Latest / The Shift Podcast / 9. Be KIND, and CHASE your dream.

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9. Be KIND, and CHASE your dream. · The Shift Podcast

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Welcome to fight my datak, a podcast that helps bridge, the
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gap between healthcare workers and First Responders and
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everything in between. Hey everyone.
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I can't believe one episode 9 of front-line static and this week,
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I had the opportunity to interview my friend Shannon, who
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is director of critical care services at Quia Health.
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In Visalia, California. She talks about her favorite
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parts of being in leadership and she also talks about the
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qualities that she looks for in a good leader.
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So without further Ado, here is my interview with Shannon Hey
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Shannon, thanks for joining me today.
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On the podcast. You're so welcome.
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Thanks for having me. So tell everybody a little bit
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about who you are your nursing career and where you are right
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now. Sure.
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So my name is Shannon. I am currently the director of
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critical care services at kuya Health.
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In Visalia, California, I have been with cahuilla health for
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about 14 years. I started, I went into nursing
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school right out of high school. I went to Fresno State graduate
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with my bachelor's. Ours in 2009 and started working
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and the medical ICU at kuya. I worked there for about four
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years and then became the house supervisor for Korea in 2013 and
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I did that for about six years. And in October of 2019, I
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accepted a position as a nurse manager of what was going to
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become the cardiovascular, intermediate Critical Care Unit.
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It was not open at the time but we were planning to open it and
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we did open that. At unit in May of 2020 and I
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continued in my manager role, until May of twenty Twenty-One
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at which point, I accepted the director of critical care
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services position. And I currently oversee the
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medical surgical neuro, trauma ICU, the ice.
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You step down the rapid response, team Critical Care,
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float pool, and our nurse practitioner team.
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That's awesome. And for those people that are
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listening, like I'm going to tell you, First impression of
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you when I met you and you can tell me if it's any different
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okay. But okay, I was just a baby ICU
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nurse well actually I think I was still attack and I saw you
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one day and you just like took me under your wing and there's
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something that you told me that I will never forget and I always
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take it with me and I always now that I'm entering and precepting
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new flight nurses and new people I tell them the exact same
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thing. I tell them you took me in your
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patient's room. You're like this is how you do a
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physical. Assessment.
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This is the right way to do it and you said this will never
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fail. You good physical assessment
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will never fail you for your Critical Care patients and I do
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that every single time, every single patient that I shook too
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and that just kind of stuck with me.
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My other impression that I had of you that I was like, okay,
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this girl is tall, she's beautiful.
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And she's smart. Like, how do I be her when I
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grow up? Well, you'll never be called,
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but I do. I will never I would never be
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but I just love that about you about you.
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I knew you were always a leader. I always looked up to you as a
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leader and you know, those were just like my first impressions
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of you and I just knew that you would always go so far in your
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nursing career. So I'm not surprised that you
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are where you are right now and I just can't wait to see like
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where you continue to grow. That's so sweet of you.
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I, I love what you said about the physical assessment because
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I still tell stuff that to this day as I Coach them and I
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counsel them and we go through their performance evaluations
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and we talked about, you know, their skills and I tell them
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that in an ICU setting, especially your assessment will
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never fail you. And it's so important to notice
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those subtle changes. And so learning the basics and
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how to do that is really important.
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So, it's funny that that's been my mantra for so long, I guess.
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But it is very true. And what do I remember about
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you? Ira do, remember when you were a
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tech and you were bubbly, and you were fun and you like to
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have a good time and you To eat donuts.
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I remember all of that good stuff, but I remember just
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watching you kind of grow into that role and with your first
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preceptors learning how to manage your time and how to just
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get everything done. But you grew so quickly and you
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blossomed into that role so well and you learned and you took on
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challenges and you just tackled it.
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So you have that like very spunky personality.
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You're not afraid of hard work which is why I think we are so
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drawn to each other because we like a challenge.
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Ang and I definitely saw that in you and I continue to see that
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new which is which is really fun.
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So yeah, we do go back aways and it seems like we still have a
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lot of the same Tendencies we did then yeah we do we enjoy
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having a good time together and we spend a little bit of time
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being managers together. You kind of talked me, going
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back to Korea for a short amount of time.
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And I really loved that because I felt like Anna.
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And you can tell me if you think this to a lot of people get
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into. Airship positions who don't
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necessarily see themselves in leadership positions but are
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kind of chosen, right? And they kind of it has to be
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fostered by someone who sees it in them to.
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And I think that going back was a little bit.
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I felt that from you too that I didn't see myself as a manager
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but you said you know, I think that you would be really good at
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it. So how important is that now is
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you're looking for managers that you're overseeing for these
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units. What are some qualities that
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you're looking in that leadership to be a strong
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manager for these, these floors You know, it is funny because a
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lot of times people don't see themselves as managers, and if
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you had asked me 10 years ago, what I would be doing, I would
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have never dreamed, I would be in leadership in hospital
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Administration, but I think to be a good manager, you have to
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really care about people, and you have to really be committed
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to helping them grow and learn, whatever that takes whether
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that's constructive criticism. Whether it's coaching and
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counseling, whether it's discipline.
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And so you have to really be able to have those
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conversations, the good ones, and the bad ones, and the hard
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ones you have to really care about people enough to do that
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for them. And to be honest with them and
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to tell them where they stand and how they can grow and
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challenge them. So, being a manager is not about
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just saying like we're setting the bar here like way up here.
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It's saying we're setting the bar way up here and this is how
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we're going to help you get there and we're going to check
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in with you. And we're going to hold you
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accountable to make sure that you're doing x, y and z.
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And so, caring about people enough to invest in them in that
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way and being able to understand that your role is no longer to
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care for patients, but to grow staff to do that for you.
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And so that can be a hard transition for a lot of people
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because they miss the patient care or they feel like they're
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going to lose their skills and you are, you're going to lose
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your patient, skin care skills. But you develop a new set of
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skills and those are leadership skills and their skills and
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having difficult conversations. And How to listen to your
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employees. So you are in essence exchanging
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one skill set for another and that can be hard sometimes for
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people to understand, but really being a good manager, taking it
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back. Is just really caring enough
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about the people to do the difficult things to help them be
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successful. Yeah, and that was my favorite
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part about being a manager because it was, I felt like, not
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only like serving the people that worked under me, but also
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having those one-on-one conversations, Relations with
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them to coach them or Mentor them to help them, get to their
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goals and where they want to be. It's almost like taking on a
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different approach like you're not helping the patient anymore
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at bedside you're helping the people who are helping the
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patients. Yeah.
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And one of the coolest things for me was I, when I was the
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manager of five Tower, this evic, you step down, I had the
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opportunity to build that team and I we went from basically
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Ground Zero, I hired 102 people to build that team and So I
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really I was fortunate I got to handpick them and felt, you
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know, kind of spoiled by that but I challenge them always to
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live your truth right? Do what you want to do, work
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hard put in the hours put in the time and when I told them that I
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was interviewing for this director position and then you
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know, informed them that I was going to be leaving for this.
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Of course they said you know we're going to miss you so much
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but by and large the overwhelming response.
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Was it's so cool to watch. You chase your dream and so I
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tell that to them live your truth.
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And then for To get to see me do that was just really amazing.
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And I guess I didn't realize how much I push them to do that
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until this opportunity came up and they said, you know what,
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it's it's so cool to watch. You chase your dream and to work
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hard and to look for that challenge.
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So being in management has a lot of different opportunities and
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you have a lot of ways to mold your staff.
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And so I love that. I think it's not for everybody
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but I think it's I love it so much.
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It's fantastic and What would you say to some of the people?
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Because I think that leadership positions whether it's manager
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director Administration in nursing.
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It's so people aren't saying that that's what immediately
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what they want to do or see themselves doing it.
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So what would you say to people who are kind of thinking about
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going into those roles, like what are some of the things that
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you love about it? And what would you say to them
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who are thinking about, possibly doing it for their future in
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nursing? Yeah, that's a great question.
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I think for me my pivotal role in my career was becoming a
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house supervisor because I really started to see some of
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the administrative type decisions and to have sort of
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that Global oversight for the organization and resource
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allocation and Staffing, and policies and procedure.
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So really, getting to kind of see that.
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And then that's really what helped me know that I wanted to
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go into leadership. And then I went back and got my
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masters in leadership during that, you know, window of time.
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But for people who are on the fence, you know, Know if they're
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not sure getting into some sort of intermediate type leader
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role, like maybe a charge nurse or a preceptor or assistant
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nurse manager, or even asking the manager in your current unit
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like hey is there any tasks? I can help with you know there's
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there's always Audits and there's time cards and there's a
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lot of things that happened, the site behind the scenes.
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And so if you're curious or not sure, you know, if it's for you
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getting into some sort of intermediate Ship role is a
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really good stepping stone and then once you get into that
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role, you just really try to see what's going on, what happens
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behind the scenes and you will eventually determine if you
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know. Yes, this is the direction I
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want. I want to do more or this is not
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for me, but I think you have to go into it with an open mind
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knowing that every manager leads differently, their style is
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different. There's right and wrong ways to
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do it but there's a lot of different styles and different
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ways to approach it and so just being mindful of that.
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That knowing how to get the job done.
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But then adding your own personal little Flair to it as
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what really makes it fun. Yeah, and I think I love that.
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You said that just getting into some form of leadership.
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Whether it's, you know, being a charge nurse or taking over a
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tasks for your manager, like, those are little things that I
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think a lot of people do but they don't realize that that are
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already taking those roles on. So, you know, I think I that was
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great for you to mention that because a lot of people have
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already done that so they know that they can they can take on a
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role. As a manager, if an assistant
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manager, if that's what they want to do for the future
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because they've already been kind of doing it.
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Yeah, absolutely. And also what I like to and what
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I've always enjoyed about working together with you is
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that we always have a good time for sure.
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He always have fun and, you know, I remember, you know, just
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going back to the short amount of time that I was the manager
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there sitting in a meeting and it was about cauti and clabsi
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and it's like, you know, some of these Things aren't fun but I
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love to have a good time and I tried to get my staff to having
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a good time too. So what are some of the things
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that you can do? Despite you know all the
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responsibilities that you have and working in these critical
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units? What are some of the things that
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you do to just have fun with your staff?
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Yeah, I definitely love to have a good time especially in my
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current role. I oversee the to Critical Care
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covid units and so that has a lot of emotional challenges of
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its own. And so when I came into this
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role, one of my goals was really just to help the team.
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And to take a step away and to remember that, it's okay.
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Yes, we have a very important job to do, but we also have to
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have fun and we're humans. And we're not robots and we're
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going to shed a tear or two or three, but we have to have fun.
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So we've had numerous dress-up days.
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Since I started, we had nurses week in May where there was a
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different dress up day every week.
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And so, I rounded with the staff I had awards for the best
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dressed each day, I bought a trophy that you shared between
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the ICU and the ice you step down.
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So whichever Every unit has the best participation.
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We pass that back and forth. It's kind of like a little
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rivalry between the teams. We had a locker decorating
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competition for Halloween. I dressed up as Little Bo Peep,
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we had a Toy Story theme for Halloween for the critical care
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unit. So we all dressed up and I was
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Little Bo Peep with, like, my cap and my staff and my big
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poofy dress. And you know, it's really
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interesting because the staff need that, reminder, that we are
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humans too. And we like to have fun.
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And so those have been some of the way.
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He's, we do things. We also have a hand hygiene
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program here called bio vigil, and it's we struggle to get
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staff participation. And so, about six weeks ago, I
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would say we started in the, I see what was called, bio vigil
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Olympics. And so, from Monday to Monday, I
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monitored their usage. And then, at the, the following
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Monday, at the end of that, I awarded a gold silver and bronze
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medal to the top three users. And then, during the week, I
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would post like little olympic memes.
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I would send a group. The Theme song from YouTube into
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their emails to like, try to get them engaged and paying
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attention. So I try to find little ways to
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make not so fun tasks fun, or in to help them, see the value, and
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why you do these things, but to make it fun at the same time.
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So yeah, I'm all about that. We can never do too much of that
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to engage our staff and help them remember that, it's okay to
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have fun at work. Yeah, that's awesome.
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I've always loved that. And I've always really enjoyed
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having a good time with you and whatever roles we were with each
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other. So that's really important.
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People you work with is really important.
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We spend a lot of time with them.
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Absolutely. Can you talk a little bit about
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how you balance? You have three kids at home,
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free, little kids at home, how you're able to balance your
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responsibilities at work? And then, you know, a little bit
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of your home life as well doing everything that you do with long
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hours? Sure, I'm probably not an expert
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at this because I think I'm still learning to manage that a
15:17
little It myself. But one of the things that I
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will do, if there's work that I need to do from home, I wait
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until either. After my kids, go to bed, or I
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do before, my kids, get up in the morning so that my time with
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them is pretty well, protected. Barring any emergencies that
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come up but I try to I do try to Silo it to that time when
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they're in bed because they are young and they go to bed early.
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So I'm able to do that and then on Weekends.
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I really try every other Sunday I do payroll on Sunday, so that
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it does take some of my time. And my kids know, it's payroll
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Sunday, and that's just part of it.
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But on the off weekends, when we don't have payroll.
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And on The Saturdays, I really do try.
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I might check my email once or twice, look through their.
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Make sure there's no emergencies.
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And then I really try not to do any work on the weekends because
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my family needs that for me. And I need it for myself because
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I do work a lot of hours during the week.
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And so I do need that At time. So I'm still working on that
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trying to make my brain. Not think about work when I roll
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over in the middle of the night. If something that I will
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probably always struggle with but I do try to practice that
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sort of take the weekends off as much as possible and do my work
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after my kids are asleep. Yeah, I like that because I
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think a lot of us struggle with that and Healthcare.
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Especially those of us who feel like we need to be
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overachievers. And I know I felt the
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responsibility as a manager to like that.
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Use this was my heard and I wanted to make sure everything
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was good for them to, you know, and not sometimes was hard to
16:55
shut off. But I love how you said that you
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liked the protected time with your kids because it's so slim
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and it's so precious and they are so little.
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So I think that's a hard thing for a lot of us to do that are
17:08
in healthcare for that lie. Yeah.
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What is your favorite part about your current position?
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Being a director, and maybe What is something that is, you're not
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so favorite part of it. My favorite part I'll say my not
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favorite part. It's payroll.
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Yes it's tough. I have about 100 120.
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I see employees that I see doesn't currently have a manager
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and so I'm acting as the manager to so that that's probably my
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least favorite just because it's very kind of tasky lots of mouse
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clicks but everybody's got to get paid.
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So this it's worth it. My favorite part is Truly it's
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going to sound so cheesy but it's really watching people grow
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today to give them a challenge and watch them rise to the
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occasion, to identify a weakness and the units, and find the
18:07
people and encourage them to get involved to be part of the
18:11
solution and then watching those conversations evolve organically
18:16
as they take on that task. And they take it seriously, just
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for an example at our organization.
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We are really trying to tackle crab season, cautis you
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mentioned that earlier. And so we are really trying to
18:28
tackle that and find ways to reduce them in the ICU and as
18:32
part of that are UBC our unit based Council.
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As part of the shared governance model, we have like soup, we
18:37
call them like champions for those different initiatives.
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So we have a couple clabsi Champions and a couple kathi
18:42
Champions and just to sit in those UBC meetings and list them
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to listen to them, talk about Solutions.
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And you know, I was thinking we should try this.
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Maybe we could ask the Doctors to do this.
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And all of those things are solutions that they're coming up
18:55
with their, the boots on the ground staff.
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It just really gives me a sense of Pride to know that they are
19:02
taking that assignment seriously, and that they are
19:06
really wanting to be solution-oriented to improve the
19:09
quality of care. So, that is probably my favorite
19:11
part is to watch them grow into these roles and to take on
19:14
responsibilities and just really exceed with them.
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Yeah, and I would have to say, like I really looked up to you
19:21
because As we, you know, you grew that unit in a time when
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covid just happened. And I think a lot has changed
19:28
for us in healthcare as in critical care.
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And for me, personally, I feel like what we do is so important,
19:36
especially right now. Yeah, with the pandemic and us
19:41
as nurses, well, our our position, our jobs, what we do
19:46
is so important, especially in critical care.
19:48
So, what would you say? Yeah, as far.
19:51
Far as covid. How has that changed you as a
19:56
leader or you as thinking about your position as even just being
20:00
a nurse? Yeah.
20:03
Covid has changed a lot of things.
20:04
It's almost hard to even put into words what it is like to be
20:12
in a covid unit. The staff have been incredible.
20:16
They just have powered through the unthinkable.
20:21
Being a leader during covid is Very different, my previous
20:28
role, as the manager of five Tower, we were not Echo video
20:31
unit and so I didn't have as much involvement with covid
20:34
processes as I do now and being exposed to it with my staff and
20:39
their struggles with it. So it has a lot of challenges
20:43
and managing a team of covid Staff requires a lot of creative
20:46
thinking finding ways to build them up even when they won't
20:51
tell you what they need. And so that's really being
20:54
intuitive to We know them as people knowing what speaks to
20:58
them, what their love language is?
21:00
Do they love coffee? Do they love chocolate?
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Do they love bubble bath? Do they end and using those
21:06
tools as little bits and pieces that you learn about them?
21:08
And really using those to speak to them at the moments when they
21:12
need it? Most and sometimes it's a thank
21:14
you card in the mail with a $5, Starbucks part and it gets
21:17
delivered at just the right moment to their home and it's so
21:21
very powerful and so being a leader in covid really has it.
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We should always do that as Leaders.
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We should always seek to know our staff that way, but this is
21:31
really a means of survival right now.
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This is this is what keeps them engaged and this is what keeps
21:36
them coming back when there's so many other things that really
21:38
could draw them away. So that is a challenge.
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But something I love and I'm very passionate about staff
21:45
recognition. I always have been but I see the
21:48
value in it, even so much more. Now, And last question for you
21:53
Shannon, I think there are some people who see failure or not,
22:01
maybe getting the position that they want that they're not
22:03
supposed to be doing it. And as far as leadership
22:07
positions go, if someone really wants to be a manager or someone
22:10
really wants to be a director, but they've applied many times
22:13
and they haven't been accepted in that position.
22:16
What's kind of advice? Now, being in the position that
22:19
you are, that you would give Of them.
22:22
Yeah, you know it's that's kind of a tricky question because
22:26
different institutions look for different qualities and
22:28
different units. Need different things from their
22:30
leaders. So there's not like really a
22:32
cut-and-dry answer for that, but I always go back to saying, you
22:37
can't go wrong with being kind and being a good team player.
22:43
And when I hire staff, I tell them, they have to be kind, they
22:46
have to know how to say please. And thank you and they have to
22:48
work well, as a team and I would certainly expect it out of it.
22:50
Leader as well because leadership starts at the top
22:52
right? And we are an example and it
22:54
trickles down but I think if your heart is really in
22:58
leadership and you've tried and it hasn't worked out for you
23:01
that you continue to seek out. Those opportunities, find ways
23:04
to maybe get some additional experience.
23:06
If you haven't been in management before maybe reach
23:09
out to your manager and thinking what are some things I can do to
23:11
help or can I, can I train for charge nurse or try to find
23:16
those little sort of intermediate opportunities look
23:18
for a supervisor position. So maybe not quite management
23:22
but a good segue into that. So I think there's a lot of
23:24
opportunities. Healthcare is wonderful like
23:26
that. There's a million things that
23:28
you can do and opportunities that you can kind of, you know,
23:33
step Stone into what you want to do.
23:35
So keep at it. Don't be discouraged.
23:38
Continue building your resume, continue, trying to learn and
23:41
gain as many skills and as much knowledge as you can.
23:43
And hopefully the right time and the right place, you will and
23:46
something. Yeah, that's great advice.
23:49
And I was just thinking Do you know I have a lot of people who
23:52
are just starting out as nurses as well.
23:55
So what piece of advice would you give those new grads that
23:59
are just starting out as nurses? Yeah.
24:01
I always I go back to be kind, right?
24:04
Because we we just get along so much better when we're all nice
24:07
to each other. So it seems silly.
24:09
But I say that's everyone but I also look for staff who are
24:12
hardworking. They're going to take initiative
24:14
if they are at work and they see a med that they don't know
24:17
anything about. They look it up real quick, make
24:19
sure it's compatible. Will they pass it?
24:21
And then that night, when they go home, like I got to know more
24:23
about this med and they look it up and they do a deep dive or
24:26
maybe it's a rhythm or something like that.
24:27
So we want you to be a self-starter.
24:29
We want you to be aggressively engaged in acquiring more
24:33
information. And then to take criticism,
24:36
right? We're not perfect.
24:38
We all make mistakes. We all have opportunities to
24:40
grow. So I always ask that staff are
24:42
receptive and that they will listen to their, their
24:44
preceptors, or their mentors, or more experienced services, or
24:47
their leaders. And, and from every opportunity,
24:50
In every discussion that is presented to them.
24:52
There's always something that we can improve upon.
24:55
So I just asked them to be open-minded and receptive and to
24:59
look for opportunities to grow. Yeah, I love that.
25:02
And I just appreciated our friendship over the years.
25:05
I've appreciated, you've been a friend and a mentor to me.
25:09
I've always looked to you gone to, for certain questions that
25:13
I've had about my career, and it's just always been fun.
25:16
And I just can't wait to see how you're going to grow.
25:20
Row and the positions you're going to go into later on.
25:23
Well, thank you so much. It's been great working with you
25:25
and I learned a lot from you too as we work together over the
25:28
years. And yeah, I definitely look
25:30
forward to seeing all the great things you're going to do as
25:32
well. Well, thanks Shannon for being
25:34
on today. I really appreciated it.
25:36
No problem. Thanks for having me.
25:37
Have a great day. You too.
25:39
Bye. I love to Shannon's.
25:45
Message of be kind and Chase your dream.
25:47
I think those are two things that some of us forget to do
25:50
along the way. It is Christmas Eve today as I'm
25:54
publishing this podcast. And so I hope everybody is just
25:58
ready for the big day tomorrow, and I hope everybody stays safe
26:02
and enjoys the holiday talk to you soon.