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The Most Powerful Leaders Make People Feel Seen · Commander's Intent

0:01
SPEAKER_00: Have you ever frozen in the key moment of making a critical decision?
0:06
SPEAKER_00: Whether it's in business or in life, it can cost you everything.
0:09
SPEAKER_00: Commander's Intent will teach and inspire you how to lead with clarity, courage, and purpose.
0:15
SPEAKER_00: So here's your host, retired Air Force Colonel, fighter pilot, and your leadership mentor, Derek Oak.
0:25
SPEAKER_02: Hello and welcome back to another episode of Commander's Intent.
0:28
SPEAKER_02: I'm happy to be here.
0:30
SPEAKER_02: I'm here with my good friend, Julie de Jesus.
0:32
SPEAKER_02: She is the founder and owner of I See You Living.
0:36
SPEAKER_02: She is a keynote speaker, a consultant, and a mentor to many.
0:42
SPEAKER_02: And I'm going to turn it over to her so she can explain exactly what I see you living is and how she got to that moniker or why it became so important to her so that she had to talk about it and share that idea with others.
0:54
SPEAKER_02: Go ahead, Joey.
0:55
SPEAKER_01: Thanks, Derek.
0:55
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I mean, to be frank, it really started with me having a mental breakdown at work when I was in my 20s and under some pretty toxic leadership and having another leader step in and not just save my life, but change it in the way that she mentored me.
1:10
SPEAKER_01: It really lit a fire in me to share not just my story, but stories of other people who felt seen often in their greatest challenges.
1:20
SPEAKER_01: And that led to my book contract ICU, which then led to as my kids got into school, I'm a mother, I was able to keynote more and more out of the house.
1:30
SPEAKER_01: And I love people.
1:31
SPEAKER_01: I love speaking to people.
1:32
SPEAKER_01: I love helping people the way that I was helped.
1:34
SPEAKER_01: And that led to me doing more and more speaking and beginning to do consulting, and which has now also led to, yeah, starting a company called ICU Living, where I still speak and I still consult, but I also now run events and I've had groups all about helping infuse human connection into our culture at large, which I think our mental health is really struggling at work and in daily life as we are feeling less seen and having less human connection.
2:05
SPEAKER_01: And it did wonders for my mental health.
2:07
SPEAKER_01: It still does.
2:08
SPEAKER_01: It's still a really important part of my life to make sure I'm getting my daily human connection in.
2:13
SPEAKER_01: And that is a mission that I will die with forever.
2:17
SPEAKER_01: How's that for an intro?
2:19
SPEAKER_02: I love that.
2:20
SPEAKER_02: So I want you to explain what it means to be seen and what it means to see somebody.
2:26
SPEAKER_01: Well, in my keynote, the connected leader, when I keynote and do workshops about this with companies and associations, we really break it down to three pillars, which as I researched, I come to look at the research of others and do my own.
2:40
SPEAKER_01: Really comes down to three things, which is I see you, I appreciate you, and I trust you that people are looking for, especially at work.
2:47
SPEAKER_01: And if we want to retain employees, I think back in the day, salary is still important and especially in our economy, but I think it was a much bigger deciding factor than it is now, with how much people's mental health has struggled, with how much virtual work we're doing, which, you know, we used to have conversations.
3:06
SPEAKER_01: There used to be so much human, more human connection in the work field just based on water cooler talk and different things like that.
3:13
SPEAKER_01: Just we were in the space together more.
3:16
SPEAKER_01: And as that's become less and less, as we've come more efficient and as AI has really taken, there's good and bad from that, right?
3:22
SPEAKER_01: But it's definitely taken more of a role in the workplace.
3:25
SPEAKER_01: It's becoming more important that we're more intentional about making people feel seen.
3:30
SPEAKER_01: So I'm gonna just throw out a couple tools I don't want to overwhelm, but like I call you by your first name, right?
3:36
SPEAKER_01: I look at you in the eye when I speak to you, feeling appreciated.
3:40
SPEAKER_01: I highlight people at work that are doing things well.
3:42
SPEAKER_01: I highlight them for their strengths.
3:44
SPEAKER_01: There is so much research around what that does for the neural pathways in our brain, what appreciation does.
3:50
SPEAKER_01: If you look at like any major religion, philosophy, wellness plan, almost all of them teach some aspect of gratitude to help with our ability to not just function but thrive as human beings and work.
4:03
SPEAKER_01: And then I trust you.
4:05
SPEAKER_01: Trust is an interesting one that I love to speak to leaders about because it kind of flips it on its head, maybe differently than they're often used to talking about trust in the workplace, which I have really come to found in my research and my own life experiences in work that trust is a two-way street.
4:22
SPEAKER_01: And it has so much to do with not just being willing to show your people that you're willing to give, that they can rely on you and trust on you to help them, but on the flip side, to be willing to receive help from your people and the people you work with and the level that takes your work relationship to when people feel like you won't just, you know, as a leader, we so often feel the need to look the part, right?
4:47
SPEAKER_01: I think it can be really lonely at the top.
4:49
SPEAKER_01: Feel like you look polished, you know what you're doing.
4:52
SPEAKER_01: And what can come with that, unfortunately, sometimes is a fear of showing vulnerability or a fear of asking our people for help or being even sometimes open to their ideas to look like we have it all figured out.
5:04
SPEAKER_01: Like we were, you know, we were put in this position for a reason and we need to act the part.
5:08
SPEAKER_01: And it's been interesting as I've looked at different companies, I've done different research and talked to thousands of people across the US as I train, that so many people, the leaders that they will follow into battle anywhere are the leaders that are willing to ask for help, that are creating a space where it's safe to ask questions and to be more innovative and things like that.
5:31
SPEAKER_01: The people want to stay and they'll follow their leaders anywhere because they're willing to be human.
5:35
SPEAKER_01: And especially specifically that trust aspect of not only will I give you help because I'm the leader, but I need your help.
5:42
SPEAKER_01: I actually need you and I'm willing to show that.
5:44
SPEAKER_02: That's a great explanation because when you look at, and I talk quite a bit about trust also, when a leader asks their people to just do what they say, to do their work, those individuals are just an extension of them.
5:56
SPEAKER_02: But when you ask your people for their opinion, when you ask them for input, when you ask them for just overall ideas, when you actually come to them and say, Hey, I don't have the answer to this.
6:07
SPEAKER_02: Can you help me with that?
6:08
SPEAKER_02: All of a sudden they feel valuable and it becomes a trust thing.
6:11
SPEAKER_02: Well, he needs me or she needs me for the good of the team.
6:15
SPEAKER_02: And all of a sudden, you don't feel this level of insecurity in working with your boss because them accepting your ideas has validated you.
6:23
SPEAKER_02: I'll give you one example, working with a certain organization and I was the supervisor.
6:28
SPEAKER_02: If I spoke first, if I gave my thoughts first, then everybody shut up.
6:33
SPEAKER_02: And everybody's like, Well, the boss has spoken, so I'm gonna just keep my ideas to myself because I don't want to come across as either countering his ideas or thinking less of his ideas.
6:45
SPEAKER_02: So I'm just gonna keep my mouth shut and I'll just do what I'm told and execute.
6:49
SPEAKER_02: But if I would shut my mouth and ask for opinion and ask for ideas and not say anything until the end, I more than likely got better ideas.
6:58
SPEAKER_02: And then the more powerful part is if I implemented their ideas, if we said, okay, we're going with that, all of a sudden they feel validated.
7:05
SPEAKER_02: Like I said something that matters, and I said something that the team embraced and the boss embraced.
7:10
SPEAKER_02: And so they feel like I'm a valuable part of the team.
7:12
SPEAKER_02: So I really like that.
7:14
SPEAKER_01: It's interesting you bring that up.
7:15
SPEAKER_01: So true.
7:16
SPEAKER_01: One of the most fundamental things we need as human beings for mental health is to feel like we make impact.
7:24
SPEAKER_01: Like what we do changes something.
7:28
SPEAKER_01: And so you think about the difference of being treated like a number, like a body in a seat, right?
7:33
SPEAKER_01: Like, how many people can be a body in a seat to listen to you as the leader, give your ideas?
7:37
SPEAKER_01: Like anyone can do that, any robot can do that.
7:39
SPEAKER_01: But to feel like something I specifically said, I utilize my strengths is affecting some sort of change.
7:46
SPEAKER_01: Something is going to be different because I was here all of a sudden makes it about the individual that I actually have, something I bring to the table.
7:53
SPEAKER_01: My humanity makes a difference in some way.
7:57
SPEAKER_01: I mean, there's a reason why kids, I used to teach school long, long ago before I ever got into this profession.
8:03
SPEAKER_01: And with kids, it's like you're always told the teacher, and it's true, that kids would rather receive negative attention than no attention.
8:11
SPEAKER_01: Because there's this human need to feel like, hey, I'm here.
8:14
SPEAKER_01: Like, do you see me?
8:14
SPEAKER_01: Do you see?
8:15
SPEAKER_02: I'm making a difference, albeit negative.
8:17
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
8:17
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
8:18
SPEAKER_01: I've done the same thing.
8:20
SPEAKER_01: I've caught myself doing the same things in my marriage before, where I'm like, you know, like I, hey, hey, like here, like if you see me here for a second, right?
8:28
SPEAKER_01: Like when we feel like, for whatever reason, we feel like, I don't know, I think maybe feeling ignored is one of the worst feelings in the world, even worse than doing something negative.
8:37
SPEAKER_01: I think people are so hungry to feel like they make a difference that they exist, especially in this day of AI and so much going virtual and becoming automated.
8:48
SPEAKER_01: And there are pros to that.
8:49
SPEAKER_01: I understand the financial reasoning behind why a lot of companies are doing that.
8:53
SPEAKER_01: I do think that needs to be super intentionally done, though, to make sure they're not cutting out more and more of the human connection aspect if they want to keep their employees, though.
9:04
SPEAKER_02: It made me think of a role that I was playing in a volunteer position in my church where I interviewed youth.
9:10
SPEAKER_02: We had about 50 youth, and I interviewed them all about twice a year.
9:14
SPEAKER_02: And before I learned this from my wife, before one of the youth would come in, I would sit and think about them and I would think, what do I really like about this week?
9:22
SPEAKER_02: What have they done that's made an impact on me?
9:24
SPEAKER_02: And it was amazing to me how when I said, I love how you interact with people this way, or I love when you talk this way, or I love how you volunteer or you never say no to things, or whatever is when I noticed something very specific about them, instead of saying, Your hair looks nice today, it was amazing how they would line up and they would completely change.
9:44
SPEAKER_02: And all of a sudden, they're more willing to talk to me.
9:47
SPEAKER_02: Instead of being forced to talk to the old man and think, ah, now I gotta talk to, you know, keep my feelings to myself, survive this five-minute interview, and then leave.
9:56
SPEAKER_02: They were more willing to talk to me.
9:57
SPEAKER_02: It became a conversation just because I had noticed one thing about them and I had shared that.
10:03
SPEAKER_02: I said I learned that from my wife because she has a special talent.
10:06
SPEAKER_02: We would be in the shopping center and she would compliment people on people, total strangers, but she would compliment them and she would compliment them in a way where they knew she was serious and they knew she was genuine about something that I don't know that I could ever get away with the way she complimented or what she would compliment sometimes.
10:21
SPEAKER_02: You would see people light up and you would see them become their my wife's instant advocate.
10:26
SPEAKER_02: You know, if it was like a store clerk and she would go up to them and compliment them and then start asking a question, all of a sudden that person would drop everything they were doing because they'd been seen and they felt that interaction.
10:36
SPEAKER_02: All of a sudden, they mattered to my wife.
10:39
SPEAKER_02: They may not have mattered to anyone else in this door, but they mattered to my wife at that particular instance.
10:43
SPEAKER_02: So I've done interviews as a supervisor for many, many years, but I've never really approached it that way until all of us and the light bulb went on.
10:50
SPEAKER_02: I may have the best mentor sitting next to me and I haven't been paying attention to it.
10:55
SPEAKER_02: So I love that.
10:57
SPEAKER_02: So I appreciate that.
10:58
SPEAKER_01: I always say, when you see me, I will follow you anywhere.
11:02
SPEAKER_01: That's just it.
11:03
SPEAKER_01: And that's exactly what your wife's doing, right?
11:05
SPEAKER_01: Like with the clerk, right?
11:06
SPEAKER_01: It's like, oh, you make me feel seen all of a sudden.
11:09
SPEAKER_01: You don't even have to ask.
11:10
SPEAKER_01: I am your advocate and I will follow you into battle.
11:12
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, interesting story.
11:14
SPEAKER_02: We were, I can't remember where it was.
11:16
SPEAKER_02: I think I was in the store, and I ran into a youth that had interacted with my wife, and I recognized the young woman, and I said something to her.
11:25
SPEAKER_02: I said hello to her, and she stops me and she said, Your wife loves me.
11:30
SPEAKER_02: And I thought, that's awesome.
11:32
SPEAKER_02: And so I went to my wife and I mentioned the girl's name.
11:36
SPEAKER_02: And my wife said, I don't remember who that is.
11:39
SPEAKER_02: And I thought it actually is more telling.
11:41
SPEAKER_02: That's just the way she treats people, and that's the way she interacts with people.
11:44
SPEAKER_02: That she she sees them, she wants to make them, you know, feel important and like they're loved.
11:50
SPEAKER_02: Like, gosh, if only more people knew how to do that.
11:52
SPEAKER_02: And so that girl was my wife's advocate, and she would do, I don't want to say anything, but she would do a lot more for my wife than she would for any other of the youth leaders.
12:02
SPEAKER_02: Like so she she taught me quite a bit with that.
12:04
SPEAKER_01: My husband, he was a teacher, and an area teacher a long time ago, and I've had the same thing where I run into parents uh and they said, Your husband what you know, like changed their life.
12:13
SPEAKER_01: He did it when I come home, and I'm so excited to tell the younger.
12:16
SPEAKER_01: He's like, Oh, what's their name?
12:18
SPEAKER_01: Again, I can you look up a picture?
12:19
SPEAKER_01: And it's it's just it's neat to be surrounded by people who live a connected lifestyle.
12:25
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
12:26
SPEAKER_02: My dad is very similar.
12:27
SPEAKER_02: I remember he retired from the Air Force in 1994.
12:31
SPEAKER_02: And I met, you know, I was in the Air Force at the time, and I met people who worked for him.
12:35
SPEAKER_02: He's a four-star general, he retired, and I met people who worked for him over the course of really the rest of my career.
12:42
SPEAKER_02: And almost every one of them would say, Your dad stopped me at this event.
12:47
SPEAKER_02: I was a lowly airman, I'm nobody, and your dad took the time to talk to me.
12:52
SPEAKER_02: And I thought, so that that individual was dramatically impacted by my dad.
12:57
SPEAKER_02: And my dad doesn't remember every one of those interactions, but it's just his way of being.
13:01
SPEAKER_02: It's the way he interacts with people where that young airman all of a sudden was an advocate for my dad and was here in some cases 20 years later, was still shouting his praises because of one particular interaction at a gate guard shack or whatever it was.
13:17
SPEAKER_02: I just got an email recently where a guy said this person was an airman and he had made a mistake.
13:23
SPEAKER_02: It was in a like a travel office taking care of my dad's the big general.
13:26
SPEAKER_02: He comes through, and the airman had made a mistake and he had received a dressing down from his immediate supervisor.
13:32
SPEAKER_02: And my dad criticized his immediate supervisor, effectively saying, It's not a big deal, it's not worth getting angry about, it's not worth treating somebody like that about.
13:42
SPEAKER_02: And so here's this guy who 30 something years later, he got a hold of my email somehow, and he sends me an email saying, tell your dad thanks.
13:52
SPEAKER_01: It's a big deal, makes an impact, and you never know where things are gonna lead.
13:55
SPEAKER_01: But when we treat people well, yeah, it has a lasting impact for sure.
13:59
SPEAKER_02: So I got two important questions with that.
14:01
SPEAKER_02: We've kind of talked about how it feels.
14:03
SPEAKER_02: How does it change you as an individual when you feel seen, when you have a supervisor or somebody above you, even on your team, who makes you feel seen?
14:12
SPEAKER_02: How does it change your productivity?
14:15
SPEAKER_01: It changes everything.
14:16
SPEAKER_01: I mean, Simon Sinek has a really great story that I love to share.
14:20
SPEAKER_01: He talks about this coffee barista in Las Vegas.
14:23
SPEAKER_01: He was staying at the Four Seasons Hotel.
14:25
SPEAKER_01: And he talks about this coffee barista.
14:27
SPEAKER_01: He comes down, Simon comes downstairs to get a coffee and it's like maybe five bucks.
14:30
SPEAKER_01: And this barista is just, I mean, he's probably like a 16-year-old kid.
14:34
SPEAKER_01: At least that's how I remember the story.
14:35
SPEAKER_01: And he's just animated and outgoing.
14:37
SPEAKER_01: And he's asking Simon all these questions.
14:39
SPEAKER_01: And Simon says, Hey, do you like you're so awesome?
14:43
SPEAKER_01: He gives him 100% tip.
14:44
SPEAKER_01: So coffee's five bucks, he gives him five bucks.
14:47
SPEAKER_01: And he asked the kid, he says, Do you like your job?
14:50
SPEAKER_01: And the kid said, Yeah, I love my job.
14:52
SPEAKER_01: And Simon's like, I mean, not to be offensive, but like, why?
14:57
SPEAKER_01: And the kid said, he stopped and he thought about it.
15:00
SPEAKER_01: And he said, You know what?
15:02
SPEAKER_01: When I come to work every day, my manager asks me how I'm doing.
15:06
SPEAKER_01: And then he stopped and he thought longer.
15:07
SPEAKER_01: And he said, Now that I think of it, when I come to work every day, anytime I see any manager in this hotel, they stop me and they asked me how I'm doing.
15:16
SPEAKER_01: He said, What's interesting is I actually work down the strip at the Caesars Palace as well with the exact same job.
15:22
SPEAKER_01: I'm a coffee barista there as well.
15:24
SPEAKER_01: He said, and I hate my job.
15:26
SPEAKER_01: He said, I clock in, I clock out, I keep my head down.
15:29
SPEAKER_01: And he said, I always feel like my manager is checking up on me to see if I'm making trouble and get me in trouble.
15:36
SPEAKER_01: And what's interesting, I'll kind of surmise what Simon Sinek says about this, but he says, if you were to pull and get an employee feedback report from each of his supervisors, these would look like very different employees, the way that they interact with customers and others.
15:49
SPEAKER_01: But it's the same kid.
15:51
SPEAKER_01: And so you see right there, when you ask Derek, how does it impact your productivity and the way you work?
15:56
SPEAKER_01: I mean, it changes everything.
15:58
SPEAKER_01: Because when you are when you feel valued, when you feel seen, when you feel appreciated, when you feel trusted, you show up completely different in all aspects of your life.
16:06
SPEAKER_01: This affects everything.
16:07
SPEAKER_01: But at work, you're gonna work harder, you're gonna be happy to stay longer because it's becoming it's becoming more than a job for you.
16:15
SPEAKER_01: It's becoming a mission.
16:16
SPEAKER_01: You're seeing that your influence makes an impact for the better.
16:20
SPEAKER_01: And when you see me, I'll follow you.
16:22
SPEAKER_01: So we talk about what it feels like to feel seen, but we talk about what it feels like to feel appreciated.
16:27
SPEAKER_01: Gratitude begets momentum.
16:29
SPEAKER_01: When I love that.
16:30
SPEAKER_01: Good.
16:30
SPEAKER_01: It's in my keynote.
16:32
SPEAKER_01: You said gratitude.
16:33
SPEAKER_01: That's what we talk about for appreciation.
16:35
SPEAKER_01: Gratitude begets momentum.
16:36
SPEAKER_01: You can look at so many catastrophic things that have happened in the world and the way that gratitude played such a vital role in the healing of our nation or different countries in being able to come back together to unify, to be productive, to do what needed to be done in really challenging circumstances.
16:54
SPEAKER_01: So you think if we can do that when there's you're a former fighter pilot, you know about this.
16:59
SPEAKER_01: And we can do this in war zones and when people are sending husbands and sons off to war, not knowing to come back.
17:05
SPEAKER_01: If gratitude can heal there, think about what it can do in a workplace when you're hoping to get your employees to feel motivated when they feel appreciated.
17:13
SPEAKER_01: It's truly gratitude.
17:14
SPEAKER_01: Like you can look up the science, find it, it heals the brain.
17:18
SPEAKER_01: And then you look at trust, giving and receiving is what builds trust.
17:23
SPEAKER_01: If you really want to build trust with people, you will learn to give and you will learn to receive.
17:28
SPEAKER_01: And those people, it changes everything.
17:31
SPEAKER_01: I think there's study that can you can all look up that I do not have off the top of my time because I haven't talked to in a while.
17:37
SPEAKER_01: There's a study that shows that 75% of work people, when they were asked, they said the most stressful part of their job is their relationship with their direct boss.
17:48
SPEAKER_01: So people aren't when they're leaving a job, they're not leaving a job, they're leaving a person and the way that person made them feel.
17:57
SPEAKER_02: It's really a shame.
17:58
SPEAKER_02: Now, I'll give you an example and then I had that point.
18:00
SPEAKER_02: We had a young Afghan girl living with us.
18:02
SPEAKER_02: So she moves to the United States and she lived a terrible life in Afghanistan.
18:07
SPEAKER_02: And she really had her entire life had been spent in fight or flight.
18:12
SPEAKER_02: She was fighting for survival, whether it was abuse from her parents, abuse from those around her, the racist name-calling in Afghanistan, because suppose I guess she's a darker skinned Afghani, and how she was treated by her co-workers across the board.
18:27
SPEAKER_02: And in living in constant fear of rape and abuse and on and on and on, she said she never walked to work without worrying about whether or not she was going to make it to work.
18:36
SPEAKER_02: Never.
18:37
SPEAKER_02: And she was walking to work at three, four in the morning or something like that for her shift.
18:40
SPEAKER_02: Like, what it would be like to live like that.
18:43
SPEAKER_02: And then she comes to the United States, the land of bounty and plenty, and and her first three jobs that she was always worried about by getting it fired tomorrow because of the kind of feedback she received and how she was treated.
18:57
SPEAKER_02: She was treated as an asset instead of as a person.
19:01
SPEAKER_02: She had a good job all three times.
19:02
SPEAKER_02: They'd given her good opportunities on paper, but the way she was treated as an asset instead of a person, she was always worried.
19:10
SPEAKER_02: And it's what made her go look for another job because she thought even though she didn't realize that higher ups in her last job actually really loved her and she was doing a great job, she left because her immediate supervisor was so dismissive of her and condescending and made her feel like she was constantly threatened.
19:25
SPEAKER_02: So she went and found another job.
19:26
SPEAKER_02: And you know what?
19:27
SPEAKER_02: She goes for this new job.
19:28
SPEAKER_02: And every day I talk to her and I say, How has worked to you?
19:31
SPEAKER_02: She goes, fantastic with her funny accent, fantastic the way she says it.
19:35
SPEAKER_02: But she loves her job and she loves what she's doing.
19:39
SPEAKER_02: She's doing the exact same tasks that she was doing before.
19:42
SPEAKER_02: And the pay isn't that dramatically different than what it was before, but she feels seen and she feels appreciated and she feels like a team member instead of as an asset.
19:52
SPEAKER_01: It's amazing.
19:53
SPEAKER_01: It's a great example.
19:54
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
19:55
SPEAKER_02: So I'll show you two thoughts that you've kind of touched on.
19:58
SPEAKER_02: I want your thoughts on them.
19:59
SPEAKER_02: To me, the two biggest issues with mental health.
20:02
SPEAKER_02: I mean, there's a chemical and there's a uh you know a physiological element of mental health, but the two biggest detractors or uh challenges for mental health is do I have worth and am I secure where I am?
20:14
SPEAKER_02: And so if I if I feel like I'm valued where I am, and I feel like um I can relax where I am because I'm gonna be able to be here for a while.
20:24
SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna be where I want to be.
20:26
SPEAKER_02: Those are some two biggest things.
20:27
SPEAKER_02: Because if you're constantly worrying about your security, your safety, whether it's financial or otherwise, and if you're constantly wondering whether or not anybody cares you that you're there, that's a serious drain on your emotional well-being.
20:39
SPEAKER_02: I wanted you to comment on that.
20:40
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I don't know where to begin, but I was just thinking about I was thinking about the girl that stayed with you and the idea of security.
20:46
SPEAKER_01: And am I secure where I am?
20:48
SPEAKER_01: I think when you're secure where you are, there's a lot of things that change also in that you're gonna be more innovative and creative.
20:55
SPEAKER_01: You're also gonna be more willing to ask for help when you need it because you're secure.
21:00
SPEAKER_01: You're secure that I can show that I'm a human being that needs other people's input and I'm not gonna lose my job.
21:07
SPEAKER_01: Like that, this is an atmosphere, right?
21:09
SPEAKER_01: That's where that trust comes in.
21:10
SPEAKER_01: This is an atmosphere where it is seen as an asset to ask each other for help on things.
21:16
SPEAKER_01: Like that it is seen as, I mean, I think that's why Brene Brown talks so much about vulnerability, right?
21:20
SPEAKER_01: And why you can get the best from your people when you're willing to have vulnerability in your work culture of giving and receiving help, because then all of a sudden people don't feel like their jobs are on their line if they need something, which we all do as human beings.
21:33
SPEAKER_01: Like it's all just a facade that we don't.
21:35
SPEAKER_01: That's not reality.
21:36
SPEAKER_01: Greatest leaders in the world still need people.
21:39
SPEAKER_01: They're still hardwired to meet others.
21:41
SPEAKER_01: And so being open to that as a leader can be life changing for your employees.
21:45
SPEAKER_01: And I really believe and have seen the study show that you get the best out of your people when they feel seen, when they feel appreciated, when they feel trusted.
21:54
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like you said, like am I worth and am I secure?
21:58
SPEAKER_01: Like, do I matter?
22:00
SPEAKER_01: And am I safe?
22:01
SPEAKER_01: Those are, I mean, biologically, that's what we all need.
22:05
SPEAKER_01: And when we don't feel that, when we question our worth and we question whether we're safe, you talked about it, fight or flight.
22:11
SPEAKER_01: And that's not where you're going to get your best from your people is if they feel like they're in fight or flight all the time.
22:15
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
22:16
SPEAKER_02: And what people start doing is number one, they're not thinking as innovatively.
22:20
SPEAKER_02: And number two, they're hiding things.
22:22
SPEAKER_02: They don't want the honest debrief because they're afraid that the honest debrief is going to take them out of the game.
22:27
SPEAKER_02: When the last time I was deployed to Afghanistan, I was a fighter squadron commander.
22:30
SPEAKER_02: And every week we would have a pilot meeting where we'd all sit down and kind of talk about what was going on, the different missions that we had flow flown and the things that we had seen.
22:39
SPEAKER_02: And I always started the meeting by talking about a mistake that I had made, by talking about something that I had done that I wasn't happy with.
22:47
SPEAKER_02: And I found that by me talking first and by me sharing, and a fighter squadron, the community is very feedback-oriented and very you take people's criticism, reject the focus, and that's very beneficial.
23:01
SPEAKER_02: But sometimes, especially when guys would get to the top, all of a sudden they didn't need feedback because they were the boss and they knew how to get there.
23:08
SPEAKER_02: So clearly they were the best.
23:10
SPEAKER_02: And I found as I became the boss that that wasn't true.
23:13
SPEAKER_02: I still sucked at some things.
23:15
SPEAKER_02: And I needed, and so by sharing that, other people talked about they were more comfortable with talking about their own mistakes and talking about their own lesson learned.
23:24
SPEAKER_02: So we as a group got better about it.
23:27
SPEAKER_02: And it I don't know if that was my intention, but that was the result of me sharing my mistake during that week.
23:33
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's incredible.
23:35
SPEAKER_01: It's incredible.
23:36
SPEAKER_01: There's a lot of interesting stories out there with some of the most successful leaders about learning or implementing some idea of talking about failure, of talking about times when they failed.
23:47
SPEAKER_01: There's a really famous story, the owner and the creator of Spanx, where she talks about growing up that every night her dad would ask, What did you do that how did you fail today?
23:57
SPEAKER_01: How'd you fail today?
23:58
SPEAKER_01: So I found myself trying to remind myself to ask my kids that, like, yeah, awesome things.
24:03
SPEAKER_01: But it's like, so what'd you try today that you fell on your face on?
24:06
SPEAKER_01: And then I share mine.
24:08
SPEAKER_01: It's like literally last night, and it's kind of become a joke.
24:10
SPEAKER_01: I don't know if it's good or not.
24:12
SPEAKER_01: We'll see when they're older, if this was a good thing.
24:14
SPEAKER_01: But last night I make these energy like protein balls with my daughter that we all love as like protein powder and chocolate chips and honey and coconut and the really healthy and just like girthy when you need a hit.
24:25
SPEAKER_01: And I had taken the batter of it and I'd spread it on a cookie sheet and put it in the fridge.
24:30
SPEAKER_01: And I was gonna cut it up into like granola bars, just changed the shape of it.
24:33
SPEAKER_01: And last night I pulled it out and it was just crumbling everywhere.
24:36
SPEAKER_01: My daughter just looked and my kids were laughing.
24:38
SPEAKER_01: My kid daughters looked at me, she said, That's what you failed at today, mom.
24:41
SPEAKER_01: Today you failed it making those into granola bars.
24:45
SPEAKER_01: I was like, I did, and I learned something, didn't I?
24:47
SPEAKER_01: And I was like, yeah, and I was like, and I will go back into I will go back to making them into just the protein balls, likely like I will not be doing.
24:53
SPEAKER_01: I said, or maybe I need to freeze it.
24:55
SPEAKER_01: Maybe the fridge wasn't maybe if I froze it, we could do that.
24:58
SPEAKER_01: And she's like, I don't know, mom, but that's what you failed at today.
25:00
SPEAKER_01: And I kind of love that my nine-year-old says that.
25:02
SPEAKER_01: And we're kind of giggly about it, but like, this is not life or death to have failure.
25:08
SPEAKER_01: That's the only way you grow.
25:10
SPEAKER_01: That's the only way you're successful, actually.
25:12
SPEAKER_01: That is the plan.
25:13
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
25:13
SPEAKER_02: And as a leader, you can't pile on.
25:15
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you're right.
25:15
SPEAKER_02: You failed at that.
25:16
SPEAKER_02: And how could you make that mistake?
25:18
SPEAKER_02: It has to be a learning environment for everybody.
25:20
SPEAKER_02: Okay, you failed.
25:21
SPEAKER_02: What did you learn from it?
25:22
SPEAKER_02: And how did you grow?
25:23
SPEAKER_02: And that's part of seeing somebody.
25:25
SPEAKER_02: That's part of valuing where they are, is valuing their process of getting better at whatever it is they're doing.
25:31
SPEAKER_01: And as simple as it sounds, a hint of humor does not hurt.
25:34
SPEAKER_01: No.
25:34
SPEAKER_01: Being able to laugh at our mistakes, it's a big deal.
25:37
SPEAKER_02: You know, I've actually had people tell me that I'm a little too self-deprecating and making fun of myself or making fun of my lack of abilities.
25:45
SPEAKER_02: He says, You don't sound like you're confident and authoritative when you're that way.
25:49
SPEAKER_02: I'm like, you know what?
25:50
SPEAKER_02: I'm okay with that.
25:51
SPEAKER_02: Because it actually, it's a constant reminder to me that I'm not all there and that I'm not all that.
25:57
SPEAKER_02: I don't have every single answer.
25:58
SPEAKER_02: If I'm making fun of my own mistakes, then I'm paying attention to my mistakes.
26:03
SPEAKER_02: Not so I can dwell on them and beat myself up.
26:05
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I can say, okay, that didn't work.
26:07
SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna move and in a different direction or make a minor modification to it.
26:12
SPEAKER_02: And it's been very beneficial for me.
26:15
SPEAKER_02: And it allows me to laugh instead of getting worked up and tied into a knot about how much of an idiot I am or how the mistakes I make because I can't ignore them, by laughing a little bit about it and being open about it, it allows me to kind of not brush it off, but to put it in perspective.
26:32
SPEAKER_02: And that one little failure, that one mistake is not me indicating me as a failure.
26:37
SPEAKER_02: It's just me, I made a mistake and I've got plenty of opportunities.
26:40
SPEAKER_01: It makes you relatable.
26:42
SPEAKER_01: When I first started working with you and I started doing consulting with you on your speaking, like looking at on paper everything you've accomplished, like I could have been very intimidated.
26:52
SPEAKER_01: And I am really honored to know you and amazed at all you've done.
26:56
SPEAKER_01: And also you're incredibly relatable that I've never felt I felt like you're someone I would follow, not someone that I would be scared to work with.
27:04
SPEAKER_01: And I think we can do both.
27:05
SPEAKER_01: I think we can be valued and show our strengths and be relatable to other human beings because we're all human beings.
27:13
SPEAKER_02: We can wrap now because I got you to give me that great compliment so we can end the show.
27:17
SPEAKER_01: You're welcome.
27:20
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
27:21
SPEAKER_02: Yes, you deserve it.
27:22
SPEAKER_02: I appreciate that.
27:23
SPEAKER_02: Anything, any parting shot that you want to talk about for I see you and the difference it's made in your life and the difference it has made in people that you've worked with.
27:32
unknown: Yes.
27:33
SPEAKER_02: Any story you want to share?
27:34
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
27:35
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
27:35
SPEAKER_02: Go ahead.
27:36
SPEAKER_01: I want to just share my thesis statement, whatever I want to call it.
27:39
SPEAKER_01: It's this.
27:39
SPEAKER_01: So after COVID, there was a ton of research done on mental health and employees.
27:44
SPEAKER_01: And COVID, I mean, we could go into that, but it did a number on people's mental health, is the is kind of the motto of that.
27:50
SPEAKER_01: There's a lot of things that happened post-COVID that are still impacting people today.
27:54
SPEAKER_01: They did research though and asked employees if they felt like COVID had impacted their mental health.
28:00
SPEAKER_01: 73% said it they felt like COVID severely impacted their mental health.
28:04
SPEAKER_01: 53% reported struggling with depression, 52% with anxiety, 32% with PTSD.
28:10
SPEAKER_01: So there is, if people are wondering, if they're listening or watching what's going on in their workplace and they're feeling like, I feel like things changed.
28:18
SPEAKER_01: It did.
28:19
SPEAKER_01: It really did.
28:19
SPEAKER_01: Like it's a real thing and it's still today.
28:21
SPEAKER_01: And it can leave leaders, especially, I think, as I've talked to them across the US, it can leave them feeling and wondering, is this my business?
28:29
SPEAKER_01: I mean, what do like mental health?
28:31
SPEAKER_01: That's not, you know, as a leader, it's like other people's mental health.
28:33
SPEAKER_01: Like, that's not what we do in business.
28:34
SPEAKER_01: That's not how we maybe we're formally trained.
28:37
SPEAKER_01: And I think if you look at some other research that's been done by Stanford Medical, they show what actually lowers those statistics.
28:47
SPEAKER_01: How do we help people in our workplace be less depressed, be less anxious, be less triggered?
28:53
SPEAKER_01: And you could spin all day whether or not that's your responsibility.
28:56
SPEAKER_01: I think it's we're looking at it the wrong way, which we're wondering if people's happiness is our responsibility.
29:01
SPEAKER_01: And to that, I say absolutely not.
29:03
SPEAKER_01: There are days in our lives I don't think we're meant to feel happy.
29:06
SPEAKER_01: You, I know you've gone through loss.
29:08
SPEAKER_01: I've gone through loss.
29:09
SPEAKER_01: There are days when I have not been very happy and I don't think anything was going wrong.
29:12
SPEAKER_01: That's just part of the human experience.
29:14
SPEAKER_01: However, if we want to impact people's mental health for the better in the workplace, we do, I believe, have a responsibility as humans and especially as leaders in a place of influence to help.
29:25
SPEAKER_01: And that is why I will say what stand for medical backstap, that human connection, social connection is what improves those things.
29:32
SPEAKER_01: And that's why I always say happiness isn't your business, connection is.
29:36
SPEAKER_01: And that is what I speak about.
29:37
SPEAKER_01: That's what I have a passion for.
29:39
SPEAKER_01: And all of that is at IC Living for speaking specifically.
29:43
SPEAKER_01: You'll take a shortcut to everything I do with speaking at icliving.com/slash speaking.
29:50
SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
29:50
SPEAKER_02: And Julia, I really appreciate you being on the show with me.
29:53
SPEAKER_02: I've enjoyed this conversation.
29:54
SPEAKER_02: I think you and I are very much synced up in how we view interacting with people.
30:00
SPEAKER_02: I would call you the expert on it.
30:02
SPEAKER_02: And so I appreciate I appreciate that that interaction.
30:05
SPEAKER_02: And we'll have to do this again.
30:06
unknown: Absolutely.
30:07
SPEAKER_02: If you have any questions, if you want to follow up with Julie or follow up directly with me, then go ahead and drop me a line at askdericnow.com and we'll have a further conversation.
30:17
SPEAKER_02: If you haven't subscribed already, please subscribe and we'll talk to you next time.
30:21
SPEAKER_02: Thanks.
30:25
SPEAKER_00: So that's it for today's episode of Commander's Intend Podcast.
30:29
SPEAKER_00: Head on over to Apple Podcasts iTunes or wherever you listen and subscribe to the show.
30:34
SPEAKER_00: One lucky listener every single week that posts a review on Apple Podcasts or iTunes will be entered in a grand prize drawing to win a$25,000 private, exclusive leadership coaching package with Derek Oaks himself.
30:48
SPEAKER_00: So head on over to Commanders Inten Podcast.com and pick up a free copy of Derek's Leadership Guide and join us on the next episode.