Latest / A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast / Talks to Daniel Rawnsley about his choice of Space Babies

Transcript

Talks to Daniel Rawnsley about his choice of Space Babies · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

• 0:23
  None Hamster with a blunt pen knife
• 0:35
  for doing quicker, quicker, quicker.
• 0:40
  Back to a hamster with a blunt pen knife.
• 0:42
  The Doctor Who Commentary podcast.
• 0:44
  It's nice to know where I am because we've done 2 recordings
• 0:48
  tonight and on different podcasts.
• 0:51
  I am here tonight with the gorgeous Daniel Rosley.
• 0:55
  Hello, Daniel. Hello, Joe, Good to see you
• 0:59
  again. Daniel, now I know you.
• 1:01
  You're an intellectual sort of chap, You know, you've very
• 1:04
  sophisticated, huge brain power. I'm sure you've chosen
• 1:08
  something, you know, vast and substantial for us to talk about
• 1:12
  today. Oh yes?
• 1:14
  Well, let me take a sip of wine and tell you what we're going to
• 1:18
  talk about today. Please.
• 1:20
  We're going to talk about babies.
• 1:22
  Sorry, space babies. So, space babies, the episode
• 1:28
  liked only by you and me in the whole world.
• 1:31
  Oh, Joe, it's terrible. Doctor Who's on it's last legs.
• 1:35
  Oh my God. Pure.
• 1:37
  How embarrassing I had to endure the entire 45 minutes.
• 1:43
  Is that genuinely your sentiment?
• 1:45
  No, no, I, I had lots of fun with it.
• 1:48
  It's fun. Doctor Who's fun again?
• 1:49
  It's it's bright and sunny and, you know, walks in with a smile.
• 1:54
  Now, you've already said three talking points in that one
• 1:57
  sentence alone, so I'm going to unpick that.
• 2:00
  You just said Doctor Who is fun again.
• 2:03
  Again, well, I mean, for me, Doctor Who's always fun, but
• 2:06
  it's very it's outwardly fun now, it's colourful.
• 2:10
  It's it's for a new audience. It's for it's for the Disney
• 2:13
  audience and not just the kids, but the Disney, the people who
• 2:17
  grew up with Disney, I think as well.
• 2:19
  So people who, who, who sing Disney songs at karaoke and
• 2:23
  never shut up and the people who watch, you know, watch all the,
• 2:29
  the, the 90s era Disney movies again and again.
• 2:33
  So Aladdin and Beauty and the Beast and.
• 2:36
  So if it's doing all of that, is it still Doctor Who?
• 2:40
  Well it's it's still Doctor Who because it spends it spends a
• 2:44
  lot of time in the 1st 10 minutes reminding you what a
• 2:46
  show it is. Or what show it was for you,
• 2:51
  Sorry. In its first four years when it
• 2:53
  came back. This is what we do, Yes.
• 2:56
  Or what? The phone?
• 2:57
  Yes. Quick, ring your mother, Right.
• 2:58
  We've done that, Tick. You know, explained about the
• 3:01
  TARDIS, Tick. Have we done talked about the
• 3:02
  Time Lords yet? Yes.
• 3:03
  Tick. Great.
• 3:04
  Right. Let's have an adventure.
• 3:07
  Well, yeah. And and yeah, it's it's one of
• 3:11
  it's it is a very standard in the sense that standard
• 3:16
  functional Russell T Davies, our opener, in the sense that it it
• 3:20
  kind of eases you into the series and gets you used to the
• 3:24
  new Doctor, the new companion for a sort of light hearted run
• 3:27
  around, you know? Do you know what I think this is
• 3:30
  doing? I think it's a bit more
• 3:33
  insidious than all of that, although it is doing all those
• 3:36
  things you just said there. I think Russell T Davies is
• 3:41
  dispelling any expectation that Disney Plus watches, you know,
• 3:47
  who are used to The Mandalorian and Andor, you know, these very
• 3:52
  serious, expensive, worthy science fiction epics.
• 3:59
  And now they're coming over to Doctor Who.
• 4:00
  Oh, maybe it's going to be a bit like The Mandalorian.
• 4:03
  So then it shoves out of space babies and an enormous spaceship
• 4:07
  shaped like an ass. With a big fart that propels it
• 4:10
  through space. If you think that's what you're
• 4:13
  getting, this is the show we this is Doctor Who.
• 4:15
  It's quirky, it's fun, it's silly, it can be outrageous at
• 4:20
  times. Get on board with this or fuck
• 4:24
  off basically. Yeah, forget Baby Yoda, this is
• 4:29
  space babies. Am I totally off off pitch by
• 4:33
  saying that? Well, it it does remind you
• 4:36
  we'll we'll get to it, but there we'll get to a moment where it
• 4:39
  very clearly reminds you that this is a British TV show.
• 4:43
  They are selling it to America. They are streaming it, you know,
• 4:46
  with, with Disney, but it is still a very British science
• 4:51
  fiction TV show. And what reason then have why
• 5:00
  has there been such a a pushback from a certain quarter?
• 5:05
  I've seen plenty of positive things about this episode, like
• 5:07
  to say everybody hated it. I think it's an exaggeration,
• 5:11
  but I have seen a lot of pushback on this episode in
• 5:14
  particular Devil Called less so because that was, you know,
• 5:18
  totally unique. So I think there was a lot of
• 5:21
  people that appreciated the musical aspect of that and
• 5:24
  things like that. But I have seen some serious
• 5:28
  pushback against this because, well, basically because it isn't
• 5:32
  Heaven, Ascent and the world, Genesis and the Daleks and
• 5:36
  things like that. Well, I think may maybe the idea
• 5:41
  is this is something that was that the the did the did that I
• 5:44
  did come up with. But maybe it's the fact that how
• 5:49
  dare you take all this Disney money that you've been talking
• 5:52
  about in the press for so long and spend it on fart jokes and
• 5:56
  babies and innuendos about bombs and, you know.
• 6:02
  I'm there for all of it. That's well, we'll get into it,
• 6:06
  but that's the side, that's the side of Doctor Who I actually
• 6:09
  really like. Well, I mean, I, I think if you
• 6:12
  do have a good deep look back at Doctor Who in the classic era,
• 6:16
  you know, this is a chase Tom and the Rani, you know, Horns of
• 6:21
  Nimon, But there's there's a lot of.
• 6:24
  Really silly stuff, right? I mean, I know this is all the
• 6:27
  stuff that lingers at the bottom of the DWM polls whilst heaven
• 6:31
  sent that old man walking around a castle for an hour towers
• 6:35
  above all the others. Well, you know, to quote a
• 6:39
  certain Mr. Gregory, that polls upside down.
• 6:43
  Well, quiet. Don't.
• 6:45
  Please don't give praise. Or any confirmation bias on this
• 6:49
  podcast? But there's space for this,
• 6:53
  right? Surely in in the the
• 6:56
  multifaceted world of Doctor Who, there is space for
• 7:01
  ridiculousness. There should be.
• 7:04
  Yeah. Yeah, That's the thing.
• 7:05
  It's, it's a Doctor Who's always walked this tightrope between
• 7:08
  the, the serious and the silly and the ridiculous and the, the
• 7:13
  really, you know, the really worthy and sort of, well, even
• 7:16
  dark. And, you know, I like dark.
• 7:18
  Doctor Who, but I like silly Doctor Who too.
• 7:21
  And there and yes, of course, sometimes it tips too far into
• 7:24
  silly and too far into dark. But, you know, it's always been
• 7:27
  a, it's always been a tightrope act, you know, and I, I like, I
• 7:31
  like both, you know, there can be, there has to be space for,
• 7:35
  for, for both. They said put in the triple era
• 7:38
  space for all. Space for all.
• 7:40
  Is this too far then? Is this going over a Cliff?
• 7:44
  It is silliness. I I don't really care if it.
• 7:48
  Does. Oh, I loved you before you said
• 7:51
  that, but I love you more now. But.
• 7:55
  People do care though, don't they?
• 7:56
  The people really do take issue with stuff that's Purell and,
• 8:02
  you know, the burping bin, the fighting Slovene.
• 8:05
  The Fighting Slovene. I was going to say, yeah, you
• 8:07
  know, the fighting Slovene and you know, Russell T Davies, who,
• 8:10
  who start, who began Series 2 with, you know, Billie Piper
• 8:13
  bouncing her boobs around and who ended it with her breaking
• 8:16
  down in tears on a beach, you know?
• 8:18
  I think people that same audience had far less trouble
• 8:21
  with Billie Piper bouncing her boobs around in New Earth if I'm
• 8:24
  honest. But I do think it's worth
• 8:27
  remembering there are kids watching this, right?
• 8:28
  This is supposed to be, this isn't 450 year old men doing
• 8:34
  podcasts, you know, is it? This is not being made for those
• 8:38
  people. This is this is trying to
• 8:40
  capture a fresh generation of kids that will literally take
• 8:44
  that torch and keep this thing going, right?
• 8:47
  Rusty Davis, Steven Moffett, Mark Gates, they all watched the
• 8:50
  classic series, right? They got the bug from it young,
• 8:54
  and now they're making the show. Someone may watch Space Babies
• 8:57
  and go, Oh my God, you know, seven years old.
• 9:00
  Wasn't that hilarious? That enormous bum spaceship.
• 9:03
  Flying through space with a big shark.
• 9:05
  Coming out of it like, I don't know, I don't know.
• 9:09
  I know I'm pushing this point quite a lot.
• 9:12
  Well, I think it's also part of the the spirit of Doctor Who is
• 9:15
  I like this. I like the Doctor Who that is.
• 9:19
  Yeah, that is quite crass and silly and kind of like the
• 9:22
  naughty kid at the back of the classroom blowing raspberries
• 9:25
  and, you know, making fart jokes.
• 9:28
  Or we would have got on greater school.
• 9:29
  Then it would have been you and me together.
• 9:33
  Well, shall we? Because there is a lot to unpig.
• 9:38
  It's 45 minutes long. We've got our three reasons at
• 9:41
  the end, so we've got time to discuss all the pertinent points
• 9:43
  of the new series. Should we go into space Babies?
• 9:48
  What a title and. Space babies, as he keeps
• 9:51
  reminding us. Space babies, Space babies.
• 9:57
  Obviously nobody's got an action like shooting out why she's got
• 9:59
  the coolest. Accent, hasn't it?
• 10:02
  Oh, well, he, he's, he's just electrifying to watch, you know?
• 10:06
  Yeah, are you might have to contain me a little bit during
• 10:08
  this. Is wearing a very tight trot and
• 10:10
  his arse is popping in those. Trousers.
• 10:13
  Oh. Sorry, almost popping out of
• 10:15
  them. Let's go into some farting and
• 10:21
  snot monsters and all of this nonsense and see what we can
• 10:25
  find, shall we? OK, right you.
• 10:27
  Want to count us in? OK, so in 5432 push the button.
• 10:40
  It's not a big red one, but. Oh what?
• 10:44
  Did you forget these titles? They fixed them.
• 10:48
  I'm so happy my big. They fixed them.
• 10:50
  Well, my big issue during the 60th was they have, that's all
• 10:54
  fine, them going through the clouds and everything.
• 10:56
  They had this shot where it was this sort of fake zoom, as
• 11:00
  though it was kind of being captured on a news camera from.
• 11:02
  A Oh during the Battlestar Galactica star thing.
• 11:05
  Yeah. Oh, you see that in so many
• 11:07
  superhero movies and it's just it's just dreadful.
• 11:10
  And so are they. That's much better that kind of
• 11:12
  going into this sort of very vortex of light, which is much.
• 11:15
  Better is that when the rocks come in?
• 11:16
  Is it that part? I think it's just after the
• 11:19
  rocks. Yeah, yeah.
• 11:21
  Now I can't help but notice this is in no way the same lighting
• 11:24
  that Greet does at the end of the Church of Ruby Rd.
• 11:28
  It is nice, yeah. It's a completely different day,
• 11:31
  clearly. She wait, she had to wait around
• 11:34
  and make a decision. Well, look.
• 11:37
  Let's let's talk about Sheetie and Millie and what you think
• 11:40
  about this new. Well, there, yeah, that's,
• 11:44
  that's the new vibe for this, this series, which I really
• 11:47
  like. It's, it's, it's, it's kind of
• 11:50
  what what Jamie said to the doctor in the Seeds of Death,
• 11:53
  where he saw him geeking out with Professor Eldred over the
• 11:56
  rocket, rocket equipment in the museum.
• 11:58
  So, oh, there are a lot, a couple of kids and that's it is
• 12:01
  they're kind of, yeah, they're, they're, they're, they're two
• 12:04
  sort of tearaways, you know, they're two, you know, he, he's
• 12:08
  like the Big Brother and she's the little sister, you know, and
• 12:10
  they have that energy together, which, which is what makes them
• 12:14
  so infectiously kind of. I mean, I've heard people.
• 12:18
  Say I've heard people say on podcasts that I am now hosting
• 12:23
  things on. But they have no chemistry.
• 12:26
  Are you watching the same shows me like these two?
• 12:29
  Clearly adore working together shooting Millie.
• 12:33
  Yeah, and we saw that during Ruby Rd.
• 12:35
  You know, I mean, they, they probably did spend a little bit
• 12:38
  too much time in that flat, but it was to sort of watch them
• 12:41
  bounce off each other and and, you know, yeah, get get into
• 12:45
  each other's groove, really. I think the shootie is just
• 12:50
  magnificent. I don't think he's hit one one
• 12:53
  Duff note so far. No, Well, this, this scene in
• 12:56
  particular in the TARDIS, it's this massive info dump of
• 12:59
  exposition. And it feels like it's
• 13:02
  deliberate for me because I mean it, it might come across a bit
• 13:06
  clunky, but for me it feels very deliberate because he he drops
• 13:09
  all this stuff about, yeah, the Time Lords and Gallifrey.
• 13:13
  And it's all about how watch him sort of.
• 13:15
  Yeah. Rattle it off.
• 13:17
  You know, just like Jodie Whittaker can can rattle off
• 13:19
  techno Babble or David Tennant can rattle off, you know,
• 13:22
  complicated space, space names, you know, And then, yes, just
• 13:27
  just now he, he's leaning against the jukebox and then he
• 13:30
  kind of brings it immediately down.
• 13:33
  And she says you're where the Time Lords and he goes gone.
• 13:36
  And sort of it's this. He's trying very hard to be, you
• 13:40
  know, positive, even though there's a, there is still that
• 13:44
  sadness that's, that's, you know, he, he, I think the
• 13:47
  Doctor's always going to be the last of the Time Lords in, in
• 13:50
  the modern iteration. It's just kind of a, it's a
• 13:54
  feature now. It's not a bug, you know.
• 13:55
  You might have tried to bring that dreary ass planet back in
• 13:58
  Day of the Doctor. Steven Moffitt.
• 14:00
  But I'm sorry, we could not allow it to exist, it's so
• 14:03
  boring. Oh thank God they brew it up
• 14:05
  again. Yeah.
• 14:08
  I think that what I what was genius move.
• 14:11
  Now I've just insulted him. Now I'm going to say something
• 14:13
  nice about him Was that after two episodes, like you said, of
• 14:16
  the two of them running and excited together, Steven Moffat
• 14:21
  forces them into a situation where they have to stand still
• 14:24
  and talk to each other. Yes.
• 14:26
  Really act. You know, which is what I think
• 14:29
  a lot of people were waiting for.
• 14:31
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 14:32
  Because Millie does do a lot of reacting in these first two
• 14:35
  episodes, I agree. But she's very, she's very good
• 14:37
  at it, you know? I mean the.
• 14:39
  Bit where the snot falls on her head and she has to play all
• 14:41
  that comedy. Yeah.
• 14:45
  What is it? It's it's not.
• 14:47
  It's not. I mean, was it unfortunately?
• 14:51
  Oh my God, hang on. Dinosaurs.
• 14:53
  Park the snot, we've got dinosaurs.
• 14:56
  Doubt. Can I say to you this bit in a
• 14:58
  minute, this very laboured comedy sequence where she turns
• 15:01
  into the lizard woman? I think that's the one bit that
• 15:05
  she doesn't act too well. She suddenly starts putting on
• 15:08
  this RP. Yeah, Posh.
• 15:10
  Maya Roth was in absolute hysterics.
• 15:13
  He thought this was the funniest part of the whole episode.
• 15:16
  Well, I love that they they spent all that money like she
• 15:18
  actually, you know, you see photos as she's wearing a whole
• 15:21
  costume and they went to all that effort from 1 laboured gag.
• 15:26
  And all of that. CGI of the the Vista with the
• 15:29
  dinosaurs and the volcano behind.
• 15:31
  Just for basically. This is where we can go and, and
• 15:36
  this is how funny we are. Well, actually, no, they're
• 15:38
  funnier than this, I think, in this episode.
• 15:41
  Well, and this is a, you know, this is a very Disney moment
• 15:43
  where he picks up the butterfly and kind of brings it back to
• 15:45
  life, you know, and gives that little grin.
• 15:48
  But we have been doing that right all throughout the new
• 15:50
  series with regeneration energy. Well, yes, I think that's what
• 15:54
  it's meant to be. And and also it's kind of a call
• 15:56
  back to the Shakespeare code where, you know, Martha asks the
• 16:00
  10th Doctor, well, what if I step on a butterfly?
• 16:03
  And he's like, what? Tell you what, don't step on any
• 16:05
  butterflies. Wasn't there another line in
• 16:07
  Thin Ice in Series 10 between Bill and the Doctor about
• 16:11
  butterflies as well? It's sort of like become a bit
• 16:13
  of a running gag now. So it's kind of yeah.
• 16:15
  And this is basically a double dose kind of crash course of
• 16:19
  Doctor Who. So these are the rules of time
• 16:21
  travel. So what if I step on a
• 16:22
  butterfly? Here's what happens.
• 16:24
  Where? Where's the Doctor from here at
• 16:26
  the time Law? Well, he's, he's from Gallifrey,
• 16:28
  and you know, Gallifrey's gone. And I think maybe some of the
• 16:32
  reason why long term fans are are enjoying this is because
• 16:36
  they know all this. But this is for a new Disney
• 16:39
  audience. Now, isn't this clever?
• 16:41
  There's no way you can tell at this point.
• 16:43
  It doesn't like a big rattle. Actually, that's PlayStation.
• 16:45
  Yes, it looks like a rattle more than a.
• 16:48
  But then when it. Turns excuse me you wait later
• 16:51
  on I'll pause it right when when you see it from the from the
• 16:53
  rear if your pardon the. Pardon.
• 16:55
  I beg your pardon? Well sorry, whilst I'm being
• 16:59
  rude, I've got to say I'm in this very unfortunate situation
• 17:03
  of truly fancying the ass off the doctor at the moment.
• 17:07
  Now this is an interesting costume choice actually that he
• 17:10
  that he makes. Is that he interesting?
• 17:12
  Is that the word you use? Yes, because he's wearing this
• 17:15
  very, you know, swaggering, impressive leather coat, which I
• 17:18
  I love. I think he looks so good in
• 17:20
  that, but he takes it off and it suddenly makes him a look a look
• 17:25
  a lot younger. So he and he and Millie are are
• 17:30
  are they are the space babies though.
• 17:32
  They are the real space babies. You know, they are, they're,
• 17:35
  they're much more they're, they're much more like a couple
• 17:38
  of kids, as I said, yeah. And he is beautiful as well.
• 17:44
  That mustache. I hope he keeps that mustache
• 17:46
  because. In the interview where he goes,
• 17:49
  I mean, you can't avoid my chocolateiness, can you?
• 17:51
  We don't want to. All right, give me more.
• 17:55
  Oh, what do you think of that snot monster?
• 17:58
  Oh wow, it looks. Great.
• 18:00
  It does, doesn't it? Yeah, they've put a lot of
• 18:02
  effort in and it's, again, it's a, it's a snot monster.
• 18:06
  But they've, yeah, they've, they, I mean, the production
• 18:08
  value on that is amazing. And just the pace.
• 18:11
  Of this when they go into that lift.
• 18:14
  Cramped inside, it sucks up the tube.
• 18:17
  Sorry. He's got his hand over.
• 18:20
  They're out. It's like 4 seconds.
• 18:23
  Yeah. Oh, it's, it moves on.
• 18:25
  It's in and out like a shot this episode, you know, it really
• 18:28
  goes, goes, goes again. That's the other thing is the
• 18:30
  the breakneck pace is back, you know?
• 18:33
  But you're right, this absolutely.
• 18:35
  This episode is also proving that shootie get what can handle
• 18:39
  all the techno Babble, all the gags, the pace of the show, all
• 18:43
  of it. Ruby Rd. that was doing a lot of
• 18:46
  establishing stuff. This is now like your standard
• 18:48
  Doctor Who episode. Can you do this?
• 18:51
  Yes, he can. Yeah, he can he he definitely
• 18:54
  can. And it's funny He he he said
• 18:55
  push the button there. He says it a lot during this
• 18:58
  episode and I did read somewhere and I'll have I'll have to be
• 19:02
  confirmed, but they originally going to put the sugar babes,
• 19:06
  push the button, you know, push the button.
• 19:11
  And I think maybe they thought, oh, well, that's maybe one song
• 19:13
  too many. We've got already got songs in
• 19:15
  Ruby Rd. We've got songs in the devil's
• 19:17
  chord, you know? No, I want series one, the album
• 19:21
  by the end. All those ghastly babies in the
• 19:25
  tubes there. Yes.
• 19:28
  But Oh yeah, that's that was a good line there.
• 19:31
  What about banning kissing? Banning kissing.
• 19:33
  Yeah, well, terrible idea. What is to God?
• 19:36
  Imagine a world without kissing Daniel.
• 19:38
  Appalling. But it's also part of, I think
• 19:42
  what we'll get into this later, but it's what this there's a lot
• 19:45
  of this episodes trying to say, I think, and it's all in the
• 19:48
  little, all in those little snatches of dialogue.
• 19:51
  See this is great there was a shot there from behind Ruby with
• 19:53
  all those weird babies in test tubes there with the the planet
• 19:57
  in front of them the gorgeous clouds around like visually
• 20:03
  spectacular. I I think anyone who says
• 20:05
  there's no money on this, I think there is.
• 20:07
  I can see less money on the screen weirdly than I could
• 20:09
  during the Jodie Whiz career. But anyone who says it looks
• 20:12
  cheap, I don't think you're watching the same show as me
• 20:16
  like there's. Clearly money on the screen
• 20:18
  here. Yeah, well, I mean, look at that
• 20:20
  planet Vista outside. I mean, it really looks
• 20:24
  dazzling, you know? And I say it again, but look at
• 20:27
  shoot to get what I mean if all the money's going on him, happy
• 20:30
  days. I'll just have close-ups.
• 20:31
  Of him all the time. OK I'll stop.
• 20:33
  I'll stop. So traditional Doctor Who
• 20:38
  exploring a space station bit arc in space, you know.
• 20:42
  Yes, a lot of people brought up this is very end of the world,
• 20:45
  but I think what people forget is the end of the world has a
• 20:49
  very different context to that scene where he upgrades her
• 20:52
  phone because there's a whole character dynamic going on
• 20:55
  there. Where here it's, it's literally
• 20:58
  just a sort of it's, it's condensed down to 30 seconds and
• 21:02
  it's just an effective storytelling device.
• 21:04
  It's like, OK, we want to get across the she's in a completely
• 21:07
  different time and how weird that is and how otherworldly
• 21:10
  that is. Well, here you go, you know,
• 21:14
  here's a future space station. Look out at the Vista and here
• 21:18
  you know, upgrade your phone and you can find your mum.
• 21:20
  But that was almost two decades ago now, the end of the world as
• 21:24
  well. So the only people that really
• 21:27
  remember that are those 50 year old geeks doing podcasts.
• 21:31
  You know, whereas the rest of the world that got on with their
• 21:33
  lives and didn't focus on Doctor Who all the time.
• 21:36
  Actually, it's a nice reminder of what you can do.
• 21:39
  Right, exactly. I don't know if you if you saw
• 21:42
  that on the on the view screen as he talks about Pacifico.
• 21:45
  Del Rio. Oh well.
• 21:47
  Done. There was so, you know,
• 21:51
  atmosphere, air and then Maverty.
• 21:55
  They're not letting that that joke go because it's still
• 21:58
  funny. They will flog it to death,
• 22:00
  won't they? It'll probably There probably
• 22:02
  will be an episode later called Maverty or some kind of joke
• 22:06
  around it. Something I.
• 22:07
  Wouldn't put it past them. Yeah, this is I love the
• 22:11
  character of of her mum and the nan.
• 22:14
  Well, that was such a big part of of Ruby Road, and that is
• 22:17
  only on the second watch that I got.
• 22:18
  Oh yeah. It's like kind of it's a
• 22:20
  wonderful life, you know? What if Ruby was never in her
• 22:24
  life and this is what would happen, you know?
• 22:27
  I was shocked at just how effective having regular family
• 22:31
  members was, just how great that was during RTD One.
• 22:35
  I was surprised how little of it we got in Steven Moffat's time
• 22:39
  because it was such a a tried and tested formula.
• 22:43
  Then I was really pleased it seemed to be coming back in
• 22:46
  Chipmel's time and then he just abandoned it all together after
• 22:49
  a little while as well, so I'm pleased with doing it again.
• 22:53
  Oh look, the space babies. Oh my God, do.
• 22:56
  You know, come on, say it. Go on.
• 22:59
  Well, this, this character, Eric, who's got this sort of
• 23:03
  perpetually perplexed look on his face, he looks like a
• 23:07
  certain songwriter who might have written Doctor in Distress.
• 23:11
  I I couldn't possibly comment. But I'm not entirely.
• 23:14
  Sure who you're talking about there?
• 23:16
  There's a shot a minute. In a minute though, we're
• 23:18
  surrounded by a harem of babies crying, so I feel as if the the
• 23:23
  metaphor may extend. It will sort of push their all
• 23:29
  their dubbies out. And yeah.
• 23:32
  Well, that's the thing too. I mean, babies, babies are
• 23:34
  funny. You know, that's The thing is,
• 23:36
  is, and that's what I think is quite is is funny about the
• 23:39
  episode itself is you've got all this Disney money and he's going
• 23:42
  to go in the complete opposite direction.
• 23:44
  Yeah, I'm going to work with babies when they say that, you
• 23:47
  know, the two things you should never work for is animals and
• 23:51
  children. If you're on a film set or TV
• 23:53
  set, that's what you should never, ever do.
• 23:55
  He's like, no, let's do that. Now, I often complain about the
• 23:59
  Brute of the Damned and the Steven Moffat era, those ghastly
• 24:02
  children that we always see, Angie and Arsie and and all of
• 24:05
  that. Those those dreadful children
• 24:07
  into remember Forest of the Night.
• 24:10
  Oh, may that. Girl blinking away.
• 24:12
  With the Peppa Pig voice. Yeah.
• 24:13
  Oh, God, Killed a lot of them. They're so annoying.
• 24:16
  Now this I can get by our cute little babies.
• 24:19
  Yeah. Yes, I mean, there, there is
• 24:22
  that there they they've explained the, you know, that
• 24:24
  they're over. They've got these actors dubbing
• 24:27
  their voices and a very complex kind of CGI effect.
• 24:31
  But to be honest, I don't know how else you would do it, is the
• 24:34
  thing. Is, well, I think it's sort of
• 24:37
  it's good enough. It's good enough for.
• 24:38
  Plot purposes and but it is creepy, isn't it?
• 24:42
  It is a bit unsettling, isn't it?
• 24:44
  Sometimes I think they're a bit more creepier than than the
• 24:46
  bogeyman downstairs, I think. Oh, far more, I thought.
• 24:50
  The twist of this was going to be when I first watched it.
• 24:52
  Like the Galaxy 4 twist but the monster.
• 24:54
  Was actually a good guy and the babies were evil.
• 24:58
  Yeah, same, same. I was like and and then I was
• 25:00
  thinking, oh, what's this? That's that's that's such my
• 25:03
  Doctor Who brain. You know I.
• 25:05
  Think that might have been a bit too much for the Disney audience
• 25:07
  if the Doctor had had to summarily execute a load of
• 25:10
  babies. Although he did do it in in.
• 25:15
  Runaway Bride didn't he killed all those spider babies.
• 25:19
  So he's got, he's got form with infant side, doesn't he?
• 25:23
  And it's a great sort of challenge for Shooty and Millie
• 25:25
  because now, you know, this is really going to test their
• 25:27
  acting skills. You're going to act against
• 25:29
  babies. And, you know, they and, you
• 25:32
  know, I can just imagine babies crying.
• 25:34
  You know, they were only allowed to work two hours on set every
• 25:37
  day. So.
• 25:38
  Did you see the behind the scenes of dolls that they used?
• 25:42
  Oh. God, they were absolutely
• 25:44
  chilling. I wonder where all those dolls
• 25:46
  ended up. Oh, look.
• 25:49
  He gives her a hug. He's sweet.
• 25:53
  Look at that shot, that station, the planet.
• 25:56
  It's gorgeous. We're going through the window,
• 26:00
  Daniel. It's the truth that I'm watching
• 26:02
  Babylon Five at the moment. OK, CGI from 30 years ago.
• 26:06
  And I'm telling you now, I don't know.
• 26:07
  Nothing like this. Oh, this moment.
• 26:11
  OK, so this is such a great moment because he's I think it's
• 26:14
  this moment where he says, you know, maybe I grew up.
• 26:18
  She says maybe I grew up wrong. Captain Poppy does.
• 26:21
  And then he says, oh, no one grows up wrong.
• 26:25
  And that's such an important message, you know, that that is
• 26:28
  the Doctor. That is the philosophy of the
• 26:30
  Doctor. You know what The kind of the
• 26:33
  kind of ethos that Doctor Who strives for, you know?
• 26:36
  But then I did see the usual angry people on social media
• 26:41
  going what you're trying to say that serial killers didn't?
• 26:44
  Grow up wrong and paedophiles didn't grow up wrong.
• 26:48
  I was like, Oh my God almighty, you know, you just don't have a
• 26:51
  happy moment in your life, do you?
• 26:55
  It's a lovely scene. And the when it the way he says
• 26:57
  like my uniqueness, it's like a superpower.
• 27:01
  Yes, is, you know, is, is, is everyone's ordinary, but
• 27:04
  everyone's special too. You know which it's, yeah, it's
• 27:07
  a very Disney message actually, you know, but in very one of the
• 27:11
  positive ones, you know, it's, it's a good one.
• 27:13
  I think that's a very new who message as well, though.
• 27:18
  That's true. You know your unique strengths
• 27:20
  and celebrating them well. What do you think about
• 27:25
  extending the I won't say the Timeless Child arc because
• 27:29
  Russell Davis condemned the words in a recent interview.
• 27:32
  He did, didn't he? He said He wasn't very
• 27:34
  interested in those those words, you know?
• 27:36
  But he is interested in the emotion of the storyline of the
• 27:39
  Doctor being a foundling and not knowing where he's from and the
• 27:43
  armour around that and how that relates to people.
• 27:45
  How do you feel about that? Well, and it's, it's again, it's
• 27:49
  another way of going. Doctor Who, the question, Doctor
• 27:53
  Who. So.
• 27:55
  And of course, it's meant to parallel Ruby.
• 27:57
  He was found on a on our church doorstep, you know, so that's
• 28:02
  what kind of bring, that's what connects them together, is that
• 28:04
  they're both orphans in a sense, and both never knew who their
• 28:08
  parents really were. And yeah, Key again, it keeps
• 28:12
  that mystery back in the show again.
• 28:14
  And because, you know, we're always finding out about the
• 28:17
  Doctor's family and the Doctor's people, the Doctor's name, the
• 28:20
  Doctor's life. But it always kind of, it's
• 28:23
  almost like a circle. Then it circles background.
• 28:25
  Anything. Actually, no, we don't.
• 28:27
  We don't know anything about him, you know.
• 28:29
  What's interesting, though, is that Chris Chipnall effectively
• 28:35
  cut ties with the Muffet era, didn't he?
• 28:37
  But he did his own thing, like, and there were developments, but
• 28:41
  he basically said, all right, yeah, great, that's happened,
• 28:43
  but we're going to do this. Whereas what Russell Davis has
• 28:46
  done is he said, no, I'm going to take that, thank you very
• 28:49
  much, and explore it some more. In a way, I think it positively
• 28:54
  endorses Chiba's time. Exactly.
• 28:56
  Yeah, Which is? I think, which is great because
• 28:59
  I think a lot of people go oh RC DS back, you know, he'll he'll
• 29:02
  get rid of all that timeless child bullshit.
• 29:05
  And yeah, we do. He didn't.
• 29:09
  What do you think about these Bush chairs flying around the
• 29:11
  place? Well, they have this, oh, this
• 29:15
  bit where she's like, oh, I, we didn't mean to scare you.
• 29:18
  And then the doctor immediately afterwards scares them and he
• 29:21
  thinks it's funny. He laughs.
• 29:25
  Boogie man. He's laughing his head off.
• 29:30
  Naughty doctor. The babies look really scared.
• 29:34
  It's like the reaction when an AI gets a bad response in it.
• 29:38
  Oh well, Speaking of AI, there's the was the nanny, which is I
• 29:44
  think it's such a funny joke because you know, Nan E and this
• 29:48
  this actually relates to I I remember reading in the writer's
• 29:51
  tale, Russell T Davies is having a really dreary day at work, you
• 29:56
  know, trying to write Torchwood and he's had to put one of his
• 29:59
  own ideas that he was saving for Doctor Who into a Torchwood
• 30:02
  episode and he's very upset, stressed out about it.
• 30:05
  So he goes to the cinema with his phone off and sits through
• 30:10
  in in order, you know, The Dark Knight wanted and and wall-e,
• 30:15
  the Pixar film wall-e. So I think that's a little sort
• 30:18
  of idea in his brain that sort of finally kind of coming on
• 30:23
  screen, you know? It's too similar to be a
• 30:25
  coincidence, right? Well, yeah, And you have in
• 30:28
  Wally, you had those, those humans who were basically giant
• 30:31
  babies, you know, on a space station, this kind of the same
• 30:35
  thing. Horse they were.
• 30:36
  Yeah, even the imagery is quite similar.
• 30:39
  Very much, though, you know. Yeah, Jesus.
• 30:42
  Oh God, I love all that crayon all over the walls.
• 30:45
  Like if you're going to do it right, just go to town and do it
• 30:48
  if you're going to do space babies.
• 30:51
  Well, yeah. And oh, that he brought up his
• 30:54
  two hearts. I think that's the other thing.
• 30:56
  He he's very, he's a very open doctor.
• 30:58
  He'll just, I mean, if there is always that secret side to him
• 31:01
  where he'll, he'll clam up about his name or, or Susan that, you
• 31:06
  know, he mentions in the devil's Chord.
• 31:09
  But but he'll, he'll, he'll be very open about saying, you
• 31:12
  know, oh, I've got two hearts. I haven't got a people.
• 31:15
  Why, you know? I do.
• 31:17
  I wonder if, and you know, I love Jodie Whisker as Doctor,
• 31:20
  but I wonder if in the writing they made her a bit too closed
• 31:25
  off to that stuff. Like they didn't even learn that
• 31:28
  she used to be a bloke until Spy Fall I.
• 31:32
  Had to catch up. Get to the end of it.
• 31:34
  Like, do we even know you at all?
• 31:37
  Oh, this? Big.
• 31:39
  That was such a good edit too, like it's sort of a cut back to
• 31:42
  the to the church on Ruby Rd. And yeah, how the memory the
• 31:46
  flashback changes? And the person pointing at him?
• 31:50
  Whoever. That is very eerie.
• 31:52
  And I mean, that is amazing bit of filmmaking.
• 31:55
  Yeah. And I.
• 31:56
  Know you don't like spoilers, so I shall keep that to myself I.
• 32:00
  Think yeah? Well, we'll discuss it later.
• 32:03
  OK, otherwise I should put a spoiler.
• 32:04
  Tag out on this, but the the the idea of using the snow as a as a
• 32:10
  visual arc indication right? This is important.
• 32:13
  The snow's falling. Pay attention.
• 32:15
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. And how it keeps sort of, and
• 32:18
  just for snow falling can be very kind of, yeah, slightly
• 32:21
  eerie, slightly atmospheric. You know, it's like the song,
• 32:24
  isn't it? That keeps coming up.
• 32:26
  Carol of the Bell. Carol of the Bell.
• 32:27
  Laughs. It's kind of disturbing as well
• 32:31
  as celebratory. Yeah, well, that's always been
• 32:34
  slightly creepy song too, especially if you listen to it
• 32:37
  alone at night on, well, maybe not on Christmas, but before
• 32:41
  Christmas, but. What you said here about him,
• 32:45
  like he's all he's going, oh, and I thought, you know, my back
• 32:49
  story was weird. He grabs hold of her in a big
• 32:52
  hug, and then the look of his face is like, something's wrong
• 32:55
  here. I've got to figure this out,
• 32:57
  which is why we do the scanning at the end of the episode of him
• 33:00
  trying to figure out just what is going on.
• 33:02
  Oh. They're going to meet Nanny.
• 33:07
  Yeah, Oh my God, there will be a twist in the tail in a minute.
• 33:13
  Pay. Attention, Yes.
• 33:13
  Who is that on the screen, I wonder?
• 33:17
  I think it's very clever though, the way they distract them.
• 33:19
  So she she bashes the pie, doesn't she?
• 33:22
  So they both look away and then Susan Twist appears on the
• 33:25
  screen. Oh yeah, no, I didn't.
• 33:27
  I didn't realise that. Yeah, in the devil's, in the
• 33:30
  devil's core, they both turn away and then.
• 33:32
  Yes, that's right. Turns around, yeah.
• 33:34
  Yeah. But then in boom, obviously
• 33:38
  she's the ambulance. That's right.
• 33:41
  So yeah, very, very. They both talk to her in that.
• 33:45
  And I'm wondering if this week, because we're halfway through
• 33:47
  the season, this week, it's going to be they're like, oh, I
• 33:50
  keep seeing that face. Yes.
• 33:54
  Maybe that's the arc of this season.
• 33:56
  They'll say to each other, right, What's occurring now?
• 34:02
  Oh. They've met Jocelyn.
• 34:03
  That lovely lady from Bridgeton. Bridgeton.
• 34:06
  That's right. Yeah, Queen wants her name.
• 34:08
  Couldn't they have had her in in the Bridgeton episode this
• 34:11
  season? That would have been funny.
• 34:15
  What do you think? This is a loaded question.
• 34:18
  OK, you can choose to duck it if you want.
• 34:21
  What do you think about the discussion about the Sonic
• 34:25
  screwdriver where the design was changed because, and I quote,
• 34:30
  the original looked to like a gun?
• 34:33
  So that was from, I seem to remember that's from an article
• 34:36
  with and Rolling Stone with Alan Sepinwall, who wrote it, and he
• 34:41
  was quoted as saying that, wasn't he?
• 34:43
  Yeah, OK. Well, I suppose, I mean, I think
• 34:47
  it's maybe just he looked back at all those episodes of, you
• 34:51
  know, Matt Smith and Peter Capaldi and, you know, waving
• 34:54
  their Sonic screwdrivers around and just thought, you know, it
• 34:59
  just it's it's basically a functional, it's a functional
• 35:03
  plot device, the Sonic screwdriver.
• 35:04
  So maybe we're a bit too focused on it and we just want to take
• 35:08
  the focus off it. And I, I don't know, I, I think
• 35:12
  it looks a bit like a mouse really.
• 35:14
  I'm going. To be more pointed then are we,
• 35:17
  are we making concessions because Shuji Gatwa is a black
• 35:21
  man? Because I think that's the
• 35:23
  inference is they didn't want a black man holding an instrument
• 35:27
  that looked like a gun. I think that was that was the
• 35:29
  problem. Oh, yeah, no, I never thought
• 35:31
  about that. But yes, that's probably he.
• 35:34
  He's probably being very careful about all those possibly yeah,
• 35:37
  loaded images. And have they had to sort of
• 35:41
  make alterations to the show because some people will be
• 35:46
  going in with appalling expectations?
• 35:52
  I don't know, actually, it's, it's certainly something to
• 35:57
  certainly something to think about.
• 35:58
  Although it'd be interesting to see in the rest of the season
• 36:01
  if, if you know, if you can, how we can do anger as well.
• 36:05
  Because that's another sort of dangerous kind of stereotype is
• 36:10
  the angry black man, you know? And there's there's been like a
• 36:13
  deliberate attempt to make him very joyful in the first two
• 36:16
  episodes. That's right.
• 36:17
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 36:18
  Which he plays. Brilliantly, because shooting
• 36:20
  get was full of life. And they had this discussion
• 36:24
  too, that, I mean, that's one of the things they're talking
• 36:26
  about, isn't it? Is the, is why the babies were
• 36:30
  left behind, you know, and how they were basically forced to be
• 36:34
  born and then their parents just left, You know, all the
• 36:38
  grown-ups went and there's a recession down on Pacifico Del
• 36:42
  Rio and, and yeah, the government basically forced
• 36:46
  these babies to come to term and then just abandoned them.
• 36:48
  I I wonder what he's trying to say.
• 36:53
  Yes I can. I wonder what the Americans are
• 36:55
  making of all this. And then they follow that up
• 36:58
  with boom with this anti religion, anti capitalism, anti
• 37:02
  warfare message. They must be sitting at home
• 37:06
  very confused. Surely all these things are
• 37:08
  good, right? Yeah, yeah.
• 37:11
  And, and well, we, we mentioned, you know, nobody grows up wrong
• 37:15
  and they do. They in that same conversation,
• 37:17
  they mentioned, you know, refugees as well.
• 37:21
  But you know, I think we've just come out of an era which was
• 37:28
  almost entirely apolitical in terms of being angry about
• 37:34
  things. I think Chris Chipnall was great
• 37:37
  at putting a message on the screen.
• 37:39
  I think he did environmentalism well.
• 37:41
  I think he did. He certainly tackled racism
• 37:44
  brilliantly, mental health a couple of times, stunningly
• 37:49
  well. But I don't know.
• 37:51
  Nobody gets angry like Rusty Davis about the injustices in
• 37:55
  the world. And I thought.
• 37:57
  Well, we only read very recently with the giggle, you know,
• 37:59
  that's a very angry piece of work, you know?
• 38:03
  I'm right all the time, all right?
• 38:09
  Oh, I was, I was, I was did. I did have a sort of Russell T
• 38:13
  Davies moment. I was like, is he?
• 38:15
  Has he actually killed off a kid?
• 38:16
  Has he actually killed the? Baby sitting there going oh
• 38:19
  marvellous, that's the last. It's doing that, Steven.
• 38:23
  Spielberg and Jaws again, isn't it?
• 38:25
  That's the last thing they'll expect.
• 38:28
  Oh, I love that. This time we go down in the lift
• 38:30
  shaft. It's two seconds because we've
• 38:32
  already done it once. Just a very quick shot, but you
• 38:36
  know. All of this cut into the camera
• 38:38
  footage that's doing like sort of found footage style direction
• 38:43
  like we got in sleeping the more.
• 38:45
  Horror movie angles? Yeah, yeah.
• 38:47
  And I swear to God, if you'd seen that monster in Classic
• 38:50
  Who, it would be declared one of the best looking monsters we've
• 38:53
  ever seen in Doctor Who. Yeah.
• 38:56
  I think some people just aren't seeing the good that's here.
• 38:59
  Well, yeah, and, you know, even we mentioned the the, the sort
• 39:03
  of political points he makes and they think, oh, well, he's just
• 39:06
  tossing a bunch of hot button issues and being I'm so clever.
• 39:09
  But that's how he writes. He he doesn't space babies isn't
• 39:12
  isn't about these these political points.
• 39:15
  It's about a bunch of babies on a space station.
• 39:18
  But oh, space babies. But he, he's always commented
• 39:24
  about the world. It's always going on in the
• 39:26
  background, like a, you know, like a sort of hum.
• 39:28
  There's always a hum of, of commentary going on in the
• 39:31
  background. And it's the way Russell writes,
• 39:33
  you know? And he does.
• 39:34
  Yeah, you're right, he does get cross about things, but he also
• 39:37
  just writes fantastically entertaining TV as well.
• 39:41
  Those two things are not mutually exclusive.
• 39:46
  Oh, another chase. Oh, it's great.
• 39:49
  Do you know what? There was a second a moment a
• 39:50
  second ago where I was like, Oh my God, Ruby's got agency where
• 39:54
  she goes, right? So when we make noise, it'll
• 39:56
  come for us. Yeah.
• 39:57
  And she grabs the pipe and she's like bashing the shit out of the
• 40:00
  set. And I'm like, bloody hell, don't
• 40:02
  get her mass. Well, and as soon as she heard
• 40:05
  that Eric was in trouble, she was like, she charged out, you
• 40:08
  know, she was the one to go to his rescue, you know?
• 40:11
  I thought that moment in Boone, I know we're not talking about
• 40:14
  it, where she refused to just throw him the the thing that
• 40:17
  would balance his way and she put herself in doubt.
• 40:20
  That was so brilliantly done. Yeah, she, she, yeah, she does.
• 40:25
  She does. She, she's very proactive, you
• 40:27
  know, and that's, that is what I was, I was hoping for, you know,
• 40:31
  when with when Millie Gibson was introduced, you know.
• 40:35
  And don't you love that by the end of this episode it is a snot
• 40:38
  monster redeemed as well, you know?
• 40:42
  Well, that's the thing too, is that it's yeah, it's, it's the
• 40:47
  well, it's, you know, he's done this before with, you know, the
• 40:49
  Adipose and and other, other monsters where it's not bad.
• 40:53
  It's, you know, it's just, it's well, I would say misunderstood,
• 40:57
  but it's, you know, it's babies to the rescue with the flame.
• 41:03
  Fiji and they didn't give that little baby a flamethrower.
• 41:07
  Well, she looks, well, happy with it.
• 41:11
  Oh my God, they're so funny. Oh.
• 41:13
  Babies, babies, babies. You did brilliant.
• 41:15
  You did so great. And then he corrects himself
• 41:20
  again. Space babies.
• 41:22
  He needs to make this stuff. Plausible, right?
• 41:24
  That's an acting feat. Probably got you probably got
• 41:30
  the first script and he went right.
• 41:32
  Come on, what's? We do some serious science
• 41:34
  fiction now. Oh, space babies, What could
• 41:36
  that be about? And then they have this, this
• 41:38
  sort of this, this swearing translation software.
• 41:43
  Isn't it great? Children will return to the
• 41:46
  upper levels. We'll have no expletive dinner.
• 41:50
  Well, it just so happens that you mentioned another Doctor Who
• 41:53
  episode to me in another podcast like New Earth, where he did
• 41:56
  that a couple of times, didn't he?
• 41:58
  Yeah, there's very much the the the spirit of New Earth in this
• 42:01
  isn't. There bit rich.
• 42:03
  Isn't it rich? Yeah.
• 42:04
  Talking out of your ass, not talking about bums, Yeah.
• 42:13
  I mean, I'm always talking about bums.
• 42:15
  I mean, look at you. No.
• 42:17
  OK, please. But even Luke Malloy, a straight
• 42:21
  man, was saying to me when we were watching Devil's Court
• 42:24
  doing the commentary, he's kind of, Oh my God, you know, look at
• 42:27
  his bum. I mean, it's just popping.
• 42:29
  I mean. There you go.
• 42:31
  There's some very tight trousers he's wearing.
• 42:33
  Shooty cat wise the only man in Doctor Who that can turn every
• 42:36
  man guy. Apparently he came in late,
• 42:41
  didn't he? Was a late audition.
• 42:43
  He was update there. I mean they say he's the last
• 42:45
  one. Maybe that's just to kind of big
• 42:47
  him up, but but I mean, yeah, it's you read, you can read
• 42:51
  those part of those auditions on the the The Doctor Who script
• 42:56
  collection on the BBC website, I think.
• 42:59
  I can see why they went for Shooty though, because just in
• 43:03
  the three episodes we've seen in this, like we said, he can
• 43:06
  handle all the traditional Doctor Who stuff.
• 43:08
  Plus he's got tons of energy. And the next one, he's playing
• 43:12
  the instruments. You know he gets to show he gets
• 43:14
  to be properly scared in the next one as well when he's
• 43:16
  running away from Maestro. And then in Boom, he's playing
• 43:20
  the intensity of that situation. You know when Ruby gets shot?
• 43:24
  Sorry, I'm just doing this episode full of spoilers now.
• 43:28
  You know the heated reaction when Ruby gets shot is
• 43:30
  unbelievably good. Well, and and you know, in this
• 43:34
  bit where she gets the snot over her, he he calls her rubes and
• 43:38
  that's what she really objects to is not necessarily the snot
• 43:41
  on her head. And well, my favorite shooting
• 43:45
  moment so far is in the Church of Ruby Rd. where he's he's
• 43:49
  singing that goblin song and he goes, you know, neon rules.
• 43:55
  We got just one hope if I have understood that rope.
• 43:58
  And he does this little sort of finger wag with a knowing smile
• 44:02
  as he looks up at the ropes. And I think that is just that is
• 44:04
  pure Doctor Who. That is that is the doctor that
• 44:08
  is the doctor. You know, it's just.
• 44:09
  I'm going to see if I can still remember the other ones.
• 44:14
  Oh my God, I've forgotten. How does it start that bit.
• 44:18
  Oh oh oh the goblin king, oh the goblin king.
• 44:24
  It is good to meet. You great big thing.
• 44:27
  It's good to. See.
• 44:29
  Having a fun day, it's good. To meet my friend she's.
• 44:32
  She's Ruby Sunday. Oh, he mentions here that the
• 44:37
  bogeyman was roaring at sort of 17 Hertz and which is the, the
• 44:41
  pitch that is supposed to make you scared.
• 44:43
  And I, when I did watch it for the first time, I was like, God,
• 44:46
  they've put it a bit loud. All this bogeyman screeching,
• 44:49
  you know, and that that's kind of what makes you jump a little
• 44:52
  bit when it comes roaring at the camera.
• 44:54
  But yeah, that's, I mean, that's part of the, the sort of the,
• 44:58
  the plot design, isn't it? Oh.
• 45:00
  Bloody love, don't you love all those bogies up the walls?
• 45:04
  Yes, well, and this is what this is what I was saying is that
• 45:06
  there's this is the moment, the sort of cement as a very British
• 45:10
  science fiction show because they say bogeys, they don't say.
• 45:13
  Boogers. All those, you know,
• 45:15
  Americanisms that, where they're afraid to say words sometimes.
• 45:20
  I think this is the point where you've got the two two types of
• 45:24
  people in the audience now, those that are happily have a
• 45:27
  dig up their nose and those are a bit embarrassed about it, you
• 45:30
  know, and always get a little hanky or something like that.
• 45:32
  And those with the hankies are the ones that go.
• 45:34
  Oh, this is oh so offensive. And those that'll have a dig,
• 45:37
  go. Oh wait, what does that say
• 45:39
  about you and me? Oh well, that I am the latter
• 45:41
  category, yeah. What you're you're a nose
• 45:43
  blower? No.
• 45:45
  Oh no, Neither am I. That's probably too TMI, too
• 45:50
  much information. Well, there we go.
• 45:52
  This is hamster after. Oh, here we go, your hair.
• 46:01
  This is the worst thing that's ever happened to anyone.
• 46:05
  Oh, when he goes, isn't the universe mad?
• 46:08
  Yeah. How great.
• 46:10
  And then look, that awful monster comes.
• 46:12
  Because you remember the previews for this before we saw
• 46:16
  the babies, We just saw the monster, didn't we?
• 46:18
  And them in the corridors. And everyone thought, my God,
• 46:21
  it's going to be a really scary opener.
• 46:23
  Yes, but as he says, you know there's no such thing as
• 46:26
  monsters. Monsters are just creatures you
• 46:28
  haven't met yet. Yeah, here we go.
• 46:34
  Come on Nanny, you can get him out of this.
• 46:38
  Well, at this point, when I was watching this on transmission, I
• 46:40
  was just sold. I was like, yes, we're on an
• 46:43
  adventure again. I mean, it's very dog to who
• 46:45
  running down corridors, you know?
• 46:47
  I don't think I've done that too often, have they?
• 46:52
  Oh, I feel really sorry. Is it now where we see the poor
• 46:55
  old bogey monster hanging on for dear life?
• 46:58
  Yeah, as it gets sucked out of the airlock.
• 47:00
  Yeah, I feel empathy for that thing.
• 47:03
  Well, yeah, And that's very much the message of the episode is.
• 47:05
  Yeah, is of course the bogeyman's not bad, but of
• 47:09
  course Jocelyn's not bad either. She's just trying to protect the
• 47:12
  babies, you know? Yeah.
• 47:14
  It's a sort of maternal instinct, you know?
• 47:16
  What does Ruby say you save them all?
• 47:20
  Yeah, that's right. You save them all, you know,
• 47:23
  Even the ones, Yeah, who look like a giant snot monster.
• 47:25
  Not. The fact that when he's hanging
• 47:28
  on, they've done all that CGI snot going out into the air.
• 47:32
  That must have taken a bit of time to animate.
• 47:36
  On the on the special feature documentary thing, they were
• 47:39
  like, well, we're making the snot today.
• 47:41
  Yeah, they're there with these vats of green goo.
• 47:44
  I thought, oh I'm in the wrong line of work.
• 47:48
  Well, you mentioned Chibnall earlier.
• 47:49
  I mean, we're far, we're a long, we're a far cry away from him
• 47:52
  hanging out of that airlock in 42 trying to reach that lever
• 47:55
  going, oh, go on. Just the show's doing the same
• 48:02
  things though, right? Just in very different ways.
• 48:05
  Yes, mixing and matching, cherry picking little bits, you know.
• 48:08
  But it's leaning into that thing that Colin Baker always says
• 48:11
  about how the Doctor has a different morality and he sees
• 48:14
  the universe in a different way. And I think the new series does
• 48:16
  that really well, showing the Doctor having huge empathy for
• 48:20
  right ugly monsters. Sorry, maybe I shouldn't use the
• 48:23
  word ugly. No, but he says it in the
• 48:25
  episode. He says, you know, I've seen,
• 48:27
  I've met a million ugly bugs. I am an ugly bug, you know.
• 48:31
  That's a lovely. Line.
• 48:32
  That's a great line, isn't? It great lines peppered in this.
• 48:37
  And as I said, yeah, at the beginning is yeah, he that I
• 48:39
  think that the last of the Time Lords thing is now just a
• 48:42
  default feature is that you don't, doesn't have to be the
• 48:45
  Time War or, you know, whether it's the Time War or the
• 48:48
  Timeless Child or whatever. It's just that it makes him much
• 48:52
  more, yeah, much more of a character if he, if he have he,
• 48:57
  if he's the only one of his kind, because that's just makes
• 49:00
  him have more empathy for for every everyone else, you know?
• 49:04
  And it means saving that boogeyman.
• 49:07
  It's important because he's unique.
• 49:09
  There's not another one. Like him, you know.
• 49:13
  Oh, he gets to be a hero. Here, Oh, it's wonderful.
• 49:15
  When he's hanging off there and being sucked into space, it's
• 49:18
  great. Well, and I mean, that's that's
• 49:21
  another thing is when I first heard Shooty's 15th Doctor theme
• 49:25
  from Murray Gold when they were doing the that special concert,
• 49:28
  Yeah. I was like, oh, what, what is
• 49:30
  this? And of course what you needed
• 49:33
  was some visuals attached to it. And when you, when I heard it in
• 49:36
  Ruby Road and then again here. And it's like, it's so cheeky.
• 49:43
  It's very playful. Again, you know.
• 49:45
  Yeah, it's almost harking a bit to Series 5 Matt Smith music in
• 49:51
  being quite a. Little bit.
• 49:53
  Yeah, but it's not as in your face as series five was.
• 49:56
  It's. Yeah, it's Murray.
• 49:57
  Coulton found subtlety in the intervening years.
• 50:01
  Well, yes, and there are snatches of old music.
• 50:03
  You know, I think at the beginning when he mentions
• 50:05
  Gallifrey, you get a snatch the the Gallifrey music.
• 50:08
  And that's the thing. That's what I was worried about
• 50:10
  when Murray Gold first was announced that he was coming
• 50:13
  back because is he really going to bring out all the old tunes
• 50:16
  again? But it's snatches almost like
• 50:18
  it's sort of 1/2 remembered song that you, you know, that's way
• 50:22
  in the past. And so you can only have
• 50:24
  fragments and you know little bits of it.
• 50:27
  So it is, it is like we have just sort of done lots of
• 50:30
  running around, had some Jeopardy bomers and this is the
• 50:33
  end now. But beneath, you know, we've
• 50:36
  talked about a lot that's going on beneath this sort of surface
• 50:39
  level plot that keeps you interested.
• 50:41
  The arc, you know what it's saying about the Doctor being
• 50:46
  the last of the Time Lords, what it's saying about abortion.
• 50:51
  And about storytelling too, is that the, you know, to keep the
• 50:53
  kids occupied, they needed a bogeyman.
• 50:55
  They needed, they were living a sort of a, a fairy tale.
• 50:59
  They were living a storybook, you know?
• 51:02
  Oh, it's great. Now he goes.
• 51:03
  Oh. He's turned into a dog, I think,
• 51:08
  as Eric keeps saying. Oh, you, I'm going to tell him
• 51:11
  what a Naughty Dog oh he is. Oh, you know, the baby that
• 51:15
  goes, I'll pull this string. Yeah, I don't know what it does,
• 51:19
  but I'll pull the string really well.
• 51:21
  That's basically how I live my life, you know?
• 51:24
  I don't know what I'm doing, but I'll just do it, you know?
• 51:28
  Oh, would you say that this ends on a bum note?
• 51:32
  Oh bottom. Do you love The funny thing he
• 51:35
  says? A big pile of shizzle.
• 51:38
  Shizzle. Is that the first time the
• 51:40
  doctor swears? Maybe I could just see all of
• 51:44
  those 50 year olds weeping now. I'm so ageist.
• 51:48
  Honestly, I'm nearly 50 myself, but I'm not there yet.
• 51:52
  OK? I'll be a cynical bastard when I
• 51:54
  hate to hit that decade. Oh my God, surely you saw that
• 51:58
  Looking like a bum there. That big fart coming out?
• 52:02
  Come on. Oh come on, who doesn't like a
• 52:05
  fart gag? What's wrong with you people?
• 52:07
  It's funny. Bum bums are funny.
• 52:10
  Babies are funny. Farts are funny.
• 52:12
  Excuse me, Bums are very serious business.
• 52:14
  Daniel Roxley. All right.
• 52:18
  Oh, sorry. Lifestyle differences.
• 52:20
  Bums are also extremely funny. And then he gives her the TARDIS
• 52:24
  key and I see, I did see people complaining.
• 52:27
  Oh well, it's too soon. And you think, well you, you
• 52:30
  have to remember he's only got 8 episodes so they are going to
• 52:34
  speed a lot of this up. It's probably the same people
• 52:37
  that whinge that it took Martha Jones 8 episodes to get her key.
• 52:41
  Well, quite, yeah. Yeah, it.
• 52:43
  Was just like whinging I think. Isn't it lovely?
• 52:46
  That we're over here in our own little quiet.
• 52:48
  Corner just enjoying Doctor Who. Well, you know, and if you don't
• 52:52
  enjoy it that that's fine. It's I, I would say though it,
• 52:57
  it is nice every now and again to ask yourself, what do you
• 53:00
  want from Doctor Who? What are you expecting when you
• 53:03
  get new Doctor Who? What is, what are you looking
• 53:06
  for? And and try and find something
• 53:09
  you can latch onto, which has always been my thing is there's
• 53:13
  some areas that are more for me and some areas that are less for
• 53:15
  me, but I tend to like them all because I find my way in
• 53:19
  somewhere, you know? Should we both answer that
• 53:22
  brilliant question you just posed then?
• 53:24
  Because for me, I won ATV show that uniquely gives me space
• 53:31
  babies, the devil's cord and boom back-to-back three entirely
• 53:37
  disparate pieces of television that in no way belong in the
• 53:40
  same season together but somehow brilliantly juxtaposed together
• 53:46
  just make this spread of of what's the word?
• 53:50
  I'm looking for diversity. Thank you.
• 53:53
  Variety. Yeah, that just absolutely
• 53:56
  thrills me. I never know what I'm going to
• 53:57
  get next. What are you?
• 54:00
  Oh well. I'll answer that immediately
• 54:02
  after this this bit, because I just wanted to mention this bit
• 54:04
  where he after all that high energy, high sort of high, high
• 54:09
  spirits, high enthusiasm he's given throughout the whole
• 54:11
  episodes. He brings it right down in this
• 54:14
  scene and it's kind of a take off of Father's Day, but again,
• 54:17
  condensed into a single minute, you know?
• 54:20
  But making the right choice this time.
• 54:24
  I mean, was he stupid or what? In Father's Day, don't.
• 54:27
  You can go and see your dad die, but I don't want you to do
• 54:30
  anything about it, all right? But here he says, yeah, he, he,
• 54:34
  he, he says there is that sort of that infinite.
• 54:36
  That's the old, that's the ancient side of the doctor comes
• 54:39
  out a little bit that infinite wisdom where he sort of says to
• 54:42
  her very, very calmly, but also very sort of authoritatively.
• 54:49
  Yeah, I can't. I can't take you back to the
• 54:53
  place you probably want to go to the most.
• 54:54
  You know, it Just these are the rules and if you're going to
• 54:58
  travel with me, that's how it's going to be.
• 55:01
  And I think very cleverly this season, Russell Davis has put in
• 55:07
  about 6 arc elements. Usually there's just the one
• 55:10
  thing right that we're all posing on.
• 55:12
  This year we've got Mrs. Flood, we've got Susan Twist, we've
• 55:15
  got. Ruby's birth.
• 55:19
  That's right. Snow.
• 55:20
  We've got this pantheon of gods and there's literally no way to
• 55:23
  assemble them into one big picture, but they're all sort of
• 55:27
  running. I think that's a really clever
• 55:29
  way of doing it now, of just having so much that you just
• 55:32
  sort of go. You get excited when each thing
• 55:34
  comes up, but let's see where we end up.
• 55:38
  Oh, and I think he's taking maybe a few cues from from
• 55:42
  Steven Moffat, because Steven Moffat has done that in a few of
• 55:45
  his seasons where there are some red herrings in there and you
• 55:48
  think, oh, it must be this. And no, actually it's not.
• 55:50
  It's just something he threw in there to keep you guessing.
• 55:52
  Oh, I thought you meant the. The scanning of her on the
• 55:56
  TARDIS. Well, that is absolutely
• 55:58
  Moffett. Isn't it?
• 55:59
  That's very serious Series 6, isn't it?
• 56:02
  That's fair enough. The fact that we said, you know,
• 56:03
  he's taking bits from Chipnall's time, he's taking bits from
• 56:06
  Moffett's time, things that he's learned along the way are good
• 56:09
  things that they've done. And that's what artists do.
• 56:12
  Is is. What is it?
• 56:13
  They say Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.
• 56:19
  Well. No one's.
• 56:20
  Is it over already? Is anyone imitating you?
• 56:23
  No one's imitating me. I'm not going to do the the
• 56:30
  intro you usually do. Oh.
• 56:32
  Please do. Welcome back.
• 56:34
  To Oh, that's perfect. My God, I quit.
• 56:40
  Glad you're all things taken over.
• 56:42
  I'll get the call to start. Hang on.
• 56:44
  I'm there. When pause I do have a question.
• 56:47
  For you though, before you answer your own question, oh, go
• 56:50
  on, if you still remember your question before you can't
• 56:52
  remember my question, and that is, do you?
• 56:56
  Oh, that's very distracting how the way our paws sat there with
• 56:59
  jigs, monsoon looking demonic. And that is, do you imagine that
• 57:09
  they will romanticize to get whilst Dr. this season?
• 57:13
  And if they do, I can't say he is a gay man in real life.
• 57:19
  Do you think they'll romanticize him with a woman or a man?
• 57:23
  Because I it hasn't happened yet.
• 57:26
  I think it might be with a man. I mean, I just throwing a
• 57:29
  prediction out there, but that very pretty man in what is it
• 57:34
  the Regency one they're doing? Road.
• 57:36
  Yeah, because they're on the cover of.
• 57:40
  Yeah, D yeah, D yeah, looking very dashing.
• 57:43
  So yeah. And I, I think given, yeah,
• 57:46
  shooties background, I think they would be insane not to do
• 57:50
  that. You know, lean into that if you
• 57:52
  if, if that's what they're going for, of course, you know.
• 57:55
  And I thought. It was really bold and chippers
• 57:56
  time to do it with Jodie and Mandip to just suggest to put in
• 58:01
  a bit of a freesort, you know, and have her.
• 58:04
  In a in an all women TARDIS team.
• 58:05
  For a little while I thought that was super bold.
• 58:08
  Well, maybe if if Chibs has sort of planted the seed, maybe
• 58:12
  Russell U Davies is going to, you know, grow the tree as it
• 58:15
  were. You know, No, I mean whatever
• 58:21
  that means. But it will certainly be
• 58:24
  interesting to see it play out because I imagine I've seen him
• 58:26
  in sex education and he can, he can do romance very
• 58:31
  definitively. Well, can't now.
• 58:33
  Did you to answer your own question?
• 58:35
  Oh yeah. What was it?
• 58:36
  What am I? What do I want from Doctor Who?
• 58:38
  What do I expect from Doctor? What am I looking for?
• 58:41
  Well, just fun, really. I mean that.
• 58:47
  That's the thing as I think as fans, we do get a little too
• 58:50
  bogged down in series arcs and and sort of, you know, episodes
• 58:57
  spanning character development, sort of world building and all
• 59:02
  kinds of things. And I mean, of course that is
• 59:04
  kind of the show's fault because that they do gear it towards
• 59:08
  that as well. They kind of encourage that they
• 59:09
  wanting they want fans to join in the discussion.
• 59:13
  But I think, you know, getting too bogged down in continuity as
• 59:17
  a fan I think is let alone the show, but I think as a fan is
• 59:22
  just just just sort of kick back and enjoy it.
• 59:25
  And then you can sort of pick over the bones afterwards, you
• 59:29
  know? Always say to people, do you
• 59:31
  want it not to be here? Because that does feel like the
• 59:34
  case sometimes. I yes, I do think there is a
• 59:37
  certain strata of fan not naming any names, but who?
• 59:42
  Who. I think, yeah, they're so
• 59:44
  consumed with the cancellation anxiety that I think they're
• 59:47
  actually fantasizing for it to happen.
• 59:49
  And then you know what will happen then is it'll get
• 59:51
  cancelled one day. Of course it will.
• 59:52
  It won't go on forever and ever. There will be a break at some
• 59:56
  point, I absolutely guarantee it.
• 59:59
  Sorry anyone that's just had a heart attack, but those.
• 1:00:04
  People then will be so angry, they're angry.
• 1:00:07
  About it now, but they'll be. Incandescent with rage when it's
• 1:00:11
  cancelled. Oh well, Doctor Who fans,
• 1:00:13
  they're never happy, are they? It's the paradox of a Doctor Who
• 1:00:18
  fan. Daniel, we have a great task now
• 1:00:22
  to try and convince the hamster community three fabulous reasons
• 1:00:28
  why we would recommend space babies to them.
• 1:00:31
  To go and watch it immediately, above all other Doctor Who.
• 1:00:34
  Off you go. Oh.
• 1:00:35
  OK, well I'm not going to hug the Doctor and the companion to
• 1:00:40
  myself this time, so I'm just. Going to say.
• 1:00:43
  I'm just going to say the pairing between Shooti Gatwa and
• 1:00:47
  Millie Gibson again, I said it's like a couple of kids.
• 1:00:51
  And that's what I want. That is what I want from this
• 1:00:53
  season, is they're two sort of. Yeah, brother and sister or Big
• 1:00:57
  Brother, little sister or little or big sister, little brother,
• 1:01:01
  depends on, you know, how the dynamic goes.
• 1:01:04
  But yeah, they just sort of they they, they just click together.
• 1:01:07
  It's just that it's that sort of Catherine Tate, David Tennant
• 1:01:10
  thing or, you know, I'm sure there's a few others I can think
• 1:01:13
  of. Actually.
• 1:01:14
  We actually a bit of Patrick Troughton, Wendy Padbury and
• 1:01:19
  maybe Jamie kind of thing from season six.
• 1:01:21
  Actually, there is that because we we've we've seen shooty gout
• 1:01:25
  would be a bit sort of the scaredy cat doctor as well.
• 1:01:28
  He runs away or you know, he's not afraid of crying either, but
• 1:01:32
  that's very Troughton actually, I find you know, so I think the
• 1:01:36
  these two, you know, just make sure they have as many scenes
• 1:01:41
  together because they're just I mean, they're great on their
• 1:01:43
  own, but they're and they're just wonderful together.
• 1:01:46
  Do. You know, I did actually send
• 1:01:49
  you a message I think about a week ago saying I'm thinking of
• 1:01:52
  coming to France next year. I've got a feeling, you know,
• 1:01:55
  when you and me meet up, we're going to have the same sort of
• 1:01:57
  chemistry. We're going to go off and excite
• 1:01:59
  adventures wherever you live. We're going to be just as
• 1:02:02
  excitable as the doctor and Ruby.
• 1:02:03
  Just you say. Well, as long as we can sing.
• 1:02:08
  Oh, I don't think you can almost guarantee it.
• 1:02:11
  Well, I think that this is a script that is very far more
• 1:02:17
  sophisticated than people give it credit for.
• 1:02:20
  And I think there is that anti pro-life slant to it and
• 1:02:26
  parental abandonment to it and, you know, leaning into, you
• 1:02:30
  know, adoption and what that means and identity and all of
• 1:02:34
  that. All of those really interesting
• 1:02:36
  things that are going on, but it does also have space for the
• 1:02:41
  most fuckable ass you're ever going to see.
• 1:02:43
  In. A Doctor Who episode and so that
• 1:02:46
  is my first thing. Shuji Gatwa's posterior which I
• 1:02:50
  think is is the second best posterior in the episode after
• 1:02:55
  the space station. Which is the best visual.
• 1:02:58
  Gag you're ever going to see in Doctor Who that's upset so many
• 1:03:01
  people. OK, the second one, the babies,
• 1:03:08
  I mean, I don't, I'm not especially a fan of babies.
• 1:03:11
  I don't. I don't really plan on having
• 1:03:13
  kids anytime soon that I know of, but they're, you know, it's
• 1:03:20
  just you. How can you not melt when
• 1:03:22
  they're they're just so cute. I think Eric is very, very funny
• 1:03:25
  where he says at the end, you know, I love you Ruby.
• 1:03:30
  And he and he has he still has that sort of very kind of
• 1:03:33
  slightly confused look on his face and and yeah.
• 1:03:37
  And just the doctors sort of little heart to heart with
• 1:03:40
  Poppy. And, you know, he gives her a
• 1:03:41
  hug because she's never had one. And yeah.
• 1:03:44
  And that again, I go back to that line is nobody grows up
• 1:03:47
  wrong. I think, you know, for imagine
• 1:03:49
  if you're a kid or, or or not a kid, a Disney, a Disney kid or
• 1:03:53
  someone who grew up watching Disney.
• 1:03:55
  And then you have this, this new show and this his character
• 1:03:59
  tells you, you know, nobody grows up wrong.
• 1:04:01
  So, and that's such a broad statement.
• 1:04:03
  You could apply it to to any facet of your identity.
• 1:04:07
  So it's, I think it's a very lovely message to to give
• 1:04:12
  viewers, new viewers and also old viewers too, who probably
• 1:04:15
  who made viewers who maybe not still not comfortable with
• 1:04:18
  themselves even all these years later, you know, even after
• 1:04:21
  finding Doctor Who, you know, it's good to have those
• 1:04:24
  reminders in there too, I think. There really are, there really
• 1:04:28
  are some nuances to this, aren't there?
• 1:04:29
  But I think a lot of people are dismissing and also your
• 1:04:34
  observation earlier that Eric does have a doctor in distress
• 1:04:41
  creator. Oh, every every day.
• 1:04:46
  Every day. Joe fandom is being torn apart.
• 1:04:49
  It's terrible. I was just waiting for the bit
• 1:04:52
  where Eric would go. It is completely impossible for
• 1:04:55
  them to find any more missing episodes because I found them
• 1:04:59
  all. What's that you found?
• 1:05:02
  The chase episode? I'm sorry, The Crusade episode
• 1:05:04
  one. Bless him, I.
• 1:05:06
  I think this this particular fan was not a fan of space babies.
• 1:05:11
  I think those feelings were made abundantly clear.
• 1:05:15
  Jesus Christ, I hear the caps log on.
• 1:05:18
  His keyboard no longer functions.
• 1:05:21
  Well, I was wondering if it's maybe that line because I think
• 1:05:24
  there's a line to the halfway through where the doctor says
• 1:05:27
  because they're wondering where Eric's gone.
• 1:05:29
  And he says, well, if I were space baby, I'd have to change
• 1:05:32
  my nappy. And just the doctor saying I I'd
• 1:05:36
  have to change my nappy is probably incensed a whole a
• 1:05:39
  whole bunch of certain Doctor Who fans.
• 1:05:42
  Yeah, and that's just your start pretending this one Jesus
• 1:05:45
  Christ. Oh man, I mean well, I just
• 1:05:48
  would like to say just one last point on this is that should you
• 1:05:51
  wish to do any further episodes of hams of a blood pen knife, I
• 1:05:55
  shall require ID your full address.
• 1:05:59
  OK. And if you you need to swear
• 1:06:01
  your allegiance and life to me before you do one more 2nd of
• 1:06:06
  this podcast. Oh, and if I don't, what are you
• 1:06:08
  going to do? Send the boys round.
• 1:06:13
  No, I would ask you to put on some rugby shorts and OK, we
• 1:06:17
  better move on. Oh, it's too refused.
• 1:06:23
  What a rugby shorts. No, no, no.
• 1:06:27
  I don't wear own rugby shorts, although he has asked me.
• 1:06:29
  But Oh no, hang on quick, will you move us on?
• 1:06:31
  You see me? I think it was you was I told, I
• 1:06:35
  told, I told about the babies, the the space babies.
• 1:06:37
  Sorry I. Don't know where we are right
• 1:06:38
  now. I feel we may have got married
• 1:06:40
  and divorced. Since we started this episode.
• 1:06:43
  Oh, you can be my space baby anytime, Joe.
• 1:06:47
  So I promise. Actually, have you seen those
• 1:06:51
  people that dress up like babies?
• 1:06:54
  Oh no, you know, for for kinks. Oh, well, whatever in the mouth.
• 1:06:59
  I'm not. Going to kink shame.
• 1:07:01
  No, I mean, I'm not either, but it's OK, let's move on.
• 1:07:07
  I would like to highlight the Bogeyman, the fabulous design
• 1:07:12
  and in particular the CGI enhancements, because after
• 1:07:15
  watching Doctor Who Unleashed and seeing that poor man's face
• 1:07:18
  inside that costume. He's going hello, just shoot
• 1:07:22
  your cat one. And he's like, oh, you're
• 1:07:23
  hideous. It's so funny.
• 1:07:25
  You're literally is awed in its mouth.
• 1:07:30
  Gorgeous, absolutely gorgeous slavering snot.
• 1:07:33
  Huge teeth, you know, every bit the bogeyman of your nightmares.
• 1:07:38
  I think actually they have a they have a moment where in when
• 1:07:41
  they save Eric and they're sort of they're hiding against the
• 1:07:44
  wall and trying to keep Eric quiet because the bogey band's
• 1:07:47
  just around the corner. And that's quite, that's quite
• 1:07:50
  alien. That like the film Alien, like
• 1:07:52
  the the horror movie Alien, where there's some sort of
• 1:07:55
  certain angles where they're really trying to emphasize how
• 1:07:57
  monstrous it is. And of course, you know, as we
• 1:08:00
  find out. You can see why people were
• 1:08:03
  expecting a horror movie, right? I can.
• 1:08:07
  Start to see where the frustration came in.
• 1:08:09
  Anyway, back to you. Well, I think it's my last one
• 1:08:13
  so. Not ever.
• 1:08:14
  I hope. I hope I know back.
• 1:08:19
  We need to I think what we need to do is to reclaim the idea of
• 1:08:24
  the 3.3 star episode. Now, I don't necessarily believe
• 1:08:29
  space babies is a three star episode because I I love it more
• 1:08:32
  than that. I think.
• 1:08:33
  But but as it as it though it works as a very sort of
• 1:08:38
  functional, simple, slight, but you know, very entertaining and
• 1:08:42
  very fun episode of Doctor Who and Doctor Who's full of those.
• 1:08:47
  But we always tend to go for the dramatic ones or the important
• 1:08:51
  ones or the ones that are going to change the Canon of Doctor
• 1:08:54
  Who forever. And, you know, you need to, you
• 1:08:58
  need to have a bit of fun in your life and just sort of
• 1:09:01
  spend, spend a bit more time with, you know, not everything
• 1:09:05
  has to be a gourmet meal. You can have that cheeseburger
• 1:09:08
  every now and again, and that can be just as satisfying, you
• 1:09:11
  know? Are you listening to this man,
• 1:09:13
  Daniel Rossi? All right, You people need to
• 1:09:15
  have more fun in your lives, OK? I I love the fact you're dishing
• 1:09:20
  out live advice on this. Well, and I also think this is
• 1:09:23
  not new from Russell T Davies. He's done all, I think all of
• 1:09:27
  his openers from his first his first go round were, you know,
• 1:09:32
  the light run around. You know, that does have
• 1:09:34
  something to say. And there's a lot of subtext
• 1:09:37
  going on under all that sort of frivolity.
• 1:09:40
  But but yeah, it's too. It's a way to ease you into the
• 1:09:43
  season, to get you used to the new Doctor companion dynamic
• 1:09:48
  and, yeah, and just to sort of get you in a good mood for the
• 1:09:51
  rest, you know, and that's what you want.
• 1:09:54
  Trouble is you just put loads of people in a bad mood and you and
• 1:09:56
  me in a good mood, so I think that means we're winning.
• 1:10:00
  Well, I, I am going to quote, well, I'll quote two things.
• 1:10:04
  I'll quote the the great Tom Baker, who Once Upon a time
• 1:10:08
  said, well, there's no point being grown up if you can't be
• 1:10:11
  childish sometimes. And then I also quote, and then
• 1:10:16
  this is I, I can't remember who, who said this.
• 1:10:19
  So if, if you do recognize yourself in, in this statement,
• 1:10:22
  please get in touch. But, you know, if you don't like
• 1:10:27
  what Doctor Who's doing right now, just wait 5 minutes.
• 1:10:31
  It's like Scottish rain. It'll change.
• 1:10:33
  It'll, it'll come. Something good will come along
• 1:10:36
  that you'll like that you'll get into.
• 1:10:38
  So, you know, maybe, OK, you don't like Space babies.
• 1:10:42
  So give it a few episodes. And when they really, really
• 1:10:45
  starts cracking out the drama and the heartbreak and all the,
• 1:10:50
  you know, gloom and doom, go back and watch Space Babies and
• 1:10:54
  sort of see how you like it then.
• 1:10:56
  I mean, the last episode of this season is called Empire of
• 1:10:59
  Death. You know, like enjoy the the
• 1:11:03
  frivolity while it's there. Well, to quote the great Jon
• 1:11:08
  Pertwee's Third Doctor, what's wrong with being childish?
• 1:11:12
  I like being childish. My third thing is it's not even
• 1:11:17
  just the childishness. It's the, I've heard it
• 1:11:20
  described as pure nature of the story because I just think that
• 1:11:29
  there is space to be pure all, you know, and do a little bit of
• 1:11:33
  undergraduate humor that is about farting and snots and
• 1:11:38
  things like that. Like not every joke has to be,
• 1:11:41
  you know, working on 15 levels. Sometimes.
• 1:11:43
  Sometimes we can just be silly. Well, this is probably the wrong
• 1:11:49
  time for me to confess then, that I I'm probably the only one
• 1:11:53
  who laughed at the Wi-Fi family in resolution.
• 1:11:55
  Oh, I love it. I mean, it's ghastly, but it
• 1:11:58
  makes me laugh every time. And then I also laughed at the
• 1:12:02
  TomTom joke in the quiz in Horror.
• 1:12:06
  Do you know, I always thought you were a very sophisticated.
• 1:12:08
  Man, well, sometimes the Dumber a joke is, the funnier it can
• 1:12:12
  be. Oh, that Wi-Fi joke.
• 1:12:17
  The look on that woman's face, like a slapped arse, it's just
• 1:12:23
  oh God. And I've got a 52 inch telly.
• 1:12:25
  Can you imagine that face on a 52 inch telly?
• 1:12:27
  So do you mean we'll just have to have conversation?
• 1:12:33
  Of what? But you know, like the the the
• 1:12:37
  far at the end of this. I'm going to keep saying far
• 1:12:40
  because it's just going to annoy people because.
• 1:12:41
  It's funny to say. It's great to say the.
• 1:12:45
  Far at the end of this it's literally the payouts of the
• 1:12:48
  whole episode. Space babies, bogeyman and kids
• 1:12:52
  like it's. Almost like it's not a thematic
• 1:12:55
  resolute, it's a conceptual resolution to this episode, you
• 1:13:00
  know, And there's the ridiculous show that we haven't seen the
• 1:13:03
  back end of that space station that looks like a bloody arse, I
• 1:13:07
  mean. People should be laughing at
• 1:13:10
  this. If if don't feel angry about it.
• 1:13:14
  If only for, you know, just imagining the amount of of hours
• 1:13:18
  it must have taken all those visual effects people to make it
• 1:13:21
  to shape it like a giant ass. So maybe I'll, I won't make it
• 1:13:26
  the pure our nature of the story because I'm celebrating that.
• 1:13:29
  I'm just going to say my third thing is my sheer joy at the
• 1:13:33
  fury that people suffered because they they don't have.
• 1:13:40
  A simple enough sense of humour to enjoy a fart gag.
• 1:13:44
  Don't they have a German name for that Schadenfreude or
• 1:13:48
  something? What is that?
• 1:13:49
  What is that exactly what I just described?
• 1:13:50
  It's taking Glee in the suffering of others.
• 1:13:55
  Always. No, I think it's really a very
• 1:13:59
  funny punchline to the episode. And yeah, I'm not going to
• 1:14:04
  explain it any more than that. It's very funny.
• 1:14:06
  And it's silly and I love it. Wow, Daniel, I have to ask you.
• 1:14:14
  I don't actually know the answer to the question, so perhaps you
• 1:14:17
  could enlighten me. Where are we going next?
• 1:14:21
  Well, you tell me, Joe Ford, backwards or forwards in time,
• 1:14:27
  Where do you want to go? Oh, well done.
• 1:14:29
  Well done. Do you want to come with me?
• 1:14:35
  Did we decide? We decided.
• 1:14:36
  Beyond this, we did, I think what we we got so excited by
• 1:14:39
  this new exciting series of Doctor Who that we're like, Oh
• 1:14:42
  well, the old stuff can wait. Let's go and let's get into the
• 1:14:44
  new guy. Sorry that came out wrong.
• 1:14:47
  No, please. Any day you go over there and
• 1:14:52
  read a book. All right, I'm back in a minute.
• 1:14:54
  No. What did we decide then?
• 1:14:56
  So we are going back to, well, when the Doctor had a
• 1:15:02
  granddaughter, which she's brought up once before in this
• 1:15:05
  season and talking about all things big and small, not space
• 1:15:11
  babies this time, but giants and the planet that they're on,
• 1:15:18
  planets of giants. You were as obscure as long as
• 1:15:22
  possible then, weren't you? I'm going What?
• 1:15:24
  What if we agreed? What's he talking about?
• 1:15:26
  Right. Oh fabulous.
• 1:15:29
  Yes, I do remember I was mentioning that in our Rose
• 1:15:31
  commentary. That's right.
• 1:15:33
  Planet and the Giants. So see season 2 episode one.
• 1:15:38
  Again, a very kind of oddball concept to open up a season.
• 1:15:42
  You know, you would think, oh, let's open it up with, you know,
• 1:15:45
  the Dalek invasion of Earth with all those people dying and that
• 1:15:48
  ruined world. No, let's open it up with, you
• 1:15:52
  know, shrunk down to the size of an inch and all those bugs and,
• 1:15:57
  well, and also there's some sort of intrigue about an
• 1:16:01
  insecticide. Never mind all that.
• 1:16:04
  That enormous earthworm, that big fly, that huge knight
• 1:16:09
  scented stock, a fabulous match matchbox, the enormous phone.
• 1:16:15
  Can you? I love the way heart all fluffs
• 1:16:21
  the line as well. We've been shrugged down to just
• 1:16:23
  above the size of them. Have an inch.
• 1:16:27
  Bless him. You know I don't wish to cast
• 1:16:30
  any aspersions on your character, but you have got a
• 1:16:32
  thing about an opening, haven't you?
• 1:16:34
  We've done rows. We've done what's this called
• 1:16:38
  Space Babies and now Planet of the Giants.
• 1:16:42
  Yeah, we should. We should go to an ending too.
• 1:16:45
  An ending or. Climax.
• 1:16:47
  Somewhere in the middle. This has been the rudest hamster
• 1:16:52
  commentary in years, I'm telling you.
• 1:16:55
  I won't. I won't make any fart noises.
• 1:16:57
  Oh please do. Oh, spare the audience.
• 1:16:59
  No Planet of the Giants. A fabulous choice, a wonderful
• 1:17:03
  commentator. I can't wait.
• 1:17:05
  Thank you very much for your time today.
• 1:17:07
  It has been a absolute delight. Thanks for having me on again,
• 1:17:12
  space babies. Space babies, I've got it there.