Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Mom: 'They kidnapped my newborn from Hospital!' Couple fake kidnap and death to foil hit-man, pregnant mom begs for help

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Mom: 'They kidnapped my newborn from Hospital!' Couple fake kidnap and death to foil hit-man, pregnant mom begs for help · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

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Speaker 1: on Sirius XM Triumph Channel one thirty two. The people
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Speaker 1: they once loved paid to have them killed. Prosecutors played
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Speaker 1: audio recordings of defendant Leon Jacob talking to an undercover
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Speaker 1: officer posing as a hit man. She is Megan Vera Kiss,
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Speaker 1: Jacob's ex girlfriend. He was charged with a sultaner in
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Speaker 1: the spring of last year. The defense, on the other hand,
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Speaker 1: argues Jacob loved his ex girlfriend, but prosecutors saved those
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Speaker 1: feelings of love turned into anger in March of last year,
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Speaker 1: Jacob had started dating veterinarian Valerie McDaniel. The undercover officer
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Speaker 1: testified both talk to him about dealing with their exes.
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Speaker 1: The targets of the alleged plot even worked with investigators
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Speaker 1: staging their own kidnapping and murder. Oh what a tangled
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Speaker 1: web we weave when first we practice to deceive. Sadly,
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Speaker 1: I can't take credit for that. I did not make
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Speaker 1: it up. Listen to this. A woman stages her own kidnapping,
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Speaker 1: a man stages his own murder, complete with fake bloody photographs. Why,
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Speaker 1: it was all part of an elaborate sting. They wanted
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Speaker 1: to catch the man who paid a hit man twenty
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Speaker 1: thou dollars to assassinate both of them. When you see
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Speaker 1: these photos, you see the woman, she's crying, she's gagged,
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Speaker 1: she has duct tape over her mouth, her hands and
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Speaker 1: ankles are bound. It's Megan Vicus. She looks kidnapped, crying
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Speaker 1: all bent over the photos of the man I'm talking about,
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Speaker 1: Mark McDaniel, with a bullet wound to his head, blood
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Speaker 1: pouring down his face. Surprise, she's not kidnapped and he's
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Speaker 1: not dead. I'm Nancy Grace, this is crime Stories. Thank
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Speaker 1: you for being with us. WHOA take a listen to
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Speaker 1: this and you'll hear that all options are on the
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Speaker 1: table when it comes to me, all of kidnapping her,
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Speaker 1: planning drugs in her car to get her in trouble,
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Speaker 1: and ultimately killing And there will be no question that
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Speaker 1: Megan's death is an option, a prominent option in the
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Speaker 1: plane here because you're here to defend it himself state
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Speaker 1: that he would like to kill her himself. You heard
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Speaker 1: that right. You will hear him say he will make
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Speaker 1: reference to potassium chloride that will stop her heart. And
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Speaker 1: then it's untracing. So the stakes here are clear. He
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Speaker 1: believes he's talking to it hit man. He is talking
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Speaker 1: about killing his ex girl straight out to Jason Ocean's
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Speaker 1: veteran trial lawyer throughout the North East, joining me, Jason,
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Speaker 1: I mean, does it never end another guy ordering a hit?
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Speaker 1: And this here's the kicker, He's the X. It's over,
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Speaker 1: but he still wants to kill her and her new boyfriend.
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Speaker 1: And now the court has been shown stage photos of
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Speaker 1: the new boyfriend pretending to be dead from a bullet
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Speaker 1: to the head. There's blood going down his face. The
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Speaker 1: side of his head and her the the ex the woman,
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Speaker 1: the alleged victim in this case, pretending to be kidnapped,
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Speaker 1: all tied up and bound and gagged. They posed for
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Speaker 1: these photos for police to catch the guy who hired
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Speaker 1: a hit man to kill them, both Megan Vericus and
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Speaker 1: mc McDaniel posing for a detectives who were trying to
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Speaker 1: snare their former partners. And it's just not Leon Jacob,
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Speaker 1: it's also Valerie McDaniels, so both of their exes are
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Speaker 1: in the murder plot. Jason, I mean, really can't get
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Speaker 1: any better than this. Wasn't wasn't there a song? My
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Speaker 1: ex is from Texas? I mean, it just seems to
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Speaker 1: fit perfectly as the Netflix movie of the week of
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Speaker 1: it's a reality show. And by the way, just as
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Speaker 1: a point of questioning, doesn't the general public realize that
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Speaker 1: there are really no people out there who are hit men,
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Speaker 1: as if that's their job, that you could hire someone.
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Speaker 1: They're all cops, They're all undercover and just waiting for
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Speaker 1: the sickness to come out. I just don't know who
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Speaker 1: thinks there's really yours like the Spider and the Fly,
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Speaker 1: listen to this. Dr Bethany Marshall l a psychoanalysts joining us. Now,
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Speaker 1: the McDaniels were divorced, and very Ka said ended her
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Speaker 1: relationship with Jacob, but she still owed him her ex
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Speaker 1: husband one point to five million dollars from selling of
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Speaker 1: their estates in their homes and they're belongings. And he
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Speaker 1: was a subject of a protection order stopping him from
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Speaker 1: contacting his ex Okay, so there you go. So both
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Speaker 1: exes had motivation to kill their exes. Can you imagine
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Speaker 1: being in a new relationship and all of a sudden
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Speaker 1: you have to stage your own kidnapping in your own
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Speaker 1: death in order to throw both of your ex relationship.
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Speaker 1: I mean, what is it? What are the stats? Okay,
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Speaker 1: if your first marriage is in divorce, okay, that's about
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Speaker 1: fifty of marriages I think. But then your second marriage,
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Speaker 1: you know, no offense. But I'm not in the business
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Speaker 1: of playing Cupid. Of these two don't make it. I
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Speaker 1: can't help that. But what about this, listen, listen? Prosecutors
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Speaker 1: say he the defendant Leon Jacobs, wanted her dad so
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Speaker 1: she couldn't testify against him and his stalking case. Like,
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Speaker 1: if that doesn't prove the stalking right there, he's trying
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Speaker 1: to have her killed. So she and that's so typical
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Speaker 1: with stalking, where the perpetrator says, I either want to
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Speaker 1: own you or possess you, or I want you dead.
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Speaker 1: I mean, that's really the typical psychology. Um. So, so
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Speaker 1: it sounds like he was stalking her. He wanted to
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Speaker 1: get her back. But at the same time, the psychology
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Speaker 1: of stalking is to go after the victim for perceived
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Speaker 1: rejection because stalker's always imagine that there's a relationship when
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Speaker 1: there's evidence there's no evidence to support that. So he
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Speaker 1: must have imagined he was with her even though she
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Speaker 1: had already moved on with her life, and he either
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Speaker 1: wanted to kill her or get her back. It's such
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Speaker 1: a a sick and twisted way to say, Oh, it's
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Speaker 1: dog the bounty hunter, right, isn't that the name of
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Speaker 1: the A and A show dog Bounty Hunt in I
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Speaker 1: got a saucepar spot for Beth Chapman. I think she's awesome,
8:05
Speaker 1: but the state would have And I'm working this in
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Speaker 1: Just go with me on this, Jason and Bethany. I'm
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Speaker 1: I'm getting to a point here, all right, So how
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Speaker 1: do I get Beth Chapman and Dog the bounty hunter
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Speaker 1: in this scenario. All right, this is how the defense
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Speaker 1: would have you believe. In this case, which is a
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Speaker 1: double hit, a man and a woman want their ex
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Speaker 1: is dead for various reasons. So the ex is find
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Speaker 1: out about it, they go to police, and they stage
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Speaker 1: their own kidnapping and murder and take photos to snare
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Speaker 1: the murderous duo. The defense would have you believe in
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Speaker 1: entrapment that the state set them up. They had nothing
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Speaker 1: to do with this, They were lured into it by
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Speaker 1: the would be hitman. Zach Ah. Think about all the
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Speaker 1: bounty hunters that you have seen on Dog the Bounty
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Speaker 1: hunt her. I just spoke at a bail bond gathering
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Speaker 1: in Vegas and I met a lot of very wonderful
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Speaker 1: people there. But um, think about bounty hunters. They want
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Speaker 1: you dead or alive. Okay? He actually the defendant, Leon Jacobs,
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Speaker 1: blabbed to a Bill Bonsman. This is not a cop,
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Speaker 1: this is not an FBI agent. It's a Bell bondsman
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Speaker 1: who's out there getting down and dirty, hunting down criminals
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Speaker 1: every day. Listen to what the Bill Bonsman had to say.
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Speaker 1: Did you get through the course of your conversation with
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Speaker 1: the defendant. Um, were you ever alarmed at the phrasing
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Speaker 1: of things or the way that he said things about
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Speaker 1: his problem with me? Yes? In fact, I said, well,
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Speaker 1: I asked him, why are you talking to me like this?
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Speaker 1: I said, you know, I'm a I'm not just a bondsman.
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Speaker 1: I'm a city council member. I've taken a note of
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Speaker 1: office to protect and defend the constitution and the people
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Speaker 1: of the city want why are you talking to me
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Speaker 1: like this? Uh? Did you have any idea? Did he
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Speaker 1: ever tell you the reason he felt comfortable telling you
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Speaker 1: about getting rid of a witness in the Stocking case?
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Speaker 1: He said that all he was so so focused on
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Speaker 1: was getting Zack's number. He had paid him a lot
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Speaker 1: of money, and he wanted this, this witness, which I
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Speaker 1: learned to be Megan Vera KOs to not testify against
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Speaker 1: him on these cases because it would also hurt his
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Speaker 1: medical license. And Uh, did you ever provide any information
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Speaker 1: to him of any kind? I told you about the
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Speaker 1: time that that all this was happening, one of my
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Speaker 1: staff members, John Gibbs, uh, knocked on the door, opened
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Speaker 1: the door. Uh, And he said, counselmember, We've got to
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Speaker 1: go to Kingwood with the mayor on a c I
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Speaker 1: P project, and so it gave me an out to
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Speaker 1: get out of there. And I was feeling very uncomfortable
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Speaker 1: because I felt like that I had just learned that something,
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Speaker 1: uh something was going on that was very bad. So
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Speaker 1: that's how the whole thing comes to light. This Bill
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Speaker 1: Bondsman goes to police. I mean, Jason Oceans come on
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Speaker 1: bail Bondsman testifying alongside law enforcement. That's a pretty powerful
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Speaker 1: combination against the defense. With all due respect, bail Bondsman
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Speaker 1: in the convention, you are at some of the bail
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Speaker 1: Bondsman I've met, or just as nefarious as the CRISP bla. Jason,
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Speaker 1: wait a minute, that's what I always would say to
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Speaker 1: you on cor TV when I really can come up
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Speaker 1: with an answer, blah blah blah. So go ahead. Well wait, well,
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Speaker 1: that's that's the typical prosecutors response to defense, just trying
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Speaker 1: to create a reasonable doubt anywhere that you can't brutal tape.
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Speaker 1: For Pete's sake, they're caught on tape planning the murders. Nancy,
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Speaker 1: what do you want me to say? We want to
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Speaker 1: be the defense counsel? Do you want yes, yes, I do.
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Speaker 1: The defense counsel says, we're going to keep doing to
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Speaker 1: create reasonable doubt. But but you know as well, at
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Speaker 1: the end of the day, despite the best defense counsel,
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Speaker 1: if the evidence is overwhelming and a prosecutor like yourself
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Speaker 1: is bringing forth the case, they're going down despite what
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Speaker 1: you create. So it's good theater and it's a you know,
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Speaker 1: sick tortured the fact pattern. But you know, if there's
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Speaker 1: all of this and everyone is as credible as can
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Speaker 1: be with due deference to the bail bondsman, uh you know,
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Speaker 1: I'm going now some photo Dr Bethany h In another
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Speaker 1: image shown to the court, they would be victim McDaniels
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Speaker 1: appears still in the car with his sunglasses on and Jack,
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Speaker 1: you look at this. This is an awesome photo of
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Speaker 1: the guy that was supposed to be dead by the
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Speaker 1: hitman has slumped over his the wheel of his car
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Speaker 1: with fake blood. I don't know what it is, pouring
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Speaker 1: out the back of his head, down his face and
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Speaker 1: his I mean, that's very convincing. According to his testimony,
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Speaker 1: it was pig blood, and so the way he slumped
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Speaker 1: over the car steering whill that sort of the glasses
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Speaker 1: are half off his face, he has blonde hair, looks
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Speaker 1: like there's a hole in his head, there's blood everywhere. Um.
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Speaker 1: But then when Mac is on the witness stand talking
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Speaker 1: about this, he really reflects on this whole stunt as
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Speaker 1: an ordeal and talks about the fact that if the
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Speaker 1: perpetrators had been successful, that his eight year old daughter
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Speaker 1: would not have had parents. And he said that the
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Speaker 1: ordeal was was unimaginable, So I cannot imagine what these
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Speaker 1: uh potential victims went through. And the fact that Leon
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Speaker 1: bragged to a bail bondsman to me, just from a
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Speaker 1: psychology perspective, he was not only obsessed with his ex
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Speaker 1: in terms of stalking her, but he was blobbing to
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Speaker 1: everybody else about her too, So he had a true
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Speaker 1: obsessive preoccupation with her. So he needs to be behind
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Speaker 1: bars because he's one of these guys that will never
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Speaker 1: stop stalking her. It'll go on and on for the
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Speaker 1: rest of all. McDonald and Leon Jacob allegedly hatched this
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Speaker 1: plot to murder their exes together. The pair were dating
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Speaker 1: at the time. Valerie still Valerie McDon McDaniel still owed
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Speaker 1: her ex husband one point to five million dollars from
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Speaker 1: their divorce, and Leon Jacob was under a protective order
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Speaker 1: telling him not to contact her any more, not to
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Speaker 1: contact Vicus. Now listen to what he says. All right,
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Speaker 1: the hit man, excuse me, the bail bosman said that
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Speaker 1: first she wanted to use potassium chlori to her heart.
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Speaker 1: Quote it was untraceable. Those were his words. Freak. Now
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Speaker 1: Jacob says that he denies the charges and insists he
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Speaker 1: wants to spend the rest of his life with Megan.
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Speaker 1: That's right, Bethany Marshall, with him walking the earth and
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Speaker 1: her and the cemetery for the rest of the rest
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Speaker 1: of his life. That's what he wanted. You know, Nancy,
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Speaker 1: I've treated stalkers in my practice, and they are so unpleasant.
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Speaker 1: They are so difficult to listen to because they are
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Speaker 1: preoccupied with their exes. They claim to love their exes,
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Speaker 1: and yet they hate their exes, and they will do
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Speaker 1: everything possible to run their excess lives. You know, I've
15:37
Speaker 1: heard it all. I've heard wanting to expose videos on
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Speaker 1: the internet, wanting to send letters to family members, wanting
15:45
Speaker 1: to cyber stock, wanting to show up at the ex's
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Speaker 1: um workplace. But I mean, this is really terrible. Wanting
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Speaker 1: to kill the X and so you know, if he
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Speaker 1: kills his ex, he has control over her right for
15:57
Speaker 1: the rest of her life. I mean, this was the
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Speaker 1: ultimate end game for you know, another thing, Jason, otions
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Speaker 1: I want to put the Center's perspective. When I first
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Speaker 1: learned about this case, I learned about her Valerie the defendant. Okay,
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Speaker 1: she was a very beloved and well respected veterinarian, very
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Speaker 1: successful veterinarian with as Bething just pointed out, a little
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Speaker 1: girl to live for now, she filed for divorce. I
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Speaker 1: believe it's how it went. And so she falls for
16:35
Speaker 1: a divorce and full custody. Then they started a custody battle, okay,
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Speaker 1: and this plot was hatched. She later was so distraught, Jason,
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Speaker 1: she made bill After they were arrested for hiring a
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Speaker 1: hit man, she jumped off the balcony to her death.
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Speaker 1: Now the only one left to be on trial is mcdan.
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Speaker 1: Is Jacob a sad fact pattern relative to you know,
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Speaker 1: the value she had in in her professional license. Really,
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Speaker 1: it would seem that that debt of you know, one
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Speaker 1: point to five that she owed her ex. You know,
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Speaker 1: Dr Marshall could speak to it, but obviously that boiled
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Speaker 1: over into some sort of you know, hatred and anger
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Speaker 1: such that she couldn't even think clearly about her child.
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Speaker 1: Listen to this, guys. He told me that um, basically, uh,
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Speaker 1: that he has ex has an assault case on him
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Speaker 1: and that is it's destroying his life, and that he
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Speaker 1: wants me to actually um kidnap her, uh basically to
17:50
Speaker 1: convince her that that that to drop it and as
17:55
Speaker 1: long as he can talk to her, um, because she
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Speaker 1: loves him and he loves she, would actually change her mind.
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Speaker 1: So he wants to be there at the you know
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Speaker 1: where where I kidnapped her and if it if it
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Speaker 1: doesn't work, um, he actually wanted me to um make
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Speaker 1: it disappear and now, of course, which I consider to
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Speaker 1: be a bad idea. Jacob testifies in his own defense lesson,
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Speaker 1: I never asked anybody to kill anybody. Does the word
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Speaker 1: kill her harm in any way, shape or form appeared
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Speaker 1: in any of those recorded conversations. Not all I behalf,
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Speaker 1: except for to exclude them from things I want done.
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Speaker 1: I never asked to have anybody hurt, killed, harmed, um kidnapped.
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Speaker 1: I never asked for anybody to be in any way
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Speaker 1: physically hurt. Did you pay money at all or this purpose? No?
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Speaker 1: All right, well, there was no purpose for me to
19:04
Speaker 1: pay money towards anybody being hurt, because I never asked
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Speaker 1: for that. Did you ever pay money two an undercover
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Speaker 1: officer for the purpose of harming or hurting either Megan
19:20
Speaker 1: or by game. No? Did you ever discuss that issue
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Speaker 1: with the uncover officer? We had. Yes, we had multiple
19:33
Speaker 1: discussions or multiple conversations about not wanting to harm or
19:38
Speaker 1: hurt anybody. And that was something that you had expressed
19:46
Speaker 1: correct repeatedly. You know, Jason Oceans, why would he take
19:53
Speaker 1: the stand? You know it turned out badly. I mean,
19:56
Speaker 1: I was just working on the Robert Blake case for
20:01
Speaker 1: Dan Abrams in myn uh new program with A and
20:04
Speaker 1: A Grace Versus Abrams ps A premieres March twenty nine.
20:07
Speaker 1: That's Thursday night at eleven o'clock. Who I'll be watching, Nancy?
20:11
Speaker 1: Who you better be? Oceans and Dr Bethany, I know
20:15
Speaker 1: you'll be at watching. And I was looking at Blake
20:19
Speaker 1: when he did not testify. He got acquitted when he
20:23
Speaker 1: testified at trial at civil trial. They came back with
20:26
Speaker 1: a thirty million dollar judgment against him. Why do people
20:30
Speaker 1: take the stand? People take the stand generally in limited circumstances.
20:36
Speaker 1: Most of the time. As you know, defense counsel wants
20:39
Speaker 1: to be able to, you know, go through each piece
20:42
Speaker 1: of evidence and uh sort of you know, tear it
20:45
Speaker 1: apart and discredit it to some degree to create reasonable doubt.
20:49
Speaker 1: I think in this case, maybe you know, he presents
20:53
Speaker 1: as a good looking buy maybe he called Dall in
20:56
Speaker 1: his mind, you know, charmed the jurors in some way. Uh.
21:01
Speaker 1: I think it was his decision and rather than defense
21:03
Speaker 1: counsel and uh, at the end of the day, you know,
21:06
Speaker 1: your client makes a call on that despite your overwhelming
21:10
Speaker 1: insistence that he shouldn't or she should. And just in Aladington,
21:15
Speaker 1: a sentence have just gone down in the courtroom. Listen
21:18
Speaker 1: what the defendant three said and cause number one five four, three,
21:25
Speaker 1: eight one two were the jury find having found the
21:29
Speaker 1: defendant Leon Philip Jacob guilty of solicitation of capital murder,
21:33
Speaker 1: assess his punishment of confinement, and the Institutional Division of
21:37
Speaker 1: the Texas Department of Criminal Justice for life sussifying in
21:41
Speaker 1: the amount of ten thousand dollars. Calls number one, five
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Speaker 1: four three eight one three were the jury, having found
21:49
Speaker 1: the defendant, Leon Philip Jacob guilty of solicitation of capital murder,
21:53
Speaker 1: assess his punishment of confinement in the Institutional Division of
21:57
Speaker 1: the Texas Department of Criminal Justice for life ac sessifying
22:00
Speaker 1: the amount of one thousand and ten thousand dollars. Thank you,
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Speaker 1: maybe sits. Do you have anything to say, Mr Jacob
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Speaker 1: before I pronounced these sentences? Okay, it's the art of
22:14
Speaker 1: the court, than Mr Jacob, that you haven't been found
22:17
Speaker 1: guilty of two cases of solicitation of capital murder being
22:20
Speaker 1: now delivered by the Sheriff of Harris County to the
22:23
Speaker 1: director of the Institutional Division of the Texas Department of
22:26
Speaker 1: Criminal Justice, or on both cases you shop serve a
22:29
Speaker 1: life sentence and be fulled credited all the time that
22:32
Speaker 1: you've already served on this case. Thank you. Can you
22:35
Speaker 1: even imagine giving birth to a beautiful baby girl in
22:41
Speaker 1: the hospital and just forty eight hours later the baby
22:47
Speaker 1: is taken from you from the hospital. What I Meancy Grace,
22:53
Speaker 1: this is crime stories. Thank you for being with us.
22:56
Speaker 1: That is exactly what happened to a couple in the
22:59
Speaker 1: Miami Day area in Florida. Mom gives birth to a
23:04
Speaker 1: beautiful baby girl. Rebecca Sanders is the mom. She gives
23:08
Speaker 1: birth to baby Ingrid Ronan Johnson, only to see the
23:12
Speaker 1: baby whisked away by none other than police. The Mika
23:20
Speaker 1: Suki Indian American Indian tribal police come to the hospital.
23:27
Speaker 1: They leave their area where they live. They can't travel
23:32
Speaker 1: to the hospital at Baptist Hospital in Miami, off the
23:37
Speaker 1: tribal reservation the Everglades. They get the baby and take
23:42
Speaker 1: it back to their reservation. What the little girl's parents
23:49
Speaker 1: since been four days complaining to police and prosecutors, saying
23:55
Speaker 1: the tribal order to take the little baby away from
23:59
Speaker 1: them had been cooked up by the baby's grandmother to
24:05
Speaker 1: keep the baby on the Indian reservation. Now, the mother
24:11
Speaker 1: in this scenario is an American Indian, the father is white,
24:16
Speaker 1: and the grandmother on the Indian reservation wanted nothing to
24:21
Speaker 1: do with the baby being ra Baby Ingrid being raised
24:25
Speaker 1: off the reservation. But let me get the whole story.
24:28
Speaker 1: Maybe I've got it wrong, Paul Chamber with me, Crime Stories,
24:31
Speaker 1: investigative reporter. Take it from the top, Paul, what happened? Well, Nancy,
24:35
Speaker 1: you actually got to everything just about right. What we're
24:38
Speaker 1: dealing with here is a question of whether the Miccosuki
24:41
Speaker 1: nation overstepped its authority. A tribal court issued a child
24:46
Speaker 1: custody order on March see the baby was born March
24:51
Speaker 1: sixte and then it dispatched two police detectives to pick
24:55
Speaker 1: up the child, a newborn, at Baptist Hospital in Kendall,
24:59
Speaker 1: Florida's Bourbon Miami. The question is whether the tribe sovereign
25:04
Speaker 1: rights extends to locations off the reservation, and legal experts
25:09
Speaker 1: say tribal court orders must be endorsed first by state,
25:13
Speaker 1: local or federal court before they can be enforced. So uh,
25:17
Speaker 1: Miami Dade County police say the detectives told them that
25:20
Speaker 1: they were enforcing a federal court order, and that apparently
25:25
Speaker 1: wasn't the case. The baby was taken, and then at
25:29
Speaker 1: a tribal hearing on the twenty two the the the
25:33
Speaker 1: court of ordered that the child be returned. And but
25:38
Speaker 1: they still claim jurisdiction over the child because of a
25:41
Speaker 1: metrolineal sort of determination of whether the child is Indian
25:46
Speaker 1: or not. If the mother is a tribe member, the
25:49
Speaker 1: court considers the child to be a tribe member. Wow,
25:52
Speaker 1: well that may be what the tribe considers, but I
25:54
Speaker 1: don't know the mother and the father agreed with that.
25:58
Speaker 1: Joseph Scott Morgan joining US forensics expert Joe Scott. What
26:03
Speaker 1: do you make of it? Hey, I gotta tell you, Nancy, Uh,
26:06
Speaker 1: this idea of some group of people rushing in to
26:10
Speaker 1: snatch a newborn baby. I mean this, This is absolutely
26:14
Speaker 1: mind blowing um that authorities could come in and and
26:18
Speaker 1: on a whims. It's you know, the this idea that
26:22
Speaker 1: there's some kind of animals. That's right, Hey, every family
26:25
Speaker 1: dynamic has some kind of animals, some kind of problems,
26:28
Speaker 1: some kind of everybody doesn't like this person, this sort
26:31
Speaker 1: of thing. The fear, the fear. Can you imagine being
26:34
Speaker 1: a child's father and knowing that your child is being
26:37
Speaker 1: snatched away from you, being taken away by authorities, and
26:40
Speaker 1: then being spirited away to a location that he may
26:43
Speaker 1: never have access to the child. It's terrifying, terrifying in
26:46
Speaker 1: a free country like this. You know, I'm a little
26:49
Speaker 1: overwhelmed that not only did they come take the baby
26:52
Speaker 1: away based on the grandmother's I don't know what position
26:57
Speaker 1: she holds within the tribe, but by the grandmother's say,
27:00
Speaker 1: though to Dr Brian Russell, host of Investigation Discoveries Fatal
27:04
Speaker 1: Vow series, he was also a lawyer and psychologist, it
27:07
Speaker 1: wouldn't be the first time grand mos got involved. That's right.
27:11
Speaker 1: I've been an expert in child custody cases for some
27:14
Speaker 1: time now, and I don't doubt that the grandmother had
27:19
Speaker 1: some kind of concern I'm not saying if the concerns
27:21
Speaker 1: are valid or not. I'm just saying I don't doubt
27:23
Speaker 1: that the grandmother had concerns that the father of her
27:27
Speaker 1: daughter's baby was, you know, had had done things in
27:32
Speaker 1: the past that she was concerned about him being around
27:35
Speaker 1: the grand baby. And I don't doubt that she went
27:38
Speaker 1: in front of the tribal court and made that case
27:42
Speaker 1: in a way that caused the tribal court to be
27:44
Speaker 1: concerned about the welfare of this child. I think that
27:48
Speaker 1: the problem is that, uh, this the interaction between uh
27:53
Speaker 1: you know, tribal courts and the society outside of the
27:58
Speaker 1: reservation is a complicated thing. In fact, in the Supreme
28:03
Speaker 1: Court actually dealt with the case about it, the baby
28:06
Speaker 1: Veronica case, about where the tribal courts jurisdiction ends and
28:09
Speaker 1: the the the you know, the courts of the of
28:13
Speaker 1: the United States outside of the reservations begins and and
28:17
Speaker 1: and so I think that you know that it's the
28:20
Speaker 1: hospital that did not have the proper procedures in place
28:24
Speaker 1: to to really that went ahead and released a baby
28:28
Speaker 1: under a tribal court order when they were missing the
28:32
Speaker 1: court order from the county, the Miami Dead County court,
28:36
Speaker 1: which is what they needed in order to have it
28:39
Speaker 1: be a valid custody order outside of the reservation. This
28:44
Speaker 1: is what we know the little girl Ingrid. Baby Ingrid
28:48
Speaker 1: was born to a Mikasuki mother, an American Indian mother,
28:51
Speaker 1: and a white father. Two days after Ingrid was born,
28:56
Speaker 1: tribal detectives enter Baptist Hospital in Kindall it's off the
29:01
Speaker 1: tribal reservation, and took Ingrid away from her parents, Rebecca
29:06
Speaker 1: Sanders and Justin Johnson. Well, let's sparked outrage from Florida
29:12
Speaker 1: to d C. We also here and I have not
29:16
Speaker 1: confirmed that the Mikosuki police were accompanied by Miami Dade
29:22
Speaker 1: police officers and carried a court order. It had to
29:25
Speaker 1: be a tribal court order. Well, the parents immediately filed
29:29
Speaker 1: complaints with police, prosecutors and the Bureau of Indian Affairs,
29:33
Speaker 1: saying the tribal order was just concocted by the baby's grandmother,
29:37
Speaker 1: baby Asiola, to keep the father away from the little girl. Well,
29:43
Speaker 1: the tribal order grants custody not to the mother, but
29:48
Speaker 1: to the grandmother. I don't know how this happens, how
29:54
Speaker 1: the baby gets taken away from the mother. Now, according
30:00
Speaker 1: two sources, the grandmother feared and correct me if I'm wrong,
30:04
Speaker 1: Paul Chambers, that there have been domestic abuse? Is that true?
30:08
Speaker 1: Had her daughter gotten beaten up by the father in
30:10
Speaker 1: the past, Well, Nascy, you're right. Osciola now hasn't said
30:14
Speaker 1: anything except through her attorney, and she does claim that
30:18
Speaker 1: her daughter is a victim of domestic violence. Those are
30:22
Speaker 1: the exact words, a victim of domestic violence relating to
30:27
Speaker 1: the father. And uh so she feared for the child's safety.
30:32
Speaker 1: And one thing we should also mention, Nancy, is that
30:35
Speaker 1: two previous children had by Sanders are now in the custody,
30:41
Speaker 1: are not in her custody anymore because of actions taken
30:44
Speaker 1: by this same woman, Betty Osciola and uh the parents
30:50
Speaker 1: of sanders previous relationship. Now we also know that at
30:54
Speaker 1: one point the mother had a restraining order against the father. Still,
31:01
Speaker 1: even if that's true, to Dr Brian Russell, host of
31:04
Speaker 1: I D S Fatal vows, you still can't come in
31:08
Speaker 1: and take the baby away from the mother because at
31:11
Speaker 1: one time she had it was training order against this man.
31:16
Speaker 1: Well that's right. Basically, Uh, it sounds to me like
31:21
Speaker 1: the Miami Dade Police. So that so the the police
31:25
Speaker 1: in the county where the hospital was located were led
31:29
Speaker 1: to believe that the tribal court order was a federal
31:35
Speaker 1: court order and that this is where the complexity comes
31:38
Speaker 1: in about the tribal courts and the courts off the reservations. Uh,
31:42
Speaker 1: it is confusing, and I think that those police officers
31:45
Speaker 1: probably believed that they were actually helping the tribal police
31:49
Speaker 1: to execute a federal court order, which they were not doing.
31:54
Speaker 1: They were actually helping the tribal police to execute a
31:57
Speaker 1: tribal court order which does not have any effect outside
32:02
Speaker 1: of the reservation unless they get a judge to endorse
32:07
Speaker 1: it in the jurisdiction where the hospital is. And that's
32:10
Speaker 1: what didn't happen. So you've got some perhaps some culpability
32:14
Speaker 1: on the part of the police for not knowing that
32:18
Speaker 1: or not getting a legal opinion about it before they
32:20
Speaker 1: helped to enforce it. Certainly the hospital apparently didn't have
32:24
Speaker 1: the right procedures in place to make sure they were
32:26
Speaker 1: releasing a child only under pursue into a valid court order. Well,
32:32
Speaker 1: here's the thing. I want to vilify the grandmother for
32:36
Speaker 1: taking the baby, but I also know the grandmother has
32:40
Speaker 1: two of this woman's other children she's raising, according to reports,
32:44
Speaker 1: and there'd been a t r O against the father.
32:47
Speaker 1: But I and so she may be motivated by trying
32:51
Speaker 1: to protect the children. On the other hand, the mother
32:54
Speaker 1: says she just did not want her baby. The grandmother
32:57
Speaker 1: didn't want the baby to be raised off the reservation.
33:01
Speaker 1: And I got to tell you something, Joe Scott Morgan,
33:03
Speaker 1: I remember trying to investigate a homicide that occurred on reservation.
33:08
Speaker 1: I've never been stone Wall, so much in my life
33:11
Speaker 1: is to try to get information about the murder that
33:15
Speaker 1: occurred Indian reservations. American Indian reservations are sovereign. They are
33:20
Speaker 1: for instance, um, they're like their own country within the U.
33:24
Speaker 1: S u. S. Law does not affect them. No, it doesn't, Nancy.
33:29
Speaker 1: And as a matter of fact, I've worked cases that
33:33
Speaker 1: are in fact related uh to uh to Indian reservations.
33:38
Speaker 1: And it's a nightmare. But you know, going back to
33:40
Speaker 1: what you said, uh, you know, it seems as though
33:44
Speaker 1: this is systemic of the rest of our society. It's
33:47
Speaker 1: like due processes dying here right before our very eyes,
33:50
Speaker 1: and not just in this case, but all over the place.
33:52
Speaker 1: This idea that you know, you're you're you're guilty until
33:56
Speaker 1: you're proven innocent. In this case, that's what's so terrifying
33:59
Speaker 1: about is and these people that yeah, live in this
34:02
Speaker 1: this fifetom of their own on this reservation, can come
34:07
Speaker 1: outside of that reservation and execute what they're presenting as
34:11
Speaker 1: do is lawful authority in this hospital. I want to
34:15
Speaker 1: know where hospital council was, uh, the lawyers. I want
34:19
Speaker 1: to know where the protections were at the hospital, because
34:22
Speaker 1: somebody's got to call a time out in this case
34:24
Speaker 1: before that child leaves with these people. How do we
34:27
Speaker 1: know what kind of what kind of care the child
34:29
Speaker 1: is going to receive when the child wants upon the reservation.
34:32
Speaker 1: It leaves a lot of questions for me. It's a
34:35
Speaker 1: it's a cloaked, closed society and they can come and
34:39
Speaker 1: go and do as they please take a listen to
34:42
Speaker 1: what the parents have to say. She calls me hysterical,
34:47
Speaker 1: ask her what's wrong, and she said that they were there,
34:50
Speaker 1: that they were taking taking her baby. Incomes in the
34:53
Speaker 1: detective Michael Gay, and then a few of the security
34:58
Speaker 1: and also hospital staff, and he had The detective asked
35:03
Speaker 1: me if I knew what was going on, and said, no,
35:05
Speaker 1: I don't know what's going on. And then he said, well,
35:08
Speaker 1: your baby is being taken. Um, she is no longer
35:12
Speaker 1: in your custody. You're not her mother anymore. There has
35:15
Speaker 1: been a rolling done where all custody was granted to
35:19
Speaker 1: the grandmother. And I was like, how can this be?
35:22
Speaker 1: I haven't I'm still in the hospital, like I haven't
35:25
Speaker 1: been to the court hearing nothing. Nobody's notified me of anything.
35:30
Speaker 1: And where's your Do you have any paperwork, any you know,
35:33
Speaker 1: anything telling me that this is happening, like you know,
35:36
Speaker 1: I can't just let you leave. And he said that
35:39
Speaker 1: he didn't see any paperwork, doesn't doesn't have any paperwork,
35:43
Speaker 1: in fact, hasn't even seen it. He was just told
35:45
Speaker 1: to come to the hospital and do this. She was
35:47
Speaker 1: actually on the phone, had me on speaker and the
35:53
Speaker 1: detective that was there from Nikosuki p D. Even while
35:57
Speaker 1: we're on the phone, she's like, will you at least
35:59
Speaker 1: speak to the file learn tell him what's going on.
36:01
Speaker 1: In his exact words was I don't have anything to
36:03
Speaker 1: say to him. I don't need to talk to him.
36:07
Speaker 1: And they didn't let me see my baby again. They
36:09
Speaker 1: wouldn't even let me look at her nothing, they'd let
36:11
Speaker 1: her leave. I'm still trying to wrap my head around
36:15
Speaker 1: how how this has happened. She can't even sleep because
36:20
Speaker 1: anytimes closer her eyes, you know, she wakes up thinking
36:24
Speaker 1: that she's that she's hearing her baby crying, and her
36:27
Speaker 1: baby is not even there. I don't get how a
36:30
Speaker 1: mother could do this to her own daughter while her
36:33
Speaker 1: daughter is laying in a hospital bed. I cannot, for
36:37
Speaker 1: the life of me, I cannot wrap my head around that.
36:39
Speaker 1: I don't see how the people of the Mikosuki tribe
36:47
Speaker 1: can can look at me in the face and tell
36:49
Speaker 1: me that this is okay. Right now, they are hiding
36:51
Speaker 1: behind their suffentity. They're using that to protect My daughter
36:56
Speaker 1: is not even a tribal member. I feel like I
36:59
Speaker 1: have no what that I don't I thought the tribe
37:04
Speaker 1: was to protect its people or not use their own
37:07
Speaker 1: rulings to control their people. Right now, the baby has
37:11
Speaker 1: been ordered back to the mother. We are on the case.
37:16
Speaker 1: A sobbing wife goes before news cameras in California, begging
37:21
Speaker 1: for the public to come forward with information regarding who
37:25
Speaker 1: hurled a basketball sized rock from an overpass down to
37:32
Speaker 1: kill her husband. This gorgeous young woman, twenty one year
37:38
Speaker 1: old Guadalupe Gatiras, wipes away tears as she describes how
37:44
Speaker 1: she and her husband, twenty three year old Christopher, had
37:47
Speaker 1: learned she was expecting their second child. Quote he was
37:54
Speaker 1: so excited, she says through tears. Take a listen to
38:00
Speaker 1: what she says. Five months ago, me and my husband's
38:05
Speaker 1: decided a family. We've decided to have a second child.
38:10
Speaker 1: About two weeks ago we found out I was pregnant.
38:15
Speaker 1: He was so excited. I thought it was so excited
38:21
Speaker 1: to be a big sister. I don't know where tell
38:25
Speaker 1: He's God. We're asking for your hope, anybody side anything.
38:32
Speaker 1: She's help. Didn't him He's deserve I thought her didn't
38:38
Speaker 1: deserve this. The murderous incident takes place just before nine
38:44
Speaker 1: o'clock in the evening. Now, according to Chips California Highway Patrol,
38:50
Speaker 1: Christopher was riding as a passenger and his wife's Toyota
38:53
Speaker 1: Corolla along the one four and passed under the Orange
38:57
Speaker 1: Growth boulevard overpassed. That's near passad not where someone hurls
39:02
Speaker 1: a thirty five pound boulder a rock at the vehicle below.
39:09
Speaker 1: Now that had to be precision timing. Let me tell
39:12
Speaker 1: you he Christopher was struck by the rock and suffered
39:18
Speaker 1: fatal injuries. Of course, she the wife, rushes him as
39:23
Speaker 1: quickly she said can to Glendale Adventist Medical Center. He
39:29
Speaker 1: was pronounced dead just forty minutes after, according to kt
39:34
Speaker 1: l A, and this had to be intentional. Now, also
39:39
Speaker 1: in the car their four year old little girl and
39:44
Speaker 1: Guitara's mother. They were not harmed, but the little girl
39:48
Speaker 1: witnessed the whole thing, and now she's left to raise
39:52
Speaker 1: not one child four years old, but the unborn baby
39:56
Speaker 1: to raise by her self. Straight out to Paul Chamber,
40:03
Speaker 1: Crime Stories Investigative Report, Let's take it from the beginning.
40:06
Speaker 1: How the whole thing go down? Well, Nancy, you know
40:09
Speaker 1: a week is passed now and there's still no takers
40:12
Speaker 1: of this twenty thousand dollar reward that's now being offered
40:16
Speaker 1: for information on this incident. Uh, but you you had
40:20
Speaker 1: it right. I mean a boulder was basically pushed over
40:23
Speaker 1: offense and fell onto a car that was traveling on
40:27
Speaker 1: this Pasadena Freeway below this Toyota Corolla. This happened on
40:31
Speaker 1: March thirte The Los Angeles County Board of Supervisors approved
40:35
Speaker 1: the money marsh twentieth. Now, this boulder is about the
40:38
Speaker 1: size of a volleyball, slightly smaller than a basketball. It
40:43
Speaker 1: fell onto the Corolla. It crashed straight through the hole,
40:47
Speaker 1: was very round in the passenger side of the windshield.
40:52
Speaker 1: It was being driven by Guadalupe Gautieri's it crashed through
40:55
Speaker 1: the windshield. It landed on the chest of her husband,
40:58
Speaker 1: Christopher Lopez. She uh. The car swerved radically as you
41:04
Speaker 1: can imagine. She did manage, though, however, to drive her
41:07
Speaker 1: husband to a nearby hospital in Glendale. He didn't make it.
41:11
Speaker 1: He died of his injuries. As you mentioned, Nancy, the
41:14
Speaker 1: couple's four year old daughter was in the backseat of
41:17
Speaker 1: the car. The woman was pregnant with the victims child.
41:23
Speaker 1: Both of them were uninjured and there are no suspects
41:27
Speaker 1: and it's very frustrating, I imagine for local authorities because
41:31
Speaker 1: there isn't a lot they can do. Uh. There has
41:34
Speaker 1: been some reporting from the region that there are no
41:37
Speaker 1: apparent surveillance cameras in the areas, so they have no
41:41
Speaker 1: video to draw upon. They are testing the boulder for
41:46
Speaker 1: DNA evidence to see if they might come up with
41:48
Speaker 1: something there. And the only other theory that I've heard
41:52
Speaker 1: is that a lot of homeless people live in the area,
41:56
Speaker 1: and you know, they could dispatch detectives, I suppose is
42:00
Speaker 1: to talk to the homeless people to see if they
42:02
Speaker 1: might have any clues as to what happened. But really
42:04
Speaker 1: there's not a there's not a lot of directions to go,
42:07
Speaker 1: and no one's claimed the reward. Well, Alan, do you
42:10
Speaker 1: you went to the Saint What did you say? What
42:11
Speaker 1: did you learn? It's a high fence. It's about seven
42:14
Speaker 1: feet tall chain link fence, but it curves, you know,
42:17
Speaker 1: on the inside, specifically built to prevent this kind of
42:20
Speaker 1: a thing, and it it goes the overpass, goes over
42:23
Speaker 1: the very busy one thirty four, which I drove last
42:26
Speaker 1: night and very regularly. You have to be tall and
42:30
Speaker 1: strong to have tossed a thirty five pound rock over
42:34
Speaker 1: this fence, and the timing of it just horrible, because
42:39
Speaker 1: it's just crazy how it landed right in the middle
42:43
Speaker 1: of this man's chest. To Joseph Scott Morgan, forensics expert,
42:47
Speaker 1: Professor of Forensics at Jacksonville State University, Joe Scott has
42:52
Speaker 1: just endured uh disaster of his own. Tornadoes were ripping
42:58
Speaker 1: through his homestead, destroyed his home, all their possessions. He
43:03
Speaker 1: and his wife and son are in temporary housing right now.
43:07
Speaker 1: We have a go fund me on our website crime
43:12
Speaker 1: online dot Com if you can help Joe Scott. Joe Scott,
43:16
Speaker 1: I can't thank you enough for being back with us
43:18
Speaker 1: and lending us your expertise this soon after that disaster,
43:23
Speaker 1: as your wife is still picking through the remains. I mean,
43:27
Speaker 1: I just finished a photo album of Christmas two thousand fifteen,
43:32
Speaker 1: and it took me forever, and I put it on
43:34
Speaker 1: the shelf with all the other photo albums, and I
43:37
Speaker 1: was just thinking about all the things your wife has
43:41
Speaker 1: created and kept over the years as you raised your son,
43:45
Speaker 1: and all of it just lost. We've been praying for
43:47
Speaker 1: you so much, Joe Scott. Thank you, Nancy. That means
43:52
Speaker 1: a lot to me. The love that you guys have
43:54
Speaker 1: extended to me, it means more than you can possibly know.
43:57
Speaker 1: And hey, the best place to be is with your
44:00
Speaker 1: family to recover from this. And you guys on crime
44:03
Speaker 1: a Line, y'all are my family as well. So thank you.
44:06
Speaker 1: This particular case, I've been following it actually since before
44:10
Speaker 1: the tornado struck here in Jacksonville, and I've been very
44:13
Speaker 1: fascinated by this. I like the fact that Adam that
44:16
Speaker 1: Alan was able to go out and put eyes on
44:18
Speaker 1: the scene. We've worked cases like this before, Nancy, We've
44:21
Speaker 1: discussed this and many times it's mischievous teenagers, Nancy, this
44:25
Speaker 1: wasn't a teenager that did this. This fence is very,
44:28
Speaker 1: very tall, the rock wade thirty five pounds, and in
44:32
Speaker 1: order to have this thing over, you would have to
44:35
Speaker 1: be either very tall or and here's the kicker, or
44:39
Speaker 1: you're gonna have to have assistance this place. This would
44:42
Speaker 1: have required I think two adult males in order to
44:46
Speaker 1: facilitate this thing. And we have a huge homeless population
44:49
Speaker 1: in this area. You have to get it over this rise. Now,
44:53
Speaker 1: the odds, why you blame me the homeless people, They're
44:56
Speaker 1: just trying to find that their next meal. Well, apparently
45:01
Speaker 1: some of them found a thirty five pound boulder two
45:03
Speaker 1: and somebody has tossed this thing over, and I sure
45:07
Speaker 1: want to know who did it and who took this
45:09
Speaker 1: man away from this family, completely wrecked their life. And
45:13
Speaker 1: the police need to go out there, and they've got
45:15
Speaker 1: to rattle some cages and get some answers to this thing,
45:18
Speaker 1: because twenty dollars has not made anything shake loose yet.
45:22
Speaker 1: Let me tell you something else. They're talking about the
45:25
Speaker 1: evidential concerns here. They're talking about DNA. This is gonna
45:29
Speaker 1: be a long shot because what they're gonna be looking
45:32
Speaker 1: for this in this particular case is touch DNA. And
45:36
Speaker 1: let me paint a picture for you for our listeners.
45:38
Speaker 1: If you think about touch DNA, all it is is
45:41
Speaker 1: dead sin skin cells that transfer onto an object. If
45:45
Speaker 1: people at home will just take baby powder and put
45:48
Speaker 1: it in their hand and gently blow, that's how That's
45:52
Speaker 1: how fragile touch DNA is. So you're gonna if they
45:55
Speaker 1: contact this rock, leave dead skin cells on it, then
45:59
Speaker 1: push it over an eight foot rise, have it traveled
46:01
Speaker 1: through the air at great velocity, then passed through an
46:05
Speaker 1: intermediate target, which is that windshield and strike this man
46:09
Speaker 1: center mass right in his chest. This guy's got crushing
46:12
Speaker 1: chest injuries, and Nancy, it would not be a surprise
46:16
Speaker 1: to me if this man's heart and his lungs and
46:19
Speaker 1: possibly even his spine were completely crushed in this in
46:22
Speaker 1: this situation, terrible, terrible way to die. And I don't
46:26
Speaker 1: know if they're gonna be able to recovering any evidence
46:28
Speaker 1: off this thing. Would his death have been immediate? Jef Scott,
46:32
Speaker 1: I think that it would. He would have had an awareness, Nancy.
46:37
Speaker 1: And that's that's the thing about it. I don't know
46:39
Speaker 1: about his head injuries. If he was absent head injuries,
46:42
Speaker 1: he would have had an awareness that he had in
46:44
Speaker 1: fact been struck. Let's keep in mind. You have to
46:47
Speaker 1: keep in mind that he traveled to the hospital. I
46:50
Speaker 1: don't know how long it would have taken him to
46:51
Speaker 1: get to the hospital. The wife is just in a fury.
46:54
Speaker 1: He's breathing his last breast, literally gurgling in blood. Uh
46:59
Speaker 1: in this thing because he's gonna have a flail chest.
47:01
Speaker 1: He shows up at the hospital, he lasts for forty minutes.
47:04
Speaker 1: So yeah, I think that he would have had an awareness.
47:06
Speaker 1: I think that the pain and suffering here, to put
47:09
Speaker 1: it in legal terms, is just unbelievable. Unbelievable, the havoc
47:15
Speaker 1: and the hell that has been wrought upon the Sport family.
47:18
Speaker 1: To Dr Brian Russell, host of Investigation Discoveries, Fatal Vowel series,
47:22
Speaker 1: a big hit for I D. Lawyer and psychologist Dr Brian,
47:28
Speaker 1: what was the thinking behind an attack like this? It
47:33
Speaker 1: was clearly premeditated. It is so purely psychopathic and there's
47:39
Speaker 1: no reason other than somebody enjoying the havoc that they're
47:46
Speaker 1: wreaking on other people's lives. It is so psychopathic that
47:51
Speaker 1: you you may think I'm being barbaric here. But if
47:55
Speaker 1: we find out who did this, death by stoning is
47:59
Speaker 1: too good of a punishment. And I'm serious that we
48:02
Speaker 1: have to make that level of statement as a society
48:06
Speaker 1: that we will not tolerate this kind of behavior in
48:09
Speaker 1: this country. Because this is not the first one of
48:12
Speaker 1: these this year. There was one already earlier this year
48:16
Speaker 1: where a father of several kids and husband was killed
48:19
Speaker 1: and they did catch the perpetrators of that allegedly who
48:24
Speaker 1: are teenagers, and guess what they're charged with second degree murder?
48:30
Speaker 1: Why in the hell is its second degree. As you said,
48:34
Speaker 1: this is absolutely premeditated. This is within a few feet
48:39
Speaker 1: of the main route of the Rose Bowl Parade, and
48:43
Speaker 1: there are not I I know this area well, there
48:45
Speaker 1: are not homeless people who live in that immediate facility.
48:47
Speaker 1: But it's a really nice area and the Rose Bowl
48:50
Speaker 1: Parade just a few feet away. So where does the
48:54
Speaker 1: case stand right now, Paul Chamber. They're waiting for someone
48:57
Speaker 1: to respond to the offer of thousand dollar reward for information.
49:01
Speaker 1: I think you would that would probably be the best
49:05
Speaker 1: hope at getting some additional information on who might have
49:08
Speaker 1: done this horrible crime. And a lesson in this is
49:11
Speaker 1: look up at every overpass. I've done this for years. Um,
49:14
Speaker 1: when I when I'm driving, I look up at every
49:17
Speaker 1: single overpass because I've just heard about too many of
49:20
Speaker 1: these and and it's awful that you have to do
49:23
Speaker 1: that in the United States of America. But when you're
49:25
Speaker 1: teaching your kids to drive, I mean, obviously they don't
49:27
Speaker 1: want to take their eyes off the road for too
49:29
Speaker 1: long either, but uh, you know, unfortunately, uh, you could
49:33
Speaker 1: save your life by glancing up there. I'm just looking
49:36
Speaker 1: at their family photo. Joseph Scott Morgan. They look so happy.
49:41
Speaker 1: There's a twenty thousand dollar reward in the case of
49:45
Speaker 1: a young father killed by a boulder dropped onto the
49:49
Speaker 1: highway someone throws a huge rock from a highway overpass.
49:55
Speaker 1: The twenty thousand dollar reward offered for information leading to
49:59
Speaker 1: every is responsible for this horrible murder of the young dad,
50:04
Speaker 1: Christopher low Pass. He was in the passenger seat when
50:09
Speaker 1: a thirty plus pound rock crashes through his windshield, crushing
50:15
Speaker 1: his chest. It is believed by authorities the highway patrol
50:20
Speaker 1: someone purposefully through this large boulder from the Orange Grove
50:24
Speaker 1: Boulevard overpass. It's over Route one freeway. The pregnant wife
50:31
Speaker 1: immediately races to the hospital, but it was too late.
50:35
Speaker 1: The four year old little girl was in the car
50:38
Speaker 1: when her dad is murdered. The mom making an emotional plea.
50:44
Speaker 1: He is gone, she says, but I'm asking for your help.
50:48
Speaker 1: If anyone saw anything, please help us. There is a
50:53
Speaker 1: go fund Me campaign created to benefit those Christopher leaves behind,
51:00
Speaker 1: including trying to pay for his funeral and for everything
51:05
Speaker 1: the baby will need. I'm just just stunned by this.
51:11
Speaker 1: Um Alan. Do you have a tip line number? Yes, Nancy.
51:15
Speaker 1: The California Highway Patrol says if you have information about
51:19
Speaker 1: this incident that happened on March, you can call them
51:23
Speaker 1: at six to six two zero zero six two six
51:31
Speaker 1: eight one zero zero. Nancy Grace Crime Stories, signing off
51:37
Speaker 1: goodbye for him