Latest / Be A Global Citizen! / 209. GC Talks with Julian Velarde: Navigating Change and Finding Meaning in Life

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209. GC Talks with Julian Velarde: Navigating Change and Finding Meaning in Life · Be A Global Citizen!

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Hi there, and welcome to Be a Global Citizen, the podcast that
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explores the concept of global citizenship through the lens of
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value creating education. My name is Scott Bauer and I'm
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Ahsoka, researcher and educator. I hope you find the discussion,
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stories and insights on this podcast to be valuable and
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inspiring as we strive to become global citizens who are
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committed to living a contributive life.
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Enjoy. So my name is Julian Bellardi.
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I'm coming in from Aruba Valley here in California, Southern
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California. What I do professionally in my
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current role is I'm a diversity inclusion coordinator for the
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Orange County Fire Authority and I'm coming up on five years that
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I've been with this organization and, and prior to that I had
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about 20 years in higher education.
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Hi, Julian, thank you so much. It's so wonderful to have you on
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the podcast. Truly.
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You know, we go back, we go back to my years as, you know,
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undergrad at SOCA University of America.
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That's where you were working in student affairs, right?
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And I recall just how bright your energy was and how loving
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you were and really wanting to support the students.
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They're building out really incredible opportunities for
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students as well as programming that I really felt brought
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campus closer together. And, and it tied in with the
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work that you're, you know, continuing to do in the DEI
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space of really recognizing everyone's unique strengths, but
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also the the value that comes with really embracing diversity,
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learning across diversity and just respecting one another.
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And I just find that, you know, you really embody that and that
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bright light and spirit that you had when I was a student
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continues to shine bright in in your current career in Orange
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County with the the fire department, right.
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And I would love to just ask you more about how did, how did you
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get to to be this bright light, really kind of building
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community and really helping students feel like they belong,
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right? That they are important.
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That's something that I believe you really excel at and would
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love to hear from you. What were some of the major
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influences among your journey as an educator?
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Wow, that's a great question. And I, I, I definitely have to
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start, you know, like many, my roots begin with really my
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childhood. And, and, and I don't know if
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you know this story, Scott, but I guess this is what I'm going
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to share, you know, because it really it, it, it's, it's,
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that's where everything begins. And I am who I am today because
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of how my, my, my life began. And it's so interesting.
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It's, it's directly related to my passion, what I do, Why, why
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do the work I do? And I call it the human work.
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You know, it has other names to it like the EI and and whatnot,
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but it's really, it's the human work that I'm about.
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But I want to take it back to my childhood.
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So I'm one of fourteen children and I had a brother who is just
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the, the next one older than me, who him and I were, were in
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foster care and we grew up. I, I was an infant when I was
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put into foster care. My brother was about a year and,
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and four months older than me. So he was already young boy.
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And, and so we were put into foster care.
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And I think it was those, those years of being in that
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experience, you know, I had foster parents that they grew up
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in the 1920s. My foster father was a World War
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2 veteran. My foster mother was a stay home
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mom and she loved having being runt with kids.
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She wanted to raise kids, lots of kids.
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And so they became foster parents at a later point in
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their their lives. And so that's how it began for
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me in terms of just my entry point into the world.
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And as I got older and, and more aware, right, My brother and I
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both in terms of where we can remember really what that
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experience was about, you know, it, it, and then being adopted,
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right, there was this theme that people wanted to, wanted to care
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for other humans, right? That did not necessarily come
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from them, right? And, and, and this, this notion
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that, you know, they, they had a heart to want to, to be involved
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in a young person's life, to give them an opportunity to have
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a life. And, and that's, that really
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happened through the foster care context for me.
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And then being in my adoptive family, we were adopted once and
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that was a one and done with that family.
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I was 7, my brother was 9 at the time.
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And they have been our doctor parents have been our parents
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since since then. And, and they were really key
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in, in really taking us on from that point of our, of our early
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childhood to, to grow on US responsibility, right?
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All the things that, you know, parents want to do with their
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kids, right? To, to make sure that they get
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a, you know, a, a positive, you know, step out in the world when
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it's time for them to leave the home.
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And so my, my adopted parents played a really key role in that
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as well. In that family, I had two
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sisters and so we were a family of 6.
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And, and so, yeah, that's, those are my early years with that.
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And, and again, I think as I look back and, and as I was
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growing again into my own awareness and, and maturity as a
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human being, I was connecting the dots that, you know, it's
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about caring for others, right? It's a really about doing what
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you can to improve the lives of, of other people.
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And that's what was done for my brother and I, right?
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And, you know, my biological parents did what they could,
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but, you know, they were just not, they didn't have the
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resources and, and the ability to raise as many kids as they
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had, you know, and so thank goodness, there were resources
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beyond their existence, right, that could, could give my
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brother and I an opportunity to have, you know, a successful
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life. And, and I can tell you that
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that we have, you know, my brother went on to, he made, had
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a career in the Air Force and retired.
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And I went on to, you know, do my follow my path and journey.
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As you you know, part of that was 10 years as at one point
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with working at Soka University and and, and working with some
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life. But I found my joint passion and
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education and being an educator, being a supporter and I think an
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enabler of young people right to reach their dreams and goals.
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And so you can see directly there what is within me to do
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this work has its roots in in my early childhood and and my
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family experience growing up. I.
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Thank you. Thank you for Leon for, for
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sharing about that, that childhood of, of yours that, you
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know, in a way it was a big disruption, right, Given the
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sense that from like one family to the next, you, you were
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already, you know, several years old, I think you said six or
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seven years. Old.
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I was 7 when I was adopted officially.
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We were officially adopted. I was, and my brother was 9 at
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the time. Just turning, Yeah.
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And so in kind of navigating that, that big change within
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your life, I'm sure that there were certain kind of, you know,
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shifts in terms of just the the dynamics, not just with the, you
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know, newly, like the new family that you had, but even between
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you and your your brother. And then this, this the new, you
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know, set of siblings that you were stepping into.
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And yeah. And I'm just wondering like, you
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know, what, what was it like for you stepping into that, that new
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environment? You said that, you know, they,
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they were, they were very caring and, and it got you into the
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work of really understanding like what DEI and belonging is.
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But I'm sure that, you know, there were there were some
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difficulties initially in kind of sorting through, you know,
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maybe the the new kind of like family that you were being
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welcomed into. But yeah, could you share a
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little bit more in terms of like what what was that like in the
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early phases and then how that kind of evolved over time?
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Well, yes, and they, you know, understand anything about
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children, right? And their, their, you know, how
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they see things, right? It's all about latching on to
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those who are showing love and, and care and, you know, and,
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and, and providing a safe space, right, for you to be and, and
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knowing that, that, you know, you don't have to worry about
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your, your, you know, basic living and, you know, and, and,
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and all of that. And, and, and I think so that my
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foster family just put that in context.
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I mean, and seven years, My, my, I, my, I, I still, I have dreams
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of my foster father and mother and, and even though they've
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been long past, you know, because of the impression they
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made on me. And, and, and so I think for my
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brother and I both when we were adopted, right?
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I remember our social worker having our bags ready to go when
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we were literally at that point to be now officially
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transferred, you know, from our foster home to right, or our new
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adopted family. And you can imagine the roller
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coaster ride emotionally with that.
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And just, you know, we thought we were prepared, but we
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weren't. I mean, you know, emotionally it
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was a really, really difficult time.
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And, and, and you know, you don't realize, you know, how
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much you were, you know, you cling to certain people when you
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realize you're being taken away from them, right?
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And how much you know, you, you, you were just like for us, I, we
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were just so comfortable with the reality of just being raised
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by foster parents. And we thought, OK, well, this
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is where we're going to be. And even though we were somewhat
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like coached on, you're going to be, you know, there's a new
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family that's going to, you know, take, take you and they
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want you and they want to, you know, they're really happy about
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that. And they're, they're, they're
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excited and, you know, and so they, they did everything they
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can on social worker and, you know, hospital friends were
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working together to try to build that, that positivity for us to
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to leave, but it was really a challenge.
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So that was a really real difficult moment.
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I, you know, it's, it's like, it's like yesterday when I think
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about it, you know, remember how hard that was to, to, to
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separate, but it was, it was part of the journey.
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And so stepping into a brand new family, I mean, at 7 and 9 years
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of age that we had things that were already impressed upon us,
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right? At just certain just experiences
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or personalities, right? We were used to just seeing
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certain people and then and kids as well beyond us.
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And now we're in a completely new environment, right?
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And having to make that shift literally overnight, if you can
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imagine that, you know, very difficult for, for kids of that
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age, right, to just do that and, and feel like it's going to be
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smooth and, you know, not without its rough edges, but it,
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it, it definitely was. And so there was, you know,
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some, some challenges, right, Just getting into a new home, a
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new set of rules of, you know, of how they, how they did, you
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know, family and, you know, where we fit in that.
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God, what's interesting, right, is that that that those lessons
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that we were learning, right, those life lessons of like how
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to adapt right to, to something new, how to, you know, not
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necessarily forgetting where you came from, but having to make
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that, that transition, right, in a life transition that that had
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that was ingrained as early on, early on, right?
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And, and, and then that seeing that, that, you know, newness,
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you know, can really bring some really amazing things as you
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also were giving up other things, right, that you were
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familiar with, right? And that, that was a part of
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just your day-to-day and your norm, right?
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So it taught us a lot of lessons, honestly.
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And, and again, I, I, I know where my heart and my spirit is
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today and why I have chosen to, to, to pursue the life that I,
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I've had, right, especially in the work I do.
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It's because those life lessons and values were, were instilled
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in, in my brother and I, you know, at, at, at, in those
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formative years. And it doesn't make transition,
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you know, easy no matter what, right?
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But it, it, it, it's, that's a life skill we developed.
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It was how to how to be able to just adapt, right, to change
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and, and, and, and not necessarily see change as
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something to fear, right completely, but that, you know,
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there is breakthrough on the other side of that fear, right,
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If we're open to it, right? We were forced to let go of a
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branch we were holding onto and put into a new, you know,
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situation that just taught us so many things about life and how
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to how to, how to roll with it and how to make the most of
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circumstances, you know, when they're not as ideal as you, you
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would, you would prefer. And, and, and I've taken those
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lessons to work with young people because of what I
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learned, what, what was, you know, what I went through and,
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and knowing that that those life lessons would resonate
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eventually with many of the, the, the young people that I've,
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I've had that the blessing and opportunity to, to mentor, to,
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to walk alongside and, you know, just to be a life partner and a
13:18
journey, right. Many of you students and even
13:20
know from you were 1819 and now you're well into your adult
13:23
years and we have, you know, such deep relationships and
13:28
connections that I, I just, you just can't, I mean, I what,
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what, what a life, you know, and, and, and what a great life
13:36
in that sense for me and I, and I, so I, I think again, I don't,
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I've had a lot of time in my, and I'm well done on to my years
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now, you know, and, and, and now I could see it kind of the end
13:45
of my career in terms of, you know, retirement coming up
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right. So in the next, you know,
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another 10 or 12 years, but so I've had a lot of time to really
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think about it and, and, and do my, my, my work right on me and,
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and all those things that I've gone through, right to where I
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can look back, You know, now I think that more gratitude,
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right, for what has happened and why certain things had to happen
14:04
in, in certain stages of my life, because ultimately it's
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made me who I am. And it's actually also deep in
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my spiritual, you know, life and my faith as well, right?
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That had had come into a, a context for me when I was in
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high school just before I went, I went off to college, which was
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a great, you know, kind of turning point for me too.
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So. Well, I, I do want to ask you
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more about that turning point before going to college and also
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about the, the, the spiritual dimension that you're talking
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about. How there was a there was a, a
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moment where it really, I don't know if the word is clicked or
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sparked and then that ignited something much bigger and kind
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of it allowed you to, to really grow your, you know, like
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certain convictions and then also create this understanding
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of like why, why certain events happened.
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But you know, I, I did want to make a brief comment before that
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in saying that, yeah, these, these life transitions that,
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that we all go through can be very difficult.
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They can be even traumatic. They could be unwanted in the
15:07
moment. And yet it life continues on.
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And sometimes it feels like a current that's just sweeping us
15:14
along and we we go along either like kicking and screaming or we
15:18
go along and we just kind of, you know, floating on our backs
15:21
and like enjoying. But you know what you talked
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about in terms of these deeper lessons of like really how to
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adapt to change, how to navigate those life transitions.
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These are all something that I think everyone can really
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resonate with that will be faced with.
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But when you talk about your childhood, right, just how
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abruptly it all happened from your biological family to a
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foster care to adoptive family, I mean, all in, you know,
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relatively quick succession. Those, those imprinted something
15:56
deeper in terms of like your appreciation for family and
16:00
community and, and I think also really extended your, your
16:05
capacity for compassion. And so from what I'm hearing,
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there's this, there's also this through line of just really
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being able to like recognize those around you who are
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extending grace and being compassionate and for you to
16:21
truly absorb that and say, wow, you know, that's, that's kind of
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what I want to do. That's what I want to kind of
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give back in your own way. So, so now, you know, I wanted
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to pass it back to you and, and ask because it sounds like there
16:35
was an important, you know, transition point that you were
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going to share a little bit more about.
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And, and I'd love for you to bring up the the spiritual and,
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and, or really just kind of component because I know that
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that's something core to who you are as well.
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So yeah, thank. You, Scott, and thank you for
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your knowledge about yes, and, and and then as many of you
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know, I've, you know, I've, I've shared throughout just and
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you've seen and you know my life.
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You know, many of the students, right, how faith has been a big
16:58
part of just even, you know, my young adult into, you know,
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what, who I am today as well. And, and it's deeply shaped my
17:04
my direction in addition to those, those formative years.
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So in the in, in that high school period, it was my senior
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year, I think in the three years of high school, as a result of
17:13
things that happened to me that I was becoming, like I said, I'd
17:16
be, had a deeper awareness of just my own kind of existence at
17:19
that point, right? And like certain events that
17:21
have happened and there was some the trauma, right, that
17:23
separation. There were things that happened
17:25
with, you know, with my brother and, and, you know, in our own
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struggle and, and, you know, and, and I was really trying to
17:32
find a sense of purpose. Like, So what, what does all
17:34
this mean? Right?
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Like, what do I do with it? Like I'm to be leaving home and
17:37
going to college. What do you see?
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Sanders got accepted there. And, and I was going, I, I like
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this is it. This is, this is the next, you
17:45
know, step in my, in my journey and my abolition as a human
17:48
being. And so I think that deep search
17:51
for meaning was something that I was really starving for wanting
17:54
to understand. Like, how did all these events,
17:56
like events lead up to this moment for me, right?
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And who was I going to be, right?
18:02
Not what my mom and dad told me to be or what they expect me to
18:05
be, but who did I want to really be?
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Where was my resolve? And and so it started with that
18:09
essential, you know, it's kind of existential question.
18:11
Like, you know, that what is my proof?
18:13
Like, why was it, Why did all this even happen?
18:14
Why, like me, even here, there was a, there was a, a high
18:17
school friend of mine, a female friend of mine that I had gotten
18:22
to know. And I just had seen something
18:25
about her that was just really unique from all from other
18:28
students and, and, and friends that I knew.
18:30
She just had a certain walk about her certain way that she,
18:32
her character, her personal, like, you know, she was very
18:35
just amazing and caring and, and just, she had a sense of
18:39
maturity about her that I didn't really see in a lot of my, my,
18:41
my peers, right? And so I was curious like, so
18:43
who was this, what's, what's she, what's this person about?
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And as I got to find out more about her and they became good
18:48
friends. We both have track and field
18:50
together, right? And, and all that and, and found
18:53
out that her dad's a pastor and her mom was, you know, involved
18:57
with supporting, you know, the, the, the, the church with a,
19:00
where her dad pastored as a, as a, as a worship leader.
19:04
She played the piano and, and, and was, was amazing musician.
19:08
And and so that led into, you know, further question like, so
19:12
wow, like where this is, these are who shaped this, this
19:16
individual. And I want to know more about
19:17
this right? Can.
19:18
And so it one thing led to another.
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And I think for me, it LED eventually into diving into, you
19:26
know, the Bible, right? And, and this is and, and, and,
19:28
and from a Christian faith, you know, perspective and the
19:34
parallels that I was seeing in my life for, for, for that time,
19:39
that first time that I, that beyond me, right?
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That here is this, this piece of literature that is living and
19:46
breathing today. And it was just like I was
19:50
looking at my, my life in a mirror.
19:53
That's the best way I can describe it of, of, of just the,
19:56
the, the what I was reading, you know, I, it, it just, it, it
20:01
came into fullness for me and. One of the most powerful sort of
20:06
revelations of that was, you know, I'm, I, I'm a professed
20:09
Christian, a morning Christian. I, I believe in Jesus as my
20:12
savior And, and I don't, I don't hide that.
20:13
That's, that's, this is who, who I am and, and what has really, I
20:17
think deepened who I am as a human being and why I, like I
20:20
said, why I really do the work I do.
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But I found the story of adoption in the scriptures that
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I'd never had, had been been seen and, and and heard about.
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And, and there's more to that too.
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But it just again, that was the the, the thing that really
20:38
opened my eyes that, you know, that I was not born as an
20:41
accident, that I have a true purpose that, that, that my, my
20:45
Lord and Savior, my my creator God is, you know, has a path for
20:49
me and, and has, you know, as Jeremiah says, he wants to give
20:54
me a life and a purpose for being.
20:58
And it just clicked at that moment, Scott, for me and and I
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can see the rest is history, literally.
21:03
But you know, because my trajectory beyond that point, it
21:07
took off because at that point, I now knew that I truly had a
21:14
purpose for living. I was born into this world to,
21:17
to do something, to contribute something, to be called Ahsoka,
21:20
right? You know, the, you know, the,
21:21
the, the value, right, creating value.
21:23
The parallel was there spiritually for me, right?
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It's like I was born to create value, to be a contributor, to
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live a life of purpose with everything that has happened
21:31
that, that God would use that to grow me as more as a, as a
21:35
person to fulfill my mission and calling in life.
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And that's where eventually I've got into education because I
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want amazing. Yes, and.
21:43
That's probably a story you have not heard before.
21:46
No, no. I.
21:47
Have not and you know, and again, it from like knowing you
21:51
as part of the admin team and student affairs and you know, I
21:54
think actions really speak, you know, for themselves.
21:57
It's so clear that like of course, this is like the deeper
22:00
roots and the foundation of like who you are.
22:03
I think when we really stop to look at those individuals who
22:07
stand out, there's a certain quality about them that that
22:10
kind of just, I don't know, resonates and and that you
22:13
think, wow, you know, they're amazing.
22:15
How did they get to to be the the way they are?
22:19
It's these kind of backstories that that are really at play,
22:22
but but they're kind of like hidden underneath, right,
22:25
Because it's the root system that keeps us standing tall.
22:29
And, and I find that to be so similar to the story that you
22:33
shared about this, this friend of yours in high school that
22:37
really just kind of walk the talk basically.
22:40
And, you know, further convincing of just wow, she's a
22:44
good person. And you felt there was something
22:47
there was there must be something to this.
22:49
And that you then decided, let me try it out.
22:51
And I find that that's probably the most convincing way to
22:55
introduce anyone to a spiritual practice.
22:58
It's really to to have them explore from that for themselves
23:03
and make those connecting points.
23:05
And I really appreciate this, this, this broader conversation
23:08
about the like search for purpose, a sense of purpose and,
23:13
and, and meaning. I think everyone experiences
23:17
that everyone has that, that those questions that emerge in
23:20
their heads of, you know, why, why am I here?
23:23
What am I supposed to do? And you know, what's the, what's
23:27
the meaning of all of this? And I think that these are very
23:31
difficult questions, right? Especially when probably we
23:34
want. To have.
23:36
Immediate answers sometimes the answers take a little bit longer
23:41
and I think there are kind of filled out by the experiences
23:45
life experiences that we accrue along the way and, and, and it's
23:49
never a straightforward path. Sometimes there's underbrush and
23:52
you have to like cut through a lot of that.
23:54
But, you know, it's just, it sounds so wonderful that there
23:56
was this, you know, ain't this, this moment at a very important
24:00
point where you're about to go off to college and you were
24:05
afforded this opportunity to like kind of get this, you know,
24:07
new understanding and faith tradition and have this compass
24:13
to guide you through probably many more struggles that were
24:16
ahead of you. And, and also to have a
24:19
community, right, Not just that friend of yours, but also to
24:22
really, you know, share your own enthusiasm and and appreciation
24:26
for what what you know, the church has given to you.
24:30
And yeah, and pay it forward. So, you know, now with all of
24:33
that being said, you you mentioned, OK, now there's this
24:36
foray into education, right? Well, why?
24:39
Why exactly education? What was like the initial
24:42
attraction of wanting to go into to that field rather than oh,
24:47
absolutely, yeah. Well, and, and, and not, not a
24:50
knock in the military, you know, I mean, if you, you know the
24:52
back story, you know, my, my adopted dad is a Vietnam veteran
24:55
of Marine, my uncles, my adoptive, you know, at the end
24:57
of the family, all those brothers were went into the
25:00
military. My adopted sister, one of them
25:03
went into, she tried the Air Force as well, but didn't pan
25:07
out for her. And then here's my brother.
25:08
He makes a career out of that, right.
25:10
He's the only one who actually made a career in that, that my
25:13
sort of family, immediate family experience and loved it.
25:18
So again, and I'm a big supporter of, of, of those who
25:21
who choose to serve. But these are the things that,
25:23
you know, that that have again, my influence.
25:25
And then it's stuff that I've I've been around and stories in
25:27
there that have shaped my perspective as well on on just,
25:30
you know, what, what humans are and what they, why they do what
25:33
they do and all that it you asked me.
25:35
So why, why education, right? And really fundamentally comes
25:40
down to what I experienced in college.
25:43
It, it, it in those, those four years, 4 1/2 years I was UC
25:47
Santa Cruz. It's because of what I went
25:50
through, who shaped me, my, my, you know, professors, you know,
25:55
my, my peers. College was just a whole new
25:59
world of opportunity and, and experience in learning and
26:03
growth and being challenged. And, you know, I mean, I was
26:09
just, I was picked in Prague, you know, and intellectually,
26:13
personally, spiritually, I mean, I was, I went through some
26:15
stuff, right? And, and, and again, those were
26:17
just those needing more needed growth moments, right?
26:19
That that as a young person, I, I'd, I needed to, to again, to
26:25
kind of round me out, right, as a human being, right, to, to
26:29
help me see things on a, on a, you know, more holistic level,
26:32
right, of, of how life is and how things just work in the
26:37
world and how it, it, it impacts individual to societies, right?
26:42
And I mean, we're just, you know, as, you know, discuss, you
26:45
just kind of learn all of these things.
26:46
You're taking all these courses and from different disciplines.
26:49
You know, I was a liberal arts just like like you and, and
26:51
others at took university have graduated with those degrees.
26:53
And and so I had a lot of there was, you know, the intellectual
26:58
happening, right, growth and, you know, preoccupation with
27:02
just ideas, right, things I've never heard of before, concepts,
27:06
theories. And, you know, all of that was
27:10
just working in my spirit, in my mind.
27:12
And I was just, you know, like, okay, I just got, I just want to
27:15
try to figure this out, like give me kind of the grand theory
27:17
of it. All right, but it doesn't happen
27:20
that way. You got to just work through it,
27:22
right? And even some of the stuff, you
27:23
know, you accept things that you just maybe sometimes can't fully
27:26
understand, but you just know that you you still don't need to
27:29
keep walking and doing your doing your work.
27:31
And you know, some of those early notes are just trying to
27:35
be the best human being that I could be even then, right,
27:38
knowing that I still have a lot of years to grow and learn and,
27:41
and right and, and, and, and just do life.
27:46
And so, so it was really those those years in college that that
27:50
shaped kind of this notion like, wow, what an environment where I
27:53
was shaped right to really then move me into my adult years,
27:58
right. There was also spiritually with
28:00
that I was connected to, you know, a strong church body with
28:03
you, with, you know, with my peers would go to, you know,
28:06
Bible studies at the church, right?
28:07
We, we were just surrounded by a lot of great mentors, spiritual
28:11
mentors, but then and again, also in the academic realm, a
28:15
lot of amazing human beings that were, you know, impacting our
28:18
lives as well and, and growing us and, and, and, and in many
28:22
ways. And so education for me became,
28:26
I think that that, that professional calling that I was
28:29
in now searching for once I was, you know, getting ready to, to
28:32
leave Santa Cruz and, and with my psychology degree and, you
28:36
know, my social psych research, right, that I'm all proud of.
28:38
I'm like, oh, you know, I'm studying groups and da, da, da,
28:41
I'm like, but how does this apply?
28:42
Where can I apply it? And, and one thing kind of led
28:45
to another. Again, just to keep this moving.
28:48
There's, you know, with more backs to the story, but I was in
28:52
the Silicon Valley working when I graduated and for about 3
28:56
years I was, I, I, I did contracting work, attempting
29:00
work just to get professional experience.
29:02
And through that, Scott, I learned what I really didn't
29:05
want to do career wise, even though the Silicon Valley up
29:08
near San Francisco, right South Bay, San Jose, Santa Clara, I
29:11
was in all of that at that area, Menlo Park, these cities, you
29:14
know, working jobs just to get experience.
29:15
But I realized that there was a certain value or, or, or
29:19
experience in, in the corporate world that just wasn't
29:21
fulfilling for me. And that, that got me to, to, to
29:26
dive deeper into like, OK, So what then do I, what do I do
29:29
with this? Where do I go with this?
29:30
And there was a lot of prayer. I was seeking a lot of spiritual
29:33
wisdom and guidance and I was getting it.
29:36
And and I guess I one thing kind of led to another and then a
29:39
door open for me through UC Santa does my alma mater to be
29:43
AUC outreach counselor for working with students from
29:48
underrepresented backgrounds in a rural community South of Santa
29:53
Cruz, Watsonville, Castroville area, right.
29:57
These two cities where I so I applied to this job.
30:02
I got it and literally that started my journey in higher Ed
30:07
in 2000. That's that's amazing.
30:11
And you know this what you're talking about with like the edge
30:15
your experiences within education.
30:17
It truly was something that you just lived and breathed and you
30:20
were fully immersed and you couldn't get enough of it.
30:23
And that that really informed what the next.
30:27
It made your decision probably much easier when after doing all
30:31
these different temp jobs that you were like, I don't know
30:33
about this that didn't feel good.
30:36
And then it just it did I. Had some some real epiphotal
30:41
moments in those contracting positions and one of them was
30:43
actually working for Apple Computer in a purchasing
30:45
department for like a couple of weeks, right.
30:47
It was that these were just short assignments because I just
30:50
wanted to get experience and build my resume.
30:52
But I had but but what I was seeing going from, you know, I
30:56
mean from a startup office management position, right,
30:58
office coordinator to working again for, you know, this global
31:01
company, Apple and Fujitsu Micro Electronics.
31:03
That was another one that that came along.
31:05
There was a the, the culture of those workspaces was not
31:09
resonating with my core values. And I think for many of us,
31:13
right, when we, when we find out we're in work that doesn't align
31:17
with our past, right, like, like what we're what we really are
31:19
about who we are as a human being.
31:23
It, it, a lot of it felt transactional to me, you know,
31:25
in terms of how, you know, these businesses were operating and it
31:28
just, it's about making money. And it's, you know, again,
31:31
nothing wrong with making money, but I think how some of these
31:33
corporations were, I think going about it just, it just didn't
31:36
resonate with me, right. And again, I just, that was OK.
31:39
Like I for some people, that's that, that's a good fit.
31:42
But for me, I was like, no, this is just not, not doing it.
31:45
And I was really struggling with that.
31:47
And, and I think I was, you know, just, I was trying to
31:49
figure out like, where am I going to go, you know, beyond
31:53
this point? And and that's again, eventually
31:55
education that the field of education at K through 16 was
31:59
where, where, where it happened for me.
32:01
And once I, I jumped in, Scott, it was like, it's like, you
32:06
know, putting on, on, on shoes that just fit just perfectly
32:09
right, like new shoes, you know, you're just like, wow, this is
32:13
this is this is, this is tailored for me, right?
32:15
I'm tailored for this. And yeah.
32:19
And, and it just, I, I could then now really fully put my, my
32:24
soul, my, my heart, my passion, what I, what has shaped me as a,
32:29
as a human being. I, I feel like I could give that
32:32
to this field and be a contributor to the lives of
32:38
young people, right? Because that was also the other
32:41
connection for me on a spiritual level is like many of the
32:43
students that I was working with, there was some similar
32:45
histories that we were, we had been in, you know, been on and,
32:48
and, and upbringings and life struggles and things that, you
32:52
know, I know I had, I had overcome and, and, and, and
32:55
things that, that, that, that I, that I grew into, right?
32:59
As of as a result of, of, you know, my formative years that I
33:02
felt like I could provide at least some, some, you know,
33:07
insight, you know, into those burning questions that young
33:10
people had about their own existence, right?
33:12
Why? I'm at this college, right,
33:14
right. And somebody asked, why do I
33:16
have to what, what is a global citizen?
33:17
I'm like, well, that's a great question.
33:18
Let's, let's, let's, let's unpack that, right?
33:20
I've been a couple stuck assumes they asked me like, what, what
33:23
is it? What, what, what should that be?
33:24
Right? Like they're trying to figure
33:26
that out for themselves, right? And so again, it's like, well,
33:28
let's talk. Let's just have a dialogue.
33:31
Let's, let's, let's share our stories and experiences and
33:33
maybe we come up with something that that you know, is more
33:36
definitive for for each of us, right?
33:39
And I wanted to ask you this question now because you know,
33:42
once you'd decided, OK, higher Ed higher education is, is that
33:47
is your place that you were going to make your biggest
33:50
impact and you're going to like really like launch into your
33:52
career. And then you talked about how
33:54
important values are and you know.
33:58
You eventually. Found your way to Soca
34:01
University and talk about, you know, alignment of values and
34:05
finding a community that you know, I think really resonated
34:09
with with your own deeper values.
34:12
You spent a good stint of time, I would say many years of.
34:16
My life and Alejandra, my wife was with me, as you know, the
34:18
entire time. Amazing.
34:21
Huge shout out to to Ali as well.
34:23
And, you know, over that span of 1010 years at at a school where
34:29
they, you know, have as their mission to foster global
34:33
citizens committed to living a contributor's life.
34:35
And you've encountered many, many SUA students and now
34:39
graduates. And I'm just curious, like any,
34:43
any takeaways that you can kind of offer to us as far as what.
34:48
Yeah, those conversations that you had with these students were
34:50
when they asked you, Oh my gosh, am IA global citizen.
34:53
What does that even mean? You know, like I'm sure that
34:57
there were moments where they were trying to kind of unpack it
35:00
in real time, other times where they would OfferUp certain
35:03
understandings and then times where you would you would extend
35:05
your own personal experiences. But I mean, it's a, it's a
35:08
pretty broad concept, but I, I wanted to ask like what, what,
35:12
how does that kind of land with you?
35:14
That's a great question. There's a lot to that too, just
35:17
in terms of experience, but I, I will lay the, the a key sort of
35:22
part of that journey, right. So you, you talked about it, the
35:25
alignment, right with, with the values, right, Because I talked
35:28
about it early, right? I'm like, I don't want to be a
35:30
part of something and most humans can't not be a partisan
35:33
that really doesn't align with with who you are as a human
35:35
being, right? It's you're going to find those
35:37
that that dissonance in, in your what you care about and the fact
35:40
that it's not matching with what the work with the work you're
35:42
expected to do, right, Or, you know, you're carrying out.
35:45
And so the resolution of that is you, you, you, you find that and
35:48
you keep searching until you find it, you know, and, and so,
35:51
so Soka was, was really, it was, it was another stepping stone.
35:54
To be quite honest, in that process of me, a lot feel like
35:57
that was my, what my calling is and how to certain and who I'm
36:01
serving in this, this life, right?
36:03
And, and, and supporting being, you know, that, that community
36:07
of college students, right, young people, young adults, it,
36:12
it was Soca came along at just the, the next right moment prior
36:17
to this. I get it is another story.
36:19
You don't know. But you know, when I was working
36:20
UC Santa Cruz and student life for a couple of years, I was at
36:23
2 new colleges that, that, that were just developed, right?
36:28
Could they call them not C9 and C10, College 9 and college 10,
36:32
one college seat College 10 was social justice and community and
36:36
the others that did that was their theme in college 9 was
36:39
international and global perspectives.
36:41
And so the concept of global citizenship would came out
36:45
through literally the college 9 theme because of because of the
36:51
college theme, right. And their core course was all
36:52
about, you know, addressing, you know, global issues and, and,
36:57
you know, helping students understand, you know, how they
37:00
are, how they are a global citizen.
37:02
You know, what that looks like in the context of all of these
37:05
complex issues and, you know, subjects, right?
37:08
You know, looking at politics, economics, right?
37:12
You know, social issues, right, health issues, education, like,
37:15
how does all, you know, how do, how do we, you know, engage with
37:19
all of this, right? And not just domestically, but
37:23
you know, how does this stuff play out in the world in other
37:25
spaces, right? And, and and so that again, SOCA
37:31
came along it at like it was like that.
37:32
It was like the baton being handed on right.
37:35
And and and and then bubble was so amazing about SOCA and
37:40
uniquely different than than than the two colleges that came
37:43
from was a mission statement that emphasized fostering the
37:52
steady stream of global like building that capacity as an
37:55
entire college, as a university, right?
38:00
That and I was like, I'm all in, you know, and two phone calls
38:06
later with Michelle hobby Amirs and I was offered the position
38:10
because we just like I found and heard the values of that.
38:14
I've I wanted to continue, you know, exploring with with with
38:18
with, with student work, right in the collegiate context that
38:22
some of the program. I asked her, like, So what are
38:23
you doing to engage students? Like what are some of your
38:25
programs look like? What are some of these
38:27
initiatives? You know, what, how are you
38:29
building and enabling, empowering the young people of
38:33
SOCA right to be global citizens?
38:35
Your mission to end it just it just clicked and I'm like, I'm
38:39
there, I'm on it. So one thing led to another and
38:42
I'm, you know, I visited the campus and Michelle says, I'll
38:46
just, I'll fly you out so you can really check out the campus
38:48
and see what you think. And I'm like, I'm like, my wife
38:52
will also be sold on this one too.
38:53
So, you know, and she was working in in up in Northern
38:58
California, Sacramento area, you know, at the time, and I was in
39:00
UC Santa Cruz. So it just, you know, we're a
39:02
little, a little bit of long distance, but we we we figured
39:05
that out. And it's like, OK, yeah, this
39:06
will be this is going to be the next, next place for us.
39:08
And so, yeah, so I think everything about SOCA was
39:13
really, it was a continuation of of that type of mindset of like,
39:20
why are we doing education, right?
39:22
What is this about? And building the capacity of
39:27
humans to to contribute right, to contribute to life and the
39:30
things they care about in the things they care about, right?
39:33
Because we all care about something and we're all right
39:36
moved to, to do something. And I've seen this countless
39:39
times with students pursuing their passion as that's defined
39:43
for them and a global in this context of what?
39:45
What a global citizen is, right? Yeah.
39:48
Thank you, Julian. And I wanted to ask a follow up
39:50
question. When you when you were going
39:53
through that interview process and then made your decision and
39:57
you know, let's say you're on the plane heading over to Alizo
40:00
Fiejo. Did you already see yourself as
40:04
a global citizen? Was that something that you had
40:07
like spoken about and then articulated?
40:10
Like what was that like in terms of like the entry point?
40:13
Because I know that you had that experience in working with other
40:15
programs that were very much aligned with that.
40:17
But in terms of like what SOCA, like what you were learning
40:20
about from SOCA and its mission statement, the programs that
40:24
Michelle shared with you, like how did you convey like, oh,
40:27
this is who I am as a global citizen?
40:31
Well. Again, I, I think the, the, the,
40:34
the language of the mission statement resonated with me
40:36
because I felt like I was already from, from my, my entry
40:42
into the field of higher Ed is, you know, so we, we talked about
40:45
earlier, right? I wanted to do what I could to
40:48
serve others right, to serve students, right?
40:50
I, I felt like that was what I was, I was meant to do and being
40:55
engaged with students from multiple walks of life, right?
40:59
Domestic students, international students, you know what I mean?
41:02
I wish like it was, we're the first, but it wasn't, you know,
41:04
in terms of that experience like I was, I was already being
41:07
exposed to life experiences right from other, even as a
41:11
student. I mean, UC Santa Cruz is a
41:13
global institution. I mean, there's, we have
41:14
students and faculty from all across the globe, right?
41:18
So these earlier notions of being connected to citizens
41:24
beyond my own, you know, national, you know, experience,
41:28
right, state experience was already happening.
41:32
And I think because of the fact that I was able to meet people
41:34
from different parts of the world, you know, prior to.
41:36
So like, again, that those seeds were being planted for me around
41:41
how powerful that experience was, like, and what happens when
41:44
we put ourselves in a position where we get to experience that
41:48
difference, right? Hearing life stories from, from
41:52
others, right, that are very different from, from, from, you
41:55
know, our own, my own especially, right, but able to
41:58
have this interconnection where we're sharing stories and
42:02
narratives so that we get better, deeper perspective of
42:06
each other and, and, and humans, right?
42:10
That was happening right? In, in, in, in organic ways and
42:13
classroom discussions and hanging out and doing yeah, I
42:17
was in, I was student activities assistant at UC Santa Cruz,
42:19
right? I mean, so it's funny, like I
42:20
end up, you know, getting involved in the work where at,
42:23
at the, at the college university level.
42:24
That was a continuation of that from a professional full time,
42:28
you know, professional standpoint, right.
42:31
But I was inspired by those experiences, right?
42:33
To, to, to, to then now be able to do that work on a
42:36
professional in a professional capacity with students.
42:40
And so, you know, Soca would like I said, it just was a
42:44
continuation of that for me. But knowing that this was the
42:51
emphasis of the entire, you know, college right at it, you
42:54
know, the university, it was just like, wow, this is the air
42:59
this place breathes, right? And every student is being
43:03
engaged on this, on this concept because it's, it's in our
43:06
mission, it's who we are, right? It, it, this is the culture that
43:09
we are, we are building right? As in the, in this, this, this,
43:13
this campus community staff, faculty included, right, all
43:16
feeding into this experience, learning and growing from each
43:20
other. And again, creating the programs
43:22
that you know what we, you know, are in that, that planning
43:25
process, right? We, we want to make sure that
43:27
we're hitting those essential needs that, you know, the
43:30
academic and out of classroom experiences as you, as you know,
43:34
right, we, we, we tried to just put, put all that, that stuff
43:38
together, you know, and this, this, this, you know, holistic
43:42
formula, right? I'd, I'd call it to tap into as
43:46
many life experiences as possible.
43:47
And, and, and, you know, for students to engage each other,
43:51
engage us, we engage them, you know, we're just learning and
43:54
growing together, right? And, and for me, I think that
43:57
caught up the global Synod when I was asked by students, like,
43:59
what does that mean to you? I'm like, well, I think this is
44:01
what it's about. It's, it's that we are connected
44:04
to each other, right? We are choosing to be in spaces
44:07
that are uncomfortable. We are choosing to, to expose
44:11
our, our, our minds and our intellects to ideas that, that
44:15
are new, right, indifferent. And you know, and, and, and
44:18
stretching us in ways that we, we could never imagine, right?
44:23
And, and, and then I would ask them questions like, So what do
44:25
you care about as a human being, right?
44:29
What, what, what, what gets you up in the morning, right?
44:32
Why did you choose this university and not some,
44:34
someplace else, right? What drew you right to this, to
44:37
this place? And I think it was more of the,
44:40
those asking questions of students when I was asked that
44:42
question about Global Center, because I will give you a
44:45
definition, but that's my own definition, right?
44:48
I don't have your experiences. And so I want to find out from
44:52
you like what, who are you? What are you about?
44:55
Like, what do you care about what, what like I said, what
44:57
makes you tick? And I think those questions led
45:00
to conversations, just really organic and, and deep
45:04
conversations about what that looked like for folks.
45:07
And I think in many senses that definition for for students
45:12
became clear in some of those conversations.
45:14
And in some senses it was like, wow, one, one question leads to
45:19
another. And then you realize what this
45:21
is so much that I just will never really understand about
45:24
this concept because it's just so, so bigger than any given
45:27
person, right? It's like, I mean, the word
45:29
global in and of itself, right? Is, is, you know, how can we
45:33
really get our heads around what that even is, right?
45:37
And then we look at global citizenship and being a part of
45:39
a global community, if we're, you know, as kind of loosely
45:42
defined. And maybe in that sense it, it,
45:45
it just comes up so many, so many more questions right then,
45:49
then what we feel like we know or have answers for, if I may.
45:52
Add add a few thoughts. You know, you asking those
45:57
questions to the students is so important.
45:59
This is truly the hallmark of a great educator to put back.
46:04
You know, these questions that are really getting at their
46:06
deeper, deeper interests, their passions, but also just their
46:10
humanity, right, Giving them the not just the permission, but
46:15
like encouraging them to say like, Hey, you know, really show
46:17
up as as your genuine, authentic self.
46:21
You have doubts. That's part of it.
46:23
Bring that as well. You have concerns that's I'm
46:26
here to support you and being able to create that kind of
46:29
space for someone to to think through these these difficult
46:34
questions. But also, I think pairing that
46:38
with a mission statement that's meant to be, you know, very
46:42
empowering, that's meant to be forward-looking and that's also
46:45
meant to be altruistic. I think it's those that's a
46:48
powerful recipe for cultivating global citizens and allowing
46:53
them to arrive at their own definition of their own
46:56
understanding. I know for me, I, I don't, I
46:59
don't know if I would necessarily say I walked away
47:01
from SUA with. This.
47:04
Neatly like kind of like thought of definition, but I do know
47:10
that it left a profound mark on me and kind of constantly asking
47:14
myself my really embodying this, this ideal.
47:17
And I would ask myself this many, many times and I still ask
47:20
myself this and and that invitation to continue to
47:24
reflect and expand on kind of where I'm at and who I'm
47:27
becoming. I think it's really important.
47:29
And then another thing too, that I wanted to comment on is that,
47:32
you know, the just from what you shared about your own
47:35
background, it sounds like you were the kind of learner or
47:39
students and learner and just person who really wanted to
47:43
engage others, who really wanted to hear people out, who wanted
47:46
to engage in, in those differences.
47:48
You kind of just threw yourself into the kind of, you know, like
47:52
flames of just like discussion that, you know, you were able to
47:56
kind of just learn about many different kinds of people.
48:00
And I just think that that's like such an important way to,
48:04
to, to grow that oftentimes, you know, we can be sheltered or we
48:09
can be standoffish. But to have a have that kind of
48:13
mentality of like, you know, I, I might not become best friends
48:17
with this person or I might not like it even what they say.
48:21
But having an openness and eagerness and a curiosity to
48:25
still say, you know, like there's something of value here
48:28
that maybe I can resonate with, where I can learn from or maybe
48:32
this person just needs to be heard.
48:33
And this is me extending some kind of, you know, gift in
48:37
itself of creating that space because I've been afforded that
48:41
space myself. So, so much of these exchanges,
48:45
the kind of give and take, the consideration, the
48:48
thoughtfulness, the sincerity, all of that, I feel like really
48:52
kind of coalesces. And your own understanding of
48:55
global citizenship, of that interconnectedness that you
48:57
talked about. And so I wanted to ask if you
49:02
could share very briefly because I know you're the current work
49:05
that you're doing is no longer at SUA and but it's in the field
49:10
of DEI. And yeah, I wanted to ask if you
49:13
can briefly share just kind of what, what are you currently
49:16
engaged with and how does global citizenship also continue to
49:20
play a role in that? Great question.
49:22
Yeah. So now I am a part of the Orange
49:24
County Fire Authority and this is a they're a joint powers
49:28
authority. And and that's a key part
49:31
because we're not a municipality.
49:32
We actually are supported by 23 cities in Orange County.
49:35
So they're they're part of getting this joint powers
49:37
authority. That's why they determine that.
49:40
And so we serve nearly 2 million residents, right, and community
49:44
members. And you know, in that just the
49:50
diversity of just where people come from, right, That they've
49:53
chosen Orange County as their home and our member cities.
49:57
And so, you know, the fire service is all about saving
49:59
lives and property, right? That's kind of the motto.
50:03
But, you know, my role as a diversity inclusion coordinator
50:07
gets to bring in, you know, other lenses around what that
50:10
service looks like, right, to the to the community.
50:13
And you know, so, so it's not just doing what we need to do
50:19
operationally because we're trained to do that, right?
50:21
Like our firefighters and 1st responders and nurse educators
50:25
and you know, our prevention specialist, you name it on down
50:28
the line of, of the, the frontline, you know, folks that
50:31
that are really keeping the community safe.
50:34
But how are we doing the human work, right?
50:37
How are we making those connections across culture,
50:40
language, custom, tradition, when, you know, a part of our
50:45
demographic is, you know, we're still working on reflecting more
50:48
of the communities that we serve, right?
50:50
And so that's where the DEI piece for me comes in, right?
50:54
And I get to teach on on concepts because again, things
50:56
that I had been engrossed in myself and as a career, right,
51:00
My, my own trainings and development around concept like
51:03
implicit bias and decision making, right?
51:06
Culture, humility, competency, right?
51:08
How these things play out in, in, in decisions we make that
51:11
affect others, right? Maybe, you know, from even
51:15
family to professional right? I mean it, it's not just unique
51:18
to to our workspaces, because again, as I talked about, it's
51:21
the human work that right, that, that, that, that I have been
51:25
about for since I've been in, you know, as a full time
51:29
professional, right? And that got solidified with
51:32
with with really my interest into into education.
51:35
So it's just been a continuation right since along this work and
51:39
I think to the point in my own human growth where I've had a
51:45
lot of time to work out these concepts in my own life, working
51:48
a lot with students from, you know, and inexperiences that
51:51
are, you know, global, truly global staff and faculty as
51:54
well. And my colleagues, I've attended
51:56
countless conferences on, on a number of issues that have
52:02
global citizenship sort of implications from how we do
52:05
education. Why are we doing it the way
52:07
we're doing it, right? How do we as educators, right,
52:09
do, do better at, at what we do, right?
52:11
Are we listening to students? Are we, you know, it's all of
52:14
that. So Scott, so I feel like I bring
52:17
all that capacity and, and experience, but still learning
52:20
and growing too as a human, right?
52:23
I always, you know, yesterday I said, you know, I talked about
52:25
with cultural humility, I can be an expert in a given topic and
52:29
still not know much about anything beyond my expertise,
52:33
right? That that's just the reality.
52:36
And I think that the, the, the part about accepting that that
52:41
humility posture, right, is to recognize that, you know, I, I,
52:45
I am also still a, a, a student of life, right?
52:49
I am and the ability to remain open to learning new
52:53
experiences, even though you may be grounded solidly at certain
52:57
things. You also, we also have to
52:59
recognize that there's a lot we, you know, our audience.
53:02
I'm like, be OK with not knowing what we don't know, right?
53:05
We, we don't know what we don't know.
53:07
And, and, and that humility of just accepting that is not a
53:11
negative thing that we're putting upon us.
53:14
We're just saying that, you know what?
53:15
We recognize that our lenses, you know, have a reach to a
53:18
certain capacity right in the world.
53:22
And I always needed to leave myself open to learning new
53:24
things from other people. Oh, I love that.
53:28
So no, I love the that the humility posture that you, you,
53:32
you spoke about the lifelong learning component.
53:36
And you know, all of that ties into not just the evolution of
53:41
the work that you're doing, but also I think this, this concept
53:44
of global citizenship and that we're continuously striving
53:48
towards bettering ourselves, bettering our communities,
53:52
right? Both local and global.
53:54
And I think it's just so wonderful that you're able to
53:56
really hit this stride in your career of making the impact that
54:01
you want in the community that you, you live in and, and
54:06
bringing in all these experiences from conferences,
54:08
from friendships that are very global in nature.
54:12
But channeling that towards those, those many, many cities,
54:16
right? The, the 2 million residents,
54:19
her community that you, that you were speaking about and, and,
54:22
and, and what a career it's been.
54:24
And, you know, you have a lot to still look forward to in terms
54:28
of really extending that impact and continuing the the human
54:31
work that you're you were talking about.
54:33
So, you know, Julian, thank you so much for for sharing all of
54:36
that. We've covered a lot and I've
54:38
learned a lot about you. You.
54:40
Learned some new things, I'm sure.
54:41
Yeah, of. Course and every.
54:43
Conversation with you all to do some new things.
54:44
Likewise, you know, conversations are two way in
54:47
this this sense. So yes.
54:48
Yeah, I know. I appreciate you who Leon.
54:50
And I wanted to ask one final question if that's OK.
54:53
And this is the book or movie recommendation.
54:56
So, anything you'd like to share to the listeners?
54:59
OK, there are, there's one book in particular and and they may
55:02
seem outdated, but they're actually still very relevant.
55:05
That's two books, actually. So one is called The Lexus and
55:07
the Olive Tree. It's by Thomas Friedman.
55:11
Friedman and he wrote it in 1999, but he basically contrasts
55:17
global globalization with human traditions, cultural traditions,
55:22
right, and the sense of belonging and community.
55:26
And he he contrasts how the pursuit of globalization, right
55:31
in that process, right, that really is, is about trying to
55:35
get bring more prosperity to the world and, and, and people, you
55:38
know, globally, right, comes with some, some challenges too,
55:42
because right, that there, it's not always in alignment with,
55:46
again, sort of human sort of desire to, to you know, how we,
55:51
we, we, we, we connect and values, right?
55:54
That we, that we foster about how we want to live and be.
55:57
And, and, and notions of prosperity can be very fluid
56:02
across, you know, cultures and places and time and, and
56:04
experiences. And sometimes so, so, so this
56:06
possible position is not always, you know, connected and, and,
56:09
and and synced up with, you know, this notion of, you know,
56:13
community and cultural tradition and practices, right?
56:16
And so the olive tree, right? The way he universally.
56:20
So the olive tree represents the community that they, this humans
56:23
have to be logging, right? And the Lexus, right?
56:26
You know, that the, the Lexus being, you know, you know, the
56:28
car Lexus, right? But but that that that's being,
56:31
you know, represents globalization, right?
56:33
This, this, this new sort of way we want to want to pursue and
56:37
you know, it, it, it, it, you know, and all the feel goods
56:39
that come with that. But if we don't think about the
56:43
human impact of what globalization brings, right, you
56:48
know, we can get ourselves into some some some issues right
56:51
around that disconnect. And and so it's a great book.
56:55
I would say, you know, it's been many years ago, but the concepts
56:58
and what Thomas Freeman was writing about, I think we're
56:59
actually very forward thinking. And you can see today where, how
57:04
globalization has moved in the world, right in these processes,
57:07
economically, politically, that it, that it, that touch upon
57:10
these areas, right, of societies, education, right,
57:13
social experiences, how that's impacted for the better and,
57:17
and, and, and, and, and maybe for the worse in some
57:19
situations, right? And, and so I think as a global
57:23
citizen, right, you want to, you want to re literature that,
57:26
that, that that challenges, right?
57:28
Some of these perspectives you may have, right?
57:30
And then we may have it and just gives you another way of looking
57:32
at this concept. Another book would be the solo
57:35
politics by Jim Wallace. Recommend that as well.
57:39
OK, Solo. Politics.
57:40
Solo politics. By Jim Wallace, 1994.
57:42
But OK, still very relevant books.
57:45
There's many, many, but this is, if you ask me, ones that I've
57:48
actually have been engaged. Yeah, it really great, great,
57:52
great stuff. All right.
57:54
Thank you so much, Julian, for those two recommendations.
57:57
And yeah, and, and also like, yet again, thank you so much for
58:01
taking this this time to to Share your story, to share your
58:04
insights along your, your career and, you know, just continuing
58:09
to do the human work. I find in the the times that
58:12
we're living in feels more and more under, under strain, like
58:18
this pressure of what does it even mean, right, to be human in
58:22
a, you know, when the dominant conversation is around, you
58:25
know, increased globalization, mechanization and AI and like
58:30
the encroachment of like technology on like, you know,
58:33
all of these different facets of, of, of our lives.
58:36
And and yeah, I I find myself grappling with these questions,
58:40
but it makes me feel so much better knowing that there are
58:44
people like you out there doing the work who are continuing to
58:48
shine their bright light on others, being that model for
58:53
others to really emulate, like take notice and emulate
58:56
themselves. And I just have a lot of
58:59
appreciation for you, Julian. So thank you.
59:01
And want to give you the last word.
59:02
Just, you know, any final send off as we wrap up our
59:05
conversation first. Of all, thank you, Scott for
59:08
providing this time in in our friendship that which expands,
59:12
you know, many, many years now and seeing you grow from a
59:15
student to where you're at today and your your your adult life is
59:18
just awesome. Continue to create the value
59:20
that you're creating right. You're creating spaces where
59:23
this conversation for global citizenship and other relevant
59:26
topics can can can happen right. You keep it present, you keep it
59:30
moving. And and so like you, I, I, you
59:32
inspire me as well, because you give me hope that I know that
59:36
that the, the generations coming through, right, are, are really
59:39
going to, you know, be, be value contributors to the world and,
59:42
and, and try to right make things meaningful.
59:46
And, and you know that that contributes generally
59:49
contributes to the betterment of the world, right, in whatever
59:52
way you care about. And so thank you so much for
59:55
being you, just being authentic, man.
59:57
I know, I know you. And then I could say this
1:00:00
because you, you emanate that as well.
1:00:02
And so thank you for just being the great human being that you
1:00:05
are. And I'm grateful for our
1:00:07
friends, Joe. Music.