Latest / The Resting Stitch Face Podcast / The Invisible Scoreboard & Why Comparing Yourself to Others Could Be Holding You Back
Transcript
- Erin Sheffield: Welcome back to another episode of the Resting Stitch Face podcast. I'm your co-host, Dr. Aaron Sheffield, with Sarah Harding: Dr. Sarah Harding. Hello, welcome back. Erin Sheffield: Welcome back. Sarah Harding: So, Erin, I heard you had a little interview this morning, right? Erin Sheffield: Yes, I did. Sarah Harding: and it sounds like you didn't realize that you were a superwoman. You were some sort of business hero. Will you tell us about it? Erin Sheffield: Yes. I know. I was so surprised. I got this email yesterday from Kajabi. And Kajabi is the platform that I host my website and my sales page for the retreat. I run my coaching program through there, my email list. So it's basically the platform that helps me run my business for the doctor is all in. And I got this email from One of the head people at Kajabi saying, you know, we've looked at all the data and you are one of our, you know, big success stories using Kajabi for your business. And so we'd love to talk to you and just kind of get your story and find out what's been working and what hasn't, and see if we can, you know, help our other customers by talking to you. And then they tried to schedule and it was like Kajabi successful heroes. Sarah Harding: I love it. Erin Sheffield: It's like hero, me? But I don't know, it kind of made my day because I just feel like this flailing business owner, if I even feel comfortable using that term. Like that feels big, you know. I just feel like it's Sarah Harding: Yes. Erin Sheffield: like if I call it my side gig, then there's not like the Sarah Harding: Right. Erin Sheffield: accountability of it doing well or anything. And have I made a dollar in this venture in the last two years? No. You know, I keep pouring Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: everything back into the experiences that I'm building and the foundation I'm laying hopefully the future. So one day maybe I hope to make a little bit of money, but I just I thought I was doing I thought I was terrible. I thought I was doing it wrong. And so it was funny that they were like, Wow, way to go. We just wanna interview you so we could share how how awesome and inspiring you are. Sarah Harding: I love it. Well how did it go? Erin Sheffield: It was very casual. And they basically just wanted to know my story and kind of how things, what things in the market I've used and what I've kind of learned and using their platform. But I was finally like, well, can I ask a question before we end? Why did you choose me? And Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: they're like, Well, we're looking for new businesses using our platform in the last six to 18 months. And we went through all of our data and we chose a top. 280 people with the new business, like continuing to have month after month growth and sales. And so, it's like a multi billion dollar company. Sarah Harding: Right. Erin Sheffield: And so I just wow. I know there's like probably a hundred thousand users on there. So I don't know. I guess the numbers and the data don't lie, but I guess I've just been comparing myself to These imaginary metrics of what success looks like. You know, you always hear people online. Ever Sarah Harding: And that's the bigger question, right? Like Yeah. Erin Sheffield: everyone's doing their like million dollar launch, you know. So I'm thinking like, Sarah Harding: Right. Erin Sheffield: well, maybe one day I'll make some money and be successful. So it's just funny that I guess I'm successful Sarah Harding: Right. Erin Sheffield: and I never knew. Sarah Harding: Yeah. And it's very interesting. It poses the question, who are we actually comparing ourselves to? Is it like, is it something real? Is it something imagined? Is it something that has been sugarcoated or rosy glasses painted? Or, you know, how who are we comparing ourselves to? And I think w you and I were talking about this, and it's such an interesting thing because it can apply to so many aspects of our lives. Right. Erin Sheffield: Yeah, well, I've always looked at comparison as a bad thing. Like try not to compare yourself. But I think sometimes when you have nothing to compare to, you have no metric for success. You don't know where you land. And I keep thinking of this idea of like being in this Olympic swimming pool and swimming in a race, but everyone is swimming at a different time or in a different pool. And if you don't even know what the metric is you're trying to reach, how do you know? If you need to go faster, if you can slow down and pace yourself some more, you don't. And so sometimes maybe comparison is helpful in some ways. What do you think? Sarah Harding: Well, I think another comparison would be really interesting in this way, another analogy is if you think about it from the perspective of horse races, right? Because the horse has blinders on so that they can't see what's going on on either side of them because they don't want the Erin Sheffield: Yeah. Sarah Harding: horse to get distracted. And so, but the caveat with that is that they have a jockey that knows what's happening, right? And then can Erin Sheffield: Yeah. Sarah Harding: continue to lead and guide and turn and shift and and make moves. We don't have that, right? Sometimes we do and sometimes we don't. If you've got a great mentor that has a better outlook on what's going on in the bigger picture, then you do have a jockey that's helping you. but for the most part, I think we're all out here kind of with blinders on because the the things that are right in front of us, i.e. social media, really goes and shows us how we are not successful and how all of these other people are doing great things and bigger things and and and it can really either motivate you or demotivate you, right? And Erin Sheffield: Yeah. Sarah Harding: so I think having having that cheering squad around, having that mentor around, I think is incredibly important. I don't know. Erin Sheffield: Yeah. Well, and I think as I think on, I'm trying to distinguish between, well, is comparison good sometimes? Sarah Harding: Right. Erin Sheffield: Some of it I really appreciate the idea of competing with yourself. Sarah Harding: Mm-hmm. Erin Sheffield: But when you're competing with yourself, like if you know the world record, you know what to aim for. You know, like I think metrics are important. And so blindly striving for a goal where you don't know what's good or what's bad. That's hard. And I'm probably more the horse that's gonna run myself to death unnecessarily not knowing I was two laps ahead, you know. That's probably me, as opposed Sarah Harding: Yeah. Yeah. Erin Sheffield: to the person that just like assumes they're doing great and is not. That's more my personality, but maybe it's more being able to compare ourselves to calculable data or metrics and not so much to other people. Sarah Harding: Yeah. I have a funny story for you. Speaking of this and animal analogies, this summer we went to the Laramie Jubilee Days in Wyoming to visit my stepdaughter and her boyfriend, and they live in Laramie. And so then we went up and she signed up Rivers, my four year old, for mutton bustin. Do you know what that is? Erin Sheffield: Is that like the riding the lambs? Sarah Harding: Sure is. Yes, it's these little tiny tots. And they s they put a at the Jubilee Days, they put thankfully a helmet and a vest on them. and they put them on the sheep and they go pam and the sheep goes and they hold on. And my little guy, Rivers, was so excited. He was so excited. And he got out there and he got on the sheep and he rode the sheep and then he just fell off, you know? And then the little rodeo clown guy comes and gets him up and like, you know, all the stuff and they give him a little two dollar bill and a big old trophy. And so then at the end of it, he said, I said to him, Rivers, why did was it really hard to hold on? And he's like, No, it wasn't hard. And I was like, Well, why did you let go? And he said, Well, because I thought that I'd gone farther than everybody else. And I was like, That's some confidence, right? 'Cause you and I both are like, I just held on because you never know, you never know, like I'm probably behind. I'm probably in the Erin Sheffield: Right. You never know till that person in the maxim competition comes from behind and blows you out of the water in the last two minutes. Sarah Harding: Right. Yeah. Like, don't let your guard down. Don't let your guard down. Right. And so it was just a really funny just a totally in contrast to the way that you and I think a lot of times. It's like, okay. And he was perfectly happy with it. Erin Sheffield: I love that. I mean, that's really what what would probably be best, right? To have that internal light of just knowing I did enough. That was enough. I did well. Sarah Harding: Right. Yeah. Erin Sheffield: I did my bet. Maybe I didn't do my best, but it was good enough for the situation. Who cares? You know, but Sarah Harding: Yeah, yeah. Erin Sheffield: instead we're just constantly worried about if we're measuring up or if the person in the other pool is, you know, going faster than us. And I think sometimes we're comparing things that just really don't matter. Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: And as you think on it too, how do we even compare? Because there's not another Aaron Sheffield who lives the life that I live, you know? So Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: I remember talking to this big like social media influencer, and they were talking about, you know, they have million over a million followers and are doing all these things, and you just feel like, wow, how can how do they do that? And they talk like, well, I pay I post multiple, multiple times a day. And like, how do they do that? And they are getting all this visibility and these famous people seem to know them. And then you kind of hear the backstory of like, Well, yeah, they post four times a day because that's their job. They don't have a job as a mom or oral surgeon to be doing, you know, that's that's Sarah Harding: Right. Right. Yeah. Erin Sheffield: their job. And you spent literally millions of dollars on consultants and classes and ads and things like that to help you get where you are. Well, I I haven't treated my social media as a job yet. Sarah Harding: Right. Didn't Yeah. Erin Sheffield: And I haven't put in really any money on that. So Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: it's really easy to think, well, look at them and, you know, if only I could be like that. But am I willing to sacrifice those things to be that? Probably not. So we all have our different path and our different way to get there, but it's so easy As everyone says is to compare everyone's, you know, Photoshop perfect Sarah Harding: Right. Erin Sheffield: ten thousand dollar photo shoot pictures with your you know, funny one that your husband caught you in a bad candid photo. Sarah Harding: Right. Yeah. And I think it's really important for us to talk about this, especially because we're really we've achieved a lot. And but everybody around us has also achieved the same things. And so it feels like if I'm not doing it the best, then I've kind of failed. And so then when I get in that in my head that way, and then I talk to people, they're like, What are you talking about? You're a neural surgeon. Like Erin Sheffield: Yeah, exactly. We get so Sarah Harding: You're Erin Sheffield: used to just being one of many. Sarah Harding: Yeah. And the and it's like, well yeah, I know, but so is so many there's so many other ones too, you know. And it's it's like it's very interesting to me because it's really hard to get out of that mindset. It's really hard, you know, to think that I'm doing something that's big, right? Erin Sheffield: Yeah. Sarah Harding: because I'm doing it and so it can't be that big, 'cause me, you know? And so it's Erin Sheffield: Well, I felt like residency was a real kind of eye opener wake up call to me because to get to the point where you're in a competitive residency, you've been like the best of the best of the best so many times over. You know, it's like you're probably maybe you're the valedictorian of your high school and maybe you're even the valedictorian of your college. I I wasn't, by the way, but you know, like I know lots of people who were. Sarah Harding: Me neither. Erin Sheffield: And then you had to be the top of your dental school class. And so by the time you get to residency, these are like the creme de la creme, the top of the top, the 1% of the 1% type of thing. And then suddenly I wasn't like the shining star. I was just average. You know? Like, Sarah Harding: yeah. Yeah. Erin Sheffield: and every once in a while you get one shining star resident where everyone's like, Wow, they're the best resident we've had in 30 years, type of thing. But most of us were kind of just on par doing similarly. And that Felt weird to me. It felt uncomfortable. 'Cause I was used to always being like the one. There Sarah Harding: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Erin Sheffield: was a little bit of a identity crisis. Sarah Harding: Yeah, yeah. That is a really interesting point because I completely identify with that feeling. It's insane. Like it's just really it's really funny that you bring that up. I don't know. And it's in the same way when you're in those situations and somebody that's, you know, admirable or you know has a lot of clout or whatever, compliments you on something, all of a sudden. Even though you're doing the exact same thing today that you were doing yesterday, all of a sudden you're like, okay, I'm doing great. I'm doing great. Erin Sheffield: Yeah. Sarah Harding: I'm I'm I'm really good at this, right? And it's so interesting how that feeling can be either discounted or perpetuated, right? Yeah. Erin Sheffield: Yeah. Well, and then there's other people I think who are maybe a little less self-aware where they seem to think I'm the man, I'm the best of the best. Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: And maybe they're not. And I don't like what breeds that I'm definitely more the surprise, like, really? You think so? Someone Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: gives me a compliment. Really? You're impressed by me? Why? Tell me why you're impressed by me. What do you mean I'm a successful Kajabi hero? What does that mean? Why would you say that? You Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: probably just drew my name out of the hat, right? That wasn't like a real wait, that's like based on numbers and data. What are you talking about? You know? I I Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: I'm kind of suspicious of the compliments or just seems like they're being nice. And it's hard for me to believe when there's other people that they definitely believe it, even if it's not true. Sarah Harding: Yeah. But at the end of the day, I think this is something that I've really been it's been on the forefront of my mind the last week or so is that when I am feeling confident and exuding confidence, that manifests it around me as well. It's very interesting. And I've really noticed it when I have that feeling. It snowballs and it really like continues under its own momentum. And so in that way, maybe that's why these people have that, because it really does follow you. Erin Sheffield: Yeah. Sarah Harding: and so, you know, the whole visualizing it in your mind before you do it, all of that stuff I think is is very real. and has a lot of impact. And I think that we could really use that, and especially as women, because I think in this field. or similar fields where it's mostly male dominated, I think that we have to have that deep internal one North Star, but also that that our own momentum that carries us through because we we all have something to offer, right? I don't know. I just think it's it's just been such an interesting thought experiment that I've been having this last week because I'm like, how can I keep this feeling going? Cause so often I lose that and it's and it's hard. Erin Sheffield: How do you think we harness that energy and that feeling? Sarah Harding: To be honest, I think the best way to harness it for me is to surround myself by with people who will continue to build me up and to give me that feeling. Sadly, I wish that I could generate it internally more. But I think that I think what gave it to me this last time was just being around all of the guys from residency. and and really feeling like I was doing something good and something different and something big and something worthwhile. And f feeling the mutual respect between us. That's what really generated it for me and it you know, has carried through. So I wish that I could generate it internally, but I can't. Erin Sheffield: Well, it's easy to be like, Well, I'm not working very often as an oral surgeon and they're like, But you're an avocado farmer and you have a podcast and those are really cool and we're all impressed by that. But since that's like your normal mundane life, you're like, Yeah, but it's nothing, you know. Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: So it is nice to sometimes get that outside perspective where we can't accurately see ourselves for, you know, the good that we do in the world. There's It's hard to assess. And I think our brains, they latch onto the negative so often. I think that's a protective thing. Like I need to notice the saber-tooth tig tiger trying to come get me, not the big basket of berries I just picked. But Sarah Harding: Yeah. Yeah. Erin Sheffield: it's hard. It's definitely hard. And I think, you know, the imposter syndrome thing comes in strong. And so it's hard to recognize. Like, I'm really doing great. When you feel like I just really hope no one figures out that I'm Someone who doesn't deserve to be here. Sarah Harding: Yeah. Or I'm just here because luck. It just was the right place at the right time, you know. I Erin Sheffield: Mm it was yeah, exactly. Sarah Harding: talked to the right person at the right time or whatever it is, you know. I just think that we discount so often ourselves. Erin Sheffield: I have a friend online named Alejandra and she talks a lot on her social media platform about developing an alter ego. And I think that's such a interesting idea, but she talks about a lot like Zendaya, you know, she's so famous and so beautiful and everyone's really excited about her right now. She's having a moment and we're all looking at her, being impressed, and yet she says She's really shy and doesn't like to be in the public eye and things like that. And you're like, but look at her. She's so fierce. She's so confident in front of the cameras. And so she talks about taking on this alter ego of using maybe your clothes or some kind of maybe just a visual what's the word I'm looking for? Reminder of just this person you're trying to be. And then harness that. And so, you know. I guess is kind of the Beyonce Sasha Fierce thing, you know. When you can think about yourself as a different person, your brain actually like clicks into that really well. And it's a lot easier to be I'm podcast erin, not dirty scrub mom, Erin, or whatever it needs to be, you know, to take that on and to have Sarah Harding: Yeah. Yeah. Erin Sheffield: the practice too. Cause I think the brain plasticity idea is so fascinating that you can literally change the structure, the anatomy, the physiology of your brain just through your thoughts. But you have to Do it enough that it creates a pattern in your brain. And so we can like literally train our brains to be that fierce person, to be that confident person, to be that person that feels that way. But we might need virtual cues. That's what I was looking for before. To kind of Sarah Harding: yes. Yeah. Erin Sheffield: remind ourselves or to put ourselves into that mode and to stop like overly personalizing the anxiety or the fear that we're having in the moment. Sarah Harding: Yeah. Yeah. That's a really interesting idea. I have a hard time with that because I feel like one thing that I've never been good at was like growing up I was never good at pretend play. I was never good at costumes. Erin Sheffield: I wasn't either. Sarah Harding: I've never and so that's it's hard because it feels inauthentic to me. And so it's like if I can't be that, then I can't pretend to be that, you know. Erin Sheffield: I remember being very worried because back then at least it was always, you have an imagination and let's use it. And I remember saying out loud, I don't have an imagination and feeling even then like there's something wrong with me. So even Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: then I was comparing myself for my lack of imagination, which is so important. Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: So maybe that takes practice too. Sarah Harding: Yeah. Yeah. Erin Sheffield: So are there any areas in your life that you're kind of instinctively assuming that you're behind, or if you're honest with yourself, maybe you aren't? I mean, we've kind of alluded to that already, maybe, but Sarah Harding: Everything. Right. Because even though you've achieved all this, you're like, hmm. I don't feel like I've really achieved all this. It doesn't feel Erin Sheffield: Yeah. Sarah Harding: like it. You know, I thought the the feeling of achievement would be so much stronger, and it's not. So maybe I haven't really achieved it. You know, it's maybe Erin Sheffield: Yeah, I think that achievement fallacy is so powerful. We just keep thinking, Sarah Harding: Mm-hmm. Erin Sheffield: once I get there, it's gonna feel good. And then we've gotten so many places and we just well, there's something else to go for now, I guess. It kind of reminds me of like billionaires. They talk about billionaires being so much money we can't even comprehend it. And if you divide it among people or something, you'd be like blown away by how much money every citizen in the world would have, type of thing. You know, so you're in these Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: comparisons trying to tell you. And yet there are people who are billionaires. And I think of maybe Mark Cuban as an example. Like, Mark Cuban, why are you on Shark Tank trying to make more money? You have billion dollars. Why do you need more? What Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: but when you're that personality that has made you that successful, you don't just turn it off. That's who you are. So I Sarah Harding: Right. Yeah. Erin Sheffield: understand why he keeps going, but I kind of feel Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: like if I had a billion dollars. Maybe I go on Shark Take and give everyone money just 'cause it'd be fun to see where they go with it. But he's always like, Mm, I can't take that on. It's not it's not worth my money and time. Sarah Harding: Yeah. You know, it's so interesting because I look at it in a totally different frame of reference. I look at it as the from the perspective of if he just didn't do that, then we would not gain insight into how his business mind has worked and gotten him to this per to this point. And the Erin Sheffield: Yeah. Sarah Harding: people that he chooses versus the people that he doesn't choose, you know, it's there's something about their mindset or their business plan or how they have structured things that I think can teach us all something. And so I think in that way he's not just keeping it to himself, which I think is cool. I think it's I think that's Erin Sheffield: Mm-hmm. Sarah Harding: one of the best parts of that platform is really showing people how how successful business people become successful. I don't know. That's Erin Sheffield: Yeah. Sarah Harding: my thought on it. Erin Sheffield: That makes sense. I mean, I was thinking today as I was talking to this Kajabi lady just about sales. I hate selling things. It feels really inauthentic to me. Sarah Harding: Mm. Erin Sheffield: And I've had probably three friends who are all our like business founders in the last week be like, You don't need to be talking more about your retreat. And some of them are like, I feel like I know you really well and I didn't even know you have a retreat, you know? So you need Sarah Harding: wow. Erin Sheffield: to be talking about it more. And like Yeah, it just feels Sarah Harding: It's funny. Erin Sheffield: weird. I don't like selling and it just feels inauthentic. It's so it just is uncomfortable. So I don't like talking about it that much. But it's like, but you're here to help people and you have you know you have something to offer that is amazing and you know it's changing people's lives and you want those people to find you and you can't you can't help them if they can't find you. You can't serve people if they can't find you. And that's it's less about sales, it's more about service. And I thought Wow, that's so true. But again, it's easy to just kind of get in your head and I don't know, I'm not good at this and maybe this is wrong and people Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: don't like hearing from me. Sarah Harding: Yeah. I think too when we talk about selling things, I can't sell things that I don't believe in. I can't sell things that I haven't had a good experience with because again, it feels inauthentic. and I think that being able to have a platform where you have something that is very beneficial to people. And you've seen the results of it and you've seen success stories from it and you've felt the power behind it. I think that it's less of a sale and more of a conversation. Erin Sheffield: Yes. Sarah Harding: and I think that that is I think that's the way that I see things is I if someone else had this and didn't tell me about it, I'd be really mad at them, you know, because I Erin Sheffield: Yeah, that's so true. Sarah Harding: because how dare you have this great. thing that's making your life easier or has brought so much enrichment to your life or has made your practice better or your day-to-day routine easier. And you didn't bother to tell me like why you gatekeeping? Why you gatekeeping, bro? Erin Sheffield: Mm. Yeah, it's so true. Yeah, and we take things so personally. I think about I remember there was this taco place in Iowa City when we lived there. And there are just not that many great Mexican restaurants in the Midwest. at least when I first moved here. I can't decide if they've gotten better or if my standards have just gone down exponentially 'cause now I I enjoy some places, but that's neither here nor there. But I remember being like, Wow, this is like the best, most authentic taco place we've had in a long time. And I would tell everyone about it. And I wasn't worried if you were vegan or if you hated Mexican food. I just wanted to tell everyone so they knew if they wanted tacos, that's where they could go. And people weren't offended because I really liked the tacos and wanted Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: them to have the opportunity to experience that. But when it's something, it's your baby and it's the thing you've made and you poured your heart and soul. Sarah Harding: Yes. Then it feels very self serving. Yeah. Erin Sheffield: Yeah, it feels, yeah, it feels it self-serving or it feels like. they don't want to hear about it or if they don't like it, I'll feel bad. and so it's really easy to kind of send ourselves messages that aren't there. it's Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: embarrassing. My business hasn't made me a million dollars in a twenty four hour launch, you know. And Sarah Harding: Yeah. Yeah. Erin Sheffield: in the meantime, you're a a Kajabi successful hero and you didn't even know. So Sarah Harding: Yeah. But it's true. I think it is it's an invisible scoreboard that is sometimes maybe has a bunch of trees and bushes in front of it and you can't actually see what the score is. And maybe there's not a score at all, right? And maybe it doesn't matter Erin Sheffield: Yeah. Sarah Harding: what's on the scoreboard. we're both kind of competitive people or have been at some point in our life, and so it's always a little bit of that. Erin Sheffield: Mm. Sarah Harding: but I think that having having people around us that are Cheering us on, having mentors, having just a little sounding board, right? I think is so important Erin Sheffield: Mm. Sarah Harding: to making sure that we are going in the right direction, right? Speaking of Rivers and his sporting events, U5 soccer, they're always going the wrong way. Like, no, go the other way, Erin Sheffield: Ha ha ha ha Sarah Harding: right? Like, what are you doing? Don't do that. It's the other, go the other goal. You know, but it's it's Erin Sheffield: Yeah. Sarah Harding: good to have the the the people there to kinda guide you in in those ways. Whether or not the scoreboard reflects it or not, I think that we can appreciate those people, right? Erin Sheffield: Yeah. I think to the opposite side too is that it's really easy to give the naysayers and the negative comments undue weight. Sarah Harding: Yes. Erin Sheffield: You know, you get one bad review and you're wrecked. You could have had five five patients bring you cupcakes that day and you'd be like, That's nice, but the one bad review tanks you for the rest of the week, you know, your Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: mood. Sarah Harding: Yeah. And you can't respond. Erin Sheffield: How do you Yeah, no, yeah, that too. So how do you how do you try to keep that, you know, inner compass when you have those? Like I'm so impressed by people. I remember when we talked to Natalie Crawford in her episode and she was talking about how she just knew that if no one else would believe in her, she had to before people would. You know, she seemed to have this inner compass to just kind of keep her going. And I don't know that I'm that person or not. I I kind of feel like I'm the more if someone tells me I can't do it and they seem like the authority person, then I'm gonna believe it. I'm just gonna get really down and you're probably right. And I don't know if that's I don't know. I can't tell if that's an Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: accurate assessment or not, because clearly I've faced a lot of adversity and have pushed through, but I Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: don't I don't know if I've trusted myself to keep pushing when other people are pushing back. Sarah Harding: Yeah. I used to be more s motivated by naysayers. Now I feel like they just have so much going on in life that it's like when I hit one roadblock, two roadblocks, three roadblocks, I'm like, okay, God, I understand this is not the path forward. Like, you know, like Erin Sheffield: Yeah, I know. It's Sarah Harding: how is now the time to give up or do I just pivot? You know, and it's and it and it's really hard to know when which it's really hard to know. Like When is it time to give up? When is it time to pivot? When is it time to keep pushing? It's really hard. Erin Sheffield: I mean I kind of admire the people that take those negative things as fuel, like, well I'm gonna prove you, but I don't like I said, I don't think that's really me. I think I kind of internalize it too much and you're probably right and I'm just really sad now that I'm not gonna do it instead of pushing through. I don't know. I that's really interesting. You don't believe me? I'm wondering, I'm trying to decide. Maybe after Sarah Harding: I don't believe you. No. No. Erin Sheffield: a while I kinda come back. But it certainly doesn't fuel my follow my fire, it definitely Dampens it and maybe have to just kind of start over and build again. But yeah, I'm impressed by the people who don't. But like you said, also. That's hard to either as a person going through it or as someone like looking at it. Like think about how you advise kids or people you're mentoring. There are some times where never give up on your dream. That's Sarah Harding: Right. Erin Sheffield: really great. But there are some people that will realistically never make the dream. Like think of all the people that moved to Nashville to become country music stars. Think of all the people that moved to LA or New York to become famous on Broadway or on TV and just don't make it. And at some point there's value in cutting your losses and finding something else wonderful to do and, you know, getting your start on that versus just slugging through and never never making it. And I remember there was Sarah Harding: Right. Yeah. Erin Sheffield: this woman who was trying to get into a residency program and had left a program because of some kind of bad circumstances and had to start over as, you know, an intern year and then that didn't go well. And and so she just kept applying and applying and applying. And I remember I gave her some advice. She was like, I went on this interview and the residents were so awesome and they're basically saying I had a spot and I'm so excited. And I said, well, that's great. But it's not really how the match works. So I've seen people get burned where they put all their eggs in one basket. And because of something that someone said in an interview, they assume that it's all taken care of and it might not be. So like you should have a backup plan. And she got really mad at me. It called me out for being like a negative Nelly and you know, I can't believe you would say that. And I was just trying to be helpful and give some good advice. And then turns out she didn't end up matching. But it's like I've known people who six years later they haven't matched and they just keep doing these low level internship Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: type positions over and over and over again. And I love that. Go for your dream. But sometimes maybe the dream we need to pivot. And that's hard to know. Sarah Harding: Yeah. Yeah. Erin Sheffield: when to like trust yourself and that you can make the dream happen through pure grit and determination versus Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: you're never gonna be Barbastre and you know it's time to to go somewhere else. Sarah Harding: Yeah. You know, and I think in that but I think that the big thing here too, and something that as I've gotten older is something that is really taken a strong hold in my brain, is all of the things that I've done that didn't pan out the way that I wanted it to, or whatever. I think I learned so much in those journeys that I've been able to apply to maybe completely different. Aspects of my life, right? And so, but learning those things has been very helpful. And so I think if I think so often we are focused on the goal as opposed to the journey of what everything is teaching Erin Sheffield: Yeah. Sarah Harding: you. And so maybe like maybe I want to be an oral surgeon and I'm applying for this, I'm applying for this, I'm applying for this. But now I'm really good at interviewing and I'm really good at this. And maybe oral surgery isn't the best fit for me, but I can for sure. you know, talk with patients. I can for sure meet people that I would never meet in other circumstances and have great conversations with them. And I can, you know, get a lot of patient buy-in with my treatment plans. I can get sponsors for the PTA thing. I can, you know, things like that. And like little little things that you pick up along the way are so valuable. And maybe that's the real goal, right? Erin Sheffield: Yeah. Yeah, that makes Sarah Harding: I don't know. Erin Sheffield: a lot of sense. I like that. Yeah, sometimes it's hard to know what's realistic and what's not. There's a we all have Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: people who've told us in our lives like, You'll never get in there or that will never work out. And a lot of times Sarah Harding: Mm. Erin Sheffield: they're wrong, but then sometimes they're right. Ugh, I don't know. Sarah Harding: Yeah. Erin Sheffield: So maybe the answer isn't to stop comparing entirely, but to recognize when we're comparing our complete experience to fragments of someone else's Sarah Harding: Right. Erin Sheffield: and then grading ourselves on a rubric that like wasn't even for us. Yeah. Like Sarah Harding: Yes. Erin Sheffield: if you're getting giving yourself a grade based on math scoring and you're in English, it's just not gonna make a lot of sense. Sarah Harding: Yeah, it's not gonna go well for you. That's right. Yeah. So I think we've got a lot to learn, but I think that having the right perspective is really important and surrounding ourselves with people that will motivate us and keep us grounded at the same time, I think is really important. Erin Sheffield: Yeah, I do too. Well, thanks for joining us for another episode of the Resting Stitch Face podcast. Please like, share, and follow, we'll catch you next time. Sarah Harding: See you later.