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Parenting with a Toxic Ex After Divorce · Reflect Reclaim & Liberate - with Sallyanne Hartnell

• 0:07
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to Reflect, Reclaim and Liberate the podcast.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_00: Finding the space for all of you in life and love.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_00: I'm your host, Sally Ann Hartnell, and this podcast is for anyone wanting to reclaim and liberate themselves in their relationships and their life.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_00: Wherever you are on your relationship journey, these conversations meet you right there.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_00: In soulful, deeply supportive DNMs with me and interviews with other gorgeous humans.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_00: Moving you from where you are to where you most want to be.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_00: A life and love completely aligned with your deepest desires to have it all on your own terms.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_00: If you're seeking a relationship and a life that lights up all of you, you're in the right place.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_00: I'd also like to acknowledge that this podcast is recorded on the traditional lands of the Wurundri people and pay my respects to elders past, present, and emerging and acknowledge them as the original storytellers of this land.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome back to another episode of Reflect, Reclaim and Liberate.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_00: And today I'm going to be talking about co-parenting and specifically co-parenting with an ex or a co-parent who is tricky, challenging, or even toxic.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_00: Is it possible?
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_00: Can you do it?
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_00: And if so, what are my best top tips?
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_00: Now, when you're dealing with someone who is particularly challenging, who is toxic, it's important to bear in mind that you do teach people how to treat you.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_00: Now I say that with a little hesitation, but in this context, you I'm suggesting that you teach people how to treat you, and that in turn teaches your kids.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_00: So the way you deal with your tricky, toxic, challenging ex is also teaching your kids a lot about dealing with challenging relationships, challenging individuals, challenging situations.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_00: It helps teach them how to deal with other challenging people in their life, how to deal with their parent if they've got a challenging or tricky relationship with their other parent.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: So remember that they are watching and they are learning from how you navigate your relationship with their other parent.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_00: I also wanted to open with something a little more positive, and that is a quote from Esther Perell where she says that divorce is not the end of a family, it's a reorganization.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_00: And at times in that reorganization, there's mess and there's difficulty and there's challenge and there's resetting of boundaries, but you are still a family, and that counts that that is still the case, I should say, even if your relationship with your kid's other parent is challenging, tricky, toxic, dysfunctional.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_00: Now let's clarify here that I'm not talking abuse here.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not talking abuse.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_00: What I am talking about is the difficult, challenging, dysfunctional relationship that many of you and many of my clients have with their co-parent or the parent of their the other parent of their kids.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_00: So bearing in mind that your kids are watching and they are learning from how you navigate this.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: So what we really want them to learn is not manipulation, not dysfunction, not activation triggering dysregulated behavior responses, reactions.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_00: We want them to learn respect.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_00: We want them to learn how to communicate in difficult circumstances, we want them to learn negotiation, cooperation, teamwork.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_00: And if your ex isn't showing up in your parenting relationship like this, then it's all the more reason that you should.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_00: Research shows, and I know I've said this on the podcast before, research shows that kids really only need one mostly functional and stable parent to come out of a separation and divorce okay.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, they're going to be affected, of course they're going to be affected.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_00: But if you are solid, stable, and behaving in ways that demonstrate functional communication, respectful communication, then that is what they will learn.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_00: So keep your eye on the prize, which is your kids.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_00: What's your end goal here?
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_00: Happy, healthy, physically, psychologically, emotionally, healthy kids, well adjusted, well supported, all of those things.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_00: Keep your kids top of mind when you are dealing with a toxic ex partner.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_00: Now, my how many did I end up with?
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: My 13, 13 top tips for dealing with a tricky ex.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_00: Number one, keep it positive.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_00: Number two, keep the kids out of the conflict.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_00: Number three, manage your own emotional reactivity.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_00: Number four, stay on topic.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_00: Five, keep your contact minimal, courteous, and professional.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_00: Number six, use external supports.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_00: Number seven, have and hold clear, firm boundaries.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_00: There's a whole other podcast episode about that.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_00: Go back and listen to that one if you haven't already.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_00: Number eight, don't engage in competition.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_00: Number nine, stick to one thing at a time.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_00: Number ten, stand firm in your truth.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_00: Number 11, get it in writing.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_00: Number 12, communicate assertively.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_00: And if you don't know how to do that, let's get you learning.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_00: And number 13, accept what you can't control.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_00: So let's go through them one at a time.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_00: Number one, keep it positive.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_00: Don't talk badly of your ex ever in front of the kids.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: Accept that your ex quite likely will speak badly of you in front of and directly to the kids.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_00: Pull him or her up if it happens in front of you, in front of the kids, by saying something along the lines of that is not an acceptable way to speak to me, that's not an acceptable tone of voice.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_00: I acknowledge your XYZ, whatever it is, but that is not my truth.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_00: If you continue to communicate in this way, we will have to leave this conversation.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: I will be leaving this conversation until we can come back to it in a calmer, more courteous way.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_00: So try and focus on the positive.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_00: Keep it positive.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_00: And do show your kids the good that you do see in your ex.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_00: Wow, dad is so good at XYZ, or isn't your mum amazing at blah blah blah.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_00: Number two, keep the kids out of it.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: And by that I mean keep them out of the conflict.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: And this goes whether you have young kids or even teenage kids or even, I should say, adult kids.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_00: Keep them out of the conflict between you and their other parent as much as you can.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_00: Don't argue in front of them.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_00: Definitely don't make them the messenger between you and their other parent.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: Don't let them feel like or be actually stuck in the middle where they feel like they have to choose.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_00: If your ex does this, gently remind your kids that that's not okay and you will go back to their mum or their dad directly on issue X, whatever it is.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_00: So if they're being sent from their other parent with messages for you, thank them, say that's not a kid thing to deal with, I'll go back and discuss it with dad or I'll ring mum and talk about it.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_00: So show your kids how to behave with and communicate with dignity, with grace, with respect, with kindness, with compassion.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_00: Fairly, rationally, logically.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_00: If and when you can, do back your ex up in front of the children.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: Make a really serious effort not to disagree with a parenting decision or consequences your ex has put in place in front of the kids, in front of the children.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_00: So have your exes back.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_00: Even if it's not the way you would have done it, even if it's not a consequence that you would have put in place, back them.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_00: Allow them to parent in their way.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_00: And again, let's clarify, qualify here.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not talking abuse, I'm talking parenting decisions that you might not agree with.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_00: Have their back and support their decision and their right to make that decision, even if you wouldn't make the same decision.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_00: If you do need clarification or you want to discuss other options, do it later, do it away from the kids.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: So try and keep the kids out of as much conflict, disagreement, disharmony between the two of you as you can.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_00: Number three, manage your emotional reactivity.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_00: So know your triggers, know what topics, what um tones of voice, even what gestures or movements of your ex um activate you.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_00: Know that you're more likely to be activated when you're tired, hungry, stressed, and really tap into ways to dial down your own reactivity, whether that's breathing, whether that's yoga, whether that's tapping, whether it's meditation, whatever it is.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_00: And if it's in the moment, try and stay present in this particular interaction rather than spinning off into you know the past or future tripping.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_00: Stay present in the moment.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_00: So find ways and build strategies that you can use to stay present and not be activated, triggered, pushed off or pulled off guard, really.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: I suppose breathing is a great one.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: Mind any sort of mindfulness practice that works for you.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_00: I often recommend an elastic band or a hairband around your wrist.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_00: You can flick it, fingernails into your own palm, just to remind yourself to stay present, stay here, don't tip into reactivity.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um refuse to bite back or react if your ex is behaving passive aggressively or disrespectfully, gently, politely, calmly.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_00: We don't have to be gentle, but calmly and politely disengage without firing up.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_00: Teach your kids what is and is not okay by the way you behave.
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_00: So work to keep you cool, stay calm, dial down your emotional reactivity.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_00: Focus on behaving and interacting in a way that you most want from your co-parent.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: So actually start to model the relationship that you that you most hope for.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_00: I call this defining the container.
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_00: So you set the boundaries, you define the parameters, you define the container of the relationship you most want with them, and that invites them to step forward into it and meet you in a similar or the same way.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_00: So if you want open, direct, honest, calm, clear, respectful uh communication, start modeling that, even if it's not reciprocated.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_00: Do whatever you need to dial down your reactivity, to not be activated and triggered, to remain unemotional.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_00: Take deep breaths, wait before responding to emails or messages.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_00: Ask yourself, in fact, do I actually need to respond to that long, toxic, unnecessary text message at all?
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um, let the phone go to voicemail so you can practice your deactivating, de-escalating, and you can then engage in a calm, considered manner.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_00: If it's face-to-face, if it's in person, as I said, remove yourself from the environment if you need to.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_00: Disengage and offer to come back to the communication, the conversation when everybody's a bit calmer.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_00: Number four, stay on topic.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_00: Keep all of your interactions kid focused and on whatever topic or issue needs to be addressed.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_00: Gently refuse to engage in conversation about anything other than issues or topics directly related to your kids.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: You can have phrases ready to roll out for a toxic ex who tries to hook you into a conversation about something other than your children.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks for your concern, but I'm not willing to discuss that with you.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_00: Can we get back to the issue of XYZ?
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_00: Or simply let's just focus on finding a solution to the issue of XYZ.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_00: It's often really important to use, or helpful I should say, to use the names of your kids in interactions and communications so it keeps the conversation on topic and about the kids, not about you.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_00: So rather than saying, hey, I need you to pick up Millie from soccer training on Thursday night, flip it.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_00: Millie has soccer training on Thursday afternoon on Thursday after school.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_00: Are you able to collect her?
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_00: So make it about the child, not about you.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_00: Number five, keep contact, engagement, interaction to the baseline, to the bare minimum, and keep it professional.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_00: If you can, if you can't, I'm sorry, um, have a considered, respectful conversation face to face, put it in writing.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_00: In fact, it's often good to put it in writing because then there's no passive aggressive, oh I I forgot, or I didn't say, I, you know, you didn't say that.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_00: There's no gaslighting, there's no passive aggressive accidentally on purpose forgetting.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_00: It's in writing.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_00: So put it in writing if that's a tactic that your your ex has used or you think may use.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_00: Strip out any emotional language, keep it really professional, as you would communicate with somebody at work, somebody in the office.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_00: Strip out all the emotive language.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_00: And I often do that this with my clients so that they can see they will send me a draft message or email that they're going to send to their ex about a particular issue that needs resolution.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_00: Let's just strip out all of the emotive language to get it on on topic, but also just minimize the minimize the content and keep it just exactly to baseline and minimal.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_00: Remove things like shoulds and nevers from your from your communication with a challenging or tricky or toxic ex.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_00: Shoulds, nevers are not actually useful in terms of resolving issues and getting um yeah, getting the communication that you want and you need from a co-parent.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_00: Number six is use external supports.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_00: Of course I'm gonna say user coach, of course I am, but use a coach, use a mediator, use a psychologist, but there are also lots of apps that you can use or other technologies that you can use to minimize your contact and also just keep it on topic.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_00: There are family uh family apps, family communication apps that you can use.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_00: You can have a group message if your kids are old enough so that it is there are more eyes on the communication.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_00: It is in writing, and there are more eyes on it, so it has less of a tendency to become toxic or um even abusive.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_00: So use external supports in whatever way, shape, or form works for you and for your family.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: Number seven is boundaries.
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_00: Maintain clear and firm, healthy boundaries.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_00: Define for yourself what is and is not okay for you, and there may not even be a need to communicate with this, this, I'm sorry, with with your ex, with your co-parent, unless they overstep.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_00: Establish the rules in your own mind for yourself.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_00: You know, as I said above, you can use things like it's actually it's not okay for you to speak that way to me or to use that tone.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_00: You can, and I'm gonna say hang up the phone.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_00: I don't mean slam the phone down in your other parent in the other parent person's ear.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_00: I mean disengage politely and calmly from the conversation.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_00: I can't actually listen to that anymore.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to hang up the phone and we will need to revisit this conversation when things are calmer.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_00: Hang up.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_00: Walk away if you if it's um face to face.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_00: You can use the same kind of strategy there, just saying, I just need a few minutes.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to walk away and I'll be back in five minutes to see if we can have this conversation in a calmer fashion.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_00: Another boundary to set for yourself is about your response to texts, emails, even phone calls, but particularly texts and emails, you don't need to respond immediately, and sometimes, as I said earlier, don't need to respond at all.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's also it can also be really helpful and supportive when dealing with somebody who's engaging in toxic behaviour or toxic communication with you to set a time limit, and that can actually be uh communicated back to the back to the person.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_00: You can say, I don't respond to texts or emails after 7:30 p.m.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_00: I'll come back.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_00: If you send emails or messages at night, I will come back to you in the morning.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: You can even, I even have clients who only check their messages from their ex slash co-parent once a week.
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_00: Go in, check it all, work out what actually requires a response and what is just noise, and respond to only what really requires a response, requires your attention.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_00: So set the boundary, know what it is for yourself, and outline the quest the consequences, I'm sorry, of crossing it.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_00: Know what they are for you, and if you need to communicate them back to your ex-partner, your co-parent.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, for example, speaking to me like that is not okay.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_00: If you do it, if you continue to do it, I'll hang up the phone and we'll we can speak again when things are calm up.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_00: Set the boundary, which is you're not accepting a certain tone of voice or a certain type of engagement, interaction, communication.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: Know what the consequence is for you for you.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna hang up if he does that, I'm gonna hang up if she does that.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_00: And if you need to communicate that to your ex-partner and follow through.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_00: There is no point, it's like parenting small children or training a puppy.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it is there is no point threatening a consequence and not following it through.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_00: So you need to be certain that the consequence you threaten, or the consequence you not threaten, that's not the right word, the consequence you outline for overstepping your boundary is something that you're able and willing to follow through on.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_00: Tip number eight for dealing with a toxic, tricky, challenging X.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_00: Do not engage in competition.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_00: Allow your kids to love both of you as much as is possible.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_00: And again, I'm talking difficult, challenging, but otherwise loving towards the kids, not abusive.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_00: So allow your kids to have a relationship and love both of you equally.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_00: Don't make it a competition about who does a better job, who buys the better presents, who's there more.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_00: Your kids actually need both of you.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_00: They need both of you.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_00: So even if your ex is playing the Disney dad, even if your ex is mother of the century, keep your focus on your goal.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_00: And that's where we started this podcast episode.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_00: Keep your focus on your kids.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_00: Happy, healthy, well-adjusted children is your goal.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_00: Not winning, not being the best, not fighting or competing for their love, for their approval.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_00: Tip number nine when you are dealing with someone whose communication is toxic or challenging, is to stick to one thing at a time.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_00: Whether you're communicating a want or a need or an expectation, stick to one request at a time.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_00: Do not move on to the next issue.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_00: Do not allow them to hook you and drag you off topic.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_00: Do not move on until this first issue is resolved.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_00: The the want, need, expectation, whatever it is you're discussing, don't move on until that one thing is the question is answered or the issue is resolved.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_00: It's much harder to avoid and dodge answering a question when there's only So stick to the facts and repeat as necessary.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_00: Calmly, assertively, unemotionally, repeat your question, your need, or your expectation a little bit like a stuck record.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_00: Let's go back to Millie having soccer training.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_00: Millie has an extra soccer training on Thursday afternoon.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_00: You'll need to pick her up at 5 p.m.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_00: So your ex-partner protests, blusters, makes a fuss, makes all the noise.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's an extra training schedule because of their upcoming final on the weekend.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_00: You'll need to pick her up at 5 pm on Thursday afternoon.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_00: Then there's noise, there's response, there's all the stuff coming back at you.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_00: Millie will need you to pick her up after soccer on Thursday.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_00: Her training finishes at 5 pm.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_00: And note how I changed that there.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_00: Millie will need you to pick her up.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_00: Blah blah blah.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_00: So play the stuck record until you get the response that you need from your ex.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_00: Stick to one issue at a time.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_00: Don't be dragged off.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_00: Don't be dragged off until you have a resolution of the issue.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_00: Number 10 is to stand firm in your truth.
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_00: Except, as I said earlier, that it is likely that your ex will speak badly about you.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_00: Whether that's to the children, whether that's to friends, whether that's to family, it is highly likely that they will speak badly of you.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_00: It's almost a form of gaslighting where they are trying to create a narrative that you are the bad, you are the bad cop, they are the good cop.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_00: So stand firm in your own truth and don't allow yourself to engage and definitely don't believe what's been said.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_00: Don't doubt your own version of truth.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_00: And here it's really helpful to keep a journal.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_00: It's also helpful to have one or two really close friends, a coach, a therapist that you can check your reality against.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_00: So standing firm in your truth is about knowing what is right, knowing what is true, and not allowing what's said about you or even to you to sway you from that.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_00: You certainly don't have to defend yourself or explain or justify your actions or your decisions to your ex-partner.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_00: So stand firm and even and that may even mean you need to explain some things to your kids.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sorry dad said that to you, that's not the way I see things.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sorry mum spoke like that about me, that's not what I believe about myself.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_00: So you gently re retruthing, retelling the truth without actually bad mouthing the other person.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_00: Tip number 11 is get it in writing.
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_00: Keep your co-parent fully informed.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_00: And by fully informed, I mean accountable.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_00: Keep them fully informed and therefore accountable about the needs, the plans, the activities of the kids in writing to minimize any of what I spoke about before, accidental confusion or forgetting.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_00: It is a great tactic of somebody who wants to mess with your head to accidentally on purpose forget or get confused or mess things up.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_00: If it is in writing, preferably in a shared calendar, it's much more difficult to forget or to claim forgetting.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_00: Tip number 11: get it in writing.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_00: Keep your co-parent fully informed, and by fully informed, I mean accountable.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_00: Keep your co-parent fully informed and accountable about anything to do with the kid's needs, plans, activities.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_00: Put it in writing to minimize that confusion or forgetting tactic that can so often be used by someone who is toxic, dysfunctional, challenging to deal with.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_00: Have a detailed parenting plan with really clearly outlined pick-up and drop-off days and times, holiday arrangements, including contingencies.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_00: For example, what happens if a child is unwell or plans need to be changed last minute.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_00: Outline all the contingencies, who's responsible for what and when.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_00: It can also be really helpful just on pick-up and drop-offs.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_00: If things are difficult and challenging between you and your ex, it can be really helpful to make pick up and drop off somewhere other than your house.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_00: It can be school, it can be daycare, it can be a grandparent's home.
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_00: And this means that being accidentally on purpose late to pick up or even not turning up or late to drop off the children, it loses its power to frustrate or impinge on you.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_00: So being certain that all the other carers involved with the children are aware of the arrangements and any changes to them, who's responsible, i.e.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_00: not you, but making sure everybody else knows and make pick up and drop off not your place.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_00: Therefore, you're not stuck waiting for a co-parent who is three hours late to pick up your kids, messing with your plans, messing with your head.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_00: Make it not your house.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_00: As I said earlier, shared calendar and a or a parenting app can be really invaluable here.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_00: So try and keep communication to a minimum and also get it in writing if you can, or put a buffer in between you by using a joint calendar or a parenting app, a family communication app, even shifting things so that you don't have to be in the same space, and that accidental forgetting or accidentally being late doesn't mess things up.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_00: Tip number 12 is communicate assertively.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_00: Now, assertive doesn't mean aggressive, aggression is all about domination and winning.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_00: Assertiveness is calm, to the point, on topic.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_00: Assertive is very different to aggressive communication, but they're often confused.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_00: So if you if you're not great at communicating calmly, openly, assertively, that's something to explore working on.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_00: It's also something that takes practice, a bit like setting boundaries.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_00: If it's something that you're not used to doing, it will take practice for you and it will take time for you to get it right.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_00: It'll also take time for your ex to get used to it.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_00: You can try, you can try and preface this new form of you communicating by saying we've not been communicating well, and note we have not been communicating well.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_00: And so I'm going to try a different way of approaching things.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_00: You can preface it if you think that would be useful and helpful.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_00: Now, assertive communication looks like something like asking to meet and discuss a situation, an issue that you want to negotiate, communicate about, you state a positive intention.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_00: I have a concern about the upcoming school holiday schedule.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_00: You use really clear and concise statements, no waffling.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_00: So 10 to 15 words or less, um, and you outline, clearly outline the issue.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_00: There's a clash next weekend with schedules.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_00: Keep it simple.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_00: Note there's no emotive language, it's just a statement of fact.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_00: There is a clash next weekend with schedules.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_00: Then you can offer uh an option or a solution.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_00: I'm willing to switch weekends and blah blah blah blah blah.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_00: It also requires you to outline responsibility in the solution, all right?
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_00: Who is responsible for what?
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_00: Or something along the lines of what can we do to make sure this doesn't happen again?
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_00: Or if you need um if there's a timeline, when will you get back to me about this?
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_00: And note here, go back to the stuck record thing.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_00: When will you get back to me about this?
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_00: Waffle, waffle, waffle, waffle, waffle from your ex.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_00: When will you get back to me about this?
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_00: Will you be able to get back to me by tomorrow morning at 10 o'clock?
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_00: Just stay on the topic, outlining the responsibility in the solution, and then volunteer.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_00: Volunteer to step back in and listen to their thoughts.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_00: Can you help me understand how that will work?
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_00: Listen openly, listen objectively.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_00: Can you help me to understand what you're saying here?
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not sure, I'm clear.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_00: Can you help me understand other options?
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_00: So, assertive communication is a skill, and probably a whole other podcast episode, but there are some there are some tips that can help you start exploring a more assertive communication style if that that is not something that you have been used to doing or are skilled at doing.
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_00: And my final tip for anybody who is trying to parent with a tricky, challenging, or toxic ex is accept what you can't control.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_00: Understand what you can control, what is in your capacity to change, and be willing to accept what you can't control.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_00: You can't control what he or she says to the kids when you're not around.
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_00: You can't control his decision to turn up late, to pick up or drop off.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_00: What you can control is the circumstances around the pick up and the drop-off, as we've already spoken about.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_00: But you can't control his choices, his decisions.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_00: You can't control the way she speaks to you, the tone of voice she uses.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_00: You can only control your response, your reaction to that.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_00: You can't control what comes out of someone else's mouth, but you can control how you respond and react to it.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_00: So be really clear on what you can control and what you're willing to shift and change and release what is beyond your capacity to control.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_00: So they are my top tips for navigating a co-parenting or probably more to the point, a parallel parenting relationship with a toxic ex.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_00: I hope you've found them useful.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_00: If there is somebody in your life you know who would benefit from hearing this episode, please share it with them.
• 33:01
  SPEAKER_00: And as always, if you've loved the podcast, please rate review it wherever you listen to your podcasts so that we can get it in the ears of more people who need to hear it.
• 33:13
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much for sharing time with me.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: Until next time.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_00: You can follow me on Instagram at ReflectCoaching, and if you can think of anyone who would love this episode, please, please share it with them.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_00: I'd also be so grateful if you'd follow the podcast and review this episode so we can get it in the ears of a whole lot more humans just like you who are ready to reclaim and liberate themselves in life and love.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_00: I hope you'll join me next month for another episode of Reflect, Reclaim and Liberation.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_00: Until then.