Latest / Hemispheric Views / 134: He's an Exception to the Poll!
Transcript
- Very weird to do that countdown I didn't feel like it was appropriate for me to do it. But why are you doing the countdown Andrew what's the deal what happened. What's the two man show we lost we lost the third guy. Oh did we lose him what do we have to kick him out because of something we said in the previous episode. Well we are true to our word and what was it we were saying that we were going to have a poll and the loser of the poll was going to be evicted we're not just kicking him out because he's American it. No no we don't buy into that kind of you know social geopolitical clap trap we're accepting of everybody all hemispheres we disagree sometimes but we accept. Everybody except when they lose polls and then we just put them off. I like how you did that we accept everyone except when. Is it is an exception to the pole what Paul we referring to Martin it was one that we talked about last time. I'll sum up for people who are late to the party right so not in the last episode but the one before we ran a poll about sound quality of recordings microphones and stuff now I'm pretty sure Jason came out on top with that one you and I were tying then we both voted when we shouldn't have but then it kind of even dad and you just lost. And I was a bit worried that you would spend many hundreds if not thousands of dollars which would completely throw at your depreciation spreadsheet in an attempt to. Overhaul your setup you don't seem to have demolished everything so that's okay. Everything is okay still it is it still gonna happen it's on the agenda really well I might go back to a different microphone again. Okay will you do you but then in the following episode which is now the previous one 133 we ran another poll and it was on mastodon any listeners could chime in if I wanted to and the question was which hosts voice do you most associate with or find the closest connection with. Don't worry, it's anonymous, all good fun. It's all about favorites, right? And this time you came out on top with 53% of the vote. I came second with 26%. And given how only 19 people seem to have voted, Jason's just lost by maybe like one or two votes with 21%. And as he expressed to us, I think, was it separately in a message or if I imagine that he had to be booted off the show? Yeah, I can't remember if it was on the show proper or whether we just agreed to that after the time but I think it's a good outcome I'm okay with it let's get rid of him all right well I mean that's more aggressive than I would go for but you know I'm kind of that cringing diplomat on the show so Jason if you want to come back in future I'm gonna leave it open I mean people associate with me so what obviously from the poll evidence people associate with me so if I'm saying Jason piss off like everybody's in agreement it is a common view like Jason you're gone we don't need you anymore beautiful and I'm wondering if this reaction is representative of something. This is a story I've told many people. I used to teach drama classes years ago. I went to a particular drama school as a student and then taught there as like a studying or assistant teacher. And we had an entirely new class once. And apparently, when I was gone one week, another person stepped in and they said, "Who's normally your teacher?" And they went, "Oh, we don't know. I can't remember his name, but he's not from Australia." So they were all confused by my accent. They didn't think I was from my own city where I taught them so I reckon there's some confusion out there in the audience either they've gone well we get the Australian guy he sounds really friendly Jason's the American guy we get that for tech podcast who the hell's the other guy. What is accent and he's from Wollongong which sounds like a made up place anyway. Yes I reckon I just confused the listenership for a good hundred and thirty three hundred thirty four episodes. Yeah well there we go so I'm gonna gloat about this just for a little longer so 53% that is like you don't have to go to a preference count on that you know that that is just out now first past the post winner. 50 and I didn't vote for myself I just wanna make that clear so I was looking at it truthful so if I were to do that obviously the result would be even better. So thank you everybody and I'll do my best to continue to be the everyman that people can have that ongoing continuous connection with. I take this job sincerely and I'll continue to do my very best to represent the people who have expressed their faith in me. Well I congratulate you. Thank you to everyone who participated in the poll. Jason I mean Andrew might be aggressive towards you but look I'm happy to welcome you back to open up and welcome you back with open arms just to be the antagonist to Andrew I'm your friendly antagonist Andrew. Can we just make one thing clear though because yes he's off the show but there's still a strong expectation that he continues to do the show notes the back end uploading all that kind of like busy work he's absolutely required to still do that. So basically piss off but keep up the good work. Yes yes yep. Well, you've, um, first topic here, and we've actually kept things pretty lean. Let me talk to you about lean manufacturing. Oh god, I walked into that, didn't I? Maybe there is actually a lean manufacturing angle to what you've put in here. There's a basketball with the two words Ethernet cabling. Do you want to tie lean manufacturing into that discussion? - Not really. - Oh, okay. Well, just talk about what you want to say and I'll listen. - Okay, so people, a bit of follow up, this sort of follow up ish. People will recall some weeks ago that Jason was absolutely horrified with my internet. That was, it was terrible. I admit it. - It was crap. - It was crap, yeah. So that resulted in me just blowing everything up and suddenly running wires all over the place. I had ethernet cables just draped all through the house trying to make this internet work, but I knew that I had to get this done properly. So I got the contractors in and on the Friday that we've just gone past, the contractors came in, spent all day in this house, drilling holes, running cable, going into roof cavities. My house is now back, ethernet backhaul all the way. So it's like a two-story house. So they've had to go upstairs, downstairs. I've got three Euro 6 Pros, I think they are. And they are all back wired now. So I'm getting gigabit ethernet throughout the entire house. And let me tell you, it is something else. Although, nothing can ever be so perfect for Andrew. Because you know, Martin, you know what would happen? Most people would get the contractors in, they'd spend all day doing this work, they'd go away and you just bathe in your internet. Of course, I had to just make sure that everything was correct and do a few speed tests and that kind of thing. And I suddenly noticed upstairs, I was getting not gigabit, but 100 megabits per second. 1/10th of the speed. How did this happen? Well, how did that was the question, right? So I've got all these cabling through inside the house now. I've got switches connected at each of the outlets because I still need more ports, you know, so you have the little gigabit switches. Ethernet cables all lined up in those. It's like, what is going on? And it was and then I'm trying to use the little Eero app and it will tell me what what is connected to where and the speed that And sometimes it was saying gigabit and then other times it was saying 100. Oh no So I did a total breakdown of the network and I went back to basics just Euro to euro to euro just breaking it right down to the basics till I finally discovered there was a cable It's always the cable that was theoretically cat6 had cat6 printed on it But I guess it maybe hadn't been terminated correctly when they made it and it was not running at that speed Turf that cable put a new one in boom We're back up and running you went from zero to hero. Just like that exactly So it goes to show even though you can pay contractors to come in and do the work you are still It's still important that you check and double-check what they do now. They've been good. I'm not criticizing them I've been happy with the company. I would recommend them to others There is no canyon blog slash save unfortunately, but I would recommend it and I'm excited to have this internet now But it goes to show you can't just accept it is done when the professional walks out the door. You must double-check Look, I'm so happy for you because I think about my own internet situation Everything with this podcast set up everything that I've done related to this show other projects stuff for work Whatever hangs entirely on the fact that I can plug in one of those things that sends like the internet through the electricity. Power points. Oh yeah yeah yeah yeah they're not yeah what do they call those things are injected ethernet over I don't know what they call it I'm thinking power I'm thinking power over ethernet but it's not that because it's Wi-Fi. You know what I mean like you plug it in from your. Wi-Fi modem and then it goes through the PowerPoint or the power outlet yeah sort of Americans call it and then it comes out here. That's the only reason it works here and it's horrible because it and it's absolutely horrible because if I didn't do that I would have to rely on Wi-Fi and it doesn't reach this room properly and I had like a data person come here. And say what do you reckon we could do and he looked around hopelessly and said well the whole thing's concrete. So you basically have to run you know when you're going to like a corporate office or a warehouse and I've got the Ethernet cables in those metal. Tracing stuck to the ceiling I'd have to do that do you think that I would still be married. If I did that. Well it depends how you sell it if you went. I would want to do it either I don't think it's. If you call it industrial cheek would that get it. Sheek. CHIC. Maybe. Yeah. Maybe yeah you know people like going through and saying you know a data centre in their home. But no, I don't think look, my relationship almost didn't survive the ethernet cables lying across the floor. So, I can't see how a marriage would survive data baskets or cable baskets or whatever they call those things. That would not be good. And look, I'm not pinning it on her because I would also think it's ugly. I don't think I'd want to walk through my home seeing that on the ceiling. And yours would be more of a trip hazard. So, that's bad in its own way. But look, I'm seeing something else in the notes here, which you've added, which I think we should jump to, 'cause you would not have been able to do a very interesting little guest spot had you not fixed your internet. Can you tell us about that? - Well, it's a little bit of a bit of a worry. I actually did that guest spot while I still had ethernet cables lying all over the floor. - Oh, really? - But it seemed to do the trick. Yes, I was a guest on the Omni, the Omni show, the Omni groups Omni show, group maker of fine Mac software including OmniFocus, OmniOutliner, OmniPlan, Omni other things. They are excellent. They make Mac-assed Mac apps, if we can go back to that term that we were throwing around a while ago. And it was a great pleasure to be a guest to talk about how I use particularly OmniFocus. You would know Martin that I've banged on about OmniFocus a number of times on this show. First I've heard of it. So it was so much fun to do it. And it was kind of nerve wracking 'cause I felt more like I was having to do a really good job. Whereas here I'm a bit like an idiot. And if I stuff up, eh, I stuff up. Whereas that felt like more, I was a proper guest and I was, you know, put in the spotlight. But I think it came out okay. I listened back to it and I'm okay with it. I think the, I think it comes across quite nicely. So I'm very proud of it actually. - I think you did a great job. You did a great job. I listened to a bit of it, but I also watched more of it. I've kind of split up the whole thing that way 'cause I wanted to see how it looked as well. I'm normally, and I think this might come up on a, on a few, sorry, and this might come up on a future episode when Jason comes back, if we allow him to return, about the future of podcasting as another topic. But I was thinking about that listening to you and then watching you and you didn't come across, you know, uncomfortable or awkward or whatever, but it was interesting to see the difference. Do you watch many podcasts? - No, no, it's very unfamiliar to me. - Yeah, yeah, so it's interesting to think maybe, we'll talk about that in a future episode. I think Jason wanted to chat about it, but it came across really well. I enjoyed your enthusiasm about the topic because we make fun of you for your depreciation spreadsheets and your basketballs and stuff, but OmniFocus is probably the big one. And I think about apps that I love, I haven't been using it for the longest time need to necessarily until more recent work. But I think about how much I love Final Cut Pro and that to me just sums up the beauty of like a properly made Mac app by Apple or even things like MarsEdit. I love that, NetNewsWire, these really Mac-ass apps that you think of and it's, this is why I'm in the platform. And for you, that's OmniFocus, right? - Yeah, exactly. It's pretty cool. And do you know the thing with that podcast though I actually didn't realize it was going to be video. So, I just rolled. I kind of, it never came up in our pre-planning conversation or anything. And I think there was probably an assumption on his side that I knew it. And an assumption on mine that it was a podcast and therefore it was audio. And it turned up and then we were sort of, it was actually kind of like five or ten minutes into the show, I think. And I was suddenly like, "Oh my God, I think this is actually a video." I was just wearing a T-shirt. I was like, oh, no, I should have dressed up. Andrew, you said you are the everyman. So you are genuine, you're playing your authentic role. But when you were thinking about it, you know, leading up to the show and then you did it, even with the video surprise, what was your favourite thing, do you reckon, sharing your fandom for that app? Oh, my favourite thing. What was your favourite part of the podcast? I think it was fun casting back to how long I've actually been using it for, like going right back to before it was software when it was just kind of a conceptual thing. That was cool to reflect on and it's like, wow, I really have been using this software for a long time. It's amazing. And then I did like being able to share a couple of tips, like even they're quite simple because I find when I've listened to that show in the past, Sometimes people get quite deep in and I find this a bit difficult to follow in an audio way. But I think my little tip around alternating the review cycles was a good one that you can just go and implement. And I don't think it would overwhelm anybody if they'd use the software at all, but it might be a nice little, oh, that's helpful. So I felt like it was kind of useful without being overwhelming. And that's what I was trying to get to. Yeah, so it was really fun, really fun. - Well, you've inspired me in this case. I don't get around to writing a lot of blog posts these days but I'm gonna think very deeply about what I reckon my favourite third party app is. 'Cause we did Jewel of the Defaults. - We did. - Right back in episode 97. That was more of a competition, who's gonna win with the most default apps. But I haven't thought about it for a while, like what maybe my favourite third party Mac app is. So I'm gonna think about it and write a post that we can link in this show. - I like this. - I don't know if you wanna do the same thing. You've already done the OmniFocus thing but if you have another one or you wanna explore that, that's cool. And if anyone else out there wants to contribute, I don't know, a blog post, share it with us. Share it with us on mastodon or micro.blog hemispheric views. I'd love to see what your favourite third-party Mac apps are, things that keep you in the system or inspire you to keep using it, despite some of the more negative discussion about the Apple brand these days. What keeps you tied to it? That'd be cool. - Yeah, that would be. I'm interested to see if anybody I'm interested to see yours particularly and then see if anybody else jumps on that bandwagon That would be fun. I'll ever think about it. I've got a few floating in my head I mentioned a couple but we'll see but well done. It was a good episode and thanks for Sharing your story on it. It's nice to see those things flying around Now we have a mega topic here, but no we don't which I think was interesting no, no We have to say Do it we do what we don't but we do it I've got no real news to announce other than one from plus.com. In Louie Jason hang on let me try again one prime plus.com that's that's not right that's more Southern. I can't do it I can't do a Jason accent. You have to take particular things that he says that we've heard his catchphrases like the two questions. Yeah, let me try this man do questions. What is yes the best membership offering on the internet It's blow away Get your prayer hands up Do you know do you know the answer to my first question? What's unannounced? I have no idea You're an idiot one prime plus calm your best subscription offering my American accent. You think that my I literally have American family why is my American accent so shit ass. You were traversing states just then my friend. Oh god and then I don't have a second question because it doesn't matter but yeah if you want to get onto one prime plus and support me and Martin. Not Jackson, you just go to one prime plus calm. We have a sticker shop. You can buy stickers You can hemispheric views calm you get all the links to everywhere stickers Memberships Links to our websites. I don't know what else is there but get on board. This is discord. We talk in the discord Even if you're not a one prime plus member, you can still join the discord These are all the benefits that come from this podcast universe that you're associated with hamstrapqueues.com, oneprimeplus.com. Where is it, Martin? - Oneprimeplus.com, is that what you're saying? - No, where is it or what is it? - What? What do you mean, where is it? Didn't you say the URL? - Why are you missing all the queues? It's in the long game. - Oh God, I'm like, didn't you just say that? - No, I didn't. - Oh, well, look, no, no, the URL, look. This just shows how authentic the show is. I'm just sitting here like, oh yeah, he's just done a bit of a spiel here. Oh yeah, okay, yes, it's in the long game. Get to the chopper. Oh, that's Max role. He's not here today. We need him. I will put Gotham City into eternal winter. We need we need another guest host, actually. Maybe actually, can we just have Mac full time instead, Jason? I mean, look, I love him. He's my son. He can be very entertaining. I don't know if he can fulfill the role of a grown man on the podcast. But we're getting too old anyway. We need to like we're aging out. We're old men now. So we need to - if we're going to capture, like the growth audience is in the youth. Like we're just - like almost four year olds, is that what you're thinking? Well, you've got to average out the ages, right? So at the moment, like he would really bring down our average age a lot. Oh, good. So I'm bringing it up a lot because I'm the old fart. We need - and I'm getting older all the time. So we're aging out our engagement. So we need to bring it down. It's the tweens that spend the money. They're the ones who like get excited and they share shit. Like, so we get viral. - Are you speaking tween language now? I don't think they have much of a disposable income. Aren't they spending their parents' money? - Well, yeah, but I think parents just go with it. - Okay, right, sure. - So yeah, I just think, yeah, maybe Mac as a replacement for Jason might be something worth thinking about. - All right, so basically summing up, if you'd like to support the show, oneprimeplus.com, it's in the long game. You can find occasional member specials there and other things. Just support us if you love the show. And maybe in the future, my nearly four year old son will replace a grown man from Portland, Oregon, provided he can actually speak properly and bring down the average age of the show's audience. Is that what you're kind of going for here, Andrew? Now, onto the main topic, which you've added here, and I'm very intrigued to talk about it. Would you like to explain your thought process? What's the question here? Okay, so the thought process was, Martin always comes up with interesting questions to put to the show hosts. You are very good at that. - Thank you. - And I feel that I very rarely contribute a thought provoking question. And I thought I need to do better. And I knew that because it was just the two of us, I really needed to bring the fire. That's another young person reference, you get that? Right, so. - Wow. - In order for me to be goated, I wanted to ask you a great question. So I was thinking about it and thinking about in the context of how our world of technology is maybe not as fun as it used to be. It's sort of, it's become quite centered around these mobile devices. Every mobile device is the same. You've got these tech oligarchs that are just kind of controlling our world and all that. And we don't really love it in the way that perhaps we used to. And so I was wondering, how did we end up at this point? Which then led me to my question. And so if the past, I said 100 years, if the past 100 years, because I want to go back far enough that there would be time for perhaps a diversion. So if the past 100 years were relived, would we end up with the same tech as we currently have now? Is this technology outcome that we have at this point inevitable in any timeline of existence that we as humans went on? Right. So really your question is about whether we believe in technological determinism. Yeah. Yeah. That's a very perfunctory way to put it. I tried to really explain it. You just boiled it down to like two words. Well done. That's okay. I think it's a great question. And when you say if the past 100 years were relived, just so that we're clear here, are saying relived with hindsight and perspective, hence relived. Like looking back with knowledge or from scratch and let's see if it happens again. I was thinking from scratch, let's see what happens again. And maybe 100 years is wrong. Maybe we say like World War Two ends and then we go forth from there or something like that. It doesn't have to be exactly 100 years. It's more like that technology arc. Would we have ultimately ended up at the same, the microchip Moore's law technology, iPhone. Mega platforms. That's a great question. I'm tempted to say, look, I'm not, I would say I'm not entirely a technological determinist. I think there is sort of room for determinism in the sense of, you know, think about the course of a human life, right? How, you know, typical things happen when you're a certain age as a kid, and then you go through changes as a teenager, and then you become an adult. and then you look back and you see those same behaviours happen because we're constantly relearning or re-witnessing the same lessons that we already learnt. We go, "Oh, this generation does this," but then we forget. We look with rose-coloured glasses at our own lives, and it's just the same cycles over and over again. But amidst all that chaos, all these micro decisions, these little incidents and coincidences splinter off into this, as I said, chaos, all of these potential moments or ways that life can go. think there's any really such thing as fate or a destiny or a predetermined destination for things but there are common cycles or things that we all go through and then the complication of life shoots that off in all different directions. So if you were to go back let's say 100 years to 1925 it would I would be tempted to say yes we would end up with very similar things because if you went straight back to this point boom went on it'd be kind of like a replay of everything that had the hindsight added, like if we went back and said, "Okay, let's go back and see if we can tweak this a bit," or, "Oh, we had some lessons kind of vaguely from the future that maybe the environment's important." Who would have thought maybe cars would develop differently and those earlier electronic or, sorry, not electronic, those earlier electric cars that had been pioneered way, way back, you know, even like when petrol and oil was a bit of a, was only relatively new as well, it might have gone in other directions. So, I would say without the hindsight and lesson, probably the same, but with those things, it could be steered differently. But that being said, I think, yeah, there is still that potential for if you went back exactly to 1925, 100 years ago, because there are all these potential things that happen based on a micro decision, who runs into whom or what happens in a war or something, I don't think we would necessarily have exactly the same thing. It would be kind of like Have you watched For All Mankind? Yes. On Apple TV+. Yes. I think that is a great case study for a narrative exploration of this sort of thing, because when This isn't really a spoiler for anybody. It's been out for several years now. The whole thing starts with what happens if the Soviet Union lands on the moon first, right? And that one thing, that very seismic thing, but that one thing alters the course of history. And they what I haven't watched all of the show, I kept up with it. But what I loved about it was that they threw in these news items that showed kind of real footage, but manipulating the editing to show how things went differently. Like John Lennon doesn't end up being assassinated, but then this guy dies instead. I can't remember exactly what it was, but it shows that similar things were happening or there was a course and technologies are developing, but the biases or what things happen to whom are different. So, I would be tempted to say, without hindsight, going back to that point, things would develop roughly the same way, but there would be some key differences. I think wars that—do you want me to shut up soon, or do you want to say something? No, I will say something, but you're on a tear, so just keep going. Yeah, I think war is probably the big one, though, because you know how people say victors or the victor of a war writes its history or words to that effect. It'd be interesting how if certain wars had developed differently or hadn't happened, how much our technology would be different because war is essentially the catalyst for so much technological change that let's say the Nazis, the Axis powers had won World War II. How would that have developed differently with the atom bomb, things like you said with microchips that followed in decades and how computers developed. So yeah, I think there would be differences, but the trajectory would be roughly the same. Yeah, I mean, it's an impossible question to answer because this will never happen. We will never be confronted with the opportunity to relive our experience. But I think from my perspective, I look at it and I'm like, As you say, we may not end up with Apple, for instance, being the global dominant company, because that relied on Steve Jobs and Wozniak meeting together and building things and getting the sales at the right time. So I'm not suggesting that if we relived history, we would end up with Apple and an iPhone. But what I think would be inevitable is that because of the nature of man, we would end up with a device that we hold in our hand, because I think that is just perfect form and function. And I think there are just certain form factors that humans work with. And I think that's kind of the ultimate form factor in so many ways. I don't think the phone is gonna be beaten for a long time because there is no better form factor for a person. So I think in that regard, I think we would still hit the same beats along the way, like a car. People would always have wanted personal mobility and then it gets to the social side of things where I don't think humans will ever change their status. And I think wherever there's status, there's a desire to establish something like a car at first and then a fancy car. And it's like, I have to be better than the person next to me. So I want to get this thing to be better than. So I think the social aspects would always drive similar outcomes. And then I think ultimately the sad thing is I think we would still, if we ran this again, we would still end up with the same climate risks and problems that we have now. Because again, that's social human nature and the wicked problem. I think it was Roscano described it, where it's the prisoner's dilemma. It's like, what's best for me is not best for everyone, but stuff everyone, because everyone is gonna be thinking about themselves. So I got to think about myself to get ahead. And that's essentially why we end up with a climate crisis that nobody wants to do anything about because nobody's that motivated to care for everybody above themselves. And that is probably writ large why our society and culture is in such a perilous place at the moment. But I don't want to be depressing about it as such. But I think if we were to relive our last hundred years, we may have different leaders. We may have different, you know, like world powers or something. But ultimately, I think we'd still have corporations that push their agenda ahead of the benefits of society. We'd still end up with certain devices that were most functional for humans and that also assist those corporations in delivering their own outcomes. It's a symbiotic relationship, I think, and not always a good one. And that took a depressing turn I didn't necessarily expect. But there we are. When you start to think about how like meta and alphabet and all Apple, they're all conspiring for our attention. Yeah. I like that idea, even if you say it's depressing, that there are certain givens or ways that humanity will attempt to design for its own number of digits, for example. Or, you know, you think about things like the singularity or how we're trying to approach some sort of self-aware, you know, electronic or digital consciousness, right? And again, try not to spoil so much, but there are different shows out there or texts that really discuss this well. Like, have you ever watched the reimagined Battlestar Galactica from the noughties? I think I've heard that a few times before on the show. Yeah. So again, without ruining the ending for that, if somehow people who are listening haven't watched that, that really wrangles with that idea of technological determinism and even things like religion and religiosity and fate of the universe or fate of mankind. And that really leans into the "It's happened before, it's happened again, this is where everything's heading." But the flavour of everything or the style in which everything occurs is maybe different. So, that really… And I think that bothered a lot of people when it finished because it lends so heavily into that religious aspect. But even though I'm not a terribly religious person myself, I enjoy that that aspect of the show, 'cause it really captures that thing about humanity trying to drive everything with a story. Although we try to regard ourselves as rational beings that are scientific and going for progress, we are social animals that evolved from the primordial soup. - Yes, yeah. - Do you know what I mean? And the stuff you bring up, it's like, how does that even affect things like evolution? How does our own technological development alter the way that we're evolving? We've kind of stunted and diverged our own evolutionary path. You know, whether you want to talk about nutrition and the way that we grow crops for ourselves or things like health care, all very positive things if done properly. But we're no longer evolving in the wild, natural way. We're taking away that predetermination, if you want to put it that way, of nature. We're determining our own fate, which means that perhaps there is no fate. And then by doing that, we're actually destroying the nature that could therefore form us. But then ultimately nature will win. Because if it becomes if the planet becomes uninhabitable, like it's still habitable for nature. Nature's still going to be here. That's right. Yeah, the earth will be fine, despite whatever we do to it. We've destroyed it for ourselves and all the current animals. But yeah, yeah. It'll go alright. We dealt with the dinosaur issue. We'll carry on. Exactly. Exactly. a few million, billion years and it will be cranking up again. But you've reminded me of something else. Have you ever, I think it was a book originally, but they made a movie out of it, I think it was narrated by Tilda Swinton, Last and First Men? No, I'm not familiar with it. Well, that's fascinating. This is like sci-fi on a grand historical scale. We're talking eons, you know, many millions of years. And it's a very quirky kind of movie. It's all in black and white and it's, I'd recommend people watch it. It's more of a narrated slow series of shots of monuments and everything seems to be abandoned and it tells the story of humanity over, we're talking like millions of years. But what I find interesting and how it fits your discussion, you're saying if we relived this time, would it be the same? Would we have the same progress? Where would we end up? This is such a grand scale, this story, that in the narration it encapsulates that idea of humanity went up and it went down and it almost disappeared here and here it came back. And I think whether it's in something like the Enlightenment and the Renaissance or even something more recently like the post-war period, particularly with technology companies and the way that the news cycles developed, you and I, I'm sure, and everyone listening, particularly in the West, we buy into this idea of progress. It's like, "Oh, the next iPhone will come out next year and it'll be even better." Or, "This policy will come out from this government and it will reform that or make it better." we just think, oh, natural reforming. This is how we progress as a society. And then without getting too deep into the current geopolitical situation, blips like this happened, if you wanna call it a blip, and we were shocked. It's like, how did this natural progress of a democratic society or a rational and scientific society happen? And then you remind yourself, well, it's not really predetermined. We're not on this path of endless perfect progress where these social animals and this is the chaos of the earth, right? So I suppose getting back to your question, if we relived it, it probably wouldn't be the same. There'd be very familiar things or outcomes, but it's just the chaos of society. We've bought into this meta-narrative of everything will just always get better. But that's just because what we've been grown up. That's just because of what we've been raised to believe due to recent historical events. That is very true. And I'm just looking now because there's a book. I'm trying to recall a book that I've read that sort of I remember reading on my Kindle I'm actually looking back through my Kindle purchase history as I speak to you to try and figure out Now it really is becoming an edit job for you Oh yeah, here it is, here it is. Okay. So the book I'm thinking of, that I read a long time ago, The Silk Roads, A New History of the World by Peter Frankopan. And it goes through, kind of, through what the Silk Road was and how it, how that trade route basically morphed and modified whole systems. Trade systems, political, religious systems, and That's still happening now, right? But um, yeah, it's like nothing I don't know now I've lost my train of thought in terms of where I was going with that But the thing you were saying there just reminded me of that book that I read a long time ago Yeah that we think I think it's that we think the West what we have now is It is just inevitable and will always remain this way. But if we look back through history, there's been empires the rise and fall of empires and And why would it suddenly stop now, that process? - Absolutely, what you say works perfectly because our idea of a nation state, that is so recent, right? As you said, empires were the thing for the longest time and they still are, but they're different. It's not about, you know, aggressive domination through invading another country. It's about alliances and the economy and soft power and cultural influence. And that's why it's just so bizarre what's happening right now because we're seeing stuff change in a way that's not that format. Yes. It's more reminiscent of earlier times, different kinds of aggression and influence. So, yeah, there's no there's no given that you would go back 100 years and would be exactly the same, but you would see those similar cycles. Philosophical corner. Was that a satisfying Was that a satisfying discussion for your question? It was. It was. I think it was fantastic. I enjoyed that immensely. Likewise. But yeah, I'm always interested to know what listeners think. So, I don't know, if you chime in, I'm assuming Jason still wants to do the show notes and he'll probably just look at this and go, "What do I link from that? I don't know. Where's the show title?" Where's the tech adjacency, guys? No, there was. That's very tech adjacent because, and I'm going to resist going on a whole tangent here, but like a lot of the research that I've done, stuff that, you know, is connected to and and help lead to this show. Yeah. It's about the I don't want to sound lofty when I say this, but It's okay. It's just you and me. There's a discussion of Okay, good. Yeah. Everyone else can deal with it. Thinking about media as the overarching kind of framework for everything. So, you know, we have laws. There's religion. There's other aspects of life. Choose any discipline that you can think of. But all of it for humanity is really filtered through media. And when I say media, I don't just mean like broadcast TV or the internet on your phone. I'm talking about technology. We create stories and processes and ideas through tools that we fashion, whether it's the earliest fire as a medium for sitting around and telling a story, in the earliest times of humanity, or the table as a technology where we gather and tell stories, or as I said, the phone or the car and how that alters our perceptions of space time, you know, distance, everything that we do is essentially through or filtered through media and technology. That is what we do. We come up with stories filtered through technology and digital technology now is just the most recent version of that. So maybe that's the deterministic thing that we'll always try to fashion something out of a story and technology. what the outcome will be, we don't know. - I like that. And I also think that if this show is not got the title, the table as a technology, that is definitely has to be the show title. Otherwise, what are we doing here? Hey, I'm gonna do a 30 second media corner. - Oh, this is turbo media corner. - Turbo boost media corner. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I can't wait to wrap up the show this is like. Yeah. To the end. Yep. Okay go for it. I want to hear. Last night I rewatched a movie that I hadn't seen in a long time. It's called Moon. Have you ever seen it? You know what? I'm embarrassed to say this has been on my watch list for years and I've just always forgotten to get to it. So yes, go. I haven't. Okay, so I watched it so long ago that I couldn't really remember it, which is kind of nice. So it felt like a first watch. And even though it's old now, I think it was 2009, it holds up and is brilliant and really makes you contemplate, yeah, where humans sit. We're talking about these corporations and how they deal with people. It really makes, it has a great story to tell around the interface between people and companies. Well you motivated me to watch it I'll try to get to it do it is that the quickest segment ever I Think it might be all right. Let's not waste time cue end music Oh, no, that's media corner. How does our music? Only heard a hundred times Can't do it. I can't do the end music. Oh, how does it go sing it? It's like Yeah, but it's just faded differently. We're going to do a poll where the people actually want this show to continue after this episode. I'm thinking they're going to say no. I'm not doing that. I'm not doing that. Maybe one poll should Jason come back. That could be a valid poll. That's dangerous. We'll wrangle with that one. Well I think that that brings us to the end of this episode of Hemispheric Views. Thank you all for listening and just remember oneprimeplus.com, hemisphericviews.com, andrewcanyon.com, and burk.io. Thank you and we'll see you again next time. Bye. Should I count us down? Yeah. 3, 2, 1, STOP!