1:05:39
  Oh yeah. Oh noes she's good.
• 1:05:41
  But wait a minute. I actually might have some
• 1:05:44
  something. This might be a little bit more.
• 1:05:45
  This might be the point one percent.
• 1:05:47
  Was there any kind of like we're reflection moment in the
• 1:05:51
  Edwards. Like, oh, wait a minute and it
• 1:05:53
  was a, it was really good, but no, no she-she's.
• 1:05:56
  There's something special here right?
• 1:05:58
  That was during usually, it's at Taco Bell.
• 1:06:04
  I don't remember the name of that me.
• 1:06:06
  That meat in South Carolina. Yeah, Bojangles Bojangles.
• 1:06:09
  Yeah. I think he's be called Taco Bell
• 1:06:10
  and then they ride. Yeah yeah.
• 1:06:12
  Right right. So when she went to that meat
• 1:06:14
  she was a freshman and Camacho Quinn was a senior that year,
• 1:06:20
  right? Right?
• 1:06:21
  And she went to that me. She made a finals and I can't
• 1:06:24
  remember if she thought second. I think she got second in that
• 1:06:27
  meat and she broke 14 seconds for the first time of that me.
• 1:06:32
  And she was so excited and I said, okay, she matched my
• 1:06:37
  excitement for her and on her growth and development, that's a
• 1:06:40
  yeah, she's gonna be, she's gonna be good and I took her
• 1:06:42
  that summer that same summer to the USA trials for you think
• 1:06:47
  that usual have you 16 at the time and she missed it by?
• 1:06:51
  Spot one spot to make the team I thought.
• 1:06:55
  Okay, we're we get this, we got this and that was it, you know,
• 1:06:59
  I love that story because sometimes we think when you have
• 1:07:03
  such a gifted athlete, like an Ana and some of the others that
• 1:07:06
  you've had that it becomes easy to coach.
• 1:07:09
  It's like, oh well you just kind of, you know, just do the
• 1:07:11
  workout and the god-given town. I'll take their, it's hard to
• 1:07:15
  take a 13-9 kid to 13:5 a 13 5 to 13.
• 1:07:21
  For almost what 230 lat. That's extremely hard and you
• 1:07:25
  kind of started explaining already you started.
• 1:07:27
  Okay. If she's up in her game will
• 1:07:29
  then you have to up your game. So you started going through
• 1:07:31
  some. I double if level fives and you
• 1:07:35
  talk about dr. Mann who gosh bless has done so
• 1:07:38
  much for us in the biomechanics world for our athletes.
• 1:07:40
  You started really kind of doubling down if you will on
• 1:07:43
  your own coaching statically. Exactly.
• 1:07:45
  And it wasn't just for her. I used to spend countless hours
• 1:07:49
  videotaping and taking still shot.
• 1:07:51
  All the kids and send them there.
• 1:07:53
  Still shots frame by frame and we talked about that regardless,
• 1:07:56
  if you're done at the bottom of the pile or tear.
• 1:07:59
  So I would go to bed very late at night trying to get everybody
• 1:08:03
  to see where they are, you know, and this is at a high school
• 1:08:06
  level, so so that they can understand it.
• 1:08:10
  So even with a superstar like Anna, you still kept with your
• 1:08:15
  philosophy of coaching from the bottom up.
• 1:08:22
  And I know I'm not special, I'm never I'm not special.
• 1:08:28
  So she would tell everybody. Right all the case of
• 1:08:31
  Commonwealth, got re successful because Pat, we've had so many
• 1:08:34
  individual state champions, you know.
• 1:08:36
  And even those individual state champions would tell.
• 1:08:39
  Everybody know I'm not treated special like and I will tell
• 1:08:43
  everybody the first time I ever told that I was proud of her
• 1:08:46
  with her junior year in high school first time.
• 1:08:50
  But she say yeah she's equal opportunity hater, the guy still
• 1:09:00
  because you know I because I coach I coach the guys Springs
• 1:09:06
  hurdles and jumps as well as a girl spur Turtles and jobs.
• 1:09:10
  So that's how I coached in high school.
• 1:09:12
  All the guys on the girls and they're gonna see the same
• 1:09:15
  thing. I love that, sorry that Okay,
• 1:09:21
  so, you know, we have two goals here for the Gill connections
• 1:09:25
  podcast. One is, and I'm having a blast
• 1:09:28
  doing it is to uplift and honor your journey, which is extremely
• 1:09:31
  unique. I love it.
• 1:09:31
  When having so much fun here, the other is to bring as much
• 1:09:36
  value to those who are so humbled that listen to the
• 1:09:39
  podcast here. So I started thinking about this
• 1:09:42
  as you're telling your equal opportunity Gator story with
• 1:09:45
  Anna, you know, another thing that is unique for a High School
• 1:09:49
  coaches. Is, is you have to be an advisor
• 1:09:53
  independent, and, you know, you can talk about the, you know,
• 1:09:55
  how much to insert yourself in this role but an advisor or
• 1:09:59
  counselor on the recruiting process and it's easy because of
• 1:10:05
  our ego to get caught up in that USC and Georgia, whatever, what
• 1:10:10
  other schools organ, what other schools you think are the
• 1:10:13
  biggest baddest best out there. But you have to stay grounded
• 1:10:17
  in. Well what's best for the kids.
• 1:10:19
  Okay, thanks, Zach So can you tell us for the High School
• 1:10:23
  coaches that are listening right now?
• 1:10:25
  What was your philosophy on your involvement?
• 1:10:28
  You as the high school coach your involvement with the kid
• 1:10:31
  and the athletes in the college coaches during the recruiting
• 1:10:34
  process. I'm going to I'm going to follow
• 1:10:37
  it up with this. I have a lot of High School
• 1:10:41
  coaches right now for sending me emails and because of my journey
• 1:10:45
  through this, I respond to everybody.
• 1:10:47
  Even the kids who some of the boys who are run in 20.
• 1:10:50
  Five seconds and I asked him if they can join.
• 1:10:52
  My team are still answer their emails, right?
• 1:10:55
  So for me as a high school coach back then, is that I would reach
• 1:11:00
  out to the coaches from the colleges that I think would be
• 1:11:04
  the best fit academically and athletically for the kids,
• 1:11:09
  right? And none of the 10 times.
• 1:11:12
  The coaches agree with me, you know, and I've developed some
• 1:11:15
  really fantastic relationships over the years with some of the
• 1:11:18
  codes, because I want to send them.
• 1:11:19
  People who It fit their program, right?
• 1:11:22
  Because a lot of times, like, even for now, you look at the T
• 1:11:25
  first, I've gotten it by T first.
• 1:11:27
  And you said, okay, if this coach have a kid running the
• 1:11:31
  certain time, my kid is above that time that that doesn't
• 1:11:33
  necessarily mean it's the right place for my kid to be right.
• 1:11:38
  So and a lot of times with all all the kids that I've sent off
• 1:11:42
  to college their parents stand aside and let me take the reins.
• 1:11:48
  Because they know that, I know what the trust that I have their
• 1:11:51
  kids best interest at heart, right?
• 1:11:55
  This passed last year, I know the kid.
• 1:11:59
  He wasn't perfectly good at hurdles are two jumps, but I
• 1:12:03
  said to my famous, something that you would make a fantastic,
• 1:12:06
  had the calf meat. So it took him that summer after
• 1:12:10
  senior year that shall pay for his own private lessons for shot
• 1:12:15
  put discus cold Walt Javelin. He's now an Amherst because I
• 1:12:21
  told Rubin as a coach Rubin. This is who I'm sending to you.
• 1:12:24
  This is a character of the kid and controversial.
• 1:12:27
  Yeah, you're right. You know, you're right.
• 1:12:30
  I also sent into other very good athletes before that.
• 1:12:32
  These kids don't want to go to division one.
• 1:12:35
  They wanted to go to him, Amherst, where they can develop
• 1:12:38
  intellectually as well as take their time in athletics, right?
• 1:12:43
  So I'm not the one. She went there and Liza, she
• 1:12:47
  made it to the arm. Double A second-team
• 1:12:49
  All-American. Her freshman year book, all
• 1:12:52
  their records, so he knows I'm selling him quality kids and
• 1:12:55
  quality characters as well, right?
• 1:12:58
  So that's another thing, and what a great coach and Ruben at
• 1:13:02
  a, by the way, I mean those those kids get lucky
• 1:13:04
  academically and athletically. How do you advise a kid who is
• 1:13:12
  may be unrealistic in their expectation?
• 1:13:15
  There, let's use the anonymous 25.
• 1:13:18
  And guy. And that's a, that's a terrible
• 1:13:20
  because that's such a huge wide span but you know, someone,
• 1:13:23
  someone who just isn't there for a PAC, 12 sec, power 5, but
• 1:13:28
  would be, you know, have such a great experience at a division
• 1:13:32
  to type of school or any items. Right?
• 1:13:34
  How do you advise the the outstretched expectations of a
• 1:13:38
  student-athlete? I told, I told this person said
• 1:13:41
  they want to travel to meet Do you want to actually be coached?
• 1:13:47
  Because a lot of times on those levels, of course you don't have
• 1:13:49
  any time to be taking on projects, right?
• 1:13:52
  And I'm gonna have to shoot straight, right?
• 1:13:54
  I said do you want to be one of those that walk on a get
• 1:13:57
  embarrassed every day at practice?
• 1:13:59
  So I say you got to you've got to go somewhere where you're
• 1:14:02
  wanted, you know? I say I know it's great that you
• 1:14:05
  think oh I'm going to go to Virginia or whatever but I said,
• 1:14:08
  but realistically you cannot compete at those schools.
• 1:14:12
  So these are my recommendations for you on the other.
• 1:14:14
  Handle. I would have another student who
• 1:14:16
  give me some schools are really, really below their standards.
• 1:14:20
  And I said, nah, Let's cross those off.
• 1:14:21
  I said these are the list of schools that I think you should
• 1:14:23
  look at, right? And they do go to those schools,
• 1:14:27
  right? So now this isn't, this isn't.
• 1:14:29
  You're setting yourself to know right here.
• 1:14:31
  Let's talk about these up here, right?
• 1:14:34
  So, this is how I help them along.
• 1:14:36
  I said, no, it's not realistic. Hmm.
• 1:14:38
  Which one of those two. Do you find more common on the
• 1:14:41
  high school level? The kid who has the out sighs
• 1:14:44
  that Stations are the kid who is not thinking high enough, if you
• 1:14:49
  will academically and athletically which one you think
• 1:14:51
  you find more common well because the site is the way it
• 1:14:53
  is right now where everybody's a winner.
• 1:14:56
  Everybody start thinking there'd be one material.
• 1:14:58
  Everybody thinks they're D1 material and all the do you want
• 1:15:02
  more power, 5 material, and after Sabbath bring people down
• 1:15:07
  time I said no it's seriously. You've got to be realistic.
• 1:15:10
  So a lot of times that's that's what's going on.
• 1:15:12
  I have I'm trying to recruit top Is right now who run in 25 and a
• 1:15:16
  200. And I said, no, we're looking at
• 1:15:18
  Virginia or know. We're looking at ENT.
• 1:15:23
  I said sweetheart. Do you know what it takes to run
• 1:15:25
  at those schools? Good luck.
• 1:15:28
  Know what? It takes to get into those
• 1:15:30
  school. So that's that's the whole
• 1:15:32
  thing, everyone to things that they are special these days and
• 1:15:35
  everybody say there, you know, because we're still, I think we
• 1:15:38
  are now in the generation again, where everybody gets a medal.
• 1:15:41
  Again, we're back to that example.
• 1:15:44
  The thing that they're so special because the world tells
• 1:15:47
  them that they are special. So they all need to shoot for
• 1:15:50
  the stars and get that star no matter what.
• 1:15:52
  Interesting. So talk about the ACT actual
• 1:15:56
  Stars, athletically. So and you know, High School,
• 1:16:00
  coaches listening right now may never have this.
• 1:16:03
  I hope they do multiple times throughout their High School
• 1:16:05
  career but the recruitment of a someone like a Nana had to be
• 1:16:11
  off the charts. I mean every Power 5 school.
• 1:16:15
  Woodward wanted Anna. So, how do you, how do you Pare
• 1:16:18
  that down? How do you advise her and her
• 1:16:20
  family on that? You know, this is a whole
• 1:16:23
  different ball game than trying to get a kid into division to
• 1:16:26
  Amherst or division 3. A, how did you work that?
• 1:16:28
  Very special recruitment with her.
• 1:16:30
  Oh, I went through her lips with her and I just cross cross,
• 1:16:34
  cross cross. Cause I said, no one is the
• 1:16:36
  housing like here, are you going to be in an apartment as a
• 1:16:38
  freshman? No, I said no ever thirsty young
• 1:16:41
  man is going to be knocking on your door.
• 1:16:42
  So no, you're not going to that school.
• 1:16:44
  So if If so, that's how we go through a thing.
• 1:16:46
  I got to look at academics as well as, okay, watch what the
• 1:16:49
  academics 11. She's so intellectually sound.
• 1:16:52
  So I said, okay, what's the academics?
• 1:16:53
  Like so we go through everything, that makes sure.
• 1:16:56
  And the coaching staff, what type of support are you going to
• 1:16:58
  get, right? So it was, it was tough going
• 1:17:02
  through all of that, narrowing it down.
• 1:17:04
  It was tough. Do you?
• 1:17:07
  And, you know, maybe this is a little bit unfair because this
• 1:17:10
  is the you were involved in. Advising obviously weren't
• 1:17:13
  important piece of the puzzle. Her recruitment but she and her
• 1:17:16
  family and she made of ultimate decision.
• 1:17:18
  How did she what was the deciding factor for her?
• 1:17:23
  This is just her, not any other kid in the country and such was
• 1:17:25
  her deciding factor to go to see.
• 1:17:27
  I think it's because it was coach, Carol, her name is Carol.
• 1:17:30
  I'm at my end, I'm coach Carol. There you go.
• 1:17:35
  Boys and girls. Just have the same names in,
• 1:17:38
  you're all good. Okay, well, let's take our Focus
• 1:17:47
  to the next level. I like to mythbust, but the more
• 1:17:51
  and more that I'm learning, I don't think this is actually a
• 1:17:54
  myth. I think this is.
• 1:17:56
  I don't know. I got to find out.
• 1:17:57
  I got to, I got to find out what the actual word is here.
• 1:17:59
  So, I would typically talk about this myth busting of that, a
• 1:18:03
  high school coach, can't coach College all the excuses of will,
• 1:18:07
  they haven't recruited. They don't, you know, they don't
• 1:18:10
  know how to do this, and don't do that etcetera.
• 1:18:12
  Etc. And I am not equating the Two
• 1:18:14
  levels because there are differences for sure.
• 1:18:16
  Between coaching college and coaching high school, there are
• 1:18:19
  certainly things. You're gonna have to learn the
• 1:18:21
  bank robber and more coaches that we interview here.
• 1:18:24
  The more and more, we're finding out that they started at the
• 1:18:28
  high school level. We just had Chris Johnson from
• 1:18:30
  the University of Arkansas. Who is the head coach in
• 1:18:33
  Waiting? He'll be the head coach of mine
• 1:18:36
  and he was talking about. Oh yeah, no, I my whole plan was
• 1:18:39
  to be a high school coach. It was to be a high school ad,
• 1:18:42
  one point, he coached College, I'm sorry, High School.
• 1:18:44
  So in Houston before you went on to become a G8 Arkansas and
• 1:18:47
  then, if you haven't listened at episode, please go back and do
• 1:18:50
  so and find out that he went to the the college side.
• 1:18:53
  So it's not a myth. I don't want to see the vast
• 1:18:56
  majority, but a lot of our college coaches started out in
• 1:18:59
  high school. I coach this.
• 1:19:00
  You see in my first coaching, jobs were in high school level.
• 1:19:03
  How are you? You're now, the head coach of a
• 1:19:06
  great, great institution, great location, you're still there in
• 1:19:10
  China, Great facilities, Great Expectations, How are you
• 1:19:15
  finding the transition for you? Going from very successful high
• 1:19:19
  school program to now taking over your own college program.
• 1:19:24
  It's been a culture shock not for me but for the students ice
• 1:19:31
  because when I first started and I told him that this is my goal
• 1:19:34
  for this program and for you individually coach your
• 1:19:38
  expectations are too high. I said excuse me my expectations
• 1:19:42
  are too high. I said if You guys cannot run
• 1:19:47
  the times that my high school kids that I just left behind are
• 1:19:51
  running. There's something seriously
• 1:19:53
  wrong with this picture, right? Well, my stopwatch, yeah, if you
• 1:20:01
  can't run those times that the high school kids that I just
• 1:20:04
  left behind are running 20 15 for Brawner 10, 64 Brunner and
• 1:20:08
  as I say there's something wrong with this picture.
• 1:20:10
  So yes my expectations are going to be just that Right?
• 1:20:14
  And I need you to meet me where I'm expecting you to meet me at
• 1:20:18
  this point. So it's been a culture shock for
• 1:20:20
  them. That that, I mean business, when
• 1:20:23
  I come here and I like, I told him, I said, I'm not going to
• 1:20:27
  sugarcoat anything, I'm going to be here to make sure you're all
• 1:20:29
  successful, but if you think that I'm too harsh, this is not
• 1:20:34
  going to work, right? Because that's all it is.
• 1:20:38
  You know culture is the hardest thing to build the easiest thing
• 1:20:42
  to destroy. So yeah.
• 1:20:43
  When you come in for a new program, you've got to bring
• 1:20:46
  your bringing your own culture, your own attitudes, but mixing
• 1:20:50
  it, with the current culture. That's that's one of the hard
• 1:20:52
  Parts. I think some people will think
• 1:20:54
  I'm going to bring in my own culture.
• 1:20:55
  Well, there's a culture already there, that's already here.
• 1:20:58
  How are you finding that? It's got to be a combination you
• 1:21:01
  there is no, just my opinion, wiping off that culture and
• 1:21:05
  inserting yours. Because there is a culture of
• 1:21:06
  the school and write programs, Etc.
• 1:21:09
  How are you finding that culture merge if you will?
• 1:21:13
  Well, because I'm the type A personality, just have a person.
• 1:21:19
  I don't like to sit back and wait, right?
• 1:21:22
  So I find that everything I need to be done.
• 1:21:26
  I don't I send an email first. Yes but I'm marching up to those
• 1:21:29
  offices, right? The same thing with the kids
• 1:21:32
  here. I said I'm going to teach you
• 1:21:33
  all to Advocate to self-advocate so whatever you need.
• 1:21:37
  You're going to learn to speak on that.
• 1:21:40
  So that's it because they don't like to express themselves so
• 1:21:42
  much what I'm teaching them to express themselves.
• 1:21:46
  So their work ethic that they had before.
• 1:21:49
  Is this laser Ferris and no, we're not going to do that.
• 1:21:51
  So we're going to step it up and you're going to be here on time
• 1:21:55
  and if you come at a required time of 3:00 for practice or
• 1:21:58
  some of your 12, then you're late.
• 1:22:01
  So for every minute you're late, you're going to get punished.
• 1:22:05
  So, you know, the laid-back thing, it's not for me, it's not
• 1:22:10
  for me, right? So we have 12:00 to 6:00 a.m. on
• 1:22:14
  a track, I'm on the track from 12:00 to 6:00 because I work
• 1:22:18
  around their school schedule by because they're students first.
• 1:22:23
  So I step on the track at 12:00 and I've only the truck until
• 1:22:26
  6:00. So people come in and, you know,
• 1:22:30
  I also, I'm give me your class schedule as well, so I can see
• 1:22:33
  who I need to pair together to work out and all those goes up.
• 1:22:36
  And another thing is that so I can Pete my head in the
• 1:22:38
  classroom, so make sure they're in class.
• 1:22:41
  So so I want everybody's schedule so it's been crazy.
• 1:22:44
  Trying to blend both. With, you know, my high
• 1:22:47
  expectations, and them trying to build them.
• 1:22:50
  And I told her, I said, the great spirit is actually over
• 1:22:52
  because from August, I'm trying to cuddle and bring them on
• 1:22:54
  board. No, it's January.
• 1:22:56
  So I don't do any more grace period.
• 1:22:58
  Okay, I'm glad you brought that up because that's where I was.
• 1:23:01
  I wanted to go with this a little bit, you know, and I'm on
• 1:23:03
  the outside looking in now, you know, when I was in the muck
• 1:23:06
  coaching, I'm sure my attitude would have been a lot different
• 1:23:09
  here, my thought process. But when I think about a
• 1:23:12
  coaching change like this, I have a lot.
• 1:23:15
  I have a lot of To be for the coach.
• 1:23:16
  Because that's where my focus and love and passion is, but I
• 1:23:21
  can also have empathy for these student athletes of, man.
• 1:23:25
  This is not the first of all, they say what?
• 1:23:26
  I didn't choose Carol Lawrence for Johnson, I chose.
• 1:23:30
  And maybe they didn't even choose the past track coach.
• 1:23:33
  Maybe there's like, maybe this is what they had my major.
• 1:23:35
  I wanted to be in the city etcetera, so I have a lot of
• 1:23:38
  empathy for when a kid comes in the next year and is like, oh
• 1:23:41
  man. This is different.
• 1:23:43
  Yeah. Now I tend to think of I hope
• 1:23:47
  that all people, no matter what age and Stage there at are like
• 1:23:50
  this, but I hope for younger people there, a little bit more
• 1:23:52
  pliable like, okay. All right, they want some people
• 1:23:56
  to this day one. All right, let's go other people
• 1:24:00
  stay 100. So I like that, you talked
• 1:24:02
  about, okay, we had all fall, you know, so you understood day
• 1:24:06
  one, it might have sucked and maybe you didn't agree with it.
• 1:24:08
  Maybe they to you start to see, you know I understand maybe day
• 1:24:11
  three. It's like oh way she cares about
• 1:24:13
  me. That's because that's a big
• 1:24:14
  thing, right? I have to trust that.
• 1:24:16
  Which has my best interest at heart.
• 1:24:19
  So I was going to ask you think so what kind of I don't call it
• 1:24:22
  grace period like he said, you know like there's a defined time
• 1:24:24
  but so through the fall it was, here's the new, here's the Carol
• 1:24:28
  Lawrence style that we're going to maintain here and you know
• 1:24:31
  what? We all have our choices so you
• 1:24:33
  can make other choices if you like.
• 1:24:35
  That's okay. Exactly.
• 1:24:37
  And then I also have kids on the team who they're really didn't
• 1:24:39
  even know what event they want to do their come to college, but
• 1:24:43
  they still not sure that they're in the right event.
• 1:24:46
  So I have a young lady, who one of my phone.
• 1:24:49
  I first came out, she was running with the boys, and I
• 1:24:51
  still love the boys and just haven't, she was serious.
• 1:24:54
  I said hold it Scooby. Let's see what she can do for
• 1:24:56
  the Maltese because she's strong.
• 1:24:59
  She thought that I put her in a multi-service because she was a
• 1:25:02
  horrible athlete. I said sweetheart, huh?
• 1:25:06
  The multi-event is our, the Beast.
• 1:25:09
  These are the beasts of the team.
• 1:25:12
  So now, she's hurting is fantastic.
• 1:25:15
  She just learned triple jump, she's number four in the
• 1:25:18
  conference, with triple jump, just learning that long jump.
• 1:25:21
  She's up there too. So she's learning everything as
• 1:25:24
  she's not going to tell her that I said you know anomalies she
• 1:25:27
  said no I said go check her out and she came back just oh my
• 1:25:31
  gosh is that? Yes this is why I think you
• 1:25:33
  Going to be a great multi-vendor.
• 1:25:36
  It holds pretty good because you suck because I think I see
• 1:25:40
  something in you, you know, in that and I'm, you know, honestly
• 1:25:45
  I'm so glad I'm not coaching anymore as think about the no
• 1:25:48
  mean that in a bad way. Because now, I affect student
• 1:25:51
  athletes AF act way more student athletes but affect them a
• 1:25:54
  different way because of my servitude towards coaches, you
• 1:25:57
  know, I get to affect the 30, 40 50 kids on your team like by
• 1:26:01
  just serving, you wear a you. To multiply that, by 1,000
• 1:26:05
  coaches, I've got a million kids, right?
• 1:26:07
  But, isn't it interesting, in a world where we say that, you
• 1:26:11
  know, everybody's a winner, but he gets a trophy things like
• 1:26:13
  that. And yet what you just explained
• 1:26:15
  what I heard from that specific example, was a kid who had a lot
• 1:26:19
  of insecurities, you know, and lack of trust of like, oh,
• 1:26:23
  coached like automatically she went to coaches.
• 1:26:25
  Punishing me thinks a lot of good athletes and instead,
• 1:26:30
  because every other coach would have said, oh, why you putting
• 1:26:32
  them all ties? Oh, well, did you We thought she
• 1:26:34
  was something because that ain't for the faint of heart and I
• 1:26:37
  just find that dichotomy. So interesting with young
• 1:26:40
  people, I know another one, she is a 12.1 100 meter Runner.
• 1:26:46
  So I said to her, I said, move your 12 on and 100 I can get you
• 1:26:49
  13 change in the in the 100-meter hurdles.
• 1:26:52
  A teach you how to hurdle she write her first meet leading the
• 1:26:57
  conference, right the bunch of turned around.
• 1:27:01
  I said she don't want to do it because she came here to do
• 1:27:03
  sprints. Hmm.
• 1:27:04
  That's okay. Not forcing you, you know, it's
• 1:27:07
  interesting that insecurity and mistrust that young people we
• 1:27:12
  talked about their, you know, I and again I guess I talked to
• 1:27:15
  quote unquote, every track coach at all levels every day.
• 1:27:17
  I see a lot of it in coaching. I see coaches, who, if I don't
• 1:27:23
  have the big-name school on my business card, on my shirt, I'm
• 1:27:27
  not a I'm not a good coach or I have this athlete that just boy,
• 1:27:32
  I can see him or her. It just Is going to be the next
• 1:27:35
  Anna, Cockerel, but I can't do it.
• 1:27:37
  It's because I'm not coaching well enough and there's you
• 1:27:39
  know, there's a thousand other factors that go into it.
• 1:27:41
  Starts with genetics by the way. So it's just interesting the
• 1:27:45
  differences yet sameness of the athlete versus the coach, right?
• 1:27:49
  Because I have visions for these kids, but they don't.
• 1:27:54
  And I say, I said to him, I said, guys, I wanted those
• 1:27:56
  coaches that have no limits. I will think I would tell her
• 1:27:59
  that you are like one kid. I said you should start training
• 1:28:03
  for world. You 20 championships, I say you
• 1:28:06
  are going to be really good at this and you're 18 years old.
• 1:28:09
  No, I still got two years. Let's say you should start
• 1:28:11
  training for the world u-20 championship because I can get
• 1:28:14
  you there. If you trust me to take you
• 1:28:15
  there. I don't care that we're Johnson
• 1:28:19
  C Smith, right right, that's exactly right.
• 1:28:23
  So tell us come in from the high school ranks in knowing that
• 1:28:28
  you're in your first semester, you know, starting second
• 1:28:29
  semester is just now starting to compete and Conference here
• 1:28:33
  coming up and Nationals. What has been the biggest
• 1:28:37
  challenge for you? Whether it's, you know, coaching
• 1:28:42
  all the time, which you were coaching online high school but
• 1:28:44
  what, yeah, I don't even see. Right?
• 1:28:46
  What is this has been the biggest challenge.
• 1:28:47
  Could be a minute. Actively could be coaching.
• 1:28:49
  Could be personal. What's been like?
• 1:28:51
  Oh man, I used to do this. And now I got to do this and
• 1:28:54
  this has been a little bit of a challenge.
• 1:28:55
  I've had to adjust any challenges.
• 1:28:58
  The big challenge is not having a secretary because I'm a what I
• 1:29:04
  do. I dot every i and cross every T,
• 1:29:07
  when it comes to the finances and stuff.
• 1:29:09
  So I want to make sure that every and it takes a long time
• 1:29:12
  making sure that's that's right right?
• 1:29:14
  Everything is right. So that has been one of my
• 1:29:17
  biggest challenges challenges. So far, the second biggest
• 1:29:19
  challenges is getting kids to stay focus on your student.
• 1:29:25
  And an athlete, not an athlete who may go to class every now
• 1:29:31
  and then, right? So you got a thing that I said,
• 1:29:35
  if I know, and they told me that I'm, I'm worse than their
• 1:29:39
  mothers. Sometimes that's what I tell me,
• 1:29:41
  because I'm always making sure that they're doing their
• 1:29:44
  schoolwork, during all of these important things.
• 1:29:46
  I remember a couple couple months ago, some kids want to
• 1:29:49
  learn how to make Jamaican food so I would give them the
• 1:29:52
  ingredients and I would go over to their dorms and half.
• 1:29:55
  Glasses with them, right? So, we have cooking lessons and
• 1:29:59
  how to make rice and peas, how to make chicken, how to make
• 1:30:01
  everything, so they learn how to deliver cooking.
• 1:30:03
  So I said, yeah, I'm a coach, but I'm also a mother in the
• 1:30:06
  background and I bought, you know, sell it.
• 1:30:08
  So the challenges and I work great because, you know, they
• 1:30:11
  started trusting, you know, a lot of times it's just through
• 1:30:13
  food, right? That's a little common thing
• 1:30:16
  right there. So, that's, that's it.
• 1:30:17
  But the challenges is another thing is that I still have
• 1:30:21
  people who are listening to the old coaches.
• 1:30:25
  Like one one young lady who would you know, talk to her old
• 1:30:29
  coach and then I said to him I said know what goes on here is
• 1:30:33
  between you and the new coaches if you can't trust the process
• 1:30:36
  and it's not going to work for us and as soon as she let go,
• 1:30:41
  she's winning winning. And another thing too.
• 1:30:45
  I got to tell you that my coaching staff all High School
• 1:30:49
  coaches. Yeah.
• 1:30:49
  We're going to get there. I had my do.
• 1:30:51
  Don't hear staff. We're going to get to the staff.
• 1:30:53
  I love your staff. So we'll put a pin in that and
• 1:30:56
  come back that what is so I asked you what you know
• 1:30:59
  challenges use your scene and continue to overcome what was
• 1:31:03
  there anything that as you know, you get it.
• 1:31:06
  Did you get the job you announce okay?
• 1:31:08
  I'm going to be a college coach. Now, was there anything you're
• 1:31:11
  like you know I think this is going to be hard so I better
• 1:31:14
  better be prepared but you actually found out like oh
• 1:31:17
  actually this wasn't as hard as I thought it was good so far.
• 1:31:20
  The hardest part is going to be recruiting and I'm not telling
• 1:31:22
  him that that's that's that's no lie right there.
• 1:31:24
  That's that's going. The hardest part recruiting
• 1:31:27
  Because kids are looking at the standards as here and thinking
• 1:31:30
  that that's the standard I'm still recruiting, right?
• 1:31:33
  So that's the hardest thing, trying to get people to
• 1:31:35
  Envision, that know, we're going to.
• 1:31:37
  We're going to be bigger than what was the standard.
• 1:31:40
  So I brought in this young man from Jamaica.
• 1:31:42
  He just started last week, and he's a triple jumper, and, and
• 1:31:47
  another kid from California came by.
• 1:31:49
  He's a triple jumper as well. So when those two boys from a 6,
• 1:31:53
  step approach, hit that. Footboard and hit and Bob and
• 1:31:59
  everybody the pizza. Oh my god, did you see that?
• 1:32:03
  I say, yeah, these are the people that I'm bringing in to
• 1:32:06
  elevate, you know, and they're beautiful, jumpers, beautiful
• 1:32:11
  jumpers. So those are the people I'm
• 1:32:14
  bringing it. So let's stay in their
• 1:32:16
  recruiting vain because this is a common theme.
• 1:32:19
  You know, I live on Twitter, so I hear this a lot on Twitter of,
• 1:32:22
  you know, I look at the current stats, I go to tea first, And
• 1:32:26
  I've got a kid that would not just be their top two or three
• 1:32:29
  would be their top person. But that coach either doesn't
• 1:32:32
  respond back or has told my kid. No.
• 1:32:35
  And in this High School coach is frustrated with them.
• 1:32:39
  What do you say? You mentioned a little bit about
• 1:32:41
  like, well, I understand you're looking at T first today but I
• 1:32:45
  have a vision for what teachers is going to look like in five
• 1:32:47
  years. How do you don't say explain but
• 1:32:51
  maybe how do you explain to the high school?
• 1:32:55
  I do that. So when the high school coach
• 1:32:58
  emails me and do not give them my number.
• 1:33:01
  So give me a call tonight so we can talk about it.
• 1:33:02
  I don't talk to them, I give them my number so we can talk
• 1:33:05
  and I said, yeah, I know that this is what you see but this is
• 1:33:09
  not what I want to recruit and I said we'll have a lot of that
• 1:33:11
  time here right now and I'm trying to elevate the program.
• 1:33:14
  So if you can guarantee that you're a girl or your guy can
• 1:33:18
  give me that time next year or by the end of the season.
• 1:33:22
  I'll be glad to take them on board.
• 1:33:24
  I would gladly take I'm on board.
• 1:33:26
  You know, I have another young man.
• 1:33:27
  He just started track and field last year, and he sent me an
• 1:33:31
  email and I said, give me a call tonight.
• 1:33:33
  He called me up tonight. I was, and I spoke to him.
• 1:33:35
  I said, so what got you into track and field?
• 1:33:37
  You know, I like to talk to him before I say, no, right.
• 1:33:40
  And they said, well taught you to track a few.
• 1:33:41
  This said, well played football and I said, why you don't want
• 1:33:44
  to get hit in the more, huh, you said?
• 1:33:45
  No, it's not. Just, I just tried tracking.
• 1:33:48
  I really loved it. And I did it last year and I run
• 1:33:51
  ten eight. It's okay if you have a lot of
• 1:33:54
  upset them, because if you just started this last year, you
• 1:33:57
  know, and it's a whole school is I love school, he's a 4.2 GPA.
• 1:34:01
  I said you're my kinda guy. You know, you just started.
• 1:34:04
  You got a lot to learn and I know that you will, you will do
• 1:34:07
  well. So, how about coming for a
• 1:34:10
  visit? Yeah, so so that's it.
• 1:34:13
  So I don't just shut up. I thought I'd call the kid and
• 1:34:15
  let the kid talk and tell me exactly what their training is.
• 1:34:18
  Like, you know, one kid said, he only does 2 days a week
• 1:34:21
  training. I said, okay.
• 1:34:22
  Okay, so with that you you can do well here.
• 1:34:25
  So that's how I look at things. Not just because you have this
• 1:34:28
  time that doesn't fit the profile.
• 1:34:30
  I got to talk to you and see exactly what your training looks
• 1:34:33
  like. What if you had injuries like
• 1:34:35
  one kid said he was injured so he's no coming back.
• 1:34:38
  So you know, I give them the time, give them this as Linda,
• 1:34:42
  my ear that was go through it and it's something that said
• 1:34:44
  well you know that wouldn't really work, but if you do
• 1:34:48
  better reach back to me again, you know, another kid and Why he
• 1:34:52
  wasn't hitting them, he was 19 20 feet in the long jump.
• 1:34:57
  And I said, I said hon. If you can try to get over 20,
• 1:35:01
  then give me a call and he sent me this video.
• 1:35:04
  Few months later, said, coach, I did, I said, that's great.
• 1:35:07
  That is absolutely great know. We can talk, do you foresee, and
• 1:35:14
  you're still so young and to this side of things here in the
• 1:35:17
  college side, do you see the transfer portal being a part of
• 1:35:21
  recruiting? For you and I'm not sure, you
• 1:35:23
  know, we typically think here of it in the D1 and even the D1
• 1:35:26
  power 5, kind of level, I'm not sure where it fits in the
• 1:35:29
  division 2, you're shaking her head.
• 1:35:31
  No, no. Because there's a reason why
• 1:35:34
  they're there, so know how much rather that much.
• 1:35:38
  Rather go from scratch, got it. Okay, let's talk about your
• 1:35:42
  staff because you have one of my dearest, people, another Gil
• 1:35:47
  podcast Alum, by the way, Bianca night, but tell us, including
• 1:35:51
  her, of course, Helpin out. Tell us about your staff that
• 1:35:54
  you've got there at Johnson C Smith.
• 1:35:56
  All right. So, Bianca's here, twice a week
• 1:35:58
  around what you drop, our kids off at school, and she comes
• 1:36:01
  over. So she's here with me, from
• 1:36:02
  12:00 to 12:00 to 2:00 are 12 to 3.
• 1:36:06
  So Bianca is she's up there to, you know, you know, she's not my
• 1:36:09
  type of Personality. She wants him to come and do it,
• 1:36:12
  you know how she's already, right?
• 1:36:14
  So she's there twice a week and you know what she is she is the
• 1:36:18
  calmest out of me, believe it or not.
• 1:36:21
  So the this will tell her what they want to tell her, because
• 1:36:25
  they know that they tell that to me, I'm going to say I'm going
• 1:36:28
  to give them a real truth. Alright.
• 1:36:30
  So she is there. There's their little, their
• 1:36:34
  bumper. Yeah, their breads.
• 1:36:37
  So she's there. Then I have jjp are he was a
• 1:36:40
  high school coach and head coach for another high school.
• 1:36:43
  So he has been work. I've been mentoring him for a
• 1:36:46
  while, so he is now my, my assistants Prince coach, they
• 1:36:52
  show. Who was a high school throws
• 1:36:53
  coach? She took kids from not knowing
• 1:36:56
  they call it football, they took kids from bear to second place
• 1:37:01
  at the state championships are winning the state championship.
• 1:37:04
  So for high school cultures they have to know their craft, right?
• 1:37:08
  They have to teach. So those are the people that and
• 1:37:11
  this is where call it Big D1. Schools are recruited from the
• 1:37:14
  high schools, right? So they're getting kids from
• 1:37:18
  good places. So she's over, she's my throat's
• 1:37:20
  coach and then Hey, Jay, he is the owner of Charlotte flight.
• 1:37:26
  He was on of Charlotte flights, and he's now my jumps coach, my
• 1:37:30
  horizontal jumps coach. So have a great group of people
• 1:37:33
  put together to make it. And then, of course, I'm going
• 1:37:37
  to have a Cobalt my when I can't afford to get a pole, vault pit.
• 1:37:39
  So I'm going to bring it and I already have her in place to
• 1:37:42
  come over and do twice a week. Pulled out training.
• 1:37:45
  So you believe sounds like you believe in full track team, not
• 1:37:48
  just hey, I was 14. I was a hurdler, so we're going
• 1:37:51
  to do nothing but Spencer. Hurdles, you feel the the entire
• 1:37:54
  discipline full team. The full team right now, my
• 1:37:57
  happiest recruiting class coming in or throwers.
• 1:38:02
  Yeah, grab the weird that Throne team is looking good, coming in,
• 1:38:06
  right? And the jumps for whatever it is
• 1:38:08
  said to have seven guys trip a long jumper.
• 1:38:11
  So the final piece of the puzzle is actually the Sprint's hurdles
• 1:38:14
  whoop and the mid distance. I have a bunch of medicines
• 1:38:16
  coming in as well so I like the complete program.
• 1:38:21
  Well Carol, as we wrap up here today, you know, it's so
• 1:38:25
  interesting to see, like I can't wait to see four years five
• 1:38:29
  years, six years down the line. As, you know, you build into
• 1:38:32
  very rarely and maybe improperly that something goes from zero to
• 1:38:36
  100 in one day, one year. So you have to build a good
• 1:38:39
  foundation. Tell us, what do you, what's
• 1:38:42
  got? You excited about this upcoming
• 1:38:44
  season? I mean this is a season of
• 1:38:46
  change for the athletes for the coaches.
• 1:38:49
  What's got you excited coming up here in 2023?
• 1:38:51
  All right, so we had our first meet December 3rd or 4th.
• 1:38:56
  I think it was a fort. Okay, remember the summer, third
• 1:38:58
  or fourth and off the bat first? Meet the four by four guys team.
• 1:39:05
  They went 5050. 5050 to write, never do that.
• 1:39:10
  So they open up the season 50/50 50/50 to write, we had girls who
• 1:39:17
  started off, never run that time before, run our PR first meet a
• 1:39:21
  guy He was close to his PR the first me.
• 1:39:23
  So everybody came out on fire and they finished practice
• 1:39:27
  finished me. That's a whoa, this is good, you
• 1:39:30
  know, they started off the season in a respectable note.
• 1:39:35
  So I said, okay no you see the fruits of your labor because
• 1:39:38
  sometimes I said coach is trying to kill them.
• 1:39:40
  So now I'm not trying to kill this giving you work.
• 1:39:43
  So so that not are seeing the fruits of their labor So you're
• 1:39:47
  excited to it. Yes, you're excited to see
• 1:39:50
  because that was in December for crying out.
• 1:39:52
  Loud, December, doesn't matter right into February conference.
• 1:39:57
  In March, nationally, May and June or April and May.
• 1:40:01
  That's really nice. There's a lot of work to still
• 1:40:03
  be put in to keep improving. Exactly, exactly.
• 1:40:06
  So I'm really excited for the year because the, you know, they
• 1:40:09
  give me a taste of what they can do and know that they're
• 1:40:13
  believing in themselves, know the best part I like to, as
• 1:40:15
  well. Is every time you go to the
• 1:40:17
  weight room, you see people that wear their shirts up, taking a
• 1:40:20
  look at their ads. Everybody is so proud of their
• 1:40:23
  bodies. It's a coach check out this for
• 1:40:27
  somebody said, yeah, you have four and a half, four and a half
• 1:40:30
  cup. Milk whatever.
• 1:40:35
  Gets them motivated right. Ever get them motivated.
• 1:40:37
  So they're they're loving the way you know?
• 1:40:40
  Because we're in the weight room every day and give us your
• 1:40:43
  vision. As you start to cast out, you
• 1:40:46
  know, past 2023 season, you start looking at, you know, two
• 1:40:49
  years, four years, five years, What do you envision, the
• 1:40:53
  program under your leadership to look like here, and call it a
• 1:40:56
  five-year span. Number one is a bringing in the
• 1:41:01
  academic All-American for the team, I don't mean like 3.0, I'm
• 1:41:06
  looking at three point five because all the kids I'm
• 1:41:09
  recruiting this year. These days are 3.2 GPA or Knob.
• 1:41:12
  That's who I'm recruiting. So that's first and foremost
• 1:41:16
  right? And get them cuz I'm in
• 1:41:17
  partnership with a lot of companies as well where I'm
• 1:41:19
  trying to find summer internships summer.
• 1:41:22
  Our jobs for my athletes and making sure that they have
• 1:41:24
  something Beyond track and field.
• 1:41:26
  So I'm partnering with a lot of companies around Charlotte to
• 1:41:29
  making sure that my kids can go get a good summer job and can
• 1:41:33
  set themselves up ready for later on.
• 1:41:36
  So that part is set and what I'm envisioning for the program is I
• 1:41:40
  actually am really greedy. So this year I was thinking that
• 1:41:45
  we're both guys and girls are finishing the top three, and I'm
• 1:41:47
  going to think that we're going to have at least two people make
• 1:41:49
  it to ncaa's this year. That's a great.
• 1:41:52
  A part of me thinking right next year, based on the whole
• 1:41:55
  recruits and I don't mean to throw shade at anybody, but I
• 1:41:59
  have high hopes that both guys and girls can with us the
• 1:42:02
  conference next year and we can have a much bigger
• 1:42:04
  representation at Nationals. Oh Carol.
• 1:42:08
  I appreciate the unique diverse background.
• 1:42:12
  Like when you talk about, you know I want kids because I have
• 1:42:16
  relationships with businesses. I want to help kids get interns.
• 1:42:18
  Well golly that was half your career.
• 1:42:21
  I mean that's like you walk the walk not just walk the top
• 1:42:24
  there. Yeah with your background there
• 1:42:27
  you know the academic side is obviously very important to you
• 1:42:29
  as well not only from your own experiences but how you would
• 1:42:32
  like to impart that how you park that on your own family, your
• 1:42:36
  own kid. It's just really interesting and
• 1:42:39
  it's going to be, it's going to be awesome.
• 1:42:41
  I'm so excited to see how the program grows under your
• 1:42:44
  leadership and really very hopeful.
• 1:42:48
  And that it's going to go really, really well, you know,
• 1:42:50
  the, the plan never goes as written, but it's going to go in
• 1:42:55
  a forward manner, right? Right, I believe it.
• 1:42:58
  Yeah, yeah. So I'll see you.
• 1:43:00
  I just know what, I guess. Not.
• 1:43:01
  Like, maybe I'll see you. I know.
• 1:43:02
  I'll see you in Virginia Beach. I'll be there for division.
• 1:43:07
  Listen, but we do this, right? I'll see you there, and then we
• 1:43:10
  got a trip to Pueblo to start planning for, because we're
• 1:43:14
  going to go over there for outdoors.
• 1:43:15
  I'll see you out there as well. Here, I'll thank you so much.
• 1:43:19
  You know, I thank you, Mike. I'm always so blessed and
• 1:43:22
  honored, you know, track coaches are super busy with your high
• 1:43:25
  school college. It doesn't matter.
• 1:43:27
  I know how busy you are with teaching and coaching and
• 1:43:32
  recruiting. I mean, there's a million hats
• 1:43:34
  that you wear. And so I'm always thankful when
• 1:43:37
  a Coach sits down with us here, in the guild connections,
• 1:43:39
  podcast and Carol. I'm just so grateful for you.
• 1:43:41
  I'm just so enamored by your story, I'm enamoured.
• 1:43:44
  And what the future of that story continues to be written
• 1:43:47
  and just so grateful that you would join us here today on the
• 1:43:49
  podcast. Thank you so much.
• 1:43:52
  Awesome. And thank you for joining us
• 1:43:53
  here. Listening we're going to do it
• 1:43:54
  again next week. So hop on back here.
• 1:43:56
  Is we uplift and on our coaches from around the country have a
• 1:43:58
  good week guys.