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Sid Bream's Remarkable Journey · Pittsburgh Sports Memories

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_02: Hi everybody, welcome to the Pittsburgh Sports Memories Podcast.
• 0:03
  SPEAKER_02: My name is Tim Hannon.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_02: This week we sit down and talk with Sid Bream.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_02: And I can't think of anybody in the history of Pittsburgh Sports whose name evokes as much good memories and bad memories as as Sid Bream does.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_02: That moment when he crossed home plate as a member of the Braves is obviously a painful memory for many of us who who are Pirates fans.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_02: We get into the series of events with Sid that led him to leave Pittsburgh, and it really is a story that that I think people need to understand because it proves the mantra that you reap what you sow.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_02: The Pirates really did him wrong and they paid a huge price for it.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_02: And we all paid a huge price as fans as well.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_02: That being said, it was really cool to hear how that play in 1992 gave him a platform that he otherwise wouldn't have had.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_02: And it just goes to show that sometimes something that didn't go maybe the way you or me wanted it to can serve a bigger purpose.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_02: So here's our interview with Sid Bree, and we really hope you enjoy listening to this as much as we enjoyed doing it.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks so much for joining us.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_02: Lots that we want to ask you about.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_02: But first, please tell us what are you up to these days in your post-baseball life?
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_00: Well, uh, you know, not for one, we're still doing quite a bit of speaking.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, the month of March, the month of April, the month of May are going to be very, very busy for me.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_00: Uh at the same time for the last going a little over 10 years now, I've been a I've been a uh chaplain at a trucking company over in Alaquippa.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_00: I mean PGT trucking.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, you know, that is one of those that uh, you know, as I say to people, I said, um when Mr.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: Gallagher, the owner of PGT, asked me to do that, I looked at him and said, Nope, I'm not a chaplain, don't want to be a chaplain, don't think God's called me to be a chaplain.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_00: But it has been a an absolutely wonderful uh thing for me to be able to be there to help individuals get through storms of life.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's been 10 years and who knows how long it'll go on, but then at the same time, another thing is I have five grandchildren going on six, and right after this podcast, I'll be uh having three of them in my house, and so uh, you know, looking forward to being with my grandkids as well.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_02: Very cool.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_02: Did not know that you were a chaplain.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_02: That's um I I I know one of the things I want to talk about a little bit as we get into this is I know you're very passionate about your faith, and it's it's always funny how um God calls us to do things that we never thought we could do, isn't it?
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I think if you look back through scripture, that happened an awful lot.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, he called people that had no clue what they were doing, but he said he equipped them for what they were doing and and uh gave them the power to be able to do it.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_02: For sure, for sure.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_02: Um I I I want to dig into some of the details about your time with the pirates and and your time after the pirates in baseball.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_02: But but before we get to uh to to all that, can you tell us a little bit about your aspirations growing up?
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_02: Did you did you always want to play baseball?
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_02: I think you played basketball too, is that correct?
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_00: I uh I mean, going well, let me just say I I mean baseball, um I always had tremendous success in baseball.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, from the time that I started, you know, pony league baseball to little league baseball, uh always had a tremendous success.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, to the place that, you know, a lot of times I go out and share that uh my coach when I was 12 years old for Little League, he said that anybody that hits a home run in an 11-game season will get a half gallon of ice cream or 25 home runs later.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, he just gave me a check.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_00: So um, and so that's the way things started with me as far as baseball was concerned.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_00: Had great success up through teener ball and legion baseball and high school baseball, and and uh but I also played basketball.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, as you stated, and and you know, I was a white boy that was six foot four, was a point point guard that could jump.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_00: And um, you know, I had I actually had more offers out of high school for basketball than I did for baseball to go to college, and and um but baseball was my love, and um, you know, it it went well for me.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_02: So you so you owe your baseball career to a love of ice cream, is what you're saying?
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_00: Oh well, he just he just gave me a check, so at that point in time I just had money.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_02: Um so so let's uh let's go back to 1985 because I think at that point you're with the Dodgers, and it was reported at the time you kind of wanted out of LA.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_02: So the Dodgers deal you to the Pittsburgh Pirates, who, you know, as as those of us who are old enough to remember, at that time, 1985, one of the worst seasons probably in franchise history, and the Pirates are at the center of these notorious drug trials that that Major League Baseball is having.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_02: At the same time, you're from Carlisle, PA.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_02: So what was your reaction when you learned you were headed to Pittsburgh?
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_00: Well, first off, I mean, I don't know how much I was, I think maybe my attorneys, my agents, were saying something behind the scenes.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know how much I was verbally speaking up at that point in time to get out of LA.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I knew that I was behind Greg Brock that Tommy Lazorda loved, and I also knew that Al Campana's the general manager for the uh Los Angeles Dodgers loved Franklin Stubbs that was coming right behind me.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: So I knew that my chances of humanly speaking to be with the the Dodgers were slim.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_00: And um so I knew that I mean I needed to get out of LA in order to do anything with my career, but um, you know, coming over to Pittsburgh, I mean, it was one of those that at that time I really wasn't thinking about, you know, the whole aspect of what was going on at the drugs, and they were the worst team in baseball.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_00: My goal was to get to the major leagues, and and if it was going to come through the Pittsburgh Pirates, then uh it was gonna come through the Pittsburgh Pirates, and and it was bringing me home.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that was a nice thing.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_00: It was bringing me home to my state, and and uh, you know, so when it when it happened, obviously I was uh exuberant and uh looking forward to the opportunity.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_02: So so when you when you arrive in Pittsburgh, Chuck Tanner's still the manager, and he's actually quoted as saying that you're gonna be a backup because there's no way you you'd ever play over Jason Thompson at first base.
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_02: And by the start of the next season, Chuck Tanner's gone, Jason Thompson's gone, and the Pirates hired this guy named Jim Leland to manage the team.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_02: Did that did that change the trajectory for your career in Pittsburgh?
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_02: And do you think I knew you hadn't been there very long at that point, but do you think it altered the culture of the team as well, bringing in Leland?
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I I think that bringing in Leland, getting rid of Chuck Tanner, I think was a move that the new management they were they were wanting to bring in and just start anew, afresh.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, you know, in all reality, Jason Thompson and spring training had a better spring training than I did.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and so he really and truly deserved to be playing that uh in 1986, but because they were going with a youth movement, uh, it gave me the opportunity to uh you know to be there.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_00: They got rid of Jason, they'd send him up to Montreal, and and uh it gave me the opportunity to start to play in uh Pittsburgh, and and I I'm eternally grateful for that.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_02: So so you talked about the youth movement, and and that's kind of what's happening at that time.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_02: The the pirates are acquiring all these guys over that those couple of seasons.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_02: There's you, Doug Drabock, Bobby Bonia, Andy Van Syke.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_02: Was was there a certain point where you're in there, you're with all these other kind of newer, younger guys?
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_02: Was there a point where you felt like maybe this is a championship caliber ball club?
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_00: I knew that we I knew, Tim, that we were consistently getting better each and every year.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I know Sid Trift with the long help with Jim Lee, and I know that they were they were doing a great job of filling in the holes that we needed from year to year.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, you know, like you said, with bringing in Andy Van Sleep, bringing in Jay Bell, bringing in Baba Benia, you know, Barry Bonds, uh, you know, but every year, every year they just they took a great assessment of what the Pittsburgh Pirates needed in order to to uh keep making themselves better.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_00: And and um, you know, by 1988, uh we felt as though, man, we could compete.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, we were we were competing and and we had we were right there with the Mets going into August and and uh only one game back and and and then we fell off and then 1989 started and and we had major injuries to myself and Lavallier and you know hurt and but we we knew that we knew that we could compete at that point in time for sure.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_02: Who were your who were your like buddies on the team?
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_02: I I think you and Doug Drayback were pretty close.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_02: Correct?
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_00: Doug and Doug and I, I mean, my wife and his wife, uh, along with our our kids, we were extremely close in regards to uh you know just being together family-wise.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, we were actually they we were literally, they asked us to be godparents to their kids.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_00: And so uh, you know, Michelle and I were uh you know very close to the Draybex.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, um, you know, other than that, I mean, I can't really sit here and say that I just spent an awful lot of time with any of the players.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, uh, I enjoyed their company, I enjoyed being with them when we had the opportunities, but I'm not gonna sit here and say that that we were best buddies like the the young man that I grew up with, Jack Adams.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_00: Uh we we were best buddies.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I can't say that we were anybody on the team was like that to me with the Pittsburgh Pirates.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_02: You um you you you mentioned Barry Bonds.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_02: Uh obviously, you know, Barry amazingly talented baseball player, also you know, a guy who rubbed some of his teammates the wrong way over the years.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_02: What what was your relationship with with Barry Lake?
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I mean, again, I I state it this way, and I and and again, Barry Bonds, as far as talent-wise, I mean, probably one of the greatest players that I've ever seen with the talent that God gave him.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, just a phenomenal, phenomenal athlete.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_00: And I and I share, I share it like this.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, when you have a dad, and and his dad was a tremendous ball player, but when you have a dad that, I mean, is a 40-40 man and and uh does the thing, did the things that he did, and yet he got traded seven years or seven times in his career.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it it only comes down to the fact that maybe he was a little bit of a negative in the clubhouse, and and Barry grew up with that.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_00: And um, you know, I I don't put any of that other than the fact that you have to take your own responsibility.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: But Barry, you know, again, Barry just threw out his opinions and and didn't really care about who he was hurting and what he was doing, but I loved him.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I I appreciated him being on our team and and um I'm thankful for him.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_00: And uh I'm I'm grateful for all his success.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_02: When when you were playing for the Pirates, were there any pitchers who you dreaded facing?
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_01: All of them.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_02: So so and then the the flip side of that question, were there any pitchers who maybe other players feared but you you felt like you had success against?
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_00: I there were there were some pitchers, I mean, at uh Dwight Gooden, you know, I I think I hit in close to 350 off of Dwight Gooden.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_00: Uh you know, Kevin Gross from Philadelphia, I think I could go up to the plate blindfolded and and still get a hit off of him.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, that I think early in my career, I mean, I was a I was a fastball hitter, and anybody that was willing to get the fastball up air, uh, I was gonna have success with.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, the ones that I didn't have success with early in my career were junk ballers, truthfully, guys that couldn't throw their way out of a wet paper bag.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_00: And um and I think the reason for that is I was so pool conscious that they would throw little sinkers, a lot of all-speed stuff, never give me anything over the middle of the plate or the heart of the plate, and and um, you know, I'd roll my hands over, hit double plays.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I remember Tom Pagnos Nazi for the uh St.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_00: Louis Cardinals.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_00: Every time I'd come up with a guy on first base, he'd he'd walk out in front of the uh walk out in front of the plate and just holler to his team, great double play guy right here, great double play guy.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_00: But hey, I mean, you know, until you learned, um until I learned, I mean, you know, what I needed to do with those individuals, I mean, he was being truthful.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I would roll my hands over an awful lot, and uh I would uh be the be uh a great double playman.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_00: So he what he said was truthful, but I learned to hit the the uh I heard I learned to hit the junk ballers by not uh trying to pull the ball but trying to go to the other way, the gaps, and uh it really became a uh a great success for me.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_02: Were were there any other guys that even after you learned all those kind of lessons, were there still guys that kind of gave you heartburn whenever you came up to against them?
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_00: You know, Bobby Ojida uh, you know, couldn't throw his way out of a wet paper bag, but I mean I couldn't get a hit off of him.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_00: Dave Draveki um was an individual that threw me straight fastballs underneath my elbows, and he threw me the cutter, and I think I got one hit off of him in my career with a it was a broken bat single up the middle.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, there was a lot of, I mean, I, you know, again, what did I my average was 262.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_00: Today I would take that in a heartbeat and be making, you know, 15 million dollars a year.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um but um but at the same time, 262 meant that there were some pitchers that gave me a lot.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I just I was a streaky hitter.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, uh, as I look back over my career and back over tapes and so on and so forth that I was able to receive from the Pirates, I mean, I would sit there and and watch, and my average would be 323, you know, in the season.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_00: And and the next time, I mean, as soon as I started to watch it, I mean, I couldn't get a hit on on the on my videos.
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_00: I couldn't see myself getting any hits.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_00: And so it went back down, and then the next time, you know, there was a break in the action, and I'd come back up and I'd be hitting over 300 again.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_00: I'm saying, where were the hits?
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_00: Why can't I see some of my hits?
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_00: And and uh so I was a very, very streaky hitter.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_00: When things were going good, things were going good, and when things were going bad, man, I just I couldn't I couldn't buy a hit.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_03: Any any any legendary pitchers you you like remember batting it's like no like I'm assuming you face Nolan Ryan at some point.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_00: I got my second hit off of Nolan Ryan.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, uh, you know, that was I got my first hit off of of uh oh what's his name from from Cincinnati that that drove in Cecil Wesby from third base with the Dodgers, but my second hit uh was off of Nolan Ryan.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_00: Um I hit a a line drive to left center field, scored Mike Marshall, and uh I don't know what else happened to me after that, but at the same time I got I got at least one hit off of Nolan.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_00: Mike Scott.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_03: Mike Scott Oh, yeah, I forgot about him.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, he was man.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, early on, I just I just owned him.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_00: And and guys were coming up to me and saying, How in the world are you hitting this guy?
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, and and I think that you know, one of the times I looked, I I sat there and watched some of his pitches and saw how much they moved.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_00: And uh with his with his you know uh he split finger, yeah.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_03: He threw the split finger, yeah.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_00: Well, he he also put up the ball really good, too.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_03: Wow, things you can't do today, huh?
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_00: So, but you know, I there were a lot of individuals, I mean, a lot of top guys that I mean I had some success with, uh quite a bit of success with.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, uh Martinez from Montreal had success off of him.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but um, but there were also guys that I mean, shoot at times I mean I couldn't buy a hit.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you mentioned Dave Drevecki being one of those guys, if if again, if folks don't remember him, he really amazing story.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_02: He actually had to have his pitching arm amputated because of cancer.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_02: And um yeah, go look up his story if if you if you've never heard of him.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_02: It's a it's a really inspirational story.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it's kind of sad.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_03: He comes all the way back from the cancer and then he gets hurt again, and that was kind of the end of his career.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's it.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_00: It was a difficult thing, but I mean, you know, God got him through it, and it was uh he got had some neat testimonies to it all, and a lot of people were uplifted because of his words in his book.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_02: Himself, like yourself, is is also very passionate about his faith.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_02: And and as as you're, you know, going back to that topic, you're a professional ball player in this world where I imagine there's a ton of temptations, right?
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_02: Um to to to you're married at the time, too.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_02: You are you have a family at the time.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_02: What what was it like trying to um uh live out your faith in that in that world of baseball?
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_00: Just like anybody else, Tim.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, in all reality, just like anybody else, yes, we were in the spotlight, uh, so on and so forth, but every everybody, everybody in this nation, everybody in this world goes through the same things, maybe not in the same way, but they they have their opportunities to fall, they have their opportunities to stand strong.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, you know, it's just maybe in baseball, in sports, it's a little bit more magnified because of you're out there.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, you know, so everybody has that opportunity every day.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_00: Am I gonna be strong or am I gonna let myself go?
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_02: That's that's a good reminder for all of us, for sure.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_02: Um you talked about yeah, 1988, you guys had that great season, you you almost caught the Mets, didn't quite get there, but things really look up.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_02: And then you talked about the following season ends up being a disappointing one for for the team, but also for you personally, because um you you had battled through through injuries and I and then you eventually had to have season ending season-ending surgery on your knee, correct?
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_02: Was that was how difficult was that after you know it's it's like this progressive increase, you know, a little better in 87, a little better in 88, 89's gonna be the year, and then the it doesn't work out.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_02: What did that feel like?
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I mean, for me personally, I mean, obviously uh knowing that I had to go through surgeries, and and the reason that I probably didn't get the the reason that I probably didn't get the ACL surgery to begin with was the fact that uh um back in back when I was in between 10th and 11th grade, I had a guy in Legion Baseball take my knee out when I was stretching for a double play ball.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_00: And the trainer back then, I mean, he he messed with my knee a little bit and said, Oh, you just strained it.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_00: Well, in 1987, when I tweaked it, hitting first base bag, running down to first base, they did an MRI and found out that I didn't have uh an ACL in that thing for quite some time and uh and so they thought well shoot if your leg's that strong for for um you know it you adapted with your your leg strength I mean maybe you can do the same thing with your right leg and so after a month after they cleaned up my ACL cleaned up my meniscus they sent me back out there with tape jobs and so on and so forth and and then at that point in time I had a play at home plate with uh Craig Vigio that I was out by 15 feet but I tried to plant with my right leg in order to change directions to maybe try to do a hook slide or something to that degree and messed it up again and uh and so they that took more meniscus out and um and so after that I tried to rehab once again to get back into the the scene in 1980 1989 but it was clear that I mean it wasn't happening so I had the surgery and and you know again for me as far as my faith was concerned yes did it hurt absolutely but at the same time lessons that I learned lessons that I learned from back in 1986 1987 you know when I called up my coach from college and we went through a scenarios really helped me to understand that God has my back I mean and he has my future and it might not have been playing Major League Baseball.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_00: But uh and and and it would have hurt it would have hurt big time if I didn't have an opportunity to get back in there.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_00: But at the same time uh I I put it all in his plate and uh I got back to playing not the way that I wanted to play because obviously it it changed the way I played the game of baseball.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_00: But um but I still was able to get back out there and start playing and and uh I was thankful for that.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_00: But as far as the team was concerned yes we went through I mean Spanky Lavoyeur had his injury where the guy dove into his knee at home plate and uh messed him up and um so it it just hurt.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_02: I mean it hurt us for that year but we knew that we still had the the the uh the group together that we were going to have an opportunity in 1990 yeah and and you you do get that opportunity to come back in 1990 uh in fact you have a a really great season you win the the Hutch award that year and you helped the Pirates have this just remarkable season they win the National League East make it to the postseason um after all these years of just you know struggling in the 1980s.
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_02: What what were some of the highlights of that 1990 season for you and it did it cut did it kind of feel like the culmination of a long journey from when you got to Pittsburgh till till then I think the 1990 season uh by far uh for me was an eye-opener for me as far as hitting um that was the first year that I really had a hitting coach in Milt May you know come up and start to work with me and because as a as a power hitter slash gap hitter um I would hit balls you know all that time frame and say man that ball's out of the ballpark and the guy would go back to the warning track and catch the ball and I'm thinking how in the world is that happening and and at that point in time I mean Milk Mays helped me to understand it what I was doing was pulling across the ball and creating a side spin on the ball instead of a back spin on the ball and so we worked and we worked and we worked to get my hands going through the you know staying inside and and uh doing what I could do to to hit the ball up the middle and so on and so forth.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_00: And it it changed.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_00: I mean I I can remember going out for batting practice and stuff and and I didn't even feel like I was swinging and the ball was you know going out of the ballpark.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_00: I mean and so that allowed me that allowed me that year was the year that I started to understand how to hit junk ballers too because now all of a sudden the way I was approaching the pitch I could I could stay on and and just look away look away and start thinking about that opposite field gap and uh it it changed the way that I played the game and and um you know so I'm very very thankful to Milk that he took the time to to uh help me to understand what my swing was doing and and corrected it.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_03: Hey hey Sid I do you feel like you you learned that lesson how to hit that it seems like a lot of batters like players now just look straight fastball and they don't even they're either looking for a walk or a home run.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_03: Do you see that in a lot of the the newer players like not adjusting maybe the way you did?
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_00: Well I I do see I mean and you you know and again it's so difficult because your mind obviously in the game of baseball is is it just messes with you.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_00: I mean your mind is is incredible so when you go up and and you react to a ball and it the ball goes out of the ballpark your mind is sitting there saying man do you remember what you did there?
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_00: You swung hard well you which you really didn't you didn't swing hard you just reacted and and you know what these guys are doing today but when you're when you're staying with a focus of for me hitting the ball left center field fastball hitting the left center field and so that keeps me on the breaking ball I mean you know so that I can I can extend my swing for the breaking ball it changes my whole perspective but with these guys that are going up there turly I mean you see the I mean before they change the shift rule you see all these guys that they good green for I mean everybody's on one side of the field or the other because their their whole mindset is I'm just gonna hit the ball out of the ballpark.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_00: Well you're not gonna do that.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_00: I mean it it it might I mean you know for some guys it's gonna happen 42 times but you're gonna strike out 250 times as well I mean in in the course of a year and I mean these guys I mean like O'Neill Cruz right now for the Pittsburgh Pirates I mean I wish that somebody would just tell him you can hit the home run to left center field just as easily as you can hit the home run to right field and that'll keep you on the breaking ball.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_00: I mean you know Davis I mean the catcher I mean man I wish I had an opportunity to work with him for just a couple weeks to get him to stop dropping on his backside because every time you drop on your back side you're dragging your hands through the zone and you'll never ever hit a good fastball up and in on as far as his pitching is I mean pitching is concerned.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_00: And and so you know the more that individuals can focus you know to opposite field with their fastball that keeps them on the breaking ball and uh you know they can become much better hitters.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_00: But it's it's hard to do because like I said your head plays a whole lot of games with you thinking man I gotta pull this ball I got to take I got to I you know if he throws it there I gotta get it and and it it you just have to you your mind has to be controlled on a daily basis.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_03: Well it sounds like there seems to be like some humility and willingness to like learn too you know I mean absolutely I mean and again we had our prima donnas back then but there's prima donnas there in the game today that think that they know everything.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_00: And uh you know the more that they would humble themselves as you said Steve and just hey take somebody's advice you know you know start working on on getting your hands inside hitting the ball left field I mean it changes your whole game.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_03: Well especially like you said in PNC Park you see the size of left field in PNC Park like you know like you said you don't even have to hit a home run and with Cruz's speed if he just hits like anytime he could probably gonna get a lot of triples if he just hits a line drive and that that notch out there I mean it might knock out of the park but part about it is that that guy is so incredibly talented that he could hit he can hit home runs to left center field.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_00: I mean just inside the park maybe even does it go over the fence because he's so fast.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_00: Understand Steve but I mean you know if they and at the same time you're helping out a team.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_00: And that's a big thing.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_00: I mean all this analytics stuff I mean it's taking team out of the picture nowadays all they're thinking about is their home runs and and so on and so forth and it's it's it's just changed the game big time for me.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_00: I mean it it's messed up messed me up because teams no longer you look at the teams that are into World Series and yes you got the Dodgers that you know they spend bucku dollars but you look at the teams that consistently get up there they're they're individuals that that when there's a guy on second base they still work to get the guy over to first you know third base they let the other guy get him in.
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_02: I mean they're doing the little things in order to to win ball games and and but these guys that sit out there and just try to hit home runs they don't try to get the guy over to third base to help your teammate out you know saying hey I I trust you to get this guy in I mean they never do they never do much so so you guys lose to the Reds in that and the NLCS after that 1990 season and and then after that season's over you're a free agent pirates management is very vocal about bringing you back they publicly state that re signing you is quote their number one priority for the offseason and they they come out in the in the media they call you the glue that holds the team together they really want you back that's what they're saying but their actions don't really align with their words do they know they they uh their actions I mean they didn't even get close to market price on me let alone anything more for being their quote their priority and uh you know and so you know it it went to free agency I mean and uh you know you would think that good grief if you're gonna state that stuff I mean at least give somebody a market price I mean what what you're looking at and but uh it went to free agency the Atlanta Braves gave me a great offer said you need to make a decision because if you're not coming we're gonna go after another first baseman and at that point in time my wife and I decided said we were going to go but we literally cried our eyes out that night I mean thinking what in the world did we do?
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_00: I mean we're leaving a team that we have great success the Atlanta Braves obviously in 1990 was the worst you know last place team worst team and uh and so you know when we got up in the morning I called Jim Leland and I asked Jim I said you know skip I said I'm I'm bound to this contract and he said no you're not bound to it because you haven't uh put your name on it yet so so at that point in time I called my attorney Robert Fraley who was the one that went down with uh Payne Stewart in his plane when Payne Stewart the golfer went down in his his plane I mean Robert was on that plane with him and uh but over the course of two conversations with him I mean I was sitting there saying I'm I'm staying with Pittsburgh and he kept on trying to talk me out of doing what I I wanted to do and so finally at the end of our last conversation he made the point he said well what happens if you sign with Pittsburgh and then they trade you down to Atlanta you're gonna look like an idiot and I said great point let's go back to Pittsburgh and ask them for a no trade clause and we went back to Pittsburgh and asked them for a no trade clause and they said no to a no trade clause and I said to myself man if I'm your first priority I'd hate to see what your last one is and so we went down to Atlanta and obviously we understand what took place in 91 and 92 with the Pittsburgh Pirates and the Atlanta Braves.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and and it it's important for folks to remember so first of all again people that remember this at the time because fans were pretty livid about this not at you but at the team and and when you say you were willing you had those conversations with your agent and you were willing to stay in Pittsburgh it was something like 20% less than what Atlanta was offering I don't know anybody that would take a 20% pay cut that's how much you loved playing in Pittsburgh and the no trade clause would have been a very easy thing to put in your contract.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_02: They still could have bought it out if they wanted to uh and and they when when that happened they came out in the media and said well we we don't do no trade clauses and it was immediately pointed out even at the time that they had just done that for Neil Heaton that same season and and Neil Heaton was a good pitcher no offense no offense to Neil Heaton but he wasn't Sid Dream didn't bring the value to the team so you're right it it it was not fair what they were trying to do and I I I think like I said people people were angry at the time and and I know that had to hurt for you because you had given so many good years to the team and it would have been one thing I think Sid if they would have come out if they hadn't come out and said all that stuff, right?
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_02: Because today a lot of times they they may you know stuff like that teams play play that close to the vest.
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_02: Well you know we'd love to have them back if if if the terms are right, if things work out they say things of that nature but they were just all in on you in the media number one priority in everything.
• 36:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_02: So um I I I you talked a little bit about um because I want to get into like the human aspect of this I I I think we as fans we see pro athletes as these pawns you know trade this guy sign this guy and and this situation gave me personally a a different perspective on that.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_02: So in 1990 Steve and I were both high school students at the same school where your son was going at the time your your son was much younger than us.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_02: I think he was maybe like in kindergarten I think he was in elementary yeah yeah so so Steve and I Steve and I never really had any interaction with your family but one thing I will always remember is one day right after all this whole thing went down I came out to the parking lot after school because my mom was picking me up but my mom wasn't in her car and when I looked around I saw her over at your car talking to you and your wife Michelle and I could see that all you guys were very emotional.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_02: Everyone was in tears and I think maybe you guys might have been praying together.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_02: And and I'm not sure Sid if you remember that conversation with my mom or not but just talk about just the the how tough it was just leaving Pittsburgh.
• 37:13
  SPEAKER_03: Well I mean I again I mean you know just just in stating Tim to you about after we made that decision and how my wife and I cried uh you know thinking about leaving Pittsburgh and and uh it was very very it was devastating to us I mean you know again as you stated I mean shoot if they wouldn't have said the whole thing of you know you're our first priority and and so on and so forth you know I had a we had Jim and I had a great relationship and um you know we we loved it here we were raising our family here and uh you know it it I mean it it just hurt I mean you know I don't know what else to say it just hurt to think that I mean we were we were leaving uh a team that had so much upside and uh going to a team that was you know yeah I remember yeah I remember Atlanta stunk they had like they were the one they had uh they had that one guy um was it uh oh who's the big hitter Dale Murphy yeah and that was about it I remember that and you know it's funny it's funny Sid because I think I've lived this a little bit sometimes you go through something and it seems so horrible at the time but then you go through it and it's like you know your faith and you see oh my goodness God was setting me up for something way bigger in uh I'm thinking you can't walk down the street in Atlanta today and uh without getting getting a few handshakes and uh it smiles there from the people in Atlanta huh there's uh I mean even even 34 years later after the play I mean shoot I uh I am still welcome welcome down in Atlanta for sure I mean and I'll I mean just to let you guys know that I will be uh I'll be part of their opening ceremonies down there this year.
• 39:10
  SPEAKER_00: So I mean it's uh it's incredible to think I mean and as you said we don't understand why we go through storms but God does and uh you know he gave me the opportunity to to be a part of a play that has been around for 34 years now and I know we're gonna talk about it here before too long but at the same time uh you know a broke down old ball player that managed to do what he did and and God has used it in order to uh bring himself glory and that's it's been an amazing thing what what kind of response did you guys get when when again when all this was happening when you were leaving in 1990 did you get any kind of response um from the fans in Pittsburgh oh I I mean I I think you know that can be stated by when I came back for the first time in May uh I didn't start the game because John Smalley big left hander was pitching and we were getting killed that game uh we got it was nine to one going into the last inning and I I really truly believe that Jim Leland brought in Stan Belinda just for the fact that he knew that Bobby Cox would put me up in the on-deck circle and and uh to pinch hit and so Stan Belinda comes into the game I come on to the on-deck circle to pinch hit and and as they announced me and and you know coming up to the plate the people the people in Pittsburgh gave me a five minute standing ovation and uh you know at that point in time going up there with my knees knocking and my eyes eyes watering thinking I'm gotta I gotta hit a 95 mile an hour you know sidearm fastball coming from Stan Belinda thinking what in the world are you doing?
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_02: I mean somehow the bat was swung somehow I hit the ball and it went over the straight over the center field wall and as I came around the bases it gave they gave me another five minute standing ovation and so that meant that meant a lot to my wife and I uh you know as I've said in a humorous way I wish they would have done that a little bit more when I was here instead of the booth but at the same time it was a phenomenal phenomenal homecoming and and um you know I enjoyed every bit of it yeah we we um we we dug out a the clip of that so I remember when that happened and then I I went and dug out a clip of it and the the it it's from TBS so it's the Atlanta announcers and they're just in the on the broadcast they're kind of beside themselves of wait all the Pirates fans are are cheering for a home run against their team right it's such an unusual moment um but I think that's how much people loved you here.
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_02: And they were so happy to see you not only come to the plate but then but then hit that home run.
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_00: It was a pretty special and unique moment wasn't it I think I think it you know I was just one of those I mean Pittsburgh is such a hardworking you know group of people that I think that back at that time frame I mean shoot I I was just adopted because of that.
• 42:23
  SPEAKER_02: I mean shoot I I I worked my tail off I did all that I could do to be the best player that I could be and they uh they saw that I mean I I hustled I tried to do all that I could in order to you know help my team the most you know the the most I could and uh you know so I I I do believe that I was just brought into the family of Pittsburgh a little bit when all that happened and and uh they showed their appreciation so 1991 you guys beat the pirates in the NLCS you you you you play in the World Series and and let's now let's fast forward here to game seven of the 1992 NLCS uh so for folks who don't have that burning in their memory like we do the pirates the pirates have a two to nothing lead going into the bottom of the ninth your your buddy Doug Drabeck is on the mound he's throwing a masterful game shutout Terry Pendelman leads off the inning with a double Jose Leand who never ever ever made errors makes an untimely error and now you're at the plate facing Doug Draybick and I think he walks you on is was it four pitches?
• 43:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah four straight pitches never gave me a chance to swing the bat wow so so now the bases are loaded with no outs you're on first did you expect Bobby Cox to send out a pinch runner?
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_02: I think Skip Carey if you listen to to his broadcast of it I think he even sort of asked that question out loud like hey are they going to send in a runner for Sid you know did you think that you were going to stay on first base or did you think you were immediately going to come off
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_00: I mean I uh there was truthfully Tim and Steve, there was no reason for me to be out there.
• 44:06
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, good grief.
• 44:07
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, Bobby, Bobby will tell you to this day that he had nobody to to play first base.
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_03: I've heard that.
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, he the only guy he had left was Cabrera, the guy he ended up playing.
• 44:17
  SPEAKER_00: That's not true because Brian Brian Hunter, he platooned with me.
• 44:21
  SPEAKER_00: He pinched hit in the ninth inning.
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_00: He could have Francis Cobrera could have gone into first base and played first base.
• 44:30
  SPEAKER_00: His problem was because I mean in in in the seventh inning, he pinched it for Mark Lemke at second base, and then he pinched it for Rafael Bellyard in the ninth inning.
• 44:41
  SPEAKER_00: Then I mean, shoot, if if if we would have kept on going, he had nobody to play second base.
• 44:47
  SPEAKER_00: In the big thing, and he had had to put a pitcher out at second base in order to continue with the game.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_00: And um so it it was it was quite surprising that uh especially not so much when I was on first base, but when I got to second base, it was surprising that at that point in time he didn't put somebody in in order to pinch run for me.
• 45:14
  SPEAKER_02: So so so when you're on second base, so so here, fast forward a few batter batters later and some controversial Randy Marsh balls and strikes calls later.
• 45:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 45:24
  SPEAKER_02: So Stan Belinda's now in, the score is two to one, the bases are still loaded, now there's two outs, and like you said, you're on second.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_02: Francisco Cabrera's at the plate.
• 45:33
  SPEAKER_02: I think I've heard you say in interviews that you had a pretty big lead off of second.
• 45:37
  SPEAKER_02: Is that true?
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_02: Could could Stan Belinda have picked you off?
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_00: Stan Belinda, I mean, there was no doubt in my mind.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, he could have picked me off, but I don't know if you remember if you watched the game the the the time before I hit a double off of Doug Drabeck and I was on second base, and they tried to pick me off twice at second base.
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, but I knew at that point in time with Stan Belinda, you know, he was focused on one thing, and that was getting the hitter.
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_00: So if if you were to take a screenshot of me when I was on second base with Doug Drabeck, and a screenshot of where I was when Stan Belinda and then my secondary, I mean, there was no comparison.
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know, I was I was literally going out of the TV camera when I was taking my secondary lead uh with Stan Belinda on the mound.
• 46:32
  SPEAKER_00: And um, you know, so huge, huge help for me being somebody that was slowed down with all his knee surgeries and a big brace.
• 46:41
  SPEAKER_00: It was a uh huge thing for me to be able to know that I mean I could um I could get that good of a lead.
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_02: So so Cabrera hits the ball on the left field.
• 46:54
  SPEAKER_02: There's two outs.
• 46:54
  SPEAKER_02: I assume you're just taking off at the crack of the bat, right?
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, and and that, you know, again, another benefit for me as a as a slow runner at that point in time, I didn't have to worry about where the ball was hit.
• 47:07
  SPEAKER_00: I could do my secondary.
• 47:09
  SPEAKER_00: When that ball was hit, I could take off.
• 47:11
  SPEAKER_00: And um, you know, they all that all played into to me being able to do what I was able to do.
• 47:17
  SPEAKER_02: So so Barry Bonsfield's uh we know he's got a pretty strong arm.
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_02: When you're heading to third base, was there any attempt by the the third base coach for the Braves to stop you, or were you just like intent on making it home?
• 47:31
  SPEAKER_00: Jim, I have no clue.
• 47:32
  SPEAKER_03: I mean I I wondered that myself, at what point did you know you were going home?
• 47:39
  SPEAKER_03: From when the ball was hit?
• 47:40
  SPEAKER_03: As soon as it hit, were you just heading home no matter what?
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_00: Or this to this day, I've never seen I've never seen a video that tells me whether or not Jimmy was holding me up or or m making me go.
• 47:53
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I uh I know that I mean, shoot, they always teach you you put the pressure on the defense, and for us to be able to have to get a hit or a walk in order to score the winning run at that point in time, uh, you know, my my uh mind was saying you're going.
• 48:12
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't I don't remember, I don't ever remember looking at Jimmy and saying, you know, watching him say you're going or not going.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_00: And uh my mind was saying you're going.
• 48:25
  SPEAKER_00: And uh I'm you know, again, if I would have been out, I mean I would have been a goat, and Bobby would have been a goat.
• 48:34
  SPEAKER_00: But uh, but thankfully that didn't happen.
• 48:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yep, yeah.
• 48:39
  SPEAKER_02: You you beat the throw, the Braves win.
• 48:42
  SPEAKER_02: Um, still, like you said, all these years later, one of the most dramatic and and celebrated moments in baseball history, much to much to our Sagranus Pirates fans.
• 48:51
  SPEAKER_02: Did you realize that night that that moment was going to take on such a viol like a like a life of its own, or were you just kind of happy that you won the game?
• 49:00
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know, again, uh I'm not thinking anything, you know, in the future.
• 49:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um I'm just thinking, good grief.
• 49:07
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, we just won a ball game, we're going to the World Series again.
• 49:10
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, and uh, you know, I was thankful that uh I was able to help the team and do what I was able to do, and and uh but never, never ever thought in all these years that I mean it would have uh moved into what happened you know later on.
• 49:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah yeah, it it gives you because you're out of baseball several years later and and unlike other you know thousands of ball players who retire and just kind of fade into the background, you're forever associated with this moment that people always want to relive.
• 49:46
  SPEAKER_02: Um so so describe how that that gave you a platform and and then what you what you then did with that platform.
• 49:52
  SPEAKER_00: Well again, Tim, I mean it's Steve, but this it only comes from God.
• 49:57
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know, you got how ironic that you got a broke down, you know, old ball player out there at second base that was slower than molasses that uh you know came in and beat a throw by about four inches.
• 50:11
  SPEAKER_00: That was iconic today, as I've shared with people.
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_00: I said today Jim Leland would have thrown out the red flag and they would have sat there for all until they looked at it how many ways, and and uh you know, you won't you'll never you'll never ever have an impromptu kind of uh uh excitement like that in the game of baseball again.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_00: You know, yes, you guy can hit a home run, but you'll never have a play like that where he's coming in and sliding at home plate without a challenge, and uh then you have to sit there and wait for the challenge and and then the people can erupt, but you'll never have an impromptu thing like that again.
• 50:51
  SPEAKER_00: But again, Tim, going back to it it's all about God.
• 50:56
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, going back to when I went to Pittsburgh, back to Pittsburgh after coming to Atlanta.
• 51:01
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I didn't swing that bat that night.
• 51:05
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, there was no way I I out of my 90 home runs that I hit in my career, that was the only home run that I ever hit straightaway center field.
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, all my home runs were to right center to the line, or I hit some to left field, but no, I I never hit another home run to the straightaway center field.
• 51:24
  SPEAKER_00: And like I said, with my eyes watering, my knees knocking, God was swinging that bat for me.
• 51:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I have no doubt that God put me in that position, you know, just for the opportunity to be able to give me the platform to be able to go out and speak about his name.
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_02: What when when you're speaking to churches or or other groups or or in that role as a chaplain, what what's the message that you want to get across to folks?
• 51:52
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I mean, I think Tim, the biggest message that I want to get across to him is Jesus Christ loves you with more than anything you could ever know.
• 52:00
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, he died on a cross for you.
• 52:03
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, you know, shoot, he has a life, life for you beyond this life here on this earth.
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_00: And and, you know, if you would just understand that, I mean, your life could be full, filled with peace and joy and happiness and goodness.
• 52:19
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, you know, that's that's what I want to try to get across.
• 52:23
  SPEAKER_00: But obviously, I s I do different messages, so I mean, but most of the time I start off my my messages with my baseball because that's the platform that God gave me, and I I share the about the play.
• 52:37
  SPEAKER_00: In Pittsburgh, it's not received too well.
• 52:41
  SPEAKER_00: I can't see why.
• 52:44
  SPEAKER_00: I I mean this has been years ago, but I mean I literally had I was in the just in the middle of my serious part of my talk, talking here in Pittsburgh, and a guy stood up in the middle.
• 52:57
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, in the serious part of my talk, the guy stood up and he said, You were I guess he was seeing what he wanted to see, yeah.
• 53:07
  SPEAKER_00: And even to this day, Mike Lavalier, I mean, the catcher for the pirates, I mean, my a great friend, Mike Lavoyeur will sit and tell you that he he still thinks I was out.
• 53:19
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think, yeah, no, yeah.
• 53:21
  SPEAKER_03: He was on the other.
• 53:22
  SPEAKER_03: If the I think if the throw would have been down the third baseline, they probably get you.
• 53:28
  SPEAKER_03: But because it was offline and he had to come over with the tag that gave you the time, the no doubt about it, Steve.
• 53:35
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it you know, and again, people say terrible throw by Barry Bonds.
• 53:39
  SPEAKER_00: Shoot.
• 53:39
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that that throw was a one hopper to to Mike Lavallier just up the line where he had to reach reach out and then come back to the plate.
• 53:49
  SPEAKER_00: Most most outfielders today can't even get the ball to home plate.
• 53:53
  SPEAKER_00: And so, you know, I you know, I the throw was not bad.
• 53:57
  SPEAKER_00: It was just the fact that, I mean, shoot, I had everything in my favor in order to beat it by four inches.
• 54:03
  SPEAKER_02: And and and Sid, that's one of the reasons I want to talk about the circumstances of your leaving, because I think the the people around here that say Sid Bream crushed all my hopes and dreams as a Pirates fan need to understand that the Pirates literally created that situation for themselves by you know not dealing honestly with you when you were a free agent.
• 54:24
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, you should have still been here or could have still been here very easily.
• 54:28
  SPEAKER_02: Um so I think I think folks need to remember that as well.
• 54:33
  SPEAKER_00: Have you seen, I mean, just this year, I don't know if you've taken notice, but a shirt just came out this year that said Sid Bream destroyed my childhood.
• 54:44
  SPEAKER_03: Well, how does that make you feel, Sid, to destroy everybody's childhood?
• 54:48
  SPEAKER_00: The beauty of all this, I mean, you know, as Tim was saying, most athletes go into obscurity several years after they get out of their sport.
• 54:59
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, and all I did was run, and here it is 34 years later, that people are still talking about that play in Pittsburgh and Atlanta, and even when they bring up the World Series, a lot of times that play is still, you know, shown as a highlight.
• 55:15
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, and so you know, I'm just I'm just thankful to the Lord that that you know he used he used an old guy like me in order to be able to get the thing done.
• 55:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, very very cool.
• 55:29
  SPEAKER_02: And and again, thanks for those of us that that were pirates fans.
• 55:34
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's it's it's it hurts for pirates fans like us because it was the last chance, right?
• 55:41
  SPEAKER_02: And and the team was just so bad for years after that.
• 55:44
  SPEAKER_03: The Yankees gave up that home run to Mazurowski, but that didn't decide their you know future for you know 20 years.
• 55:51
  SPEAKER_03: I I think if the Pirates would have won another World Series even like 10 or 15 years later, it would maybe be different.
• 55:59
  SPEAKER_00: Well, even if the pirates even if the pirates would be able to compete, yeah.
• 56:04
  SPEAKER_00: And that's that's the thing I think that you know most Pittsburgh Pirate fans are so distraught about in as in in 34 years thirty-four years, there's only been three years that they've been over 500 in 34 years.
• 56:22
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's that's devastating.
• 56:25
  SPEAKER_00: That's tragic.
• 56:26
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, and that just you know, it starts from management and it and it flows down through.
• 56:32
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, and it, you know, and and I always I always go back to the fact that I mean at one of the years, and I don't know what year it was, they were 16 games above 500 in August.
• 56:44
  SPEAKER_00: And they had a chance to go out and bring in the right fielder from the Philadelphia Phillies, and he went, he eventually went to the San Francisco Giants, and I don't re I can't remember his name, but great gritty ball player that they could have brought into right field, and instead of doing that, they brought in Trevor Lawrence, a rookie from the Toronto Blue Jays, and and it not I don't know if it was Trevor Lawrence, but I mean I I think that that was his name, but he was a right fielder, and you could just see the team sitting and thinking, you gotta be kidding me.
• 57:22
  SPEAKER_00: This is what you're gonna give us in order to go the rest of the way, in order to try to win this championship or or division, and and they went, they dropped like a uh an anchor.
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_03: I I don't think I remember that season, yeah.
• 57:35
  SPEAKER_00: And then and then and then to to to top that all off, you go to the Houston Astros, and uh the set little second baseman, when they brought in Verlander, he comes out on video, he said, Well, whenever they brought in Verlander, we knew that management wanted to win this thing.
• 57:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 57:56
  SPEAKER_00: And so, you know, the way that ownership takes care of their teams, the way that they project themselves, I mean, really makes a huge difference in in do I want to win or do I wanna want to just be status quo?
• 58:12
  SPEAKER_00: And for all these years, there's they've had three years that they've been status quo.
• 58:18
  SPEAKER_00: And and I think that that's the thing that hurts the the Pittsburgh Pirate fans the most.
• 58:23
  SPEAKER_02: So so does that does that that kind of stuff has to impact the players, right?
• 58:28
  SPEAKER_02: Sid like they they have to understand, boy, our management really isn't all in on this.
• 58:34
  SPEAKER_02: And does that affect does it does that just affect team morale and and the the how hard it is to compete over a long season?
• 58:42
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely, Tim.
• 58:43
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know, and I'll even go back to when I was in Atlanta.
• 58:46
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I was there for three years, but you know, my third year that I was there, I mean, uh, they made a great move in bringing in Fred McGriff, took me out of a job.
• 58:58
  SPEAKER_00: But at the same time, what Fred McGriff game brought to that team, I mean, just propelled them to go on to the the uh the World Series again that year, or not the World Series because it got beat by the Philadelphia Phillies, but at the same time propelled us to win the division again that year.
• 59:16
  SPEAKER_00: And then for for how many more 11 more years in Atlanta, because of that move by John Sherholtz.
• 59:22
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, what management does I mean, projects a lot to a team.
• 59:28
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, do they want to win or do don't they want to win?
• 59:30
  SPEAKER_00: Or they just want to be status quo.
• 59:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, and I think we we know the answer, unfortunately, that here in Pittsburgh.
• 59:40
  SPEAKER_02: Um, Sid, we we want to let you get going.
• 59:42
  SPEAKER_02: Um, we we just so so appreciate you taking the time to talk with us.
• 59:48
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, I I hope what folks got out of this, certainly what I did, is that you know that that moment in 1992, while it was so painful for us as fans, you know, it had a bigger purpose for you and for people that you've impacted.
• 1:00:04
  SPEAKER_02: And and so I I hope that gives some folks some closure and some peace that that still struggle with that moment.
• 1:00:12
  SPEAKER_00: I understand, Tim.
• 1:00:14
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, and I think that that's I think that's the biggest thing that each one of us has to understand.
• 1:00:20
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you know, Jeremiah 29, 11 says, I mean, I know the plans that I have for you.
• 1:00:25
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, and you know, my plan, his plan for Sid Bream was that he was going to take, break me down to the point where, shoot, I wasn't the the player that I was prior to that, and use me so that I mean I could be used for his kingdom.
• 1:00:40
  SPEAKER_00: We're all here to be used for his kingdom.
• 1:00:43
  SPEAKER_00: And the more that we can understand that, the more that we reflect that, the more that we become a light for him, the more that we speak up when we have the opportunity to speak up, to share with people the greatest gift that could ever be given in Jesus Christ, the better off this world's gonna be.
• 1:01:02
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• 1:01:06
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• 1:01:10
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• 1:01:16
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• 1:01:19
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks again, and we'll catch you next time.