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Transcript

The BIGPLAY Cleveland Show 08/10/26 · BIGPLAY Cleveland

0:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Welcome to the Big Play Cleveland show presented by Fandwell.
0:02
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm Gabriella Cruz alongside Nick Padone, Chris McNeil joining us virtually and a big shout out to our producer Ryan Smith as always.
0:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Guys, right off the top here, the Browns quarterback battle did Deshawn Watson just take the lead.
0:17
[SPEAKER_01]: We may have found our first real indication here that the Browns quarterback competition is starting to shift because for the first time in training camp.
0:25
[SPEAKER_01]: Todd Munkin broke the established rotation between Deshawn and Shudor, and Watson got the number one offense for the second straight day, and it wasn't really random either because this came after Watson had his strongest overall throwing day at camp.
0:38
[SPEAKER_01]: So when you see Todd Munkin suddenly make that change and give Watson the number one offense for a second straight day exclusively, do you view that as a real sign that Watson is starting to become the leading quarterback in this competition?
0:51
[SPEAKER_02]: absolutely gap.
0:52
[SPEAKER_02]: This was a watershed day in the Cleveland Browns current quarterback battle just because it was the first time that we've seen them break the trend of rotating these quarterbacks.
1:03
[SPEAKER_02]: They did it all throughout the spring about 15 practices in the spring and the nine practices into the summer practice number 10 was the big moment where Todd Monk and told reporters were going to continue the rotation the way that you guys have been used to it.
1:18
[SPEAKER_02]: But then when we got out out of the practice field, Deshawn Watson was the first quarterback up for 7 on 7.
1:24
[SPEAKER_02]: He was the first quarterback up in 11 on 11 after practice, the Browns released a statement to some of the people in the beat saying that Munkin wanted to see Deshawn Watson with a couple of personnel looks.
1:35
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, the personnel was just the first team offence.
1:38
[SPEAKER_02]: That was the personnel that
1:39
[SPEAKER_02]: He wanted to see the Sean Watson with in pads.
1:42
[SPEAKER_02]: This is a huge moment.
1:43
[SPEAKER_02]: Obviously, we'll have to see how today's practice is handled.
1:47
[SPEAKER_02]: Munk and his set to address reporters at 12.
1:50
[SPEAKER_02]: 50.
1:50
[SPEAKER_02]: So it will be another intriguing day where if it's to Sean Watson, again, with the first team offense, it might not be formal.
1:59
[SPEAKER_02]: They might not be coming out and saying they're announcement verbally, but we are really starting to understand the mechanics of what's going into making this decision.
2:10
[SPEAKER_04]: And maybe that's something everybody's been talking about right in terms of hey this is Monk and coming in his first year as head coach, he's got to make a decision here over whether we're going to be going with Sanders, whether we're going to be going with Watson, kind of the incumbent there, you know if he's trying to install obviously his offense, something that's completely new.
2:28
[SPEAKER_04]: I wonder, Gavin, how much of this is about Watson completely earning
2:37
[SPEAKER_04]: really winning the job versus the fact that maybe he's picking up a little bit more of the offense, a little bit quicker than what should our Sanders is.
2:46
[SPEAKER_04]: And maybe Monk and with that veteran experience, maybe he's a little bit more confident with him going into the season, at least starting it that he'll be able to execute his offense, at least maybe not with, you know, all of the flash you might get with his shooter Sanders, but he might be able to at its very base be able to run
3:07
[SPEAKER_04]: that he doesn't have to worry about as many moving parts.
3:09
[SPEAKER_04]: Whereas you get shooter Sanders, you add some moving parts because he's not the veteran coming in.
3:14
[SPEAKER_04]: You're obviously he's the second year guy.
3:16
[SPEAKER_04]: He's still learning and this is his second new NFL offense in only two years on the job.
3:21
[SPEAKER_04]: So I don't know how much of it is really Watson winning it versus the fact that maybe Monk is just a little bit more comfortable with him right now.
3:28
[SPEAKER_04]: But in any case, it does seem like like you said, Nick, we've got our guy right now.
3:33
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, good points, Chris.
3:34
[SPEAKER_01]: And of course, maybe they are not wanting to say right now and create kind of a more of a frenzy.
3:39
[SPEAKER_01]: They're letting you read between the lines so that they don't, you know, maybe stir too much internal controversy for these guys competing for this role.
3:46
[SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, we have to acknowledge a fact that Watson's strongest overall throwing day of camp.
3:51
[SPEAKER_01]: And it was really his third impressive performance of the Brown's long six day stretch there.
3:56
[SPEAKER_01]: It was after that that he's getting this second consecutive look with the first offense.
4:02
[SPEAKER_01]: Do you think that is significant and telling right there of or considering that, you know, Watson didn't really come out with his best stuff.
4:10
[SPEAKER_01]: And now he is so, and he's just getting his deserve look around.
4:14
[SPEAKER_02]: I, I think they finally had an opportunity to divide the way that these reps have been going, you know, because the Sean Watson put together his past practice on Wednesday really since he arrived in Cleveland with the Browns Thursday was the first moment.
4:31
[SPEAKER_02]: That they kind of changed things a little bit because it was still Sanders day with the ones on Thursday But to Sean Watson rotated in for a few plays.
4:39
[SPEAKER_02]: It was also the most and I was out there There's the most we saw a deal in Gabriel since the spring so everybody kind of was eating on Shador's day on Thursday And then Friday was to Sean's day is scheduled, but then Saturday was when the big switcheroo happened
4:54
[SPEAKER_02]: where everybody thought that it was going to be Shoulders day to Sean gets those reps and yeah, I think you got to follow their actions Not their words.
5:03
[SPEAKER_02]: This is an organization that does nothing but lie to you.
5:05
[SPEAKER_02]: They said Miles Garrett was a lifetime Cleveland Brown They said Baker may feel it was never going anywhere
5:11
[SPEAKER_02]: So you got to follow their actions.
5:12
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, right now they're not going to name a starting quarterback.
5:15
[SPEAKER_02]: Perhaps today Todd Munkin acknowledges that the Sean Watson is the leader in this competition.
5:21
[SPEAKER_02]: There might not be any benefit to announcing publicly a starter right now.
5:25
[SPEAKER_02]: But make no bones about it.
5:27
[SPEAKER_02]: What happened over the weekend?
5:28
[SPEAKER_02]: Not good news for Shador Sanders and very good news for the Sean Watson's chances of starting week one when this thing goes on to Jacksonville
5:41
[SPEAKER_02]: is really is really what it boils down to.
5:43
[SPEAKER_02]: This is we know what this year is.
5:44
[SPEAKER_02]: It's another sunk year.
5:46
[SPEAKER_02]: If you're going back to the player that sunk this organization back in 2022 when they executed the worst trade in the history of professional sports.
5:54
[SPEAKER_04]: Now, Dave, let me ask you this question.
5:56
[SPEAKER_04]: Do you think that the Browns organization was kind of in waiting for Watson to have a day where you could say, hey, okay, that looks like a pretty good day.
6:04
[SPEAKER_04]: Now he's going to be our guy and they were up until that point kind of maybe listening to the noise in the background from the fans from the Shudder camp saying, hey, we're trying to keep things equal.
6:12
[SPEAKER_04]: We're trying to keep things equal.
6:14
[SPEAKER_04]: Finally, Deshawn has his day where he said, hey, that was a good day.
6:17
[SPEAKER_04]: He's going to be our guy.
6:18
[SPEAKER_02]: And then the monkey could drop the act to
6:21
[SPEAKER_02]: right?
6:22
[SPEAKER_02]: Because we heard coming into the spring before spring practices that Watson had an insight edge.
6:28
[SPEAKER_02]: And what did we say at the time that that meant Shador was going to have to play leaps and bounds better than him in practice, but also in the preseason games.
6:36
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, so far in practice, both of these guys have looked pretty average.
6:40
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, they've both had days where they make head-turning throws that make you think while we're really on to something here, and then they both have really baffling moments.
6:48
[SPEAKER_02]: So the fact that there has not been that separation, I think this has been what the Browns have wanted to do all along.
6:55
[SPEAKER_02]: You've heard from Insiders, Adam Shepher, Mike Garafolo, you know, these Insiders with these rumblings that the Browns really want to start to shine, the Browns really want to start to shine, but the Browns themselves aren't saying it with your chest.
7:07
[SPEAKER_02]: Say it with your chest now.
7:09
[SPEAKER_02]: we've seen it to happen on the field where you guys have changed these snaps in such a way that lead us to believe that the Sean Watson's going to be the week one starting quarterback.
7:17
[SPEAKER_02]: You've been priming the us for this since honestly Chris J. W. Johnson was in studio with us before the combine.
7:24
[SPEAKER_02]: When unprompted, he was bringing up Dishon Watson and how great he looks, enters recovery and how excited they were to get him on the field of Todd Munkin.
7:32
[SPEAKER_02]: So they've been priming us for this blow since well before the spring and now that it's reality, I think it is time for them to probably say it out loud.
7:42
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's interesting.
7:43
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree that maybe not saying it with your chest, but certainly there have been seeds planted, especially with a monk in saying things like how experience should give to Sean in an advantage here, especially when it comes to things like commanding the huddle, the cadence and diagnosing what he's seeing on defense and things like that.
8:01
[SPEAKER_01]: I think those seeds have been planted along the way and they're just still waiting for the time to be right to be come out with their big sureness and who they're looking at for number one.
8:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Also, I mean, despite the shift, Shidorr is just 24 years old, and he started the final seven games of last season.
8:18
[SPEAKER_01]: So given the Brown's youth movement, he's definitely the more logical question along term.
8:25
[SPEAKER_01]: So do you think even if Watson currently starts to play better, Shidorr still make more sense for where this Brown's team is headed, long term?
8:34
[SPEAKER_02]: Uh, this, this tells you, and, and, and again, I have to preface this by saying, I'm a Shador fan.
8:41
[SPEAKER_02]: I would personally start Shador.
8:43
[SPEAKER_02]: He matches the timeline of this roster.
8:45
[SPEAKER_02]: He's 24.
8:46
[SPEAKER_02]: He showed you some brilliant flashes during a seven starts last year with that set cap.
8:52
[SPEAKER_02]: This is now the second coaching staff saying some of the same things about Shador Sanders that we heard with the last coaching staff stuff about getting in and out of the huddles stuff about commanding the line of scrimmage the cadence the processing all of the pre-snaps stuff that fans don't get to see as it pertains to the quarterback position maybe Shador's just not there yet his arm is Uber talented I've been out there I will repeat
9:20
[SPEAKER_02]: from a pure throwing the football standpoint.
9:23
[SPEAKER_02]: Shoulder Sanders better than Deschon Watson.
9:26
[SPEAKER_02]: So it's gotta be the pre-snap stuff that they're continuing to talk about.
9:31
[SPEAKER_02]: I do think Sodor makes more sense for the Browns and the short term and the long term, all of that stuff.
9:36
[SPEAKER_02]: But they're trying to tell ya without telling ya how they really feel about Sodor Sanders if he can't even beat out a guy in Deschon Watson who actually got booed at a training camp practice earlier last week.
9:48
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, somebody actually took off a day of work in the middle of the summer, went to a practice and booed the starting quarterback.
9:56
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, that's the other guy in this competition.
9:59
[SPEAKER_02]: So if Shador can't even beat him, a player that hasn't looked good in six years from now, maybe we maybe we just don't have anything.
10:10
[SPEAKER_02]: When we thought we could have had a little glimmer as something, and again, I'm going to take you to where we're playing for the end of April this year.
10:18
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, you've got to also believe that pre-snaps stuff is so important for this particular regime and for Todd Monkin because he does so much more before the snap, it seems like rather than what's the fancy was doing in his regime in prior years, they've got a lot more motion.
10:34
[SPEAKER_04]: There's an awful lot more traffic that you've got to accommodate and you've got to be on top of and he won't even be able to run the offense if you don't get that stuff straight.
10:43
[SPEAKER_04]: So I think there's an added emphasis there for Todd Monkin because let's not forget this is a new coach coming in he needs some positive momentum too.
10:52
[SPEAKER_04]: He needs to be able to show that this offense right off the get go is making some steps in the right direction.
10:58
[SPEAKER_04]: Otherwise, you start to lose things in the locker room.
11:00
[SPEAKER_04]: We see that very quickly in the NFL, right?
11:02
[SPEAKER_04]: Even a fresh new head coach can quickly find himself in a bad spot if you don't get the team going in the right direction.
11:10
[SPEAKER_04]: And I think he wants somebody who he feels pretty confident.
11:13
[SPEAKER_04]: And at least get that pre-snapsed stuff done as a veteran enough to run the offense rather than giving those reins over for somebody who's a little bit less experienced when it comes to all those categories.
11:25
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, we also can't forget about Dylan Gabriel.
11:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Rounds of reportedly considered giving him more opportunities, and he's part of a quarterback room that has produced a lot of turnovers.
11:34
[SPEAKER_01]: Do you think he's a realistic option to win this job or has it really become solely Watson versus soon?
11:42
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, they're on his showcase at this guy, right?
11:44
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, yeah.
11:45
[SPEAKER_01]: But I mean, considering what we've seen, again, we're seeing the actions play out.
11:49
[SPEAKER_01]: What do you think?
11:50
[SPEAKER_04]: We've got to be showcased in this guy to move him right.
11:53
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, that's got to be everything that all the momentum behind Dylan Gabriel right now is to see what can we get out of them.
11:59
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't think that this regime is enamored with Dylan Gabriel.
12:02
[SPEAKER_04]: I think from everything that we saw last year, there was nothing there that led me to believe that, hey, this is a guy anything more than a backup quarterback in the NFL.
12:10
[SPEAKER_04]: So I think that they're going to try and get him some wraps, maybe get him in in the preseason.
12:15
[SPEAKER_04]: See what we could do.
12:16
[SPEAKER_04]: Maybe we get a late round pit for a guy like that.
12:18
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't know, but I don't think he really factors into the Cleveland Browns long-term plans at quarterback.
12:23
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, man.
12:24
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to push back on that a little bit.
12:27
[SPEAKER_02]: I think they really like the guy I think this path is seeing the same thing that last staff was saying about Dylan Gabriel that he's smart, that he does the little things right, that he can operate the full operation.
12:38
[SPEAKER_02]: Remember, pre-snap, post-snap, throwing the football.
12:42
[SPEAKER_02]: And under the back of an increase maybe he has been the most consistent quarterback that's been out there obviously The sample size has been way smaller because he's not getting the volume of reps.
12:53
[SPEAKER_02]: He's not really factoring in to this starting quarterback competition at all But there's a real world where independently of what happens with the starting quarterback competition
13:04
[SPEAKER_02]: Dylan Gabriel really well could be the backup quarterback and what could that really mean for Shidorah Sanders?
13:11
[SPEAKER_02]: I really do wonder if that's the sort of conversation that we're having by weeks end.
13:16
[SPEAKER_04]: bring this super computer back in his processing speed, Nick.
13:20
[SPEAKER_04]: Let's see what he can do now with Todd Monkin.
13:23
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't know, I'm not buying that.
13:24
[SPEAKER_04]: I still think the organization is eventually going to cut their losses on one Dylan Gabriel.
13:29
[SPEAKER_04]: Whether he got a fair shake or not, I just don't think it's in the cards form, but like you said, if he can truly process, like has been promised and prior regimes, he should work well with Monkin.
13:40
[SPEAKER_04]: I just don't buy it.
13:41
[SPEAKER_02]: He was splitting reps with, he was splitting back up quarterback reps with Shidorah Sanders on Saturday.
13:47
[SPEAKER_02]: So that leads me to believe that they, at least for Saturday, they were back on a level playing field, you know, with Watson being the cut above.
13:55
[SPEAKER_02]: So is there a real world where Shidorah Sanders could be closer to QB3?
14:00
[SPEAKER_02]: Then he is QB1.
14:02
[SPEAKER_02]: I think that could be reality and I do wonder if somebody came calling for Shidorr, team like the Jets, a team like maybe Atlanta.
14:11
[SPEAKER_02]: How crazy would that be?
14:12
[SPEAKER_02]: To send them back to Kevin Stephanski, the Lions.
14:16
[SPEAKER_02]: Just saw Teddy Bridgewater, but walk back into retirement.
14:19
[SPEAKER_02]: I just feel like everything is on the table with this starting quarterback, back up quarterback, how they put together this quarterback room.
14:29
[SPEAKER_02]: And the only surefire thing is to Sean Watson counting for $80 million against the team's dead cap.
14:34
[SPEAKER_02]: That's the one definite.
14:37
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, if we shift outside of this quarterback competition, there is still plenty of a look at in the developments across the roster here.
14:43
[SPEAKER_01]: So we are approaching the second week of training camp, the end of the second week, and so if we look at the rookie receivers who are making a big impression there's that, and then the Browns are also dealing with this injury situation at defensive tackle, and perhaps most surprisingly,
15:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Our first rompick Spencer Fano may not be guaranteed a starting job at left tackle when the season opens.
15:06
[SPEAKER_01]: So outside of this quarterback competition, let's evaluate some of these other things we got going on.
15:11
[SPEAKER_01]: What do you think is the biggest storyline or what are you taking away from the brown second week?
15:15
[SPEAKER_02]: Chris.
15:16
[SPEAKER_02]: Detack was thin.
15:17
[SPEAKER_02]: Any chance we could get grady McNiel up here on the defense of line in Cleveland because they're they're trying anything they can up here.
15:24
[SPEAKER_04]: I'll tell you what, either Grady or Owen McNale, both of them start on the defensive lines for their respective schools right now, Grady's on J.V., you got Owen on varsity.
15:35
[SPEAKER_04]: So either of those guys are going to be free agents here soon enough and maybe they're going to be with the Cleveland Browns, the Browns certainly need a little bit of help there.
15:43
[SPEAKER_04]: I tell you what I do like with Jared versus doing there to try and get that line and be a leader on long that line for just about everybody on that defense.
15:52
[SPEAKER_04]: He seems to be somebody they're looking up to even on offense right now.
15:55
[SPEAKER_04]: You mentioned Spencer for now.
15:57
[SPEAKER_04]: And the fact that he was working Jared versus working with him after practice a little bit working on his handwork working on his footwork.
16:05
[SPEAKER_04]: Seeing what he can do to try and improve his game a little bit.
16:09
[SPEAKER_04]: I really like that edition of Jared Verst, that's what strikes me the most with this defensive line.
16:13
[SPEAKER_04]: But certainly, if the Browns need any help, I've got a couple of McNeill's here that are ready willing to play.
16:19
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, they are already at the point in training camp, where they're just signing guys.
16:24
[SPEAKER_02]: because they need bottoms.
16:25
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, they're just standing, sign in fill in dudes that have been journeymen players on practice squads or rosters, just because they need players on that defensive line.
16:34
[SPEAKER_02]: And honestly, the offensive line is probably much more of a concern because they don't have a Jared for
16:41
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, you know the defensive line, come regular season.
16:44
[SPEAKER_02]: Molly Collins should be ready to go for week one, which is a huge deal on the interior.
16:48
[SPEAKER_02]: Mason Graham avoided a big scare.
16:50
[SPEAKER_02]: He's going to be fine, and you know the Eddraschers with Alex Wright Jared Vers, you're going to be good on the defensive line.
16:58
[SPEAKER_02]: The offensive line!
17:01
[SPEAKER_02]: Currently a beat behind the defensive line and that's putting things nicely to be expected though Because this is a completely new offensive line could have all five starters be brand new I do hope that that's an area of the team that kind of comes along a little bit better in the preseason because
17:18
[SPEAKER_02]: So far, it's really a guessing game as to who that fifth offensive line starter will be.
17:24
[SPEAKER_02]: Elton Jenkins and Parker Brailsford were both competing to be the starting center.
17:29
[SPEAKER_02]: They both missed several days of practice last week, so that competition is kind of on hold.
17:35
[SPEAKER_02]: The injury bug has piled up as the Browns just wrapped up a crazy stretch of 10 practices in 11 days and when that training camp schedule came out I kind of did wonder how are they gonna look at the end of these 11 days and and and they look like a team that's beat up They got a well deserved day off yesterday and hopefully we'll get a couple guys back out on the practice field here in just about an hour
17:58
[SPEAKER_01]: How about the wookie wookie, wookie wide receivers?
18:01
[SPEAKER_01]: The wide receivers, these rookies are making a huge statement here.
18:04
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's talk about Denzelbot.
18:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Stin, he's become one of the more impressive offensive players in camp.
18:08
[SPEAKER_01]: And obviously KC, Concepts Yon, has shown off his speed and his ability to adjust to the football.
18:14
[SPEAKER_01]: And also Jerry Judy just had one of his best days of camp on Thursday.
18:18
[SPEAKER_01]: So how excited should Browns fans be about what they're seeing from some of these young receivers?
18:23
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I'm very, very, very excited, right, Nick?
18:26
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, we have seen just a death of all fence of progress from this team, from the wide receiver position for years now.
18:34
[SPEAKER_04]: And, you know, just to get to young guys in that seem to be as exciting and excitable as both of these guys are, then Zell Boston is just a big guy and boy, you got people around the league already talking about him.
18:47
[SPEAKER_04]: Conceptually, oh, not only on offense, but then also special teams.
18:51
[SPEAKER_04]: These guys, I think, are going to be big contributors, not only this year, but then go on forward.
18:56
[SPEAKER_04]: And it's exciting because we were talking about it after the draft.
18:59
[SPEAKER_04]: We're like, this draft, I think, was really good for the Cleveland Browns.
19:02
[SPEAKER_04]: And part of the reason for that was we've had a couple of good answers at wide receiver that we addressed there in that draft.
19:09
[SPEAKER_04]: And both of those guys right off the rip here in Nick are doing very well out there in camp.
19:14
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, throughout the first, like I said, your 15 spring practices plus 10 training camp session, that's about 25 practices that Denzel Boston's had with the Cleveland Browns has probably been the best and most consistent player on that offense.
19:30
[SPEAKER_02]: He has been incredible.
19:32
[SPEAKER_02]: He catches just about everything that's thrown his way.
19:34
[SPEAKER_02]: It's been awesome.
19:35
[SPEAKER_02]: Casey concepts the own.
19:36
[SPEAKER_02]: His big red flag coming in was the drops.
19:39
[SPEAKER_02]: I can't say that I haven't seen him drop a pass because I have,
19:43
[SPEAKER_02]: no big drops, no alarming drops out of this receiver position group, and Casey is a guy that is a little bit shorter, you know, there was maybe a little bit of concern about that after round one before they drafted Denzel Boston, but he makes some big, deeping, grabbing catches, where he climbs the ladder like he's a big, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter, and he's a little bit shorter
20:02
[SPEAKER_02]: athletic dude even though his height might only say six foot so these receivers are gonna have a massive opportunity throughout this season and it wouldn't surprise me if the rookie receivers are leading the way by the end by the end of the year with potentially Isaiah Bond who's come on really strong and the team could maybe be just in a position to move on from Jerry Judy this off season who's had a much more quiet camp.
20:26
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20:59
[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome back to the big play Cleveland show.
21:01
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's talk a little guards ball here guys.
21:02
[SPEAKER_01]: We have been struggling a little bit Cleveland has lost five of its last six.
21:07
[SPEAKER_01]: Eight of its last 11 and 13 of its last 17 after dropping three of four to the white socks.
21:12
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that one hurts, you know.
21:14
[SPEAKER_01]: We now find ourselves.
21:16
[SPEAKER_01]: four games back in the division and you know the front office credits by making this big push at the trade deadline to improve the roster but so far the results just haven't followed as instantly um you know we saw that Steven vote had a team meeting after the white socks game yesterday and you know the offense still struggling in big situations here and now that the bullpen starting to show somewhere you know how how concerned should we be about the roster right the second.
21:41
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm right in the roller coaster of emotions with this guardians thing, because at the deadline I feel so good after the deadline I come in on Wednesday filling for Fontana with Carlos by Irga and he's saying the guardians are going all the way, the guardians to the world series.
21:57
[SPEAKER_02]: So I'm getting ready to buy my ALPENENT gear and then this massive losing streak happened.
22:03
[SPEAKER_02]: So what happened to Guardians of the World series because what I'm seeing with my eyeballs is a team that continues to struggle with timely hitting a team that consistently has these weird bullpen gaps.
22:13
[SPEAKER_02]: And I really do hope they get it on the straight narrow.
22:16
[SPEAKER_02]: Some point here soon.
22:18
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I think it's worth checking in with the Jensen Lewis will bring the heat here and get his opinion on just how concerned he should we should be over this bad stretch, Jensen.
22:26
[SPEAKER_01]: Is it just simply a little rough patch or are we starting to see some legitimate
22:33
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think Gabby, you go back to, you know, where the, the all star break was and just look at some of the numbers here.
22:39
[SPEAKER_03]: Let's start offensively.
22:41
[SPEAKER_03]: They've scored 88 runs in 22 games since the all star break.
22:45
[SPEAKER_03]: So just a little bit a little bit under league average right there at that point.
22:50
[SPEAKER_03]: The problem has been the pitching and, you know, Nick is is right to kind of sound the alarm on it a little bit of, we look at where this has been, you know, a group that
22:59
[SPEAKER_03]: you've traditionally been able to just kind of get the lead, send it back to the back into the bullpen and no big deal after that, but yeah, there is a bit of a leak there and it has been a more predominant as of late.
23:14
[SPEAKER_03]: The number that sticks out to me is 7 and 15.
23:16
[SPEAKER_03]: uh... they are seven fifteen since the all-star break and when you have winnable series and especially this past home stand that you should have been able to take care of business against a couple of bad teams and you don't that that really starts to send up a warning flag this is a pretty big series into troit not just from the winds and losses because we know they all are at this point
23:37
[SPEAKER_03]: But we're about to find out what this team is made of from a mental standpoint, because Detroit is absolutely rolling.
23:43
[SPEAKER_03]: Even with the TraderTurics scoobled, they're five and two up to the beginning play here today.
23:48
[SPEAKER_03]: The Dodgers are around a clear one and six in that point.
23:50
[SPEAKER_03]: They've got a lot to prove to themselves, and I don't think anyone is really fearful of this line up right now.
23:58
[SPEAKER_03]: So that in turn is really going to be a pressure test up against a Detroit Tiger team that is really hitting
24:06
[SPEAKER_02]: All right, Jensen.
24:07
[SPEAKER_02]: We've got a tweet that I want to put up on the screen for you.
24:11
[SPEAKER_02]: You know that during losing streaks fans will react passionately sometimes strongly, but this one coming from Nick think at think end to three.
24:23
[SPEAKER_02]: who says they won't fire Stephen vote but they absolutely should just not ready to be a big league manager needs to be a bench coach for a few years and try again just can't handle the day-to-day of this job we've already reached the terminate Stephen vote portion of the program.
24:44
[SPEAKER_02]: I have to cast my vote and say that I am very against this the guy is one back-to-back managers of the year but I'll let you react.
24:52
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that's a bridge too far from me at this point and I think you also have to go back to the the off season guys and and I had said this to you last year that when we got to the end of the year, you know, they needed to make some some significant additions on the offensive side and and we've now.
25:10
[SPEAKER_03]: encountered back to back years where there really hasn't been any so that that lands at the feet of the front office.
25:17
[SPEAKER_03]: That's not even votes fault.
25:18
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean he's he's kind of playing a hand here that's you know like a nine high right now.
25:24
[SPEAKER_03]: How do you go into battle series in in series out when you're short you know two or three bats in the lineup every single day that that's really tough.
25:33
[SPEAKER_03]: So on the flip side I mean the guide deserves all the credit in the world for doing so much
25:40
[SPEAKER_03]: I think the frustration goes more up to the front office and, you know, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting a different result.
25:48
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, we're now like half a decade in guys of the same off season.
25:52
[SPEAKER_03]: We've had the same non-committment to going after bigger impact offensive weapons.
25:59
[SPEAKER_03]: And you're wasting prime Jose Ramirez at that point.
26:03
[SPEAKER_03]: you have a very, very competent starting rotation.
26:06
[SPEAKER_03]: In fact, one of the elite ones that's been very homegrown, they've done exactly what they've needed to do to put themselves in position day in and day out from a starting staff to win games.
26:17
[SPEAKER_03]: But when you don't have an offense, that can basically get you more than three runs a night on any given night.
26:23
[SPEAKER_03]: That's a problem.
26:24
[SPEAKER_03]: That's not Stephen Votes fault.
26:25
[SPEAKER_03]: He's just going with the guys that have been given to him and trying to make the best of it.
26:31
[SPEAKER_03]: This is on Chris Anthony and Mike Turnoff and it's not just, you know, one or two years.
26:36
[SPEAKER_03]: This is now a better part of a half decade where there has been little to no offensive reinforcement.
26:41
[SPEAKER_03]: through the offseason.
26:43
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not even going to count the trade deadline this year.
26:45
[SPEAKER_03]: So far, guys, because we don't have a sample yet from Joe Adele and at the annual load it to even understand what their, you know, obvious production could be by the time it's all said and done.
26:55
[SPEAKER_03]: This is not Steven Votes fault.
26:57
[SPEAKER_03]: This is the front office is fault.
26:59
[SPEAKER_01]: In your point, they're gents and about we don't have enough of a sample size yet to see what these acquisitions can truly yield us.
27:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Do you think that we just need to have a little bit more patience there?
27:08
[SPEAKER_03]: Sure, I mean, Gabby, you're talking about here just the first week of August that these guys have been in uniform getting used to being with the mates every single day.
27:16
[SPEAKER_03]: So I can't pass judgment on it.
27:18
[SPEAKER_03]: Now, what I can pass judgment on is they're not the overwhelming offensive reinforcements as far as like, oh, you're going to get a middle of the order.
27:26
[SPEAKER_03]: And I get the other side of that, like, well, what were they really going to be able to acquire at this deadline?
27:32
[SPEAKER_03]: Totally understand that, and it's why I go back to reinforcing my original point of, it's the last couple of off seasons where you've come into the year.
27:40
[SPEAKER_03]: You don't have the offensive depth, and now it's put you in a position at the trade deadline to where there isn't really a lot for you to go out and get to bolster for this run.
27:48
[SPEAKER_03]: So, hopefully, Adele continues to crush left-handed pitching.
27:52
[SPEAKER_03]: Hopefully, Nathaniel Low gets some big swings.
27:54
[SPEAKER_03]: In fact, the three-run Homer, you know, in the past home stand against the match, you're like, that's exactly what you're hoping for from a trade deadline acquisition.
28:01
[SPEAKER_03]: Instant impact, it got on with in and run, unfortunately, the bullpen blows it there at the end, but they're in the fight, man.
28:08
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'm going to say, like, this schedule, at least for the next two series, add Detroit, and then home to start the home stand against San Diego.
28:17
[SPEAKER_03]: You're you're going to be up against it, but after that guys, if you want to go super glass have full and I've usually been that with you guys, the giants to finish the home stand.
28:26
[SPEAKER_03]: You go to Colorado who's been better, but you should win that series.
28:29
[SPEAKER_03]: You're going to the angels who are full cell mode, you should beat them.
28:33
[SPEAKER_03]: You come back home against Kansas City.
28:35
[SPEAKER_03]: You should beat them to close out the month.
28:37
[SPEAKER_03]: If you can't take advantage of the back end of this month of scheduling, then they don't
28:45
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a good point.
28:46
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I think a big piece, Jensen, that this fan base has got to be really worried about is just the bullpen.
28:53
[SPEAKER_02]: This is completely different from last year, where these guys are really anything but automatic, like they were last year.
29:01
[SPEAKER_02]: What are you seeing?
29:02
[SPEAKER_02]: What's going wrong with this bullpen?
29:04
[SPEAKER_02]: And how is it so different year over year?
29:06
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, well, that's the thing is it's fickle Nick, you know, and as someone who's been a part of it, you know, 2007, my rookie year, we had, you know, one of the best and back-end dominant groups, Joborowski, let the League and Saves, the very next year, I was closing, you know, at the end of the year, the last couple of months, because we had just such a tradition and such falloff in the first half of the season, we were out of the race, but then that presents opportunities for young guys to take advantage.
29:31
[SPEAKER_03]: Just by the numbers, this is pretty startling, guys, since the all-star break,
29:35
[SPEAKER_03]: The Cleveland Guardians bullpenny area is five 13 now you could have not given me 10 guesses and and I would have gotten anywhere close to that number just knowing the pedigree of what this group has had year in and year out only the Rangers the Royals in the Athletics.
29:52
[SPEAKER_03]: have a worse bullpenny R8 than the Guardian since the all-star break.
29:55
[SPEAKER_03]: That's your season right now.
29:57
[SPEAKER_03]: Is coming out of that second half and starting as slow as you have, that has really put you in a predicament.
30:04
[SPEAKER_03]: Now in the division where you lose a series head to head, against the Chicago White Sox.
30:09
[SPEAKER_03]: you're now facing a Detroit team on the road that is really playing well and has been all the way back, probably since July 1st, one of the best teams only in the American League, but in Big League Baseball.
30:19
[SPEAKER_03]: So round about the answer to your question, what has been the problem?
30:22
[SPEAKER_03]: I think you have to go guy by guy.
30:23
[SPEAKER_03]: It was a Kate Smith has done everything you can ask for him and more.
30:26
[SPEAKER_03]: everyone else has gone on a bad stretch where out over the big part of the plate falling behind, not throwing strike one, you know, there are a lot of mistakes in the big part of the zone that we are so not customary to seeing from a lot of these guys and it's all happening at the same time.
30:43
[SPEAKER_03]: So it's really magnified the issues and you don't have like a whole
30:51
[SPEAKER_03]: It has really been tough sledding.
30:53
[SPEAKER_03]: It's almost like you don't want your name to be called on that phone because you're like, God, what's going to happen today?
30:59
[SPEAKER_03]: But they got to get in the fight.
31:00
[SPEAKER_03]: They got to push back.
31:01
[SPEAKER_03]: They got to swing back a little bit here because if this team is going to go anywhere, this bullpen unit must get right here by the end of the month.
31:10
[SPEAKER_01]: yeah and in your opinion, Jensen, how much do things that happen that are kind of outside of the bullpens control, kind of, you know, force them to bring their best stuff.
31:22
[SPEAKER_01]: I think what I'm looking at is the Randalay from Sunday and how that changed the entire game plan, Joey Cantillo was forced.
31:28
[SPEAKER_01]: out just after one ending because of the rain delay two hours twenty three minutes and you know in terms of facing adversity with curveballs pun intended like this outside of your control what does that do for for the guys having to change their game plan like does that can't tell a situation for example expose a roster management problem or you know is it something with the guys something they really need to come together and and just lock in more.
31:55
[SPEAKER_03]: Sunday's kind of an outlier gap right because you know you look at where that rain delay happens you never know how long it goes but you know fortunately the off day on Monday able to allow the reset if you will because you get that off day and you get that rest time but it's more of the body of work and that's kind of why I wanted to go back and look you know we're now into you know a fair amount of games here guys when you go from the start of the second half
32:21
[SPEAKER_03]: of the season and you look through, you know, a good four weeks of just really detrimental bullpen performances.
32:29
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a big reason why they have really struggled to win series.
32:33
[SPEAKER_03]: I'll even start with, you know, looking at Pittsburgh out of the shoot.
32:38
[SPEAKER_03]: you end up losing that series.
32:40
[SPEAKER_03]: But you end up finding a way to get back and split a series against Minnesota for intensive purposes.
32:46
[SPEAKER_03]: You should have won that series.
32:47
[SPEAKER_03]: You won the first two.
32:48
[SPEAKER_03]: You had a chance to at least take three or four.
32:51
[SPEAKER_03]: That's where the slide really started.
32:53
[SPEAKER_03]: Tampa absolutely dominant pitching wise.
32:56
[SPEAKER_03]: You ran into a buzz saw there.
32:57
[SPEAKER_03]: Cincinnati, probably a winnable series, or at least a sweepable series.
33:02
[SPEAKER_03]: But again, you'll take the series
33:07
[SPEAKER_03]: the sweep by the mets inexcusable.
33:10
[SPEAKER_03]: If you are a contending team, that cannot happen, especially at home after they've traded everybody, that one will probably stick with them for a while and then the opportunity after Martinez hits a grand slam on Friday night.
33:24
[SPEAKER_03]: That's a moment right there.
33:25
[SPEAKER_03]: You're like, okay.
33:26
[SPEAKER_03]: And we're going to assert our will here, we take game one, we leave no doubt, and then you give away leads on Saturday and Sunday, that again, you know, it kind of rears.
33:35
[SPEAKER_03]: It's likely head.
33:36
[SPEAKER_03]: It's not just a series here there.
33:39
[SPEAKER_03]: This has been an epidemic now for the bullpen since the second half started.
33:43
[SPEAKER_02]: Hey, Jensen, speaking of this bullpen, Craig Yoho, Kaita shaky start here for our guards.
33:48
[SPEAKER_02]: What have you seen go wrong for him?
33:51
[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe different than what he had working right for him during his time with Milwaukee.
33:56
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think Nick, when you look at a guy coming over trying to make an impression and it's not, you know, the wipe out high 90 stuff and off speed that, you know, we're, we're used to seeing from a lot of our guys here.
34:08
[SPEAKER_03]: If you just kind of go back, it is, I mean, the, the ending against the mats, no bueno whatsoever and then the command issues against Chicago.
34:18
[SPEAKER_03]: That's going to happen, but the four, I mean, two walks is one thing.
34:21
[SPEAKER_03]: Four walks, yikes, you know, that is going to get yourself in trouble.
34:25
[SPEAKER_03]: And it's kind of the overall theme that I've illuminated when you fall behind in the count, you're making life difficult period.
34:32
[SPEAKER_03]: But when you continue to miss over the big part of the plate, outing in and outing out.
34:36
[SPEAKER_03]: Is that mental?
34:38
[SPEAKER_03]: Is that a little mechanical?
34:39
[SPEAKER_03]: Is it a little bit of both?
34:40
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, Carl Wilson's one of the best in a business and this this staff is probably just drilling down on anything right now to try and get these guys back on the right side.
34:49
[SPEAKER_03]: But certainly not the first impression for Yoho that he wanted to make.
34:52
[SPEAKER_01]: You know what I'm glad you brought that up is Carl Willis is a dude and he's been one.
34:57
[SPEAKER_01]: So some of the slander of both vote in Willis, I guess I've been kind of defensive on these knee jerk reactions.
35:03
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, hey, put some respect on his name, all right.
35:06
[SPEAKER_01]: Um, you got a high-bub car oil list.
35:09
[SPEAKER_01]: I think some of these problems, and honestly we can take a look at the offense too, just the clutch hitting not being, you know, we always say guards ball, guards ball, but it's been kind of an issue, like, you know, we had opportunities on Sunday, couldn't capitalize, and the same issues have continued throughout this little skid.
35:27
[SPEAKER_01]: Why do you think that these bats have struggled in big moments?
35:31
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, again, great job by some of the opposing scouting departments and a lot of the preparation from these opposing pitching staff.
35:39
[SPEAKER_03]: So again, I'll go back through the opponents too, guys.
35:41
[SPEAKER_03]: When you look at this schedule and as I said, Pittsburgh, one of the better young staffs, one of the better swing and misstaffs.
35:48
[SPEAKER_03]: So you can understand why it was tough sledding there trying to go up against them.
35:52
[SPEAKER_03]: Minnesota, you know, that that's a team in the division that may be adjustments in game three and game four Tampa Bay has been an absolute buzz saw it has always been a tough place for this team to win and then looking at what Arizona and the metstead again I'll go back to you know what you have when you're a club that believes they belong.
36:11
[SPEAKER_03]: You make the adjustment before your opponent does to you and they haven't done that that's on them now.
36:17
[SPEAKER_03]: We're going to find out.
36:18
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
36:18
[SPEAKER_03]: You're up in it.
36:19
[SPEAKER_03]: You're against a corner and are you going to come out swing in.
36:22
[SPEAKER_03]: Are you actually going to make an opposing pitching staff feel you a timer to and guys the numbers are they're not horrible.
36:30
[SPEAKER_03]: As far as, you know, where this team is, run scoring wise, they're 70th, they scored 88 runs in 22 games basically since the All-Star Break.
36:39
[SPEAKER_03]: So, not great, not awful.
36:41
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, home run wise can this is still a team that struggles in the power department, only 21 home runs in 22 games, 27 doubles in 22 games.
36:49
[SPEAKER_03]: But hey,
36:53
[SPEAKER_03]: you can only do with what you have and you got a lot of young kids that are starting to cut their teeth here.
37:00
[SPEAKER_03]: And when you're in a penit race and you are playing divisional opponents and American League opponents that have seen you already, the book is out.
37:08
[SPEAKER_03]: This is now the litmus test that this young team is going to have to go through.
37:12
[SPEAKER_03]: And it is really, really uphill as far as trying to find a way to break through when it has been a prolonged slump here for the last three to four weeks.
37:21
[SPEAKER_02]: Jensen.
37:21
[SPEAKER_02]: I got to admit after what happened against the white socks I pulled up my phone and I looked up Guardians versus white socks upcoming schedule and realize their final three game series of the regular season September 14 through the 16th.
37:33
[SPEAKER_02]: We got about a month until that point.
37:36
[SPEAKER_02]: If the guardians don't sweep it Chicago owns the tiebreaker in the event of a tie in the division here could that final series.
37:45
[SPEAKER_02]: against the white socks end up being seasoned to finding for the guardians, and if so, how much pressure is that going to put on the guards by giving Chicago that tiebreaker advantage over the weekend?
37:56
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, these guys won't think about that right now, but you're right, Nick, to look at it just from from our standpoint on this side of the ledger, that that beginning of that final homestand might end up deciding playoff positioning for both clubs.
38:11
[SPEAKER_03]: And I had told you guys, I think that it's still this division could come down to the final weekend of the regular season.
38:17
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, the card's going to have to go to Fenway Park for three, then your home gets Kansas City, who, God knows what that roster is going to look like by the time we get there, but you have to kind of drill down and worry about Tuesday, August 11th at the Detroit Tigers and figure out how to go just win a game.
38:34
[SPEAKER_03]: Keep it small.
38:35
[SPEAKER_03]: And I appreciate that Steven Vogue brought everyone together and knowing you got an off day, sometimes that's the perfect time.
38:41
[SPEAKER_03]: Like guys, remember when we started, we're pretty damn good.
38:45
[SPEAKER_03]: We've hit some skids, we've had some things that have not gone our way, but that's the beauty of the marathon of the season.
38:51
[SPEAKER_03]: Who are we now?
38:53
[SPEAKER_03]: you know, you can make it basically a month and a half season.
38:55
[SPEAKER_03]: You can put everything behind you right now and start zero and zero tomorrow.
38:59
[SPEAKER_03]: If indeed that was the message or just trying to rally the troops, you got a lot of young kids who've not gone through this adversity at this level and then knowing what's in front of you.
39:10
[SPEAKER_03]: So that's why I think we're going to know a lot about this club, probably by the time they get done with that San Diego series, and that's where that schedule kind of opens up.
39:19
[SPEAKER_03]: They can tread some water heck if they can win one or two of these series.
39:22
[SPEAKER_03]: That all of a sudden makes things look a little bit different.
39:25
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I love that point, Jensen, just bringing up the fact that voter brought these guys together and the fact that things could change in a hurry.
39:31
[SPEAKER_01]: If you just, it's one game, one series at a time.
39:34
[SPEAKER_01]: I know it sounds cliche, but truthfully, it's not like we're that far off.
39:37
[SPEAKER_01]: This could all happen.
39:38
[SPEAKER_01]: So if you're looking at this Guardian's team right now, what do you think is the one thing that you need to see a change on over the next couple of weeks for this team to prove that they're capable for a playoff run?
39:49
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, the easy answer, Gabbas, is Jose Rivera does Jose Rivera's things.
39:54
[SPEAKER_03]: And that's going to be a lot to ask, no, and he's still recovering with this handmade issue.
39:59
[SPEAKER_03]: Well, documented that these injuries can take time for the actual power, the slug to come back.
40:05
[SPEAKER_03]: But if you can get Jose ignited, that's the domino.
40:08
[SPEAKER_03]: That's the biggest domino to fall, and then everyone else kind of takes a deep breath.
40:13
[SPEAKER_03]: I think we had said it during the injury, but man is it's so much more apparent.
40:18
[SPEAKER_03]: When you don't have that guy and you don't even have him, you know, doing what he usually does day in and day out at 100% health, you understand why he is the most valuable player, not only of this team, but of any team.
40:29
[SPEAKER_03]: There is not a team I find that when you take that star player out, that misses him more at his usual production level.
40:38
[SPEAKER_03]: So I think this is a group that if Jose can get going,
40:41
[SPEAKER_03]: And the next week or two, that's going to give the deep breath to the rest of the lineup.
40:46
[SPEAKER_03]: If you can get the water kind of going back to where he was at the beginning of the year, Steven Quann has been the table setter, get the start of that lineup moving, get that kind of momentum, and that can create a little bit better vibe for this offense day in and day out.
41:02
[SPEAKER_02]: All righty, he is Jensen Lewis.
41:04
[SPEAKER_02]: We appreciate him joining us this week and every week on the Big Play Cleveland show.
41:09
[SPEAKER_02]: Jensen looking forward to doing it again next Monday.
41:11
[SPEAKER_03]: You got it guys, thanks.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Welcome back to the Big Play Cleveland show.
42:42
[SPEAKER_01]: We've got our top dog in the studio.
42:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Hanford Dixon, the Cleveland Browns legend, who knows what it means to play quarterback in this city because you know, someone pretty vocal about your beliefs and Shudor Sanders.
42:56
[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like we got to be asking you about the shift in this quarterback competition that we've been seeing.
43:01
[SPEAKER_01]: because it looks like things have started to change a little bit in Beria top dog, you know Watson getting more of the first team opportunities and it's beginning to look like he could be the guy taking the first snap for the Browns when the season starts and you know we just had to get your opinion on on this.
43:17
[SPEAKER_01]: When you look at everything that's happened at camp and it's starting to look more like the Sean Watson being the starter.
43:22
[SPEAKER_01]: What's your initial reaction to that?
43:24
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I'm a little bit upset about the reps thing, because as we all know, Chador is supposed to get so many, and then Deshawn was supposed to get so many reps. And I go back to last year.
43:40
[SPEAKER_00]: uh... when uh... Dylan was uh... taken most of the raps of a way from uh... this kid should door uh... you know what you know i know it's is still training camp obviously they're trying to figure out who the guy is a who the guy is uh... uh... going to be
43:57
[SPEAKER_00]: But, uh, and I've heard all the chat are coming out of a train coming coming from Maria, uh, especially, uh, from a lot of the people, uh, the sports writers and everybody saying that, uh, should, um,
44:12
[SPEAKER_00]: should doer is taking a step back a little bit and Watson is a guy that's pretty much at the forefront of this thing that's quarterback battle.
44:22
[SPEAKER_00]: But I think it's absolutely crazy because we haven't played a preseason game yet and I think we need to play a little bit of a game against some
44:33
[SPEAKER_00]: bonafide opponents, not saying the guys in practice are not, but they're we're not going full speed in practice and preseason Obviously we'll be going full speed, but I don't like it because and it's nothing to do with nothing against Watson It's just everything to do with should door because I think we have to get this kid ready.
44:53
[SPEAKER_00]: We have to
44:55
[SPEAKER_00]: uh... see if this kid if this kid is going to be uh... quarterback of the future or if he has what is take to be the quarterback of the future who knows maybe he uh... does not have it but still we have to find out and uh... but i also understand where they're coming from a little bit and who knows what's happening i mean what kind of pressure uh...
45:18
[SPEAKER_00]: they're putting on Todd, hopefully none at all to play Watson because we all know Watson has made a lot of money.
45:27
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, we gave him 230 billion and all that was pretty much guaranteed and I think this is pretty much the last year of that contract.
45:36
[SPEAKER_00]: But we still got to find out what we have in Shoulder.
45:40
[SPEAKER_00]: And my understanding is, even there's saying, not Dylan Gabriel, for instance, they're saying that he's moving up the depth chart in a little bit, he's taking some of the reps away from Shoulder, which I think is just absolutely crazy because guys, we have to find out whether or not this guy can play.
45:58
[SPEAKER_00]: We have to find out whether he can be a number one quarterback.
46:01
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think the reason why I think he can and the reason why I want to see him play is because after your second year, after your first year, the game starts to slow down for you.
46:16
[SPEAKER_00]: And I don't care what position you play, whether it's quarterback, defense, a back defensive line, an offensive line or whatever it is.
46:22
[SPEAKER_00]: The game starts to slow down for you and it'll be interesting.
46:26
[SPEAKER_00]: guys to see what this kid could do if we give him a chance.
46:30
[SPEAKER_00]: And if he can't, that's fine.
46:31
[SPEAKER_00]: We got to move on.
46:32
[SPEAKER_00]: But we still have to find out.
46:35
[SPEAKER_04]: What do you think?
46:36
[SPEAKER_04]: What do you make of top dog when people are talking about Shader and saying that he's having some problems getting the offense to the line, the offensive line can't hear his cadence at times.
46:49
[SPEAKER_04]: He's having problems with the play calling.
46:51
[SPEAKER_04]: I've heard all of that coming out of camp here.
46:55
[SPEAKER_04]: Do you think there's anything to that, do you think there's anything to the fact that, okay, well, now you're pulling them away from the ones who is getting less time with those guys to kind of go over that thing.
47:05
[SPEAKER_04]: So where do you come out on all that.
47:08
[SPEAKER_00]: is bullshit myself because I think it's a way of saying the kid is dumb.
47:14
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that's a way of saying the kid is not too bright and I disagree with that.
47:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Hell, I never played quarterback a day in my life and I guarantee I could take it and I can get them up to the line.
47:25
[SPEAKER_00]: I could call the plays and that's what he's been doing pretty much all of his life
47:38
[SPEAKER_00]: we have to face this too.
47:40
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, there's a lot of people that don't like your door.
47:43
[SPEAKER_00]: When I talk about a lot of people, I'm talking about a lot of people in the media.
47:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, much rather see Watson started quarterback rather than should do her because we've heard all the China we've heard all people talking about they don't like him because you know who his daddy is and who
47:59
[SPEAKER_00]: uh... who he carries himself around with he's got a bunch of people on to rudge and all that kind of stuff uh... Chris i i i think a lot of that has a lot of do with where this chatter is coming from but uh... to answer your question i i just don't agree with it i think it's just i'm gonna say it again i think it's bullshit
48:15
[SPEAKER_00]: that he can't get people up to the line.
48:18
[SPEAKER_00]: He can't call the place.
48:19
[SPEAKER_00]: That is crazy.
48:21
[SPEAKER_00]: But if it is true, I mean, let us see it.
48:24
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, put him out there in the game and let's see what's going on.
48:26
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's see because we have to find out if he can play or if he can't play.
48:32
[SPEAKER_04]: I love it, man.
48:33
[SPEAKER_04]: I love getting you fired up here, Todd Donnell, thank you, come out to flame it on that one.
48:40
[SPEAKER_04]: You really just come to blaze and both sides.
48:42
[SPEAKER_04]: I absolutely love it.
48:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, Chris and Gab, you know, it's just really upsetting to me because, you know, obviously, that's what training camp is all about.
48:52
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't have to tell you guys, it's trying to get ready.
48:55
[SPEAKER_00]: It's trying to get ready for the regular season.
48:57
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, I keep saying, and over and over again, we need to know whether or not this kid can play, whether or not this kid can play quarterback, whether or not this kid can leave this football team.
49:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Because the reason why I said, we looked at him last year, guys.
49:11
[SPEAKER_00]: And when we looked at this football team, he didn't have any weapons.
49:14
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, he just didn't have any weapons.
49:17
[SPEAKER_00]: And we've done everything, I mean, Andrew Barry has done everything in his power to put this team together and bring him, not only him, every quarterback on this team, some more weapons.
49:28
[SPEAKER_00]: And I want to see what he can do with the new guys that we have on this team.
49:33
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think it'd be okay, but hell, I'm not there.
49:36
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not the guy that have to make this choice.
49:40
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, when you watch Shodore Hanford, since you are, that's your guy, you've been saying this for a long time.
49:47
[SPEAKER_01]: When you watch him, who does he remind you of, or, you know, with his personality confidence in the way that he carries himself, what do you see in him?
49:56
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I see Bernie Cozore and what I mean by that is one thing we knew about Bernie Bernie was very confident.
50:04
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, he was a guy that believed in his ability, know that he can play and know that he could play quarterback.
50:11
[SPEAKER_00]: Shoulder is the same way.
50:13
[SPEAKER_00]: He's a very confident guy.
50:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Some people call him cocky.
50:16
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't have a problem with being a
50:19
[SPEAKER_00]: I think at the quarterback position, if he can get away with it, I think he'll talk a little bit more trash.
50:25
[SPEAKER_00]: But you know, that's not in the cards for quarterbacks.
50:28
[SPEAKER_00]: They normally have to keep their mouth shut and keep it all inside.
50:32
[SPEAKER_00]: But I think this guy's very, very confident.
50:35
[SPEAKER_00]: He knows that he could play, he believes that he could play, and he's the type of guy at the quarterback position that a team will rally themselves around him.
50:47
[SPEAKER_00]: They'll get behind this guy if we give him the chance to prove himself, but I'm just afraid that may be
50:54
[SPEAKER_00]: that we're not given him that chance, uh, because, uh, and I know, uh, there's different systems, but I think with the system that Todd has, you know, maybe Watson fits that a little bit better, but, uh, and Todd also, Todd is the first year, Todd's the first year here at Coach, and, uh, obviously he's, I think Todd is going to do everything he possibly can.
51:19
[SPEAKER_00]: to win football games, which he should, but I just, me personally, I just, I don't know why we would go back to to Sean Watson.
51:28
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's the guy that's been with us for years now, at least four years with this football team, and he has not shown us anything.
51:36
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, we, we know what he did in Houston.
51:39
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, he was a great, great quarterback in Houston.
51:43
[SPEAKER_00]: but now I mean that's years later I mean we we're trying to move forward we're trying to get our offense going so it's the whole thing just frustrates me as you guys can tell I just get so upset thinking about this whole thing because you know people have talked about this is going to be a year well we just want to win six games win seven games I mean
52:05
[SPEAKER_00]: No, no, no, we want to make it to the playoffs.
52:08
[SPEAKER_00]: We want to go to the playoffs.
52:10
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I think that with the moves that we've made, if we get some competent quarterback play, I think we can do that.
52:17
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I really do the hell with that five or six games.
52:20
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's compete for this AMC North.
52:23
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's compete to win the division.
52:25
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think we can, we're good quarterback play.
52:29
[SPEAKER_00]: I think we could do that because guys,
52:31
[SPEAKER_00]: When you look at our defense, let me sure we lost Miles Garrett, but first is gonna come in here and I like him anyway because he talks a lot of shit.
52:41
[SPEAKER_00]: He's a guy that he's gonna tell you what's on his mind and he's gonna back it up.
52:45
[SPEAKER_00]: So I think the defense is gonna play well and if we get anything out to his offense, I think we'll be okay.
52:54
[SPEAKER_04]: Talk more about that.
52:55
[SPEAKER_04]: What do you think about Jared verse?
52:56
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, you start looking and what your defense used to do back in the day for us old heads.
53:02
[SPEAKER_04]: We know it, man, you would get those guys fired up.
53:06
[SPEAKER_04]: You get the fans fired up even at training camp.
53:08
[SPEAKER_04]: And that's where it all started, obviously.
53:10
[SPEAKER_04]: was getting the folks fired up, getting that defense fired up, and getting them kind of all on the same page.
53:16
[SPEAKER_04]: And seasonally, Jared verse, not only is he firing up that defense, he's also working with some of the offensive guys to get them better.
53:23
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, I love the fire that I'm seeing.
53:25
[SPEAKER_04]: I love the fact that he's willing to mix it up with Fano.
53:28
[SPEAKER_04]: You've got some juice there on the line.
53:31
[SPEAKER_04]: He seems to be really getting things
53:33
[SPEAKER_04]: kind of kind of amped up and you would love to see that at least me because you know in the past you see some of these guys who were kind of more business like going about it and it's like man, Hanford, I love seeing that fire again.
53:46
[SPEAKER_00]: Chris, you are 100% right and I thought it was very, very interesting.
53:50
[SPEAKER_00]: I was listening to
53:52
[SPEAKER_00]: uh... an interview he did with someone i can think of uh... who it was but anyway uh... that's what he was uh... he was talking about he was talking about the defense how good the defense is going to be and then he was saying uh... some of this is going to be on the defense because uh... he said there's going to be some games where the offense is going to have to maybe score forty points but but then again he said what is good as the defense is they may not say there's going to be some games where they have to score twenty points
54:21
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's a big big plus because he's what he's saying is the defense is going to come out.
54:27
[SPEAKER_00]: They're going to play, but
54:30
[SPEAKER_00]: there's going to be some games where you're going to run up against one of those offenses that's going to score a lot of points and we're going to need our offense to step up.
54:38
[SPEAKER_00]: But most of the time with the way this defense is played last year in the way has good as this defense has been.
54:44
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, these guys are going to lay the hammer down and I like him.
54:49
[SPEAKER_00]: I like his enthusiasm.
54:50
[SPEAKER_00]: I like his confidence.
54:52
[SPEAKER_00]: I like
54:54
[SPEAKER_00]: everything every place that he's coming from because this guy is a monster.
55:00
[SPEAKER_00]: You know what?
55:01
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if you guys knew this.
55:03
[SPEAKER_00]: When he first found out that he was going to be traded to the Cleveland Browns.
55:11
[SPEAKER_00]: When the head coach came and told me, he told him he said, look, he said, I don't want you to tell my teammates, I want to be the one to tell them.
55:28
[SPEAKER_00]: address these guys and he told him he said hey guys, I just wanted to tell you this he said I'm okay but I'm going to Cleveland I've been traded to Cleveland and he just told him he'd love them and I just thought you know for this guy to think of something like this and to say this to his teammates it means a lot and it tells you pretty much what type of guy he is and he's a guy that I would love
55:57
[SPEAKER_00]: I tell you he's going to be a master on that defensive line.
56:01
[SPEAKER_04]: There's a lot of pride on that side of the ball now.
56:03
[SPEAKER_04]: Don't you see it?
56:04
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, like, you know, you lose miles, Garrett, you know, obviously make that trade.
56:09
[SPEAKER_04]: But we're already in a lead defense.
56:12
[SPEAKER_04]: And it seems like we have just moved from there to Jaredverse and we've only upgraded it positions behind that.
56:20
[SPEAKER_04]: I think this defense has come an out saying, hey, we're more than miles, Garrett.
56:24
[SPEAKER_04]: And I expect them to have a big season here at Top Dog.
56:27
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I agree with you and a quick question I had for you was also on that defensive line.
56:35
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't you think now that Alex Wright, I mean, don't you think he's, I think he's got a booster his game a little bit.
56:43
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't you think so along with everybody else on that defensive line?
56:46
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, especially in a defensive middle, right?
56:48
[SPEAKER_04]: Did offensive tackles what you're looking at there in the middle.
56:51
[SPEAKER_04]: They're trying to really figure out what they've got there right now.
56:54
[SPEAKER_04]: So, you know, I think that's going to be, you know, you know, how that really sets kind of the tempo and time of the tone for the entire defenses that up front.
57:04
[SPEAKER_04]: And they're going to have to have a solid front in order for this whole thing to work.
57:07
[SPEAKER_04]: But yeah, it's time for guys like that to take the next step in order for this defense to do.
57:12
[SPEAKER_04]: What I think I think this could be top five defense again this season.
57:16
[SPEAKER_04]: I really do.
57:17
[SPEAKER_04]: I think the Cleveland Browns have brought back enough with Jared Versh.
57:21
[SPEAKER_04]: We've, we get another year of Carson, swishing her in there in the middle.
57:24
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, obviously, if we can get Ward Campbell or cornerbacks, which I know you love top dog playing at that level once again this year.
57:33
[SPEAKER_04]: I really, we could have a really good year out of this defense once again and that would really help back to our original conversation that would help that offense and the quarterbacks really find their footing because if you come out and stumble and we've seen this in past years, you come back and stumble offensively and set you back but if the defense can get you the ballback and you can immediately rectify those mistakes that you made on the opening drive or even the
58:03
[SPEAKER_04]: right as an offense if your defense is doing their job and I think this defense can do their job and more this season.
58:09
[SPEAKER_00]: Well you you're right and I know Gap has a question for him before she does I want to say this you know especially in that secondary in that AFC North my understanding is there's a kid right now at why receiver for the Baltimore Ravens that are just tearing it up
58:29
[SPEAKER_00]: in camp.
58:29
[SPEAKER_00]: A kid named, I think it's Jacobi Lane.
58:32
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's his name and they said this kid is making plays.
58:37
[SPEAKER_00]: He's doing things.
58:38
[SPEAKER_00]: He's got everybody.
58:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Everybody is just jumping around talking about how good of a camp that this kid is having and Lamar has found a new weapon.
58:49
[SPEAKER_00]: So you mentioned
58:52
[SPEAKER_00]: that's all, you know, I'm like those guys.
58:54
[SPEAKER_00]: I know that's all we needed somebody else in the in the A of C North that we got to worry about talking about the wire receiver speaking as a defensive bag with Miles Garrett gone, but I think our guys are up for the challenge.
59:07
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's going to be interesting to see what happens in that in that A of C North, but I still think, uh,
59:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Baltimore is going to be right there as far as trying to win this thing.
59:18
[SPEAKER_00]: But I don't want to see us at the bottom.
59:20
[SPEAKER_00]: I think we can come out this year again.
59:22
[SPEAKER_00]: If we get competent quarterback play and our defense to play the way we know it could play, I think we could be right there possibly to try to try to win this thing.
59:33
[SPEAKER_01]: One of the things I kind of want to go back and ask you about Hanford was in your training camp days.
59:38
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, these guys are putting in days back to back to back and maybe some of that fatigue or some of the frustrations start to show through when you're a little more tired and on Saturday, we had verse and Fano getting a little bit of love at that level.
59:53
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's good stuff, right?
59:55
[SPEAKER_01]: Because I mean, first, earlier in the week, he was getting praise for kind of taking Fano under his wing and whatnot.
1:00:00
[SPEAKER_01]: So I was going to ask you back in your playing days if you can recall any fights or did you get in any scuffles?
1:00:05
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, what you would just start to see, Gab, Chris, especially now with a few days in training camp, players get tired.
1:00:13
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, you talked about it there hot.
1:00:16
[SPEAKER_00]: uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh
1:00:44
[SPEAKER_00]: and you don't want to break a hand or anything like that in the meantime you know we know you're all frustrated and you just want to break someone's face but fights uh yeah yeah uh back when I'm played uh especially a lot of the defensive line and all offensive line and things like that you should get into it but we used to go out with the uh with the y-receivers uh Reggie Langhorn uh Brian Brennan
1:01:08
[SPEAKER_00]: uh... because i know you talk some of that yeah and always uh... we always had fights uh... with those guys uh... going back and forth but you know what's interesting you hear all the fights and everything that's going on around the uh... national football league with the uh... different teams uh... i think uh... quarterbacks now or are getting to it with uh... i think two uh... two two guys were with the other with two guys with the raiders uh... well i would say
1:01:34
[SPEAKER_00]: LA Raiders or whatever they call themselves today, but the Raiders had two guys that one of the quarterbacks got into like a big, big, scoffle of fights, but that's normal at this time of the year because again, you talk about guys that tired, they're frustrated and it's all about two days and once they get past these two days, but you gotta remember just like the coach said, this is your teammate.
1:01:59
[SPEAKER_00]: You don't want to hurt them, you want everybody to be ready to go,
1:02:03
[SPEAKER_00]: fight to what whatever the quarterback says the quarterback's got to be off limits.
1:02:07
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you can't you can't get in a fight with the quarterback.
1:02:10
[SPEAKER_00]: That is absolutely absolutely insane.
1:02:13
[SPEAKER_00]: But I'm just excited because it's training camp and we've had one game.
1:02:19
[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously, we had the Hall of Fame game and we got and speaking of the Hall of Fame, I got to say congratulations to
1:02:25
[SPEAKER_00]: all those guys that went in this year, congratulations.
1:02:31
[SPEAKER_00]: I think each and every one I'm deserving and God bless them.
1:02:39
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a cool ending.
1:02:40
[SPEAKER_01]: Speaking of Hall of Fame, I mean, just a reminder that, Hanford, you're going in with our Cleveland Sports Awards.
1:02:45
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I was waiting for you.
1:02:47
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sitting there mad at you and Chris, because I'm waiting and you know who else I'm mad at over there.
1:02:55
[SPEAKER_00]: You know what's the guy damn it, you know, they go say the thing till the top dog But they go say congratulations or or something got them.
1:03:05
[SPEAKER_00]: I shouldn't know my girl.
1:03:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah Let's go cover thank you.
1:03:08
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well, we were a couple weeks ago
1:03:12
[SPEAKER_01]: The ones to break the news get you really put a little prank on Hanford to surprise him with his induction.
1:03:17
[SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, we got to keep drumming up that excitement that you're going into our greater Cleveland sports hall of fame and excited for me.
1:03:24
[SPEAKER_00]: I got to say this, Gab, they call me and they ask me because you know when they call your name and you know, it's just like the baseball players when they play this song for them every time they come up to bat.
1:03:37
[SPEAKER_00]: They ask me is there a song
1:03:38
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, you're going to get a walk-up song?
1:03:40
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so I was trying to think, uh, I was trying to think, uh, what song I should use when I, who let the dogs out, man?
1:03:50
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, my gosh.
1:03:51
[SPEAKER_01]: Could you imagine if Hanford's song was that, that would actually get kind of.
1:03:55
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm totally for it.
1:03:57
[SPEAKER_01]: Who let the dogs out in this room?
1:04:01
[SPEAKER_01]: Where you're for coat if you if that's your walk-up.
1:04:04
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that would be that would be that would just That would be that would be something else right there Chris Leave the I don't know what he would say or do that What if we do a poll on X and see like wigs?
1:04:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, song Dog walk out to and who let the dogs out has to be one of the options?
1:04:22
[SPEAKER_01]: That's a wrap for our Big Clay Cleveland show.
1:04:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Don't forget you can watch us live Monday through Friday from 12 to 130 so make sure you're subscribed to the Big Play Sports Network YouTube channel and hit that like button turn on your notification so you never miss an episode.
1:04:36
[SPEAKER_01]: If you can't watch us live the audio version of the show is available wherever you stream your podcast.
1:04:41
[SPEAKER_01]: So thanks for watching everybody.
1:04:42
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll see you tomorrow.