Latest / Beyond The Horizon / Mega Edition: The State Of Idaho And It's History With The Death Penalty (8/29/26)

Transcript

Mega Edition: The State Of Idaho And It's History With The Death Penalty (8/29/26) · Beyond The Horizon

0:01
Speaker 1: What's up everyone and welcome back to the program. One
0:05
Speaker 1: of the topics we've discussed here on the podcast has
0:08
Speaker 1: to do with what the penalty for Brian Koberger will
0:12
Speaker 1: be if he is found guilty of these murders. Well,
0:16
Speaker 1: People Magazine has an article out today discussing this very thing. So,
0:21
Speaker 1: let's dive into this article from People Magazine and let's
0:25
Speaker 1: see what they're talking about when it comes to the
0:28
Speaker 1: death penalty. Headline, Will Brian Koberger face death penalty if
0:33
Speaker 1: convicted of Idaho murders? Legal expert weighs in. This article
0:38
Speaker 1: was authored by Corin Kisarik. It will be more than
0:45
Speaker 1: five months before murder suspect Brian Koberger appears in a
0:49
Speaker 1: courtroom again for his preliminary hearing after being charged with
0:53
Speaker 1: the murders of four University of Idaho students. The 28-year-old
0:58
Speaker 1: former Ph.D. criminology student is accused of stabbing to death
1:03
Speaker 1: Madison Mogan, Kaylee Gonsalves, Zanna Kernodal, and Ethan Chapin in
1:08
Speaker 1: an off-campus residence in Moscow, Idaho, in the early morning
1:12
Speaker 1: hours of November 13th of 2022. Gonsalves, Mogan, and Kernodal
1:18
Speaker 1: lived together at the Moscow home where the murders took
1:20
Speaker 1: place with two additional roommates, and Chapin was staying the
1:25
Speaker 1: night with his girlfriend, Kernodal. And obviously a whole host
1:30
Speaker 1: of facts are going to come into play when it
1:33
Speaker 1: comes to making a decision on whether this is a
1:37
Speaker 1: death penalty case or if they're going for life in prison.
1:42
Speaker 1: And one of those factors is certainly going to be
1:45
Speaker 1: the brutality of what we saw here. Never mind the
1:48
Speaker 1: fact that there's four murders. but the brutality of it all,
1:52
Speaker 1: and the fact that, at least the police allege, that
1:55
Speaker 1: it was all premeditated, I think that's going to weigh
1:58
Speaker 1: heavily in favor of this being a death penalty case
2:01
Speaker 1: when all is said and done. After nearly seven weeks
2:06
Speaker 1: of investigating, Koberger, who was living in Pullman, Washington, and
2:10
Speaker 1: attending Washington State University at the time of the murders,
2:14
Speaker 1: was arrested across the country in his home state of
2:16
Speaker 1: Pennsylvania and charged with four counts of murder, and one
2:20
Speaker 1: count of felony burglary in connection with the slayings. Questions
2:25
Speaker 1: continue to loom over the case, including whether Koberger could
2:29
Speaker 1: face the death penalty if he is found guilty. One
2:32
Speaker 1: of many questions. There are a lot of questions that
2:36
Speaker 1: still have to be answered. And the probable cause affidavit,
2:40
Speaker 1: while it gave us a little look behind the curtain,
2:43
Speaker 1: it certainly didn't give us the whole entire plot. So
2:47
Speaker 1: there is a lot more That is bubbling below the
2:50
Speaker 1: surface right now. That is being worked on by not
2:53
Speaker 1: only the prosecution. Remember, the defense, they're sinking their teeth
2:56
Speaker 1: in too. And we don't know what they're up to.
3:00
Speaker 1: We have no idea what their strategy is. We have
3:03
Speaker 1: no idea what the game plan is going to be.
3:06
Speaker 1: And that all has to do with the gag order.
3:09
Speaker 1: And obviously, the defense doesn't want to tip their hand,
3:13
Speaker 1: even in the slightest way. because they certainly don't want
3:16
Speaker 1: the prosecution to know what's coming. The death penalty is
3:20
Speaker 1: legal in Idaho, and 29 executions have been carried out
3:24
Speaker 1: in the state since 1864, but only three have since
3:29
Speaker 1: the death penalty resumed in 1976 after a hiatus. The
3:34
Speaker 1: last execution in Idaho was in June of 2012. Prosecutors
3:39
Speaker 1: have not yet announced if they will pursue the death
3:42
Speaker 1: penalty in Kohlberger's case as it heads to trial. And again, look,
3:47
Speaker 1: I'm not going to sit here and tell you with
3:48
Speaker 1: certainty that they're going to pursue the death penalty. But
3:52
Speaker 1: it looks like if any case was ever tailor made
3:55
Speaker 1: to fit the parameters of a death penalty kind of case,
3:59
Speaker 1: this would certainly seem to be it. The cold blooded
4:02
Speaker 1: murder of four people in their home while they were
4:05
Speaker 1: sleeping or getting ready to go to sleep. certainly adds
4:09
Speaker 1: up to a death penalty from my position over here
4:13
Speaker 1: in the who gives a hell what I'm thinking peanut gallery.
4:16
Speaker 1: And I'm not somebody who really believes in the death penalty,
4:19
Speaker 1: to be honest with you. The idea of the state
4:21
Speaker 1: having that power over citizens is a bit disconcerting to me.
4:26
Speaker 1: But whenever you have a situation such as this, and
4:29
Speaker 1: if the death penalty is on the books, it's certainly
4:32
Speaker 1: something you have to pursue. However, trial lawyer and former
4:36
Speaker 1: federal prosecutor Nima Rahmani tells people that it is very
4:40
Speaker 1: likely prosecutors will pursue the death penalty in this case
4:44
Speaker 1: that has shocked the nation. Well, look, I know it's
4:47
Speaker 1: a shocking case and I know that people all around
4:50
Speaker 1: the country want justice here, but certain parameters are going
4:54
Speaker 1: to have to be met for it to meet the
4:57
Speaker 1: standards set by the state of Idaho to be a
5:00
Speaker 1: death penalty case. And according to various experts and prosecutors, ex-prosecutors,
5:06
Speaker 1: these murders certainly fit the bill. If you believe in
5:10
Speaker 1: the death penalty, this is a death penalty case. Rachmani said,
5:14
Speaker 1: you have multiple victims. You have evidence of premeditation. You
5:18
Speaker 1: have a victim's family who want the death penalty. So
5:21
Speaker 1: there's a lot of aggregating factors here. And a lot
5:25
Speaker 1: of times that plays a big part. Whenever you have
5:28
Speaker 1: a family that wants the death penalty, the judge, the prosecutor,
5:32
Speaker 1: the state, they'll take that all into account. And when
5:35
Speaker 1: they're rendering their decision, a lot of times they'll use
5:39
Speaker 1: that as part of the justification if they are indeed
5:43
Speaker 1: going after the death penalty. Prosecutors are elected officials and
5:49
Speaker 1: there's going to be a lot of political pressure on
5:51
Speaker 1: them to seek a death sentence in a case like
5:53
Speaker 1: this and not offer any type of deal like life
5:57
Speaker 1: without the possibility of parole. Rahmani continues. It is one
6:02
Speaker 1: of the most gruesome murders in Idaho state history. So
6:05
Speaker 1: all those factors lead me to believe that very likely
6:09
Speaker 1: prosecutors will seek the death penalty in this case. All
6:13
Speaker 1: of that adds up. I mean, when you have the
6:16
Speaker 1: kind of murder you have here, and then you have
6:19
Speaker 1: how egregious it was, and with premeditation on top of it,
6:23
Speaker 1: there's just no other way you can go. If the
6:26
Speaker 1: death penalty is available to you in your state as
6:29
Speaker 1: a prosecutor, you have a lot of other factors that
6:32
Speaker 1: you have to look at and be aware of. The
6:35
Speaker 1: insanity defense has not been available in Idaho since 1982.
6:40
Speaker 1: But Rahmani believes his attorney will argue he didn't commit
6:44
Speaker 1: the murders. I think that's where it's going to go.
6:47
Speaker 1: I think Ann Taylor is going to push her chips
6:49
Speaker 1: all the way to the center of the table and
6:51
Speaker 1: go with the whole theory of it wasn't my client.
6:55
Speaker 1: And while that might sound great on its face, you're
6:58
Speaker 1: going to have to prove that. It's one thing to say, hey, look,
7:01
Speaker 1: it wasn't my client. It's a whole nother thing to
7:03
Speaker 1: prove to a jury what you're trying to say. Kohlberger's
7:07
Speaker 1: attorney will most likely argue that he didn't do it.
7:10
Speaker 1: Rather than present an insanity defense, Rachmani said, he was
7:15
Speaker 1: accomplished enough as a scholar to become a PhD student
7:18
Speaker 1: and he showed no indication of mental illness before the stabbings.
7:22
Speaker 1: So there would be little justification for his defense to
7:25
Speaker 1: argue he is incompetent to stand trial. And if he
7:29
Speaker 1: wasn't a PhD, he didn't have all of these other
7:32
Speaker 1: scholarly accolades, then it might be a different story. But
7:36
Speaker 1: when you have all of that, and it's not easy
7:38
Speaker 1: to become a PhD candidate, when you have all of
7:41
Speaker 1: that that you're doing, arguing that you're insane here is
7:45
Speaker 1: probably not the best way to go. During an appearance
7:50
Speaker 1: on News Nation, Stephen Christie Gonsalves, the parents of Kaylee Gonsalves,
7:54
Speaker 1: said they would support the death penalty for the killer.
7:57
Speaker 1: Justice is when you leave the planet. And the whole
8:00
Speaker 1: world is able to rejoice and be glad that you're
8:03
Speaker 1: not here, Steve said. And pretty harsh words, right? But
8:06
Speaker 1: guess what? This is a man who just lost his daughter.
8:10
Speaker 1: Imagine that pain. And then imagine having a conduit to
8:14
Speaker 1: focus on, like Brian Koberger, who the government's alleged killed
8:18
Speaker 1: your daughter. So I have a lot of respect for
8:21
Speaker 1: Steve Gonzalez, honestly, because there'd be no gag order on
8:24
Speaker 1: this whole entire planet. I don't care if it's the
8:26
Speaker 1: gaggiest of gag orders. That would keep my fat mouth shut.
8:31
Speaker 1: When host Ashley Banfield asked both parents if they support
8:34
Speaker 1: the death penalty in the case against Kohlberger, if he
8:37
Speaker 1: were to be convicted, they said they do. If you
8:40
Speaker 1: want to play God's role, you're going to have to
8:42
Speaker 1: answer to him, Steve said. A recently unsealed search warrant
8:46
Speaker 1: of Coburger's Pullman Home, which was obtained by People, sheds
8:50
Speaker 1: light on the items taken from the resident shortly after
8:53
Speaker 1: his arrest. These items included one disposable black glove, receipts
8:58
Speaker 1: from Walmart and Marshalls, a dust container vacuum, possible hair strands,
9:03
Speaker 1: one fire TV stick, one possible animal hair strand, one
9:07
Speaker 1: computer tower, an item with a dark red spot, two
9:10
Speaker 1: pieces of an uncased pillow with a reddish-brown stain, and
9:14
Speaker 1: mattress covers. I think the strongest piece of evidence would
9:18
Speaker 1: be if the victim's blood is at his apartment or
9:22
Speaker 1: on his car, Rahmani said. We don't know yet, but
9:25
Speaker 1: I think that would be very strong evidence if true.
9:29
Speaker 1: That would be the sinker. If that evidence is available
9:33
Speaker 1: to the prosecution and that's what the tests show, then
9:36
Speaker 1: this dude's done and there's not going to be one
9:38
Speaker 1: single argument that anyone can make that's going to get
9:41
Speaker 1: him off. All you have to do is go back
9:43
Speaker 1: in history and look at all the other scumbags who
9:46
Speaker 1: tried to argue their way out of the DNA net.
9:51
Speaker 1: Former Los Angeles County Prosecutor Joshua Ritter told people in
9:55
Speaker 1: a statement that he believes there is a strong case
9:58
Speaker 1: against Koberger. The DNA evidence, coupled with the other corroborating evidence,
10:04
Speaker 1: is enough to build a very strong case against Brian Koberger,
10:07
Speaker 1: Ritter said. I can't imagine this being a case where
10:10
Speaker 1: prosecutors don't seriously consider the death penalty. In that scenario,
10:15
Speaker 1: the only way Kohlberger would accept a plea deal would
10:18
Speaker 1: be if prosecutors take the death penalty off the table.
10:22
Speaker 1: But it's a little too early to talk about plea
10:24
Speaker 1: deals at this point. Oh, there's no doubt. Way too early.
10:28
Speaker 1: We have to see what the government really has. Remember,
10:31
Speaker 1: we're all working off of... the speculation that the government
10:35
Speaker 1: has a ton more that they're going to drop on
10:37
Speaker 1: Brian Koberger like a ton of bricks. Now, is that
10:42
Speaker 1: the case? Well, usually it is. But until we see
10:45
Speaker 1: it again, I'm a trust and verify kind of guy. Oh,
10:48
Speaker 1: I'll trust you. But I got to verify that work.
10:52
Speaker 1: And it goes doubly for the government. So I'm going
10:56
Speaker 1: to have to see what they have as far as
10:58
Speaker 1: receipts and goods and evidence against Brian Koberger before I say,
11:03
Speaker 1: oh yeah, this dude needs to go meet the hangman's noose.
11:07
Speaker 1: But it's certainly trending that way. And when you have
11:10
Speaker 1: all of this evidence that we have circumstantially, if it's
11:14
Speaker 1: really glued together with strong DNA evidence that's taken from
11:18
Speaker 1: Brian Koberger's car, as far as I'm concerned, you can
11:22
Speaker 1: put him on the lip of that volcano. All right, folks,
11:26
Speaker 1: that's going to do it for this one. All of
11:29
Speaker 1: the information that goes along with this episode can be
11:32
Speaker 1: found in the description box. What's up, everyone, and welcome
11:40
Speaker 1: back to the program. In Idaho, they have reinstated death
11:46
Speaker 1: penalty via firing squad, and that could certainly impact Brian
11:50
Speaker 1: Koberger moving forward. However, I will caution you that Idaho
11:55
Speaker 1: isn't known as a state that is bringing people up
11:59
Speaker 1: to be executed and doing it in a quick manner.
12:03
Speaker 1: There are people who are sitting on death row in
12:05
Speaker 1: Idaho for quite some time. And according to some of
12:08
Speaker 1: the lawmakers in the state, it had to do with
12:11
Speaker 1: the fact that they couldn't get the proper chemicals to
12:15
Speaker 1: pass down the sentence of death. Well, now that the
12:17
Speaker 1: firing squad has been reinstituted, That all might change, and
12:23
Speaker 1: obviously if it does, and Brian Koberger is sentenced to death,
12:28
Speaker 1: it might affect him. So today we have an article
12:31
Speaker 1: from the Idaho Statesman talking about this very topic. Headline,
12:36
Speaker 1: Idaho's history offers clues. Idaho's passage last month of a
12:44
Speaker 1: new law adding the firing squad as an execution method
12:48
Speaker 1: for death row inmates... could one day play a role
12:52
Speaker 1: in Moscow murder suspect Brian Kohlberger's case. 100%. If he's
12:57
Speaker 1: given the death penalty, I'm sure it's going to play
13:00
Speaker 1: a role. Especially if they can't get the doctors to
13:03
Speaker 1: come and help out with the process of administering the
13:08
Speaker 1: lethal injection. So if that's going to continue to be
13:10
Speaker 1: an issue, and the fact that they can't get the
13:12
Speaker 1: chemicals to boot, well, they're going to have to go
13:15
Speaker 1: a different route. Now, we can argue until the next
13:19
Speaker 1: San Gennaro about the death penalty, and as you all know,
13:22
Speaker 1: I'm not a big fan of it. But what I think,
13:25
Speaker 1: or what you think, doesn't really matter in this case,
13:28
Speaker 1: considering it's what the people of Idaho want and what
13:31
Speaker 1: the people of Idaho have voted for. So if that's
13:34
Speaker 1: what they have voted for, and those are the rules
13:36
Speaker 1: on the book, then Brian Koberger, if anyone, should be
13:40
Speaker 1: getting the death penalty if he's guilty. And while I
13:44
Speaker 1: prefer the whole volcano method, I don't think that the
13:47
Speaker 1: firing squad idea is the bad one. I know it
13:50
Speaker 1: sounds a bit barbaric, but according to that expert that
13:54
Speaker 1: we heard from previously, that expert was saying that actually
13:58
Speaker 1: the firing squad is much more humane. And I can
14:02
Speaker 1: see that. Honestly, all it takes is one bullet well placed.
14:05
Speaker 1: And if you have a bunch of marksmen doing it,
14:07
Speaker 1: I don't think it's going to be that difficult for
14:10
Speaker 1: them to hit the target. Whereas you see with this
14:13
Speaker 1: lethal injection, sometimes things go south. People are on the
14:17
Speaker 1: gurney for a couple of hours, squirming, all kinds of
14:20
Speaker 1: wild shit. If I was going to get executed and
14:23
Speaker 1: the state decided that my punishment was death, I'd want
14:26
Speaker 1: it to be as quick as possible. So I'm thinking
14:29
Speaker 1: that the firing squad might not be a bad idea.
14:32
Speaker 1: In December, police arrested 28-year-old Kohlberger for allegedly murdering four
14:37
Speaker 1: University of Idaho students in November. He remains in custody
14:41
Speaker 1: in the Latah County Jail, awaiting a preliminary hearing in
14:44
Speaker 1: June on four counts of first-degree murder and one burglary charge.
14:50
Speaker 1: First-degree murder is the only charge that qualifies a defendant
14:54
Speaker 1: for the death penalty in Idaho, one of 24 U.S.
14:57
Speaker 1: states that still actively enforces the death penalty. After Governor
15:02
Speaker 1: Brad Little signed a new law last month, Idaho will
15:05
Speaker 1: become the fifth state to allow executions by firing squad
15:09
Speaker 1: when it goes into effect July 1st. Latah County Prosecutor
15:14
Speaker 1: Bill Thompson has still not said whether he will seek
15:17
Speaker 1: the death penalty against Koberger, a former student at Washington
15:21
Speaker 1: State University, if convicted. Under state law, prosecutors have 60
15:27
Speaker 1: days from the time a defendant enters a plea to
15:30
Speaker 1: to tell the court if they will ask a jury
15:32
Speaker 1: to consider a death sentence. So we know that this
15:36
Speaker 1: is all coming up. And we all know that it's
15:38
Speaker 1: looking like Bill Thompson is going to seek the death
15:42
Speaker 1: penalty here. Koberger's legal team is well buffered with lawyers
15:47
Speaker 1: who are capable of dealing with capital murder cases and
15:51
Speaker 1: with lawyers who are prepared to go that route if
15:55
Speaker 1: it's necessary. And as far as the state goes, I
15:58
Speaker 1: think that the people living in the state of Idaho,
16:01
Speaker 1: if you listen to the tenor of the people there,
16:04
Speaker 1: they all want Brian Kohlberger to get the death penalty
16:07
Speaker 1: if he's guilty. And with prosecutors always thinking about the
16:11
Speaker 1: next election, I would think that a death penalty case
16:15
Speaker 1: here is almost a foregone conclusion. Defendants in Idaho felony
16:20
Speaker 1: cases do not enter a plea for a district court arraignment.
16:23
Speaker 1: That's the immediate step after a preliminary hearing when a magistrate,
16:28
Speaker 1: Judge Megan Marshall, in Kohlberger's case, decides whether there is
16:32
Speaker 1: probable cause to take the case to district court for
16:35
Speaker 1: a possible trial. But the collection of charges against Kohlberger
16:39
Speaker 1: is extremely rare, if not unprecedented, in Idaho. No other
16:43
Speaker 1: defendant in recent state history has faced four counts of
16:47
Speaker 1: first degree murder in a single case. According to a
16:50
Speaker 1: poll of longtime law enforcement and legal officials, an analysis
16:55
Speaker 1: by the Idaho statesman. Look, it's a very small state.
16:59
Speaker 1: They don't have this kind of thing happen there all
17:00
Speaker 1: the time. This isn't something that, you know, you expect
17:03
Speaker 1: to happen in a place like Idaho. This is a
17:06
Speaker 1: New York crime, or California, or Texas, or you get
17:09
Speaker 1: my drift. These little small places, very rarely do you
17:13
Speaker 1: see a multiple homicide. I'm very confident it's going to
17:17
Speaker 1: be a necktie, Jessica Bublitz, a Boise criminal defense attorney,
17:22
Speaker 1: told the statesman by phone. The common sense reason everyone
17:26
Speaker 1: thinks it should be capital murder is the aggravating circumstances.
17:30
Speaker 1: I think this qualifies as particularly gruesome, gruesome or brutal,
17:35
Speaker 1: the manner and manner in which they were killed. The
17:39
Speaker 1: victims in this case were U of I seniors Madison
17:42
Speaker 1: Mogan and Kaylee Gonsalves, Zanna Kernodle, and Ethan Chapin. All
17:48
Speaker 1: four were stabbed to death shortly after 4 a.m. in
17:51
Speaker 1: an off-campus rental home. In what police later acknowledged in
17:55
Speaker 1: a search warrant application, was a particularly bloody crime scene,
17:59
Speaker 1: and we heard how gruesome it was at the time.
18:03
Speaker 1: Before there was a gag order, we heard from the
18:05
Speaker 1: people who were on scene that it was a very
18:08
Speaker 1: bloody and gruesome scene. And to these cops, the ones
18:12
Speaker 1: that were there, it was the worst crime scene that
18:15
Speaker 1: they had ever seen, according to reports in the direct
18:18
Speaker 1: aftermath of the murders. First-degree murder convictions in Idaho require
18:23
Speaker 1: a jury to unanimously determine the presence of at least
18:27
Speaker 1: one alleged aggravating circumstance in order to sentence a defendant
18:31
Speaker 1: to death. Those include a defendant who has committed more
18:35
Speaker 1: than one murder, is likely to be continuing threat to society,
18:39
Speaker 1: and has shown an utter disregard for human life, or
18:43
Speaker 1: committed a murder that was particularly gruesome, gruesome, or brutal.
18:49
Speaker 1: Brian Koberger, if he's the man they tell us he is,
18:52
Speaker 1: checks all of those boxes. All of that stuff is true.
18:56
Speaker 1: The unusual nature of the student killings in Moscow, in
18:59
Speaker 1: the city of about 26,000, as well as Idaho, makes
19:03
Speaker 1: direct comparisons difficult for area attorneys. But several cases in
19:08
Speaker 1: the state in which an individual defendant was sentenced to
19:11
Speaker 1: death for multiple murders offer insight into whether Koberger could
19:16
Speaker 1: eventually face the death penalty. the history of the death
19:20
Speaker 1: penalty in Idaho. Two of the eight death row inmates
19:24
Speaker 1: in Idaho have been convicted of four counts of murder,
19:27
Speaker 1: but some of those murders took place outside of Idaho,
19:31
Speaker 1: and some played no part in their death sentence. Today,
19:35
Speaker 1: Thomas Creech and Gerald Pizzuto are the longest serving prisoners
19:40
Speaker 1: of the state's death row, where they both have evaded
19:42
Speaker 1: the death penalty for decades. Creech, 72, was subsequently convicted
19:49
Speaker 1: of a previous murder in Oregon and also pleaded guilty
19:52
Speaker 1: to killing a fellow inmate while incarcerated in Idaho, for
19:56
Speaker 1: which he received the death sentence. Pizzuto, 67, was convicted
20:01
Speaker 1: of two counts of murder in Washington after his conviction
20:04
Speaker 1: and death sentence in Idaho. Joseph Duncan, who pleaded guilty
20:08
Speaker 1: in 2005 murder of four members of the Coeur d'Alene family,
20:13
Speaker 1: is perhaps the closest example of the Koberger case. He
20:17
Speaker 1: received three life sentences for the three first-degree murders in
20:20
Speaker 1: Idaho and was later sentenced to death in a separate
20:23
Speaker 1: federal case for the murder of a nine-year-old boy who
20:27
Speaker 1: was also a member of the family. If you kill
20:30
Speaker 1: a family member, it should automatically be up as a
20:33
Speaker 1: death penalty case. Duncan also later pleaded guilty to murdering
20:38
Speaker 1: a 10-year-old boy in Southern California and confessed to the
20:42
Speaker 1: murder of two sisters, ages 11 and 9 in Seattle,
20:45
Speaker 1: but was never charged. Duncan was diagnosed with late-stage brain
20:50
Speaker 1: cancer and died in federal prison at the age of
20:52
Speaker 1: 58 in March 2021. Well, finally some good news in
20:56
Speaker 1: this article, huh? The federal capital case against Duncan remains
21:01
Speaker 1: the only one in Idaho history Josh Hurwit, U.S. Attorney
21:04
Speaker 1: for the District of Idaho, confirmed to the statesman. He
21:08
Speaker 1: declined to comment on the Kohlberger case or say whether
21:11
Speaker 1: his office would consider participating. We do not confirm or
21:15
Speaker 1: deny whether we have an investigation into specific cases, Hurwit
21:19
Speaker 1: said by telephone. A handful of other Idaho inmates have
21:23
Speaker 1: been convicted of three counts of murder. Among them are
21:26
Speaker 1: Robin Rowe, Adam Dees, and Paul Rhodes. Rose, 65, the
21:31
Speaker 1: only woman on death row in Idaho, was convicted of
21:33
Speaker 1: murdering her husband and two children in a fire at
21:37
Speaker 1: their Ada County home in 1992. Two of her earlier
21:41
Speaker 1: children also died under suspicious circumstances in other states, but
21:46
Speaker 1: she was never charged in either case. Oh, well, it's
21:49
Speaker 1: just a coincidence that all of these kids happen to
21:51
Speaker 1: die in her care, right? Dees, 30, agreed to plead
21:55
Speaker 1: guilty to the first-degree murder of three members of a
21:58
Speaker 1: Boise area family during a robbery in 2015. In exchange,
22:04
Speaker 1: he avoided the death penalty and was sentenced to three
22:07
Speaker 1: life terms without charge. Chance of early release. Seems like
22:11
Speaker 1: another candidate for the volcano if you're asking me. Rhodes
22:15
Speaker 1: was convicted of three murders in 1987. in Blackfoot and
22:20
Speaker 1: Idaho Falls. He was also suspected in Utah and Wyoming
22:24
Speaker 1: of four other murders but was never charged. Idaho executed
22:29
Speaker 1: Rhodes by lethal injection in November 2011 at the age
22:33
Speaker 1: of 54. In addition, Chad Daybell faces three counts of
22:37
Speaker 1: first-degree murder in his upcoming trial from Rexburg. He is
22:41
Speaker 1: pleaded not guilty to all charges and faces the death penalty.
22:45
Speaker 1: His wife, Lori Vallow Daybell, faces two counts of first-degree
22:48
Speaker 1: murder in her separate case, which is ongoing in Boise,
22:52
Speaker 1: but does not face the death penalty after the judge
22:55
Speaker 1: dropped the possible sentence as part of her expedited trial.
22:59
Speaker 1: So we've been talking about that for the past few
23:02
Speaker 1: weeks now, and Chad Daybell's definitely going to get the
23:06
Speaker 1: death penalty if he's convicted. Lethal injection, first choice. Until
23:11
Speaker 1: House Bill 186, The new firing squad law goes into
23:15
Speaker 1: effect this summer. Lethal injection is the only legal method
23:18
Speaker 1: of execution in Idaho. Bill's sponsors and Idaho Attorney General
23:23
Speaker 1: Raul Labrador, who helped draft the legislation, sought to provide
23:28
Speaker 1: the state with another method after officials failed to carry
23:31
Speaker 1: out Pazuto's planned execution in December. Prison officials have said
23:36
Speaker 1: that they have been unable to obtain the drugs needed
23:39
Speaker 1: to perform a lethal injection. In recent years, efforts by
23:43
Speaker 1: anti-death penalty groups to persuade drug makers and pharmacies to
23:47
Speaker 1: stop selling the chemicals to state prisons have been effective.
23:51
Speaker 1: Idaho Deputy Attorney General Lamont Anderson said in public testimony
23:56
Speaker 1: last month at a Senate hearing on the firing squad bill.
24:00
Speaker 1: And look, again, I'm not a big fan of the
24:02
Speaker 1: death penalty, but there has to be a way to
24:05
Speaker 1: administer it. In fact, Idaho no longer had the ability
24:09
Speaker 1: to enforce death sentences, said Anderson, chief of the firm's
24:13
Speaker 1: capital litigation division. The sponsors of the bill, Republican Bruce
24:18
Speaker 1: Scogg of Nampa and Senator Doug Ricks, Republican of Rexburg,
24:22
Speaker 1: argued the same in building support for the state that
24:25
Speaker 1: relaunch firing squad executions. The method previously existed in Idaho
24:30
Speaker 1: as a backup from 1982 to 2009, but the state
24:35
Speaker 1: has never executed an inmate by firing squad. Idaho currently
24:40
Speaker 1: has a death penalty law, and we can't actually enforce
24:43
Speaker 1: it because we can't get the drugs, Rick said at
24:46
Speaker 1: the hearing in March, identifying the state's eight-member death row.
24:50
Speaker 1: And right now, Idaho has some very visible homicide cases
24:54
Speaker 1: that you may know are pending in Moscow and Rexburg
24:58
Speaker 1: that could end up being affected by this as well.
25:01
Speaker 1: And that's why they acted. That's why they put this
25:04
Speaker 1: new law into effect. And that's why the governor signed
25:06
Speaker 1: off on it. The new law requires the director of
25:10
Speaker 1: the state prison system to decide within five days of
25:13
Speaker 1: a death sentence being issued whether the prisoner will be
25:16
Speaker 1: executed by lethal injection or by firing squad. if the
25:20
Speaker 1: required drugs are unavailable. Lethal injection remains Idaho's method of choice,
25:25
Speaker 1: Skog told The Statesman in an interview. Lethal injection is
25:30
Speaker 1: the first choice, he said, acknowledging that a firing squad
25:33
Speaker 1: may never be necessary. That could happen, but I think
25:36
Speaker 1: it will, more likely than not. I believe it will happen.
25:40
Speaker 1: The Idaho Department of Corrections is in the process of
25:43
Speaker 1: establishing state policy for the execution of an inmate by
25:47
Speaker 1: firing squad. Department spokesman Jeff Ray told the statesman by
25:51
Speaker 1: email they must then be approved by the three-member council
25:55
Speaker 1: of the state prison system. The department also plans to
25:59
Speaker 1: spend an estimated $ 750, 000 to renovate a cell block at
26:04
Speaker 1: the Idaho Maximum Security Institute that holds death row inmates
26:09
Speaker 1: so that executions can take place by firing squad. There
26:12
Speaker 1: is no planned completion date for the construction, Ray said.
26:16
Speaker 1: We don't have a timeline, he said. In the coming weeks,
26:19
Speaker 1: we will consult with other states, review their procedures and
26:23
Speaker 1: develop protocol that ensures the process is conducted with respect,
26:28
Speaker 1: dignity and professionalism. Koberger's preliminary hearing is scheduled for June
26:34
Speaker 1: 26th in the Latah County District Court. All right. Well,
26:38
Speaker 1: there's a little bit of an update. on the firing
26:40
Speaker 1: squad and the potential that Brian Kohlberger might meet his
26:44
Speaker 1: fate at the hands of it. But before we get
26:47
Speaker 1: to that point, there is a whole lot of road
26:49
Speaker 1: to still cover. And we'll be right here with you
26:52
Speaker 1: on the journey up that road as the case against
26:55
Speaker 1: Brian Kohlberger continues to move along. All right, folks, that's
26:59
Speaker 1: going to do it for this one. All of the
27:01
Speaker 1: information that goes with the episode can be found in
27:04
Speaker 1: the description box. Spice up your love life with... What's
27:08
Speaker 1: up everyone and welcome back to the program. When it
27:12
Speaker 1: comes to Brian Kohlberger, the main question on everybody's mind
27:15
Speaker 1: at this point is will he get the death penalty
27:19
Speaker 1: or won't he? Well, according to a new report, if
27:23
Speaker 1: he does get the death penalty, going by how the
27:26
Speaker 1: state of Idaho has dealt with other inmates on death row,
27:30
Speaker 1: there is an estimate about how much it would cost
27:33
Speaker 1: to give Brian Kohlberger the death penalty. And for me,
27:36
Speaker 1: that's all fine and well, but the problem is that
27:40
Speaker 1: after these guys get the death penalty, they sit around
27:43
Speaker 1: on death row waiting to get put to death for
27:46
Speaker 1: decades sometimes. And that has to change. You get yourself
27:49
Speaker 1: an appeal or two, and then that's the end of it, right?
27:53
Speaker 1: This isn't a life sentence. This is a death penalty.
27:56
Speaker 1: So that should be carried out the second that all
27:59
Speaker 1: appeals and all of the other moves that could be
28:02
Speaker 1: made by the person who is being put to death
28:05
Speaker 1: have been exhausted. But instead what we see is this
28:09
Speaker 1: process get dragged on and we end up seeing how
28:12
Speaker 1: expensive it is to keep somebody incarcerated on death row.
28:16
Speaker 1: It's certainly more expensive than keeping somebody in a regular prison.
28:20
Speaker 1: But the idea of death row, now hang with me
28:23
Speaker 1: here folks for a second if you will, is to
28:25
Speaker 1: actually execute the inmates that are on death row. Not
28:28
Speaker 1: have them sit around and marinate and waste taxpayer dollars.
28:34
Speaker 1: If the death penalty is on the books in the
28:35
Speaker 1: state and the people decide that that's the way they're
28:38
Speaker 1: going to go, then what's the holdup? Today's article is
28:42
Speaker 1: from Fox News. Headline, Brian Kohlberger death penalty would cost
28:46
Speaker 1: $ 1 million more than life in prison, according to a report. Well, yeah,
28:52
Speaker 1: that's if you let him rot on death row. Here's
28:55
Speaker 1: an idea. Helicopter volcano. This article was authored by Michael Ruiz.
29:03
Speaker 1: Seeking the death penalty rather than life imprisonment for Idaho
29:07
Speaker 1: student murder suspect Brian Kohlberger could cost taxpayers an additional
29:11
Speaker 1: $ 1 million if he's convicted, according to a new report.
29:16
Speaker 1: Latah County Prosecuting Attorney Bill Thompson notified the court and
29:20
Speaker 1: the defense on June 26 that his office intended to
29:24
Speaker 1: seek death if Kohlberger is convicted in the November 2022 slayings.
29:29
Speaker 1: of four University of Idaho students. And if there has
29:33
Speaker 1: ever been a case that deserves to be a death
29:35
Speaker 1: penalty case, this is it. If they have the evidence
29:38
Speaker 1: that they're telling us they have then there's no doubt
29:41
Speaker 1: in my mind that this fits the parameters of what
29:44
Speaker 1: a death penalty case should be and as far as
29:48
Speaker 1: the financial cost of it well I think that could
29:51
Speaker 1: be mitigated by following some of the steps we discussed
29:54
Speaker 1: earlier like you know executing somebody in a timely manner
29:57
Speaker 1: when they're found guilty Convicted killers stack up hefty medical
30:02
Speaker 1: bills as they await execution. Gerald Pizzuto, a 67-year-old inmate,
30:07
Speaker 1: has been on death row in Idaho since 1986 while
30:11
Speaker 1: battling numerous health conditions, including most recently terminal cancer. His
30:16
Speaker 1: post-sentencing incarceration has cost taxpayers $ 1. 3 million, according to the
30:22
Speaker 1: Idaho Statesman. All right, so considering I'm done being cordial,
30:26
Speaker 1: you mean to tell me that they're wasting money on
30:28
Speaker 1: this guy? He has terminal cancer, he's been found guilty,
30:31
Speaker 1: he's been given the death sentence, and you're going to
30:33
Speaker 1: waste taxpayer dollars on treatment? Here's an idea. Directly to
30:37
Speaker 1: the death penalty chamber for this guy and be done
30:40
Speaker 1: with it. I mean, either you have the death penalty
30:42
Speaker 1: on the books or you don't. In addition to the
30:45
Speaker 1: legal delays keeping inmates on death row longer, there is
30:48
Speaker 1: also a shortage of lethal injections, which prompted Idaho to
30:52
Speaker 1: reinstate the firing squad earlier this year. The state's longest-serving
30:56
Speaker 1: death row inmates has been held for more than 40
30:59
Speaker 1: years with a tab of $ 1. 5 million. The state has
31:04
Speaker 1: themselves to blame for that. Nobody else's fault. Why are
31:07
Speaker 1: you holding this guy for so long? Do what you
31:09
Speaker 1: gotta do. Either execute him or grant him a stay
31:12
Speaker 1: or whatever and let him go to a general population
31:16
Speaker 1: for a life sentence. But all this bullshitting around, keeping
31:19
Speaker 1: people on death row for 20 years, 30 years, 40 years,
31:23
Speaker 1: enough is enough already. Kohlberger, 28, was a criminology Ph.D.
31:27
Speaker 1: student at Washington State University last year when police alleged
31:32
Speaker 1: he drove to the neighboring University of Idaho and killed
31:35
Speaker 1: four undergrads with a knife in their off-campus apartment. He
31:39
Speaker 1: is now accused of burglary and four counts of first-degree
31:42
Speaker 1: murder in the deaths of Kaylee Gonsalves, Madison Mogan, Zanna Kernodle,
31:47
Speaker 1: and Ethan Chapin. Authorities have not publicly revealed the potential
31:52
Speaker 1: motive for the massacre, but they gave conflicting statements early
31:56
Speaker 1: in the investigation about whether the house or someone inside
32:00
Speaker 1: had been targeted. According to court documents, Kohlberger allegedly stalked
32:05
Speaker 1: the King Road rental home a dozen times before the
32:08
Speaker 1: murders and returned once more hours after the slayings, but
32:12
Speaker 1: before police arrived. Now remember, the police didn't get there
32:16
Speaker 1: till like 11 or 12 o'clock the next day. So
32:19
Speaker 1: Brian Koberger showed back up at like 9 o'clock, according
32:23
Speaker 1: to the affidavit anyway, and was checking out what was
32:26
Speaker 1: going on. You know, getting a lay of the land.
32:28
Speaker 1: Going back to examine his work, if you will. And
32:32
Speaker 1: imagine what he ran into when he showed up there.
32:35
Speaker 1: No cops. He must have been like, what the hell happened?
32:37
Speaker 1: I just murdered a whole house full of people and
32:40
Speaker 1: there's no police here? Must have been a very disquieting
32:43
Speaker 1: experience for bitch-ass Koberger. A judge entered a not guilty
32:48
Speaker 1: plea on his behalf to all charges at Koberger's arraignment
32:52
Speaker 1: in May. A different judge ordered him held without bond
32:55
Speaker 1: in January after his arrest in Pennsylvania, where he is from.
33:00
Speaker 1: Prosecutors then had 60 days to decide whether they would
33:04
Speaker 1: seek the death penalty, and it was a foregone conclusion.
33:07
Speaker 1: There was no doubt that if they were going to
33:10
Speaker 1: go after Kohlberger, it was going to be in the
33:13
Speaker 1: capital punishment realm. When you have murders that occur the
33:18
Speaker 1: way that these murders occurred, there's no way that a
33:21
Speaker 1: state with the death penalty on the books is not
33:24
Speaker 1: going to pursue the death penalty. And if you don't
33:27
Speaker 1: want the death penalty on the books, I'm totally fine
33:29
Speaker 1: with that as well. But if it's the law and
33:33
Speaker 1: that's what the people of Idaho have voted on and
33:35
Speaker 1: that's what the people of Idaho want, then why is
33:38
Speaker 1: it taking so long to get people executed who obviously
33:42
Speaker 1: should have been executed a very long time ago? I'm
33:45
Speaker 1: not surprised, said Niyama Rahmani, a former federal prosecutor and
33:50
Speaker 1: Los Angeles-based trial attorney, said after Thompson's office made the announcement.
33:55
Speaker 1: This is one of the most heinous murders in Idaho
33:58
Speaker 1: state history. And when you have that designation on the murder,
34:02
Speaker 1: then it's something that has to be addressed as far
34:05
Speaker 1: as legally, right? So what is the highest punishment that
34:09
Speaker 1: you could possibly dish out? Capital punishment, killing the person
34:15
Speaker 1: who is responsible for killing these other people. And according
34:20
Speaker 1: to the state of Idaho, that is the maximum penalty
34:24
Speaker 1: for this crime. And the state of Idaho now is
34:27
Speaker 1: attempting to get the maximum penalty for this crime. There
34:36
Speaker 1: are many aggravating factors supporting the imposition of the death penalty,
34:40
Speaker 1: including multiple victims who were brutally and senselessly stabbed, he added.
34:46
Speaker 1: A six-week trial is scheduled to begin on October 2nd.
34:49
Speaker 1: And I just doubt that the trial is going to
34:51
Speaker 1: kick off on October 2nd. That's a very big ask
34:55
Speaker 1: considering all of the discovery material that they have to
34:58
Speaker 1: go through, how complex this case is, and how many
35:02
Speaker 1: different twists and turns are still on the way. So
35:06
Speaker 1: I don't think they're going to be able to hit
35:08
Speaker 1: that target date of October 2nd, and I think we'll
35:11
Speaker 1: see a postponement here, and I think this trial will
35:14
Speaker 1: kick off next summer. The prosecution's intent to seek the
35:17
Speaker 1: death penalty... Come on the same day, Kohlberger's defense team
35:21
Speaker 1: claimed their client had no connection with the victims. And
35:25
Speaker 1: we know that that has been called into question, considering
35:28
Speaker 1: what we heard about the Mad Greek and the University
35:31
Speaker 1: of Idaho, and the fact that Kohlberger allegedly had pictures
35:34
Speaker 1: of at least a couple of these victims on his phone.
35:38
Speaker 1: So it might be a loose connection, but to act
35:40
Speaker 1: like there's no connection here is a bit ridiculous. The
35:45
Speaker 1: defense team took issue with the prosecution's DNA collection and
35:49
Speaker 1: use of genetic genealogy. Defense attorney Jay Lodgson wrote in
35:53
Speaker 1: a court filing that DNA from three other unidentified males
35:58
Speaker 1: was found at the crime scene, including on a glove
36:01
Speaker 1: outside the home, which stands at the edge of campus
36:04
Speaker 1: and the heart of the university's Greek row nightlife. The
36:09
Speaker 1: defense also questioned the tracking of a white Hyundai sedan,
36:13
Speaker 1: authorities say, links Kohlberger to the murders. So all this
36:16
Speaker 1: stuff that they're challenging, you expect them to do that.
36:20
Speaker 1: There was no doubt that they were going to challenge
36:22
Speaker 1: the DNA. They were going to challenge the Elantra. They
36:25
Speaker 1: were going to challenge every last thing. And if it
36:28
Speaker 1: was just one bit of this evidence standing on its own,
36:32
Speaker 1: then Kohlberger would have a real good chance of beating
36:36
Speaker 1: this case. But when you add everything together and you
36:39
Speaker 1: ball it all up, It's very difficult to just go
36:42
Speaker 1: after one aspect of this evidence that has been provided,
36:46
Speaker 1: considering that it's all glued together by the DNA. No
36:50
Speaker 1: matter what came first, the car or the genetic genealogy,
36:54
Speaker 1: the investigation has provided precious little. Kohlberger's defense team has
36:58
Speaker 1: argued there is no connection between Mr. Kohlberger and the victims. However,
37:04
Speaker 1: according to prosecutors, DNA found on the knife sheath discovered
37:08
Speaker 1: next to Mogan's body contained Kohlberger's DNA. And therein lies
37:13
Speaker 1: the whole case, folks. The DNA on the knife sheath.
37:16
Speaker 1: The prosecution, they're going to push that as the glue
37:19
Speaker 1: that binds. And the defense, it's going to be up
37:22
Speaker 1: to them to try and poke holes in that narrative.
37:25
Speaker 1: The question is, will Ann Taylor and company be able
37:29
Speaker 1: to do that? All right, folks, that's going to do
37:32
Speaker 1: it for this one. All of the information that goes
37:34
Speaker 1: with the episode can be found in the description box. Hey, guys,
37:38
Speaker 1: it is