Latest / A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast / Talks to Dylan Rees & Luke Molloy about their choice of The Keys of Marinus (1/6)

Transcript

Talks to Dylan Rees & Luke Molloy about their choice of The Keys of Marinus (1/6) · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

• 0:33
  Hamster with a blunt. Pen knife for doing quicker
• 0:35
  quicker. All right, someone give me 3
• 0:37
  seconds. 3-1, 3 2/1. 1. Welcome back to a hamster with a
• 0:51
  blood pen knife the Doctor Who commentary pot.
• 0:54
  I don't say that very often these days, you know, I'm so
• 0:56
  busy saying fucking strictly cum hamster hamster book club
• 1:00
  hamster erotic novel series Jesus for hamster app the Doctor
• 1:06
  Who commentary podcast hello. It's a rare thing these days to
• 1:10
  bring together two of the hottest men in all of Doctor Who
• 1:13
  fandom. I've got with me Mr. Luke
• 1:17
  Malloy. Hello, Luke.
• 1:18
  Hello, very excited to be here. Is that all you got?
• 1:24
  We've got 6 fucking episodes to get from.
• 1:27
  He's saving the chat. He's.
• 1:28
  Saving the chat. Yeah, Christ, not even said what
• 1:30
  we're doing. And there's a voice there that
• 1:32
  we all just heard for the first time, the dulcet tones of the
• 1:36
  gorgeous Mr. Dylan Reece. Hello, Dylan.
• 1:38
  Hello, it's lovely to be back. We were supposed to be back
• 1:42
  earlier than this with with Star Beast, but that didn't happen
• 1:46
  for many. Complicated because I didn't
• 1:49
  like the starbeast, so I thought it'd.
• 1:51
  Be fun because. I wanted to do the commentary
• 1:56
  because I didn't like it, and when it was one episode on its
• 1:58
  own, I didn't like. But now I've got issues with the
• 2:00
  whole era. I just don't want to be a
• 2:02
  negative ninny. Also, when we were going to do
• 2:06
  it, I felt like everyone was pretty on board with RCD too.
• 2:09
  So you were proper out there as the controversial figure now?
• 2:13
  Everyone thinks it's a plan. I do find we've got to find
• 2:16
  something though, right? Because we did the one where,
• 2:18
  you know, Luke was the moaning Mary spy fall.
• 2:21
  We did the one where I was the moaning Mary, which was
• 2:24
  impossible astronaut. So we've got to find one.
• 2:27
  And he and Luke love. Oh yeah, exactly.
• 2:30
  You turn me around on Hell Bent, though.
• 2:31
  We've got a fine one where Dylan don't like it, but the two of us
• 2:34
  like it. How do you feel about Deep
• 2:35
  Breath? Oh no.
• 2:38
  Awful. I was going to say that's not
• 2:39
  going to rhyme with Joe, but it's good.
• 2:41
  It's. So boring.
• 2:43
  Apart from the bit where the newspaper brains though.
• 2:45
  That's hilarious. Hey guys, what are we here to
• 2:48
  talk about today? I'm sure we've got, you know, 3
• 2:51
  hours to spare. Well, there's three of us.
• 2:54
  There's 3 little void submarines going over to the island.
• 3:00
  What is it? It's the the island of what?
• 3:03
  I guess at the Island of Death, but it's a.
• 3:04
  Sea of death. Sea of death surrounds the
• 3:07
  island, and that's where we're headed to Marinus.
• 3:10
  I'm hoping this. Of my anus.
• 3:14
  Oh, OK. Well, there is a bit of hump the
• 3:16
  key in there so we could have some fun later.
• 3:19
  I'm hoping you guys can sort of explain to me the geography of
• 3:22
  Marinus as we go along. As I was watching through this,
• 3:24
  I was like, there's so much going on on this planet.
• 3:27
  I can't quite figure out how you've got these ice tundras and
• 3:29
  these magical cities, desert, landscape.
• 3:32
  I mean, it's all going on on this planet.
• 3:34
  Isn't it all that on our planet? Yeah, I think, I think this, I
• 3:37
  think this is the only one in Doctor Who's entire history that
• 3:41
  feels like a planet and not, not a planet, that city size.
• 3:46
  What was that book called? Now this are too hot for TV spin
• 3:50
  off media. You might know this that
• 3:52
  fabulous book which was like the Atlas of Doctor Who or something
• 3:55
  like that, where it it literally did this.
• 3:57
  It was like maps of planets where lots of is that.
• 4:00
  Fairly recently, in the last, yeah.
• 4:02
  I saw it in Forbidden Planet and Marinus is on there with all the
• 4:05
  different locations that they go.
• 4:06
  Yeah, because it's got Trentsilor on there as.
• 4:08
  Well, Trentsilor, yeah, that's. On there, it's like a more
• 4:11
  colour. It's sort of infographic book.
• 4:14
  Yeah. I don't know what it's called.
• 4:15
  I think it might. Is it not just called the Atlas?
• 4:17
  Something like that. It's got basically about 10
• 4:20
  pages devoted just to London, the various boroughs, because
• 4:22
  there's so much. Going on there, planet London.
• 4:26
  Does it talk about how in the Daleks invasion of Earth 2150 AD
• 4:30
  London's been squashed together and the the the skyline is
• 4:34
  actually impossible? Like so Paul's is next to Big
• 4:37
  Ben or whatever it is. It's gorgeous though.
• 4:40
  I know that we're already off target, but.
• 4:42
  Cracks in time cracks. In yeah, I think most Doctor Who
• 4:45
  planets though, just look like ice world from Dragon Fire,
• 4:48
  where there's like one big land mass at the top and then the
• 4:51
  rest is just sea or buckle. Jason Thompson.
• 4:55
  Calls it small planet syndrome. You know, you just have like one
• 4:58
  location where everybody is. Yeah.
• 5:01
  Except except marinus. Except Marinus.
• 5:04
  Exactly. Good link.
• 5:07
  Thank you 800 of these. Now I've got a question for you
• 5:11
  though, before we go into episode one, if I may, I'm going
• 5:14
  to throw this out to to Dylan 1st and then to Luke.
• 5:17
  And that is like when did you discover the Hartnell era?
• 5:22
  Because I know Luke that wasn't your in that your in was the new
• 5:24
  series. So then you must have come back
• 5:26
  to this later. How old do you think Dylan is?
• 5:30
  There's no way this was his first bloody story.
• 5:33
  Or this era. Dylan, you started with McCoy,
• 5:35
  didn't you? I did start with McCoy and then
• 5:38
  I got into Doctor Who, got some videos.
• 5:41
  I know that I can't remember which one was first, but I
• 5:44
  think, well, my first arsenal would have been the Five
• 5:47
  Doctors, so it would have been Richard Hurdner.
• 5:50
  And then I definitely got An Earthly Child and the Daleks and
• 5:54
  thought they were dull as shit because I was like 8 years old
• 5:58
  and they were in black and white and boring.
• 6:00
  And then I probably when I was about 9 or 10, I got obsessed
• 6:04
  with the Hartnell Years VHS, which I know hasn't got an
• 6:07
  amazing array of episodes on it. It's got the Celestial Toy Maker
• 6:13
  episode 4. Yahoo.
• 6:16
  It's got the pilot and it's got the one that really got me
• 6:19
  though, the one that I loved was the Crusade Episode 3.
• 6:23
  And so I got a bit more into it. And then by my teams, I was, I
• 6:26
  was, you know, I was a Hartnall fanboy and I, I tape traded like
• 6:31
  various sort of UK gold recordings and sent off for all
• 6:35
  the recons. And I was just sort of
• 6:37
  maintaining the massacre like every other weekend it was.
• 6:41
  And it's still my after the McCoy era.
• 6:43
  It's my go to classic series era.
• 6:46
  It's gorgeous, the 1st and the last eras of the classic.
• 6:50
  Everything in between is a load of shit but.
• 6:52
  It's all generic stuff I like to show when it's experimental.
• 6:55
  There it's basically it's an argument there, you know, I
• 6:58
  think there is an argument that those were the two most
• 7:00
  experimental. It's McCoy and it's Jodie
• 7:02
  Whittaker. The rest of it's shit.
• 7:03
  It's not. It's not repair.
• 7:07
  Move on to Luke. Luke, the William Hartnell era.
• 7:10
  I would say it was doing it would have been the Five
• 7:12
  Doctors, so it wouldn't have been Hartnell, but then I I'm
• 7:15
  guessing it would have been the beginning box set, which I don't
• 7:19
  think bored me shitless. I was probably just fascinated
• 7:22
  by the law and stuff at the time.
• 7:26
  You're awful. Yeah, I was.
• 7:28
  Definitely was, definitely less so now I'm.
• 7:35
  Yeah. There's something about the
• 7:36
  heart and all that's a bit magical.
• 7:38
  You know, you like, I think I used to watch it out of pure
• 7:42
  fascination. Doesn't quite feel like it
• 7:45
  should exist. It's just a bit bit spooky and a
• 7:49
  bit magic. Saying that, I'm talking
• 7:53
  specifically about the futuristic ones or the sideways
• 7:55
  ones, because the historicals did and still sort of do bore me
• 8:00
  no matter how good this. Comes.
• 8:02
  No matter how good people tell me.
• 8:04
  Historicals. And people tell me the dialogue
• 8:06
  is good and badly bad. OK, I do agree.
• 8:08
  But yeah, they are boring at the same time.
• 8:11
  Luke. Give me Planet a Giants over the
• 8:14
  Aztecs any day. The only thing that's left for
• 8:17
  you is death, and death is very far away.
• 8:20
  You know where that's from? No.
• 8:23
  The Crusade episode. Thank you.
• 8:25
  An episode where Julian Glover goes Joanna.
• 8:29
  Nobody says Joanna like that. You defy me with the pop You.
• 8:33
  Defy the world with your politics.
• 8:37
  We're doing, we're doing a much better episode of The Crusade
• 8:39
  today, though. Come on.
• 8:40
  That is true. That is true.
• 8:42
  I think this one I really liked as a kid because of that
• 8:45
  variation if some black and whites, you can get a bit tired.
• 8:48
  This one brand new set and brand new thing every week.
• 8:52
  Bang, let's go. Which are all I love about the
• 8:54
  heart in the era. I think I might have discovered
• 8:57
  some of the soundtracks first and then watched the videos.
• 9:00
  I remember watching the Aztecs and I absolutely loving it.
• 9:03
  And I was sort of flawed about how pacey it was.
• 9:06
  I really thought it was going to be creaky and slow and that
• 9:08
  because that's only four episodes it goes bye bye a lick.
• 9:11
  But Marinus is a brilliant example of why I love the First
• 9:14
  Doctor here at because all bets are off.
• 9:17
  They can't afford to show you this planet in the corner of
• 9:20
  Lime Grove, but fucking hell, they're going to have a go at it
• 9:23
  anyway. So they'll they'll take you to
• 9:25
  every single corner of this planet and every danger they
• 9:28
  want to show you for tuppence. And fuck me, I just love
• 9:32
  watching them try. That's why I love the word
• 9:34
  planet. I think you can't do this.
• 9:36
  You don't have the resources, the time, and certainly not the
• 9:38
  director, but you're still going to give it a go.
• 9:41
  And to be honest with you, there are parts of the keys of mirrors
• 9:44
  you could probably point at, you know, as a man in TV too.
• 9:46
  And you can probably point and say they could have done that a
• 9:48
  bit better. There's a couple of moments,
• 9:51
  just one or two. But you talk about that little
• 9:54
  cardboard void, who goes? I'm talking about 97% of it's to
• 9:58
  be perfectly. Honest.
• 10:00
  You could point those bits out for us please as we go in, but
• 10:03
  we're all starting from a place of love for the era and love for
• 10:07
  the story, right? Yeah, and and love for ambition.
• 10:11
  And I think what I think this gets exactly right is I believe
• 10:15
  in this world every every episode where we go somewhere
• 10:18
  different, I believe in it. So even if there's a few dodgy
• 10:22
  slip UPS in acting or lines or whatever, the world feels
• 10:28
  believable. Yeah.
• 10:29
  And so I'm immersed in it. I mean, I believe every single
• 10:33
  place they go to is basically an escape room in this story.
• 10:36
  So I believe in the the building full of escape rooms.
• 10:39
  At least I believe that. I don't think at any point I
• 10:41
  believe that jungle and that place where they go in and look
• 10:44
  in jars for the key is a is a real place.
• 10:47
  Really. Do you think that looks?
• 10:48
  Yeah. Because it's weird and alien,
• 10:50
  and they're on a weird and alien planet.
• 10:52
  But but it's also because Doctor Who doesn't have a format at
• 10:55
  this point. It's an anthology show, as we
• 10:57
  know, but this is a real anthology show.
• 10:59
  It's going these are all tied together, but every week is a
• 11:03
  different mini adventure on this world.
• 11:05
  Like nobody's gone. Well, if you're doing 6 parts,
• 11:08
  it's six parts all in the same place with the same monster and
• 11:10
  the same villains. This has got a new threat every
• 11:13
  week with and it's just sort of bookended by the board.
• 11:16
  So it's, it's it, it sticks out from a lot of the other episodes
• 11:20
  of the time. In fact, probably all of them.
• 11:22
  Is there another story you can think of in the 60s that's like
• 11:25
  that? Or any point?
• 11:26
  This sort of like the War games, but it doesn't bookend it, but
• 11:30
  it has the sort of in and outness of Marinus.
• 11:34
  Oh God. My other trouble with this is
• 11:37
  obviously Mark adores his story as well, and he loves quest
• 11:40
  stories. So he's now brought me around to
• 11:43
  his way of thinking this the Chase, the Daleks, master plan,
• 11:46
  anything where you're going from a, you know, to a new place from
• 11:49
  episode to where? Yeah, I do love them as well.
• 11:51
  You can't really get bored, can you?
• 11:53
  You can't get bored. I think there's an argument to
• 11:56
  be made that the Keys of Virus is the most successful Doctor
• 11:58
  Who arc that we've ever had. Can you write that thesis then
• 12:03
  please? I can try and vocalize over the
• 12:06
  next 6 episodes. Excellent.
• 12:09
  Well, shall we dip our toes into the sea of death then at.
• 12:13
  Least our shoes to do that. At least our shoes.
• 12:15
  Oh. Yeah, of course.
• 12:16
  Sorry. You could have lent a hers.
• 12:22
  So many horrible quotes to do in this July.
• 12:24
  We're in a very odd position today that we're all in
• 12:26
  agreement. Oh yeah.
• 12:29
  Let's make this interesting. Seriously.
• 12:31
  Yeah, I understand how interesting it's.
• 12:34
  Not even in colour. I mean, I will.
• 12:36
  I will laugh at some of the more inept moments, like Carolyn
• 12:40
  Ford's acting. Oh, stop it.
• 12:42
  I'm not sitting there for six episodes where you slug off
• 12:44
  Carolyn Ford's The Peria. See you later.
• 12:46
  Then in 54321 we go, oh God, I've got the sound up.
• 12:56
  Jesus Christ. Very professional way to start.
• 13:00
  Right straight off the bat, you know this starts with the
• 13:03
  beautiful shot of Marinus. Like the Triangle, the building
• 13:08
  in the city. Starting with the title
• 13:09
  sequence, aren't you? Yeah, but Oh my.
• 13:11
  God just getting us going. He's getting ahead.
• 13:13
  We've all seen the title sequence.
• 13:15
  What do you want to say about the title sequence then, Joe?
• 13:17
  It's my favorite of all of them. It's a good one, isn't it?
• 13:19
  Yeah, very important. I believe in this alien planet
• 13:23
  more than the one in Boom. Is this a problem?
• 13:25
  Discussed. Well, you see more of it.
• 13:29
  There's more detail, very. True.
• 13:31
  I just this is just. Stunning shot.
• 13:33
  Yeah, this is stunning, but it's the reflection in the water
• 13:35
  actually makes it really real. Are those sort of polar ice caps
• 13:40
  in the background there? What is that?
• 13:41
  Oh yeah, there's a Terry going on everything.
• 13:43
  No, let's, no, let's go. Polar ice caps I.
• 13:46
  Like that Ice caps. Oh, when it zooms in.
• 13:48
  So someone's literally made this island and then put this tiny
• 13:51
  little TARDIS on it. Yeah.
• 13:52
  Yeah. Oh, it's bigger on the inside.
• 13:55
  It's Raymond Cusick, isn't it? He's he's the one that's doing
• 13:57
  all these early stories. Now, why is Ian still dressed up
• 14:01
  from Marco Polo, but everyone else seems to have gotten
• 14:03
  changed? That would be.
• 14:04
  He just found the outfit sexy. It is sexy isn't everything.
• 14:07
  I don't know why the Doctor asked to explain that he hasn't
• 14:10
  got colour TV when the whole thing's in black and white
• 14:12
  anyway. He could have called the TV.
• 14:14
  In the original script, at this point he was explaining that the
• 14:18
  reason he was in London in 1963, this was a screwed remembrance
• 14:23
  of the Daleks, was that he was going to Television Centre to
• 14:25
  find out how to turn his scanner into colour.
• 14:30
  The TV man. No.
• 14:33
  No, that's a real fact. It's on the commentary of this.
• 14:36
  Oh boy, I love the little submarines.
• 14:39
  With the TV's in colour. Because.
• 14:42
  We wouldn't. We wouldn't.
• 14:43
  Know it's very unusual for Doctor Who to do this as going
• 14:48
  forward is having like no dialogue and it's just telling
• 14:51
  the narrative through pictures. Being pulled along by string.
• 14:55
  One of those little one of those little things still exists, you
• 14:57
  know, I believe it's in the. Collection the full size 1.
• 15:01
  No, the little ones. I believe it's in the collection
• 15:02
  of David J Huh. And I like the way this last one
• 15:05
  struggles up onto the beach because obviously it's sprung
• 15:08
  the leak. That's like you turning up at
• 15:11
  Hooverville at half ten straight late out of the Premier in bed
• 15:16
  when the rest of us are already there.
• 15:18
  That is me. We're all living in a void
• 15:21
  submarine. Now you just love the little cut
• 15:23
  out of walls inside the submarines as well.
• 15:26
  I just like the details, you know?
• 15:28
  Yes, yeah. Now this four shot of the TARDIS
• 15:32
  team, half of it appears in a Matt Smith episode.
• 15:37
  Do you know which one it is? Oh my God.
• 15:41
  It's the name of the Doctor when it when Susan and the Doctor are
• 15:47
  going to get in the TARDIS. It's a little clip from them to
• 15:51
  get outside the TARDIS there when they hear the baps cut off.
• 15:56
  Right, the board, the board are here.
• 15:58
  Yes, so you 2 would both look very sexy and like get up.
• 16:03
  Which we would, we would, yeah. I, I, I've got a question about
• 16:08
  the boards that I haven't watched this quite keenly.
• 16:11
  I still didn't have the answer to are the board human looking
• 16:15
  and wearing that suit or are they just that suit because
• 16:20
  because there's a question about them being the acid gets inside
• 16:24
  and burns them and they said there's some there's a line.
• 16:27
  Layer in the suit, don't you they find?
• 16:29
  Yeah, and there's a line layer about them being human.
• 16:33
  But the question is, is, is their head shaped like the mask?
• 16:37
  I hope so, yes. Yeah.
• 16:38
  Me too. It'd be very impractical.
• 16:40
  Has anyone heard domain of the board from Big Finish?
• 16:43
  Did that explain what the void were like?
• 16:45
  I don't think. So but it makes them, it goes
• 16:47
  out of its way to make them a real menace.
• 16:49
  And it's, it's really quite an enjoy.
• 16:51
  I really enjoyed. That one but Andrew Smith.
• 16:54
  It was, yeah. Well worth a Well worth a.
• 16:56
  Little Susan's sniveling already.
• 16:58
  None of us. No one knows what a void looks
• 17:01
  like. No.
• 17:02
  That's what was blowing that was blowing my mind.
• 17:05
  I mean, the story doesn't go out of its way to show us either.
• 17:07
  You guys keep talking. I'm just going to Google naked.
• 17:12
  I might just get naked pictures of Carol Vorderman.
• 17:15
  If it directs you to Deviant Art, don't go there.
• 17:18
  Doctor screw season 3 like. What do you think about these
• 17:22
  fabulous triangular rocks? Look.
• 17:24
  Yeah, brilliant. Alien.
• 17:26
  How do you make rocks, Alien? Just making triangles make them
• 17:30
  symmetrical because my sorry, sorry, back to the board thing
• 17:34
  that because they're wearing the the scuba diver seats so they
• 17:37
  don't get burnt in the acid sea. It's just so it's just I've
• 17:42
  watched my own loads of times. It's only this time I realised
• 17:45
  we've not seen is. It what it is, though, it's a
• 17:48
  great silhouette, right? That shadow shot is like, yeah,
• 17:53
  it's great, isn't it? It's a shame VORD Mania didn't
• 17:56
  sweep the nation after this because this got higher ratings
• 17:59
  than the Daleks. This got terrific ratings,
• 18:03
  didn't they? One of the episodes got 10.7
• 18:06
  million for this story. You know where the vord should
• 18:09
  have come back though Spiteful. That was the that was the
• 18:13
  moment. And God then, then you would
• 18:16
  have had all three of us praising it to her.
• 18:19
  Are you talking about the Jodie Whitts career there?
• 18:22
  You know, when we went to that planet in Ghost Monument, I
• 18:26
  figured that was the sort of thing they were going to do,
• 18:27
  right? Because she'd have the, she'd
• 18:30
  have the one of these watches and we'd be hopping about all
• 18:33
  over the planet and having a great time.
• 18:35
  We didn't have time for that. No, I know.
• 18:37
  We have to get a bandage to drop a a plot point for the next
• 18:41
  season. This really reminds me of the
• 18:43
  ghost monument apart from we actually see the acid sea burn
• 18:46
  something in this. Yeah, only in Only in a rock
• 18:49
  pool. Though only in the chip no there
• 18:52
  would you have a. Why is it?
• 18:54
  Is it like most piranha field sea or something?
• 18:57
  No, it's just an acid. Sea.
• 18:58
  Is it just an acid sea? But we don't see anything get
• 19:00
  burned. I don't know what this would say
• 19:02
  about me, but I would absolutely sleep in one of those
• 19:05
  submarines. It just put a cushion in there
• 19:07
  and a duvet. I'll be happy as Larry.
• 19:10
  Are you into sensory deprivation?
• 19:11
  No, I just like Thai spaces I think.
• 19:14
  I love how spiky all the rocks are on this.
• 19:18
  Planet we. Were doing that?
• 19:20
  Yeah. Are you typing?
• 19:22
  Up, naked, bored. Bored footprints?
• 19:24
  Did you see them? They look just like flip flops.
• 19:28
  The the board also show up in a couple of comics, don't they?
• 19:33
  So there's one in the 80s where they say that they evolve into
• 19:37
  Cybermen or Vorderman. Carol Vorderman.
• 19:39
  Again, this is the same joke. I don't know you're.
• 19:41
  Making. This I'm not, I'm not.
• 19:43
  There's a thing where they turn into Cybermen.
• 19:45
  But they're not. Called Vorderman, are they?
• 19:47
  No, they're not bad. And they also show up in IDW
• 19:53
  comics as well as sorts of and like they turn them into like
• 19:55
  beefy motherfuckers. Too hot for TV man.
• 19:58
  It's blowing is like. How many trivia points have you
• 20:04
  got for the six episodes? Not many.
• 20:07
  This stuff is just in my mind or it's not, you know?
• 20:10
  You've missed 1 though. I know somewhere else where the
• 20:12
  board turn up Doom Coalition box set 2 episode 1 Beach head.
• 20:18
  Yes, written by Nicholas Briggs. And it's.
• 20:21
  Very good it was. A I've a raised.
• 20:23
  Doom Coalition from. My head.
• 20:24
  It's very good apart from spoiler at the end.
• 20:28
  A SWAT team snipes the void. So that pool void, the acid has
• 20:35
  leaked into his submarines and literally melted his entire
• 20:39
  body. Yeah.
• 20:40
  And he's just left his a limp suit.
• 20:42
  Yeah. Yeah, he's RIP.
• 20:44
  What a way to go. See, am I?
• 20:47
  I get the impression there's a line of dialogue where I get the
• 20:49
  impression that the void would just look like everyone else on
• 20:52
  Marinus. Yeah, and it's and it's like a
• 20:54
  cult. The border is called.
• 20:57
  I can see right into the distance there from that.
• 20:59
  Building. I love those.
• 21:00
  Look at that shot. Look at that shot of the
• 21:02
  building. Yeah, the way it looks up here,
• 21:05
  it's amazing, isn't it? Yeah, genuinely vertigenous.
• 21:10
  There's a real effort gone for this gone to into this, even if
• 21:14
  it doesn't always work. Have you seen it?
• 21:16
  Seriously. I think design wise the whole
• 21:18
  thing is brilliant, the whole 6 episodes.
• 21:20
  I mean, I don't think it's always successful, but I think
• 21:22
  they're always trying. Like, but have you seen the
• 21:26
  special feature with is it Raven P Cusack, the guy who designed
• 21:31
  the Daleks? And he did the designs for this
• 21:33
  and they come into him. So how do you feel about the
• 21:36
  Keys of Marinus? And he's like, yeah, it wasn't
• 21:38
  very good, was it? And for 10 minutes, they're
• 21:40
  trying to get something out of him, something positive, and
• 21:43
  they just failed and. It.
• 21:45
  Just ends. Have you seen it?
• 21:47
  It's a tough watch. It is a tough watch.
• 21:50
  These early DVDs, try them. Trying to get anything out of
• 21:54
  people on commentaries and stuff like that was a bit hit and
• 21:56
  miss. Although can I ask you, would
• 21:58
  you rather they did that sort of getting blood out of a stone or
• 22:01
  sort of the Crystal Maze challenges that they're doing
• 22:03
  now? No, I would rather blood out of
• 22:05
  a stone. There is a joy in in listening
• 22:07
  to people get blood out of the stone, isn't it?
• 22:09
  Yeah. Yes.
• 22:11
  It's almost more enjoyable than you, sort of just typical behind
• 22:15
  the sofas. Jolly, jolly, everything's good.
• 22:18
  There's nothing more exciting than a secret passage coming out
• 22:21
  of a wall like that, is there? That someone falls into.
• 22:25
  You're a fan of a secret passage?
• 22:26
  How many people fall into your secret?
• 22:28
  I'm. Going to try and be sensible.
• 22:30
  It's very sort of famous 5 though, isn't it?
• 22:32
  Sort of adventure storytelling. Also as a kid, like you're just
• 22:37
  obsessed with secret passages. Well, it's a building for traps,
• 22:40
  you know, and that's a sign for kids, so.
• 22:45
  I never realised how riddled the the whole thing is with errors
• 22:49
  until until watching it this time around.
• 22:53
  Like every episode has fluffs or crew walk into shot or just
• 22:58
  like. Basics.
• 23:01
  Like Susan doesn't see a void right in front of her before.
• 23:04
  It's not the most that it's not the most successful production,
• 23:10
  but as we were saying before, like I'm invested and just for
• 23:15
  the in. I think it's just fun.
• 23:17
  I think Season 1 can be quite worthy, shall we say, and this
• 23:23
  is the one that just goes for the entertainment jugular all
• 23:26
  the way through and they need it without this season.
• 23:29
  One, it would be seriously unbalanced, wouldn't it?
• 23:31
  Yeah. I also think this is the point
• 23:33
  where the crew start to get on for the first time, as in the
• 23:36
  TARDIS crew like they're on an adventure together and as much
• 23:39
  as Ian and Barbara might want to go home.
• 23:41
  Boom, Mike. Yeah, yeah, as much as they
• 23:46
  might want to go home, they know they're going the long way
• 23:48
  around now, so it's just about them all getting on and sort of
• 23:51
  the camaraderie and looking out for each other.
• 23:53
  I've got a genuine sartorial question for both of you.
• 23:56
  Now we. How sorry, how is Susan not
• 23:58
  seeing this thought anyway? Because she's Susan.
• 24:01
  She's stupid, all right. She's got telepathic powers,
• 24:04
  man. Oh boy, Arbitan's here.
• 24:06
  But Arbitan, even though he he says later, doesn't he, that he
• 24:09
  knows that they're not a threat, but he just keeps wandering up
• 24:12
  and down the corridor rather than going.
• 24:13
  There's a fucking void there, mate.
• 24:15
  There's a void. Or like, come with me, I've got
• 24:18
  a mission for you or something. You know, you could say any of
• 24:20
  those things. But I imagine that's partly down
• 24:23
  to sort of the space. And like in the script, I'm sure
• 24:26
  it made sense. Much like McCoy hanging off the
• 24:28
  thing in Dragon Fire, yeah. The hell stabbed that void.
• 24:32
  Arbiter. It's Arbiter, yeah.
• 24:35
  He's right down the end of the corridor.
• 24:37
  We did it earlier, it had been stabbed.
• 24:38
  For eight it's got stabbed ages ago.
• 24:41
  He was already dead, and usually.
• 24:44
  Susan didn't see him. I think it was supposed to be
• 24:46
  darker than it was. Usually when you die, you stand
• 24:49
  up for 10 minutes afterwards. Happens.
• 24:51
  In Marinus. Now we, no, we did establish in
• 24:54
  a previous hamster commentary we did together that Dylan is into
• 24:57
  high fashion. And so I've got a question about
• 24:59
  clothes because I don't know how she does it, but that dreadful
• 25:03
  bar jumper that Barbara wears all the time, it's just
• 25:06
  fabulous, isn't it? It's lovely.
• 25:08
  I mean, she looks like every librarian I've ever met.
• 25:11
  I like it's it's big neck opening.
• 25:15
  Make that what you. Will this actually reminds me of
• 25:23
  like the first episode of Daleks.
• 25:24
  Obviously Terry Nation, but it's that whole abandoned city.
• 25:29
  Weird alien city. The accusation that he works for
• 25:32
  a formula could be, you know, correct.
• 25:35
  I've no issue. Terry Nation.
• 25:37
  I think he's an absolute brilliant writer.
• 25:40
  I love, I love all the stories. He essentially writes a page
• 25:43
  Turner for the screen. Yeah.
• 25:45
  Yeah, yeah, he's great. And he just gets everyone really
• 25:49
  fun things to do. Like, for example, I'm sort of
• 25:52
  jumping way ahead now. They take Harlow out for a
• 25:54
  couple of episodes, but when he's back, it's the most joyous
• 25:56
  thing. Oh, it's loving it.
• 25:59
  But even if Nation's plot mechanics are very simple,
• 26:02
  that's quite nice. It's quite comforting.
• 26:04
  You know where you are and you can just.
• 26:06
  Moffett's are very, very, you know, the same every episode,
• 26:09
  but you know. Yeah, every right, He's got
• 26:11
  tropes. Exactly.
• 26:14
  I mean, you've got three very diverse opinions on that in this
• 26:17
  call. Don't know what you.
• 26:20
  Mean someone that always excuses it, someone that excuses it some
• 26:23
  of the time, and someone who never excuses it.
• 26:26
  This is totally off the topic, but yeah.
• 26:30
  He's not going to die. We know this.
• 26:32
  Like, I mean, the new series would not have this many knives
• 26:35
  on the show, would it? No, but.
• 26:37
  No one cared about knives. Is this the one who goes down
• 26:40
  the hole? I'd really love this bit.
• 26:42
  Yeah, man, kicked down a hole, he goes.
• 26:46
  I just like, I like this weird fight that Ian's has with him
• 26:49
  where they're just sort of holding each other's arms.
• 26:52
  Oh so Ian kills a lot of dudes in the 60s.
• 26:54
  Yeah, Ian doesn't give a fuck. He'll.
• 26:57
  Stab you. He's.
• 26:58
  A hero for the generations. And he looks fabulous as well.
• 27:03
  When you you take his clothes off and cover him in honey and
• 27:07
  and some run over his chest. There's just nothing he can't
• 27:11
  do. Just think.
• 27:13
  If they found that episode, that bit was shot in on on film so
• 27:17
  you could see his nipples in high def.
• 27:19
  You'd have to rebuy season 2 the collection though.
• 27:23
  I didn't do that. Yeah, I would.
• 27:26
  Where Ian's nipples? You bet your life this fella
• 27:30
  George. Oh, what's his name?
• 27:32
  George Caloris. Yeah.
• 27:34
  So he had done a lot of film, hadn't he?
• 27:38
  And all those film actors were sort of new to TV at this point
• 27:42
  and breaking their way into TV because he'd done some prestige
• 27:45
  films, I think. He's in Citizen Kane.
• 27:47
  He looks like he's struggling a bit though, doesn't he?
• 27:49
  Yeah, in a way that heart all sort of is perfect on on TV.
• 27:54
  Do you think it's the pace of it or having said that they have
• 27:57
  just come back from lunch? So because they broke for
• 28:00
  recording at 7:00 PM, my info text is telling me just before
• 28:05
  Ian killed the the Vorde did. You see that triangular door
• 28:08
  where he just slipped across there?
• 28:09
  Yeah, I. Love it.
• 28:11
  Oh, look at this, this remorse. Me and the mime robot.
• 28:13
  You know the Super brain. Yeah.
• 28:16
  Admittedly it's a very empty super brain though, isn't it?
• 28:19
  Well, that's because it hasn't got the keys in it.
• 28:22
  Yes, true. The camera just went just did a
• 28:24
  wobble up and down there and obviously hit a cable on the
• 28:27
  floor. But they're given a mission, and
• 28:30
  I think that's really exciting as well.
• 28:32
  And we do it a couple of times during dogs who don't.
• 28:34
  We key to time things like that. I think we like a mission.
• 28:37
  Love a mission, love a mission. It's a great clear setup.
• 28:42
  Like it's quite nice to know what's driving the characters
• 28:47
  occasionally because Doctor Who can be so sort of turned up.
• 28:51
  Do this for the sake of it. Leave.
• 28:53
  It is nice when there's a there's something in place.
• 28:56
  And it's interesting when you look at those all the failed
• 28:59
  attempts to make Doctor Who the movie in the late 80s and early
• 29:02
  90s, all of them are either quest or missions.
• 29:05
  Not that because it's the most simple's the wrong word, but
• 29:09
  it's it's the most effective way you can do the whole of Doctor
• 29:12
  Who because you know you're going to visit multiple
• 29:14
  locations across time and space and not be a beginning, a
• 29:17
  middle, and an end. Yeah, I always thought so.
• 29:20
  It's season 11, especially with the way it started that chip Nor
• 29:23
  was going to do a search for the TARDIS thing.
• 29:27
  Yeah, I was 2 episodes but in similar mind actually.
• 29:30
  I thought it might be like their planet hopping too fast
• 29:33
  together. That was a rumor that went
• 29:34
  round, wasn't it? That the TARDIS wasn't going to
• 29:36
  show up until the end of the. Series.
• 29:38
  I think I put it on a blog about a year before season 11 ahead.
• 29:42
  Maybe I started it, yeah. Can I also write because?
• 29:45
  I also said she should have a cat anyway to.
• 29:48
  Stop people from, you know, using this great conscious of
• 29:52
  marinus, yeah, this super brain or whatever it is, you know,
• 29:55
  they created 5 micro keys and put them in various destinations
• 29:59
  around the planet. Yeah, as we've discovered these
• 30:02
  keys throughout the story, can we just have a little chat about
• 30:05
  what the poor person would have had to have done to set up that
• 30:08
  key in that position? Because sometimes it's very
• 30:12
  complicated setup, For example the key that's in the block of
• 30:16
  ice in The Cave. I mean, it's quite, I mean,
• 30:20
  it's, it's quite similar to the Oster Hagen kit, isn't it?
• 30:23
  Yeah, but do you? Think he just put it in water,
• 30:26
  shoved it in the freezer, and when it was ready, right there
• 30:28
  you go. Shove it up against that ice
• 30:30
  ball. Let's go.
• 30:32
  Absolutely. I would have just stuck.
• 30:33
  Stuck it out of my bum. That would have been it.
• 30:36
  Yeah, I would. Have found it immediately.
• 30:40
  Susan and Barbara would have had to go rooting around and.
• 30:43
  Yeah, hide it in a copy of Susan's War.
• 30:44
  No one's finding that. I certainly wouldn't.
• 30:51
  Oh dear, Oh dear. I I should say.
• 30:54
  Sorry, that line. Sorry, Luke.
• 30:57
  It's the most stagey line in the whole thing.
• 31:01
  You must find the keys for me. I'd totally forgotten this bit
• 31:08
  until watched it again that only in the 60s.
• 31:11
  Does the TARDIS crew go? No, it sounds like quite a lot
• 31:13
  of work actually. We're just going to.
• 31:15
  We're just going to head back, which is brilliant.
• 31:18
  That's how. That's how everyone was act
• 31:21
  stuff your hero. This.
• 31:23
  Didn't you hear what Barbara just said?
• 31:24
  I felt so terrible for that old man.
• 31:27
  Oh well, let's go. Because they're not heroes.
• 31:30
  Yet you totally relate. It's just like it's not their
• 31:32
  problem. Yeah, if it was, the three of us
• 31:35
  and our Patan have gone right? Joe, Luke, Dylan, I need you to
• 31:38
  go and find that. Nah, you're right.
• 31:40
  I hope you, I hope you sort it out, but we're off.
• 31:43
  We're off down spoons. Premier Inn is calling OH.
• 31:48
  I love this invisible barrier acting.
• 31:50
  No one can quite decide how far out the barrier is because
• 31:53
  they're all at different. It's a wobbly barrier, everyone
• 31:56
  assumes they're flat, but actually it goes.
• 31:59
  Thank you for the sound effect, Dylan it.
• 32:01
  Was my pleasure. Oh, thanks, Susan.
• 32:04
  It goes all the way round, you know, do.
• 32:08
  You know what if they were to do in colour, they can't really cut
• 32:11
  anything out of this because every episode is subtle incident
• 32:16
  and. Yeah, nor should they.
• 32:19
  Nor should they. No.
• 32:20
  It's not like the war games where you can just get rid of
• 32:22
  two to 8. The same with the Daleks.
• 32:24
  Learn about bollocks that. Does Arbitan have speakers
• 32:27
  around the whole planet? His voice seems to be coming out
• 32:29
  of nowhere, like gold. It's a massive building, isn't
• 32:32
  it? Surely they've got some Subs?
• 32:34
  And megaphones, you know how that I tell her in Dealt with
• 32:40
  the Batterman wakes up and starts singing, you know,
• 32:42
  wearing the red, red. That's what Arbiter does in the
• 32:45
  morning as well, Yeah. I bet so the whole bored, so
• 32:48
  bored on that island because we have.
• 32:50
  Him there? No, we used to have that pretty
• 32:52
  Sabitha where he could have some fun with wasn't.
• 32:54
  That his daughter. That's his daughter.
• 32:56
  Different, different rules on Mariners.
• 33:00
  Oh sorry, I've forgotten that, I only watched it last.
• 33:02
  Week, they've just said there's two land masses.
• 33:07
  Interesting the ice one and the desert one.
• 33:10
  I guess so can we? Can we check this against Doctor
• 33:12
  Who the Atlas? Between one buy it, between now
• 33:15
  and then we do. It's like a recording place.
• 33:18
  I'll put together a special PowerPoint presentation for you
• 33:21
  for next time. I mean I this is following the
• 33:24
  formula of season 1 as well, isn't it?
• 33:25
  It's separate the regulars from the TARDIS in some way.
• 33:30
  I mean, this is the one time where it's literally just there.
• 33:32
  Usually it's been taken off or the locks gone or or something.
• 33:37
  I mean, not having the TARDIS or having control of it, it does
• 33:41
  make these early adventures so much more threatening.
• 33:44
  I'm not kidding you, this has two minutes left this episode.
• 33:48
  It's just shot by. But as you said back then, it
• 33:52
  wouldn't necessarily be like, it's not a given you've lost the
• 33:55
  TARDIS, It's not a given you're going to get it back.
• 33:57
  Like we know now, if anyone loses the TARDIS, they're
• 34:00
  getting it back. But at this point the whole show
• 34:03
  and the format is still very much up for grass.
• 34:06
  My first move a show would be that the Doctor can't saw this
• 34:11
  like like in Hartnell. It can't and actually control it
• 34:15
  because then that you know if you do lose someone along the
• 34:18
  way you can't have that question phone if why didn't you not just
• 34:21
  go back in time or why don't you just he can't do it but.
• 34:24
  Sorry, because he's going to vanish now for five episodes.
• 34:27
  I just have one moment for. More than five forever.
• 34:30
  For the sake of my people, I hope they succeed, he says,
• 34:34
  straight to camera. It's wonderful.
• 34:38
  Did you notice how they shipped to Barbara?
• 34:40
  Can you go and stand over there away from the rest of the
• 34:42
  regulars, please, because we want to do the special effect of
• 34:44
  you vanishing. Thank you very much.
• 34:47
  That's how they did it and now he's going to get stabbed in the
• 34:49
  back. What a way to go.
• 34:50
  I don't know why the boards are so like.
• 34:53
  Why are the so stabbing? No.
• 34:55
  Why are they going? Why are they going sub diffuse?
• 34:57
  Like if if three of them turned up against 1 old man, why did
• 35:00
  they not just go and absolutely do it?
• 35:03
  There's so many knives on the screen.
• 35:05
  This could be set in my hometown of Crawley.
• 35:07
  Do you know? It's very reminiscent.
• 35:10
  Oh my God. This is clearly a beautiful city
• 35:12
  that they've landed in. Look at that backdrop like
• 35:14
  Adrick's bedroom. It's not Adrick's bedroom
• 35:17
  though, is it? This is.
• 35:17
  Before that it's. Predomutants, yeah.
• 35:21
  This is another thing you love about Marinus, that every
• 35:24
  episode ends and you get a peek at what it's going to be next
• 35:28
  week or where you're going to be.
• 35:30
  You know, it's like, it's that thing of the smile and thin ice.
• 35:35
  They did it the where you just get a little peek at next week.
• 35:39
  I think that's great. Well, and the ghost monument.
• 35:41
  Let's be fair, they were in space at the end of The Woman
• 35:43
  Who Fell to Earth. You know it's not a peak, is it?
• 35:47
  I mean, it's a peak of souls. No, that's like a full
• 35:52
  cliffhanger of them dying. Oh, you mean not just the
• 35:55
  Segway? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 35:57
  I mean, that's the whole of the heart in the where, isn't it?
• 35:59
  It's wonderful, especially when it's between stories.
• 36:02
  I suppose it's because it's every week in this one.
• 36:04
  It's just exciting. I think the funniest one of all
• 36:06
  is when Hartnell has the sweet at the end of the celestial
• 36:10
  toilet and goes Oh my God he's dead, he's poisoned.
• 36:14
  Yeah, one of the Doctor's stupidest moments, surely, of
• 36:18
  all time. I don't know.
• 36:21
  We've still got 5 episodes. Well, how did you find episode
• 36:24
  one guys? Do you think in terms of a sort
• 36:26
  of setup episode? It ticks all the boxes.
• 36:29
  Yeah, it's a great clear setup and it looks gorgeous.
• 36:33
  There's loads of problems with production wise, but I mean I am
• 36:37
  in. Yeah, it ticks all the boxes and
• 36:40
  some, and I would have loved to have seen this turned into a
• 36:43
  Peter Cushing movie. Are you in as well, Dylan?
• 36:48
  I'm so in, I'm the most in you can be.
• 36:51
  I'm more in than you. I've got, I'm good.
• 36:54
  Stop it. It's too painful.
• 36:59
  I'll tell you what, I'll cut it there.