Latest / Motherhood Uncut / Judgment in Motherhood Part 2 | Motherhood Uncut Podcast | Season 1 Episode 3

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Judgment in Motherhood Part 2 | Motherhood Uncut Podcast | Season 1 Episode 3 · Motherhood Uncut

0:00
SPEAKER_02: Hi Deb.
0:00
SPEAKER_01: Hi, Kate.
0:02
SPEAKER_02: Deb.
0:03
SPEAKER_02: This is episode three of our podcast, and it is the second uh phase of our two-part series in judgment.
0:18
SPEAKER_02: Last week we talked about what to do when we judge our kids, which we got a lot of feedback from our listeners because so many people saw themselves in that because it's so easy and inevitable that we're going to be judging our our children and other people, actually.
0:33
SPEAKER_01: Yes, and people thought got some levity out of it.
0:36
SPEAKER_02: People got levity out of it.
0:38
SPEAKER_02: Um, and we hope that today when we talk about when judgment shows up between mothers, right?
0:44
SPEAKER_02: When mother one mother feels judged by another mother or when they are judging someone else, both of those things feel bad in our body, by the way.
0:51
SPEAKER_02: Um and we hope we can bring I hope we can bring some levity to that as well.
0:54
SPEAKER_02: But ironically, we got um actually we got an email from a listener that was really interesting.
1:00
SPEAKER_02: This was after our episode last week, um, and it was perfect timing.
1:04
SPEAKER_02: And I'm gonna read this to you, and maybe this can start us off today.
1:06
SPEAKER_01: Sounds good.
1:07
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
1:08
SPEAKER_02: Hello, Kate and Deb.
1:09
SPEAKER_02: I know you have only just started, but I am loving your podcast.
1:13
SPEAKER_02: Oh, I love this part of this email.
1:14
SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much for your humor and vulnerability.
1:16
SPEAKER_02: I will follow both of you on Instagram, and I'm so excited to continue to learn from you.
1:21
SPEAKER_02: Based on your last episode regarding judgment, I am struggling hard with feeling judged by other mothers in my community.
1:28
SPEAKER_02: I don't work, and I often feel less than from the working moms.
1:32
SPEAKER_02: I also find myself regularly judging other moms for all sorts of things, and I hate that about myself.
1:38
SPEAKER_02: How do we change this culture of judgment and why is it so prevalent with moms?
1:42
SPEAKER_02: Thank you, Susan, Chicago, Illinois.
1:45
SPEAKER_01: Okay, Susan.
1:46
SPEAKER_02: Susan, I love your question, and the timing was perfect.
1:50
SPEAKER_01: And and Susan, I'm just so grateful that you reached out because you are so not alone, especially being an at-home mom and feeling judged by working moms, and I'm sure it goes both ways, but I just think that this is such an important topic to talk about.
2:05
SPEAKER_02: You know, and this reminds me, Deb, of one piece of feedback that we got after our episode last week, when where was a qu no, it was the first episode, episode one, 20 questions for Deb and Kate.
2:14
SPEAKER_02: And one of the questions was who is a mom you least um emulate?
2:20
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, right.
2:21
SPEAKER_02: And we both said, leave it to beaver mom.
2:23
SPEAKER_02: And we made a comment in the beginning of that about how we felt like we would not want to be in a situation where quote unquote all we had to think about or to do were our kids and our husbands or partners.
2:38
SPEAKER_02: And that actually stirred up some feelings of judgment from a couple of our listeners.
2:43
SPEAKER_02: And I and I actually love that that came up right before this episode because it's a great it goes it f works right into what we're talking about today.
2:51
SPEAKER_01: It does, and I actually think with any misstep, there's an opportunity to repair.
2:56
SPEAKER_01: So I really actually would like to say to our listeners that I'm sorry, and I know Kate is too, that this was i it was never our intent to try and put down another way of being in the world, right?
3:13
SPEAKER_01: And yet it it probably came from a place within us that was feeling somewhat of an inner conflict.
3:21
SPEAKER_01: That's right.
3:21
SPEAKER_01: And that's when judgment comes out.
3:23
SPEAKER_01: That is exactly right.
3:25
SPEAKER_02: I think that's the point, Deb, that when we were planning for today, we wanted to get across, right?
3:30
SPEAKER_02: Is that when we are judging someone else, that is almost always, if not always, going to come from a discomfort within ourselves about that thing.
3:40
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
3:40
SPEAKER_02: And we can project it on to another person.
3:43
SPEAKER_02: And I will say, being raised by a mom who worked full time and who was never home, you know, I think there's a part of me that judges myself for working so much.
3:54
SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
3:55
SPEAKER_02: And that, and I think this is one of the parts about judgment, and I it happens in mother with between mothers all the time, is we don't always know where that unconscious insecurity within ourselves is coming from.
4:06
SPEAKER_02: So it's easier to make a statement about someone else, like leave it to Beaver's mom, than it is to sort of own the part within myself that's uncomfortable about that thing.
4:16
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely, absolutely.
4:18
SPEAKER_01: Because I think so often, just to kind of echo what you're saying, is when judgment comes up, unless we're if if we're paying attention that it's a judgment and a projection, then we actually get to put light on what in the therapy world we call blind spots.
4:37
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
4:38
SPEAKER_01: Right.
4:38
SPEAKER_01: Because these blind spots are the parts of ourselves that we're having some internal conflict.
4:44
SPEAKER_01: Totally.
4:45
SPEAKER_01: So that is why judgment is so confusing.
4:47
SPEAKER_01: So let's let's go to Susan's question.
4:49
SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes, yes.
4:51
SPEAKER_01: So she's saying that she has felt judged by other moms in her community for not working.
4:58
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
4:58
SPEAKER_01: And then she's also saying that she has been judging left and right.
5:02
SPEAKER_01: That's right.
5:04
SPEAKER_01: So I think the a really important place to start, and I think this is kind of where we went last week, was let's again start with curiosity and how to actually be gentle with this part of ourselves that is judging, even though it is such an icky feeling in our bodies and it feels so icky to be judged.
5:26
SPEAKER_01: But I guess I want to invite all our listeners and ourselves to start with compassion.
5:32
SPEAKER_02: Maybe even before that though, Deb, there's starting with the recognition that something feels icky in our bodies.
5:39
SPEAKER_02: Do you know what I mean?
5:40
SPEAKER_02: Like that's good.
5:41
SPEAKER_02: Like Susan is Susan says it does, I don't like that part of myself.
5:45
SPEAKER_02: It doesn't feel good.
5:46
SPEAKER_02: And I think there's a way in which when we can slow down and tune in and say, ooh, something feels really icky in my body.
5:54
SPEAKER_02: And what am I telling myself in my head?
5:56
SPEAKER_02: Am I being judgmental of myself or someone else?
5:59
SPEAKER_02: I have yet to have an experience in my life where I've been judgmental and felt good in my body.
6:04
SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
6:04
SPEAKER_02: Like it doesn't work that way.
6:06
SPEAKER_01: Recognition first.
6:07
SPEAKER_01: I love that.
6:07
SPEAKER_01: It's so, so key.
6:09
SPEAKER_01: So recognition that something is off-center.
6:14
SPEAKER_02: And then the question that we can ask is not what is this feeling telling me about that other person?
6:20
SPEAKER_02: What is it telling me like she doesn't know how to mother her children?
6:24
SPEAKER_02: What is it telling me about me?
6:25
SPEAKER_02: Ah, something is coming up for me when I observe this person making these choices.
6:31
SPEAKER_02: What is that telling me about me?
6:32
SPEAKER_02: Ah, maybe my judgment of that person who is um not working is telling me that I might be somewhat uncomfortable with either my desire to not work or my choice to work.
6:51
SPEAKER_02: So it has everything to do with me and nothing to do with that other person.
6:54
SPEAKER_02: If I was really grounded and comfortable with my choices, I wouldn't care what someone else does in their life.
7:00
SPEAKER_01: I agree with that fully.
7:02
SPEAKER_01: And I also think that you can be really grounded with your choices and still have an a part of you that wants something different.
7:10
SPEAKER_01: Great point.
7:10
SPEAKER_01: Great point.
7:11
SPEAKER_01: And I think some I know as a working mom, and there was moments where I judged non-working moms or at-home working moms, I felt jealous.
7:21
SPEAKER_01: Of course.
7:22
SPEAKER_01: And so I think that judgment and jealousy really might be cousins.
7:27
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
7:28
SPEAKER_02: Wow, say more about that, Deb.
7:30
SPEAKER_02: That is a that's actually a profound statement.
7:32
SPEAKER_02: First say it again.
7:34
SPEAKER_01: That judgment and jealousy may be cousins.
7:38
SPEAKER_01: Right.
7:38
SPEAKER_01: And they're connected.
7:40
SPEAKER_02: And we used the word comparison earlier today.
7:43
SPEAKER_02: So say more.
7:44
SPEAKER_01: Let's talk about that for a minute.
7:46
SPEAKER_01: So jealousy and comparison often lead to inadequacy.
7:52
SPEAKER_01: And what I actually find in the culture of girls and women is that there is a very like almost I hate to use this word, but constant comparing that happens.
8:03
SPEAKER_01: And and what it does is it creates this sense of inadequate adequacy within ourselves that actually keeps us disconnected from ourselves and then disconnected from each other.
8:15
SPEAKER_01: Totally.
8:15
SPEAKER_01: And actually, as women and moms, connection is what we long for.
8:22
SPEAKER_01: Totally.
8:22
SPEAKER_01: And to remember we're so much more alike than we are different.
8:26
SPEAKER_01: Totally.
8:26
SPEAKER_01: And so there's a bit of they all sort of build on each other.
8:30
SPEAKER_02: That's right.
8:30
SPEAKER_02: And what's different is our preferences.
8:34
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
8:34
SPEAKER_02: And our opinions, perhaps, about things.
8:37
SPEAKER_02: Our values.
8:38
SPEAKER_02: Our values, our beliefs.
8:40
SPEAKER_02: And that all comes from our prior experiences, right?
8:43
SPEAKER_02: So one of the things we know to be true about judgment, and we talked about this last week, snow is snow and nails are nails.
8:51
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
8:51
SPEAKER_02: Right?
8:52
SPEAKER_02: And one of the things that's happening when we're judging somebody else, or judging ourselves, is that we're assuming that there's a right way and a wrong way, a good and a bad.
9:02
SPEAKER_02: And that's just preference and opinion and experience that brought us to the table.
9:07
SPEAKER_02: It's not at all objective.
9:09
SPEAKER_02: It's totally subjective.
9:12
SPEAKER_01: Totally.
9:12
SPEAKER_02: Imagine if, just for a moment, I just had this sort of hit.
9:16
SPEAKER_02: Imagine if in the mom world and the mom culture, instead of judging each other, we just asked each other a lot of questions.
9:26
SPEAKER_01: Hello, curiosity.
9:28
SPEAKER_01: Whoop whoop.
9:28
SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's literally the antidote, I think, for judgment.
9:33
SPEAKER_02: This feels like a really good time to tell our judgment story.
9:36
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
9:36
SPEAKER_02: Let's the deal.
9:39
SPEAKER_02: It was our first fight.
9:40
SPEAKER_02: It was our first fight, and I actually might say maybe one of the only times that judgment showed up.
9:46
SPEAKER_02: I think so.
9:46
SPEAKER_02: Where we because we've we I'm sure we've had, but we were good at asking each other questions.
9:50
SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
9:50
SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
9:51
SPEAKER_02: So this is actually sort of a hilarious story because what everybody needs to know about Kate and Deb is that we both share a background as outward bound instructors, which means that we have both done a lot of peeing in nature.
10:03
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
10:04
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
10:04
SPEAKER_02: And then we both had become mothers.
10:07
SPEAKER_02: And then there was a weekend that we were in Aspen, Colorado, with our four children, our two daughters.
10:13
SPEAKER_02: I actually wonder if we would tell the story the same or different.
10:16
SPEAKER_01: But why don't you go first?
10:17
SPEAKER_02: Okay, here's my example.
10:19
SPEAKER_02: We're sitting, we're with our kids outside of this restaurant on the mountain in Aspen.
10:26
SPEAKER_02: Our husbands are finishing a mountain bike race.
10:28
SPEAKER_02: They were.
10:29
SPEAKER_02: So they I don't even, I can't even remember if they were with us when this happened.
10:32
SPEAKER_02: But all of a sudden, Tess, who's how old at the time?
10:36
SPEAKER_02: I mean maybe two.
10:38
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, she's little.
10:38
SPEAKER_02: Two or three.
10:39
SPEAKER_02: Maybe two.
10:39
SPEAKER_02: And two or three.
10:40
SPEAKER_02: And Tess is the youngest of our four kit four girls.
10:44
SPEAKER_02: And yes, potty trained.
10:45
SPEAKER_02: All of a sudden she says, Mommy, I have to pee.
10:48
SPEAKER_02: Right?
10:49
SPEAKER_02: Yep.
10:49
SPEAKER_02: And Deb says, Okay.
10:53
SPEAKER_02: Go pee.
10:54
SPEAKER_02: And what I want everyone to know is there was no tree to go behind.
10:58
SPEAKER_02: We were outside of a restaurant.
11:01
SPEAKER_02: But it was a very grassy.
11:02
SPEAKER_01: It was a grassy bottom of a ski hill.
11:05
SPEAKER_01: Let's actually, it was the bottom grassy.
11:07
SPEAKER_02: And to be clear, I want you all to visualize this.
11:09
SPEAKER_02: It was the bottom of the ski hill, and the restaurant was at the bottom of the ski hill.
11:14
SPEAKER_02: She's still judging me.
11:17
SPEAKER_01: Like all of our listeners to hear this loud and clear.
11:21
SPEAKER_01: Because in my world, little people compete.
11:26
SPEAKER_02: Here's my point.
11:26
SPEAKER_02: Here's my point.
11:27
SPEAKER_02: What happened for me was there was a bathroom about 20 feet away inside of the restaurant.
11:32
SPEAKER_02: And where I went, and I actually have thought a lot about this in preparation for this podcast today because I was really trying to remember what happened for me in that moment.
11:40
SPEAKER_02: In that moment, I was embarrassed of what people would think of me.
11:45
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
11:46
SPEAKER_02: And so my judgment showed up projected onto you, right?
11:51
SPEAKER_02: Rather than owning my own discomfort about Tess going to the bathroom outside peeing instead of going 20 feet into this bathroom, was to say, you're making a choice.
12:02
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
12:02
SPEAKER_02: That I don't agree with.
12:03
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
12:04
SPEAKER_01: And I don't exactly remember the interact, like what happened in between.
12:09
SPEAKER_01: It was very passive.
12:10
SPEAKER_01: Yes, I thought it was very passive.
12:12
SPEAKER_01: So I remember it.
12:13
SPEAKER_01: And um, and we get in the car and I looked at you and I said, I feel really judged by you right now.
12:20
SPEAKER_02: And you know what I remember doing?
12:21
SPEAKER_02: What?
12:22
SPEAKER_02: I got really defensive.
12:23
SPEAKER_01: I remember that.
12:23
SPEAKER_02: I was like, I'm not being judgmental.
12:25
SPEAKER_02: I just think that if your kid has to go to the bathroom and there's a potty 20 feet away, take her to the potty.
12:30
SPEAKER_02: Right.
12:30
SPEAKER_02: And that's called judgment, ladies and gentlemen.
12:33
SPEAKER_01: And I cried a little.
12:34
SPEAKER_01: You did.
12:35
SPEAKER_01: I felt really tender, and I was kind of like Didn't don't we have an agreement not to judge our parenting choices?
12:42
SPEAKER_02: Well, here's the other thing though.
12:43
SPEAKER_02: When we feel judged by someone else, we start questioning ourselves.
12:46
SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes, yes.
12:47
SPEAKER_02: You were solid in your choice until you felt judged by me.
12:51
SPEAKER_01: Yes, and then I felt embarrassed, and then I compared myself.
12:54
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
12:54
SPEAKER_01: And then I felt inadequate.
12:56
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
12:56
SPEAKER_01: And at the same time, like I I actually am still pee outside, and probably not in front of a restaurant, but I'm like, there's a lot of peeing that happens on the side of the roads, all the things.
13:08
SPEAKER_01: But I think I love that you owned your discomfort.
13:12
SPEAKER_01: So thank you for that.
13:14
SPEAKER_01: And I like that I was able to name what I was feeling in the moment too.
13:18
SPEAKER_01: And we got through it pretty quickly.
13:20
SPEAKER_01: I mean, we did.
13:21
SPEAKER_01: By the time we got back to the condo or whatever, we were, I think we were totally repaired.
13:26
SPEAKER_02: I want to remind everyone, because I'm actually remembering this now as we're talking, what happened was you called me out on feeling judged by me.
13:34
SPEAKER_02: And by the way, I want to be clear.
13:35
SPEAKER_02: Deb, Deb did not say you are judging me.
13:38
SPEAKER_02: She said I feel judged.
13:41
SPEAKER_02: Big difference.
13:42
SPEAKER_01: Which was hard to say, by the way, because we were still new friends.
13:45
SPEAKER_01: It was hard to say, but but it made me it made me a little less defensive than I may have been.
13:50
SPEAKER_02: Okay, you're throwing in a little communication when I am I feel statement.
13:55
SPEAKER_02: We'll do a podcast on that too.
13:56
SPEAKER_02: Um, but I think what happened next is that I started judging myself for judging you.
14:00
SPEAKER_00: Oh.
14:01
SPEAKER_02: I think that's one of the things that can happen in a judgment cycle, right?
14:05
SPEAKER_02: Is that we start going down that rabbit hole.
14:08
SPEAKER_02: It's really hard to pause and come out of that until we sort of ask ourselves, now in retrospect, I might say, wow, I am feeling really uncomfortable about the fact that I made you uncomfortable.
14:21
SPEAKER_02: Right?
14:21
SPEAKER_02: So judgment can take all kinds of weird twists and turns.
14:26
SPEAKER_02: So back to that curiosity comment.
14:30
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
14:31
SPEAKER_02: I think what I could have done back then, we did this later, yes, was say, can you help me understand why you let your kid pee right outside of this restaurant?
14:38
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
14:39
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
14:39
SPEAKER_02: Instead of getting really critical.
14:41
SPEAKER_01: Yep, yep.
14:42
SPEAKER_01: And I made a pause and been like, you're right, the restaurant's right in there.
14:45
SPEAKER_01: Or I might have actually what I remember happening is not wanting to go into a restaurant just to use the bathroom.
14:50
SPEAKER_01: I think that.
14:51
SPEAKER_01: And I didn't think Tess would make it.
14:52
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I think there was a whole lot of like you have to pee, you're little.
14:56
SPEAKER_01: Totally.
14:57
SPEAKER_01: You're Tess, just pee.
14:58
SPEAKER_01: Like, do it.
14:59
SPEAKER_01: Totally.
14:59
SPEAKER_01: And um No right or wrong.
15:01
SPEAKER_01: No right or wrong.
15:02
SPEAKER_01: I mean, and that's kind of what I think if we really break it down, if no one's getting harmed, then most likely there's everyone is right.
15:13
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you know, maybe that's too simple, but like I think that's maybe a line around harm and really just knowing that there's so many ways to do this.
15:25
SPEAKER_01: There's so many ways to parent.
15:27
SPEAKER_02: This comes up in my work a lot though, Deb, because I think that sometimes as new mothers, we're actually really scared of causing harm.
15:38
SPEAKER_02: Right.
15:39
SPEAKER_02: And we get so self-protective and almost a little self-righteous about that, that if someone else is modeling something that we even a little a little part of us knows that we're capable of, right?
15:55
SPEAKER_02: This goes back to that earlier thing.
15:57
SPEAKER_02: That what I when I see that person doing that thing, like let's say I'm a breastfeeding mom and I see someone bottle feeding, right?
16:07
SPEAKER_02: And I am so terrified about making the wrong choices in motherhood, but I actually don't really want to be breastfeeding.
16:14
SPEAKER_02: And I see someone bottle feeding, right?
16:17
SPEAKER_02: Yep.
16:17
SPEAKER_02: And rather than understand that I am judging that part of myself that's interesting, interested in bottle feeding instead of breastfeeding, I will judge that mom.
16:27
SPEAKER_01: There's the inner conflict.
16:28
SPEAKER_01: That's the inner conflict.
16:29
SPEAKER_01: And then the flip side of that is let's say I'm breastfeeding and I'm just so clear that that's all I care about.
16:36
SPEAKER_01: Everyone else's choice doesn't really matter.
16:38
SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
16:39
SPEAKER_02: Right.
16:39
SPEAKER_02: So that goes back to the what is this feeling telling me about me instead of what is it telling you about you.
16:44
SPEAKER_02: But if we're not paying attention, that gets so muddled and we really screw up actually in those moments.
16:50
SPEAKER_02: We talked about this last week with Sage, right?
16:53
SPEAKER_02: We can really if we're acting upon those judgments without pausing and getting curious about ourselves, we can ruin relationships.
16:59
SPEAKER_01: Yes, absolutely.
17:00
SPEAKER_01: We I mean I think that it goes back to so let it goes back to what do we do with it, right?
17:06
SPEAKER_01: So you've you've named we feel it in our bodies, we get curious with ourselves, what is it telling me about me?
17:14
SPEAKER_01: And then I think if it's a relationship like we have, or you know, because a lot of times parent the I would say some of the biggest judgments come up with the people we're closest with often or who we're parenting with.
17:26
SPEAKER_02: Right.
17:27
SPEAKER_02: Or yeah, or our own parents.
17:29
SPEAKER_02: I mean, how often do we have we been, of course, and do you hear about other people who are feeling so judged by their own mothers or their aunts or their mother's friends or their mother-in-laws or whatever it is, right?
17:42
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely, absolutely.
17:44
SPEAKER_01: So I think this, and this is not going to be a one-size-fits-all, but I do think that there's so much opportunity to have a repair that could be really healthy and go a long way if the relationship is safe enough for that.
17:59
SPEAKER_01: What would that look like?
18:00
SPEAKER_01: Well, I think it happened with us.
18:01
SPEAKER_01: Ah.
18:02
SPEAKER_01: I think that we actually like named it, moved through it.
18:06
SPEAKER_01: There were tears, there was defensiveness, there was honesty, there was vulnerability.
18:10
SPEAKER_01: And then we got to the next place in our relationship.
18:13
SPEAKER_01: So that is an example of of a place where it can be really safe and healthy.
18:19
SPEAKER_01: Um, I've been in a situation before where I felt myself judging someone and later I shot a text and was just like, hey, uh I want to own something.
18:27
SPEAKER_01: I f I think I was critical of you in that moment.
18:30
SPEAKER_01: And so the power of ownership.
18:32
SPEAKER_01: Oh my gosh, I mean, you never it's uh it's so big and it's actually this kind of awesome opportunity to not be attached to an outcome.
18:39
SPEAKER_01: Totally.
18:40
SPEAKER_01: Because if I'm gonna own something, I'm doing it so that I know I'm owning it, you are hearing it, and then I don't I can't be attached to you forgiving me or giving me props or anything, but it's just owning it to own it.
18:54
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
18:55
SPEAKER_01: And I think that really goes so deep into inadequacy, compared comparing jealousy, all of it.
19:02
SPEAKER_02: I'm wondering if we can just take a minute and bring the idea of self-compassion back in.
19:06
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
19:07
SPEAKER_02: Right?
19:07
SPEAKER_02: Because I know that when I either side of the coin, if I recognize that I'm being judgmental towards someone else, right?
19:18
SPEAKER_02: Or if I am feeling judged by someone else, the worst thing I can do is get critical about either of those things.
19:26
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
19:26
SPEAKER_02: Right.
19:27
SPEAKER_02: And shame shows up when that happens.
19:29
SPEAKER_02: And we know that the anecdote to shame is empathy and self-compassion or compassion, right?
19:34
SPEAKER_02: So I think that is that time.
19:36
SPEAKER_02: I love that reframing of that question.
19:38
SPEAKER_02: We've now said this like three times, but rather than what is that ma other mom's behavior telling me about her, the question is what is it telling me about myself?
19:48
SPEAKER_02: And how do we actually tap into self-compassion in that moment?
19:53
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
19:53
SPEAKER_02: Once we've turned it back to ourselves.
19:55
SPEAKER_02: Not criticiz not more criticism and judgment towards ourselves, because then we're down that rabbit hole, but self-compassion.
20:02
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
20:04
SPEAKER_01: And tenderness, you know.
20:06
SPEAKER_01: I mean, and I think the biggest piece of self-compassion is recognizing that it's just a part of you, it's not all of you.
20:15
SPEAKER_01: And we have so many layers and parts of ourselves that all deserve attention, and so then it's actually we can look at it with gentle eyes.
20:25
SPEAKER_02: Also, yes, right?
20:28
SPEAKER_02: Um judgment, judging other people.
20:32
SPEAKER_02: I think what we need to back up and say, actually, we maybe we should have said this in the beginning, but none of us know what the F we're doing.
20:38
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
20:40
SPEAKER_02: So judgment assumes that we know more than someone else does.
20:44
SPEAKER_02: And we're all trying to figure this thing out all the time.
20:47
SPEAKER_02: Hallelujah.
20:48
SPEAKER_02: Hallelujah.
20:49
SPEAKER_02: Thank you for ending on that.
20:51
SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
20:51
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
20:52
SPEAKER_02: So um, Deb.
20:54
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
20:56
SPEAKER_02: This is a short podcast this week.
20:58
SPEAKER_01: No, it's right on right when we wanted it.
21:00
SPEAKER_01: Okay, right where we wanted 20 minutes.
21:02
SPEAKER_02: Okay, so Deb, um, I think in wrapping up, I did this last week, but I think maybe it would be useful for us to just name some of the things that let's get vulnerable for a moment.
21:12
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
21:13
SPEAKER_02: Each of us to name out loud some of the things that we are unsettled about within ourselves that might show up as judgments towards other people.
21:22
SPEAKER_02: And the re and again, I want to say this has nothing to do with the other people.
21:27
SPEAKER_02: Totally and everything to do with ourselves.
21:29
SPEAKER_02: And I'll start us off because I have a couple that come up a lot, right?
21:34
SPEAKER_02: I am very unsettled right now with the amount of time that my girls are on their phones.
21:45
SPEAKER_02: I'm unsettled with how to manage that within my own parenting right now.
21:50
SPEAKER_02: And I know that that because I'm so unsure and uncomfortable about that, that that could be a place that if I weren't paying attention, I could get.
22:00
SPEAKER_02: Judgmental of other people for some of the choices they're making.
22:03
SPEAKER_02: That's like my most present example.
22:05
SPEAKER_01: That's a really good one.
22:07
SPEAKER_01: Um oh, I got two.
22:10
SPEAKER_01: Well, one is I feel like I have been a really lazy cook lately.
22:18
SPEAKER_01: And um and I Are we back in the um mac and cheese and chicken nugget stage?
22:24
SPEAKER_01: Yes, I'm unsettled within myself about how my kids' eating choices are, and I'm feeling um I'm just feeling a like a little out of control of it, and also just paying attention to all of how out of control and food and me showing up as a great cook, you know, nourishing my family, all of that is coming up for me right now.
22:51
SPEAKER_02: Stir it up for you.
22:52
SPEAKER_01: So then, like when my kids want pizza again, and then I get mad at them for wanting pizza, just like me that had didn't get time to go to the store, that's a whole inner struggle for me.
23:02
SPEAKER_02: Or how that this could show up for you.
23:04
SPEAKER_02: Don't know if it has or not, but is that you see another mom feeding her kid pizza for the fourth day in a row and you feel a little judgmental towards her.
23:12
SPEAKER_01: That could be.
23:13
SPEAKER_02: But that's but that's how it happens.
23:16
SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
23:17
SPEAKER_02: Um exactly.
23:19
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think those are two good examples.
23:22
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
23:23
SPEAKER_02: So we want to hear from you.
23:25
SPEAKER_00: Yes, you guys.
23:26
SPEAKER_02: We want to hear from you what are the things that you feel judged about in motherhood, or what are the things that you catch yourself judging other people about?
23:34
SPEAKER_02: You can come on to our Instagram feed at motherhood, what's our podcast called?
23:39
SPEAKER_02: At motherhood uncut podcast.
23:42
SPEAKER_02: Um, and and post them there and we can have some discussions.
23:44
SPEAKER_02: Because I actually think one of the best things about a podcast like this is that we learn that, oh my God, we all do this stuff all the time.
23:51
SPEAKER_01: That's the connectedness.
23:52
SPEAKER_01: That's what we're trying we're trying to create is this connectedness of motherhood and that's right.
23:59
SPEAKER_01: Again, I had already said it, but I want to say it again, we're more alike than we're different.
24:03
SPEAKER_01: And I think that that is such an important thing to remember because otherwise it can feel so isolating.
24:09
SPEAKER_01: Um the other thing is we want to hear other questions from you.
24:13
SPEAKER_01: So if you, if there's any topics you want us to cover, please send us emails, write on our Instagram, whatever, any way to get in touch with us, that would be wonderful.
24:23
SPEAKER_02: For those of you watching the video, I'm sorry about this background today.
24:26
SPEAKER_02: It's a it's a little uninteresting.
24:29
SPEAKER_02: Uninteresting.
24:30
SPEAKER_02: Um, Deb, I just want to mention our sponsors before we jump off today.
24:34
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
24:35
SPEAKER_02: We have um, we actually have four really big sponsors, right?
24:39
SPEAKER_02: The first is the Postpartum Wellness Center here in Boulder.
24:42
SPEAKER_02: The Postpartum Wellness Center is a collaborative comprehensive care clinic that focuses on early maternal mental health, and and we we support moms all over um the state of Colorado.
24:53
SPEAKER_02: Um why don't you tell it talk to us about Mother Daughter Journey?
24:57
SPEAKER_01: And then there is the Mother Daughter Journey, which is trying to change the cultural messaging about how mothers and teens and tween girls have to look and how if we can empower moms to find their way in order for our girls to find our way, we can parent in a different way with more confidence.
25:14
SPEAKER_01: So that includes classes that I teach and that are just for moms, and mother-daughter workshops where moms and daughters come together to learn a bunch of tools and skills.
25:25
SPEAKER_02: I took those workshops, they're amazing.
25:28
SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
25:29
SPEAKER_02: Um, we also you can also follow me at at Kate Kripke where I have some of my coaching and consulting thoughts up there.
25:36
SPEAKER_02: Finally, I'd like to mention the one clock.
25:38
SPEAKER_01: Oh, one clock.
25:40
SPEAKER_02: Oneclock.co.
25:41
SPEAKER_02: If you're interested in uh waking up to a clock, that's gonna help you your nervous system get off to the right start.
25:47
SPEAKER_02: Wake up better.
25:48
SPEAKER_02: Wake up better with the one clock.
25:50
SPEAKER_01: We love you, listeners.
25:52
SPEAKER_01: Yes, thank you so much, and we'll see you next time.
25:55
SPEAKER_02: Dad?
25:56
SPEAKER_01: Kate.
25:56
SPEAKER_02: Love ya.
25:57
SPEAKER_01: Love you.
25:58
SPEAKER_02: Bye.