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Rewrite Your Story: Overcome Limiting Narratives through Self-Acceptance · No Shrinking Violets Podcast for Women

• 0:00
  Laura: If you are looking for everything on your exterior to change who you are and get the life you want, you're going to be fighting quite a while.
• 0:08
  Laura: Like it has to be a journey that comes from inside you and self-awareness and self-understanding.
• 0:13
  Laura: You can experience profound change by changing your relationship with yourself.
• 0:22
  Mary: For centuries, the phrase shrinking violet was used to diminish women, to suggest we were meant to be small and meek.
• 0:29
  Mary: But in nature, violets are anything but weak.
• 0:32
  Mary: They're resilient, beautiful, and essential to the ecosystem.
• 0:35
  Mary: Hi, I'm Mary Rothwell, licensed therapist, and each week I sit down with women who remind us that being compared to a violet isn't an insult.
• 0:44
  Mary: It's a testament to strength, endurance, and the power of taking up space and living by your true nature.
• 0:50
  Mary: If you're ready to stop shrinking and start thriving, you're in the right place.
• 0:54
  Mary: Hey violets, welcome to the show.
• 0:59
  Mary: One of the things I learned from leaving the world of higher education and starting my own business is that the biggest successes can come from not doing what the millionaires claim you should do.
• 1:09
  Mary: I tried those things.
• 1:11
  Mary: I spent the money, the time, and experienced the discordant inner voice, the cognitive dissonance, of doing things in a way that felt inauthentic.
• 1:19
  Mary: Part of my work was to figure out why I didn't trust myself, and that answer could be found partly in what happened to ignite the decision to leave a career that I loved in the first place.
• 1:30
  Mary: The final months of that career saw me as a target of lies and claims by a new supervisor that had no basis in fact.
• 1:37
  Mary: However, like the song of the sirens in the Odyssey, for a time the tale told by someone else was louder than my own inner knowing.
• 1:45
  Mary: And plainly there was no evidence for what was being said.
• 1:49
  Mary: Yet I admit I was so distracted by those lies that I wrecked my own ship on the rocks.
• 1:54
  Mary: I could have navigated around them if I had believed in my own voice, in my own story, but I didn't.
• 2:01
  Mary: And that mistrust of my own sense of self led me to abandon my initial business idea and try all the things until I had to admit that when I made choices that match my intuition and my honest narrative, not only was I more fulfilled, but I was more successful.
• 2:18
  Mary: My guest today understands the power of stories, even and especially those we believe about ourselves.
• 2:25
  Mary: Laura Nespoli is a storytelling strategist and founder of Mecian Movement who helps women understand how the stories they've been living shape their careers, relationships, and sense of self.
• 2:37
  Mary: Welcome to No Shrinking Violets, Laura.
• 2:39
  Laura: Thank you so much for having me, Mary.
• 2:42
  Mary: So I told Laura this before I hit record.
• 2:45
  Mary: There's a million ways we could go today.
• 2:47
  Mary: And so I'm so excited to dig into this and figure out where we end up because I don't know where we're going to end up.
• 2:54
  Mary: But I would love if you would start by telling us the highlights of your story, like the plot points that you feel got you to where you are today.
• 3:02
  Laura: Yeah, I absolutely.
• 3:04
  Laura: So it it um it feels very in line with your opening, um which I thought was beautiful and resonated with me.
• 3:13
  Laura: I spent most of my life not knowing who I was.
• 3:17
  Laura: I flexed others' needs, I followed all the shoulds, I lived my life based on others' expectations.
• 3:24
  Laura: And I reached a point when I was 38 where I was in a job I loved, absolutely loved the work I did.
• 3:33
  Laura: But a friend of mine highlighted that I was a highly sensitive person and I had never thought about that before.
• 3:41
  Laura: And that understanding just had me look back on my life and realize how much I had flexed to others' needs and how much that sensitivity changed who I was.
• 3:53
  Laura: Um and a week after that came up, I had this wake up in the middle of the night sort of vision for a connecting meal experience.
• 4:04
  Laura: So it wasn't just people coming together around the table at a really nice candlelit sort of experience, um, but there would be a narrative that unfolded with every course and custom.
• 4:17
  Laura: Little things to unwrap, unfold, meaning, messages of connection to connect the attendees to themselves, to one another, to the universe through food and to their communities.
• 4:30
  Laura: I had this idea that every paid experience would pay it forward to a foundation or a nonprofit in need.
• 4:37
  Laura: And once I had that sort of idea for weaving more purpose into my work, I could not let it go.
• 4:46
  Laura: And even though I loved my daytime work, which was brand and product storytelling, I felt there was a big gaping hole.
• 4:54
  Laura: And I started pursuing this idea and had a colleague who agreed to leave work and pursue it with me.
• 5:02
  Laura: He said, You bring people together around the table all the time.
• 5:06
  Laura: You could do this, you could do your regular work in story consulting and pursue this idea.
• 5:11
  Laura: So I started Mesh and Movement, which is a story consulting company.
• 5:16
  Laura: But the bigger narrative that was happening is that was that was just like the tip of the iceberg.
• 5:21
  Laura: It was the catalyst that told me I needed more connection and authenticity in my own life.
• 5:27
  Laura: And this sort of transformation journey started, the domino started to topple towards change.
• 5:34
  Laura: I realized how much my relationships lacked a sense of understanding who I was and therefore understanding the people in my life.
• 5:42
  Laura: I wanted more connection and authenticity with my core relationships.
• 5:46
  Laura: I came out, I'm bisexual.
• 5:49
  Laura: Um, and then over the course of a couple of years, it sort of mounted to this point where I confronted childhood trauma and it brought me to just a complete emotional breakdown of realizing I needed to re-weave who I was from the ground up.
• 6:06
  Laura: And that process, you know, was hard and grief-stricken, but also beautiful and magical.
• 6:13
  Laura: And um, over the course of um the last few years, three or four years, you know, I've just um been slowly rewriting my story for who I wanted to be and and living with intention.
• 6:27
  Laura: Um, but it it really all started with that sense of purpose and filling that hole.
• 6:33
  Mary: Holy moly.
• 6:35
  Mary: Okay.
• 6:35
  Mary: That's that's so awesome.
• 6:38
  Mary: There's so much there.
• 6:39
  Mary: So, you know, interesting that started with a simple observation about something that I think is true, especially for a lot of women, that we are good at reading the room, we are good at chameleon, um, typically other people choosing the color that we should be.
• 6:56
  Mary: Um, but it's interesting that you make a connection between that and then this uh wonderful idea to actually use what you already were doing, but in a way that was connecting on a different, deeper, larger level.
• 7:12
  Laura: Yeah.
• 7:12
  Laura: You know, I didn't, I didn't even share this part of the of my story, but my work has evolved.
• 7:18
  Laura: I mean, when I started, once I reached that emotional breakdown, I couldn't help but share my story after a lifetime of keeping it contained.
• 7:26
  Laura: Um, I love the name of your show, No Shrinking Violets.
• 7:30
  Laura: Um, and it just started, it was like spilling out of me.
• 7:34
  Laura: And I um a company started asking me to speak and talk about my story.
• 7:39
  Laura: It was COVID, the year of COVID, it was 2020.
• 7:43
  Laura: And they were inspired by the just open sharing of authenticity and what I was going through in this emotional breakdown.
• 7:49
  Laura: And that really got me interested in the science of story for personal growth and development.
• 7:55
  Laura: All my years, my career and working in how to change mindset and behavior with story for marketing, I started to dig into what is it about our own stories and how can we actually use that as a tool for our own growth and development?
• 8:09
  Laura: And at the same time, a handful of people were urging me to write a book because of the details of what got me to that um, you know, confronting childhood trauma were significant and a lot of people resonated with it during the year of COVID that first year.
• 8:27
  Laura: So, in writing my my book, Threads of Me and You, even in that first draft, that first process, it was incredibly healing for me.
• 8:37
  Laura: And the book has evolved so much, but the first, the first pass, um, I was actually able to apply and almost study the effects of storytelling and how that impacts us in terms of strength and resilience and connection and sense of belonging when we share our stories.
• 8:55
  Laura: I mean, there's just so much interesting through lines there in terms of.
• 9:01
  Laura: So now my my purpose, which started with that connection and authenticity, it I'm very clear, my purpose is to unite people and inspire movement, whether it's through ourselves or in in the world, through shared meaning and storytelling.
• 9:16
  Laura: And that became my guide, and it continues to serve as a North Star in everything I do.
• 9:23
  Laura: And it's it's something I tap into for courage when I'm doing something new.
• 9:28
  Laura: It's a way for me to make decisions on what's right for me and what's not.
• 9:32
  Laura: Um, but now even though I it took a while to get it clearly articulated to that point, that was the purpose all along.
• 9:39
  Laura: I know now.
• 9:40
  Mary: Yeah.
• 9:40
  Mary: Yeah.
• 9:41
  Mary: And it's interesting as a fellow author, um, the first draft of my book, I didn't intend to put anything about myself in there.
• 9:48
  Mary: And there's there's significant information.
• 9:51
  Mary: And I just attended a writer's conference, and so many people said the same thing that this was cathartic, this was revealing.
• 10:00
  Mary: And so it's so funny to me.
• 10:02
  Mary: And I've been a therapist for 35 years, how we can live inside a body and not know parts of who we are or hide parts of who we are until we do something like writing.
• 10:16
  Mary: And all of a sudden, it's like we turned a corner that we either didn't know was there or we kept the door shut.
• 10:23
  Mary: And all of a sudden, it's like, oh, well, now I can move into sort of that next authentic level of who I really am.
• 10:31
  Laura: Yeah, it's really powerful.
• 10:33
  Laura: I mean, when you when you read a story, you anytime we hear a story, it opens up parts of our brain that are related to empathy, emotional engagement, and memories.
• 10:44
  Laura: And so that's cortisol and dopamine and oxytocin and the way that they all work together.
• 10:51
  Laura: When you read your own story, I liken it to stepping outside yourself and reading your story as if you were the protagonist that you're rooting for.
• 11:00
  Laura: And it, I think it does have that effect on your brain where you're just able to kind of change your perspective and appreciate what you've been through and just take a different lens that differs from the limiting beliefs and negative self-talk within the first person inside our minds.
• 11:17
  Mary: I don't think we often see ourselves as the protagonist, to be honest.
• 11:21
  Mary: We are looking for all the flaws, or we feel like those are our main traits, are the things that are, quote, wrong with us.
• 11:30
  Mary: So we yeah, I think that shift is so important.
• 11:35
  Mary: Um so I wanted to dig more into this idea of narrative.
• 11:40
  Mary: And you mentioned a couple times the trauma of childhood.
• 11:44
  Mary: And what I think we don't realize till later is the narratives.
• 11:50
  Mary: So I think we start with knowing our narrative.
• 11:53
  Mary: We know who we are when we're young.
• 11:55
  Mary: I talk about this all the time.
• 11:56
  Mary: And then we start to have other characters come into our story and they start to define who we are.
• 12:02
  Mary: And we believe them because we're a kid.
• 12:05
  Mary: And it's like, well, I thought this thing was cool, but it must not be cool if all these other people at school are saying, or I thought this emotion was okay, but my mom or my dad reacts this way when I have this emotion.
• 12:16
  Mary: And so those experiences, and then if we're talking about true trauma, they really write parts that are kind of fiction.
• 12:27
  Mary: Does that make sense?
• 12:28
  Mary: That's sort of how I'm thinking about it.
• 12:30
  Laura: Oh, yeah, absolutely.
• 12:31
  Laura: I mean, I I talk a lot about our beliefs inform our thoughts, feelings, and actions.
• 12:37
  Laura: So everything we become, how we show up in the world, what we think, what we do, what we go out and you know, decide in our lives stems from beliefs.
• 12:46
  Laura: And if those beliefs start with limiting beliefs as a child, you know, it just the cycle continues and those actions that you take just reinforce the old beliefs.
• 12:57
  Laura: Um, it's yeah, it's absolutely true.
• 13:00
  Laura: My my story started with just believing I it was not okay to have feelings.
• 13:05
  Laura: I was, you know, I grew up believing that my feelings didn't matter and that I should never think about myself before thinking about somebody else.
• 13:15
  Laura: And so I was, it was reinforced that I was not the protagonist of my story.
• 13:20
  Laura: I really needed to live to make others happy.
• 13:23
  Laura: Um, so it never, you know, I any sense of who I might have been, it just never occurred to me that it even mattered.
• 13:31
  Mary: But yet so sensitive to the other, the experiences of other people and their emotions.
• 13:36
  Laura: Yes, absolutely.
• 13:37
  Laura: And so, I mean, I spent a lot of my adult, like high school through young adult years in my 20s in and out of the hospital.
• 13:46
  Laura: I had chronic illness, inflammatory disease, you know, all sorts of things, cancer and breast tumor, and but uh especially an autoimmune um inflammatory response to life's stimulants.
• 14:00
  Laura: And for the longest time, I just had no idea what was wrong with me.
• 14:03
  Laura: But once I understood how much I'd been absorbing and never allowing an outlet, you know, I just realized that, you know, I I did so much damage on my nervous system by just pushing things down so much, which is why when I finally realized how, you know, how emotional neglect and you know how that childhood experience impacted me, like it all came pouring, pouring out of me.
• 14:32
  Laura: And I mean, I've never felt better from a physical perspective now that I share openly and have done the work and have addressed those relationships.
• 14:43
  Mary: Well, it's it's really interesting and I think important that you bring up that physical aspect because we often are divorced, we're sort of disconnected, divorced from that and how our emotions and those things play into it.
• 14:57
  Mary: And, you know, at one point I made this the connection, especially with cancer.
• 15:00
  Mary: So I had thyroid cancer.
• 15:02
  Mary: Well, your thyroid is at the base of your throat.
• 15:04
  Mary: So where else would you hold stuck energy if you don't use your voice than there?
• 15:10
  Mary: And so, you know, people say, Well, I grew up near Three Mile Island in Pennsylvania.
• 15:15
  Mary: So it was like, well, maybe it was the radiation there.
• 15:16
  Mary: And I'm thinking, oh no, I think it was that my voice was stuck and that energy got stuck there.
• 15:21
  Mary: And I know there are people that are like, oh, that's so woo-woo.
• 15:24
  Mary: But I can tell you the people I know that have had breast cancer, they have the tenderest hearts.
• 15:28
  Mary: And I feel like energy is getting stuck near there.
• 15:31
  Mary: So I think it's so important to recognize that our body can sometimes know what's happening before our mind does.
• 15:39
  Laura: Oh, yeah, absolutely.
• 15:41
  Laura: Absolutely.
• 15:42
  Mary: Yeah.
• 15:42
  Mary: So I think listening to that, okay.
• 15:44
  Mary: So this idea of narrative and who writes our narrative.
• 15:47
  Mary: So I work now mostly with women.
• 15:50
  Mary: I worked a lot with college students.
• 15:52
  Mary: And so when I think about how each of those sort of populations or groups of people held their narratives, it's very different.
• 16:02
  Mary: So people would come to college and they would have this idea of what is what am I supposed to do with my life?
• 16:08
  Mary: Very informed by the adults around them.
• 16:11
  Mary: And they were on a journey of recognizing, wait a minute, I'm in a major I don't want, or I'm at a college I don't want to be at, or all of those things.
• 16:21
  Mary: When I'm talking about women later in life, they have carried this narrative much, much longer that I'm a mom, or I'm, or worse, I'm not a good mom, or whatever the career narrative is.
• 16:35
  Mary: And so the college students were a little bit easier.
• 16:38
  Mary: But when I you're working with someone who has sort of this entrenched idea of who they are, I have seen them, first of all, not really know, well, I don't know what my true story is, or two, I think I know, but I'm really afraid to tell it.
• 16:54
  Mary: What do you what are your thoughts when I say those things?
• 16:58
  Laura: Oh, it's fascinating.
• 17:00
  Laura: So um I think I work with women as well in helping them uncover their story from a go-to-market business perspective.
• 17:09
  Laura: But I recently created a program because after writing my book, and and my book has a whole workbook in the back about connecting with your own experience and your own, it's the the framework is really follow those threads of discovery, unravel their meaning, understand what's at the core, and reweave your story with intention for who you want to be.
• 17:31
  Laura: And in doing this consulting work on the go-to-market business side, what I saw was women who knew their business opportunity, they understood what their market potential was and what their go-to-market story should be.
• 17:50
  Laura: The biggest challenge they have was having the courage to share it.
• 17:54
  Laura: The having the confidence to feel validated that they should take up space with their story.
• 18:01
  Laura: And so I realized how much of our personal narratives are holding us back from even our professional narratives and how we want to grow our business, grow our work, or show up out in the world.
• 18:14
  Laura: This limitation that you're talking about, like that's holding like the predefined narrative, it's not just in like our identity work, it's it's everywhere, you know.
• 18:25
  Laura: Um, and so what's been interesting about this go-to-market storytelling program, own your story, every one of my clients has told me the most powerful aspect that they're so happy to get to a purpose articulation for their business, but the thing that they wouldn't have been able to unlock is what are the what was the barrier story getting in the way of actually sharing it and feeling confident and standing behind it?
• 18:50
  Laura: It's such a a huge barrier.
• 18:53
  Laura: Um, and it's interesting when you said, you know, um, with college students, they're asking, you know, what should I, what should I be?
• 19:01
  Mary: Yeah.
• 19:01
  Laura: I actually think we get to a point in midlife as women where we have the same question, what am I, what should I do with my life?
• 19:10
  Laura: What am I supposed to be doing?
• 19:12
  Laura: But I think, as you said, the the barriers, the narrative narrative, the limiting belief narrative is so strong and so entrenched at that point that that we shy away, we feel guilt, we don't even want to think about that nagging sort of question.
• 19:29
  Laura: Maybe we don't even say it out loud that there's a sense of something calling for us, but we're afraid of what it might be because we don't think we should or could or we're allowed or have the permission to even answer that call or explore it with curiosity.
• 19:47
  unknown: Yeah.
• 19:48
  Mary: Yeah.
• 19:48
  Mary: So you mentioned a barrier narrative.
• 19:50
  Mary: So that's really the story about what we're afraid of, what's holding us back?
• 19:56
  Laura: Yeah.
• 19:56
  Laura: What's getting in the way of you owning your story?
• 19:59
  Laura: What's it what's hold yeah, what are those beliefs that feel like they're not even yours, maybe?
• 20:04
  Laura: Do an exercise where I have someone list all of the shoulds that rule like, why wouldn't you do that?
• 20:11
  Laura: Like, I should be doing this, I should be doing this, I should be now.
• 20:14
  Laura: Look at them and which what shoulds came from you?
• 20:17
  Laura: Where did these come from?
• 20:20
  Mary: Yeah.
• 20:20
  Mary: Well, and the other thing that I think women bring into this process is guilt.
• 20:25
  Mary: That if they have this idea, well, you know, I really have not been living authentically, and you mentioned coming out as bisexual.
• 20:33
  Mary: So that's a thing where if you're in a marriage, a heterosexual marriage, that's a bombshell.
• 20:42
  Mary: And so that I that sort of do I just keep living this way so I protect that thing.
• 20:51
  Mary: But if I am authentic, I can be rejected.
• 20:55
  Mary: And you know, the interesting conundrum there is don't you want to just be loved for who you are?
• 21:01
  Mary: And if it is blow it up, then that wasn't the thing.
• 21:06
  Mary: But boy, is that a barrier.
• 21:08
  Laura: Right.
• 21:09
  Laura: Yes, huge.
• 21:10
  Laura: I mean, that was uh such a scary part of this journey.
• 21:14
  Laura: Um and I think you're right, it starts with the desire for authenticity.
• 21:22
  Laura: So I started to realize that connection, true connection, authentic connection, based on my real feelings and true understanding of myself was no it was a non-negotiable.
• 21:35
  Laura: I it it wasn't even it didn't even feel like a conscious choice.
• 21:40
  Laura: It was like a visceral response in my body that I could not ignore.
• 21:45
  Laura: Um and so with that in mind, I wouldn't have been able to stay in a relationship inauthentically.
• 21:54
  Laura: I could I that was what forced me to to speak my truth and and put it there.
• 21:59
  Laura: Between us and say, I want this life.
• 22:03
  Laura: I chose you.
• 22:05
  Laura: I chose this life.
• 22:07
  Laura: I I want this, but I want it on different terms with deeper understanding between us and deeper connection.
• 22:15
  Laura: And you're right.
• 22:16
  Laura: If if that I'm grateful to my husband, he put in a lot of work.
• 22:21
  Laura: And we were stuck for a long time just cycling in place.
• 22:26
  Laura: And if it weren't for, I mean, to be completely honest, if it weren't for the fact that we have kids and we have a commitment, and you know, and one friend who said to me, if you know, you have to give everything to your marriage before you walk away.
• 22:43
  Laura: So that if you need to walk away, which is fine if that needs to happen, you know that you did everything first.
• 22:50
  Laura: Um, and so yeah, I I had understood that value that value on authenticity was non-negotiable for me, but I was also ready to make the commitment.
• 23:02
  Laura: I didn't want to tear down my life.
• 23:03
  Laura: I I wanted I wanted all of these elements in my life.
• 23:08
  Laura: I just wanted them woven together in a different way, in a way that was more true, clear, and mutual.
• 23:15
  Laura: Um so I'm lucky, I'm lucky, we're lucky, we put in the work, and it took a long time.
• 23:22
  Laura: But we my husband had to do the same thing.
• 23:25
  Laura: He grew up never being allowed to have his feelings and know who he was.
• 23:30
  Laura: And so we had this journey of self-discovery side by side and relationship discovery at the same time.
• 23:38
  Mary: Yeah, so much power in that, but so much fear to to take that step.
• 23:43
  Mary: And I'm curious, were you surprised that he kind of knuckled down and did that work with you?
• 23:51
  Laura: Um I think because he didn't at first, it wasn't a surprise.
• 23:58
  Laura: You know, like for a long time, I was like, why aren't you doing this with me?
• 24:04
  Laura: Um, and so then when it came along, it it was gradual enough.
• 24:08
  Laura: We it was a gradual opening up.
• 24:10
  Laura: Um I don't know, that's an it's it's an interesting question.
• 24:15
  Laura: I'm not sure if I have an answer for that.
• 24:17
  Laura: Yeah, I don't know that I felt surprised because I just thought, you know, if if we're gonna do this, we're gonna do it, right?
• 24:25
  Mary: Yeah.
• 24:25
  Laura: You know, we chose to do this together, and this is how we're gonna get there.
• 24:29
  Mary: Yeah.
• 24:30
  Laura: Um, yeah.
• 24:32
  Mary: Well, and I think over the years, hearing client stories, when they had something big to share, something they've been hiding, and whether it was sexual identity or gender identity, whatever it was, it could have been as simple with in some cultures you want to change your major to art.
• 24:48
  unknown: Yeah.
• 24:48
  Mary: So that's huge.
• 24:49
  Mary: Yeah.
• 24:50
  Mary: So I think we sometimes have this idea that here are the people that won't support me.
• 24:56
  Mary: And I've it's been amazing the times when, especially my college students would come back and say, I never thought so-and-so would be on board with this.
• 25:05
  Mary: They are my biggest supporter.
• 25:06
  Mary: And so I'm always curious that is do we have a sense really of, oh, these people aren't going to support me, or is it truly that we so believe what we've told ourselves that we're just creating barriers where really they aren't.
• 25:23
  Mary: They they aren't gonna be there.
• 25:25
  Laura: It's a good question.
• 25:26
  Laura: I think having gone through this, there were people who said to me about my husband, he's never gonna change.
• 25:32
  Laura: And I again going back to that idea, I have to try.
• 25:37
  Laura: And so I think coming out of this, I've learned that people can change.
• 25:42
  Laura: And as long as you want to, like every moment is an opportunity to begin again.
• 25:49
  Laura: Yeah you know, every we're every day we are confronted with so many choices to show up as the person we want to be, even in the life we have.
• 25:58
  Laura: It doesn't, you know, it doesn't require some massive overhaul to show up in a totally different way.
• 26:04
  Laura: It just means just taking those daily encounters we have with choices and being more intentional about the choices that we make.
• 26:13
  Mary: Yeah.
• 26:14
  Mary: And I think some of it comes from an intolerance of things not not being okay.
• 26:20
  Mary: That we want, we want to arrive, we want to look like, and and it's interesting this idea of we do brand ourselves on social media for sure.
• 26:28
  Mary: We want to be that brand that we've created.
• 26:31
  Mary: And we just, again, I'm gonna say in this in the United States culture, many people have that discomfort or intolerance for things that are not black and white or that are messy and unsure.
• 26:46
  Mary: We hate uncertainty.
• 26:48
  Mary: And I think that's another barrier that if I make this move, it should be like a light switch and everything is is just fine, and it's it's not.
• 26:59
  Laura: Yeah, totally.
• 27:01
  Laura: That's a great point.
• 27:03
  Laura: And I can't say enough how much I spun in not understanding anything.
• 27:09
  Laura: Like when we started our conversation, and I said, you know, and then I had this discovery, and then I took these steps, and the domino in the midst of that journey, I was like, what is happening to me?
• 27:21
  Laura: What is this?
• 27:22
  Laura: Why?
• 27:23
  Laura: Like, where am I going?
• 27:25
  Laura: What's pulling me?
• 27:26
  Laura: Why I I'm terrified.
• 27:28
  Laura: It was there was zero clarity in the midst of it all.
• 27:33
  Laura: It's only in the processing and looking back and really understanding what was happening.
• 27:39
  Laura: And that's why, again, going back to this idea of narrative, when you take the time to reflect on those experiences, even in morning pages, for instance, just like writing in the you know, fresh mind.
• 27:52
  Laura: I don't know if you've heard of the artist way from Julia Cameron, highly recommend it.
• 27:56
  Laura: It was huge for me.
• 27:57
  Laura: But even in morning pages, you can understand yesterday with new insight and clarity just from writing that down and processing, you know, a different perspective on your experience.
• 28:10
  Laura: But it is messy work.
• 28:11
  Laura: And I think, I mean, that's one of the things that gave me the push to share my story.
• 28:18
  Laura: As every time I shared when I was in the midst of that breakdown, I was in, I was a disaster.
• 28:23
  Laura: I was going through ambiguous grief.
• 28:26
  Laura: I had quote unquote lost my mom who was still alive.
• 28:30
  Laura: It was so traumatic, and I couldn't help but cry on client meetings.
• 28:34
  Laura: If someone just said, How are you?
• 28:36
  Laura: I immediately started to cry.
• 28:38
  Laura: I was not okay.
• 28:39
  Laura: And this went on for months.
• 28:41
  Laura: It was so messy.
• 28:44
  Laura: But I think um, in just I had to go through it.
• 28:49
  Laura: And when I embraced, because I was so committed to authentic connection, and I was so committed to the power of sharing my story, even in writing my book all the way, you know, year, a couple of years later, it's so hard to put it out there.
• 29:04
  Laura: But the importance of it is that I know every time I share my story, someone else gets a little bit more permission to maybe explore that unnamed feeling, maybe conjure the courage to wonder and to challenge what their narrative may have been.
• 29:22
  Laura: Um, and so I'm glad you raised that point.
• 29:25
  Laura: This is messy work.
• 29:27
  Laura: It's so beautiful and it can be so powerful.
• 29:31
  Laura: And what comes out on the other side is liberation.
• 29:35
  Laura: It is total freedom of, you know, no longer being contained by something that's not yours, those expectations and those narratives.
• 29:44
  Laura: You don't have to carry them anymore.
• 29:46
  Mary: Yeah.
• 29:47
  Mary: And to circle back on kind of what we started talking about originally, then when you create connection, it is real.
• 29:55
  Mary: I mean, people will fall away.
• 29:57
  Mary: I mean, I think we need to be honest with that also, that you're not coming out of this with every relationship intact because you are not the person that some people believe or convince themselves or convinced you that you are.
• 30:10
  Mary: So there's loss in all of this.
• 30:13
  Mary: But I believe what you gain when you have that, I call it like a you feel like a click.
• 30:20
  Mary: When you're living authentically, you like click into place and it's sort of like this moment of almost like moment of silence, like I've arrived.
• 30:29
  Mary: Like, or when you're walking through the forest and you come out of the trees into the clearing, and you're like, okay, like I see where I've been and I see where I've arrived at.
• 30:38
  Mary: But what it creates is truly this connection, which is so interesting that you had that idea, and it sounds like it was kind of nearer to the beginning of this, you know, opening up in this journey for you, but it was exactly the thing that was going to happen to you personally.
• 30:56
  Laura: Yeah, it's wild that that idea about connecting people around the table, it became a metaphor for everything that needed to happen from that moment forward.
• 31:07
  Laura: It's unbelievable.
• 31:09
  Mary: And then you have the tolerance.
• 31:11
  Mary: If people say you're too much or you're not for me, you're like, okay, like the end of your story is not tied up anymore in pleasing and being what someone wants you to be, fitting into sort of that outline that someone made for you.
• 31:29
  Laura: Yes, there's so much more peace, you know, and I I did a lot of work in terms of mindfulness along the way.
• 31:37
  Laura: Um, you know, what I went through with my mom and needing to confront childhood, a lot of my upbringing was um almost like a spiritual superiority that that she she used spirituality as you know, um a mantra and needed um needed me to not be human, needed me to rise above my human ego.
• 32:01
  Laura: Um and so when we went through this, you know, when I went through an emotional breakdown, the practice that I had in morning reflection and my morning meditation, I I lost all connection to it.
• 32:15
  Laura: It almost just created this visceral toxicity inside me.
• 32:20
  Laura: So I had to find another way to channel that sigh.
• 32:25
  Laura: I needed to take care of my mind.
• 32:28
  Laura: Um and I I started following the work of Sam Harris and his, I used his app, Waking Up.
• 32:33
  Laura: He's a neural neuroscientist, neurologist, um, and he says it's a new operating system for the mind with all the woo-woo stuff.
• 32:42
  Laura: And so I dug into just the practicalities of mindful attention and what you pay attention to.
• 32:50
  Laura: And I think that and what you're talking about, where once you're you click into place with true authenticity and the wrong things tend to fall away.
• 32:59
  Laura: The people that aren't aligned with you fall away, but you don't stress about it because you know what matters to you and they're not right for you either.
• 33:08
  Laura: Um, and I think mindfulness was a really big part of moving through those changes with not the questioning, racing thoughts about like, well, what will they think, or like, how will I explain this to them?
• 33:22
  Laura: Learning that I don't need to explain myself to anybody's a huge, huge win.
• 33:30
  Laura: You know, you don't understand me, that's okay.
• 33:33
  Laura: It's okay.
• 33:34
  Mary: Yeah.
• 33:35
  Mary: And again, a journey to get there.
• 33:37
  Mary: So if there's people listening, which I'm guessing there will be women listening who they hear this and it's almost like the mirage that they're looking out there and they're like, I want to get to that island so badly, but they feel the guilt, um, or whatever the other emotion is, the fear.
• 33:56
  Mary: So you use the term borrowing other people's belief in you.
• 34:00
  Mary: How can that help?
• 34:01
  Mary: Is that a starting point?
• 34:03
  Mary: Talk a little about that.
• 34:05
  Laura: Yeah, I uh thank you.
• 34:07
  Laura: Um I didn't believe in myself at the start of this journey.
• 34:10
  Laura: So my colleague who was like, you can just start your business.
• 34:14
  Laura: I was like, no, I can't.
• 34:15
  Laura: Um, if you don't have people, you said this also at the beginning of our conversation that not everyone will be, they'll encourage you to kind of stay the same.
• 34:25
  Laura: People are not comfortable with change.
• 34:28
  Laura: And most likely the people who are closest to you will sense that change in you will require change in them.
• 34:34
  Laura: I believe the space, you know, every relationship is just the space between two people.
• 34:40
  Laura: And if one of those people shifts their position and where they are, naturally the space shifts.
• 34:46
  Laura: And so change in you will feel threatening to change in the people around you.
• 34:52
  Laura: And I don't think that needs to mean let go of them, like I was experiencing.
• 34:58
  Laura: I think um I borrowed belief on I it kind of goes hand in hand with find your people.
• 35:04
  Laura: I, you know, when I explain, I was starting to share that what I was going through.
• 35:09
  Laura: And when I shared and someone said, You should be my friend, so and so, or borrow belief from writers, authors, other people, my story.
• 35:18
  Laura: I share my story because we are inspired and connected by our stories.
• 35:22
  Laura: Threads of me and you is, you know, threads of me because it was my story.
• 35:27
  Laura: And then I realized as I shared it that no matter our experiences, no matter your background, no matter where you're coming from, this is our shared experience of growing and expanding into who we're meant to be.
• 35:38
  Laura: So I think you can borrow on that belief, whether it's from people you know in your immediate circle or whether it's people you connect with over, you know, understanding alignment as you start to understand where your alignment takes you, or just books and other people's stories that inspire you.
• 35:58
  Laura: They're out there for a reason.
• 36:00
  Laura: So um, borrow on the belief in that sense can can mean a lot of different things, but just connect to it wherever you can.
• 36:07
  unknown: Yeah.
• 36:08
  Mary: And get and and take the first step.
• 36:10
  Mary: Not you're not gonna know the next step, probably.
• 36:13
  Mary: Yes.
• 36:14
  Mary: So you started to live this way to kind of speak your true story, not knowing what would happen with your family.
• 36:23
  Mary: And I think that's the biggest fear that women feel like, well, look what look at everything I have.
• 36:29
  Mary: It's not perfect, but it's mine.
• 36:31
  Mary: What if I lose that?
• 36:34
  Mary: Can and you were able to really be authentic in that space by saying, Here's like you said, I chose you, but here's the thing.
• 36:43
  Mary: There's more of me than I need to share with you.
• 36:47
  Mary: That is has to be that's the scary step.
• 36:52
  Laura: Yeah, right.
• 36:52
  Laura: Yeah, it is.
• 36:54
  Laura: And I think um, you know, anytime someone says, What's the one thing you want people to take away from your book?
• 37:00
  Laura: I always say, you don't have to tear down your life to weave the life you want.
• 37:05
  Laura: It doesn't need to be rebuilt.
• 37:07
  Laura: You just, you know, it's rewoven.
• 37:08
  Laura: All those threads can be there.
• 37:10
  Laura: Um but it it is scary to get there.
• 37:14
  Laura: And I would say the the subtitle, Unravel Your Limits, Weave Growth from Within, so much of our fulfillment and satisfaction and sense of who we are is within us.
• 37:29
  Laura: And so if if you are looking for everything on your exterior to change who you are and get the life you want, you're gonna be fighting quite a while.
• 37:38
  Laura: Like it has to be a journey that comes from inside you and self-awareness and self-understanding.
• 37:44
  Laura: And so much of that work, you you can experience profound change just by changing your relationship with yourself.
• 37:51
  Laura: Yes.
• 37:52
  Laura: Um, and I think there's no threat to start there.
• 37:55
  Laura: Right, you know, and what if if you start that relationship and you get to a solid place of self-understanding, self-awareness, and you know who you are through and through, and your exterior life isn't aligned with that, well, then you're in a better place anyway to make that change.
• 38:11
  Laura: But you can start just with yourself.
• 38:14
  Mary: Yes.
• 38:14
  Mary: And that makes it accessible, that you're not, you know, you're not looking at the end journey yet or the end point.
• 38:22
  Mary: You're looking at, okay, what's the first step?
• 38:25
  Mary: And that's really, I think, turning inward and doing some of the things like you mentioned, the artist's way, obviously your book.
• 38:33
  Mary: And I want you to, in a minute, tell us a little bit more about it.
• 38:36
  Mary: Um, but I think those are the starting places, and there are really amazing resources out there, and you have you can have nothing.
• 38:45
  Mary: That's where mindfulness starts.
• 38:46
  Mary: You can have stillness for, and mindfulness doesn't mean you have to go meditate for an hour.
• 38:51
  Mary: You can sit still for 30 seconds and watch what comes up and observe it and be curious.
• 38:57
  Mary: You don't have to do anything except observe something, and that is your first step.
• 39:02
  Laura: Yeah, absolutely.
• 39:04
  Mary: Low barrier to entry.
• 39:05
  Mary: Yes.
• 39:06
  Mary: Yes, very much so.
• 39:08
  Mary: Well, what an amazing story.
• 39:11
  Mary: And I love the honesty because again, when we talk about brand, you know this, you're doing all the work with these companies, corporations, products because you're creating in the end result.
• 39:24
  Mary: You what does this look like to the world?
• 39:26
  Mary: We put a brand out there, but the work behind the brand.
• 39:31
  Mary: So it's almost like let's rebrand ourselves.
• 39:34
  Mary: And it's ironic because I did one of my online courses I created.
• 39:38
  Mary: I took, I one of the little assignments was, I want you to create an Instagram page for what you truly want your life to look like.
• 39:45
  Mary: Not polishing it up to like, here's me and the kids on the holiday morning, and when really we just had a huge fight and everybody was crying and we're miserable.
• 39:56
  Mary: But what do you what is that authentic moment that you would like to have in your life?
• 40:01
  Mary: We're not authentic, usually, on social media.
• 40:06
  Mary: So just so many interesting things, I think, for people to think about.
• 40:10
  Mary: So tell us a little more about the kind of the structure of your book.
• 40:13
  Mary: Remind us what it is called, tell us what else you offer and where to find you, and I'll put all the stuff in the show notes.
• 40:20
  Laura: Amazing.
• 40:21
  Laura: Um, thank you.
• 40:22
  Laura: My book is called Threads of Me and You Unravel Your Limits, Weave Growth From Within.
• 40:28
  Laura: And it's my story.
• 40:30
  Laura: So a lot of what we discussed today, and it starts with that sense of maybe there's more out there and what is this feeling, and following those curiosities and how to lean into that curiosity.
• 40:45
  Laura: I call it wonderlust.
• 40:47
  Laura: Curiosity is so strong that you're actually able to overcome the fear of what you might discover, just being curious.
• 40:55
  Laura: Um, and it takes you through my unraveling and all the challenges I've I've talked about and the reweaving process.
• 41:05
  Laura: And there is a workbook in the back.
• 41:06
  Laura: So there's corresponding takeaways and exercises for every chapter of the book.
• 41:12
  Laura: I mean, you can find all of this on my website, meshin movement, M-E-S-H-I-N movement.com.
• 41:19
  Mary: So wonderful.
• 41:21
  Mary: And I pronounced it wrong in the intro.
• 41:23
  Mary: So, people, it's meshin.
• 41:24
  Mary: I said meshin.
• 41:25
  Mary: But thank you, Laura.
• 41:27
  Mary: I have loved this conversation.
• 41:30
  Laura: Same.
• 41:30
  Laura: Thank you so much, Mary.
• 41:31
  Laura: I really appreciate it.
• 41:32
  Laura: I love an honest talk.
• 41:34
  Mary: Yes, yes.
• 41:35
  Mary: Well, you're very welcome.
• 41:36
  Mary: You made my day better.
• 41:37
  Mary: And I want to thank everyone for listening.
• 41:39
  Mary: Please take a minute to click the link in the show notes and leave me a written or voice text with your thoughts on this episode.
• 41:45
  Mary: Those always make my day.
• 41:47
  Mary: And until next time, go out into the world and be the amazing, resilient, vibrant violet that you are.